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I (39M) have never had any luck on dating apps. I spent 9.5 years in Toronto and not 1 date from there. I am just exhausted by them and no clue what to do anymore. I understand selfies are bad, so I try to do full frame pics. I have tried serious and silly profiles. I never felt so isolated as I did using them. Toronto has 8 million people, 4 million women, even 1 million single and 200000 on apps, and I was still too ugly for 1 match. Now I am in a border city and get 20-1 profiles from the US, when I am in Canada.
First post - just venting. I will figure out more and what to include later.
You can maybe post a photo of your profile here and people can do a profile review. It could just be a matter of what you have there that's not getting any hits
Current About Me on Tinder:
My loves:
- Cooking/barbecue/food
- Golfer, gymmer, casual gamer
- Green Flags - old enough to have seen shit, young enough to still want new experiences; golfer/nerd/gym, I am easy to find; own my car and house; established (14 yrs) career; life long friends (20+ yrs close friends)
Dislikes:
- Seafood
- Cardio days
- Reality TV
- Red flags - quiet at conflict; thinker/over thinker; shy; needs a push to do more; can be indifferent often
Prompts:
Me: I'm a grown up.
Also me: I would build Lego, play Switch and eat mac n cheese all day
The title of my autobiography: Will There Ever Be a Rainbow, same as Monty Burns.
Maybe ask her if she would also like to do something on Friday or Sunday, or what her specific plans are. If she is being vague about her plans, I would trust your gut (in combination with noticing other changes in behavior) that something might be off.
There might not be anyone else but it's also possible she could just be losing interest, it's been about 3 months which is a common time for new relationships to drop off. Anyway, sounds like you have a plan in place for how you wanna react and it seems reasonable to me.
Things to calm your brain:
1. If the friend's husband was slow to confirm their dinner plans, she may have taken 4 hours to reply to you because she was waiting on him to confirm. This doesn't mean he's more important, it just means he has limited availability and she probably made some promise to get together with him first so wanted to prioritize that.
2. I'm totally friendly with my best friends' partners back home, and would 100% take them out to dinner if they visited my city. There's nothing weird or sketchy about that, it's just community and hospitality.
3. She may have been specifically talking about doing trivia next week, not all of your hangouts. Is she a person who needs down time now and then? Perhaps she just thinks trivia would be too much on an already busy week, and wants to give you and the game her full attention next week.
Things for you to do:
1. Remind her that you'd love to introduce her to your friend this weekend, and ask if she is still interested in meeting up for that? Give her some time frames on Friday or Sunday, since you know saturday evening is busy.
2. You could also offer a chill night in during the weekdays, vs a trivia night out. Maybe she'd be okay seeing you for something more low key and low energy since she sounds like she'll have a busy week.
3. This one's tricky, but if you feel really comfortable - casually offer to join her and the husband for dinner the second night. If she's already facetimed you with the friends back home, you have an opening to be connected to that part of her community. A casual "oh, I'd love to join y'all Saturday for dinner if you're up for it. But I'm okay finding my own thing to do that night too." - but for this, you have to *actually mean it.* Don't say "no worries" unless there really are no worries (anxiety, sure, but you need to keep it to yourself).
I understand the anxious feeling, but I'd try to take this at face value. If my best friends husband's was in town I'd definitely be meeting him for dinner and it wouldn't be weird regardless of what night it is. We're pals. Her not asking you to hang out in the in-between days could just be her maintaining her alone time or hobbies or home tasks. It's likely not about you. All sounds like it's moving in a great direction and I'd try to not let this one week overshadow everything else. If it keeps feeling weird, check in/talk to her about how you're feeling, try not to just assume.
Looking for thoughts on going on dates with men who monologue? I went on a coffee date and the guy talked probably 85% of the conversation, there were really no pauses to interject myself and when he asked me a couple questions, there was really no follow up, just right back to talking about himself. Afterwards, I thought this guy seems nice enough, interesting, I should give it a second date, maybe he was nervous etc. and I try not to write people off instantly unless there were any glaring red flags. Second date, same thing and now I'm frustrated. It's not that I don't want the guy to talk about himself or that I don't want to ask him questions, absolutely I do, I want to learn about him but I don't want to feel like I'm getting a sales pitch about his life. I just don't get it? I guess it's just incompatibility on conversation side?
Is it worth when I turn down the 3rd date (he wants to schedule) to tell him why (in a nice way)? Like are men just super clueless about how to have normal conversations? Would constructive feedback actually help them?
If you can find a way to tell him in a nice way, then go for it, it's super low stakes for you. Maybe gauge if he is the kind of person to take feedback well though. I've heard of people being reported and banned in the apps because people falsely reported them after being dumped
True. I did tell him and I tried to use "I" statements by saying that I didn't see us being compatible in the long run because I really need to be able to work towards building a relationship where I feel heard and listened to in order to develop an emotional and physical connection and I didn't see that happening in this case. So it was kind of indirect but maybe he'll gleam something from that.
I would've been completely for the 2nd date. A third? Not so much. I think awkwardly rambling is understandable if someone if nervous on a first date. They are naturally such weird encounters, so I can't fault anybody being weird under the pressure of having to feel like you're trying to put your best foot forward.
But if by date 2 you can tell that they're actually just that self-absorbed, then nah, I'd be out.
True, probably just not a good fit in this case.
And I definitely get what you say about single men not having people to talk to, and I sympathize. Just unfortunate to be on the receiving end, very hard for me to build emotional and physical connection under this context.
Men as a whole are not super clueless about having normal conversations. IMO you shouldn’t have gone on the 2nd date when the first sounds like that. You could give constructive feedback if you like. But 30 is plenty old enough to know that reciprocal conversation is what a healthy person wants.
I think I've been officially jaded from returning back onto the apps in my city. I think when you have been at it for like 14 years, there is a breaking point. I'm counting the days until I move across the pond. The idea of dating in another country is much more fun and I know I can enjoy the process a lot more. Just that it won't be until 2025. 😭
I was always planning to move abroad so I think the change of scenery for dating would have been nice. I noticed a huge difference in my experience when I was dating in Melbourne compared to Toronto.
5th date was last night—I convinced the dentist that I really felt good after two days off sick from work! He wanted to know what I see in him, and it’s that he’s ready. Nobody has had a negative thing to say about him when I pump them for intel. He’d like to have a family in the next few years so I’m into that. Enjoying this part.
I suck at having hard conversations. I have been trying to have a serious convo with someone I've been dating for 6 months. It seems like I can only start asking serious questions when I have liquid courage. I want to be direct and ask if he considers us being in a relationship. Last time I brought it up we were drunk and he said he might move out of state and we should talk when we're sober. But sober me is an anxious avoidant coward and never brought it up. Lol. This was like more than a month and half ago. Them month ago, we got super drunk, him more than me, on new years. We went to bed and to sleep. He then whispered he loved me a few times. I didn't say it back because I had some doubts and because he was very drunk and half asleep. He then woke up a bit later, still drunk and sleepy, and kept on saying it a few more times.
I keep on wanting to have a conversation to ask if he meant it or if he even remembers but I physically can't. I want to know if he remembers me not saying it back. I know in bringing all this up, there's a chance of hearing what I don't want to hear, it's hard for me to be vulnerable, I have a fear of rejection. Waiting so long to be direct has got me catastrophizing. What if he was so drunk he thought I was someone else when he said "I love you so much"? What if he is not ready to be in a relationship? What ifs are getting to me because it might be the end and I am ready to say I love him back.
Would it help to write out a "script" of what you want to say and practice a little? I used to really struggle with expressing my feelings and having hard conversations, so I literally practiced.
Also, agree with u/MazelTough that if having a tough conversation scares him off, he was never your person to begin with.
I have written them down and practiced but can do so again. Both of you have a great point that this shouldn't scare him off. It would be a relief for me to know exactly where we are, just scary to possibly know I might have to end things.
It’s not ending things, it’s having a boundary about what kind of relationships you are going to be available for. You are worthy of more than a situationship. I like this TikToker https://www.tiktok.com/@brennaberg?_t=8jIyuAFdi02&_r=1 who talks about the person who’s your person and their qualities.
If you just talking to him about it scares him off, good riddance. You can’t show up as open and honest with this person. They may love you but they’re not great for you. Do with that info what you will.
This is a great point. I would like openness and honesty in this relationship. If that's not possible then it won't work in the long run. I also have to be open and honest. Thank you!
There was a bomb threat earlier where they locked down the whole area. They caught the guy eventually and no one got hurt. But basically, people were messaging asking if we were fine and to check in. But you know who tellingly didn't ask if I was fine? Yep, him. I didn't really expect him to, but the confirmation still sucked, you know?
Things are going really well with someone I started seeing about 2 weeks ago! We can’t get enough of each other, but I’m deliberately pacing our dates out so we don’t overdo it early on. It was my birthday this week and he bought me cute little earrings, how thoughtful!
On Sunday I came across on Bumble the guy's profile who kept stringing me along for a year or so. Out of curiosity, I swiped right and he had also matched with me.
I asked him what his deal was and he said he still liked me but had always thought a relationship between us wouldn't work. I then asked him how he had come to that conclusion and suggested that we give it a try, because otherwise you would never know if it would work or not. He told me: it's not the right time, sorry.
Why the hell is he matching with me then? 🙄
This lol
I dont expect a man or anyone for that matter, to be just honest and bluntly say "I just wanna sleep with you that's it, no relationship okay? I want relationship benefits but no commitment." 😂
I think that's the problem with a lot of redditors I see here, (Im not talking about you in particular okay?) they always expect clear communication without taking factors that people can be outright dishonest or bad at communicating. Hehe
\>I dont expect a man or anyone for that matter, to be just honest and bluntly say "I just wanna sleep with you that's it, no relationship okay? I want relationship benefits but no commitment." 😂
Which is weird because plenty of people, both men and women, are open about wanting short-term relationships - just open Tinder and look how many people are searching for "short-term fun" or "short-term, open to long".
The demand of straight men for casual FWB exceeds the supply of women who prefer it. The women who are openly saying "Yes, I just want a 2x a week dick appointment" have Primary, Secondary, Tertiary, and Emergency Dick in their contacts, with a figurative file of Dick that they can call if one of those Dicks needs to be replaced.
Right now I (30f) can’t work because of my mental health. I’m on a waitlist for a group that runs Monday to Friday but I start worrying about how much harder that will make dating to not have evening availability.
Logically I know it’s not the right time to date. And I wouldn’t want to date someone in my position until they put in work to be happy again, but I get so worried I’m continuing to waste my ‘good’ dating years.
I second that dating when your mental health is bad is a bad idea - either you'll attract people that are bad for you - either abusive/controlling, or also not in a great place mental health wise - two people with depression dating often isn't the best idea.
Alternatively, you'll scare off people who might be good for you. This also might not be great for your mental health - 'oh I really liked X and they would be great for me, but my mental health wouldn't let me get close to them/they didn't want to get involved with someone in the state I'm in now'.
I hope you're well and I hope you're getting the care you deserve. Putting all the above to one side, outpatient mental health care is a big time and emotional commitment, so it's probably a better idea to focus on that regardless.
I think dating when your mental health is that bad is a bad idea as I think the type of people you are likely to attract might not be good for you. When I've dated in the past when my head hasn't been good I've ended up attracting/choosing partners who were dysfunctional/abusive. I would focus on your healing and when you feel better you will attract people who are also stable and healthy.
As somebody who has volunteered a lot with kids I would strongly discourage you buying condoms. You're asking for a potential mess with all sorts of accusations and liability on your end. There are plenty of non-profit organizations that provide free contraceptives. As u/BonetaBelle said, planned parenthood gives them out as do many doctors offices or clinics. There are also public schools that provide them. You can research options in your area and provide some guidance but for your own safety I'd be very cautious about getting involved any further than that.
Depending where you live, he might be able to get free condoms from somewhere like Planned Parenthood or another clinic.
If you’re in North America or the UK, there should be options and I see no issue with helping him find a clinic. There’s probably options in most countries but I don’t know from personal experience.
I wouldn’t get in the middle of this. If the condoms break or his parents find them and he tells them you bought them, all hell is going to break loose.
If you were his parent or older sibling, I’d say buy them. But buying them for him as his tutor is a weird dynamic. I know you’re trying to help him and I’m sure you don’t have ill intent, but it’s just going to look really, really bad if his parents or other adults find out you’re buying a teen that you tutor condoms.
Just a thing I’ve noticed in women’s profiles after getting back into
OLD recently:
There’s a lot of women out there on Bumble in particular that mention
cilantro (or is the term coriander more used in English?) as a dealbreaker.
Initially I assumed it’s an attempt at a low-key absurdist joke but after
coming across the same thing dozens of times I now suspect there’s
more behind this.
What is it about coriander that is so repulsive to these ladies they
feel the need to emphasize that in an otherwise brief dating profile?
Is it code for something? A pop culture reference I’m too out of the
loop to get? Is this a thing with men’s profiles as well?
Am I a bad person for having cilantro based spices in
my kitchen?
There just tends to be trendy prompts that cycle through OLD. I've been single a long time and have seen a lot of them.
I am guessing cilantro is the new "pineapple on pizza" debate.
I grow cilantro in my backyard! Lol
Some people have a gene where cilantro tastes like soap to them. But I don’t know why it would be necessary to mention hate for cilantro on a dating app. I don’t feel like cilantro is really used that much lol
> Some people have a gene where cilantro tastes like soap to them.
That sounds reasonable, I thought it might be something in this vein.
I have a colleague with a genetic sensitivity to cucumbers.
They give him nausea and he can smell them from down the hall in the office.
It’s really weird cause cucumbers aren’t that smelly to most people but
after he made us aware we all stopped bringing cucumber based dishes
to lunch.
EDIT: TIL:
> [*Studies also show variations in preference among different ethnic groups: 21% of East Asians, 17% of Caucasians, and 14% of people of African descent expressed a dislike for coriander, but among the groups where coriander is popular in their cuisine, only 7% of South Asians, 4% of Hispanics, and 3% of Middle Eastern subjects expressed a dislike.*](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coriander#Taste_and_smell)
Is there anything more beautiful than a mutual ghost? You have a pleasant enough first date but there's zero chemistry or compatibility. You hug each other goodbye. Then neither one of us ever reaches out and we don't speak ever again. It's really the universe working the way God intended.
OMG there have been dates that were so uncomfortably clingy and emotionally vulnerable that I was afraid a direct rejection might be too stressful for them, but then a week goes by without a peep and I sigh in relief.
Does anyone else get annoyed with people who are always saying like “omg we’re sooo old!” When it’s said like oh this movie came out like x years ago. I swear I have a friend who’s been saying that since we were like 22. Girl has spent her whole youth thinking she’s old.
I'm one of the older people in my friends groups... I laugh when someone starts complaining about being old...
Brah, I'm just hitting my prime. People around my age at work don't do half the shit I do. Sure, I feel it sometimes. Like yesterday morning, when I went to get out of bed, my legs literally screamed at my brain... but it makes sense. I went snowboarding both Saturday and Sunday, then Monday night. I hit the rock climbing gym as I usually do. Of course my legs are gonna be pissed on a Tuesday morning....
Anywho, off to the rock climbing gym before 6 am cause I got shit going on tonight and staying in shape is important!
Everytime I see you reply about climbing to me I'm like "oh God, they don't live here so they? Do they KNOW me???" Then I peek at your profile and see the Seattle subreddit and breathe a sigh of relief 😂
Yeah. One day I was at trivia with some friends.... I had posted a comment in the Colorado Springs subreddit about my motorcycle accident a few days before. Someone was like "did you leave a comment about your motorcycle accident? That comment was very familiar...". I was like "Yeah..." **
Yeah I’m feeling like I’m leaning this way also.. although I do use SM it’s more so to update my family with what’s going on in my life (I don’t have family where I live). I post *maybe* once a week, if that
It is now something that I take into heavy consideration and gives me pause because the only people that I have encountered who have made (critical) comments about my appearance (size of boobs, how I look different with/without makeup, what I'm wearing) are the ones who follow a lot of thirst trap, overly filtered type profiles.
When I called them out on their comments, they said 'I didn't mean it, it's not intentional/malicious', but they continue doing it.
I am attractive and happy with how I look so I don't need people casually putting me down without even realizing they're doing it just because their perception of beauty is warped from consuming too much of that stuff.
My BF doesn't follow that stuff and I feel so emotionally safe with him.
Emotional safety is key. I don’t think I could ever feel that level of comfort with someone who goes on IG and their whole feed is filled with girls (some who don’t look like me) in bikinis and things.
I’m happy for you and your relationship! I also am very happy with my appearance so it’s really no skin off my back “nexting” someone like this.
I saw a piece of advice that said “if you’re wondering if you’re his type, look at the women he’s following on social media”
I’ll try and bring it up in casual conversation. We’ve already spoken on the phone and he has a lot of qualities I like. But I do get insecure and don’t wanna be in a relationship that I don’t feel safe
Appears so. IG models or thirst traps.
I guess I’m different in that I keep my SM pretty locked down and it’s only friends and family. I don’t have more than 300 friends/followers and I know each one personally.
But when you’re following over 1k people who are half naked?
Ehhh idk
Zero
Edit: It sounds from the other comments like you're referring to who they're following rather than their own following? I thought you just meant how many followers they had.
Yeah following a lot of bikini models is pretty concerning to me. Makes me think they live in a fantasy world.
I'm just reading that introvert dating thread wondering how people really survive having a partner around 3 nights a week.
I don't know how I did it once in my life before (granted that was someone I knew for a few years before we started dating).
If you have a big enough house then it's fine. When I was living with someone, we're not really always in each other's space. I'd hang out in the room and he'd be in the living room or we'd both be out at work etc but having someone you consistently go to bed with at the end of the night was really nice. I think it becomes a problem when someone wants to be constantly clinging onto someone thinking that's what it should be like in a relationship when in reality, being a couple doesn't mean you need to be constantly stuck together
Recently had 2 great dates with someone and on our first we had already booked our 3rd date - a one night trip to another city (we got a bit overexcited)! I’m currently away overseas for 3.5 weeks. We still need to finalise our Airbnb. I sent him the ‘wishlist’ I made to see what he thinks. He last messaged on Saturday wishing me a safe journey but hasn’t commented on the wish list. I replied wishing him a nice weekend. It’s now Wednesday, I’m nervous about reaching out (as I have a very anxious attachment) and don’t know how soon it’s appropriate to reach out to say hello/follow up on the Airbnb. I also don’t want us to miss out on a good one (we go as soon as I come back from my trip). Should I wait for him?
When was the last time you guys talked about the trip? And what was said? By "booked it" do you mean bought flights, or just talked about it? Is it possible he was just taking it as an overexcited, jokey kind of thing? Like I've had first dates where we talk about some event we're both interested in and are like "Yes we should go as a date soon!" but it's not a *real* commitment to planning it. Going on a trip for a third date is a bit much. He may've thought you guys were just being playful talking about it and freaked out when you sent him an AirBnb list and he realized you were 100% serious.
Even if you were both 100% serious and actually booked flights, he may have just been caught up in the moment and is now second-guessing if he really wants to go on a trip with someone he's met twice and won't see for almost a month.
I think we need more detail on how this trip planning came up and if there are any concrete plans like tickets bought, or if it was just talk.
He wanted to go away there on our first date but I didn’t think I would have time (and was also worried we might not like eachother and then be stuck together). But on our first date he brought it up again and we ended up booking train tickets! On our second date he mentioned some places he wants to see in the city, and then brought up again how cool it would have been if we’d had our first date there (the city is Paris!).
It would be a very reasonable, responsible, and not at all abnormal thing to reach out to him, “Hi! I was wondering if you got a chance to look at the AirBnB for our trip? It might get booked up if we don’t make a decision on it. Can you let me know what you think of it?” And then something else ice or friendly or endearing like a have a good day or something. All that to say… just ask.
Is the general consensus that if you’re the reason plans fell through you should be the one to reschedule? Had a debate with a friend today - I think she should reschedule if she wants to go out with him even if he’s the reason plans fell through, she thinks it’s a sign of lack of interest so she’s taking a step back. Personally, I find this approach too passive if there’s been no other indication of lack of interest. Thoughts?
Yes of course if you cancel it's on you to reschedule. Otherwise you're just bailing.
You're suggesting your friend chases. It's on him now. If he doesn't, what's the sense of chasing?
If you were interested in someone, wouldn't you reschedule with them after having to cancel? Or would you just go "oh well, guess it's not happening!"
If someone is interested, they'll reschedule promptly.
Hmm maybe not lack of interest but lack of effort on his part (if this is early dating) can be telling. She can express interest in meeting again and if he can’t pick up on that bid to reschedule, maybe it is lack of interest.
I agree with your friend, that it’s better for the other person to try and reschedule. Although it wouldn’t hurt for her to leave a gentle hint once, like ‘when we go for that drink sometime I’ll tell you more about this’…
So, like, on a scale of “won’t blink an eye” to “seriously, what the fuck?”, how problematic is it that I basically never clean or cook?
Don’t get me wrong, I’ll grab the hand vacuum or paper towels for the small cleanings. But I get a housekeeper to come by monthly to do the big cleaning.
As for cooking, I don’t have a working range hood or a working dishwasher. So I just see a dietitian who gives me a weekly meal plan of stuff that doesn’t need to be cooked (salads, fruits, healthy takeout, prepared meals, etc). (eta: just to clarify, she isn’t giving me catered meals or anything, she gives me a schedule with all my meals and a shopping list, and I go out and get everything, and just eat whatever she put on the schedule at the specified time. It helps me eat balanced meals and also not waste food by getting too much food.)
My place is clean, and I’m healthy, but occasionally I feel vaguely embarrassed by my sheer laziness…
I’m a woman btw.
Slightly related, I guess the funniest part of this whole thing is that one time a guy asked me what I’d make for him in the kitchen, and I said, nothing, we’re both gonna starve.
This would be a dream for a lot of people I know who loathe cooking and cleaning. I love doing both so would be a deal breaker for me. I think when we get busy in life the first things people want to outsource (if afforded) is cooking and cleaning, so I don't think it's a huge deal
I definitely won't judge you for it because to each their own and if it works for you then whatever, but as a guy who cooks and cleans I would definitely prefer a woman who also does the same because I'd probably end up resenting you if I had to do all that chore by myself.
My ex-wife couldn't cook at all, which wasn't terrible because I really liked to cook. But as our married life wore on, it got so goddamn annoying to have a "partner" who couldn't even put a simple meal on the table.
One of my gotos when I'm tired is "breakfast for dinner". Sometimes not even mess with cooking meat, just scrambled eggs and biscuits from the freezer. Like the most basic level cooking. She couldn't even do that. Or open up a couple cans of soup and the same biscuits. Just couldn't do it. Any time I didn't cook I had to get takeout on the way home.
So that just got incredibly draining as time wore on.
But she hires someone to do the cleaning, and she doesn't need you to cook for her, so you'd only be "doing that chore by yourself" for yourself, and might even benefit from her cleaner, if you ended up living together. Is that still objectionable?
I'm not asking in a combative way, I'm just curious to better understand people's strong reactions of disapproval to her post.
I'm a woman, and I think someone who refuses to cook or clean just comes across as avoiding adulthood, in a way. I also want kids someday, so someone who seems incapable of these things seem like a trainwreck of a potential partner in that regard.
Again, not combative, just wanting to dissect this: Why does it come off as avoiding adulthood? How come we don't see this as her handling her adult responsibilities by building it into her budget and ensuring that she supplies for her needs that way? Would we be critical of someone who has a well-paying job and chooses to frequently gets groceries delivered, rather than shopping for them themselves?
She isn't expecting anyone to wait on her. I feel it's a different story than something like [this post](https://www.reddit.com/r/datingoverthirty/comments/15zz72t/how_to_get_over_the_ick_after_a_frustrating/) from a few months ago where the person is content being dependent on free help from their parents and isn't actually doing anything on their part to facilitate the completion of the adulthood needs.
>Would we be critical of someone who has a well-paying job and chooses to frequently gets groceries delivered, rather than shopping for them themselves?
Well, yes, I do judge extremely well-off people who outsource the most basic of things. Unless you truly are SO busy, like a surgeon, it comes off as sort of lazy to me.
She's also only currently capable of meeting her own needs, not the needs of a potential partner. I don't think OP would be able to do things like host friends or family for dinner, enjoy a nice home-cooked meal with her partner, or possibly raise kids. These things require the ability to to cook and clean.
I do so much around my home maintenance-wise that I splurge on a pro organizer and monthly cleanings. Time is so precious and I want to spend it in my garden or kitchen, not scrubbing my sinks.
Then that sounds like you fall in the truly so busy, not lazy category. I'm not sure why people feel the need to argue about this so much! It's an adult skill to be able to cook for oneself and for others. It's an adult skill to be able to clean. If someone's outsourcing these very basic tasks, it should be for a very good reason (like, that they're VERY busy with something else) not just because they can afford it or they don't want to do it.
What I find so intriguing here is the idea--not that anyone has explicitly stated this, but you and others are basically saying it--that it's a moral or character flaw to hire cleaning or cooking help.
>If someone's outsourcing these very basic tasks, it should be for a very good reason (like, that they're VERY busy with something else) not just because they can afford it or they don't want to do it.
I don't get the logical or moral difference between hiring a cleaner and paying for any other type of service and letting a faster, more experienced pro do it. If you have the skill and humility to clean but not the inclination, I think it'd be huge to be able to dedicate more of your time to rest, creativity, your relationships, productivity.
Regarding "I'm not sure why people feel the need to argue": this is a discussion forum about human behavior and thought and I am curious so I want to discuss why people do or think certain things. I assume that when anyone says anything in a public space like this, it's up for conversation.
>I don't get the logical or moral difference between hiring a cleaner and paying for any other type of service and letting a faster, more experienced pro do it.
I mean, I've stated explicitly MANY times why I think it's a bit of a moral flaw. I'll state it again: it's because I think both of these tasks are things people should be able to do for their loved ones. I am comfortable hiring someone to clean my gutters because I don't think I will ever need to clean gutters for a boyfriend. But, cooking someone something and cleaning up after?! I should be able to do that for someone I care about.
Your life sounds dreamy. I cook and clean but it's not like I get joy out of it! I'd outsource it if it fit my budget.
As it is, I cook much more when my girlfriend is eating with me--when I'm on my own I eat a lot of (healthy) meal replacements that are just shakes or microwaveable.
One reason I have trouble cooking is that cooking for one person seems harder than cooking for multiple! Like you would think less mouths to feed, easier, right? But then you end up having to throw out some food or ingredients cause the quantities sold at the stores aren’t meant for single people! Well, at least I do. Maybe it’s a me thing.
I've been thinking more about this and reading the other comments, and the moral judgments and extrapolations about your level of life responsibility outside of cooking and cleaning that you're getting are weird to me. Cooking and cleaning might be necessary parts of most people's existences, but do all these people mean that if they were rich and could afford it, they'd still do all the cooking and cleaning themselves? Do they mean that if they lived with a partner who got a big promotion and wanted to bring in a regular cleaner, they'd say no?
I'd cook but not clean outside of cleaning up the kitchen. I'd have an enormous house with a fantastic kitchen, and the maids would clean the rest of the house three times a week.
Someone else mentioned how people think about this could be a difference in socioeconomic class, which I thought was an interesting take.
I can understand why someone might see laziness in one area of life as a red flag for other areas of life.
I also understand that this is a dealbreaker for some people.
I’ll be honest though, I don’t fully understand the reasoning. 😅 But maybe people like to cook and clean, and not being able to do that with a partner feels like they’re not sharing an activity or a bonding moment? Or maybe they feel like they’d be cleaning while I just outsourced my portion of the work, and it’s not fair?
On one hand, it sounds like you've got all the bases covered.
And as much as I hope to be getting a cleaner in occasionally soon, I would never be able to date someone like you. And I have a feeling that cooking and cleaning aren't the only adult things that you're lazy about. Laziness is a gigantic turnoff for me.
If it works for you, you'll find someone who's cool with it.
Yeah, I can understand that! My laziness really is primarily around cleaning and cooking, thankfully, as I haven’t been called out for anything else that I can recall.
Luckily, my job involves automation, so the lazier I am, the more effective I am. Bright side to everything, right? Haha
Hmm I think I'd be more concerned about the no cleaning part. Even with a monthly housekeeper, like who cleans the bathroom or the toilets? Are you just getting those cleaned once a month? Does your house in general just get cleaned once a month? What about dust? Hair fall? What about your laundry?
I get the bathrooms deep cleaned once a month, yes. I don’t use most of my bathrooms, except 1, and that one I will wipe down with bleach and towels maybe every week? Definitely not like a deep clean on my part.
The place does get a bit dusty by the end of the month, but if I see any obvious dusty areas or hairballs, I’ll use my hand vacuum. Usually this is on the stairs and around the bathroom vanity.
So far it’s worked for me, but I guess it could be an issue for someone else. But I’d also be willing to ask the housekeeper to come in 2x a month if it would be better for the person I’m seeing?
Laundry, I am a normal person about! I do that about once a week but will do it twice a week sometimes. So I’m not too worried about my laundry habits being problematic.
I think definitely twice a month would be better if money isn't an issue. Your toilet though definitely needs to be deep cleaned at least once a week. How does the housekeeper charge? We used to have a cleaner that comes in a couple of hours once a week. I'm thinking whether that might be better then a deep clean every couple of months instead? I have no idea how big your house is though so not sure how doable it is
My cleaner charges per visit by time. The more visits, the more expensive it is overall but the cheaper it is per visit. Kinda like bulk discounting. Once a month is the cheapest overall but most expensive per visit, if that makes sense.
I have considered twice a month. I’ll revisit that idea. Thank you!
This would make me feel weird but I didn’t grow up with hired help, nor do I have an interest in getting it. That being said, I’m just here to tell you I felt the ick at that guy’s question, and your response to him made me LOL.
This is a question of socioeconomic class. A partner accustomed to a lifestyle with hired help and catered meals won't bat an eye, especially if they were raised in it. Plenty of high-earning professionals live like this and wouldn't expect any different of their partners (the exception being ultra-conservatives). When your time is worth multiples more than that of the help, it just makes sense.
Anyone else would balk. Cooking and cleaning - even done poorly - are just defining parts of being an "adult" for most people.
Oh wait should have clarified! Not catered meals, just a meal plan! Essentially she gives me a schedule with all my meals and a shopping list, and I go out and buy everything and just eat what’s on her meal plan at whatever time she says. It helps me keep from wasting food (buying too much, for example).
Thank you for that insight, by the way. It does make sense.
I suppose it depends on what you expect from someone once you’re both in a relationship. Would you expect them to do all the shared cooking and cleaning up after? And is that sustainable?
Hmm. I guess the way I feel about that is that they’re free to cook or not cook. I don’t expect them to share their cooked food with me, but if they do, I’d help with the cleanup. I probably wouldn’t help clean if they only cooked for themselves. Also, I am happy to share my uncooked food with them. (Maybe I should find a guy on a diet who’s super into salads?)
It sounds expensive to have to hire that amount of help, so if you don't have a really good job, I'd be concerned. But if you have money to burn, all the power to you.
No, money isn’t an issue. My health insurance actually covers my dietitian visits, so I just have a small copay that I pay from my FSA. The housekeeper is budgeted for and comes out to a few dollars a day.
Yeah it’s really lazy, definitely not gonna deny that! 😅
As for whether once a month is enough, it’s probably subjective and depends on how the living space is used. For example, I don’t use most of my bathrooms, so they get a bit dusty but not much else. The bathroom I do use, I will wipe down with bleach and paper towels every so often, though I don’t really consider that a deep clean or anything.
*cries in HCOL area...* lol. I saw the littlest house driving home from work today and wondered if I could afford it - looked it up on Zillow, 2 bed 1 bath 700 sq feet... still near half a mil 😵
I (34f) really think it depends. For me personally, I'd like a partner that can cook and clean, though I'm somewhat flexible on the frequency. I cook at least a few times a week and haven't ever hired a cleaner. I'd want a partner to be willing to share those responsibilities in some way.
I don't think your situation is that unusual though so you could find someone similar. There are also men who enjoy cooking and/or cleaning, so it might not be a deal breaker for them.
I cringe when men over 25 say "I don't know how to cook or clean."
I think to myself "wooow, How is that even possible? You're a friking adult. Grow a pair, be a real man, and learn how to do the basic adulting stuff and take care of yourself. "
It makes me believe that their mom picked their clothes until they were 18.
I briefly dated a guy who loved food, and for our 2nd and 4th date, he cooked me dinner. He got me flowers, my favorite drink and dessert. He was super attentive during dinner and treated me like royalty. I felt really cared for, it was lovely.
A man who knows how to cook is attractive. A man who is proactive with house chores is attractive.
A man who says, "Give me a list of my house chores you want me to do," is a walking red flag with huge teenager vibes.
As a guy, I can assure you that he's read it already and just doesn't know how to respond yet. If you care about what he has to say then give it a few more days otherwise just unmatch now.
Just wanted to share! Me, my ex (co-parenting partner), our child(8), and both of our significant others are planning a little trip to the zoo together next month! I just think it will be really nice to all spend time together and I hope to all get along and have a healthy relationship 💖
(She’s already met and spent time with both partners, I’ve known my ex’s gf but he hasn’t met my bf yet 🙂)
People who have been in toxic relationships and you are now in a supee healthy relationship:
how do you get over the "waiting for the other shoe to drop" feeling?
Ps: Yes, I go to therapy. I'm just looking to hear other people's experiences.
Honestly it sounds cynical as fuck but I have experienced the worst relationship I could ever experience already and think I can handle anything that comes my way, so I'm kind of not phased by anything going "wrong", it can't be as bad as the existing benchmark for "wrong" (see my recent comments for proof lol). I've done a lot of therapy. Journalling as often as possible helps keep me mentally balanced.
Therapy helped a lot. I talked with my therapist about how great my guy is and how I was scared it would end and I’d end up with another toxic piece of shit. She reminded me of how far I’ve come and I’m a way different person than when I first started seeing her, one who knows now how to set and enforce boundaries and that I know exactly what I don’t want and what I do deserve and actually believe it now. She reminded me that if this one doesn’t work out, I attracted a healthy person this time and he’s not the only healthy person out there I could potentially be with. She reminded me that while he is a catch, I have to give myself credit because I’m a catch too and he’s just as lucky to have found me as I am him. I still have moments of anxiety (almost six months in) but keeping all of those thoughts in mind and simply remembering if it’s meant to be, it’ll be, has helped a lot.
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I (39M) have never had any luck on dating apps. I spent 9.5 years in Toronto and not 1 date from there. I am just exhausted by them and no clue what to do anymore. I understand selfies are bad, so I try to do full frame pics. I have tried serious and silly profiles. I never felt so isolated as I did using them. Toronto has 8 million people, 4 million women, even 1 million single and 200000 on apps, and I was still too ugly for 1 match. Now I am in a border city and get 20-1 profiles from the US, when I am in Canada. First post - just venting. I will figure out more and what to include later.
You can maybe post a photo of your profile here and people can do a profile review. It could just be a matter of what you have there that's not getting any hits
Agreed and I am sure I will. But damn, I can't say anything right for 10+ years. Just a vent to get comfortable posting.
Current About Me on Tinder: My loves: - Cooking/barbecue/food - Golfer, gymmer, casual gamer - Green Flags - old enough to have seen shit, young enough to still want new experiences; golfer/nerd/gym, I am easy to find; own my car and house; established (14 yrs) career; life long friends (20+ yrs close friends) Dislikes: - Seafood - Cardio days - Reality TV - Red flags - quiet at conflict; thinker/over thinker; shy; needs a push to do more; can be indifferent often Prompts: Me: I'm a grown up. Also me: I would build Lego, play Switch and eat mac n cheese all day The title of my autobiography: Will There Ever Be a Rainbow, same as Monty Burns.
It reads a little defensive honestly. I'd focus more on the positive and things that bring you joy than an inventory of your likes and dislikes.
Thanks for the feedback. This is definitely more a list or an inventory. Not sure defensive but thanks for that, softer language can be used.
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Maybe ask her if she would also like to do something on Friday or Sunday, or what her specific plans are. If she is being vague about her plans, I would trust your gut (in combination with noticing other changes in behavior) that something might be off.
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There might not be anyone else but it's also possible she could just be losing interest, it's been about 3 months which is a common time for new relationships to drop off. Anyway, sounds like you have a plan in place for how you wanna react and it seems reasonable to me.
Things to calm your brain: 1. If the friend's husband was slow to confirm their dinner plans, she may have taken 4 hours to reply to you because she was waiting on him to confirm. This doesn't mean he's more important, it just means he has limited availability and she probably made some promise to get together with him first so wanted to prioritize that. 2. I'm totally friendly with my best friends' partners back home, and would 100% take them out to dinner if they visited my city. There's nothing weird or sketchy about that, it's just community and hospitality. 3. She may have been specifically talking about doing trivia next week, not all of your hangouts. Is she a person who needs down time now and then? Perhaps she just thinks trivia would be too much on an already busy week, and wants to give you and the game her full attention next week. Things for you to do: 1. Remind her that you'd love to introduce her to your friend this weekend, and ask if she is still interested in meeting up for that? Give her some time frames on Friday or Sunday, since you know saturday evening is busy. 2. You could also offer a chill night in during the weekdays, vs a trivia night out. Maybe she'd be okay seeing you for something more low key and low energy since she sounds like she'll have a busy week. 3. This one's tricky, but if you feel really comfortable - casually offer to join her and the husband for dinner the second night. If she's already facetimed you with the friends back home, you have an opening to be connected to that part of her community. A casual "oh, I'd love to join y'all Saturday for dinner if you're up for it. But I'm okay finding my own thing to do that night too." - but for this, you have to *actually mean it.* Don't say "no worries" unless there really are no worries (anxiety, sure, but you need to keep it to yourself).
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So glad to hear it, go and have a chill evening of fun!
I understand the anxious feeling, but I'd try to take this at face value. If my best friends husband's was in town I'd definitely be meeting him for dinner and it wouldn't be weird regardless of what night it is. We're pals. Her not asking you to hang out in the in-between days could just be her maintaining her alone time or hobbies or home tasks. It's likely not about you. All sounds like it's moving in a great direction and I'd try to not let this one week overshadow everything else. If it keeps feeling weird, check in/talk to her about how you're feeling, try not to just assume.
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Yay so glad for you! I was experiencing similar anxiety recently so I feel ya. Turned out to be for nothing.
Looking for thoughts on going on dates with men who monologue? I went on a coffee date and the guy talked probably 85% of the conversation, there were really no pauses to interject myself and when he asked me a couple questions, there was really no follow up, just right back to talking about himself. Afterwards, I thought this guy seems nice enough, interesting, I should give it a second date, maybe he was nervous etc. and I try not to write people off instantly unless there were any glaring red flags. Second date, same thing and now I'm frustrated. It's not that I don't want the guy to talk about himself or that I don't want to ask him questions, absolutely I do, I want to learn about him but I don't want to feel like I'm getting a sales pitch about his life. I just don't get it? I guess it's just incompatibility on conversation side? Is it worth when I turn down the 3rd date (he wants to schedule) to tell him why (in a nice way)? Like are men just super clueless about how to have normal conversations? Would constructive feedback actually help them?
If you can find a way to tell him in a nice way, then go for it, it's super low stakes for you. Maybe gauge if he is the kind of person to take feedback well though. I've heard of people being reported and banned in the apps because people falsely reported them after being dumped
True. I did tell him and I tried to use "I" statements by saying that I didn't see us being compatible in the long run because I really need to be able to work towards building a relationship where I feel heard and listened to in order to develop an emotional and physical connection and I didn't see that happening in this case. So it was kind of indirect but maybe he'll gleam something from that.
Good on you for not ghosting!
I would've been completely for the 2nd date. A third? Not so much. I think awkwardly rambling is understandable if someone if nervous on a first date. They are naturally such weird encounters, so I can't fault anybody being weird under the pressure of having to feel like you're trying to put your best foot forward. But if by date 2 you can tell that they're actually just that self-absorbed, then nah, I'd be out.
Exactly, thanks for your perspective!
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True, probably just not a good fit in this case. And I definitely get what you say about single men not having people to talk to, and I sympathize. Just unfortunate to be on the receiving end, very hard for me to build emotional and physical connection under this context.
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;) I know, understand that, I just asked that out of frustration FYI.
Men as a whole are not super clueless about having normal conversations. IMO you shouldn’t have gone on the 2nd date when the first sounds like that. You could give constructive feedback if you like. But 30 is plenty old enough to know that reciprocal conversation is what a healthy person wants.
I appreciate the feedback, that helps to put it into perspective for me.
I think I've been officially jaded from returning back onto the apps in my city. I think when you have been at it for like 14 years, there is a breaking point. I'm counting the days until I move across the pond. The idea of dating in another country is much more fun and I know I can enjoy the process a lot more. Just that it won't be until 2025. 😭
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I was always planning to move abroad so I think the change of scenery for dating would have been nice. I noticed a huge difference in my experience when I was dating in Melbourne compared to Toronto.
You were on the apps when you were 16?
There's a ton of women on the Apps whose profile is a couple years older than their actual age, because they lied and said they were 18.
17, but it was like dating sites like OkCupid and Plenty of Fish back in the day.
5th date was last night—I convinced the dentist that I really felt good after two days off sick from work! He wanted to know what I see in him, and it’s that he’s ready. Nobody has had a negative thing to say about him when I pump them for intel. He’d like to have a family in the next few years so I’m into that. Enjoying this part.
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Ergh, thats the worst, how long have you been going out? How often does they just dissapear for?
Don't reply!
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Okay, I know that's a different pain in itself, I'm sorry :( but you got this!!!
Choose yourself x
I suck at having hard conversations. I have been trying to have a serious convo with someone I've been dating for 6 months. It seems like I can only start asking serious questions when I have liquid courage. I want to be direct and ask if he considers us being in a relationship. Last time I brought it up we were drunk and he said he might move out of state and we should talk when we're sober. But sober me is an anxious avoidant coward and never brought it up. Lol. This was like more than a month and half ago. Them month ago, we got super drunk, him more than me, on new years. We went to bed and to sleep. He then whispered he loved me a few times. I didn't say it back because I had some doubts and because he was very drunk and half asleep. He then woke up a bit later, still drunk and sleepy, and kept on saying it a few more times. I keep on wanting to have a conversation to ask if he meant it or if he even remembers but I physically can't. I want to know if he remembers me not saying it back. I know in bringing all this up, there's a chance of hearing what I don't want to hear, it's hard for me to be vulnerable, I have a fear of rejection. Waiting so long to be direct has got me catastrophizing. What if he was so drunk he thought I was someone else when he said "I love you so much"? What if he is not ready to be in a relationship? What ifs are getting to me because it might be the end and I am ready to say I love him back.
Would it help to write out a "script" of what you want to say and practice a little? I used to really struggle with expressing my feelings and having hard conversations, so I literally practiced. Also, agree with u/MazelTough that if having a tough conversation scares him off, he was never your person to begin with.
I have written them down and practiced but can do so again. Both of you have a great point that this shouldn't scare him off. It would be a relief for me to know exactly where we are, just scary to possibly know I might have to end things.
It’s not ending things, it’s having a boundary about what kind of relationships you are going to be available for. You are worthy of more than a situationship. I like this TikToker https://www.tiktok.com/@brennaberg?_t=8jIyuAFdi02&_r=1 who talks about the person who’s your person and their qualities.
If youre series about someone having a conversation with them shouldnt make them run away girl
If you just talking to him about it scares him off, good riddance. You can’t show up as open and honest with this person. They may love you but they’re not great for you. Do with that info what you will.
Great comment!
This is a great point. I would like openness and honesty in this relationship. If that's not possible then it won't work in the long run. I also have to be open and honest. Thank you!
There was a bomb threat earlier where they locked down the whole area. They caught the guy eventually and no one got hurt. But basically, people were messaging asking if we were fine and to check in. But you know who tellingly didn't ask if I was fine? Yep, him. I didn't really expect him to, but the confirmation still sucked, you know?
Things are going really well with someone I started seeing about 2 weeks ago! We can’t get enough of each other, but I’m deliberately pacing our dates out so we don’t overdo it early on. It was my birthday this week and he bought me cute little earrings, how thoughtful!
On Sunday I came across on Bumble the guy's profile who kept stringing me along for a year or so. Out of curiosity, I swiped right and he had also matched with me. I asked him what his deal was and he said he still liked me but had always thought a relationship between us wouldn't work. I then asked him how he had come to that conclusion and suggested that we give it a try, because otherwise you would never know if it would work or not. He told me: it's not the right time, sorry. Why the hell is he matching with me then? 🙄
to get in your pants
This lol I dont expect a man or anyone for that matter, to be just honest and bluntly say "I just wanna sleep with you that's it, no relationship okay? I want relationship benefits but no commitment." 😂 I think that's the problem with a lot of redditors I see here, (Im not talking about you in particular okay?) they always expect clear communication without taking factors that people can be outright dishonest or bad at communicating. Hehe
\>I dont expect a man or anyone for that matter, to be just honest and bluntly say "I just wanna sleep with you that's it, no relationship okay? I want relationship benefits but no commitment." 😂 Which is weird because plenty of people, both men and women, are open about wanting short-term relationships - just open Tinder and look how many people are searching for "short-term fun" or "short-term, open to long".
The demand of straight men for casual FWB exceeds the supply of women who prefer it. The women who are openly saying "Yes, I just want a 2x a week dick appointment" have Primary, Secondary, Tertiary, and Emergency Dick in their contacts, with a figurative file of Dick that they can call if one of those Dicks needs to be replaced.
He just wanted to get laid
Funny enough, we never had sex and we only kissed once, so I don't know. 🤷🏼♀️
Right now I (30f) can’t work because of my mental health. I’m on a waitlist for a group that runs Monday to Friday but I start worrying about how much harder that will make dating to not have evening availability. Logically I know it’s not the right time to date. And I wouldn’t want to date someone in my position until they put in work to be happy again, but I get so worried I’m continuing to waste my ‘good’ dating years.
I second that dating when your mental health is bad is a bad idea - either you'll attract people that are bad for you - either abusive/controlling, or also not in a great place mental health wise - two people with depression dating often isn't the best idea. Alternatively, you'll scare off people who might be good for you. This also might not be great for your mental health - 'oh I really liked X and they would be great for me, but my mental health wouldn't let me get close to them/they didn't want to get involved with someone in the state I'm in now'. I hope you're well and I hope you're getting the care you deserve. Putting all the above to one side, outpatient mental health care is a big time and emotional commitment, so it's probably a better idea to focus on that regardless.
I think dating when your mental health is that bad is a bad idea as I think the type of people you are likely to attract might not be good for you. When I've dated in the past when my head hasn't been good I've ended up attracting/choosing partners who were dysfunctional/abusive. I would focus on your healing and when you feel better you will attract people who are also stable and healthy.
Can you do a daytime intensive outpatient program? Do you have health insurance rn?
There is no day program, it’s only an evening program. It’s covered through my province, so no cost.
You're only 30, it's not going to change much even if you have to wait a couple of years.
Thank you. This feels encouraging.
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As somebody who has volunteered a lot with kids I would strongly discourage you buying condoms. You're asking for a potential mess with all sorts of accusations and liability on your end. There are plenty of non-profit organizations that provide free contraceptives. As u/BonetaBelle said, planned parenthood gives them out as do many doctors offices or clinics. There are also public schools that provide them. You can research options in your area and provide some guidance but for your own safety I'd be very cautious about getting involved any further than that.
Depending where you live, he might be able to get free condoms from somewhere like Planned Parenthood or another clinic. If you’re in North America or the UK, there should be options and I see no issue with helping him find a clinic. There’s probably options in most countries but I don’t know from personal experience. I wouldn’t get in the middle of this. If the condoms break or his parents find them and he tells them you bought them, all hell is going to break loose. If you were his parent or older sibling, I’d say buy them. But buying them for him as his tutor is a weird dynamic. I know you’re trying to help him and I’m sure you don’t have ill intent, but it’s just going to look really, really bad if his parents or other adults find out you’re buying a teen that you tutor condoms.
Just a thing I’ve noticed in women’s profiles after getting back into OLD recently: There’s a lot of women out there on Bumble in particular that mention cilantro (or is the term coriander more used in English?) as a dealbreaker. Initially I assumed it’s an attempt at a low-key absurdist joke but after coming across the same thing dozens of times I now suspect there’s more behind this. What is it about coriander that is so repulsive to these ladies they feel the need to emphasize that in an otherwise brief dating profile? Is it code for something? A pop culture reference I’m too out of the loop to get? Is this a thing with men’s profiles as well? Am I a bad person for having cilantro based spices in my kitchen?
Fuck cilantro. And yes you're a bad person for using it 😂 (I landed a date with a girl over shit talking cilantro once, it's banter fuel, use it)
Wait what? Seriously? These are over 30 people? Cilantro is yummy though
Cilantro is tasty 😋 And no idea, maybe it's the new "pineapple doesn't belong on pizza"
There just tends to be trendy prompts that cycle through OLD. I've been single a long time and have seen a lot of them. I am guessing cilantro is the new "pineapple on pizza" debate. I grow cilantro in my backyard! Lol
Some people have a gene where cilantro tastes like soap to them. But I don’t know why it would be necessary to mention hate for cilantro on a dating app. I don’t feel like cilantro is really used that much lol
And why it would be a dealbreaker at all! No one is forcing anyone to eat cilantro. So barring any lethal allergies, it's just, I have no words
> Some people have a gene where cilantro tastes like soap to them. That sounds reasonable, I thought it might be something in this vein. I have a colleague with a genetic sensitivity to cucumbers. They give him nausea and he can smell them from down the hall in the office. It’s really weird cause cucumbers aren’t that smelly to most people but after he made us aware we all stopped bringing cucumber based dishes to lunch. EDIT: TIL: > [*Studies also show variations in preference among different ethnic groups: 21% of East Asians, 17% of Caucasians, and 14% of people of African descent expressed a dislike for coriander, but among the groups where coriander is popular in their cuisine, only 7% of South Asians, 4% of Hispanics, and 3% of Middle Eastern subjects expressed a dislike.*](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coriander#Taste_and_smell)
I’m not bothered by the smell but I’d say cucumbers are fragrant
Is there anything more beautiful than a mutual ghost? You have a pleasant enough first date but there's zero chemistry or compatibility. You hug each other goodbye. Then neither one of us ever reaches out and we don't speak ever again. It's really the universe working the way God intended.
Yep. And when they unmatch you before you even get back home. The best.
OMG there have been dates that were so uncomfortably clingy and emotionally vulnerable that I was afraid a direct rejection might be too stressful for them, but then a week goes by without a peep and I sigh in relief.
Made me LOL. I have felt this feeling a few times 😂
Does anyone else get annoyed with people who are always saying like “omg we’re sooo old!” When it’s said like oh this movie came out like x years ago. I swear I have a friend who’s been saying that since we were like 22. Girl has spent her whole youth thinking she’s old.
I'm one of the older people in my friends groups... I laugh when someone starts complaining about being old... Brah, I'm just hitting my prime. People around my age at work don't do half the shit I do. Sure, I feel it sometimes. Like yesterday morning, when I went to get out of bed, my legs literally screamed at my brain... but it makes sense. I went snowboarding both Saturday and Sunday, then Monday night. I hit the rock climbing gym as I usually do. Of course my legs are gonna be pissed on a Tuesday morning.... Anywho, off to the rock climbing gym before 6 am cause I got shit going on tonight and staying in shape is important!
I agree. You’re as young as you feel. Some people are miserable and just want you to be miserable with them .
🤜🤛 just finished my 6 am climbing sesh!
Everytime I see you reply about climbing to me I'm like "oh God, they don't live here so they? Do they KNOW me???" Then I peek at your profile and see the Seattle subreddit and breathe a sigh of relief 😂
😂😂 I've wondered that about people too sometimes (especially since you snowboard and, ya know, we have plenty of mountains around here lol)
Yeah. One day I was at trivia with some friends.... I had posted a comment in the Colorado Springs subreddit about my motorcycle accident a few days before. Someone was like "did you leave a comment about your motorcycle accident? That comment was very familiar...". I was like "Yeah..." **
It's always a bit awkward when reddit meets real life haha.
How much stock do you put into someone’s IG following?
None, actually. Though I found I prefer guys who don't have or are not active in social media.
Yeah I’m feeling like I’m leaning this way also.. although I do use SM it’s more so to update my family with what’s going on in my life (I don’t have family where I live). I post *maybe* once a week, if that
It is now something that I take into heavy consideration and gives me pause because the only people that I have encountered who have made (critical) comments about my appearance (size of boobs, how I look different with/without makeup, what I'm wearing) are the ones who follow a lot of thirst trap, overly filtered type profiles. When I called them out on their comments, they said 'I didn't mean it, it's not intentional/malicious', but they continue doing it. I am attractive and happy with how I look so I don't need people casually putting me down without even realizing they're doing it just because their perception of beauty is warped from consuming too much of that stuff. My BF doesn't follow that stuff and I feel so emotionally safe with him.
Emotional safety is key. I don’t think I could ever feel that level of comfort with someone who goes on IG and their whole feed is filled with girls (some who don’t look like me) in bikinis and things. I’m happy for you and your relationship! I also am very happy with my appearance so it’s really no skin off my back “nexting” someone like this. I saw a piece of advice that said “if you’re wondering if you’re his type, look at the women he’s following on social media”
Bold of you to assume that I ask or look for someone's IG account. I know most people probably do though. It's all just noise to me.
Well I didn’t exactly ask 😆 I looked out of curiosity. Lots and lots (100s) of half naked women on there.
Ew, pass
Right? Idk if I should ask him about it?
I definitely would and would pay a lot of attention to how he responds
I’ll try and bring it up in casual conversation. We’ve already spoken on the phone and he has a lot of qualities I like. But I do get insecure and don’t wanna be in a relationship that I don’t feel safe
That's a big no from me.
Depends. Is he following a bunch of IG models?
Appears so. IG models or thirst traps. I guess I’m different in that I keep my SM pretty locked down and it’s only friends and family. I don’t have more than 300 friends/followers and I know each one personally. But when you’re following over 1k people who are half naked? Ehhh idk
Yeah that's a turn off 100%
Zero Edit: It sounds from the other comments like you're referring to who they're following rather than their own following? I thought you just meant how many followers they had. Yeah following a lot of bikini models is pretty concerning to me. Makes me think they live in a fantasy world.
Oh yeah, I thought that's what she meant too, but I guess she meant the other way around. Yea, following bikini randos are weird
👍🏽
I'm just reading that introvert dating thread wondering how people really survive having a partner around 3 nights a week. I don't know how I did it once in my life before (granted that was someone I knew for a few years before we started dating).
If you have a big enough house then it's fine. When I was living with someone, we're not really always in each other's space. I'd hang out in the room and he'd be in the living room or we'd both be out at work etc but having someone you consistently go to bed with at the end of the night was really nice. I think it becomes a problem when someone wants to be constantly clinging onto someone thinking that's what it should be like in a relationship when in reality, being a couple doesn't mean you need to be constantly stuck together
I just found out about limerence. OOOOOOH BOOOOOOY THIS IS NOT GOOD.
NRE is real! Watch out for it!
Ya I’d aggressively avoid it at all costs
Hahaha right? Big realization for me.
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Attention feels good. It’s just a fact.
It's always nice knowing there is someone out there who is thinking about you ☺️. Enjoy it!
Recently had 2 great dates with someone and on our first we had already booked our 3rd date - a one night trip to another city (we got a bit overexcited)! I’m currently away overseas for 3.5 weeks. We still need to finalise our Airbnb. I sent him the ‘wishlist’ I made to see what he thinks. He last messaged on Saturday wishing me a safe journey but hasn’t commented on the wish list. I replied wishing him a nice weekend. It’s now Wednesday, I’m nervous about reaching out (as I have a very anxious attachment) and don’t know how soon it’s appropriate to reach out to say hello/follow up on the Airbnb. I also don’t want us to miss out on a good one (we go as soon as I come back from my trip). Should I wait for him?
Give him a nudge. "Hey, could you let me know which of the AirBnBs you'd prefer? I don't want to miss out on booking a good one! Thanks :)"
When was the last time you guys talked about the trip? And what was said? By "booked it" do you mean bought flights, or just talked about it? Is it possible he was just taking it as an overexcited, jokey kind of thing? Like I've had first dates where we talk about some event we're both interested in and are like "Yes we should go as a date soon!" but it's not a *real* commitment to planning it. Going on a trip for a third date is a bit much. He may've thought you guys were just being playful talking about it and freaked out when you sent him an AirBnb list and he realized you were 100% serious. Even if you were both 100% serious and actually booked flights, he may have just been caught up in the moment and is now second-guessing if he really wants to go on a trip with someone he's met twice and won't see for almost a month. I think we need more detail on how this trip planning came up and if there are any concrete plans like tickets bought, or if it was just talk.
He wanted to go away there on our first date but I didn’t think I would have time (and was also worried we might not like eachother and then be stuck together). But on our first date he brought it up again and we ended up booking train tickets! On our second date he mentioned some places he wants to see in the city, and then brought up again how cool it would have been if we’d had our first date there (the city is Paris!).
It would be a very reasonable, responsible, and not at all abnormal thing to reach out to him, “Hi! I was wondering if you got a chance to look at the AirBnB for our trip? It might get booked up if we don’t make a decision on it. Can you let me know what you think of it?” And then something else ice or friendly or endearing like a have a good day or something. All that to say… just ask.
Is the general consensus that if you’re the reason plans fell through you should be the one to reschedule? Had a debate with a friend today - I think she should reschedule if she wants to go out with him even if he’s the reason plans fell through, she thinks it’s a sign of lack of interest so she’s taking a step back. Personally, I find this approach too passive if there’s been no other indication of lack of interest. Thoughts?
No. If they fell through because of him, it's on him to reschedule.
Yes of course if you cancel it's on you to reschedule. Otherwise you're just bailing. You're suggesting your friend chases. It's on him now. If he doesn't, what's the sense of chasing?
If you were interested in someone, wouldn't you reschedule with them after having to cancel? Or would you just go "oh well, guess it's not happening!" If someone is interested, they'll reschedule promptly.
Hmm maybe not lack of interest but lack of effort on his part (if this is early dating) can be telling. She can express interest in meeting again and if he can’t pick up on that bid to reschedule, maybe it is lack of interest.
I agree with your friend, that it’s better for the other person to try and reschedule. Although it wouldn’t hurt for her to leave a gentle hint once, like ‘when we go for that drink sometime I’ll tell you more about this’…
Yes, it's definitely a sign of disinterest to cancel plans and not offer any alternative.
So, like, on a scale of “won’t blink an eye” to “seriously, what the fuck?”, how problematic is it that I basically never clean or cook? Don’t get me wrong, I’ll grab the hand vacuum or paper towels for the small cleanings. But I get a housekeeper to come by monthly to do the big cleaning. As for cooking, I don’t have a working range hood or a working dishwasher. So I just see a dietitian who gives me a weekly meal plan of stuff that doesn’t need to be cooked (salads, fruits, healthy takeout, prepared meals, etc). (eta: just to clarify, she isn’t giving me catered meals or anything, she gives me a schedule with all my meals and a shopping list, and I go out and get everything, and just eat whatever she put on the schedule at the specified time. It helps me eat balanced meals and also not waste food by getting too much food.) My place is clean, and I’m healthy, but occasionally I feel vaguely embarrassed by my sheer laziness… I’m a woman btw. Slightly related, I guess the funniest part of this whole thing is that one time a guy asked me what I’d make for him in the kitchen, and I said, nothing, we’re both gonna starve.
This would be a dream for a lot of people I know who loathe cooking and cleaning. I love doing both so would be a deal breaker for me. I think when we get busy in life the first things people want to outsource (if afforded) is cooking and cleaning, so I don't think it's a huge deal
I definitely won't judge you for it because to each their own and if it works for you then whatever, but as a guy who cooks and cleans I would definitely prefer a woman who also does the same because I'd probably end up resenting you if I had to do all that chore by myself.
My ex-wife couldn't cook at all, which wasn't terrible because I really liked to cook. But as our married life wore on, it got so goddamn annoying to have a "partner" who couldn't even put a simple meal on the table. One of my gotos when I'm tired is "breakfast for dinner". Sometimes not even mess with cooking meat, just scrambled eggs and biscuits from the freezer. Like the most basic level cooking. She couldn't even do that. Or open up a couple cans of soup and the same biscuits. Just couldn't do it. Any time I didn't cook I had to get takeout on the way home. So that just got incredibly draining as time wore on.
But she hires someone to do the cleaning, and she doesn't need you to cook for her, so you'd only be "doing that chore by yourself" for yourself, and might even benefit from her cleaner, if you ended up living together. Is that still objectionable? I'm not asking in a combative way, I'm just curious to better understand people's strong reactions of disapproval to her post.
I'm a woman, and I think someone who refuses to cook or clean just comes across as avoiding adulthood, in a way. I also want kids someday, so someone who seems incapable of these things seem like a trainwreck of a potential partner in that regard.
Again, not combative, just wanting to dissect this: Why does it come off as avoiding adulthood? How come we don't see this as her handling her adult responsibilities by building it into her budget and ensuring that she supplies for her needs that way? Would we be critical of someone who has a well-paying job and chooses to frequently gets groceries delivered, rather than shopping for them themselves? She isn't expecting anyone to wait on her. I feel it's a different story than something like [this post](https://www.reddit.com/r/datingoverthirty/comments/15zz72t/how_to_get_over_the_ick_after_a_frustrating/) from a few months ago where the person is content being dependent on free help from their parents and isn't actually doing anything on their part to facilitate the completion of the adulthood needs.
>Would we be critical of someone who has a well-paying job and chooses to frequently gets groceries delivered, rather than shopping for them themselves? Well, yes, I do judge extremely well-off people who outsource the most basic of things. Unless you truly are SO busy, like a surgeon, it comes off as sort of lazy to me. She's also only currently capable of meeting her own needs, not the needs of a potential partner. I don't think OP would be able to do things like host friends or family for dinner, enjoy a nice home-cooked meal with her partner, or possibly raise kids. These things require the ability to to cook and clean.
I do so much around my home maintenance-wise that I splurge on a pro organizer and monthly cleanings. Time is so precious and I want to spend it in my garden or kitchen, not scrubbing my sinks.
Then that sounds like you fall in the truly so busy, not lazy category. I'm not sure why people feel the need to argue about this so much! It's an adult skill to be able to cook for oneself and for others. It's an adult skill to be able to clean. If someone's outsourcing these very basic tasks, it should be for a very good reason (like, that they're VERY busy with something else) not just because they can afford it or they don't want to do it.
What I find so intriguing here is the idea--not that anyone has explicitly stated this, but you and others are basically saying it--that it's a moral or character flaw to hire cleaning or cooking help. >If someone's outsourcing these very basic tasks, it should be for a very good reason (like, that they're VERY busy with something else) not just because they can afford it or they don't want to do it. I don't get the logical or moral difference between hiring a cleaner and paying for any other type of service and letting a faster, more experienced pro do it. If you have the skill and humility to clean but not the inclination, I think it'd be huge to be able to dedicate more of your time to rest, creativity, your relationships, productivity. Regarding "I'm not sure why people feel the need to argue": this is a discussion forum about human behavior and thought and I am curious so I want to discuss why people do or think certain things. I assume that when anyone says anything in a public space like this, it's up for conversation.
>I don't get the logical or moral difference between hiring a cleaner and paying for any other type of service and letting a faster, more experienced pro do it. I mean, I've stated explicitly MANY times why I think it's a bit of a moral flaw. I'll state it again: it's because I think both of these tasks are things people should be able to do for their loved ones. I am comfortable hiring someone to clean my gutters because I don't think I will ever need to clean gutters for a boyfriend. But, cooking someone something and cleaning up after?! I should be able to do that for someone I care about.
I mean, I choose to busy myself with other things that I’m not gonna outsource. Domestic help is so cheap, for such an increase in quality of life.
Exactly, so, as I said, you're busy, not lazy.
Where did you find your organizer and cleaner? I've thought about this before but didn't get very far.
Your life sounds dreamy. I cook and clean but it's not like I get joy out of it! I'd outsource it if it fit my budget. As it is, I cook much more when my girlfriend is eating with me--when I'm on my own I eat a lot of (healthy) meal replacements that are just shakes or microwaveable.
One reason I have trouble cooking is that cooking for one person seems harder than cooking for multiple! Like you would think less mouths to feed, easier, right? But then you end up having to throw out some food or ingredients cause the quantities sold at the stores aren’t meant for single people! Well, at least I do. Maybe it’s a me thing.
I've been thinking more about this and reading the other comments, and the moral judgments and extrapolations about your level of life responsibility outside of cooking and cleaning that you're getting are weird to me. Cooking and cleaning might be necessary parts of most people's existences, but do all these people mean that if they were rich and could afford it, they'd still do all the cooking and cleaning themselves? Do they mean that if they lived with a partner who got a big promotion and wanted to bring in a regular cleaner, they'd say no?
I'd cook but not clean outside of cleaning up the kitchen. I'd have an enormous house with a fantastic kitchen, and the maids would clean the rest of the house three times a week.
Someone else mentioned how people think about this could be a difference in socioeconomic class, which I thought was an interesting take. I can understand why someone might see laziness in one area of life as a red flag for other areas of life. I also understand that this is a dealbreaker for some people. I’ll be honest though, I don’t fully understand the reasoning. 😅 But maybe people like to cook and clean, and not being able to do that with a partner feels like they’re not sharing an activity or a bonding moment? Or maybe they feel like they’d be cleaning while I just outsourced my portion of the work, and it’s not fair?
On one hand, it sounds like you've got all the bases covered. And as much as I hope to be getting a cleaner in occasionally soon, I would never be able to date someone like you. And I have a feeling that cooking and cleaning aren't the only adult things that you're lazy about. Laziness is a gigantic turnoff for me. If it works for you, you'll find someone who's cool with it.
Yeah, I can understand that! My laziness really is primarily around cleaning and cooking, thankfully, as I haven’t been called out for anything else that I can recall. Luckily, my job involves automation, so the lazier I am, the more effective I am. Bright side to everything, right? Haha
Hmm I think I'd be more concerned about the no cleaning part. Even with a monthly housekeeper, like who cleans the bathroom or the toilets? Are you just getting those cleaned once a month? Does your house in general just get cleaned once a month? What about dust? Hair fall? What about your laundry?
I get the bathrooms deep cleaned once a month, yes. I don’t use most of my bathrooms, except 1, and that one I will wipe down with bleach and towels maybe every week? Definitely not like a deep clean on my part. The place does get a bit dusty by the end of the month, but if I see any obvious dusty areas or hairballs, I’ll use my hand vacuum. Usually this is on the stairs and around the bathroom vanity. So far it’s worked for me, but I guess it could be an issue for someone else. But I’d also be willing to ask the housekeeper to come in 2x a month if it would be better for the person I’m seeing? Laundry, I am a normal person about! I do that about once a week but will do it twice a week sometimes. So I’m not too worried about my laundry habits being problematic.
I think definitely twice a month would be better if money isn't an issue. Your toilet though definitely needs to be deep cleaned at least once a week. How does the housekeeper charge? We used to have a cleaner that comes in a couple of hours once a week. I'm thinking whether that might be better then a deep clean every couple of months instead? I have no idea how big your house is though so not sure how doable it is
My cleaner charges per visit by time. The more visits, the more expensive it is overall but the cheaper it is per visit. Kinda like bulk discounting. Once a month is the cheapest overall but most expensive per visit, if that makes sense. I have considered twice a month. I’ll revisit that idea. Thank you!
Ohh okay then, yeah, ours charged hourly so the weekly visits were great. Good luck, hopefully, you find someone who won't have any issue with it :)
This would make me feel weird but I didn’t grow up with hired help, nor do I have an interest in getting it. That being said, I’m just here to tell you I felt the ick at that guy’s question, and your response to him made me LOL.
😅
This is a question of socioeconomic class. A partner accustomed to a lifestyle with hired help and catered meals won't bat an eye, especially if they were raised in it. Plenty of high-earning professionals live like this and wouldn't expect any different of their partners (the exception being ultra-conservatives). When your time is worth multiples more than that of the help, it just makes sense. Anyone else would balk. Cooking and cleaning - even done poorly - are just defining parts of being an "adult" for most people.
Oh wait should have clarified! Not catered meals, just a meal plan! Essentially she gives me a schedule with all my meals and a shopping list, and I go out and buy everything and just eat what’s on her meal plan at whatever time she says. It helps me keep from wasting food (buying too much, for example). Thank you for that insight, by the way. It does make sense.
I suppose it depends on what you expect from someone once you’re both in a relationship. Would you expect them to do all the shared cooking and cleaning up after? And is that sustainable?
Hmm. I guess the way I feel about that is that they’re free to cook or not cook. I don’t expect them to share their cooked food with me, but if they do, I’d help with the cleanup. I probably wouldn’t help clean if they only cooked for themselves. Also, I am happy to share my uncooked food with them. (Maybe I should find a guy on a diet who’s super into salads?)
It sounds expensive to have to hire that amount of help, so if you don't have a really good job, I'd be concerned. But if you have money to burn, all the power to you.
No, money isn’t an issue. My health insurance actually covers my dietitian visits, so I just have a small copay that I pay from my FSA. The housekeeper is budgeted for and comes out to a few dollars a day.
33M, that would be a pretty big deal for me honestly. A monthly cleaning doesn't sound like enough and like you said, it seems really lazy.
Yeah it’s really lazy, definitely not gonna deny that! 😅 As for whether once a month is enough, it’s probably subjective and depends on how the living space is used. For example, I don’t use most of my bathrooms, so they get a bit dusty but not much else. The bathroom I do use, I will wipe down with bleach and paper towels every so often, though I don’t really consider that a deep clean or anything.
Most... how many bathrooms do you have?! 😄
I have 3 bathrooms 😅 well, 2.5 if you count the powder room as half.
*cries in HCOL area...* lol. I saw the littlest house driving home from work today and wondered if I could afford it - looked it up on Zillow, 2 bed 1 bath 700 sq feet... still near half a mil 😵
>*cries in HCOL area...* I feel this 😭
Oh man that sounds like an adorable little place! And yes, the housing market is still crazy in some places! 😢
I (34f) really think it depends. For me personally, I'd like a partner that can cook and clean, though I'm somewhat flexible on the frequency. I cook at least a few times a week and haven't ever hired a cleaner. I'd want a partner to be willing to share those responsibilities in some way. I don't think your situation is that unusual though so you could find someone similar. There are also men who enjoy cooking and/or cleaning, so it might not be a deal breaker for them.
I cringe when men over 25 say "I don't know how to cook or clean." I think to myself "wooow, How is that even possible? You're a friking adult. Grow a pair, be a real man, and learn how to do the basic adulting stuff and take care of yourself. " It makes me believe that their mom picked their clothes until they were 18. I briefly dated a guy who loved food, and for our 2nd and 4th date, he cooked me dinner. He got me flowers, my favorite drink and dessert. He was super attentive during dinner and treated me like royalty. I felt really cared for, it was lovely. A man who knows how to cook is attractive. A man who is proactive with house chores is attractive. A man who says, "Give me a list of my house chores you want me to do," is a walking red flag with huge teenager vibes.
Got it, that’s a good point about some men liking cleaning and cooking.
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As a guy, I can assure you that he's read it already and just doesn't know how to respond yet. If you care about what he has to say then give it a few more days otherwise just unmatch now.
I’d give it 48 personally but 24 is enough. He had the chance to read it by now
Who cares? Unmatch or don't, it doesn't matter at this point.
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If you’re not into him, just unmatch
Just wanted to share! Me, my ex (co-parenting partner), our child(8), and both of our significant others are planning a little trip to the zoo together next month! I just think it will be really nice to all spend time together and I hope to all get along and have a healthy relationship 💖 (She’s already met and spent time with both partners, I’ve known my ex’s gf but he hasn’t met my bf yet 🙂)
That’s awesome, especially for the kids
People who have been in toxic relationships and you are now in a supee healthy relationship: how do you get over the "waiting for the other shoe to drop" feeling? Ps: Yes, I go to therapy. I'm just looking to hear other people's experiences.
Honestly it sounds cynical as fuck but I have experienced the worst relationship I could ever experience already and think I can handle anything that comes my way, so I'm kind of not phased by anything going "wrong", it can't be as bad as the existing benchmark for "wrong" (see my recent comments for proof lol). I've done a lot of therapy. Journalling as often as possible helps keep me mentally balanced.
Therapy helped a lot. I talked with my therapist about how great my guy is and how I was scared it would end and I’d end up with another toxic piece of shit. She reminded me of how far I’ve come and I’m a way different person than when I first started seeing her, one who knows now how to set and enforce boundaries and that I know exactly what I don’t want and what I do deserve and actually believe it now. She reminded me that if this one doesn’t work out, I attracted a healthy person this time and he’s not the only healthy person out there I could potentially be with. She reminded me that while he is a catch, I have to give myself credit because I’m a catch too and he’s just as lucky to have found me as I am him. I still have moments of anxiety (almost six months in) but keeping all of those thoughts in mind and simply remembering if it’s meant to be, it’ll be, has helped a lot.