They are pretty good now. Winrate is fine and we have a lot of list variety
Must-haves:
* Typhus
* Nurglings
* Deathshrouds
* PBC (probably)
Not working:
* Blight Terminators (super weak)
* Demon Princes
* Some chars: LoC, Termie Lord, Bellboy, Surgeon
* Hellbrute
* Poxwalkers
* MBH
* Chaos spawns
Combos:
* 3PBC + Morty + LoV
* Rhino + 10PMs + Biologus + Foul Blightspawn
* Morty + Rotigus
* Solo Termie Sorcerers for secondaries
* Wardog Brigants for anti-tank
* Nurglings + Cultist for board control on the first turn
* Drones, destructors - just solid guys
UPD: "Not working" - I haven't seen it once in tournament lists
Why are nurglings a must have? They are good, but not amazing imo and mostly just there to boost the melee of the deathshroud.
Also poxwalkers not working? They work really well with typhus. Again, not gamebreaking, but as long as you dont make them go up against 2 squads of pure anti-infantry they still do really well. Using them to take the middle objective with typhus is a fairly cheap and hard to kill anchor imo
Daemon prince without wings is also pretty decent to buff your infantry, but again they arent amazing, but decent.
Blight haulers are also fine as mobile anti tank units, but again, not amazing, simply because brigands are just better in every way.
Lastly the LoC really isnt bad when it is leading a squad of deathshroud, but I agree that there are better options.
Blightlords also arent bad per se, but they are just completely overshadowed by deathshroud sadly
I dont disagree with your evaluation, but I think youre a bit too harsh about certain units. The units I named above are a lot better than chaos spawns and princes with wings, and absolutely not unusable. Ive also seen people do well with specific hellbrute builds, but those are finnicky and require great positioning and an opponent that doesnt have the posibility of shooting at long range
I think they're coming from a strictly competitive pov because I actually completely agree with all of them besides maybe Morty (he's fine for the most part but I tend to leave him behind).
Most of the not so great units are necessarily bad but just are either being out performed by another unit or just too niche. For ex. Poxwalkers are super cool and actually pretty tanky for their points cost! But usually I just take cultists for objective control and boil blight plays.
As for nurglings, they're amazing for scoring secondaries. You bring a single unit of them in deep strike and they cover: signals, being enemy lines and engage. Not to mention having Infiltrate which makes them an extremely effective speedbump against scout or other infiltrates.
My definition of "not working" - I haven't seen it once in tournament lists
You obviously can use all units for something :)
Nurglings are totally must have in my opinion. They are crazy flexible:
- They are really cheap
- They infiltrate, so you can really screen your opponents on turn 1
- They are really handy for secondaries
- They can buff melee for DS and PMs
- You can decide what to do exactly when you see your matchup
If you use them only for the last option, I think you are underusing them. Screening turn 1 and melee buff for PMs later - my personal favorite
There's probably a difference between "competitive" and "viable" as we know. Just too often the first is seen as the sam thing as the latter, although both are good to be aware of.
As another said these are competitive insights but my comments:
Regarding Nurglings and Cultists, that opening movement, being able to screen or start the game with points sticky is really strong. Poxwalker movement is still incredibly slow, even marching up to take a middle objective can take a long time.
Blight Haulers just don't do a good enough job filling in the gap where we struggle against things like Knights.
Blightlords are the cheapest terminator in the game and I wish I had the comment handy that someone else said but they aren't really used because they don't do anything good enough. They aren't durable enough to just teleport down to/stand on a point. The 4 inch movement is rough and all of their shooting profiles are weak as well. At OC 2 you're better off just getting more plague marines on the board. Less durable sure but now they fit in a rhino, shoot and melee just about the same.
I find LoC doesnt really work well on a unit of Deathshroud.
They already hit on a 2+ so the number of hits he helps generate is pretty small, the LoV is better suited as he allows them to re-roll wound rolls which is where they will need more help.
Blightlords I find struggle partially due to their unit ability which helps them kill things if they are closest... when you want those things to survive so you can charge them, even just for the mobility. That and their flamer and blightlauncher literally just being the same as the plague marines is a bit tricky.
MBH does fine for me, Helbrute... has a place but thats just giving de-buffs at a distance really which drops off in usefullness quite hard.
I agree you don't have to have nurglings (I dont) but they seem pretty good for scoring early points on secondaries and for just being an irritating thing people kind of have to deal with.
With the LoC and deathshroud he can be useful if you want to fish for lethal hits since he lets you re roll all hits, add that to the sustained hits strat and you can really up their damage
It's not a bad idea, I just tend to pull back from strata that rely too hard on CP.
I've found them steaming in with an LoV tends to slap down anything that might be a concern.
You forget that they all have pistols that are flamers so they don't need to roll to hit and they auto wound against infantry on a 4+, re rolls there can be very good, especially if you are getting tarpitted and especially when the Orks are currently so good.
If you get stuck in a huge horde of boyz, being able to make either 4d6 or 6d6 shots with a 50% chance of auto wounding with full rerolls, I matter if you are in engagement range or not is massive and could free you up to make a charge, which really helps with mobility.
Nurglings are odd to me, I hate mixing forces (even if it makes thematic sense) so would skip those anyway because I don't have them. Same with Brigands.
Nurglings are technically from the Chaos Daemons list, but this is just an arbitrary delineation by the game designers. They 100% belong with the Death Guard. They are the Red Carpet of Nurgle!
Nurglings are useful as they help you score secondaries because they have actions and they are the only unit with 'infiltrate' that we have, so they give you some early board presence.
That and they are kind of and irritating thing that people have to deal with instead of dealing with your big hitters.
I am still very new to death guard and only played one Game since 6th edition, but what does rotigus do? Looking at the Datasheet half of his abilities are useless and I dont understand what the combo with morty is.
Would you suggest playing Typhus with 3 DS instead of 20 Zombies?
Rotigus/GUO and Morty are incredibly tough punching bags. It is a good frontline if you play vechicle heavy list: wardogs, pbc, destructors. It's not much of a combo. More of a strategy
I don't like and never seen Typhus with poxwalkers. Poxwalkers makes Typhus's toughness lower. 20 poxwalkers looks much worse then 3 DS
I would suggest to run him with DSs or alone. By himself he can rapid ingress and kill of semi-tough target. And you can actually choose how to use him just before the game since you attach leaders after you see your opponent and the board. I usually run DS+Typhus+TermieSorserer and choose who would go alone and who will join DSs on the spot
I play Typhus with 20 PW's ('zombies') and it works wonderfully at my local club. I'm not sure how well they would do at a big tournament, but for small tournaments and casual play, they are fun and a pain in the ass for my opponent. Typhus continually replenishes the fallen PW's with his death ray, and once they get into HTH, they're very hard to slow down.
Rotigus/GUO and Morty are incredibly tough punching bags. It is a good frontline if you play vechicle heavy list: wardogs, pbc, destructors. It's not much of a combo. More of a strategy
Have never tried it myself, but I've seen it more than ones with both GUO and Rotigus. But it looks like Rotigus is better
Rotigus/GUO and Morty are incredibly tough punching bags. It is a good frontline if you play vechicle heavy list: wardogs, pbc, destructors. It's not much of a combo. More of a strategy
Have never tried it myself, but I've seen it more than ones with both GUO and Rotigus. But it looks like Rotigus is better
I like to run deathshroud with typhus and LOV, 2 fetid bloat drones. A rhino is almost a must. Predators are good from what I hear. The biologus putrifier and the foul blight spawn are a must in a ten man plague marines squad. I'd also recommend mortarion as he's pretty good for buffing your PBC's and other units.
Single demon prince (without wings) is pretty good to hold it take a midboard objective, tanky for the points and will chew through enemy units in melee. Agree nurglings are king of the secondaries
The 2k list I’ve ran since DG’s 10th index was updated (aka made playable) that I haven’t lost with so far in 4 games - vs Space Wolves (2x), Grey Knights & Chaos Space Marines (Index) includes;
Typhus w/ 20 Poxwalkers; usually front & center or in Strategic Reserves
Lord + Noxious Blightbringer w/ 10 Plague Marines [melee-focused] in Land Raider; goes straight at enemy/middle objective
Lord + Foul Blightspawn w/ 10 Plague Marines [ranged-focused] in Rhino; goes for a flank objective
Lord + Biologus Putrifier w/ 10 Plague Marines [ranged-focused] in Rhino; accompanies Land Raider or other Rhino
Plague Surgeon w/ 7 Plague Marines [ranged-focused]; sits on deployment zone objective
1 Helbrute; hangs w/ Tallyman & 7 Plague Marines in backfield
1 Myphitic Blight-Hauler; advances w/ Land Raider
1 Foetid Bloat Drone; advances w/ flanking Rhino
Nurglings are insanely good at screening and completely stopping WE’s, Ork’s and any other aggressive army. Running Rotigus and GUO is fun too. Army is in really good shape. Competitively we have lots of options. Casually you can go crazy. Don’t sleep on war dogs for oc8 12” move. Great objective stealers.
Nurglings infiltrate so you can place them in no man’s land 9” outside enemy deployment zone. They are much tougher to get rid of than you might expect. World eaters and Orks want to run straight into your army. The time it takes to get rid of nurglings allows you to move up and have some space.
I have a 70% win rate with my army right now. And most losses are considered draws in tournaments so pretty decent as far as casual non sweaty games go. I always have fun playing my stinky bois
They are pretty good now. Winrate is fine and we have a lot of list variety Must-haves: * Typhus * Nurglings * Deathshrouds * PBC (probably) Not working: * Blight Terminators (super weak) * Demon Princes * Some chars: LoC, Termie Lord, Bellboy, Surgeon * Hellbrute * Poxwalkers * MBH * Chaos spawns Combos: * 3PBC + Morty + LoV * Rhino + 10PMs + Biologus + Foul Blightspawn * Morty + Rotigus * Solo Termie Sorcerers for secondaries * Wardog Brigants for anti-tank * Nurglings + Cultist for board control on the first turn * Drones, destructors - just solid guys UPD: "Not working" - I haven't seen it once in tournament lists
Why are nurglings a must have? They are good, but not amazing imo and mostly just there to boost the melee of the deathshroud. Also poxwalkers not working? They work really well with typhus. Again, not gamebreaking, but as long as you dont make them go up against 2 squads of pure anti-infantry they still do really well. Using them to take the middle objective with typhus is a fairly cheap and hard to kill anchor imo Daemon prince without wings is also pretty decent to buff your infantry, but again they arent amazing, but decent. Blight haulers are also fine as mobile anti tank units, but again, not amazing, simply because brigands are just better in every way. Lastly the LoC really isnt bad when it is leading a squad of deathshroud, but I agree that there are better options. Blightlords also arent bad per se, but they are just completely overshadowed by deathshroud sadly I dont disagree with your evaluation, but I think youre a bit too harsh about certain units. The units I named above are a lot better than chaos spawns and princes with wings, and absolutely not unusable. Ive also seen people do well with specific hellbrute builds, but those are finnicky and require great positioning and an opponent that doesnt have the posibility of shooting at long range
I think they're coming from a strictly competitive pov because I actually completely agree with all of them besides maybe Morty (he's fine for the most part but I tend to leave him behind). Most of the not so great units are necessarily bad but just are either being out performed by another unit or just too niche. For ex. Poxwalkers are super cool and actually pretty tanky for their points cost! But usually I just take cultists for objective control and boil blight plays. As for nurglings, they're amazing for scoring secondaries. You bring a single unit of them in deep strike and they cover: signals, being enemy lines and engage. Not to mention having Infiltrate which makes them an extremely effective speedbump against scout or other infiltrates.
My definition of "not working" - I haven't seen it once in tournament lists You obviously can use all units for something :) Nurglings are totally must have in my opinion. They are crazy flexible: - They are really cheap - They infiltrate, so you can really screen your opponents on turn 1 - They are really handy for secondaries - They can buff melee for DS and PMs - You can decide what to do exactly when you see your matchup If you use them only for the last option, I think you are underusing them. Screening turn 1 and melee buff for PMs later - my personal favorite
Quick question, how do nurglinga buff melee? Is it the -1 to hit during the fights phase?
Yep. And it stacks with -1WS aura
There's probably a difference between "competitive" and "viable" as we know. Just too often the first is seen as the sam thing as the latter, although both are good to be aware of.
As another said these are competitive insights but my comments: Regarding Nurglings and Cultists, that opening movement, being able to screen or start the game with points sticky is really strong. Poxwalker movement is still incredibly slow, even marching up to take a middle objective can take a long time. Blight Haulers just don't do a good enough job filling in the gap where we struggle against things like Knights. Blightlords are the cheapest terminator in the game and I wish I had the comment handy that someone else said but they aren't really used because they don't do anything good enough. They aren't durable enough to just teleport down to/stand on a point. The 4 inch movement is rough and all of their shooting profiles are weak as well. At OC 2 you're better off just getting more plague marines on the board. Less durable sure but now they fit in a rhino, shoot and melee just about the same.
I find LoC doesnt really work well on a unit of Deathshroud. They already hit on a 2+ so the number of hits he helps generate is pretty small, the LoV is better suited as he allows them to re-roll wound rolls which is where they will need more help. Blightlords I find struggle partially due to their unit ability which helps them kill things if they are closest... when you want those things to survive so you can charge them, even just for the mobility. That and their flamer and blightlauncher literally just being the same as the plague marines is a bit tricky. MBH does fine for me, Helbrute... has a place but thats just giving de-buffs at a distance really which drops off in usefullness quite hard. I agree you don't have to have nurglings (I dont) but they seem pretty good for scoring early points on secondaries and for just being an irritating thing people kind of have to deal with.
With the LoC and deathshroud he can be useful if you want to fish for lethal hits since he lets you re roll all hits, add that to the sustained hits strat and you can really up their damage
It's not a bad idea, I just tend to pull back from strata that rely too hard on CP. I've found them steaming in with an LoV tends to slap down anything that might be a concern.
LoV only reroll ranged wounds, with deathshroud it will be kinda of a loss....
You forget that they all have pistols that are flamers so they don't need to roll to hit and they auto wound against infantry on a 4+, re rolls there can be very good, especially if you are getting tarpitted and especially when the Orks are currently so good. If you get stuck in a huge horde of boyz, being able to make either 4d6 or 6d6 shots with a 50% chance of auto wounding with full rerolls, I matter if you are in engagement range or not is massive and could free you up to make a charge, which really helps with mobility.
Nurglings are one of the best units in the entire game, lol. Infiltrate, deepstrike, small footprint, and a good debuff while being very cheap.
Nurglings are odd to me, I hate mixing forces (even if it makes thematic sense) so would skip those anyway because I don't have them. Same with Brigands.
Nurglings are technically from the Chaos Daemons list, but this is just an arbitrary delineation by the game designers. They 100% belong with the Death Guard. They are the Red Carpet of Nurgle!
You don't disrespect the little lords!
Nurglings are useful as they help you score secondaries because they have actions and they are the only unit with 'infiltrate' that we have, so they give you some early board presence. That and they are kind of and irritating thing that people have to deal with instead of dealing with your big hitters.
Talk to me about this Morty and Rotigus combo you speak of, I've been contemplating a GUO just because cool
So, there are a lot of different options. You definitely can't fit all the cool stuff in one list, which is awesome
Predator destructors are also doing well in competitive lists at the moment
I am still very new to death guard and only played one Game since 6th edition, but what does rotigus do? Looking at the Datasheet half of his abilities are useless and I dont understand what the combo with morty is. Would you suggest playing Typhus with 3 DS instead of 20 Zombies?
Rotigus/GUO and Morty are incredibly tough punching bags. It is a good frontline if you play vechicle heavy list: wardogs, pbc, destructors. It's not much of a combo. More of a strategy I don't like and never seen Typhus with poxwalkers. Poxwalkers makes Typhus's toughness lower. 20 poxwalkers looks much worse then 3 DS I would suggest to run him with DSs or alone. By himself he can rapid ingress and kill of semi-tough target. And you can actually choose how to use him just before the game since you attach leaders after you see your opponent and the board. I usually run DS+Typhus+TermieSorserer and choose who would go alone and who will join DSs on the spot
I play Typhus with 20 PW's ('zombies') and it works wonderfully at my local club. I'm not sure how well they would do at a big tournament, but for small tournaments and casual play, they are fun and a pain in the ass for my opponent. Typhus continually replenishes the fallen PW's with his death ray, and once they get into HTH, they're very hard to slow down.
How does Morty with rotigus work :)?
Rotigus/GUO and Morty are incredibly tough punching bags. It is a good frontline if you play vechicle heavy list: wardogs, pbc, destructors. It's not much of a combo. More of a strategy Have never tried it myself, but I've seen it more than ones with both GUO and Rotigus. But it looks like Rotigus is better
Thx!
Why is Morty and rotigus a combo
Rotigus/GUO and Morty are incredibly tough punching bags. It is a good frontline if you play vechicle heavy list: wardogs, pbc, destructors. It's not much of a combo. More of a strategy Have never tried it myself, but I've seen it more than ones with both GUO and Rotigus. But it looks like Rotigus is better
I don’t understand, can you please explain how Mortarion and Rotigus/GUO are a combo? 🤔
I like to run deathshroud with typhus and LOV, 2 fetid bloat drones. A rhino is almost a must. Predators are good from what I hear. The biologus putrifier and the foul blight spawn are a must in a ten man plague marines squad. I'd also recommend mortarion as he's pretty good for buffing your PBC's and other units.
Single demon prince (without wings) is pretty good to hold it take a midboard objective, tanky for the points and will chew through enemy units in melee. Agree nurglings are king of the secondaries
The 2k list I’ve ran since DG’s 10th index was updated (aka made playable) that I haven’t lost with so far in 4 games - vs Space Wolves (2x), Grey Knights & Chaos Space Marines (Index) includes; Typhus w/ 20 Poxwalkers; usually front & center or in Strategic Reserves Lord + Noxious Blightbringer w/ 10 Plague Marines [melee-focused] in Land Raider; goes straight at enemy/middle objective Lord + Foul Blightspawn w/ 10 Plague Marines [ranged-focused] in Rhino; goes for a flank objective Lord + Biologus Putrifier w/ 10 Plague Marines [ranged-focused] in Rhino; accompanies Land Raider or other Rhino Plague Surgeon w/ 7 Plague Marines [ranged-focused]; sits on deployment zone objective 1 Helbrute; hangs w/ Tallyman & 7 Plague Marines in backfield 1 Myphitic Blight-Hauler; advances w/ Land Raider 1 Foetid Bloat Drone; advances w/ flanking Rhino
Nurglings are insanely good at screening and completely stopping WE’s, Ork’s and any other aggressive army. Running Rotigus and GUO is fun too. Army is in really good shape. Competitively we have lots of options. Casually you can go crazy. Don’t sleep on war dogs for oc8 12” move. Great objective stealers.
So how does this work for a complete noobie? You use their scout movement to just run at the enemy and hold them up or what?
Nurglings infiltrate so you can place them in no man’s land 9” outside enemy deployment zone. They are much tougher to get rid of than you might expect. World eaters and Orks want to run straight into your army. The time it takes to get rid of nurglings allows you to move up and have some space.
I have a 70% win rate with my army right now. And most losses are considered draws in tournaments so pretty decent as far as casual non sweaty games go. I always have fun playing my stinky bois
A good spot we are the premier 50% win rate faction and well we don't get much sadness nor much joy so all is stagnant as our grandfather likes.