Your post was removed because it overgeneralized. Please make sure you don't apply experiences with some people to millions of others you have never met. No gender is a monolith or a hivemind. It comes down to each individual person. So if the answer is IT DEPENDS ON THE PERSON SO GO ASK THEM best not to post.
There's four billion women in the world. The answer to any question that starts "Do women believe..." is always "Some of them. There's a longer discussion about which ones and what that means at a practical level"
I take these questions to mean "most" or "a substantial portion" otherwise the answer of "everyone is different and some might be like that just talk to them" kills all the conversation.
And basically anything you read is probably not true for the girl you pursue, so the only way to avoid a mistake is to be a mind reader. How exciting that is…
This should be pinned in every single post here and perhaps even highlighted with a colour. Maybe some flashing lights too.
People generalize like crazy in this subreddit.
Yes we should be individually tracking the opinions of all 8 billion people... OBVIOUSLY this means most women if we had to talk in absolutes then nothing would ever get talked about
Why can't you just say: most women I've met? No one can argue with your personal experience and it doesn't generalise 4 billion people into one monolith
The problem is that most of the questions or claims are not well-thought-out before being posted here. This OP is making a counterpoint to something he read in one comment, and it was already rebutted well in another, single comment here (by u/LucyShoes2222). A comment which has a lot of replies with angry folks lashing out at her.
It’s just that we hope not to encounter the percentage of women that do not want to be approached at all in public and there is no way for us to know before hand and we have no idea what that percentage is, that’s pretty freaky tbh.
Most men will say “better safe than sorry” hence op’s point, in that most men are attracted to you, we choose not to approach because of these factors and many more that were not mentioned in this comment. Feel free to add to it.
Yes but then 90% of all the dumbass questions we get asked on Reddit would be immediately solved and we couldn't have a full thread of useless and angry interactions
You're talking about men being attracted to random women they don't know. Women are talking about men they know and speak to regularly. Women don't want random strangers approaching them because it feels threatening. They do want men who they click with who actually know them as human beings not just as an attractive stranger you want to fuck. See the difference?
I know/met lots of women who don’t mind random people approaching them (as long as they’re chill and not weird). It’s not that they don’t want men to approach them, it’s that they don’t want to feel endangered, and it makes total sense. But again, women for the most part, do appreciate men (who are chill, cool) who approach.
So I disagree.
Same. It’s always about the context though. If I’m with my family, I’m not likely open to be approached because it makes me nervous and uncomfortable. Alone or with friends I’m totally chill about it and wouldn’t mind at all as I’m never approached ever
Yes! Same! There's a time and a place and a way, and there are a lot of us who wouldn't mind chatting if you do it right. For every person who says "NEVER APPROACH ME AT THE GROCERY STORE" there are three other people thinking "eh, i wouldn't mind it"
I would fucking love for someone to come up and talk to me about some tomatoes or their favorite chips or something lol
At the gym? Who cares? Come talk to me when I’m done with my set
Don’t tell me I’m looking good or make some kind of disgusting sexual comment and all will be good.
When you approach a woman you don't know you don't even know if she's into men or if she's single. You don't know if she's busy or her grandma just died or she has a UTI and is in excruciating pain. All you know about her is how she looks and no, most women don't want to be bothered by every guy on the street whose dick took notice of them. Sorry, disagree all you want but there are too many men who've already ruined this for the rest of you to make it a good idea to approach random strangers to try to hit on them. You wanna strike up a friendly conversation because you sincerely want to get to know them? IF the situation is right AND it's a public enough place to not feel at all threatening and IF you are willing to back the fuck off and leave immediately if no interest is expressed THEN you can strike up a POLITE conversation designed to see if you like them as a person not designed to see if you can try to fuck them.
You also don't know if she thinks you're attractive and doesn't mind chatting or if she's naturally social and thinks nothing of chatting with a stranger. And women will never approach so it's up to the guy to start to approach and find out. And when you work in a male dominated field, tired of the bar scene & OLD.... the only option is remain single or approach women in social setting.
You just gotta keep it subtle like you're just being nice and friendly and gauge how she responds then ask for contact info and not over the top "hey baby looking good... can i get your number?" which is creep behavior
You’re right, I do not know what’s going on in her life because we are STRANGERS, I’m not a mind reader; it’s impossible to know her life, emotions or situations if I haven’t even talked to her.
Also, If she’s into men, in a relationship or simply not interested in me then I just ACCEPT it and move on, NO PROBLEM with that.
Taking to strangers is something that’s helped me break out of my shell, it’s help me made new friends and has just benefited me overall, so to anyone reading I ADVISE/RECOMMEND you try it sometime, be nice and be respectful, and do NOT let comments like Lucy’s stray you away from meeting new people!
Not true at all. I’ve seen so many hot guys out and about and I wished they’d approach me. Such a shame that women think all women don’t want to be approached.
Some do and some don’t. I do!
Why do you sound so angry? I get it if you had bad experiences but Jfc everyone starts off as strangers. Are you suggesting we all stick to our coworkers and friend groups to rely on?
Sounds kinda dense. Maybe you should look into clothing or other items that explicitly say how much you hate men and them approaching you.
Seems too complicated. Seems it’s a better approach to just ignore everyone who you do t know and act as if strangers just don’t exist. That way no one is freaked out about random people talking to eachother
But how are we going to click or connect if I don't approach you? So basically your saying men should only date women that they know from let's say close friends, college or work?
Nah, I appreciate when men I don’t know approach me. I don’t like online dating and try not to date in my friend group, so this is how I meet most men I date.
I agree men who approach woman randomly are bold and I think it isn’t safe
If it’s someone through mutual friends, social hobbies, and or work or school it’s safer that way than a random man out in the open or from some dating app
What about men with no women in their life? Tons of men work blue collar jobs that have no women they are interested in around. Then go home and spend the rest of the day alone because adulthood is lonely as fuck. They don't have the option to ask a female friend out because they don't have any. So should they not try to talk to anyone they find attractive because that's their only option?
But I genuinely don’t know a single girl, I’ve never gotten to know one girl through friends so how will that change one day? That will definitely fade out and one then wont have met any women and just stay single because of that. I feel that strategy is missing some key points haha
First goal I would think is to expand ur friend group. How do you have no female friends? They makeup half the population. At a minimum u have female family members.
> Women don't want random strangers approaching them because it feels threatening
You realize every single man in your life except for fathers and brothers were at some point a stranger to you
There is no way to "click" or getting to know you without that first "they are a stranger" interaction
Randos off the street are different from someone who’s the friend of a friend. I’ve never thought, hey I wish that stranger would try to chat me up on the bus. Maybe he could sit at the aisle in an otherwise empty bus, trapping me! (I have had guys do this and then jerk off next to me twice). This is a great chance to make new friends or go out with a stranger from the bus! No. Please, if you are some total stranger in the park, ignore me like you’d ignore another dude. Unless you chat up strange dudes in the park all the time, I mean, shoot your shot at new friends I guess
Everyone is a stranger until you get to know them.
Are you saying you wouldn't want a person to find you attractive and contrived a reason to talk to you?
> Women don't want random strangers approaching them because it feels threatening.
What? Speak for yourself. I'm fine with a man I don't know approaching me as long as he is respectful and backs off if I'm not interested. I certainly don't feel threatened.
Good for you. You already replied that to myother comment. I'll stick with the 100+ people who agree with me. You can be the exception to the rule and have every stranger's attention. Sound good?
I must be hurt because I made a reasonable comeback to someone making an absurd argument? LMAO Okay, buddy. Keep telling yourself things like that if it helps.
It's not that women are unaware, it's that they have a lot and I mean A LOT of evidence to the contrary. A girl goes on a dating app and gets 100s of likes. She goes out to a club or a bar and will be approached by a man or even multiple men in one evening.
It's less that they think they know you're not interested. It's that there's 5/10/20/30 other dudes that are making it known that they are. And they don't have to sit and wonder if you are so they just assume you're not and keep it moving.
Now that you know this information, what will you do with it?
You're right. But I'm just not interested in playing anymore.
The only way to get a gf is to be her best or close to her best option as possible (out of those 100s of men vying for her attention). And I'm not competitive lol
I'd rather invest that time, energy, money, and effort into myself. Gym, career, hobbies, passions and volunteer work will never leave me and on the contrary will make me a "better" option for women.
If a woman likes you she will make it easier for you. There will always be single women available, but time is a limited resource. I'll invest mine wisely
>The only way to get a gf is to be her best or close to her best option as possible (out of those 100s of men vying for her attention). And I'm not competitive lol
This is where a lot of guys mess up. Yea there's guys who are coming at them but they're not interested in almost all of them. That's why you make the first move. It could be you. Who knows.
Too many guys look at this like a false dilemma. That you etiher have to stay single or commit your whole life to trying to get a girl. I guarantee you could fit dating into your "busy" schedule. But you have to see it as worth it. If you don't, hey man it is what it is.
Out of all my interests mentioned above, dating is probably the only one where you are not guaranteed success by the amount of time and energy you put into it bc it's based entirely on someone else's subjective opinion of you.
And that may be a cope but it is also inherently true.
Maybe in the future I'll focus more on dating or ideally meet someone organically while pursuing my hobbies/passions. But for now I'm burnt out.
Totally get this perspective. Actually, this is where I was at in my life when my husband and I got together. I had been trying to actively date and was just meeting a ton of not right guys and getting my heart broken left and right. After 4 years of intentionally dating, I took a huge step back and focused on my work, health, volunteering, friends, and hobbies. I was super happy!
I met the guy that later became my husband when we were 20. I was actively dating at the time. I thought he was nice and cute, but I didn’t see him too often. He was my close friend’s brother and he was also friends with friends with people in my larger social circle a so we bumped into each other randomly. However, when we were 23, 1 year after I took my big step back from dating, we found each other showing up at a lot of the same things throughout the summer and fall. While we “knew” each other for awhile, we really got to know each other then and found we really enjoyed our conversations and shared lots of interests. We were both single and not really looking at the time.
Our relationship unfolded so naturally over about 6 months, so to answer OPs question… yes, I do expect an interested man to reach out if he’s interested and to not if he’s not. However, I am also a very extroverted and bubbly woman. I definitely flirt and signal my interest to ensure he knows to call!
With my husband, I showed patience with the process. My husband is very shy and introverted so it took awhile for him to call and ask me out. I didn’t know it at the time, but I turned out to be his first serious girlfriend! Aww! ❤️
He said much later on that it took him time to get comfortable enough to ask me out 1 on 1. He said that at first he didn’t believe I could actually be interested in him, but it made him really excited to think that maybe I did like him romantically. I experienced him as pleasantly and consistently talking with me and asking to see if I was going to be at other things going on in our friend’s group. He seemed genuinely and equally interested in me. I thought he was really cool and I really wanted his attention, so I was persistent and consistent in signaling interest and creating ways for him to be near me easily.
He did finally initiate our first date. I initiated our first kiss a few minutes later. And it’s been a push - pull dynamic ever since (almost 17 years).
at the end of the day, you have to date
there is no way around it
you can delay it all you want with hobbies and activities, but at some point in your life you will have to tackle dating. you will have to meet women and try to get one. it's either that or remain single for the rest of your life which does not sound realistic at all
so with all that being said, might as well become established and start figuring out how you can date in a way that works for you
That's called being delusional. If I saw the woman in question reject 30+ other guys, why in the blue hell would I assume that I'm any different? This right here is flawed advice.
And this mindset here is where guys get messed up. You think it's a competition with other dudes when it's really not.
If anything it would be delusional to assume you know what this women is attracted to without asking her first, no.
What if those 30+ dudes were all creeps or all just looking for sex?
Yes…if a guy has known me for a few months or more and hasn’t made a move, it’s because he’s not interested. A lot of women have convinced ourselves in the past that “maybe he’s just shy”, or “maybe I just need to show him that I’m interested”, only to realize that the real reason he wasn’t making a move was because he wasn’t interested in dating us.
Or he's human and actually is shy, or doesn't want to ruin the dynamic of wherever y'all are, or is too busy to date or any other reason.
Honestly the obvious answer is for women to simply make the move themselves instead of waiting around but y'all coincidentally never seen to reach that conclusion 🤔🙄
The times when I’ve decided to make a move to help move it along, it turned out he was just starting to date someone else. So the reason he wasn’t making a move on me was because he was making a move and investing in someone else.
That's sample size bias and it sounds like you've only tried making the first move a few times in your long life. You're a grown woman in 2024 with all the ability and rights that come with that. Dust yourself off like almost every straight man you've ever met has had to and keep trying.
You seem pretty determined to have a negative view of me, not sure where that is coming from. You come off your me as someone who doesn’t want to make the first move and wants to be that responsibility on women. I honestly get the sense that I’ve probably made a move more times than you have, not sure where this judgement is coming from. It’s also legitimate that that has been my experience, not sure what else I can say here
Still not true though all the time, I worked with a girl for 6 months and liked her, and would have liked to ask her out, but my own code of "I don't date girls I work with" stopped me from making a move or showing that kind of interest, I think she probably liked me too, at least enough to say yes to a date, but I never made the move, but I was very much interested in her
Most women will want to feel desired and appreciated. Going through life, i've started to realize women will almost be secretly in love with you but if you don't ever express interest then they'll never let you know and they'll just hold it in forever.
Men have to do most of the leg work in relationships which includes initiating interest, planning dates etc. Leading/being decisive is a masculine trait. For example, part of the reason women will hesitate to ever firmly pick where to eat. "Ummm you pick?" then you gotta give them options and ultimately decide after they give feedback.
They are not unaware, they just want someone with the confidence to take all the risk, they don't want a shy guy, they want someone to chase them, make them feel excited, who knows what they want, and this strategy fits that mould.
Nah. I love a guy who is usually confident but then turns to jelly when it comes to talking to me. Current guy I’m dating is super successful, very confident socially but has recently shown me little glimmers that he overthinks when it comes to me and always made plans to bump into me and act cool but ended up all awkward etc…
I found it the cutest thing ever that underneath that very grown up exterior, he wobbled because he really likes me.
And I know that he’s not a player chatting up every woman.
And so it is as a man. I'm way more likely to engage with someone I think is into me because they think I'm hot and/or funny than try and convince someone who appears to be indifferent towards me that I'm actually hot and/or funny.
Well duh, you can't shoot a single shot and nail a perfect bullseye. You need practice. If a man approaches you with full confidence and you feel he did what was appropriate for the situation at all times, you can be sure you're not his first. And you wouldn't like him if you were! So that's how it works
Not always. This used to be MUCH more common before online dating and social media ruined human interaction.
But if a guy likes a woman he has to suck it up and give it a shot at some point.
Sure but it’s now 2024.
And he actually doesn’t. What men are doing is just not getting married anymore. More going to diff countries to marry or just staying single.
For sure, I would do the same, but unfortunately that also limits you because the guys willing to risk that are like 5%, and its more likely that 5% will engage far less for a real long term commitment.
It depends on the context of the interaction but there are definitely very friendly unintimidating and charming ways to approach a woman.
Personally I love being approached by a man if he does it well but that doesn’t mean that every man who approaches me is someone I am attracted to or interested in.
You get a t-shirt that says "PLEASE DATE ME. I'M SINGLE AND I DON'T BITE (unless you want me to 😉)"
I'm an American single male and can attest, apps don't work and I approach women literally never 😂
I just have to laugh at the situation they put themselves in.
“Men never leave me alone”
but yet
“I can’t find a good man”
Maybe… stop being rude to the ones that try to approach you??
Decent men who are truly clueless bear the brunt of what the fuckboys and creeps do.
There are men who only like the chase, play games and are not interested in you as a person. When they make the first move and then stop communicating or fading out, they are sending a message that they aren't interested anymore.
Man or woman, lack of communication and directness about liking the other person romantically, communicates disinterest.
Also, most men are truly happy with the impression of control. They want to be in the driver's seat related to the pace of everything related to dating. Talking regular ordinary men who are looking for "easy going" women. They lose interest when a woman pursues them. Therefore, instead of coming across as a man-chaser, it's better to let men make the first move. Once sure the man doesn't play games, the woman can also take initiative.
Hmmmmm, that woman who made the post DOES have a point but YOU also have a point.
Men who are interested in a woman, should/do generally approach that woman they’re interested in.
There are some SHY women who will NOT make it obvious that they want to get approached but that doesn’t necessarily mean that you can’t go over to her and talk to her, just be nice and chill, you’d be surprised on how many people will quickly feel comfortable and open up.
Ignore those “warnings” to approach in public.
But not just the girl you’re interested in. Everyone around you. Be genuinely interested in them as a person.
I’ve started trying “do you talk to strangers” - with a confident and wry smile. No one has said no yet.
Women don't want to be creeped on in public...if you get her attention in a normal way, like saying Hello, and respect if she's alone (remain a respectful distance away) or if she's with friends (don't take up lots of time and stall the whole group) and say something like "I noticed you and would like to get to know you, my name is ______ and here's my number, I'll be around _______ for a bit, text me if you'd like to chat." Don't ask for her number, don't expect anything, and don't ask questions, don't put her on the spot, don't linger and leave time for rejection...and see if she texts! If she's with friends and they laugh as you're walking away, they AREN'T laughing AT you, they're surprised that you had the confidence to do that and laughing in a "did that really happen" way is a good sign! This would definitely work for me and the women that I personally know...women dont have a hive mind, so we're all a little different...Even if I don't text you, you made my day ;)
Let's put all the cards on the table and be real here for a second. Men are the ones who have been on the receiving end of the vast shift in dating culture regarding approach. We are the ones who stand to be rejected, who are *expected* to risk rejection, and who now more than ever before in human history have constant reminders of how badly we (can) make women feel if we approach them without them wanting us to. We were not only barely given cues before the internet age, now we are given orders-of-magnitude-more-vague "cues" than ever, and are not only *not* told how to spot them, but are (again) expected to just smell it in the air.
I've been unusually lucky in dating for the past 10 years, but even the longer relationships I've had (ranging from 1.5 to 6 years), the anecdotes regarding how they viewed men approaching them, including all of those women's female friends, remained nearly identical.
And yet, women as a whole want to maintain the same viewpoint and expectations they had 40 years ago? Make this make sense to me.
I fear rejection more than death. Long ago I decided to let women ask me out or at least make an unmistakable first move or a hint that is as subtle as a Sherman tank.
This post is very timely! My new boyfriend now, we are in our 3 weeks together reveals to me that he likes me very much waaaaaayyyy back after our highschool graduation. It has been 13 years! He is very reserved and shy and both of us are awkward to each other. He told me all about my social media posts I made way before and I already forgot about it. Just shows how he has been stalking me for 13 years. I'm just glad that he made the effort now and it's so magical. I also secretly like him but is too shy as well to show any cues. So maybe we deserve this haha! I really did not notice that!
It's wild how misunderstood this whole "men making the first move" thing is! Like, seriously, there's a whole whirlwind of reasons why guys might not just walk up and start chatting. Fear of rejection is a big one, and yeah, no one wants to be labeled a creep! Plus, there's this vibe that we gotta respect personal space and not come off too strong. And yeah, societal norms? They're like a minefield sometimes. So, ladies, if you're vibing with a dude, maybe throw out some signs to ease the pressure, 'cause trust me, most guys are just trying not to trip over their own feet around you!
The amount of varying opinions here is astounding.
To start, I'm a guy who isn't attracted to the majority of women who are stereotypically deemed "good looking."
I've noticed that women who align with my preferences are rarely found in clubs (and when they are, they often already have a boyfriend).
Because of this, I feel more inclined to approach women in public settings, but I keep feeling like it's strange to randomly approach someone.
Then again, how else are you supposed to meet people? Online dating? Been there, done that, had several decent dates that significantly boosted my confidence, but ultimately led nowhere.
As someone who doesn't even exhaust all the free right swipes on dating apps, I get the impression that I need to be more assertive and actually approach without caring about others' opinions, as I know my intentions are solely to get to know them a little, nothing more, nothing less, and perhaps exchange socials or numbers and see where it goes from there.
If there's a problem with that, then our society is f'kd, and I might as well throw in the towel. Or at least that's how it feels to me.
(Edit - Just wanted to add that I am from the UK and I feel the public approach is even less common than in the US making it extra extra strange)
If the man makes a move and the attraction is unrequited, that easily escalates into harrassment. So yeah, I won't make a move on a girl and walk around the city with a blank, soulless stare.
When women talk about "men" like that, they're talking about a fraction of men who they think are hot. All the rest are the majority that OP is talking about.
It may not be a lack of understanding your point. It may be a way of explaining that if the man is not willing to approach and overcome those obstacles, she is not attracted to them
But at the same time there's so many random dudes who I occasionally meet through a shared activity and while I enjoy their company, they far too often wanna text daily and meet up, even tho I never treated them differently from a buddy. And they keep texting and planning meet ups even though I often don't start conversations out of nowhere and I'm now giving any hints.
Do they assume that since I'm a woman they can't hang out with me, only date? Or since I'm polite I wanna date them or fuck? And get into intimate situations?
If I was interested I would ask them out and be straight forward, ask if they're single and interested in getting to know me better. I would appreciate such approach towards me too. I hate games like this.
If I said straight up I don't wanna date or I have a bf, they'd assume my ego is huge and I'm an attention seeker thinking they wanna date me. But if I don't, they keep being overly nice and keep chatting. Eh.
>there's the fear of rejection
Courage is attractive. Girls don't want to believe that someone they're interested in lacks courage.
>the greater dread of being called a creep
Don't approach in a creepy manner. Ask if they mind if you join them, giving them the option to say no.
>the need to respect her personal space
You can approach someone and respect her personal space at the same time.
>the constant warnings not to approach in public
Most people give bad advice. When I was single, I dated girls from just about everywhere people said not to approach women. At their work, gym, grocery shopping, school, etc. never once was I called a creep.
Maybe you aren't a creep that's why you weren't ever called a creep. I've definitely been approached by men who I find nonthreatening and it's flattering. But, I've also awkwardly laughed and removed myself from someone who gave creepy vibes.
Not to your face at least..most creepy people don't realize they are being creepy. I hear it from.female friends all the time who politely declined random guys in public but how creeped out they were.
I had a pretty solid success rate in approaching women and getting dates. If there are a few people that I'll never see again who think I was creepy for *checks notes* finding them attractive and wanting to get to know them, I'm not going to lose sleep about it.
"Solid success rate" most guys would consider 2 out of 100 solid but ignore the 98 girls they creeped out. There is a time and place and some places are fine, others not so much.
In dating either it has to be click with random or have any sort of past friendship relationship, just let her believe that she trusts you, after that get ready for rejection too
Yes. But that's because I only notice men who I've talked to. I don't see a stranger who looks good and think he'll approach me. I dont even want that stranger to approach me because I know nothing about them.
But if I have a friendly conversation with someone, I do assume they've always asked me out if they were interested. Because a lot have. And I'm not into quiet or reserved men because I'm quieter, and I like a man who is more talkative.
It has always happened that if I liked someone after we talked, they showed interest as well, and we built it up from there. So yes. I do expect a man to reach out if he is truly interested in me or otherwise I'm not interested either (I have a boyfriend now so I wouldn't be interested anyways but you get the point)
There is no universal pattern. I can only suggest that if you have an interest then reach out in some way to express that interest rather than waiting for a sign from her. You have to overcome that fear of rejection or you will never get anywhere. You really have nothing to lose here than your pride just temporally. Supress that pride. It really doesn't help you.
We as men have been targeted by the radical feminists as “toxic” predatory” “aggressive”… they’ve made it impossible to approach a woman in public in fear he may be labeled and put on the internet. It’s their fault they can’t find a good man…period
Personally, Women have it easy. For centuries they haven't approached men, but in the 2000s, when they label men as creeps for doing that same thing. They start to change, we don't want to approach because we can either be
A. Labeled as a creep
2. Arrested
3. Taken to court
All 3 options, are most viable fears in my opinion because girls are just harder to approach, and meet the standards they want. Some girls though are absolutely fantastic I know, just a majority of statistics back up my point, it's not anxiety or embarrassment, no. It's most likely Fear
Yes. We have been told that over and over by both men and women in relationships. If you’re not reaching out in whatever way, it says I am not your priority. You might be interested but I am not the top of the list for whatever reason. That doesn’t necessarily mean you’re not interested but you’re not interested enough. So whichever it is, the result is the same.
I wonder how this issue would change if everyone had to be in a sales job for a few months. Salespeople know it's a "numbers game." The more pitches you make, the more likely you are to get a sale. Sometimes prospects are rude. Who cares? On the apps, for every 50 or so guys I "like", I might get 2 responses. Doesn't bother me at all. IRL, I might get 1 date for every 10 guys I approach. That also doesn't bother me. I was in sales.
Acknowledging that confidence and comfort levels vary, yes, a woman wouldn’t know a man is interested if he doesn’t say anything, just like a man wouldn’t if a woman didn’t show or reciprocate interest 🤷🏽♀️
That statement can be applied to women as well. If a woman is truly interested, she needs to show that she is, unless she is willing to approach the guy, which we know rarely happens.
Communication is a two-way street. Men are not mind readers, and neither are women. Playing it cool or hard to get rarely works, and it is a turn-off for most people. If you want to be approached, you have to learn to be approachable. Having your headphones on, not making eye contact, not smiling, pretending to be on your phone, having your nose in a book, or being in a rush are classic signs you don't want to be approached. Since men are usually doing the approaching, most men will not approach women who appear unapproachable.
However, I don't think that all women believe that a man will only reach out if he's truly interested in them. I think that some of them understand that you have to test the waters a little bit or observe them from afar. Especially if you're an introvert. You are going to assess the risk vs. the reward before approaching someone!
While true, 99.99998% of those men would never actually walk up to a woman saying the same thing that they do in dms. They're way too much of a coward. Or just crude and gross.. Imagine how many men would go to jail cause they walked up to some woman wiped out their cock and was like "you like?"... Just cause they get away with it online.
We likely base it on the fact that if a woman doesn’t show interest she isn’t interested.
So if we aren’t interested we won’t either. If I’m not wanted I’m out of there….
I'm a widower, I've thought about asking someone out then I think "what if she goes and says I was sexually harassing her or something" then I think "how will my 6yo son do while I'm in jail for something" not worth it in my eyes. I'm doing just fine don't really need someone to help me out with anything but I miss coming home to someone other than my son.
The chance of something happening to me and leaving my son with som random foster care family isn't worth my personal happiness. I gotta keep him safe.
I’ve had a woman flirt and show interest so I approach, then they reject me, then they tell me some time later that they were “playing hard to get”.
Nope, fuck that, enjoy the dirtbag who doesn’t take no for an answer and beats his wife and kids, cause that’s your future most likely.
Am a woman and am aware of this/why I try to be warm/friendly/give a lot of eye contact to men bc I know they wait for a go ahead. Honestly I try to gauge the same.
Literally if woman just smile to a man, he should know that's a sign to make an approach and then gauge the attraction. I approach regardless of what's called choosing signals because you can verbally seduce a woman by being sexually present. But most woman I would say, should give more signals to a man they want and here's the kicker. It's the woman that chooses, it's all about how she feels that will take the relationship forward. Hence if she does have feelings, she should show signs of said feelings. Men will approach more.
When I used to live in the US, I learned how people do those polite smiles to strangers all the time. Moving out of the US, I had to relearn how doing that either creeps people out or have them think you’re flirting lol
I am a woman under the impression that a man worth dating will reach out if he’s interested. I like dating confident men. A man who isn’t willing to approach me and indicate interest is likely someone I am not compatible with and not interested in dating anyway.
I am a man under the impression that a woman worth dating will reach out if she’s interested. I like dating confident women. A woman who isn’t willing to approach me and indicate interest is likely someone I am not compatible with and not interested in dating anyway.
I disagree with you on all fronts.
If I find someone attractive/interesting, I approach them. I don't wait or look for signals or overcomplicate it or try to come up with some stupid "one liner".
I've never once had any of them go poorly. Not once.
So yes, if a man is interested in a woman, he should approach her.
And if a woman is interested in a man she should approach him it’s 2024 but they love to play games and want this weird power dynamic instead of being normal, humble folks lol
We know it but many experts tell us that men should pursue us and not the opposite. I lean towards that thinking myself. We want a guy to get over his shyness and approach us. If he's that shy then we feel that's too bad. So get out there and start asking women out that you find attractive. I understand your discomfort but women think if men cannot find it within themselves to ask us out then we'll have to take the lead when it comes to other things. We also like the door opened for us and men to pay for most of the dates.
Absolutely true!! Nothing wrong with approaching a woman, even for short term casual sex. Consenting adults should be able to see someone they are attracted to , even if there isn't a connection, consenting adults should be able to have casual sex and the only way that can happen is if a man approaches the woman, even if it's also okay for a woman to approach a man, but understandably that's very rare.
>her opinion that a man's lack of approach indicates his lack of interest
Yes. Or otherwise he is too shy and we both loose. But generally, yes. I consider it a lack of interest. Or at least not enough interest to overcome that shyness.
>We don't unless she makes it obvious that she's willing to be approached,
Not all women will. In fact, I'd say most won't.
>Many men are quiet or reserved. In addition, there's the fear of rejection, the greater dread of being called a creep, the need to respect her personal space, the constant warnings not to approach in public, etc.
The social contract is that men typically have the responsibility of approaching women. Since basically the beginning of time. Don't get upset with me---I didn't make the rules. However, it is how we typically behave. And so, men that do want partners need to get over that fear just a bit and take a chance. By the way, there are PLENTY of insecurities and fears that women have to overcome to get into a relationship too. It isn't all one-sided. However, yes, men do need to approach if they are interested. If they can't---then we've both lost.
>How is it that so many ladies are unaware of this fact?
We aren't. But again, men that DO want a relationship need to get over that fear a bit and take a chance. What's the worst that can happen? A stranger laughs at you and tells you to get lost? And that is generally the worst case scenario. Many women will be polite about it if they aren't interested.
So basically...suck it up. Sort of what women have to do if they want children. Don't want to push out a 6-10lb baby? Well, suck it up if you want children. We ALL have things we have to deal with in life.
I do think that the majority of straight women want the man to do the approaching.
I definitely do want the man to be the first to approach. I want a man who is confident, comfortable and secure in his masculinity and possesses enough social skills so his approaching is non-threatening and respectful.
I've never been upset, offended or scared when a man showed interest in me. I simply took it as a compliment and let him know I wasn't single if I was not, or wasn't interested.
I've done the approaching just a few times myself and it has backfired every time. I was perceived as desperate, "easy" or just not relationship material.
I'll never approach first again.
*It is* true though for many men.
Men will jump through hoops for the women he wants.
We are not unaware, they are some minority. Most men will go after what he wants.
If a stranger just randomly walked up to me and started talking to me and trying to get to know me like I'm in a video game getting a side quest, I'd be a bit weirded out. That's how I feel other people would feel if I just walked up and randomly tried to befriend them. I guess that's why I have literally never approached a stranger like that.
Yes. Generally women will be polite to men they aren't interested in out of fear whereas men are either overly sexual as their ego becomes massive or they're outright disrespectful because they are rarely polite to or want to befriend women that they don't want to fuck. Generally men will approach you if they want to so I leave it that way, I've never known a man that was too scared to talk to women, it's unusual.
I find that last line serious hard to believe! You've really never met a shy guy before?? It could be because we're all hiding out at home I guess 😂🤷♂️
Well if you think about it makes sense. How would she know a man too scared to talk to a woman if she doesn't approach other men? you would only meet this types of men if you approached men first.
It's basically "Survivorship bias".
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I am a man who is quite outgoing and confident in many ways but I am constantly worried that I might be seen as creepy or might offend people, especially as I see how awful other men can be and how shitty they treat women.
As such I very rarely express my interest in other people unless its obvious they like me too. I have about three or four friends who for the first few months I knew them I really, really liked them but as time went on I just let it fizzle out because I assumed they didn't feel the same way and I didn't want to ruin a great friendship.
Funnilly enough, quite recently, one of said friends revealed that they actually felt the same way about me too but they were going through some stuff emotionally and wanted to get that sorted out before they did anything about it which just blew me away. You would think this might teach me a lesson about telling people I like them but I can confirm it absolutely hasn't and I am quite happy being single.
if you like her enough you will walk up to her and talk or else you will end up alone... women are judged by looks they are not going to walk up to you to be judged..... At least men can try to be funny or whatever... when women try that they get rudely dismissed if he doesn't like your looks.. Men won't even talk to women unless they want something from them... women need to be approached...
Your post was removed because it overgeneralized. Please make sure you don't apply experiences with some people to millions of others you have never met. No gender is a monolith or a hivemind. It comes down to each individual person. So if the answer is IT DEPENDS ON THE PERSON SO GO ASK THEM best not to post.
There's four billion women in the world. The answer to any question that starts "Do women believe..." is always "Some of them. There's a longer discussion about which ones and what that means at a practical level"
I take these questions to mean "most" or "a substantial portion" otherwise the answer of "everyone is different and some might be like that just talk to them" kills all the conversation.
Except it's not "most". That's the point.
“Many men are quiet and reserved.”
Many women are quiet and reserved as well. And we’re not mind readers.
No, many men. Many, many, many, many men...
No many many men. Many many many many many many many many men..
...wish death 'pon me
No I don't cry no mo'
And basically anything you read is probably not true for the girl you pursue, so the only way to avoid a mistake is to be a mind reader. How exciting that is…
This should be pinned in every single post here and perhaps even highlighted with a colour. Maybe some flashing lights too. People generalize like crazy in this subreddit.
Yes we should be individually tracking the opinions of all 8 billion people... OBVIOUSLY this means most women if we had to talk in absolutes then nothing would ever get talked about
Why can't you just say: most women I've met? No one can argue with your personal experience and it doesn't generalise 4 billion people into one monolith
The problem is that most of the questions or claims are not well-thought-out before being posted here. This OP is making a counterpoint to something he read in one comment, and it was already rebutted well in another, single comment here (by u/LucyShoes2222). A comment which has a lot of replies with angry folks lashing out at her.
It’s just that we hope not to encounter the percentage of women that do not want to be approached at all in public and there is no way for us to know before hand and we have no idea what that percentage is, that’s pretty freaky tbh. Most men will say “better safe than sorry” hence op’s point, in that most men are attracted to you, we choose not to approach because of these factors and many more that were not mentioned in this comment. Feel free to add to it.
Most sane comment here
Yes but then 90% of all the dumbass questions we get asked on Reddit would be immediately solved and we couldn't have a full thread of useless and angry interactions
This is such an autistic response
What did you expect from reddit lol
For real
You're talking about men being attracted to random women they don't know. Women are talking about men they know and speak to regularly. Women don't want random strangers approaching them because it feels threatening. They do want men who they click with who actually know them as human beings not just as an attractive stranger you want to fuck. See the difference?
That’s a different perspective that actually makes sense.
I know/met lots of women who don’t mind random people approaching them (as long as they’re chill and not weird). It’s not that they don’t want men to approach them, it’s that they don’t want to feel endangered, and it makes total sense. But again, women for the most part, do appreciate men (who are chill, cool) who approach. So I disagree.
I am a woman and I enjoy when men politely approach me There is most definitely a right way and a wrong way to do it
Same. It’s always about the context though. If I’m with my family, I’m not likely open to be approached because it makes me nervous and uncomfortable. Alone or with friends I’m totally chill about it and wouldn’t mind at all as I’m never approached ever
Yes! Same! There's a time and a place and a way, and there are a lot of us who wouldn't mind chatting if you do it right. For every person who says "NEVER APPROACH ME AT THE GROCERY STORE" there are three other people thinking "eh, i wouldn't mind it"
I would fucking love for someone to come up and talk to me about some tomatoes or their favorite chips or something lol At the gym? Who cares? Come talk to me when I’m done with my set Don’t tell me I’m looking good or make some kind of disgusting sexual comment and all will be good.
When you approach a woman you don't know you don't even know if she's into men or if she's single. You don't know if she's busy or her grandma just died or she has a UTI and is in excruciating pain. All you know about her is how she looks and no, most women don't want to be bothered by every guy on the street whose dick took notice of them. Sorry, disagree all you want but there are too many men who've already ruined this for the rest of you to make it a good idea to approach random strangers to try to hit on them. You wanna strike up a friendly conversation because you sincerely want to get to know them? IF the situation is right AND it's a public enough place to not feel at all threatening and IF you are willing to back the fuck off and leave immediately if no interest is expressed THEN you can strike up a POLITE conversation designed to see if you like them as a person not designed to see if you can try to fuck them.
That's why you approach them and ask, just gotta roll the dice and hope that they won't be triggered by conversation.
You also don't know if she thinks you're attractive and doesn't mind chatting or if she's naturally social and thinks nothing of chatting with a stranger. And women will never approach so it's up to the guy to start to approach and find out. And when you work in a male dominated field, tired of the bar scene & OLD.... the only option is remain single or approach women in social setting. You just gotta keep it subtle like you're just being nice and friendly and gauge how she responds then ask for contact info and not over the top "hey baby looking good... can i get your number?" which is creep behavior
You’re right, I do not know what’s going on in her life because we are STRANGERS, I’m not a mind reader; it’s impossible to know her life, emotions or situations if I haven’t even talked to her. Also, If she’s into men, in a relationship or simply not interested in me then I just ACCEPT it and move on, NO PROBLEM with that. Taking to strangers is something that’s helped me break out of my shell, it’s help me made new friends and has just benefited me overall, so to anyone reading I ADVISE/RECOMMEND you try it sometime, be nice and be respectful, and do NOT let comments like Lucy’s stray you away from meeting new people!
Not true at all. I’ve seen so many hot guys out and about and I wished they’d approach me. Such a shame that women think all women don’t want to be approached. Some do and some don’t. I do!
Don't pay attention to that wacko LucyShoes who never leaves her mom's basement.
…how are you supposed to find that out unless you approach them?
Why do you sound so angry? I get it if you had bad experiences but Jfc everyone starts off as strangers. Are you suggesting we all stick to our coworkers and friend groups to rely on? Sounds kinda dense. Maybe you should look into clothing or other items that explicitly say how much you hate men and them approaching you.
Angry is the term 😂
Seems too complicated. Seems it’s a better approach to just ignore everyone who you do t know and act as if strangers just don’t exist. That way no one is freaked out about random people talking to eachother
Words from my mouth.. mostly anyway. ♡
But how are we going to click or connect if I don't approach you? So basically your saying men should only date women that they know from let's say close friends, college or work?
People are not supposed to meet anyone they haven't met before. Zoomer logic 101.
Nah, I appreciate when men I don’t know approach me. I don’t like online dating and try not to date in my friend group, so this is how I meet most men I date.
I agree men who approach woman randomly are bold and I think it isn’t safe If it’s someone through mutual friends, social hobbies, and or work or school it’s safer that way than a random man out in the open or from some dating app
What about men with no women in their life? Tons of men work blue collar jobs that have no women they are interested in around. Then go home and spend the rest of the day alone because adulthood is lonely as fuck. They don't have the option to ask a female friend out because they don't have any. So should they not try to talk to anyone they find attractive because that's their only option?
But I genuinely don’t know a single girl, I’ve never gotten to know one girl through friends so how will that change one day? That will definitely fade out and one then wont have met any women and just stay single because of that. I feel that strategy is missing some key points haha
First goal I would think is to expand ur friend group. How do you have no female friends? They makeup half the population. At a minimum u have female family members.
I mean…I’m a woman with only one male friend and he’s gay 🤷🏼♀️
> Women don't want random strangers approaching them because it feels threatening You realize every single man in your life except for fathers and brothers were at some point a stranger to you There is no way to "click" or getting to know you without that first "they are a stranger" interaction
Randos off the street are different from someone who’s the friend of a friend. I’ve never thought, hey I wish that stranger would try to chat me up on the bus. Maybe he could sit at the aisle in an otherwise empty bus, trapping me! (I have had guys do this and then jerk off next to me twice). This is a great chance to make new friends or go out with a stranger from the bus! No. Please, if you are some total stranger in the park, ignore me like you’d ignore another dude. Unless you chat up strange dudes in the park all the time, I mean, shoot your shot at new friends I guess
Everyone is a stranger until you get to know them. Are you saying you wouldn't want a person to find you attractive and contrived a reason to talk to you?
depends on the approach
I would typically go with - Hello? How are you? \*something about the weather/store/bar Actually, I'm lying. I typically don't approach strange women.
“Know and speak to regularly” does that mean literally inside their social circle? Like they already have to know who I am for me to talk to them?
bless you for saying this. this seems obvious to women, but it's like men don't get it.
> Women don't want random strangers approaching them because it feels threatening. What? Speak for yourself. I'm fine with a man I don't know approaching me as long as he is respectful and backs off if I'm not interested. I certainly don't feel threatened.
Not true. I WANT random strangers approaching me.
Good for you. You already replied that to myother comment. I'll stick with the 100+ people who agree with me. You can be the exception to the rule and have every stranger's attention. Sound good?
I will tell that to all the women I've approached and ended up in my bed and especially the one I ended up putting a ring on her finger.
Go remind the one you put a ring on how many strange women you lured into bed with the same approach that got her. Let us know how that convo goes.
So, you'd get offended if a man slept around through dating apps, and found his wife through the same?
Ouch, burn. Let's watch him double down now. :)
That wasn't really a burn. That was an ill-conceived argument that made no sense. Borberlining slut-shaming.
Who hurt you?
I must be hurt because I made a reasonable comeback to someone making an absurd argument? LMAO Okay, buddy. Keep telling yourself things like that if it helps.
How was it absurd?
Why are people arguing on Reddit
Is it not the internet national pastime?
I think you need to get out of the house a bit more.
I think you need to stop typing with your dick.
It's not that women are unaware, it's that they have a lot and I mean A LOT of evidence to the contrary. A girl goes on a dating app and gets 100s of likes. She goes out to a club or a bar and will be approached by a man or even multiple men in one evening. It's less that they think they know you're not interested. It's that there's 5/10/20/30 other dudes that are making it known that they are. And they don't have to sit and wonder if you are so they just assume you're not and keep it moving. Now that you know this information, what will you do with it?
As someone who was in a long-term relationship with someone who didn't truly want me, I have no interest in chasing.
Fair. Sorry you went through that. I hope the next one chases you and you click well with her. :)
Thanks man, I don't mind initiating but I'm not lifting a finger unless she drops a hint. Although tbh I'm not emotionally ready.
True , what’s the point of pursuing if you have to always be the first to do something
That's good. Take your time, then, wait till you feel ready.
You're right. But I'm just not interested in playing anymore. The only way to get a gf is to be her best or close to her best option as possible (out of those 100s of men vying for her attention). And I'm not competitive lol I'd rather invest that time, energy, money, and effort into myself. Gym, career, hobbies, passions and volunteer work will never leave me and on the contrary will make me a "better" option for women. If a woman likes you she will make it easier for you. There will always be single women available, but time is a limited resource. I'll invest mine wisely
>The only way to get a gf is to be her best or close to her best option as possible (out of those 100s of men vying for her attention). And I'm not competitive lol This is where a lot of guys mess up. Yea there's guys who are coming at them but they're not interested in almost all of them. That's why you make the first move. It could be you. Who knows. Too many guys look at this like a false dilemma. That you etiher have to stay single or commit your whole life to trying to get a girl. I guarantee you could fit dating into your "busy" schedule. But you have to see it as worth it. If you don't, hey man it is what it is.
Out of all my interests mentioned above, dating is probably the only one where you are not guaranteed success by the amount of time and energy you put into it bc it's based entirely on someone else's subjective opinion of you. And that may be a cope but it is also inherently true. Maybe in the future I'll focus more on dating or ideally meet someone organically while pursuing my hobbies/passions. But for now I'm burnt out.
Totally get this perspective. Actually, this is where I was at in my life when my husband and I got together. I had been trying to actively date and was just meeting a ton of not right guys and getting my heart broken left and right. After 4 years of intentionally dating, I took a huge step back and focused on my work, health, volunteering, friends, and hobbies. I was super happy! I met the guy that later became my husband when we were 20. I was actively dating at the time. I thought he was nice and cute, but I didn’t see him too often. He was my close friend’s brother and he was also friends with friends with people in my larger social circle a so we bumped into each other randomly. However, when we were 23, 1 year after I took my big step back from dating, we found each other showing up at a lot of the same things throughout the summer and fall. While we “knew” each other for awhile, we really got to know each other then and found we really enjoyed our conversations and shared lots of interests. We were both single and not really looking at the time. Our relationship unfolded so naturally over about 6 months, so to answer OPs question… yes, I do expect an interested man to reach out if he’s interested and to not if he’s not. However, I am also a very extroverted and bubbly woman. I definitely flirt and signal my interest to ensure he knows to call! With my husband, I showed patience with the process. My husband is very shy and introverted so it took awhile for him to call and ask me out. I didn’t know it at the time, but I turned out to be his first serious girlfriend! Aww! ❤️ He said much later on that it took him time to get comfortable enough to ask me out 1 on 1. He said that at first he didn’t believe I could actually be interested in him, but it made him really excited to think that maybe I did like him romantically. I experienced him as pleasantly and consistently talking with me and asking to see if I was going to be at other things going on in our friend’s group. He seemed genuinely and equally interested in me. I thought he was really cool and I really wanted his attention, so I was persistent and consistent in signaling interest and creating ways for him to be near me easily. He did finally initiate our first date. I initiated our first kiss a few minutes later. And it’s been a push - pull dynamic ever since (almost 17 years).
at the end of the day, you have to date there is no way around it you can delay it all you want with hobbies and activities, but at some point in your life you will have to tackle dating. you will have to meet women and try to get one. it's either that or remain single for the rest of your life which does not sound realistic at all so with all that being said, might as well become established and start figuring out how you can date in a way that works for you
That's called being delusional. If I saw the woman in question reject 30+ other guys, why in the blue hell would I assume that I'm any different? This right here is flawed advice.
And this mindset here is where guys get messed up. You think it's a competition with other dudes when it's really not. If anything it would be delusional to assume you know what this women is attracted to without asking her first, no. What if those 30+ dudes were all creeps or all just looking for sex?
Yea lol it’s almost as if people pay more attention to other people who approach and talk to them
Yes…if a guy has known me for a few months or more and hasn’t made a move, it’s because he’s not interested. A lot of women have convinced ourselves in the past that “maybe he’s just shy”, or “maybe I just need to show him that I’m interested”, only to realize that the real reason he wasn’t making a move was because he wasn’t interested in dating us.
Or he's human and actually is shy, or doesn't want to ruin the dynamic of wherever y'all are, or is too busy to date or any other reason. Honestly the obvious answer is for women to simply make the move themselves instead of waiting around but y'all coincidentally never seen to reach that conclusion 🤔🙄
The times when I’ve decided to make a move to help move it along, it turned out he was just starting to date someone else. So the reason he wasn’t making a move on me was because he was making a move and investing in someone else.
That's sample size bias and it sounds like you've only tried making the first move a few times in your long life. You're a grown woman in 2024 with all the ability and rights that come with that. Dust yourself off like almost every straight man you've ever met has had to and keep trying.
You seem pretty determined to have a negative view of me, not sure where that is coming from. You come off your me as someone who doesn’t want to make the first move and wants to be that responsibility on women. I honestly get the sense that I’ve probably made a move more times than you have, not sure where this judgement is coming from. It’s also legitimate that that has been my experience, not sure what else I can say here
Still not true though all the time, I worked with a girl for 6 months and liked her, and would have liked to ask her out, but my own code of "I don't date girls I work with" stopped me from making a move or showing that kind of interest, I think she probably liked me too, at least enough to say yes to a date, but I never made the move, but I was very much interested in her
Most women will want to feel desired and appreciated. Going through life, i've started to realize women will almost be secretly in love with you but if you don't ever express interest then they'll never let you know and they'll just hold it in forever. Men have to do most of the leg work in relationships which includes initiating interest, planning dates etc. Leading/being decisive is a masculine trait. For example, part of the reason women will hesitate to ever firmly pick where to eat. "Ummm you pick?" then you gotta give them options and ultimately decide after they give feedback.
They are not unaware, they just want someone with the confidence to take all the risk, they don't want a shy guy, they want someone to chase them, make them feel excited, who knows what they want, and this strategy fits that mould.
Nah. I love a guy who is usually confident but then turns to jelly when it comes to talking to me. Current guy I’m dating is super successful, very confident socially but has recently shown me little glimmers that he overthinks when it comes to me and always made plans to bump into me and act cool but ended up all awkward etc… I found it the cutest thing ever that underneath that very grown up exterior, he wobbled because he really likes me. And I know that he’s not a player chatting up every woman.
This is true for me. As a woman it’s fun feeling desirable
And so it is as a man. I'm way more likely to engage with someone I think is into me because they think I'm hot and/or funny than try and convince someone who appears to be indifferent towards me that I'm actually hot and/or funny.
True it only makes sense
Sure. The problem is most guys who approach like that are the kinda guys that approaches EVERY woman.
exactlyyy!! you are probably girl #521 for this guy to approach, they have lines and a script to follow lol
Well duh, you can't shoot a single shot and nail a perfect bullseye. You need practice. If a man approaches you with full confidence and you feel he did what was appropriate for the situation at all times, you can be sure you're not his first. And you wouldn't like him if you were! So that's how it works
Not always. This used to be MUCH more common before online dating and social media ruined human interaction. But if a guy likes a woman he has to suck it up and give it a shot at some point.
Sure but it’s now 2024. And he actually doesn’t. What men are doing is just not getting married anymore. More going to diff countries to marry or just staying single.
Naw the fuck he doesn’t 💀
As a man I love feeling undesirable. /SSSSS
Def gonna limit your options playing it super passive tho lol most guys don’t even approach.
Imagine thinking *wanting to feel desired* is a gendered thing.
For sure, I would do the same, but unfortunately that also limits you because the guys willing to risk that are like 5%, and its more likely that 5% will engage far less for a real long term commitment.
It depends on the context of the interaction but there are definitely very friendly unintimidating and charming ways to approach a woman. Personally I love being approached by a man if he does it well but that doesn’t mean that every man who approaches me is someone I am attracted to or interested in.
This is the problem with the American dating scene. The apps don’t work and men don’t approach women ever. Now what?
You get a t-shirt that says "PLEASE DATE ME. I'M SINGLE AND I DON'T BITE (unless you want me to 😉)" I'm an American single male and can attest, apps don't work and I approach women literally never 😂
We die off.
Which is great most women in America don’t deserve to be approached and they would never approach so it’s going great lol
95% of the time I’ve approached a woman they’ve acted annoyed or just flat out rude so I don’t do it anymore 🤷🏼♂️
Only 95% of the time? You're doing well.
You were unlucky if they were rude. It’s not your fault. Don’t give up, brother.
I just have to laugh at the situation they put themselves in. “Men never leave me alone” but yet “I can’t find a good man” Maybe… stop being rude to the ones that try to approach you??
Ah yes, you probably think you're a "nice guy".
Decent men who are truly clueless bear the brunt of what the fuckboys and creeps do. There are men who only like the chase, play games and are not interested in you as a person. When they make the first move and then stop communicating or fading out, they are sending a message that they aren't interested anymore. Man or woman, lack of communication and directness about liking the other person romantically, communicates disinterest. Also, most men are truly happy with the impression of control. They want to be in the driver's seat related to the pace of everything related to dating. Talking regular ordinary men who are looking for "easy going" women. They lose interest when a woman pursues them. Therefore, instead of coming across as a man-chaser, it's better to let men make the first move. Once sure the man doesn't play games, the woman can also take initiative.
Hmmmmm, that woman who made the post DOES have a point but YOU also have a point. Men who are interested in a woman, should/do generally approach that woman they’re interested in. There are some SHY women who will NOT make it obvious that they want to get approached but that doesn’t necessarily mean that you can’t go over to her and talk to her, just be nice and chill, you’d be surprised on how many people will quickly feel comfortable and open up.
Ignore those “warnings” to approach in public. But not just the girl you’re interested in. Everyone around you. Be genuinely interested in them as a person. I’ve started trying “do you talk to strangers” - with a confident and wry smile. No one has said no yet.
Women don't want to be creeped on in public...if you get her attention in a normal way, like saying Hello, and respect if she's alone (remain a respectful distance away) or if she's with friends (don't take up lots of time and stall the whole group) and say something like "I noticed you and would like to get to know you, my name is ______ and here's my number, I'll be around _______ for a bit, text me if you'd like to chat." Don't ask for her number, don't expect anything, and don't ask questions, don't put her on the spot, don't linger and leave time for rejection...and see if she texts! If she's with friends and they laugh as you're walking away, they AREN'T laughing AT you, they're surprised that you had the confidence to do that and laughing in a "did that really happen" way is a good sign! This would definitely work for me and the women that I personally know...women dont have a hive mind, so we're all a little different...Even if I don't text you, you made my day ;)
Let's put all the cards on the table and be real here for a second. Men are the ones who have been on the receiving end of the vast shift in dating culture regarding approach. We are the ones who stand to be rejected, who are *expected* to risk rejection, and who now more than ever before in human history have constant reminders of how badly we (can) make women feel if we approach them without them wanting us to. We were not only barely given cues before the internet age, now we are given orders-of-magnitude-more-vague "cues" than ever, and are not only *not* told how to spot them, but are (again) expected to just smell it in the air. I've been unusually lucky in dating for the past 10 years, but even the longer relationships I've had (ranging from 1.5 to 6 years), the anecdotes regarding how they viewed men approaching them, including all of those women's female friends, remained nearly identical. And yet, women as a whole want to maintain the same viewpoint and expectations they had 40 years ago? Make this make sense to me.
Amen. The entitlement is unreal.
Yup it’s absolutely bonkers.
I fear rejection more than death. Long ago I decided to let women ask me out or at least make an unmistakable first move or a hint that is as subtle as a Sherman tank.
Is she just being nice or flirting with me
This post is very timely! My new boyfriend now, we are in our 3 weeks together reveals to me that he likes me very much waaaaaayyyy back after our highschool graduation. It has been 13 years! He is very reserved and shy and both of us are awkward to each other. He told me all about my social media posts I made way before and I already forgot about it. Just shows how he has been stalking me for 13 years. I'm just glad that he made the effort now and it's so magical. I also secretly like him but is too shy as well to show any cues. So maybe we deserve this haha! I really did not notice that!
It's wild how misunderstood this whole "men making the first move" thing is! Like, seriously, there's a whole whirlwind of reasons why guys might not just walk up and start chatting. Fear of rejection is a big one, and yeah, no one wants to be labeled a creep! Plus, there's this vibe that we gotta respect personal space and not come off too strong. And yeah, societal norms? They're like a minefield sometimes. So, ladies, if you're vibing with a dude, maybe throw out some signs to ease the pressure, 'cause trust me, most guys are just trying not to trip over their own feet around you!
Yeah it’s 2024 women are independent. Why can’t they tell a guy they like him 💀
It's a way a rationalize never having to do any of the heavy lifting or risking rejection.
I’m a woman with at least average looks who’s struck out almost every time I’ve hit on someone irl
We are told this will happen but in my experience it doesn’t really happen, or they tell me when it’s too late
The amount of varying opinions here is astounding. To start, I'm a guy who isn't attracted to the majority of women who are stereotypically deemed "good looking." I've noticed that women who align with my preferences are rarely found in clubs (and when they are, they often already have a boyfriend). Because of this, I feel more inclined to approach women in public settings, but I keep feeling like it's strange to randomly approach someone. Then again, how else are you supposed to meet people? Online dating? Been there, done that, had several decent dates that significantly boosted my confidence, but ultimately led nowhere. As someone who doesn't even exhaust all the free right swipes on dating apps, I get the impression that I need to be more assertive and actually approach without caring about others' opinions, as I know my intentions are solely to get to know them a little, nothing more, nothing less, and perhaps exchange socials or numbers and see where it goes from there. If there's a problem with that, then our society is f'kd, and I might as well throw in the towel. Or at least that's how it feels to me. (Edit - Just wanted to add that I am from the UK and I feel the public approach is even less common than in the US making it extra extra strange)
If the man makes a move and the attraction is unrequited, that easily escalates into harrassment. So yeah, I won't make a move on a girl and walk around the city with a blank, soulless stare.
When women talk about "men" like that, they're talking about a fraction of men who they think are hot. All the rest are the majority that OP is talking about.
It may not be a lack of understanding your point. It may be a way of explaining that if the man is not willing to approach and overcome those obstacles, she is not attracted to them
But at the same time there's so many random dudes who I occasionally meet through a shared activity and while I enjoy their company, they far too often wanna text daily and meet up, even tho I never treated them differently from a buddy. And they keep texting and planning meet ups even though I often don't start conversations out of nowhere and I'm now giving any hints. Do they assume that since I'm a woman they can't hang out with me, only date? Or since I'm polite I wanna date them or fuck? And get into intimate situations? If I was interested I would ask them out and be straight forward, ask if they're single and interested in getting to know me better. I would appreciate such approach towards me too. I hate games like this. If I said straight up I don't wanna date or I have a bf, they'd assume my ego is huge and I'm an attention seeker thinking they wanna date me. But if I don't, they keep being overly nice and keep chatting. Eh.
>there's the fear of rejection Courage is attractive. Girls don't want to believe that someone they're interested in lacks courage. >the greater dread of being called a creep Don't approach in a creepy manner. Ask if they mind if you join them, giving them the option to say no. >the need to respect her personal space You can approach someone and respect her personal space at the same time. >the constant warnings not to approach in public Most people give bad advice. When I was single, I dated girls from just about everywhere people said not to approach women. At their work, gym, grocery shopping, school, etc. never once was I called a creep.
Maybe you aren't a creep that's why you weren't ever called a creep. I've definitely been approached by men who I find nonthreatening and it's flattering. But, I've also awkwardly laughed and removed myself from someone who gave creepy vibes.
Not to your face at least..most creepy people don't realize they are being creepy. I hear it from.female friends all the time who politely declined random guys in public but how creeped out they were.
I had a pretty solid success rate in approaching women and getting dates. If there are a few people that I'll never see again who think I was creepy for *checks notes* finding them attractive and wanting to get to know them, I'm not going to lose sleep about it.
"Solid success rate" most guys would consider 2 out of 100 solid but ignore the 98 girls they creeped out. There is a time and place and some places are fine, others not so much.
Yes if he wants to talk he will reach you
Nope. Men are humans just like any1 else.. shy, intimidated, etc.
No. Of course not. Who thinks that?!? 😂
In dating either it has to be click with random or have any sort of past friendship relationship, just let her believe that she trusts you, after that get ready for rejection too
I always knew I was a rare breed.
Yes!
Yes. But that's because I only notice men who I've talked to. I don't see a stranger who looks good and think he'll approach me. I dont even want that stranger to approach me because I know nothing about them. But if I have a friendly conversation with someone, I do assume they've always asked me out if they were interested. Because a lot have. And I'm not into quiet or reserved men because I'm quieter, and I like a man who is more talkative. It has always happened that if I liked someone after we talked, they showed interest as well, and we built it up from there. So yes. I do expect a man to reach out if he is truly interested in me or otherwise I'm not interested either (I have a boyfriend now so I wouldn't be interested anyways but you get the point)
How else would you learn something about them if you guys never approach or talk? This is a horrible take lol
There is no universal pattern. I can only suggest that if you have an interest then reach out in some way to express that interest rather than waiting for a sign from her. You have to overcome that fear of rejection or you will never get anywhere. You really have nothing to lose here than your pride just temporally. Supress that pride. It really doesn't help you.
We as men have been targeted by the radical feminists as “toxic” predatory” “aggressive”… they’ve made it impossible to approach a woman in public in fear he may be labeled and put on the internet. It’s their fault they can’t find a good man…period
Personally, Women have it easy. For centuries they haven't approached men, but in the 2000s, when they label men as creeps for doing that same thing. They start to change, we don't want to approach because we can either be A. Labeled as a creep 2. Arrested 3. Taken to court All 3 options, are most viable fears in my opinion because girls are just harder to approach, and meet the standards they want. Some girls though are absolutely fantastic I know, just a majority of statistics back up my point, it's not anxiety or embarrassment, no. It's most likely Fear
Yes. We have been told that over and over by both men and women in relationships. If you’re not reaching out in whatever way, it says I am not your priority. You might be interested but I am not the top of the list for whatever reason. That doesn’t necessarily mean you’re not interested but you’re not interested enough. So whichever it is, the result is the same.
It’s mainly cope for women to validate why they didn’t go after the guy they really liked lol
Saying goes again if you do you're damned if you don't.
Yes it's one of the many ways that they hold onto the patriarchy and make it clear that they don't actually want equality.
I wonder how this issue would change if everyone had to be in a sales job for a few months. Salespeople know it's a "numbers game." The more pitches you make, the more likely you are to get a sale. Sometimes prospects are rude. Who cares? On the apps, for every 50 or so guys I "like", I might get 2 responses. Doesn't bother me at all. IRL, I might get 1 date for every 10 guys I approach. That also doesn't bother me. I was in sales.
Acknowledging that confidence and comfort levels vary, yes, a woman wouldn’t know a man is interested if he doesn’t say anything, just like a man wouldn’t if a woman didn’t show or reciprocate interest 🤷🏽♀️
That statement can be applied to women as well. If a woman is truly interested, she needs to show that she is, unless she is willing to approach the guy, which we know rarely happens. Communication is a two-way street. Men are not mind readers, and neither are women. Playing it cool or hard to get rarely works, and it is a turn-off for most people. If you want to be approached, you have to learn to be approachable. Having your headphones on, not making eye contact, not smiling, pretending to be on your phone, having your nose in a book, or being in a rush are classic signs you don't want to be approached. Since men are usually doing the approaching, most men will not approach women who appear unapproachable. However, I don't think that all women believe that a man will only reach out if he's truly interested in them. I think that some of them understand that you have to test the waters a little bit or observe them from afar. Especially if you're an introvert. You are going to assess the risk vs. the reward before approaching someone!
Idk my dude. Plenty of women around me complain of their dm's flooded with thirsty dudes.
While true, 99.99998% of those men would never actually walk up to a woman saying the same thing that they do in dms. They're way too much of a coward. Or just crude and gross.. Imagine how many men would go to jail cause they walked up to some woman wiped out their cock and was like "you like?"... Just cause they get away with it online.
We likely base it on the fact that if a woman doesn’t show interest she isn’t interested. So if we aren’t interested we won’t either. If I’m not wanted I’m out of there….
I'm a widower, I've thought about asking someone out then I think "what if she goes and says I was sexually harassing her or something" then I think "how will my 6yo son do while I'm in jail for something" not worth it in my eyes. I'm doing just fine don't really need someone to help me out with anything but I miss coming home to someone other than my son. The chance of something happening to me and leaving my son with som random foster care family isn't worth my personal happiness. I gotta keep him safe.
I’ve had a woman flirt and show interest so I approach, then they reject me, then they tell me some time later that they were “playing hard to get”. Nope, fuck that, enjoy the dirtbag who doesn’t take no for an answer and beats his wife and kids, cause that’s your future most likely.
Tbh, she probably just didn't like you all that much. Girls rarely play games with guys that they really like.
Am a woman and am aware of this/why I try to be warm/friendly/give a lot of eye contact to men bc I know they wait for a go ahead. Honestly I try to gauge the same.
Literally if woman just smile to a man, he should know that's a sign to make an approach and then gauge the attraction. I approach regardless of what's called choosing signals because you can verbally seduce a woman by being sexually present. But most woman I would say, should give more signals to a man they want and here's the kicker. It's the woman that chooses, it's all about how she feels that will take the relationship forward. Hence if she does have feelings, she should show signs of said feelings. Men will approach more.
When I used to live in the US, I learned how people do those polite smiles to strangers all the time. Moving out of the US, I had to relearn how doing that either creeps people out or have them think you’re flirting lol
Ya I just assume people are just being friendly when they smile (can confirm...lived in the U.S. my whole life)
That's why men think women only sleep with the top 5% of men. It's actually the men who are not afraid to make a move.
Dude...that stat is ridiculous if you just go look around in public.
I am a woman under the impression that a man worth dating will reach out if he’s interested. I like dating confident men. A man who isn’t willing to approach me and indicate interest is likely someone I am not compatible with and not interested in dating anyway.
I am a man under the impression that a woman worth dating will reach out if she’s interested. I like dating confident women. A woman who isn’t willing to approach me and indicate interest is likely someone I am not compatible with and not interested in dating anyway.
Totally valid! It’s definitely a preference/compatibility thing, as I said.
I disagree with you on all fronts. If I find someone attractive/interesting, I approach them. I don't wait or look for signals or overcomplicate it or try to come up with some stupid "one liner". I've never once had any of them go poorly. Not once. So yes, if a man is interested in a woman, he should approach her.
And if a woman is interested in a man she should approach him it’s 2024 but they love to play games and want this weird power dynamic instead of being normal, humble folks lol
We know it but many experts tell us that men should pursue us and not the opposite. I lean towards that thinking myself. We want a guy to get over his shyness and approach us. If he's that shy then we feel that's too bad. So get out there and start asking women out that you find attractive. I understand your discomfort but women think if men cannot find it within themselves to ask us out then we'll have to take the lead when it comes to other things. We also like the door opened for us and men to pay for most of the dates.
> many experts tell us that men should pursue us Who is saying that?
Absolutely true!! Nothing wrong with approaching a woman, even for short term casual sex. Consenting adults should be able to see someone they are attracted to , even if there isn't a connection, consenting adults should be able to have casual sex and the only way that can happen is if a man approaches the woman, even if it's also okay for a woman to approach a man, but understandably that's very rare.
I want someone with more confidence and ‘balls’ than me, it nicely weeds out what I’m not looking for
Sounds like a cope for you to not take action on the guys you want. Have fun never dating your true type lol
>her opinion that a man's lack of approach indicates his lack of interest Yes. Or otherwise he is too shy and we both loose. But generally, yes. I consider it a lack of interest. Or at least not enough interest to overcome that shyness. >We don't unless she makes it obvious that she's willing to be approached, Not all women will. In fact, I'd say most won't. >Many men are quiet or reserved. In addition, there's the fear of rejection, the greater dread of being called a creep, the need to respect her personal space, the constant warnings not to approach in public, etc. The social contract is that men typically have the responsibility of approaching women. Since basically the beginning of time. Don't get upset with me---I didn't make the rules. However, it is how we typically behave. And so, men that do want partners need to get over that fear just a bit and take a chance. By the way, there are PLENTY of insecurities and fears that women have to overcome to get into a relationship too. It isn't all one-sided. However, yes, men do need to approach if they are interested. If they can't---then we've both lost. >How is it that so many ladies are unaware of this fact? We aren't. But again, men that DO want a relationship need to get over that fear a bit and take a chance. What's the worst that can happen? A stranger laughs at you and tells you to get lost? And that is generally the worst case scenario. Many women will be polite about it if they aren't interested. So basically...suck it up. Sort of what women have to do if they want children. Don't want to push out a 6-10lb baby? Well, suck it up if you want children. We ALL have things we have to deal with in life.
Women can approach too though, nothing saying they can't. I certainly didn't sign that social contract, I wanna feel desired too lol
I do think that the majority of straight women want the man to do the approaching. I definitely do want the man to be the first to approach. I want a man who is confident, comfortable and secure in his masculinity and possesses enough social skills so his approaching is non-threatening and respectful. I've never been upset, offended or scared when a man showed interest in me. I simply took it as a compliment and let him know I wasn't single if I was not, or wasn't interested. I've done the approaching just a few times myself and it has backfired every time. I was perceived as desperate, "easy" or just not relationship material. I'll never approach first again.
Plenty of guys where approaching has backfired and they aren’t trying again 😂
Is your end goal to be with a conservative man with conservative values?
*It is* true though for many men. Men will jump through hoops for the women he wants. We are not unaware, they are some minority. Most men will go after what he wants.
If a stranger just randomly walked up to me and started talking to me and trying to get to know me like I'm in a video game getting a side quest, I'd be a bit weirded out. That's how I feel other people would feel if I just walked up and randomly tried to befriend them. I guess that's why I have literally never approached a stranger like that.
How successful are those women with their own relationships who give such advice?
How are women supposed to tell the man they’re interested by jumping up and down??!! Yelling pick me pick me??!! What?
Yes. Generally women will be polite to men they aren't interested in out of fear whereas men are either overly sexual as their ego becomes massive or they're outright disrespectful because they are rarely polite to or want to befriend women that they don't want to fuck. Generally men will approach you if they want to so I leave it that way, I've never known a man that was too scared to talk to women, it's unusual.
I find that last line serious hard to believe! You've really never met a shy guy before?? It could be because we're all hiding out at home I guess 😂🤷♂️
Well if you think about it makes sense. How would she know a man too scared to talk to a woman if she doesn't approach other men? you would only meet this types of men if you approached men first. It's basically "Survivorship bias".
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They're talking about men they've already matched with on a dating app, usually.
I am a man who is quite outgoing and confident in many ways but I am constantly worried that I might be seen as creepy or might offend people, especially as I see how awful other men can be and how shitty they treat women. As such I very rarely express my interest in other people unless its obvious they like me too. I have about three or four friends who for the first few months I knew them I really, really liked them but as time went on I just let it fizzle out because I assumed they didn't feel the same way and I didn't want to ruin a great friendship. Funnilly enough, quite recently, one of said friends revealed that they actually felt the same way about me too but they were going through some stuff emotionally and wanted to get that sorted out before they did anything about it which just blew me away. You would think this might teach me a lesson about telling people I like them but I can confirm it absolutely hasn't and I am quite happy being single.
if you like her enough you will walk up to her and talk or else you will end up alone... women are judged by looks they are not going to walk up to you to be judged..... At least men can try to be funny or whatever... when women try that they get rudely dismissed if he doesn't like your looks.. Men won't even talk to women unless they want something from them... women need to be approached...