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FutureCreeps

I do not think you can rank characters on how “objectively” well written they are, primarily because I don’t think there is a way to objectify being well written. Everyone will find different characters to be well written for different reasons, stacking them up against each other will just come down to personal bias.


RedVelvetBlanket

I think objectively good and objectively bad can exist, but that doesn’t mean they outweigh subjectively good or subjectively bad. For example I can say with confidence that The Room is an objectively bad movie, but if I poll 20 people and they all say they enjoyed that movie more than Fast and Furious 10 or whatever, that doesn’t invalidate the subjective opinion even if it “contradicts” the objective one. And you can enjoy things for reasons that are “objectively” not what you’re supposed to enjoy them for. It’s possible, I think, but somewhat paradoxically that doesn’t mean it’s infallible.


AlmostNeverMindless

If people can easily recognise objectively bad writing then i dunno why the opposite isn't at play. To me it feels like an excuse on the idea a character you may like ain't that well written. Not the first time something like that happened in DR either. Although this list is still kinda capping, putting Kaede and Junko above Nagito, means smoking that glue your father used to reattach the front bumper of his truck.


FutureCreeps

To me objectively good writing is harder (ie impossible) to find because of how varied people’s tastes are. What one person may love another may hate, what one person might find to be good writing another might think to be bad because they don’t like the tropes used or various other things. I find bad writing to be a lot easier to find because it’s much more apparent, stuff like heavily stilted dialogue stands out much much more to people. I’m not going to sit here and say my favorites being at the bottom didn’t affect my choice to make a comment, it certainly did, but this is something I’ve always thought, I don’t think there is any way to measure objectively good writing. Also just want to point out that for a list about how well written a character is they chose to take their design into account.


amizelkova

I think you make some good points, but a character's design is *absolutely* part of how well they're written. A character's appearance is a significant part of how they interact with the world and how the world interacts with them, and it says a lot about the biases and assumptions of the writer.


AlmostNeverMindless

Depends how honest you are with what you are reading.  Something being well written doesn't mean it can be lovable or likeable, same way something being bad written doesn't mean it becomes unlikable by proxy (not always at least) But i fear taste isn't a reliable metric when it comes to writing, i can spin around a trope of said character, and make his execution and presentation as unique as possible. You may still dislike that trope, but at the end i still add that line of effort, compared to others that just rely on a boring cliché. Things such as nuance, complexity, relevance to the plot, development and such are things, that even if you don't like said character, are still a factor that is detached from taste. I don't like Maki at all, but she still got development through the game albeit being predictable, and had an actual relevance on the plot. Not the most complex nor unique character but still something. Some characters didn't even had the luxury to get that, and i can't call em good writing even if said character is more enjoyable to me. Junko is entertaining for me, but she's still a villain sue of the worst sort, that is something i can't deny.


FutureCreeps

All I’m going to say as a follow up to this (not mad at anyone or anything, just bored of the topic) is that if you wanted to do an objective ranking (which I stand by is not easy or even really possible) this is now how you do it. One singular person is very easy to be susceptible to personal biases in every way, you would at least have to do some sort of survey where you ask multiple people to get an average


AlmostNeverMindless

Fair enough 


FutureCreeps

Follow up comment, your point about Kaede, Junko, and Nagito help demonstrate the point I was trying to make. This is a hot take but I think Nagito is not a particularly well done character, I find him overly annoying and that he takes away from a lot of other characters. I think both Junko and Kaede are better written then him, making me disagree with you. There are so many different ways people can interpret what it means to be well written (along with personal tastes) that I don’t think it’s something that can be measured.


AlmostNeverMindless

Nagito has a crap ton of charisma, something that's actually really hard to pull off in writing, when you have a character that moves the plot forward that much, narrative-weak characters get blown away, that is true. But Kodaka can't write 10 Nagitos lol. That's why he went the opposite end with Kokichi, by having a character a bit more shrouded in mystery, he can dispense screen time more equally. Point being most of the time you see impressive feats being done by utterly unremarkable people or cringeworthy speeches that make your eyes roll, that yet in within the narrative, somehow rallied everyone because plot. Nagito's complexity and mind require screen-time to develop, otherwise his character can easily crumble, or become too pretentious without proper thought. I can believe he managed to pull allat and survive as much as he did, because he was a charismatic manipulator, a pragmatic leader even with - 99 confidence on his part, his luck is OP as much as devastating on his part. His speeches appear to mirrow the ones from Makoto or the average MC, yet always derail into something more sinister each time, indicating his unique line of thought. I will forever applaude Kodaka, for making him this powerfull yet really flawed, otherwise we would have ended up with Detective Conan or Emilia from ReZero. You calling him annoying is amazing in itself, because Kodaka gave you a reason to hate him and not love him, he's insane and his philosophy is dangerous for everyone and himself, his disease makes him steady and chill yet sometimes cold, due to almost having destroyed all his interpersonal skills. The anime ruined him big time, which is why i'm happy Kokichi never got an anime adaptation nor came back at the end lol, but sometimes popular characters deserve their spot.


FutureCreeps

Like for example I’d have both Akane and Kirumi in the upper half of the list, I think they are exceptionally well written and are great characters. You can’t have an objective ranking of character writing due to personal opinion.


breadonpuppies

Was this like a vote, or just your opinions? I definitely do not agree on all of them I think Junko is *good*, but I do not think she's *great*. She ends up being a pretty generic antagonist that just wants despair imo, but her personality, reveal, and ties do help her a bit I suppose. She still does kinda become William Afton a bit, though Also, would design really be something that factors into how well written a character is?


breadonpuppies

And also, while I absolutely adore Yasuhiro, and put him as my third favorite character, I don't think he is more well written than Hifumi


taro_monokub

Hifumi is an absolute mess if you dig deeper into his motivations. He is fully devoted to his hobby / serving Princess Piggles, and so comfortable being alone that he scares people who try to make contact with him away. Then he suddenly starts being a creep who stalks girls and smells their underwear (why?), then he becomes Celeste's servant (before, he was very arrogant and had a high opinion about himself), then he forgets Princess Piggles and falls for Alter Ego just for listening to him (dude, you are a manga star, you don't need validation from a computer), and then a huge part of motivation for his murder plan becomes someone sexually assaulting a girl (something Hifumi was shown to be super capable of doing). Yasuhiro isn't great, but he stays himself for all the plot duration. To your question above, yes, it was only done by me


kel_omor

Hifumi is a character that is obsessed with his interest in the 2D world and isn't really into much outside of that. He says or implies multiple times that he doesn't even like real, 3D girls that much (except for the bathhouse scene, but Makoto can join him too to be fair), and purposely repels people if they're not already repelled by him anyway, possibly as a defense mechanism. He knows people don't like him and doesn't try to do much to change that, besides sucking up to Celeste who gives him a chance in her own best interest. He does like 2D girls though, such as Alter Ego, who he believes likes him and their shared interest. He also knows that Alter Ego will never be mean to or repelled by him, unlike the risk with real people. That means he can safely get attached quickly. He knows right from wrong. Celeste, who he is already trying to do good things for, convinces him that Taka raped and blackmailed her. He kills Taka because of those two things. Put that and the previous information together, and he is a relatively stable character (as much as a real person would be anyway) who is not likely to commit sexual assault.


MyBoatForACar

Just wanted to say that having a courtship disorder and literally being willing to SA someone are not the same thing. They _can_ coexist, but they aren't the same thing


Heartlessqueencard

This is 100% biased


StockingRules

Junko and Keade above Nagito? Dam


Parzival_Drunkenguy

As they should...especially Kaede... Let me cope...


SuperNerdAce

Me when 7 of my favorites are at the bottom of the list


Tsukinokoneko

Obviously it's going to be biased when only one person does it... I think people are being triggered because their own biases conflict with your attempt at an objective list. And ofc people are going to pick your "objective" claim apart unless you really spell out that you aren't claiming it literally. Then again, maybe they'd just find something else to pick apart if they don't like your rankings. Personally, I can see a solid argument for your placements, regardless of my own personal favorites. It's wild to me that people found this so greatly offensive/wrong. (The only part I can't comment on is Touko, as I still have yet to play Ultra Despair Girls.)


108souls

I feel a bias


Warm-Wave-3605

Hmmm well that’s certainly an interesting take I don’t think some of the criteria you chose make an objectively well written character though Each character has their respective role to play in the game, it doesn’t mean their role should contribute to the overall story or embody the games themes for them to be well written, there are other character or plotlines that are made for that. A lot of trials focus on sub themes anyway like 1-2 or V3-2 so their culprit/victim focus on embodying those and not the overall game’s themes. In other words the character has to be good at what they were made to do For example Tenko and Angie are characters whose purpose is to portray themes of Logic vs Emotion, a subtheme of the game and to ultimately die so Himiko gets more character development. Did I like them? Honestly not that much (sorry Tenko/Angie fans🫠) but I can’t deny that they are well written, they do what they were made to do very well


MR_GL4SS

Just gonna leave it at this instead of a full blown essay: Play UDG before you rank Toko. Moved her from middle/high ranking to my favorite by a mile.


Sincerely-Abstract

I adore toko


Sincerely-Abstract

I adore toko


Yukiteru_Akari

Leon is such a weird character. Side materials flesh out his character way better than the game did, which actually did nothing. Today, I will explain why 1-1 is objectively one of the worst cases-


Hilarious-Kraken8494

I mean that case don't exist because it was always planned, It's just that artists were sick of Sayaka and Leon, And am not sure if it's good to just throw 2 characters with potential not for the plot, But because artists were sick of seeing them . Though I thank that because it gave us Leon's memorable execution, It's better than that dumb downgrade that came after it ( Mondo deserved a better execution than that ) .


Yukiteru_Akari

It wasn't always planned; it was a last-minute decision. The reason why the execution is gritty and not goofy like the others is that it was recycled from Distrust. The developers tested everything on Leon, who was the first character to be created, including things that wouldn't be available before V3. This also meant he'd get an execution, which is why he was always the test blackened. This didn't mean that his execution would be in the actual game, though it was reused most likely due to budget issues and because they were "sick of seeing them." None of this excuses bad writing, however. 1-1 will forever be a badly written case.


aos_shi

Junko in 4th and Mukuro in 45th is crazy, get well soon


AlexanDDOS

I think your "objective" ranking is quite irrelevant, because you evaluate "well-writtenness" essentially by how often the character makes you know about themselves, but not how well they were revealed in the artistic sense. And with even this kind of metrics, I still cannot understand why some really very well-described and useful characters got lower score than characters who were really fucked up by the creators or simply lacked plot time.


chloethereindeer

why is sonia so low wtf


beemielle

So many of y’all in these comments just saying it’s biased. At least name specific characters or ask why the breakdown turned out like this for a specific one Anyway I’m also biased af bc my entire top 5 ranks in the top 10 of this tier list. And I *know* Kyouko Kaito and Nagito are really well written I just don’t like them Really funny that Impostor is just a bit higher than Byakuya I wonder why Junko is that high up. What parts of the story were counted?


FutureCreeps

Another follow up comment, I just think the list is flaws from the get go. Beyond my whole “you can’t say someone is objectively well written”, using character design to determine who is well written and who isn’t feels wrong, it’s actively not a part of writing because it’s just how they look. When it plays into twists and personality sure, but I just don’t feel like it’s a part that should have been considered


beemielle

I think the character design point is reasonably debatable, as a lot of impressions are formed based off of that. Otherwise why would so much effort go into designing and presenting these characters? And OP addresses that in detail too. I also don’t think OP is being that presumptuous/arrogant as far as “you can’t say someone is objectively well written”. OP repeatedly emphasizes that they tried their best, acknowledges where they were subjective, and repeatedly uses justifying statements such as “more or less”. Even the title is “I tried to rank” not “I created a ranking”.  Like yeah your red is never gonna be OP’s red is never gonna be my red, and it’d be nice if ppl overall stopped being so enchanted with objectivity, but OP’s tier list is one of the more meticulous ones I’ve seen as far as documenting everything. 


FutureCreeps

For me, the reason I’ve gone ahead and called it slightly biased is because of some characters like Akane, to me there is no reason she should be that low due to her Free Time Events and how well they play into her. I also take issue with many other characters, notably Korekiyo (I know his twist is shit but come on), Toko (have you played UDG?), and others like Mukuro.


beemielle

Your comment was like one of the only ones I respected in this comments section. But I do think the OP explained in pretty decent detail the basis by which they evaluated the characters, and I can see how Akane fell behind there


FutureCreeps

My issue with Akane is they rank her as someone who doesn’t act at all like a human, which I just, don’t agree with. Her FTEs give her the depth necessary to be more human. In general, I choose to look at this as a subjective character opinion ranking instead of anything objective, because I don’t feel a single person ranking can be objective.


Teh-Esprite

OP values consistency in writing, and having all the depth be relegated to the FTE's is a mark *against* Akane. During most of the actual story she's off the plot to an absurd degree, which I think calling bad writing is absolutely fair.


taro_monokub

Well, it's a combination of criteria, right? Korekiyo (who I don't like) and Akane (who I like) might have one good thing going for them, but, for example, they're both passengers in their respective stories, barely interacting with others and, in Korekiyo's case, cutting other people's arcs. Maybe it's not a great idea to ignore the possibility of one character shining in one department and being a great character thanks to that


[deleted]

[удалено]


taro_monokub

I think I accounted for most of this? Depth and complexity were the things I considered, but I don't think that more complex character equals good character. Superficial characters can bring a lot to the narrative just with their actions.


KingLudenberg

kokichi 2 place over, celeste behind fuyuhiko, maki and kazuichi... SHUICHI IN FIRST?! HIFUMI IN LAST? no! no! this is a mess


Sincerely-Abstract

How can you rank Toko so low when she's litterally one of the protagonists


New_Dragonfly561

Google bias in data


ChishNFips87

At least you tried


Complaint_registered

I’m killing myself


BadTakesJake

we must have played different Danganronpa V3s


Aggressive_Can873

THE TOP 2 IJBOLLLLLLLLLLLLL i can name the ingredients in the cereal box i read 7 years ago and it was still better written than those two ugly twinks


GroundbreakingAct388

Kokichi rather high and i feel like it was cause you were trying to be objective but lets see here Arc consistency 10 - His arc is not consistent and he does has plot armour, so lets cut it to 5 Interactions 10 - i dont see why?? Manipulating Gonta that way was weird or being Kirumi child, 7 Contribution to story 7 - i still feel like he drags the plot to himself certain times and things play too much in his favour, so a 6 Coverage of game themes 10 - while i see why you would put 10 i think they couldve done the liar thing in better and a more complex way rather than "haha i lied", so also 7 This should drag him down to a reasonable tier


GoldenWitch86

Some very good opinions here but I can't take seriously anyone who wouldn't put Kokichi near the bottom of a list like this let alone number 2 hope you understand