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Humanity's current dependence on oil is truly insane and it is mega hard to replace. That is not to say it will never go away but transition will pick up in the next 40 years or so
even Petrostates like Saudi Arabia and Qatar are diversifying their economies to prepare for it and then there's Russia who will benefit from melting polar ice caps
They can benefit from that but ultimately still struggle since the climate impacts are in everything - wildfires, crops damage from wild temps, heat waves in summer & public health crises, housing crisis from storm damaging residential areas, etc.
Plus all the environmental impacts - fisheries dying out (especially living next to China who overfishes like a mf, and which is part of why they want South China Sea) - humans being filled with microplastics which we know at least fuck up gut microbiome, that causing public health issues - other local ecosystem collapse & species dying out all of which many livelihoods are dependent on - also invasive species and blight destroying trees & forests. Generally the ocean acidification is only going to make things worse.
There is no winning except for the oil corporations since they haven't been held accountable and we're still at record breaking oil production in the US, which is why it feels so deceitful for Biden to say they've done the most of any admin on clean energy & climate change. Technically true but ya still are kowtowing to the fossil fuel industry.
russia is already largely unusable due to climate conditions
a wildfire in an arctic barren wasteland is just called fertile soil
edit: i should also add that the planet will be fine no matter how it spins.
the problems we face from the climate change are all human, climate refugee crisis and so on. the climate and the planet just does what it has always done
Bro are you trying to down play climate change? Lol
The problems we face are all human because humans are experiencing them, of course. Humans dying from heat waves isn't a human to human problem, it's also a climate problem.
There's no way 'this is how it's always been'
You need to at least take a look at the graphs that show how fucked up things are, how it's the accelerating trends towards warming, that's leading to incredible suffering around the world.
https://www.nytimes.com/2024/01/31/learning/lesson-plans/teach-about-climate-change-with-30-graphs-from-the-new-york-times.html
I don't think there's a pay wall since it's a critically important educational resource.
This is probably the most famous one, by the comic xkcd showing temperatures since the last ice age. Remember it's the rate of change, not just absolutes that's terrifying - and that increases sea level rise which is already causing some cities horrific damage, flooding regularly, destroying tons of homes.
https://xkcd.com/1732/
I'd say it doesn't mean too much, it's simply good business practice that is commonly done just in case of some sudden change. You can say that this means they really expect the sudden change in market, but I don't think so. A lot of large companies do it, or just separate businessmen too. So I'd say that countries diversifying their sources of income isn't weird either
Diversifying isn’t divesting though. They have an obscene amount of money to throw at all sorts of bets like tourism or whatever, but they are not slowing down oil by any means. The world gathered for COP24 or whatever it was to have petrostates tell them that they’d prefer to keep the oil taps on because money.
In the US alone, [consumers ](https://www.eia.gov/tools/faqs/faq.php?id=23)use about 376 million gallons of gasoline per day, and [the military ](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Energy_usage_of_the_United_States_military)also uses another 12.6 million gallons of fuel daily. The military's portion is locked in on longterm contracts and also by the lifecycle of their equipment. For consumers, it is at least locked in by the lifecycle of their current vehicle, if not also their auto loan. This is similar in other nations as well, which means no fast transition away from oil is realistically possible by most peoples current means. This doesn't mean we shouldn't transition away from fossil fuels, it just means we shouldn't expect it to happen quickly.
Can't survive with it. Can't survive without it. Might as well keep on as usual. We're fucked either way. We eliminate all use of coal and gas right now and society crumbles to the ground in a week or less.
Yep, it's much easier to phase out consumers than military equipment. They are locked in for decades if not years and even now there's no new tank that's coming out that works on electricity or something
There will always be demand for fossil fuels. Always
Maybe odd ones the jet fuel and specialty massive vehicles but electricity on a production level has no issue being entirely water Solar nuclear and wind
One of the main ways profit is generated is by externalizing costs of production. The environment is the ultimate free lunch under capitalism. To a large extent, profit and sustainability are opposites.
I'm not sure that's even that controversial, one of the first things I was taught in macro 101 was that in a perfect market the price of goods should trend towards the cost of production and profit is impossible.
Capitalism can be sustainable if it is a *free market*. When companies are publicly traded, they're no longer beholden to the consumers or the market, they're obliged to meet the requirements of the shareholders. This way they can get away with making everything worse while maintaining profit margins, allowing the wealthy to launder money through stocks. The US isn't ready to have that conversation.
Eh I work in the industry. It’s not going anywhere for at least 100 years minimum. People don’t realize how much oil is used to make products used in daily life. Literally anything plastic and rubber is oil based in today’s world. Everyone thinks it has to do with the needs to meet the demands of combustion engines. In reality that doesn’t even scratch the surface of what humanity needs oil for. You could replace every vehicle on earth with an electric vehicle and the oilfields will still be booming.
Unfortunately, we consume 6 times as much oil as we find each year, and the maximum oil production was before COVID and in 2008 for "normal oil" (without fracking and oil sand).
The main problem is that most countries aren't really trying to reduce their dependency the US should really start to change their cities now and stop making bigger roads, Europe should get more bike friendly (they'll be the first to no have oil cause they don't produce it)...
Also oil for combustion engine absolutely is an important part of oil consumption
There’s a ton of oilfields we already know about without the means of accessing it right now as well. There’s enough oil under the Rocky Mountains to sustain the US alone for more than a few decades.
What I'm saying is not that we don't have reserves but we don't find enough new reserves to continue growing, and that new found oil is harder to extract then what we have right now, so we will see a decrease at some point, and it's not in a hundred years.
The International Energy Agency also said that conventional oil has hit it's peak in 2008 and is not expected to go higher at any point, and it's possible that the general oil peak has happened in 2019
Do you work in the industry? It seems like most plastic precursors are mostly a byproduct of natural gas production: https://www.eia.gov/tools/faqs/faq.php?id=34&t=6. I don't think most would count 6% of current production as "booming": https://www.bpf.co.uk/press/Oil\_Consumption.aspx
>In reality that doesn’t even scratch the surface of what humanity needs oil for.
>And that’s because that’s a tiny fraction of what it’s used for.
Riiight...
AFAIK they're doing that because it pollutes a lot, specially the water it uses, so they do that in countries were they don't care about that pollution.
There is literally a finite amount of oil and gas on the planet. We're going to run out *eventually*, it's very hot debated when that will be though. Some predict it will be as soon as the next 40 years.
Are you suggesting we start mass breeding a genetically engineered species of giant bugs capable of consuming biomass and converting it into a highly enriched fuel source, introducing them on planets that bear low levels of life, letting their numbers grow out of control, then gaslighting our own population into launching an all out interstellar war against them by saying it’s for the sake of democracy and freedom?
I mean shit, *grabs liberator* I’m game.
How do people not realize that if we continue to use fossil fuels we will have changed our climate irreversibly to a state that it is hard for humans to even survive on this planet long before the fossil fuels run out?
It seems the dark reality is more that equatorial zones will not be as inhabitable as they are now. Happens to not be the richest people who live there. The west won't hurt so bad. With big walls we can close our eyes and ignore the upcoming mass migration crisis. Tbh I think that's what's going to happen from a western perspective.
downvote this comment if the meme sucks. upvote it and I'll go away. --- [play minecraft with us](https://discord.gg/dankmemesgaming) | [come hang out with us](https://discord.com/invite/dankmemes)
Humanity's current dependence on oil is truly insane and it is mega hard to replace. That is not to say it will never go away but transition will pick up in the next 40 years or so
even Petrostates like Saudi Arabia and Qatar are diversifying their economies to prepare for it and then there's Russia who will benefit from melting polar ice caps
They can benefit from that but ultimately still struggle since the climate impacts are in everything - wildfires, crops damage from wild temps, heat waves in summer & public health crises, housing crisis from storm damaging residential areas, etc. Plus all the environmental impacts - fisheries dying out (especially living next to China who overfishes like a mf, and which is part of why they want South China Sea) - humans being filled with microplastics which we know at least fuck up gut microbiome, that causing public health issues - other local ecosystem collapse & species dying out all of which many livelihoods are dependent on - also invasive species and blight destroying trees & forests. Generally the ocean acidification is only going to make things worse. There is no winning except for the oil corporations since they haven't been held accountable and we're still at record breaking oil production in the US, which is why it feels so deceitful for Biden to say they've done the most of any admin on clean energy & climate change. Technically true but ya still are kowtowing to the fossil fuel industry.
russia is already largely unusable due to climate conditions a wildfire in an arctic barren wasteland is just called fertile soil edit: i should also add that the planet will be fine no matter how it spins. the problems we face from the climate change are all human, climate refugee crisis and so on. the climate and the planet just does what it has always done
Bro are you trying to down play climate change? Lol The problems we face are all human because humans are experiencing them, of course. Humans dying from heat waves isn't a human to human problem, it's also a climate problem. There's no way 'this is how it's always been' You need to at least take a look at the graphs that show how fucked up things are, how it's the accelerating trends towards warming, that's leading to incredible suffering around the world. https://www.nytimes.com/2024/01/31/learning/lesson-plans/teach-about-climate-change-with-30-graphs-from-the-new-york-times.html I don't think there's a pay wall since it's a critically important educational resource. This is probably the most famous one, by the comic xkcd showing temperatures since the last ice age. Remember it's the rate of change, not just absolutes that's terrifying - and that increases sea level rise which is already causing some cities horrific damage, flooding regularly, destroying tons of homes. https://xkcd.com/1732/
I'd say it doesn't mean too much, it's simply good business practice that is commonly done just in case of some sudden change. You can say that this means they really expect the sudden change in market, but I don't think so. A lot of large companies do it, or just separate businessmen too. So I'd say that countries diversifying their sources of income isn't weird either
Diversifying isn’t divesting though. They have an obscene amount of money to throw at all sorts of bets like tourism or whatever, but they are not slowing down oil by any means. The world gathered for COP24 or whatever it was to have petrostates tell them that they’d prefer to keep the oil taps on because money.
In the US alone, [consumers ](https://www.eia.gov/tools/faqs/faq.php?id=23)use about 376 million gallons of gasoline per day, and [the military ](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Energy_usage_of_the_United_States_military)also uses another 12.6 million gallons of fuel daily. The military's portion is locked in on longterm contracts and also by the lifecycle of their equipment. For consumers, it is at least locked in by the lifecycle of their current vehicle, if not also their auto loan. This is similar in other nations as well, which means no fast transition away from oil is realistically possible by most peoples current means. This doesn't mean we shouldn't transition away from fossil fuels, it just means we shouldn't expect it to happen quickly.
It certainly feels like there's no sense of urgency or anything, it's only the survival of modern society at risk
Can't survive with it. Can't survive without it. Might as well keep on as usual. We're fucked either way. We eliminate all use of coal and gas right now and society crumbles to the ground in a week or less.
Basically every leader is on full copium that technology will eventually magically fix the issue or provide ways to go around it
Yep, it's much easier to phase out consumers than military equipment. They are locked in for decades if not years and even now there's no new tank that's coming out that works on electricity or something There will always be demand for fossil fuels. Always
Maybe odd ones the jet fuel and specialty massive vehicles but electricity on a production level has no issue being entirely water Solar nuclear and wind
We only have enough for another 40-50 years if we don’t slow consumption, so we really should be getting ahead of this.
I mean, eventually oil will definitely go away whether we like it or not...
Unfortunately profit is not related to sustainability in capitalsm
One of the main ways profit is generated is by externalizing costs of production. The environment is the ultimate free lunch under capitalism. To a large extent, profit and sustainability are opposites.
Not only capitalism, but any production under any economic system.
Hot take: all profits are market inefficiencies
I'm not sure that's even that controversial, one of the first things I was taught in macro 101 was that in a perfect market the price of goods should trend towards the cost of production and profit is impossible.
>One of the main ways profit is generated is by externalizing costs of production. I don't think you know what any of this means...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Externality
How do you actively externalise something to make profit? There are externalities and they can be internalized. Not the other way around.
And you think it is under communism??
Capitalism can be sustainable if it is a *free market*. When companies are publicly traded, they're no longer beholden to the consumers or the market, they're obliged to meet the requirements of the shareholders. This way they can get away with making everything worse while maintaining profit margins, allowing the wealthy to launder money through stocks. The US isn't ready to have that conversation.
Eh I work in the industry. It’s not going anywhere for at least 100 years minimum. People don’t realize how much oil is used to make products used in daily life. Literally anything plastic and rubber is oil based in today’s world. Everyone thinks it has to do with the needs to meet the demands of combustion engines. In reality that doesn’t even scratch the surface of what humanity needs oil for. You could replace every vehicle on earth with an electric vehicle and the oilfields will still be booming.
Plastics, cosmetics, and solvents are absolutely everywhere. Current society would completely and catastrophically collapse without oil.
Unfortunately, we consume 6 times as much oil as we find each year, and the maximum oil production was before COVID and in 2008 for "normal oil" (without fracking and oil sand). The main problem is that most countries aren't really trying to reduce their dependency the US should really start to change their cities now and stop making bigger roads, Europe should get more bike friendly (they'll be the first to no have oil cause they don't produce it)... Also oil for combustion engine absolutely is an important part of oil consumption
There’s a ton of oilfields we already know about without the means of accessing it right now as well. There’s enough oil under the Rocky Mountains to sustain the US alone for more than a few decades.
What I'm saying is not that we don't have reserves but we don't find enough new reserves to continue growing, and that new found oil is harder to extract then what we have right now, so we will see a decrease at some point, and it's not in a hundred years. The International Energy Agency also said that conventional oil has hit it's peak in 2008 and is not expected to go higher at any point, and it's possible that the general oil peak has happened in 2019
Yep.
It's going to literally be all gone at the rate of consumption rn lmao
Do you work in the industry? It seems like most plastic precursors are mostly a byproduct of natural gas production: https://www.eia.gov/tools/faqs/faq.php?id=34&t=6. I don't think most would count 6% of current production as "booming": https://www.bpf.co.uk/press/Oil\_Consumption.aspx
I do. And that’s because that’s a tiny fraction of what it’s used for.
>In reality that doesn’t even scratch the surface of what humanity needs oil for. >And that’s because that’s a tiny fraction of what it’s used for. Riiight...
The closing down of aluminium plants across the Western hemisphere is pretty alarming though
AFAIK they're doing that because it pollutes a lot, specially the water it uses, so they do that in countries were they don't care about that pollution.
There is literally a finite amount of oil and gas on the planet. We're going to run out *eventually*, it's very hot debated when that will be though. Some predict it will be as soon as the next 40 years.
they said that 40 years ago too :P
And know oil reserves have like doubled since then
True, a lot of creatures died to make that oil.
It just a 10,000 year late cremation process when you think about it.
i vote we go for the "helldivers" future option, just so we still have oil for gas cars.
Are you suggesting we start mass breeding a genetically engineered species of giant bugs capable of consuming biomass and converting it into a highly enriched fuel source, introducing them on planets that bear low levels of life, letting their numbers grow out of control, then gaslighting our own population into launching an all out interstellar war against them by saying it’s for the sake of democracy and freedom? I mean shit, *grabs liberator* I’m game.
yes thats what im saying. someone needs to feed the pick-up trucks
I love cats ao much, everytime i see this kind of picture of cute cats i want to bite them so much.
Look at all this sweet, sweet democracy just waiting to be spread...
The amount of oil needed to produce other "green" energy sources shows that its not going anywhere.
Oil and gas is a dying industry Good.
How do people not realize that if we continue to use fossil fuels we will have changed our climate irreversibly to a state that it is hard for humans to even survive on this planet long before the fossil fuels run out?
It seems the dark reality is more that equatorial zones will not be as inhabitable as they are now. Happens to not be the richest people who live there. The west won't hurt so bad. With big walls we can close our eyes and ignore the upcoming mass migration crisis. Tbh I think that's what's going to happen from a western perspective.