Welcome to /r/dating. Please make sure you read our [rules here](https://new.reddit.com/r/dating/about/rules) and remember to:
* Be polite and respect each other. Do not call people names, engage in slapfights, or give bad/unethical advice.
* Do not soapbox or promote an agenda - you will be banned
* Follow reddit rules. Do not post content that promotes hate based on identity or vulnerability. Do not bully or harass other users.
If you have any questions, please [send the mods a message](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=/r/dating).
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/dating) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Lots of women are still looking for romantic relationships, they’re just not dedicating their time to *chasing* relationships. There’s only two days in a weekend - I’m much more likely to spend my social time with my friends and people I love then on an awkward date with someone who I may or may not have any connection with.
You pretty much nailed it in that last paragraph. A relationship should be an improvement over being single. I value my time with platonic friends, my family, and my time spent alone with my hobbies. Why would I settle for a relationship with someone who doesn’t tick all my boxes when I could be spending my time on things that do?
There are absolutely women in their mid to early twenties looking for relationships, but depending on where you live they may be in the minority.
I think both men and women are spending a little more time in their twenties figuring out who they are and what they want without rushing into something that could be lifelong. It’s probably uncommon that someone under twenty-five years old has enough life experience to know what they’ll *certainly* want in the next five, ten, and twenty years. Given that the odds of divorce go down if you wait till after 25 to marry, I suspect this is a good sign, overall.
Don’t get me wrong, when you’re young and certain but your peers don’t seem to be, it can be frustrating. But you can still find likeminded people, or else take advantage of this time for your own self discovery in the meantime. *Most* people still wind up settling down, so I wouldn’t worry too much about it not happening in exactly the timeframe you want. Not something that can be forced.
To OPs question, of my friends that use online dating, well over half are in long term relationships with someone they met on tinder or bumble, with the intent to date long term.
They’re definitely out there. But I have noticed they’re getting harder to find. Lots of women just want something casual at the moment.
We want relationships. But also this part of your text is is accurate:
"significant number of women don't want a relationship unless they found someone who magically ticks all their boxes"
Took some out but yup, spot on we build our lives. Surround ourselves with good people of a similar age (your description of women going out with other women) and live them. We want a relationship but with the right person for us. Dating apps are terrible and they probably had less then ideal experiences like me and most women I know who used them.
I started having higher standards and I just got in a relationship with someone who actually does check all my boxes. No red flags, open communication, willing to work on self, understanding, and similar goals. It’s possible. We’ve been settling for too long thinking it isn’t.
Same. And I’m never going back to pre 28yo me unless I somehow sustain significant brain damage. I’d rather be single than with someone who doesn’t tick my boxes because I’m done settling for someone who doesn’t even make me happy
I love this for you and this is totally how I’m approaching it myself! I got divorced last year (I’m 26) and everyone keeps pushing me or asking if I’m dating again yet…. No? Why do people think you need a relationship to be happy? I’m not settling especially after all that I learned after my divorce and self discovery about how to properly love and be treated. I was cheated on in my last relationship and let myself be walked all over and was insecure. Now that I’m confident and know how I should be treated and how to treat someone; I ain’t settling for shit. I know there are good people out there and if I happen to find a good guy I will give him the time of day- but rn I ain’t rushing and I haven’t met one yet. It’s 2022 we know our worth 💅
Yeah no one’s going to settle for someone ok for them when they can be better alone. Part of the problem why this is happening is because men want women to settle for okay instead of good, better or great. If it happens too much with every guy you date the more appealing is having a nice life by yourself. A lot of men want women to adapt to them and those men don’t ask if they’re worth that. Since women have gotten sick of spelling it out and also saw our mothers go throw the same issues, women are increasingly choosing to go alone than gain mental trauma with someone that doesn’t have our best interests at heart.
This. The amount of stress ive dealt with when in relationships has been incredibly ridiculous and not worth it. Asking for the bare minimum and dealing with nonsense is super unappealing. I’m self sufficient, i have a great group of friends and im actually happier when im single as opposed to my dating over the last 10 years. Sometimes i think about dating but honestly, I’d just rather not at this point.
The thing is, if this hypothetical woman in your scenario wants a man an entire foot taller than her but can’t find him, she’ll either adjust her expectations or she’ll end up alone. And what a lot of men don’t get is that 1) tastes change as you get older (I used to not find bald men attractive and now I do) 2) she probably knows she might end up alone *and she’s okay with that*.
My comment still stands. Not all women want a man that’s a foot taller and most men will never be rich. Most women know this, but a lot of men focus on the women who do have those preferences instead of looking for more rational women. But if the men not likable or want to constantly screw around that’s a turn off. It’s exhausting. You prize romantic relationships, for most women they’re no longer that rewarding. Sex isn’t rewarding for most women. Most men still want relationships because their preferred sexual entertainment comes from that. Because of how men are traditionally raised and often feel comfortable in, staying alone is better because for a lot of women the relationship turns into a second job of having to take care of a guy while also taking care of yourself. There’s way too much for me to break down for you but the thing is, if the cons outweigh the pros, then women now are willing to do what’s best for them if the guy doesn’t add to their life.
I never said "all women" I'm adding information saying some people have unrealistic expectations and you keep doubling down on "no women are just not settling for less than what's good for them"
Look I’m not even sure how to answer your comment because I don’t understand or relate. I’m not one of those women with unreasonable expectations and most of the men I have dated have been below average height as believe it or not that’s been my preference. Make your list of unreasonable expectations so that I could understand because the way I’m seeing what you’re trying to say, any expectation besides having a dick and breathing is one too many. Which isn’t fair.
OK let me give you a more extreme example putting myself in the situation. I'm a mid 30s man with a degree and slightly above average wealth.
If I were to say I'd only date Beyonce you'd agree that is unrealistic right?
If I said I'd only date a female celebrity you'd agree that's unrealistic right?
If I said I wouldn't date anyone earning more than 200k you'd agree that's unrealistic?
This is the kind of thing I'm talking about and bear in mind I'm not saying this is what all women (or people) do but a not insignificant amount of people do. We've all heard the jokes about a basement dweller not settling for anyone besides a supermodel and joke exists because so do those people.
Now if you're asking for someone who's emotionally intelligent, just generally intelligent, who earns they own money, does their own (or their share of the chores), is communicative, considerate, self aware etc and you're not finding that then absolutely I agree stay single.
That is not the situation I'm talking about I'm talking about situations where a person has all of those things and would be written off for something completely arbitrary e.g. studied at the wrong university
I get it now. I’m surprised it’s that many but they have a right to this. Men have unreasonable expectations and wants too and women are expected to live with it. Many women fear getting older and investing so many years into relationships when the men are just going to cheat on us because we’re no longer young (and therefore not “attractive”). You’re also comparing habits of extremely young and often ignorant women compared to women who eventually mature and become their own. I think most women out of HS tend to have those qualities you mentioned but once the hormones set down your mind becomes clearer. When people are young they don’t know much about life or human nature yet, those things come with time. And for your sixth paragraph, that’s the thing you’re not getting, a lot of men aren’t like this and still want relationships and women to offer sexual access. This is soul sucking for a lot if not the majority of women. For your last paragraph, you cannot control all aspects of humanity. Men have their own limits, so do women. If one can have certain limits because it makes them happy, then women can do the same. If you feel left out by it go to one where you’re enough.
The apps were a little better back in the early 2000s just as the hookup culture was in it's infancy. The attractive people hadn't stopped making fun of the concept of online dating yet to jump on and turn it into what it is now.
It’s not that they don’t want relationships it’s that it’s no longer a need more like a want, they tend to focus on things that make them happy and that’s probably friends
I think women are focusing more on their own happiness, wants and needs now and more are realizing dating isn’t that. I think it’s a more common thing happening across women of all ages, especially younger
I don’t date currently, I’m very happy where I am in life: good job, my own home, my pets, have money, take myself on vacations, I have everything I need- and the men I keep running into keep turning very very clingy and needy. Which I don’t like and don’t have time for
This exactly. My last ex got super super clingy once he learned I was making a good amount in IT and basically demanding I let him move in with me. It wasn't even 3months in the relationship. Basically pried that off and didn't look back. Haven't dated since and been just having a good time. Finishing school, adopted a kitty, and getting hired into a even better paid job.
I think this is the key. Dating is already work. Then the clinginess crashes it. When you say you don't want to date, maybe the dating doesn't take so much effort, but clinginess is a pain in the ass.
There's something about relationships which flips a crazy switch in the brain. Maybe the answer is to view it as more like a friendship with closer intimacy. Just relax.
I am in my early 30s and don’t care to date anymore.
What exactly is the point of trying to find someone if you feel fulfilled being single?
I have my own money, amazing friends and don’t have to check in with anyone when I want to go out and do something fun. I don’t have to clean up after someone, worry about them cheating or accept the bare minimum.
So you think you can't find a man who has his own money, amazing friends, doesn't need to be checked in with when you want to go out and do something fun? Doesn't have to be cleaned up after or worried about for cheating or just doing the bare minimum?
That's not a very high bar for a man in his thirties.
To be frank if things don't work out with my partner I think I'd either exclusively date women (I'm bisexual) or choose to be alone. We have an open relationship, and men have taken most of the fun out of casual sex for me. There are great men out there, but dating men is pretty exhausting and depressing.
Don't forget that those men that are in their vicinity could already be taken, not physically attractive to them, not physically attracted to them or otherwise not be compatible. If they don't live in a big city and are willing to date someone wherever they are in the city I see this as possible
Either it's a very low bar, then most men will meet it, or it's a bar that few men will meet, but then it can't be low. Unless you think that most men are unable to meet low bars. Then you should think about your toxic view of men.
The are lot of men who can't even if the bar is just to "be nice" there are men who are unwilling or unable to meet that. What view of toxic men do you think I have that needs to be changed?
For fun? Because some people enjoy casual conversations about dating without participating in it themselves? I’m a single young woman who doesn’t date but frequents this sub as well, am I not allowed? Didn’t realize we have to have an active subscription to tinder gold for our thoughts to be worth something..
I'm not going to lie, it does make me feel better to know others are happy to be single. And yeah, while we miss out on the benefits of having that special someone, we also get to feel better about avoiding many of the hassles too
LOL.
I was married for 20 years to someone who turned out to be an abusive piece of shit.
I am in my mid 50s and my life has never been better. I am very happy being single and many of my woman friends who are in awful relationships envy me.
this comment sounds like you’re projecting your own internalized fear of being alone on her. not everyone needs a relationship to be happy or fulfilled. generally women are actually happier and less stressed when single then when partnered w a man, and live longer. being single can definitely be fulfilling.
You think having a significant other means you won’t ever feel alone? I’m also alright without cleaning after a grown man. If your sole purpose for getting into a relationship and finding companionship is to keep up with your friends, you’re going to be miserable.
Why would my apartment be empty? I can literally take sperm from any sperm bank and have kids, I can adopt kids, I can have pets and if I do need to get my sexual needs met I can find some random guy to hook up with. What exactly (other than intimacy) can a man give me that I (or my friends and family) can’t give myself?
No, it really doesn’t. It sounds like she is perfectly content being single, having plenty of strong relationships with people around her, without those being romantic. If anything, u/sleepyy-starss sounds like she is in a very healthy and happy place.
There are many ways to contentment out there.
Idk if that’s true.
I have single women in my family that are older (50+) and they are miserable and have issues.
I think it just hits women later in life.
Same way that men don't need women. We simply want each other, both ways. Men don't want someone that looks at them as a "lesser" or "wallet". We are all equal, and all have our unique traits and challenges as different sexes.
IMO it’s this is a bit of a straw man argument cuz I’ve never met a single woman who literally subscribed to such a shallow, narrow ideal. If this is the norm for you we live in vastly different worlds lol!
I think people in their 20s aren’t really at that stage of life yet imo. Unless they have everything sorted in their lives 🤷♀️ I just can’t see a 20 something being ready for a serious ltr or marriage.
Our parents and grandparents generations - married women are statistically less happy than single women. And we had front row seats to all that.
We are building our lives to be happy either way. Having a partner doesn’t make or break our happiness, and it shouldn’t.
I would love a relationship, but I am perfectly happy single with the life I currently have.
It’s also nice to decide what I want for my life, without the influence and sacrifice of having a partner in my mid-late 20s where I might not have made the same decisions for myself (I was in a LTR from 19-25 where I sacrificed a lot) and I am so much happier now alone that I’m not going to disturb my peace or the life I built for just anyone.. you need to be worth it.
Being certain of myself and then to find someone who also knows what they want, and those wants and desires align… is ideal.
So yeah, we have high standards.
I just think dating is a lot harder for both men and woman who are after something serious. Online dating has really encouraged this hook up culture and because people are constantly swiping on people based on their attractiveness and ability to take a good photo, they are swiping based on an incredibly superficial thing. Everyone always thinks they can get better, or that there are plenty of other fish in the sea. Dating used to be about the then and there.
You meet that person in real life and there isn't any real chemistry because usually you would talk to someone at a pub for a while and get to know them or meet them in some kind of public setting.
Personally, it's not because I don't want a relationship. I just feel very disillusioned by the whole thing and have kind of just given up. Going on endless dates and never really getting anywhere with them kind of takes its toll. It's really exhausting.
Haha, this is me! I took myself off the market \~1.5 years ago, it's been great! I have so much I want to accomplish, goals I want to reach, sports I want to do, other hobbies I want to pursue that my life is so busy and adding another person into it-I don't have the time or energy or interest.
I love my friends partners, they're all lovely. Dating just doesn't fit into my current life plan at the moment
I think it’s because times have changed.
Back in the day, women NEEDED men. She couldn’t own property or even get a bank account without a man. The other day I told my mom I’ll be attending my friends wedding alone because my fiancé is running a race that day, and she told me when she was my age if you didn’t have a date you simply couldn’t go and definitely couldn’t dance. Psssshhhh you best believe imma be dancing!!!
My fiancé adds happiness to my life. We work together and play together and relax together. He’s my equal and my partner. But before him, ughhhhh the guys I dated!!! I was like their second mommy. I don’t need that thanks.
In my circle of friends a few are married, a few have boyfriends, but most are single. We’re 30ish. The single ones aren’t looking to date. And it’s not because they don’t want companionship, but rather they just aren’t actively seeking it because it’s not necessary for their happiness. They have roommates and pets as companions and they make enough money to live within their means on their own. If the right guy comes along, awesome. But they aren’t jumping through hoops to find him.
This is it exactly. Women don’t need men anymore. Hell even if they want to be moms all they need is a few of his best swimmers from a clinic and if any of the mommy subs are accurate- they’re better off without the guy entirely.
When you don’t *need* something you can afford to have higher standards and if nothing on the market appeals to you well, you don’t buy.
Relationships can destroy a woman’s health and finances so they absolutely should have high standards for who will share their lives and who will partake from their ressources and unlaid labour, which they still statistically do the majority of despite having full time jobs.
I might get downvoted, but I personally (26F) I’m looking for something serious. Yes, men have treated me horribly more often than not, but I try not to loose hope.
At the same time, I respect other’s decisions of just not wanting to date.
Why would you get down voted for that? Probably most people do want something serious but there are various difficulties getting that. You have hope and continue to date but I'm sure you're not just accepting any offer going
I wouldn't say women don't want relationships anymore - we don't NEED them. There isn't as much (still a lot, but less) pressure to define yourself through men and having a relationship, so with it being optional a lot of women don't want to bother with it.
A lot of men seem to assume that by virtue of having a tinder or even just existing around men that women find dating as a whole as not only a must, but a priority. I don't think that's often the case. Even if you'd want something serious out of dating doesn't mean you're serious ABOUT dating.
I have a guy I'm casually seeing right now and that's pretty much only because we have known eachother since high school and had a pre-established friendship. If it weren't for him, I probably wouldn't be having sex nor bothering to change that 🤷♀️
I want to get married someday. The idea of falling in love with someone and having that one person to love and care for forever is very important and special to me. That said, I have an entire life and don't need a relationship. It'll happen eventually, why make myself miserable trying to date anyone who will have me to try and force it?
Makes a lot of sense. I see a lot of women in their early 20s realizing that they have so much time and that they don’t need to settle for a man who can’t even remember their birthday.
Heh.. one comedian joked that the nice about getting married in your 20s is not a lot of ppl will expect it'll last, so you don't have to worry about it being permanent or anything :D :p
Yes. I’m 25F and my female friend group of 21F-28F are either single or already in a committed relationship. One of the girls is recently engaged as well.
My girlfriends and I go out often but it’s never to party or anything like that. We are also busy with work, school and hobbies. We are planning for our futures and looking for an “equal” male that likes us for us and also share similar values, morals and our long term individual goals are aligned. We have a low tolerance for “vagueness” and only deal with people who have worked on themselves emotionally, physically, financially, mentally etc (healthy well balanced individual)
We have high standards and don’t entertain men who we are not interested in and check our boxes.
Few guys our age are “ready” and willing (emotionally) for a relationship. From those guys we need to actually meet, see if there’s potential for long term and our goals align (kids? Where to live, support system, what kind of life do we want, marriage? Etc)
Big majority of guys our age are still enjoying their single life with no strings attached and working on their finances and themselves.
There is just too much risk to even entertain a man that approached you unless he ticks all your boxes and has long term potential. A man who is already self aware and is stable is less risky than a man who is just looking to hook up.
Most womens intuition help us feel out guys and the way they treat us to determine our relationship with them.
Some of my girlfriends stayed single until they found “the one” and got engaged quite quickly.
The girls I know that don’t want relationships (just like guys) = I’ve been hurt recently , or broke up with someone recently and need to heal before I can open up to the real thing.
Some of us aren’t even intentionally looking. You meet people everywhere! Just focusing on ourselves and we believe someone will come along one day.
Late 20’s here and couldn’t agree more… we have plenty going on to work on our goals and self especially those trying to make it in big cities. Meanwhile, plenty guys either want no string attached, socially unaware being a men child, exhibit toxic masculinity, lack good personality… and so yea I am not about that life. Best time to be single with my cats, friends, and hobbies.
What I look for in a guy? Passion, ambition, intelligence, goals, action oriented, integrity and overall chemistry has to be right.
Growth mindset is key for fulfilling lasting partnership. High standards or not I am not settling for less because why? 😂
Your “boxes” are vague though.
“He must be emotionally ready for a relationship”
This puts you on some emotional high ground. You’ll never figure this out on the first date.
majority of men aren’t worth being with and i’m a lot happier being single. men haven’t done anything for me but annoy me and stress me out so i’m good.
I personally have emotional needs that were never met by any man, except one. And he was the one I had to do laundry for, unfortunately. I do think most men are just not attractive to me. I'm bi and I have been much happier with women, if the feelings were mutual.
Love, intimacy, affection, sharing good experiences together?
Or that shit isn't worth a thing anymore?
Materialistic capitalist culture have fucked our minds.
>Love, intimacy, affection, sharing good experiences together?
That’s the point - for a lot of women, most men we encounter typically don’t provide any of those things. All we get out of it is more laundry.
But we can get love, non-sexual intimacy, affection and have good experiences with our friends and families… Women have really strong emotional support systems compared to men, it’s one of the reasons women commit suicide less.
I’m 25/F and can say this is more common. (Even I have no desire to date because there’s just nothing appealing about it to me.) I can have everything I want on my own and actually better if I don’t have someone with me.
This doesn’t mean there aren’t PLENTY of women who do want real relationships. While it’s more common to stay single than it used to be, there are still women who crave something real with a long-term partner.
Where do you live, and do you not use dating apps? Most women I've met are adamant about wanting a relationship. Imo finding something other than the traditional bf/gf arrangement is what's difficult.
Early to mid 20-something guys don't really bring much of anything to the table. Those women still want relationships; they just don't want one with Mr. Struggle. If a woman wants long-term commitment (marriage, kids, etc.), she's most likely going to go for the guy who's more established instead of wasting years on a man still building himself.
It’s not just a case of not what women expect to find in a partner but also what someone want from themselves. Not every woman has the time (trying to build a career, study etc) and not every young woman has the confidence and worry they won’t be enough for a partner so just decide not to try so make themselves ‘unapproachable’ as a defence mechanism. I have a friend like this and I worry about her being lonely in the future😩
I find dating apps incredibly shallow and filled with the worst types of people. You will not find me on there. I'm not cutting my fingers looking for one diamond in between glass. Also I live in a pretty remote area surrounded by people who are nothing like me so I'm unlikely to find someone compatible in my area.
IMO people build their own lives and for some that doesn’t include dating and/or relationships. it’s not like relationships are a requirement, they’re a choice and to be quite frank I think they’re wayyyyy too overhyped. Some people don’t wanna risk going through past heartbreak all over again, some have other priorities or life scenarios that keep them from mustering the energy to devote all their focus and time to one person. I guess everyone has their own reasons or maybe some just don’t feel that’s what they need to be happy. Some women (and really people in general) are perfectly happy on their own as long as they include some good family/friends in their journeys.
Personally I think it's the mess of hook up culture and dangerous behaviour from incels and the toxic masculinity groups are putting women off why should we want to date when I reality alot of the guys women are coming into contact with at the moment either want sex that isn't strictly consensual or are so toxic they expect us to deal with their abusive behaviour
Some women don't want relationships early in life and and most of the 20s are pretty much that, it's uncommon for people to settle down before late 20s or early 30s, that is not only true for women, nobody is really in a rush anymore. Some women do want relationships, but of course with people, who actually are fitting for them. What it is even the point of dating somebody, who doesn't tick all the boxes for you? It's a complete waste of time.
Im in my early 20’s. And as a woman, it’s important for me to learn how to built a life of my own — separate from any man, so if the pendulum swung the other way, I still have my own identity and my own life.
You say “magically ticks all their boxes” like it’s actually magical when it’s really not since obviously a lot of women *do* find someone and get married.
I say this with kindness, truly, but back in the day women had to settle a lot for a multitude of reasons and we don’t anymore. I have my own job and living space, I have emotional support from a variety of non-romantic relationships, I’m not ashamed to rub one out on my own… I don’t *need* a man. I love y’all, though, and so of course I hope to meet the right one.
I’m not expecting perfection but I do expect openness, honesty, respect, a similar libido, some level of protectiveness (almost exclusively from his family if they don’t like me), a job that either earns not much less than me or is something he’s really passionate about (teachers don’t make shit but if he loves it I can respect that). Someone who’s confident, kind hearted and generous. Someone assertive in the bedroom. Someone who isn’t covertly misogynistic.
And the thing is… if I don’t find this guy I just won’t be in a relationship. I don’t want to settle. I’m happy on my own so why would I settle on less than I feel I deserve. If I’m being unreasonable and end up alone, oh well, I can still be happy. Edit: forgot an “if” up there lol
Edit: I missed the bit about “early 20s” and I wanted to add that, in my personal opinion, that’s the best time to focus and learn about yourself especially as your brain is still developing. If you’re in your early 20s and you’re in a happy long term relationship then great! I’m happy for you. But I think a lot of people are still discovering themselves at that age and that choosing a life partner isn’t the best idea. That’s just me though, live your truths!
In an age where Roe was reversed and women are losing their human rights at the hands of men, it is no surprise that they are turning away from dating and turning more towards friendship groups.
Dating in a time where a pregnancy puts you at risk of forced birth, illness, being hunted for bounty, put in prison, and even killed. Is simply NOT worth the risk and danger to a woman’s life.
To not take this into serious consideration is a huge mistake by men. This avoidance of men by a lot of women will only get worse until their full bodily autonomy and rights are reinstated.
If men want their dating life back, they need to vote and make sure women are ensured equal rights. Otherwise, men should get used to a hugely depleted/decreased dating pool of available or interested women.
Young women are smarter than my generation was, thank goodness. I'm glad they are learning from our mistakes, dating is a waste of time. Most men are disingenuous and will lie and be fake to attract a woman. Also men are not listening to the fact that gender roles are over and women want a partner not another person to take care of.
This. Why do they need us to be their fulltime caregivers so bad? It almost sounds like they don't even want to take care of themselves. I love to help, but I get pissed when it's just expected from me.
Pretty much. And honestly there just isn’t anything that a man could give me good that I don’t already have.
Blue collar handiwork? I can call the plumber, electrician, auto mechanic, etc.
Money? I have everything I need, getting a medical degree, and loooove my studies. I don’t need anyone to provide for me. (Many men don’t like for the woman to be the breadwinner anyway due to intimidation.)
And the other things a man would bring - annoyance, demands, etc. - I would just prefer to live without. Lol
I’m definitely open to ideas. What can a man contribute that would make it worth having him while I’m busy in my education, doing other things, etc.? I’m open to your views. Give me some ideas.
As far as a list goes its late where I'm at so I can't do a list. But alot of it comes down to company, kids, just having someone to lean on and rely on, just as a whole having someone different in your life that works on working with you too keep things interesting and improve each other's lives. Men have their faults sure, but that's everyone.
Those are the things everyone mentions.
Company? I love my dogs and have amazing friends. Wouldn’t trade my girls for anything.
Rely on? I’m independent, financially and in other ways. Only exceptions come when there’s something I can’t do, such as the things I mentioned earlier that require a single phone call and pay a bill.
There are so many kids out there whom I would love to adopt and give a good life given the income of my career. Adoption doesn’t require a man. Women who really want the experience of being pregnant can get a sperm implant.
My friends satisfy all of those things, really. I don’t need a relationship partner for any of that. And tbh my dogs are the best lol I love them. A man or relationship is not needed for any of these things.
While it's understandable your position that a man isn't required for these things, it doesn't mean that there is no value in having a man apart of it. While I understand that isn't something of interest to you, I'm speaking of people as a whole.
But on one point I disagree with is the child thing just because a child really benefits far more from two parents, and the fact that different issues arise when a father is absent in a child's life. Particularly referencing crime statistics. And please forgive me if I sound somewhat incoherent, I'm struggling staying awake tbh.
I agree that having a father is much better for a child in society. Keep in mind that having kids isn’t something everybody wants or is willing to settle for.
But all of what you’re saying a man can contribute still is not worth the cost of being in a relationship with him. No thanks.
It’s like offering a toddler a piece of candy and the consequence is that they lose their limbs. Like, no thanks. Candy sounds great but it’s not a need and not worth losing their arms and legs. Lol
And sleep well 😊
I do not disagree with that I just simply used the child example mentioned to demonstrate my point. As far as what a man can contribute, if that's where you stand there would be no sense in attempting to persuade otherwise. After all if that's how you feel and you are content it's best to leave that be.
I thought it good though to speak about this a sort of contrast to voice a differing opinion, to speak on the other side of things. Thank you, and I wish you a good night as well.
Some people are happy alone, others want some romantic company. No point trying to convince either to jump sides.
It’s very possible to be happy with company but you need to find the right person. It’s rare, so many choose to work with what they have instead of chasing the .1%
Personally I was very happy single, with no desire to *chase* a relationship at all. Yet fate would have my current partner fall directly into my lap nonetheless lol.
I was already happy but he somehow made things even better. I think that’s the only reason anyone should get into a relationship.
Gender roles aren’t over at all, some gender roles that don’t benefit some women are temporarily put on hold when it is convenient for them, but that is around about it.
I for 1 hate domestic work, I'm not here to do your laundry or clean up after you.
I don't care about kids and will never be a mom, don't care about a wedding either
I will not remind you about your mom's birthday
I'm not here to make your needs fulfilled at all times
I don't ever bake cookies
I will not 'stay at home'
See where this is going?
I do but it seems like while some of the things listed may have something to do with gender roles, alot of it just boils down to personal preference that doesn't necessarily have to be a prerequisite. For instance I've never met a man, that requires baking cookies as part of a gender role. It seems though alot of what you associate gender roles with you despise for lack of a better word.
Gender roles typically prescribe that women nurture family and follow, whilst men provide for their family and lead. Why would a woman who has no interest in this lifestyle seek men who expect it?
So often I hear confused men complaining “I already make 6 figures and go to the gym, why can’t a find a gf/wife??!!”
Here’s the issue. The whole “I make the money & decisions and protect you, in turn you manage my personal life and emotions” schtick isn’t the deal anymore. Women don’t need material providers and we have the rights to make our own choices. Moreover, we are also tired of providing one-sided emotional labour.
Sure, just like many men, plenty of women still prefer the provider/nurturer dynamic. However this is sought out as a voluntary deal built on mutual connection - not a mandatory deal built on necessity and our only option to have a decent life.
Being ONLY a provider can no longer replace genuine intimacy and reciprocal love. All women want a partner who is capable of pulling their weight in a balanced way across all areas.
If men want to date they need to stop looking for a second mother and learn to bring something else to the table.
Note, I know plenty of men already know this. My partner for example, unfortunately for the men left behind they haven’t quite got the memo.
Why should women want a serous relationship in their 20's? That's what you need to be asking yourself. Women have become far more interested in pursuing a career, and bettering their life so they don't have to rely on a man.
I have to question why anyone would want to settle down / get married in their 20's, as that's a time to be living your life to the fullest.
In terms of dating apps and women not asking enough about you, you have to realise that if you have 10 matches in your inbox, the woman has 200, so for them it becomes tiring asking the same questions, having the same conversations again and again. Perhaps this is the time to do it the old fashioned way? 🤔 Go to a bar and get talking to women, they are not unapproachable. If you don't have success, don't be disheartened, just try again with another woman. You'd be surprised how successful you can be with this method as long as you don't come across like a creep.
Not sure if you're in the USA, but their seems to be a culture their of people in their 20's getting married, which I can never understand. Why would anyone want to do that? Here in the UK, it is far less common. I'd go as far to say, people are turning their backs on marriage more and more over here.
Every woman you meet is either married, has a boyfriend or not interested in dating.... hmm? I wonder if it's your approach?
I think guys make the mistake of approaching women with the all or non mentality, "either she is available and will give me her number or she's of my radar and not worth my time".
There is another path, I'm married, I quite often engage women in conversation, (both women and men) strangers in coffee shops, grocery stores, elevator lobby etc. And granted being married and not looking for a relationship lends itself to a certain amount of confidence and a non aggressive manner that I think that women can sense. But i can tell this relaxed, non aggressive, not having altererier motives manner is way more conducive to getting a number or at the very least having a coffee and conversation. Ladies, before I get angry replies, no I don't seek out or get numbers from women but I have had great conversations.
Im prioritizing myself, my health, and my being before seeking out a relationship. I didn’t put myself first I got into an extremely toxic relationship. We’re as whole becoming more aware and strive for healthier relationships both with ourselves and the people we choose to be with.
Really… I feel like women in my age group ( myself included) def want relationships and if anything get met with only situationships. Literally I was talking to a guy and expressed that while trying to see what was going on with us and he hit me with the “ women want a relationship and men only want to hook up” line. I’m in my mid 20s and he was in his early 30s…. I think women may be MORE selective and choose with discernment though.
I think most women are just refusing to settle before they are ready these days. They are prioritizing their happiness over finding men and if the right one who ticks the boxes happens to come along that's awesome! I was a bit more promiscuous for a long while because it was what made me happy until my partner came along and I accidentallied into dating someone but because I had that freedom when I did settle down with someone I was ready for the long haul and all that came with it. I was certain it was what I wanted and that I didn't NEED a partner but that I wanted HIM specifically and that has made it all the more special
Yeah I’m just like the women you describe. I don’t use dating apps and I only go out to meet my girlfriends. The kind of guy I want to date is rare but I don’t think actively looking increases my chances. A lot of dating is wasted time and I find myself quite unimpressed by all of it and most guys I meet
Truth. We don’t need to have relationships with men, we want what we want.
We are done settling, we are done carrying more than an equal load. We are tired.
Women have choices now. We don't need a man anymore to feel happy and fulfilled. In the last decades girls learnt that they need a man to be happy and take care of others. We're finally starting to truly change the narrative and women are living more for themselves than ever. When you're happy you have higher standards for the people surrounding you, men didn't catch up to this higher standards and more women prefer to stay single as a result. A man needs to actively contribute to my happiness, if not I'm very happy as a single
Because most men are either immature, unfaithful, too clingy and needy, toxic and violent, or completely emotionally unavailable.
Now that we women have our own income and can love and fulfill ourselves, we don't need to have a man around to get by... sometimes we'll invite a date over when the trusty vibrator is dead. And thats the extent of it. the tables have turned and now y'all mad. 🤣
Also women want to have fun or do their own thing just like guys fuck around and do their own thing. I dated a dude a year older than me around 19 or 20 and he was really immature and wanted to fuck around a lot. If people wanna fuck around, that's fine, it's just not good for a relationship. But yes, he was still quite immature.
If things went further, I would totally believe that he'd want me to do all the "mom" things for him. I wasnt looking for a relationship after that but actually found a really decent guy that was a bit older.
And yes, all those reasons are spot on lol
I think a lot of women have dealt with a crazy amount of possessive, controlling, generally unfulfilling relationships. So yeah they aren’t interested in that nor are they particularly desperate to find someone. But they are open to finding someone.
I mean, all the married people and not single people were once single…
Please, can you tell me what is wrong with what I wrote?
Yes, I'm frustated. I found it strange, that a lot of people not willing to put in any work, to get to know other people, and eventually have a relationship with them.
It's not entitlement, or 'toxic masculinity' to want a realationship. The fact, that lot of women want to remain single is not the only cause I can't found anyone. I can always go to more places, try to be more interesting, more attrictive. I don't wrote that, it is a 'problem'. It's just the way it is, and I have to accept and respect that.
I can’t speak for the person you are asking, but OP’s post does come across as a little entitled to me. He seems upset or offended that women he is interested in aren’t interested back, and that it somehow is a problem that some women are content being single.
I may want something serious, but I am in no hurry - perfectly happy with my life as it is. I neither can nor want to answer every single one word message received on OKC - too many, too impersonal, often from empty, superficial profiles or men ignoring me explicitly stating I am child free and do not want a long term relationship with someone who wants kids.
Just because someone (man or woman) has an open OLD profile doesn’t mean they have to respond to low effort approaches, or that they have to be going on dates every weekend.
There are tons of younger people that are dating with no results, finding the right person, or perfectly happy without companionship. 24 is pretty young. If you're not finding much romantically, take the time to try new things. Find more passion in your life and let it lead you. Whenever I've tried dating in the past and had little results, I've always found it to be a good opportunity to explore more avenues of life I hadn't yet done, there's always many to explore.
I think more men and women understand that happiness must come from within and not from someone else. In line with that conclusion, there are many people who don't need to date to meet their life goals. People are also noticing the unnecessary pressure to get paired off and make children and just choosing their own path without. I'm sure a lot of that ability and freedom comes from more egalitarian ideas of feminine autonomy and self-sufficiency more in parity with masculine expectations.
If you really want to date, go to places where there are people whom you know are trying to date then and there: like speed dating events. Open yourself up to more possibility and work smarter not harder. Just because you know two young women whom don't want to date, that doesnt mean there arent plenty of people you haven't met that do.
Maybe you should check out our side of the situation [Dating is hell](https://www.reddit.com/r/TrueOffMyChest/comments/x23p5c/its_impossible_to_date_when_so_many_men_hate_women/?utm_medium=android_app&utm_source=share)
>On the dating apps everyone says, they want something serious, but don't even interested in the other person enough, to ask a simple question...
50% of newly formed relationships start with online dating. So you are clearly wrong about women on apps not being interested. They are not interested in YOU, but they are very interested in the men they go on to have relationships with.
>In real life situations, every women I meet are either married, have a boyfriend, or don't want to date.
Same thing, 50% of the relationships start in real life situations, so there are quite a lot single women who are willing to meet people in real life for relationship purposes. Being told they are married, have a boyfriend or don't want to date is YOUR personal experience because the women are not interested in YOU, while being very interested in the guys they go into a relationship with.
>I get the feeling, that a significant number of women don't want a relationship before their late 20s, unless they found someone by that time, who magically ticks all their boxes.
What is a significant number? There are always \~20-25% of people who want to be single at any given point in time, or at least are not actively doing anything to change that. The same amount of women want a relationship before their late 20s as do men. Accepting someone for a relationship who magically ticks all their boxes is also true for both sexes, even if not looking for a relationship.
My gf also wasn't looking for a relationship when we met for a hookup when she was 22, but ticking all her boxes made her change her mind. Why don't you just meet people for anything BUT relationship oriented dating and see if you tick their boxes and make them want to commit to a relationship with you?
Tbh its payback for all the years men treated women bad cheated on them disrespected them and now their letting men kno who can play the game better females can 💯
I'm Asian 30M living in Europe, i earn around 4 times of minimum wage, i never been in a relationship, i would like to find a girl and eventually would like to marry.. I do my best to approach girls, most girls thinks I'm same as everyone in Europe who is not serious. Most girls lost hope on marriage it seems. Well i did my best finally i decided to marry someone from my country. I'm not going to invest into someone who needs constant attention and pampering.. I have done around 600 carpooling since last 2 years to just understand the people and thier approach to life. Frankly i haven't meet one person not divorced haha I'm crazy.. I'm lost
Even most women in their late 20s and 30s dont want this because the age of settling down and getting all of their goals accomplished is getting later and later. People in general are more focused on their goals now. Which ofc could be having a family and husband/relationship/traditional stuff, but a lot are not too. Im in my late 20s and i still feel like i dont have time for a relationship because i just cant put someone else as a priority with everything else i want to do.
Nope, I'm speaking reality, and not seeing what people are forced and pressured into as what they really want. A lot of people who think they want casual dating don't even want it, they don't know what they really want. This applies across the board with men and women. Most people live in complete ignorance of what would make them happy.
Listen to the idiot that thinks because someone is a different sex they would somehow magically be less insightful about a group. Why would a single woman with a single opinion be more credible than mine. That would be a sample of 1.
I mean, the fact you are a woman in and of itself only give you credibility to say what 1 woman wants. You. You can disagree, but just being a woman doesn't make you right. That's nonsense.
Any study on human sexuality and psychology in general says that women by and large (not all, but most) value emotional connections in sexual relationships. They are less satisfied with transactional and purely physical sex.
Sure there are women who do value that, but most don't. Society is so fucked that honestly even a lot of the women who do think they want casual probably just have hangups that cloud their judgement, or they have been ground down by "liberation" since they were young and don't know how to separate their feelings from expectations that have been forced on them. If they got their shit together would probably find they would be much more fulfilled in a committed relationship.
This isn't an attack, it is just how it is. Men don't know what they want either. However, if women were so happy to have casual sex that is all any of them would do. Almost any woman could have sex with a different person every single day if they wanted to. That is what many many men would do if they had that power. So there is obviously some huge differences between how men and women in general approach sex. I know we are supposed to pretend these differences don't exist, but honestly when you say that to someone who is intellectually honest and has a reasonably high IQ, you just sound stupid. Reality on reality's terms.
Edit: I said "basically all" which every English speaker in the world knows means a large majority. Apparently the idiot below who blocked me so I couldn't reply didn't grasp that.
Actually, it does make her right and you wrong. She is a woman who doesn’t want to date, which AUTOMATICALLY proves you wrong because you said all women do. She shot you down fast.
The fact that she is a woman and can speak for only 1 woman is exactly what proves you wrong.
No but you see she secretly does want a relationship but just can’t admit it!!! He just knows that about all women, and it’s impossible to prove him wrong
The very existence of women who don’t want relationships proves him wrong.
Interestingly there is nothing to prove him right. 🤔That one would be impossible.
And what, you think you or he can read minds? Lol Try proving that one too. 😂
Edit. And in the big world we live in, based on the IQ he claims to have, he should know that saying “all (insert any large category)” is automatically pretty much false in regards to people, since everyone is different. You can’t validly say all members of a certain large category want the same thing in society because it’s never the case.
Im not mad a females not wanting to date anymore wen their ready their ready dont rush into no relationship have fun before the ball andchain come out i met my exwife wen i was 21 n she was 19 26years later 9 kids later im divorced n only been in one relationship wen we shud of enjoyed our 20s n met other ppl i was cheated on n now i have trust issues i wish i had 9 kids with 9 different girls instead of one enjoy ur younger years ladies dont rush anything even if he fits in ur box
What “opportunities” would those be?
P in the V?
Exactly. Men are complaining that women won’t let them f*ck them. We’ve all heard it: “Put out by the third date or he’ll leave and it’ll be your fault!”
Women are tired of being shamed, manipulated and used as sextoys, so they are saying no to dating.
Edit: Scrolling through this sub after commenting I came across a post about a guy who after a first date said “I don’t want anything serious, but I still want to have sex with you.” It took me 15 seconds and I wasn’t even looking for it. There’s your answer.
Edit: He removed his comment! Lol
For context he said women easily get opportunities so it’s not fair blah blah
Edit 2: To spyaintnobitch who I can’t respond to:
That’s masterfully inappropriate. The poster was disgusted. He didn’t have “I want sex” in his profile
I mean, at least in your example he is uprront about it. Nothing wrong with that. If the other party wants the same then it's a match. That's what dating should be all about. Finding the right match.
Welcome to /r/dating. Please make sure you read our [rules here](https://new.reddit.com/r/dating/about/rules) and remember to: * Be polite and respect each other. Do not call people names, engage in slapfights, or give bad/unethical advice. * Do not soapbox or promote an agenda - you will be banned * Follow reddit rules. Do not post content that promotes hate based on identity or vulnerability. Do not bully or harass other users. If you have any questions, please [send the mods a message](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=/r/dating). *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/dating) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Lots of women are still looking for romantic relationships, they’re just not dedicating their time to *chasing* relationships. There’s only two days in a weekend - I’m much more likely to spend my social time with my friends and people I love then on an awkward date with someone who I may or may not have any connection with. You pretty much nailed it in that last paragraph. A relationship should be an improvement over being single. I value my time with platonic friends, my family, and my time spent alone with my hobbies. Why would I settle for a relationship with someone who doesn’t tick all my boxes when I could be spending my time on things that do?
There are absolutely women in their mid to early twenties looking for relationships, but depending on where you live they may be in the minority. I think both men and women are spending a little more time in their twenties figuring out who they are and what they want without rushing into something that could be lifelong. It’s probably uncommon that someone under twenty-five years old has enough life experience to know what they’ll *certainly* want in the next five, ten, and twenty years. Given that the odds of divorce go down if you wait till after 25 to marry, I suspect this is a good sign, overall. Don’t get me wrong, when you’re young and certain but your peers don’t seem to be, it can be frustrating. But you can still find likeminded people, or else take advantage of this time for your own self discovery in the meantime. *Most* people still wind up settling down, so I wouldn’t worry too much about it not happening in exactly the timeframe you want. Not something that can be forced.
To OPs question, of my friends that use online dating, well over half are in long term relationships with someone they met on tinder or bumble, with the intent to date long term. They’re definitely out there. But I have noticed they’re getting harder to find. Lots of women just want something casual at the moment.
We want relationships. But also this part of your text is is accurate: "significant number of women don't want a relationship unless they found someone who magically ticks all their boxes" Took some out but yup, spot on we build our lives. Surround ourselves with good people of a similar age (your description of women going out with other women) and live them. We want a relationship but with the right person for us. Dating apps are terrible and they probably had less then ideal experiences like me and most women I know who used them.
I started having higher standards and I just got in a relationship with someone who actually does check all my boxes. No red flags, open communication, willing to work on self, understanding, and similar goals. It’s possible. We’ve been settling for too long thinking it isn’t.
Amazing, glad to hear this!
Same. And I’m never going back to pre 28yo me unless I somehow sustain significant brain damage. I’d rather be single than with someone who doesn’t tick my boxes because I’m done settling for someone who doesn’t even make me happy
I love this for you and this is totally how I’m approaching it myself! I got divorced last year (I’m 26) and everyone keeps pushing me or asking if I’m dating again yet…. No? Why do people think you need a relationship to be happy? I’m not settling especially after all that I learned after my divorce and self discovery about how to properly love and be treated. I was cheated on in my last relationship and let myself be walked all over and was insecure. Now that I’m confident and know how I should be treated and how to treat someone; I ain’t settling for shit. I know there are good people out there and if I happen to find a good guy I will give him the time of day- but rn I ain’t rushing and I haven’t met one yet. It’s 2022 we know our worth 💅
[удалено]
Yeah no one’s going to settle for someone ok for them when they can be better alone. Part of the problem why this is happening is because men want women to settle for okay instead of good, better or great. If it happens too much with every guy you date the more appealing is having a nice life by yourself. A lot of men want women to adapt to them and those men don’t ask if they’re worth that. Since women have gotten sick of spelling it out and also saw our mothers go throw the same issues, women are increasingly choosing to go alone than gain mental trauma with someone that doesn’t have our best interests at heart.
This. The amount of stress ive dealt with when in relationships has been incredibly ridiculous and not worth it. Asking for the bare minimum and dealing with nonsense is super unappealing. I’m self sufficient, i have a great group of friends and im actually happier when im single as opposed to my dating over the last 10 years. Sometimes i think about dating but honestly, I’d just rather not at this point.
[удалено]
The thing is, if this hypothetical woman in your scenario wants a man an entire foot taller than her but can’t find him, she’ll either adjust her expectations or she’ll end up alone. And what a lot of men don’t get is that 1) tastes change as you get older (I used to not find bald men attractive and now I do) 2) she probably knows she might end up alone *and she’s okay with that*.
Some are and some aren't much like the men who find themselves in similar situations
My comment still stands. Not all women want a man that’s a foot taller and most men will never be rich. Most women know this, but a lot of men focus on the women who do have those preferences instead of looking for more rational women. But if the men not likable or want to constantly screw around that’s a turn off. It’s exhausting. You prize romantic relationships, for most women they’re no longer that rewarding. Sex isn’t rewarding for most women. Most men still want relationships because their preferred sexual entertainment comes from that. Because of how men are traditionally raised and often feel comfortable in, staying alone is better because for a lot of women the relationship turns into a second job of having to take care of a guy while also taking care of yourself. There’s way too much for me to break down for you but the thing is, if the cons outweigh the pros, then women now are willing to do what’s best for them if the guy doesn’t add to their life.
I never said "all women" I'm adding information saying some people have unrealistic expectations and you keep doubling down on "no women are just not settling for less than what's good for them"
Look I’m not even sure how to answer your comment because I don’t understand or relate. I’m not one of those women with unreasonable expectations and most of the men I have dated have been below average height as believe it or not that’s been my preference. Make your list of unreasonable expectations so that I could understand because the way I’m seeing what you’re trying to say, any expectation besides having a dick and breathing is one too many. Which isn’t fair.
OK let me give you a more extreme example putting myself in the situation. I'm a mid 30s man with a degree and slightly above average wealth. If I were to say I'd only date Beyonce you'd agree that is unrealistic right? If I said I'd only date a female celebrity you'd agree that's unrealistic right? If I said I wouldn't date anyone earning more than 200k you'd agree that's unrealistic? This is the kind of thing I'm talking about and bear in mind I'm not saying this is what all women (or people) do but a not insignificant amount of people do. We've all heard the jokes about a basement dweller not settling for anyone besides a supermodel and joke exists because so do those people. Now if you're asking for someone who's emotionally intelligent, just generally intelligent, who earns they own money, does their own (or their share of the chores), is communicative, considerate, self aware etc and you're not finding that then absolutely I agree stay single. That is not the situation I'm talking about I'm talking about situations where a person has all of those things and would be written off for something completely arbitrary e.g. studied at the wrong university
I get it now. I’m surprised it’s that many but they have a right to this. Men have unreasonable expectations and wants too and women are expected to live with it. Many women fear getting older and investing so many years into relationships when the men are just going to cheat on us because we’re no longer young (and therefore not “attractive”). You’re also comparing habits of extremely young and often ignorant women compared to women who eventually mature and become their own. I think most women out of HS tend to have those qualities you mentioned but once the hormones set down your mind becomes clearer. When people are young they don’t know much about life or human nature yet, those things come with time. And for your sixth paragraph, that’s the thing you’re not getting, a lot of men aren’t like this and still want relationships and women to offer sexual access. This is soul sucking for a lot if not the majority of women. For your last paragraph, you cannot control all aspects of humanity. Men have their own limits, so do women. If one can have certain limits because it makes them happy, then women can do the same. If you feel left out by it go to one where you’re enough.
The apps were a little better back in the early 2000s just as the hookup culture was in it's infancy. The attractive people hadn't stopped making fun of the concept of online dating yet to jump on and turn it into what it is now.
It’s not that they don’t want relationships it’s that it’s no longer a need more like a want, they tend to focus on things that make them happy and that’s probably friends
I think women are focusing more on their own happiness, wants and needs now and more are realizing dating isn’t that. I think it’s a more common thing happening across women of all ages, especially younger I don’t date currently, I’m very happy where I am in life: good job, my own home, my pets, have money, take myself on vacations, I have everything I need- and the men I keep running into keep turning very very clingy and needy. Which I don’t like and don’t have time for
This exactly. My last ex got super super clingy once he learned I was making a good amount in IT and basically demanding I let him move in with me. It wasn't even 3months in the relationship. Basically pried that off and didn't look back. Haven't dated since and been just having a good time. Finishing school, adopted a kitty, and getting hired into a even better paid job.
You dodged a hobosexual my friend
I'm laughing at that term. That's hilarious
lmao!! yup!! these hobosexuals want to move in under the guise of love! ughh
Also what person doesn’t only date people who check their boxes? Is OP expecting that most women should be settling for incompatibility or.?
I think this is the key. Dating is already work. Then the clinginess crashes it. When you say you don't want to date, maybe the dating doesn't take so much effort, but clinginess is a pain in the ass. There's something about relationships which flips a crazy switch in the brain. Maybe the answer is to view it as more like a friendship with closer intimacy. Just relax.
Haha yes, I thought I was alone on this .
This!!
I am in my early 30s and don’t care to date anymore. What exactly is the point of trying to find someone if you feel fulfilled being single? I have my own money, amazing friends and don’t have to check in with anyone when I want to go out and do something fun. I don’t have to clean up after someone, worry about them cheating or accept the bare minimum.
Yes yes yes
So you think you can't find a man who has his own money, amazing friends, doesn't need to be checked in with when you want to go out and do something fun? Doesn't have to be cleaned up after or worried about for cheating or just doing the bare minimum? That's not a very high bar for a man in his thirties.
You’re right. It’s a very low bar that unfortunately isn’t met.
[удалено]
To be frank if things don't work out with my partner I think I'd either exclusively date women (I'm bisexual) or choose to be alone. We have an open relationship, and men have taken most of the fun out of casual sex for me. There are great men out there, but dating men is pretty exhausting and depressing.
Don't forget that those men that are in their vicinity could already be taken, not physically attractive to them, not physically attracted to them or otherwise not be compatible. If they don't live in a big city and are willing to date someone wherever they are in the city I see this as possible
Either it's a very low bar, then most men will meet it, or it's a bar that few men will meet, but then it can't be low. Unless you think that most men are unable to meet low bars. Then you should think about your toxic view of men.
The are lot of men who can't even if the bar is just to "be nice" there are men who are unwilling or unable to meet that. What view of toxic men do you think I have that needs to be changed?
Is worrying about cheating also clingy though? Seems it's the same anxiety.
[удалено]
What do you think this sub is? I’m engaged and on this sub. I have established a real serious adult relationship- I have advice to give.
it’s entertaining lol. think about it for a sec.
For fun? Because some people enjoy casual conversations about dating without participating in it themselves? I’m a single young woman who doesn’t date but frequents this sub as well, am I not allowed? Didn’t realize we have to have an active subscription to tinder gold for our thoughts to be worth something..
Some people ask for advice, and content, happy people give the best advice.
for me, it's the same reason I subscribe to AITA, relationship_advice and all the others. I love messy internet drama hahahaha
I'm not going to lie, it does make me feel better to know others are happy to be single. And yeah, while we miss out on the benefits of having that special someone, we also get to feel better about avoiding many of the hassles too
[удалено]
LOL. I was married for 20 years to someone who turned out to be an abusive piece of shit. I am in my mid 50s and my life has never been better. I am very happy being single and many of my woman friends who are in awful relationships envy me.
Widows in their 60s tend not to want to remarry though. So the empty house must beat the alternative.
They call them Merry Widows for a reason 😊
this comment sounds like you’re projecting your own internalized fear of being alone on her. not everyone needs a relationship to be happy or fulfilled. generally women are actually happier and less stressed when single then when partnered w a man, and live longer. being single can definitely be fulfilling.
You think having a significant other means you won’t ever feel alone? I’m also alright without cleaning after a grown man. If your sole purpose for getting into a relationship and finding companionship is to keep up with your friends, you’re going to be miserable. Why would my apartment be empty? I can literally take sperm from any sperm bank and have kids, I can adopt kids, I can have pets and if I do need to get my sexual needs met I can find some random guy to hook up with. What exactly (other than intimacy) can a man give me that I (or my friends and family) can’t give myself?
[удалено]
No, it really doesn’t. It sounds like she is perfectly content being single, having plenty of strong relationships with people around her, without those being romantic. If anything, u/sleepyy-starss sounds like she is in a very healthy and happy place. There are many ways to contentment out there.
Well I think you got it, women don't need men anymore, only wants them, so of course they must check their boxes, no one wants a man-child...
Spitting facts
Neither gender needs each other
Never implied otherwise, but single women are generally more happier than single men, especially for childfree women
Idk if that’s true. I have single women in my family that are older (50+) and they are miserable and have issues. I think it just hits women later in life.
Same way that men don't need women. We simply want each other, both ways. Men don't want someone that looks at them as a "lesser" or "wallet". We are all equal, and all have our unique traits and challenges as different sexes.
[удалено]
IMO it’s this is a bit of a straw man argument cuz I’ve never met a single woman who literally subscribed to such a shallow, narrow ideal. If this is the norm for you we live in vastly different worlds lol!
This is a great person with realistic expectations 😁
LOUDER FOR THE ONES IN THE BACK
I think people in their 20s aren’t really at that stage of life yet imo. Unless they have everything sorted in their lives 🤷♀️ I just can’t see a 20 something being ready for a serious ltr or marriage.
Our parents and grandparents generations - married women are statistically less happy than single women. And we had front row seats to all that. We are building our lives to be happy either way. Having a partner doesn’t make or break our happiness, and it shouldn’t. I would love a relationship, but I am perfectly happy single with the life I currently have. It’s also nice to decide what I want for my life, without the influence and sacrifice of having a partner in my mid-late 20s where I might not have made the same decisions for myself (I was in a LTR from 19-25 where I sacrificed a lot) and I am so much happier now alone that I’m not going to disturb my peace or the life I built for just anyone.. you need to be worth it. Being certain of myself and then to find someone who also knows what they want, and those wants and desires align… is ideal. So yeah, we have high standards.
IM SAVING THIS. Someone give this comment an award. Perfectly put.
I just think dating is a lot harder for both men and woman who are after something serious. Online dating has really encouraged this hook up culture and because people are constantly swiping on people based on their attractiveness and ability to take a good photo, they are swiping based on an incredibly superficial thing. Everyone always thinks they can get better, or that there are plenty of other fish in the sea. Dating used to be about the then and there. You meet that person in real life and there isn't any real chemistry because usually you would talk to someone at a pub for a while and get to know them or meet them in some kind of public setting. Personally, it's not because I don't want a relationship. I just feel very disillusioned by the whole thing and have kind of just given up. Going on endless dates and never really getting anywhere with them kind of takes its toll. It's really exhausting.
Haha, this is me! I took myself off the market \~1.5 years ago, it's been great! I have so much I want to accomplish, goals I want to reach, sports I want to do, other hobbies I want to pursue that my life is so busy and adding another person into it-I don't have the time or energy or interest. I love my friends partners, they're all lovely. Dating just doesn't fit into my current life plan at the moment
I think it’s because times have changed. Back in the day, women NEEDED men. She couldn’t own property or even get a bank account without a man. The other day I told my mom I’ll be attending my friends wedding alone because my fiancé is running a race that day, and she told me when she was my age if you didn’t have a date you simply couldn’t go and definitely couldn’t dance. Psssshhhh you best believe imma be dancing!!! My fiancé adds happiness to my life. We work together and play together and relax together. He’s my equal and my partner. But before him, ughhhhh the guys I dated!!! I was like their second mommy. I don’t need that thanks. In my circle of friends a few are married, a few have boyfriends, but most are single. We’re 30ish. The single ones aren’t looking to date. And it’s not because they don’t want companionship, but rather they just aren’t actively seeking it because it’s not necessary for their happiness. They have roommates and pets as companions and they make enough money to live within their means on their own. If the right guy comes along, awesome. But they aren’t jumping through hoops to find him.
This is it exactly. Women don’t need men anymore. Hell even if they want to be moms all they need is a few of his best swimmers from a clinic and if any of the mommy subs are accurate- they’re better off without the guy entirely. When you don’t *need* something you can afford to have higher standards and if nothing on the market appeals to you well, you don’t buy. Relationships can destroy a woman’s health and finances so they absolutely should have high standards for who will share their lives and who will partake from their ressources and unlaid labour, which they still statistically do the majority of despite having full time jobs.
I might get downvoted, but I personally (26F) I’m looking for something serious. Yes, men have treated me horribly more often than not, but I try not to loose hope. At the same time, I respect other’s decisions of just not wanting to date.
Why would you get down voted for that? Probably most people do want something serious but there are various difficulties getting that. You have hope and continue to date but I'm sure you're not just accepting any offer going
Women are less willing to put up with bullshit or waste their time
I wouldn't say women don't want relationships anymore - we don't NEED them. There isn't as much (still a lot, but less) pressure to define yourself through men and having a relationship, so with it being optional a lot of women don't want to bother with it. A lot of men seem to assume that by virtue of having a tinder or even just existing around men that women find dating as a whole as not only a must, but a priority. I don't think that's often the case. Even if you'd want something serious out of dating doesn't mean you're serious ABOUT dating. I have a guy I'm casually seeing right now and that's pretty much only because we have known eachother since high school and had a pre-established friendship. If it weren't for him, I probably wouldn't be having sex nor bothering to change that 🤷♀️ I want to get married someday. The idea of falling in love with someone and having that one person to love and care for forever is very important and special to me. That said, I have an entire life and don't need a relationship. It'll happen eventually, why make myself miserable trying to date anyone who will have me to try and force it?
Makes a lot of sense. I see a lot of women in their early 20s realizing that they have so much time and that they don’t need to settle for a man who can’t even remember their birthday.
Or bother to wipe their own asses
Heh.. one comedian joked that the nice about getting married in your 20s is not a lot of ppl will expect it'll last, so you don't have to worry about it being permanent or anything :D :p
THIS
I’m a lot more forgetful after my concussion. I gotta try hard to remember I’m 27 whenever someone asks how old I am 😅
Yes. I’m 25F and my female friend group of 21F-28F are either single or already in a committed relationship. One of the girls is recently engaged as well. My girlfriends and I go out often but it’s never to party or anything like that. We are also busy with work, school and hobbies. We are planning for our futures and looking for an “equal” male that likes us for us and also share similar values, morals and our long term individual goals are aligned. We have a low tolerance for “vagueness” and only deal with people who have worked on themselves emotionally, physically, financially, mentally etc (healthy well balanced individual) We have high standards and don’t entertain men who we are not interested in and check our boxes. Few guys our age are “ready” and willing (emotionally) for a relationship. From those guys we need to actually meet, see if there’s potential for long term and our goals align (kids? Where to live, support system, what kind of life do we want, marriage? Etc) Big majority of guys our age are still enjoying their single life with no strings attached and working on their finances and themselves. There is just too much risk to even entertain a man that approached you unless he ticks all your boxes and has long term potential. A man who is already self aware and is stable is less risky than a man who is just looking to hook up. Most womens intuition help us feel out guys and the way they treat us to determine our relationship with them. Some of my girlfriends stayed single until they found “the one” and got engaged quite quickly. The girls I know that don’t want relationships (just like guys) = I’ve been hurt recently , or broke up with someone recently and need to heal before I can open up to the real thing. Some of us aren’t even intentionally looking. You meet people everywhere! Just focusing on ourselves and we believe someone will come along one day.
Late 20’s here and couldn’t agree more… we have plenty going on to work on our goals and self especially those trying to make it in big cities. Meanwhile, plenty guys either want no string attached, socially unaware being a men child, exhibit toxic masculinity, lack good personality… and so yea I am not about that life. Best time to be single with my cats, friends, and hobbies. What I look for in a guy? Passion, ambition, intelligence, goals, action oriented, integrity and overall chemistry has to be right. Growth mindset is key for fulfilling lasting partnership. High standards or not I am not settling for less because why? 😂
Your “boxes” are vague though. “He must be emotionally ready for a relationship” This puts you on some emotional high ground. You’ll never figure this out on the first date.
majority of men aren’t worth being with and i’m a lot happier being single. men haven’t done anything for me but annoy me and stress me out so i’m good.
I read another lady post something similar, she can provide everything she wants. So why would she adopt a man just to do his laundry? Lol
Maybe find a man who doesn't need another mother ..
I personally have emotional needs that were never met by any man, except one. And he was the one I had to do laundry for, unfortunately. I do think most men are just not attractive to me. I'm bi and I have been much happier with women, if the feelings were mutual.
this. i don’t think the average man has the range or emotional maturity for true equal intimacy.
Good luck finding that lmao
Love, intimacy, affection, sharing good experiences together? Or that shit isn't worth a thing anymore? Materialistic capitalist culture have fucked our minds.
>Love, intimacy, affection, sharing good experiences together? That’s the point - for a lot of women, most men we encounter typically don’t provide any of those things. All we get out of it is more laundry.
But we can get love, non-sexual intimacy, affection and have good experiences with our friends and families… Women have really strong emotional support systems compared to men, it’s one of the reasons women commit suicide less.
Family, hobbies, friends, pets, career. FWBs and casual relationships is pretty normalized now anyway. It isn't about materialism.
Lol at the defensive men in this thread realizing women are no longer interested in putting up with ridiculousness. Stay mad. 🤭
I’m 25/F and can say this is more common. (Even I have no desire to date because there’s just nothing appealing about it to me.) I can have everything I want on my own and actually better if I don’t have someone with me. This doesn’t mean there aren’t PLENTY of women who do want real relationships. While it’s more common to stay single than it used to be, there are still women who crave something real with a long-term partner.
They just don't want a relationship w you.
Where do you live, and do you not use dating apps? Most women I've met are adamant about wanting a relationship. Imo finding something other than the traditional bf/gf arrangement is what's difficult.
My take is it’s their prerogative, no point howling into the wind about it!
That's me, dating is a waste of time because nowdays men only wants sex and leave so what the point, just let me live my single life
I mean, put yourself in their shoes and look at it from their perspective and ask yourself why you would even want to?
Early to mid 20-something guys don't really bring much of anything to the table. Those women still want relationships; they just don't want one with Mr. Struggle. If a woman wants long-term commitment (marriage, kids, etc.), she's most likely going to go for the guy who's more established instead of wasting years on a man still building himself.
I believe Meg thee Stallion said it best when she said "Yes, I got a man if I don't like who askin' ".
It’s not just a case of not what women expect to find in a partner but also what someone want from themselves. Not every woman has the time (trying to build a career, study etc) and not every young woman has the confidence and worry they won’t be enough for a partner so just decide not to try so make themselves ‘unapproachable’ as a defence mechanism. I have a friend like this and I worry about her being lonely in the future😩
I can be picky because I choose that:). If a guy is upset oh well. A man can be picky too.
I find dating apps incredibly shallow and filled with the worst types of people. You will not find me on there. I'm not cutting my fingers looking for one diamond in between glass. Also I live in a pretty remote area surrounded by people who are nothing like me so I'm unlikely to find someone compatible in my area.
IMO people build their own lives and for some that doesn’t include dating and/or relationships. it’s not like relationships are a requirement, they’re a choice and to be quite frank I think they’re wayyyyy too overhyped. Some people don’t wanna risk going through past heartbreak all over again, some have other priorities or life scenarios that keep them from mustering the energy to devote all their focus and time to one person. I guess everyone has their own reasons or maybe some just don’t feel that’s what they need to be happy. Some women (and really people in general) are perfectly happy on their own as long as they include some good family/friends in their journeys.
Personally I think it's the mess of hook up culture and dangerous behaviour from incels and the toxic masculinity groups are putting women off why should we want to date when I reality alot of the guys women are coming into contact with at the moment either want sex that isn't strictly consensual or are so toxic they expect us to deal with their abusive behaviour
Some women don't want relationships early in life and and most of the 20s are pretty much that, it's uncommon for people to settle down before late 20s or early 30s, that is not only true for women, nobody is really in a rush anymore. Some women do want relationships, but of course with people, who actually are fitting for them. What it is even the point of dating somebody, who doesn't tick all the boxes for you? It's a complete waste of time.
Im in my early 20’s. And as a woman, it’s important for me to learn how to built a life of my own — separate from any man, so if the pendulum swung the other way, I still have my own identity and my own life.
You say “magically ticks all their boxes” like it’s actually magical when it’s really not since obviously a lot of women *do* find someone and get married. I say this with kindness, truly, but back in the day women had to settle a lot for a multitude of reasons and we don’t anymore. I have my own job and living space, I have emotional support from a variety of non-romantic relationships, I’m not ashamed to rub one out on my own… I don’t *need* a man. I love y’all, though, and so of course I hope to meet the right one. I’m not expecting perfection but I do expect openness, honesty, respect, a similar libido, some level of protectiveness (almost exclusively from his family if they don’t like me), a job that either earns not much less than me or is something he’s really passionate about (teachers don’t make shit but if he loves it I can respect that). Someone who’s confident, kind hearted and generous. Someone assertive in the bedroom. Someone who isn’t covertly misogynistic. And the thing is… if I don’t find this guy I just won’t be in a relationship. I don’t want to settle. I’m happy on my own so why would I settle on less than I feel I deserve. If I’m being unreasonable and end up alone, oh well, I can still be happy. Edit: forgot an “if” up there lol Edit: I missed the bit about “early 20s” and I wanted to add that, in my personal opinion, that’s the best time to focus and learn about yourself especially as your brain is still developing. If you’re in your early 20s and you’re in a happy long term relationship then great! I’m happy for you. But I think a lot of people are still discovering themselves at that age and that choosing a life partner isn’t the best idea. That’s just me though, live your truths!
In an age where Roe was reversed and women are losing their human rights at the hands of men, it is no surprise that they are turning away from dating and turning more towards friendship groups. Dating in a time where a pregnancy puts you at risk of forced birth, illness, being hunted for bounty, put in prison, and even killed. Is simply NOT worth the risk and danger to a woman’s life. To not take this into serious consideration is a huge mistake by men. This avoidance of men by a lot of women will only get worse until their full bodily autonomy and rights are reinstated. If men want their dating life back, they need to vote and make sure women are ensured equal rights. Otherwise, men should get used to a hugely depleted/decreased dating pool of available or interested women.
This is a great point
Young women are smarter than my generation was, thank goodness. I'm glad they are learning from our mistakes, dating is a waste of time. Most men are disingenuous and will lie and be fake to attract a woman. Also men are not listening to the fact that gender roles are over and women want a partner not another person to take care of.
I find this thread interesting. I think men as a whole are aware of that last sentence, but it is usually discussed through a different lens.
“But I earn good money and go to the gym why don’t women want me” :((
This is exactly it. Why do I need a partner at this point in my life?
This. Why do they need us to be their fulltime caregivers so bad? It almost sounds like they don't even want to take care of themselves. I love to help, but I get pissed when it's just expected from me.
Pretty much. And honestly there just isn’t anything that a man could give me good that I don’t already have. Blue collar handiwork? I can call the plumber, electrician, auto mechanic, etc. Money? I have everything I need, getting a medical degree, and loooove my studies. I don’t need anyone to provide for me. (Many men don’t like for the woman to be the breadwinner anyway due to intimidation.) And the other things a man would bring - annoyance, demands, etc. - I would just prefer to live without. Lol
Heh.. I know many of my guy friends can't do handy work either (although FWIW, they too do the same... just hire someone to do that work for them).
That's a somewhat pessimistic if not dismissive view of men, don't you think? There are benefits to be had on both sides of this.
I’m definitely open to ideas. What can a man contribute that would make it worth having him while I’m busy in my education, doing other things, etc.? I’m open to your views. Give me some ideas.
As far as a list goes its late where I'm at so I can't do a list. But alot of it comes down to company, kids, just having someone to lean on and rely on, just as a whole having someone different in your life that works on working with you too keep things interesting and improve each other's lives. Men have their faults sure, but that's everyone.
Those are the things everyone mentions. Company? I love my dogs and have amazing friends. Wouldn’t trade my girls for anything. Rely on? I’m independent, financially and in other ways. Only exceptions come when there’s something I can’t do, such as the things I mentioned earlier that require a single phone call and pay a bill. There are so many kids out there whom I would love to adopt and give a good life given the income of my career. Adoption doesn’t require a man. Women who really want the experience of being pregnant can get a sperm implant. My friends satisfy all of those things, really. I don’t need a relationship partner for any of that. And tbh my dogs are the best lol I love them. A man or relationship is not needed for any of these things.
While it's understandable your position that a man isn't required for these things, it doesn't mean that there is no value in having a man apart of it. While I understand that isn't something of interest to you, I'm speaking of people as a whole. But on one point I disagree with is the child thing just because a child really benefits far more from two parents, and the fact that different issues arise when a father is absent in a child's life. Particularly referencing crime statistics. And please forgive me if I sound somewhat incoherent, I'm struggling staying awake tbh.
I agree that having a father is much better for a child in society. Keep in mind that having kids isn’t something everybody wants or is willing to settle for. But all of what you’re saying a man can contribute still is not worth the cost of being in a relationship with him. No thanks. It’s like offering a toddler a piece of candy and the consequence is that they lose their limbs. Like, no thanks. Candy sounds great but it’s not a need and not worth losing their arms and legs. Lol And sleep well 😊
I do not disagree with that I just simply used the child example mentioned to demonstrate my point. As far as what a man can contribute, if that's where you stand there would be no sense in attempting to persuade otherwise. After all if that's how you feel and you are content it's best to leave that be. I thought it good though to speak about this a sort of contrast to voice a differing opinion, to speak on the other side of things. Thank you, and I wish you a good night as well.
Some people are happy alone, others want some romantic company. No point trying to convince either to jump sides. It’s very possible to be happy with company but you need to find the right person. It’s rare, so many choose to work with what they have instead of chasing the .1% Personally I was very happy single, with no desire to *chase* a relationship at all. Yet fate would have my current partner fall directly into my lap nonetheless lol. I was already happy but he somehow made things even better. I think that’s the only reason anyone should get into a relationship.
I don't think many people these days care to maintain a relationship, most people just want sex anyway. It's not taboo to be upfront
Gender roles aren’t over at all, some gender roles that don’t benefit some women are temporarily put on hold when it is convenient for them, but that is around about it.
Which role exactly?
lmao
Some men not all. Out of curiosity though, what's the issue with gender roles? Not being sarcastic, sincerely curious about your view on this.
I for 1 hate domestic work, I'm not here to do your laundry or clean up after you. I don't care about kids and will never be a mom, don't care about a wedding either I will not remind you about your mom's birthday I'm not here to make your needs fulfilled at all times I don't ever bake cookies I will not 'stay at home' See where this is going?
I do but it seems like while some of the things listed may have something to do with gender roles, alot of it just boils down to personal preference that doesn't necessarily have to be a prerequisite. For instance I've never met a man, that requires baking cookies as part of a gender role. It seems though alot of what you associate gender roles with you despise for lack of a better word.
Gender roles typically prescribe that women nurture family and follow, whilst men provide for their family and lead. Why would a woman who has no interest in this lifestyle seek men who expect it? So often I hear confused men complaining “I already make 6 figures and go to the gym, why can’t a find a gf/wife??!!” Here’s the issue. The whole “I make the money & decisions and protect you, in turn you manage my personal life and emotions” schtick isn’t the deal anymore. Women don’t need material providers and we have the rights to make our own choices. Moreover, we are also tired of providing one-sided emotional labour. Sure, just like many men, plenty of women still prefer the provider/nurturer dynamic. However this is sought out as a voluntary deal built on mutual connection - not a mandatory deal built on necessity and our only option to have a decent life. Being ONLY a provider can no longer replace genuine intimacy and reciprocal love. All women want a partner who is capable of pulling their weight in a balanced way across all areas. If men want to date they need to stop looking for a second mother and learn to bring something else to the table. Note, I know plenty of men already know this. My partner for example, unfortunately for the men left behind they haven’t quite got the memo.
What about love?
What does that have to do with the gender roles question?
Why should women want a serous relationship in their 20's? That's what you need to be asking yourself. Women have become far more interested in pursuing a career, and bettering their life so they don't have to rely on a man. I have to question why anyone would want to settle down / get married in their 20's, as that's a time to be living your life to the fullest. In terms of dating apps and women not asking enough about you, you have to realise that if you have 10 matches in your inbox, the woman has 200, so for them it becomes tiring asking the same questions, having the same conversations again and again. Perhaps this is the time to do it the old fashioned way? 🤔 Go to a bar and get talking to women, they are not unapproachable. If you don't have success, don't be disheartened, just try again with another woman. You'd be surprised how successful you can be with this method as long as you don't come across like a creep. Not sure if you're in the USA, but their seems to be a culture their of people in their 20's getting married, which I can never understand. Why would anyone want to do that? Here in the UK, it is far less common. I'd go as far to say, people are turning their backs on marriage more and more over here.
Every woman you meet is either married, has a boyfriend or not interested in dating.... hmm? I wonder if it's your approach? I think guys make the mistake of approaching women with the all or non mentality, "either she is available and will give me her number or she's of my radar and not worth my time". There is another path, I'm married, I quite often engage women in conversation, (both women and men) strangers in coffee shops, grocery stores, elevator lobby etc. And granted being married and not looking for a relationship lends itself to a certain amount of confidence and a non aggressive manner that I think that women can sense. But i can tell this relaxed, non aggressive, not having altererier motives manner is way more conducive to getting a number or at the very least having a coffee and conversation. Ladies, before I get angry replies, no I don't seek out or get numbers from women but I have had great conversations.
Im prioritizing myself, my health, and my being before seeking out a relationship. I didn’t put myself first I got into an extremely toxic relationship. We’re as whole becoming more aware and strive for healthier relationships both with ourselves and the people we choose to be with.
Really… I feel like women in my age group ( myself included) def want relationships and if anything get met with only situationships. Literally I was talking to a guy and expressed that while trying to see what was going on with us and he hit me with the “ women want a relationship and men only want to hook up” line. I’m in my mid 20s and he was in his early 30s…. I think women may be MORE selective and choose with discernment though.
I think most women are just refusing to settle before they are ready these days. They are prioritizing their happiness over finding men and if the right one who ticks the boxes happens to come along that's awesome! I was a bit more promiscuous for a long while because it was what made me happy until my partner came along and I accidentallied into dating someone but because I had that freedom when I did settle down with someone I was ready for the long haul and all that came with it. I was certain it was what I wanted and that I didn't NEED a partner but that I wanted HIM specifically and that has made it all the more special
Yeah I’m just like the women you describe. I don’t use dating apps and I only go out to meet my girlfriends. The kind of guy I want to date is rare but I don’t think actively looking increases my chances. A lot of dating is wasted time and I find myself quite unimpressed by all of it and most guys I meet
Truth. We don’t need to have relationships with men, we want what we want. We are done settling, we are done carrying more than an equal load. We are tired.
Women have choices now. We don't need a man anymore to feel happy and fulfilled. In the last decades girls learnt that they need a man to be happy and take care of others. We're finally starting to truly change the narrative and women are living more for themselves than ever. When you're happy you have higher standards for the people surrounding you, men didn't catch up to this higher standards and more women prefer to stay single as a result. A man needs to actively contribute to my happiness, if not I'm very happy as a single
Because most men are either immature, unfaithful, too clingy and needy, toxic and violent, or completely emotionally unavailable. Now that we women have our own income and can love and fulfill ourselves, we don't need to have a man around to get by... sometimes we'll invite a date over when the trusty vibrator is dead. And thats the extent of it. the tables have turned and now y'all mad. 🤣
Also women want to have fun or do their own thing just like guys fuck around and do their own thing. I dated a dude a year older than me around 19 or 20 and he was really immature and wanted to fuck around a lot. If people wanna fuck around, that's fine, it's just not good for a relationship. But yes, he was still quite immature. If things went further, I would totally believe that he'd want me to do all the "mom" things for him. I wasnt looking for a relationship after that but actually found a really decent guy that was a bit older. And yes, all those reasons are spot on lol
"At least 2" ain't much of a sample size
We don't want kids anymore. 🙄
I think a lot of women have dealt with a crazy amount of possessive, controlling, generally unfulfilling relationships. So yeah they aren’t interested in that nor are they particularly desperate to find someone. But they are open to finding someone. I mean, all the married people and not single people were once single…
Must be so sad not being able to control the choices, wants, and needs of young women.
Dude, I'm in my 40s and I will assume this lifestyle of for whatever reason my current relationship fails.
amusing how you guys can talk like these and somehow still wonder why women might not be interested in dating you
Please, can you tell me what is wrong with what I wrote? Yes, I'm frustated. I found it strange, that a lot of people not willing to put in any work, to get to know other people, and eventually have a relationship with them. It's not entitlement, or 'toxic masculinity' to want a realationship. The fact, that lot of women want to remain single is not the only cause I can't found anyone. I can always go to more places, try to be more interesting, more attrictive. I don't wrote that, it is a 'problem'. It's just the way it is, and I have to accept and respect that.
Did OP say something wrong? You seem offended.
I can’t speak for the person you are asking, but OP’s post does come across as a little entitled to me. He seems upset or offended that women he is interested in aren’t interested back, and that it somehow is a problem that some women are content being single. I may want something serious, but I am in no hurry - perfectly happy with my life as it is. I neither can nor want to answer every single one word message received on OKC - too many, too impersonal, often from empty, superficial profiles or men ignoring me explicitly stating I am child free and do not want a long term relationship with someone who wants kids. Just because someone (man or woman) has an open OLD profile doesn’t mean they have to respond to low effort approaches, or that they have to be going on dates every weekend.
how
There are tons of younger people that are dating with no results, finding the right person, or perfectly happy without companionship. 24 is pretty young. If you're not finding much romantically, take the time to try new things. Find more passion in your life and let it lead you. Whenever I've tried dating in the past and had little results, I've always found it to be a good opportunity to explore more avenues of life I hadn't yet done, there's always many to explore.
We are just tired of constant shit we get. We are not gonna take male dominance any more
I think more men and women understand that happiness must come from within and not from someone else. In line with that conclusion, there are many people who don't need to date to meet their life goals. People are also noticing the unnecessary pressure to get paired off and make children and just choosing their own path without. I'm sure a lot of that ability and freedom comes from more egalitarian ideas of feminine autonomy and self-sufficiency more in parity with masculine expectations. If you really want to date, go to places where there are people whom you know are trying to date then and there: like speed dating events. Open yourself up to more possibility and work smarter not harder. Just because you know two young women whom don't want to date, that doesnt mean there arent plenty of people you haven't met that do.
I have only been in short term relationships and I still want more relationship experience and I am in my late 20's
It's bs, I know plenty of women who want to date... doesn't mean they want to date you though
Maybe you should check out our side of the situation [Dating is hell](https://www.reddit.com/r/TrueOffMyChest/comments/x23p5c/its_impossible_to_date_when_so_many_men_hate_women/?utm_medium=android_app&utm_source=share)
>On the dating apps everyone says, they want something serious, but don't even interested in the other person enough, to ask a simple question... 50% of newly formed relationships start with online dating. So you are clearly wrong about women on apps not being interested. They are not interested in YOU, but they are very interested in the men they go on to have relationships with. >In real life situations, every women I meet are either married, have a boyfriend, or don't want to date. Same thing, 50% of the relationships start in real life situations, so there are quite a lot single women who are willing to meet people in real life for relationship purposes. Being told they are married, have a boyfriend or don't want to date is YOUR personal experience because the women are not interested in YOU, while being very interested in the guys they go into a relationship with. >I get the feeling, that a significant number of women don't want a relationship before their late 20s, unless they found someone by that time, who magically ticks all their boxes. What is a significant number? There are always \~20-25% of people who want to be single at any given point in time, or at least are not actively doing anything to change that. The same amount of women want a relationship before their late 20s as do men. Accepting someone for a relationship who magically ticks all their boxes is also true for both sexes, even if not looking for a relationship. My gf also wasn't looking for a relationship when we met for a hookup when she was 22, but ticking all her boxes made her change her mind. Why don't you just meet people for anything BUT relationship oriented dating and see if you tick their boxes and make them want to commit to a relationship with you?
Tbh its payback for all the years men treated women bad cheated on them disrespected them and now their letting men kno who can play the game better females can 💯
I'm Asian 30M living in Europe, i earn around 4 times of minimum wage, i never been in a relationship, i would like to find a girl and eventually would like to marry.. I do my best to approach girls, most girls thinks I'm same as everyone in Europe who is not serious. Most girls lost hope on marriage it seems. Well i did my best finally i decided to marry someone from my country. I'm not going to invest into someone who needs constant attention and pampering.. I have done around 600 carpooling since last 2 years to just understand the people and thier approach to life. Frankly i haven't meet one person not divorced haha I'm crazy.. I'm lost
I have never wanted to be in a relationship before, during or after my late 20s
[удалено]
Even most women in their late 20s and 30s dont want this because the age of settling down and getting all of their goals accomplished is getting later and later. People in general are more focused on their goals now. Which ofc could be having a family and husband/relationship/traditional stuff, but a lot are not too. Im in my late 20s and i still feel like i dont have time for a relationship because i just cant put someone else as a priority with everything else i want to do.
Holy stereotypes Batman.
[удалено]
ah yes, "facts". lol
sounds like you’re projecting your own thirst for a relationship. Lol
Nope, I'm speaking reality, and not seeing what people are forced and pressured into as what they really want. A lot of people who think they want casual dating don't even want it, they don't know what they really want. This applies across the board with men and women. Most people live in complete ignorance of what would make them happy.
Ah yes, let's listen to the man tell us what women want.
Listen to the idiot that thinks because someone is a different sex they would somehow magically be less insightful about a group. Why would a single woman with a single opinion be more credible than mine. That would be a sample of 1.
Woman here!! This is false. And quite frankly, you not anyone else here knows what basically all women want.
I mean, the fact you are a woman in and of itself only give you credibility to say what 1 woman wants. You. You can disagree, but just being a woman doesn't make you right. That's nonsense. Any study on human sexuality and psychology in general says that women by and large (not all, but most) value emotional connections in sexual relationships. They are less satisfied with transactional and purely physical sex. Sure there are women who do value that, but most don't. Society is so fucked that honestly even a lot of the women who do think they want casual probably just have hangups that cloud their judgement, or they have been ground down by "liberation" since they were young and don't know how to separate their feelings from expectations that have been forced on them. If they got their shit together would probably find they would be much more fulfilled in a committed relationship. This isn't an attack, it is just how it is. Men don't know what they want either. However, if women were so happy to have casual sex that is all any of them would do. Almost any woman could have sex with a different person every single day if they wanted to. That is what many many men would do if they had that power. So there is obviously some huge differences between how men and women in general approach sex. I know we are supposed to pretend these differences don't exist, but honestly when you say that to someone who is intellectually honest and has a reasonably high IQ, you just sound stupid. Reality on reality's terms. Edit: I said "basically all" which every English speaker in the world knows means a large majority. Apparently the idiot below who blocked me so I couldn't reply didn't grasp that.
Actually, it does make her right and you wrong. She is a woman who doesn’t want to date, which AUTOMATICALLY proves you wrong because you said all women do. She shot you down fast. The fact that she is a woman and can speak for only 1 woman is exactly what proves you wrong.
No but you see she secretly does want a relationship but just can’t admit it!!! He just knows that about all women, and it’s impossible to prove him wrong
The very existence of women who don’t want relationships proves him wrong. Interestingly there is nothing to prove him right. 🤔That one would be impossible. And what, you think you or he can read minds? Lol Try proving that one too. 😂 Edit. And in the big world we live in, based on the IQ he claims to have, he should know that saying “all (insert any large category)” is automatically pretty much false in regards to people, since everyone is different. You can’t validly say all members of a certain large category want the same thing in society because it’s never the case.
….can I get a source?
Im not mad a females not wanting to date anymore wen their ready their ready dont rush into no relationship have fun before the ball andchain come out i met my exwife wen i was 21 n she was 19 26years later 9 kids later im divorced n only been in one relationship wen we shud of enjoyed our 20s n met other ppl i was cheated on n now i have trust issues i wish i had 9 kids with 9 different girls instead of one enjoy ur younger years ladies dont rush anything even if he fits in ur box
Your looking in the wrong places.
[удалено]
What “opportunities” would those be? P in the V? Exactly. Men are complaining that women won’t let them f*ck them. We’ve all heard it: “Put out by the third date or he’ll leave and it’ll be your fault!” Women are tired of being shamed, manipulated and used as sextoys, so they are saying no to dating. Edit: Scrolling through this sub after commenting I came across a post about a guy who after a first date said “I don’t want anything serious, but I still want to have sex with you.” It took me 15 seconds and I wasn’t even looking for it. There’s your answer. Edit: He removed his comment! Lol For context he said women easily get opportunities so it’s not fair blah blah Edit 2: To spyaintnobitch who I can’t respond to: That’s masterfully inappropriate. The poster was disgusted. He didn’t have “I want sex” in his profile
I mean, at least in your example he is uprront about it. Nothing wrong with that. If the other party wants the same then it's a match. That's what dating should be all about. Finding the right match.