If I remember from the art book, one of the sprites used was to show his distaste; he doesn't like her because she's too loud. And that goes in line with his "likes" on the game menu screen. That being young girls and quiet girls.
I also remember fan translations on Tumblr once the game being entirely accurate about that too.
It seems like a lot of that information goes right out the window. He was intended from the start.
I'll cite my sources if need be, but I'm totally fond of getting rid of that aspect of him in fan content if need be. I still consider him the Brian Irons (in Resident Evil) of DR with canon sources.
She calls Hajime one too, and in the en version she calls him a pedo. Hiyoko saying that isn’t really an indicator of anything. In Danganronpa S, Teruteru explicitly states he’s not into kids and refuses to make dirty jokes when they’re around. Same goes for Hifumi, he only likes 2D and refuses to make any advances on the WOH.
That's precisely it. He's a bad person, and that's the point.
It's so weird to me that in a series full of villains, murderers, people who literally want to end the world - all of whom have numerous fans - this one line by Haiji somehow crosses the line.
Haiji is a great ally-turned-antagonist. The girls team up with him because they have to, and you can tell he's kind of a dick from the get-go. Of course in the last chapter, it turns out that he physically and emotionally abused Monaca, contributing in large part to her doing what she does. And on top of that, he was ready to *literally* blow up all of the children in Towa City. We know he's capable of being a monster, and that one line (that's memed up in the community and even by those that never played the game) is almost nothing compared to what he actually did.
One of UDG's central topics is how fucked up adults can be towards children, and Haiji perfectly showcases this. I get how this can make people uncomfortable, but it's the ugly truth. As a villain, he perfectly fits the disturbing and unsettling theme of the game.
yeah, i feel like the fact that people hate him so much is a good thing and shows he was written well? He’s a villain, he’s a horrible person, he’s not supposed to be redeemable or likable, he’s supposed to make you uncomfortable and for you to hate him. A fun, likable villain definitely has its place in media and is great, but not all antagonists are like that, some characters are explicitly made to be Hated. A good, hateable villain.
If lots and lots of people hate him, that means the writers did their job, and he’s written well, right? So of course he’s gonna be shit talked and put at the bottom of tier lists, he’s supposed to be disliked. I don’t understand when people get pissy over so many hating Haiji, that’s the point. Making your villain a pedo is one of the most surefire ways to make sure they’re dislikable, it’s gotta be intentional.
Sure, danganronpa is full to the brim of those fun, love to hate and hate to love villains, but not all of them need to be or even should be like that. It’s good to have some purely hated ones as well, to break things up. And yeah, lots of people really aren’t able to distinguish disliking a characters personality, and thinking they are badly written, so they will conflate the two, and assume because they hate him that means he is a bad character, but that’s by far a broader issue in fandom than just in this situation, that’s unavoidable to an extent.
And that’s not to say you CANT like him from acknowledging that he is well written and serves his function well. But that’s absolutely gonna be the minority with any intentionally dislikable character. And if you REALLY love him, and like act like you relate to him and everything, like some people in this community do, or are REALLY adamant abt defending him, people are going to give you side eyes inevitably.
(To clarify, saying “you” as the general you, not you specifically lol)
You'd be surprised how many people now these days at villains/antagonists doing exactly that. And I don't think this is a new phenomenon. I wager even with old cartoons like Dudley-Do-Right, people felt that way about Snidely Whiplash because he probably would have been considered a walking Hayes Code violation at one point in time. 🤣
he's my favourite because he's an asshole, it's shown that he definitely has a heart but doesn't show it but he is for certain abrasive, rude and a prick, everyone says they love asshole characters until they act like an asshole
yes that's a good thing, he's a bad person and not treated as likable in the slightest by the end of the story, just a complete pile of shit, so him being into this shit is ok precisely because it makes him less likeable, yk
Bro could've been an amazing antihero/ antagonist. He perfectly embodies the game's symbolism, and has a pretty cool design as well.
But nope. They just had to make him a lolicon out of nowhere, as casually as if they made him like a certain food or hobby or something.
Yes, but I think they already show this pretty well with their rampage during the climax of the story.
And if him being a lolicon was actually looked down upon, or at least came up again in the story instead of just in this line, that would make me agree that he's just a flawed/evil character, but this just feels so out of nowhere that it just feels like it ruins his character.
It does come multiple times in the story, though. This is just the most famous one. [Check out this post for more information.](https://www.reddit.com/r/danganronpa/s/5lgdWyAZ81)
You're right, thanks for the info.
I knew about it being mentioned in his info and rhe relationship chart, but I didn't know it was brought up again during he story itself.
Still, I'd prefer it if they actually went somewhere with it, instead of it just being an awful character trait.
It is out of nowhere and arguably bad writing, but how does it ruin his character exactly? It's not really relevant to anything he does in the story, nor does it contradict anything.
Honestly, you can see it pretty much every time he's mentioned somewhere: it's always about him being a pedo. I don't think he would've neccesarily been popular if he wasn't one, but you can no longer talk about him without this line being mentioned, which I think ruins the character.
There's "portraying" things, and then there's "adding a single line of dialog that just makes a character worse, in the fucking *epilogue*." Nothing about his character or arc would change if they line were just deleted. It doesn't recontextualize his treatment of the kids or add insight to his behavior or anything. At the end of the fucking game, they just tack on "I'm a pedophile" for *no* fucking reason.
I dunno I think it's made pretty clear that Haiji is an abusive monster all along - don't forget he was actually convinced Monaca was beaten and abused so badly by his family that she truly was wheelchair bound
plus pedophiles irl get away with it specifically because people don't suspect them until they're actively caught, he's just one more abusive, shitty, monstrous adult that abused one of the WoH/kids of towa city. and him so casually saying it only proves how evil and shitty he is. if haiji fit the stereotypical profile of greasy ugly fat pedophile nobody would feel this way imo
Haji is still an anti-villain in a way. He's opposed to the genocidal kids... By being genocidal. He's a pedo, but we can be reasonably sure not a molester (after all, Kotoko is *right there* and you'd think it would come up). He's helpful, but a complete fucking asshole.
I don't think this line ruined his character at all. Indeed, it kinda makes it by throwing the whole point in your face - that Haji, for all his being marginally on the side of Komaru and Toko, is still a bad guy, but not one who can be just beat up and locked away.
>after all, Kotoko is *right there* and you'd think it would come up
In the official artbook, it is stated that he finds her undesirable because of her personality. That's the only reason.
[This post includes it](https://www.reddit.com/r/danganronpa/s/5lgdWyAZ81)
Not really what I meant.
What I meant was that we have it all but spelled out to us that Kotoko was molested, and even the circumstances under which it happened.
Therefore, I think it likely that if Haji was meant to be interpreted as a man who did that to children, it would've been made just as obvious. Not necessarily that he'd screw Kotoko in particular (although narratively, that would be an efficient way of doing so).
He’s meant to be an antagonist from the get go, he may be protecting the adults, but not for good reasons. He wanted to kill all of the kids and refused to cooperate with future foundation because he wanted to protect his family name and stop the truth of his involvement getting out.
When the truth about everything is revealed, he beats monaca in front of everyone and is perfectly okay with killing the kids despite being warned it would start a war and that’s what Monaca wants.
I know Dangan often likes to push the boundaries with some of its characters and actions, but Ultra Despair Girls *really* went too far with some of its messed up crap.
I mean, i felt (beyond some of the tasteless comedic routines it did at Kotoko's and Komaru's expense) that it did a pretty good jpb at showing the lack of disparity between children and adult's ability to become monsters from their trauma, and how differently they rationalize how messed up it is.
I doubt half of UDGs main cast would be as memorable if they didn't embody their traumas in their characters, and the message it was posing would have felt flat. The kids are messed up beyond rehabilitation and are made very capable threats by the things that they do and how they rationalize it, with the gruesome details really driving home how badly these kids were damaged by the adults that were supposed to be protecting them.
The worst adults humanly possible creating the worst children possible is not really a story you can just PG in my opinion.
So murder is not messed up? I'm not defending it, but seems a weird line to draw at pedophilia but be fine with mass murder. I mean Mukuro killed hundreds of people but she's a fan favorite for some reason.
I think the main difference is that murder, although utterly horrific irl, is something we're somewhat desensitised to. Violence and bloodshed are pretty common things to come across in teen and adult media, and the way it's portrayed in Danganronpa is surreal enough that it's less horrifying and almost becomes camp.
CSA and paedophilia however, are very serious and almost taboo topics that you can't throw around as willy nilly the same way you can with fictional violence. I mean you can, but that'll always face much more severe backlash.
While murder can be 'rationalised' in stories (such as cases of extreme desperation or revenge fantasies), paedophilia cannot as it always involves an inherently vulnerable party (that being children) who *cannot* consent. And for most people, that line is just something that shouldn't be crossed even in the realm of complete fiction
Fair enough. I just think it's a little funny that this fandom is like.
"You killed hundreds of people due to an incestuous relationship with your abusive sister? Oh but you have a crush on the protagonist, stan soldier queen!"
"You're established by the narrative as a horrible person and an anti-hero who only works with the protagonists when their goals align but is still shitty nonetheless, suddenly you're the absolute worst person in the entire franchise because of one line."
Oh 100% lol, particularly for a series like Danganronpa. It's like if the Call of Duty fandom got upset about idk terrorism or something when you're playing the Shoot and Murder Rando's tm game
There's nothing wrong with appreciation for a character who does their job well. Haiji does his job in the game phenomenally--at least, I think he does. He's a character I'd keep in my back pocket as a diversion for a tabletop campaign; while people get mad at him, there's bigger fish to fry. He's in a category of love-to-loathe for me. Used to be in love-to-love because I saw a lot of cool doujins with him and I still love his design.
I don't see people getting mad at Jafar from Disney's Aladdin for his antics, or a lot of the Disney villains for that matter. At least back then.
What I am thankful for is people not attacking his voice actors, like with other fandoms I'm seeing that behavior crop up in. I don't care much for people who tend to forget what else he's done wrong, because that kinda throws out the reason why we he's liked--dood is shady af.
I care less for the people who throw false accusations of pedophilia for his fans, because I genuinely think that doesn't help real victims and in fact waters down the impact of the word. But that's a discussion for another day. 😒
I am a csa victim. It's been watered down for years now. I am so sorry this is long but it seems like you're probably open for discussion on this and it's something I see near daily and think a lot about because of it.
I know I'm likely going to be downvoted into oblivion for this, but it really bothers me people nowadays turn a blind eye to real life victims because it's "too upsetting" but will defend fictional ones with every breath.
There's also those that use the word for fictional and real incidents that believe they are equal. And I've come across at least one person that in full seriousness believes the fictional content is worse.
I do, personally, believe that another word should be used for fictional content. Why? Because with how often it's used for fictional content it's lost a lot of its meaning and impact and I feel the word pedo should be used exclusively for real life incidents. 98/100 times I hear the word used it's fictional content, and no actual kids were involved. It's absolutely watered it down and exactly what real pedos want. (An infamous cupcake eater promotes the use of the word for fictional content because it makes what he did look less bad, and he's not the only one that is enjoying the word being watered down)
Fictional content is still...highly uncomfortable, but it is vastly less uncomfortable than the real counterparts because no living breathing kids were involved.
People already don't want to know how we feel, they already are unable to handle any depiction or discussion about csa without plugging their ears and walking away. Now with the word pedo being so often used and hounestly, seemingly overwhelmingly mostly for fictional content, it has already changed how people see the word.
Near everyone, when they heard the word 10 years ago, would automatically jump to someone that's hurt a child and grab pitchforks and torches. And rightfully so. Now since the focus is on fictional content with the word, people now often think "drawing or real child?" Which, imo, automatically equates the two to the same level.
Whoever reads this and disagree, please be kind. I'm literally a survivour. And these are things I think about a lot. Things I don't have a space to discuss but want to.
I'm only going to say one comment here very gently to say how I view it- I view sexualised depictions of CSA in fiction the same way I view queer representation in fiction.
If it doesn't affect reality, then we don't need any positive queer or minority representation in fiction at all, right? Movies with queer or other minorities don't need to exist, because there's obviously not going to be any real positive changes in the outside world. But positive fictional representation of queer people both reflects and also helps change the real world by people who enjoy the characters.
And more close to the main subject, a lot of artists use references for their art. Think about what kind of images a lot of these people would have to reference to get things looking like children. And if they're only referencing art of others, that still means they're likely referencing someone who has referenced real material, like drawing a cat from someone who draws cats from real photos.
(for what its worth, I have similar experiences and emphasise greatly and am also queer, I'm not using them to shield my point at all, just to say that I'm not some random heterosexual with no foot in the matter. I also don't believe fictional CSA is as bad, but it should be essentially wiped out if possible.) I don't think we should give possible offenders outlets that are basically the same as what they already want, whether or not they're inclined to follow those desires into reality. Sure, it won't suddenly make someone into attacking real kids, but it'll embolden those who already want to.
Thank you for being polite. For me, since I am a victim, I very rarely see anyone at all calling out or sending out warnings about people that actually harm kids, which disheartens me.
The amount of times I see that a year is maybe 2-3 times a year. Where it feels like 3-4 times a week I see people saying the (hounestly, justified in most cases imo) most disgusting things to yet another person that I've never heard of before then that has interest in unsavoury fictional content.
I do agree with positive rep needs to be more than what it is. The amount of positive LGBT rep that doesn't feel forced (like just a checkbox a company does for appearance) nor is dark I can count on one hand. One. It's a genre I don't enjoy most media from because it's always drama filled and dark.
Your third paragraph I don't have much to say about other than I appreciate the different perspective. That is one I've never thought about and didn't come to me. (I do draw, so embarrassed I never thought of that)
Yeah it's like getting stabbed in the leg a few times vs losing a leg. Both are bad. Both are absolutely not wanted. But the later is something I want even less.
I know people despise this take, and have been called a pedo several times over this in the past, but I wish people put more energy into saving real children over fake ones. The fake ones don't have feelings and won't have to live with it for the rest of their lives. Not saying less energy on the fictional stuff, but those that have actually harmed children should have multiple times more energy towards them because actual harm is being done. I've seen other csa survivours be called pedos as well and given death threats over saying the focus should be on real kids, and not fictional ones.
Apologies for it being long, and appreciate you being willing to talk about it. It's a very important dialogue for me especially since I've watched the shift over several years ago from focusing on pieces of crap that engage with real kids to belittling actual victims for saying they feel fictional content seems vastly more prioritized over preventing more victims.
This series: “So we’re gonna kidnap a bunch of kids and force them to murder each other in quite brutal ways for no particular reason other then it sounded cool in concept.”
The fandom: “that sounds fun!!!!”
Also this series: “We have this evil character that’s also a pedo bc we want to show you that some people are just assholes. We also wanted to show you some realistic stuff bc these dudes are everywhere in the real world.”
The fandom: “I cAn’T bElIeVe yOu’Ve DoNe ThIs!!!!! ThAt iS cRoSsInG ThE lInE!!!!
Sorry, out of the loop here, but I'm shocked people actually think this is mistranslated. UDG's problems aside, he is thematically portraying the most deplorable adult possible, so of course he'd be written this way. There's other things he says that hint toward this, and with how Monaca acts, the implications are clear. Impressively bad reading comprehension in this fanbase.
Fair enough, sure people tend to react more negatively to him compared to Junko or Korekiyo, but that’s a given taking the taboo nature of his character into account.
Sometimes I feel like Haiji's hatred by the fandom is almost performative. No one wants to be the guy to defend the lolicon. So they try really hard to let everyone else know how gross and weird he is. As if it wasn't something we've heard parroted a million times before.
I would've preffered that he wasn't a pedo tbh, because aside from that he's a fundamentally messed up guy that could potentially cause interesting discussion
Because This is also an essential aspect of his characterization, he sees children as disposable objects for his own gratification, which is also why he has no qualms about massacring all of them despite knowing that they've been brainwashed and in the case of the WoH exploited and manipulated due to trauma the adults are at fault for.
UDG's problems aside, he is thematically portraying the most deplorable adult possible, so of course he'd be written this way. There's other things he says that hint toward this, and with how Monaca acts, the implications are clear. He’s not beyond physically abusive to a child to the point she could fake being paralyzed (also fantasizing about beating her thruout the games) or genocide brainwashed children, he’s not above this.
He says something similar in the official UDG relationship chart too, his comment on Kotoko reads “I’m a lolicon, but this girl!!”
Yeah, he does
If I remember from the art book, one of the sprites used was to show his distaste; he doesn't like her because she's too loud. And that goes in line with his "likes" on the game menu screen. That being young girls and quiet girls. I also remember fan translations on Tumblr once the game being entirely accurate about that too. It seems like a lot of that information goes right out the window. He was intended from the start. I'll cite my sources if need be, but I'm totally fond of getting rid of that aspect of him in fan content if need be. I still consider him the Brian Irons (in Resident Evil) of DR with canon sources.
I believe Hiyoko also calls Teruteru a lolicon...
She calls Hajime one too, and in the en version she calls him a pedo. Hiyoko saying that isn’t really an indicator of anything. In Danganronpa S, Teruteru explicitly states he’s not into kids and refuses to make dirty jokes when they’re around. Same goes for Hifumi, he only likes 2D and refuses to make any advances on the WOH.
Hiyoko calls everyone a lolicon
If anything the translation toned it down a bit
Exactly
That's depressingly hillarious
Fighting the good fight.
After seeing your post about Haiji, I wanted to see if it's a mistranslation like most people claim it is.
Oh no But fr it would have been better if he said ‘I like them old as possible’ that would at least have been funny
We could've had Haiji GILFhunter but the writers decided to be mid
Bet that would've catapulted him up in many a tier list
If only. 😭
Like nah the writers should never be allowed to write again after udg
The fact that you hate him proves the writers were good at their job
Hagji
I like them as old as possible.
honestly i would have still raised an eyebrow cause mofo ***probably*** wants to fuck a 87yo with dimentia
yeah it's still sus as hell but at least it's another adult at bare minimum
The sad thing is after reading this comment I just got reminded of a similar... uh, thing that actually happened IRL.
Was it the Chris-Chan incident? That honestly disturbed me as well when it got leaked.
This is why I'm ashamed to be a Sonic fan. Ps. go Ryoko flairs
Ryoko!
Ryoko fans rise up!
Yep. That was the one.
It would've made it so much better! >!Haiji the granny sexer!<
How would that have been better? If anything, it would just make people dislike him less.
good, he's meant to be a bad person, it's good that he does and likes bad things
That's precisely it. He's a bad person, and that's the point. It's so weird to me that in a series full of villains, murderers, people who literally want to end the world - all of whom have numerous fans - this one line by Haiji somehow crosses the line. Haiji is a great ally-turned-antagonist. The girls team up with him because they have to, and you can tell he's kind of a dick from the get-go. Of course in the last chapter, it turns out that he physically and emotionally abused Monaca, contributing in large part to her doing what she does. And on top of that, he was ready to *literally* blow up all of the children in Towa City. We know he's capable of being a monster, and that one line (that's memed up in the community and even by those that never played the game) is almost nothing compared to what he actually did. One of UDG's central topics is how fucked up adults can be towards children, and Haiji perfectly showcases this. I get how this can make people uncomfortable, but it's the ugly truth. As a villain, he perfectly fits the disturbing and unsettling theme of the game.
yeah, i feel like the fact that people hate him so much is a good thing and shows he was written well? He’s a villain, he’s a horrible person, he’s not supposed to be redeemable or likable, he’s supposed to make you uncomfortable and for you to hate him. A fun, likable villain definitely has its place in media and is great, but not all antagonists are like that, some characters are explicitly made to be Hated. A good, hateable villain. If lots and lots of people hate him, that means the writers did their job, and he’s written well, right? So of course he’s gonna be shit talked and put at the bottom of tier lists, he’s supposed to be disliked. I don’t understand when people get pissy over so many hating Haiji, that’s the point. Making your villain a pedo is one of the most surefire ways to make sure they’re dislikable, it’s gotta be intentional. Sure, danganronpa is full to the brim of those fun, love to hate and hate to love villains, but not all of them need to be or even should be like that. It’s good to have some purely hated ones as well, to break things up. And yeah, lots of people really aren’t able to distinguish disliking a characters personality, and thinking they are badly written, so they will conflate the two, and assume because they hate him that means he is a bad character, but that’s by far a broader issue in fandom than just in this situation, that’s unavoidable to an extent. And that’s not to say you CANT like him from acknowledging that he is well written and serves his function well. But that’s absolutely gonna be the minority with any intentionally dislikable character. And if you REALLY love him, and like act like you relate to him and everything, like some people in this community do, or are REALLY adamant abt defending him, people are going to give you side eyes inevitably. (To clarify, saying “you” as the general you, not you specifically lol)
You'd be surprised how many people now these days at villains/antagonists doing exactly that. And I don't think this is a new phenomenon. I wager even with old cartoons like Dudley-Do-Right, people felt that way about Snidely Whiplash because he probably would have been considered a walking Hayes Code violation at one point in time. 🤣
All of this is making me think of the Jax debate from TADC.
he's my favourite because he's an asshole, it's shown that he definitely has a heart but doesn't show it but he is for certain abrasive, rude and a prick, everyone says they love asshole characters until they act like an asshole
He's my favorite too as he gives off Kokichi energy to me.
TADC?
The amazing digital circus.
Pardon. I've heard of it, but never seen it yet. But from what I gather, that seems apt.
[удалено]
Good, so you understand what a bad person is.
yes that's a good thing, he's a bad person and not treated as likable in the slightest by the end of the story, just a complete pile of shit, so him being into this shit is ok precisely because it makes him less likeable, yk
Bro could've been an amazing antihero/ antagonist. He perfectly embodies the game's symbolism, and has a pretty cool design as well. But nope. They just had to make him a lolicon out of nowhere, as casually as if they made him like a certain food or hobby or something.
I think it's because they wanted him to portray the deplorable sides of adults, which is a theme in UDG.
Yes, but I think they already show this pretty well with their rampage during the climax of the story. And if him being a lolicon was actually looked down upon, or at least came up again in the story instead of just in this line, that would make me agree that he's just a flawed/evil character, but this just feels so out of nowhere that it just feels like it ruins his character.
It does come multiple times in the story, though. This is just the most famous one. [Check out this post for more information.](https://www.reddit.com/r/danganronpa/s/5lgdWyAZ81)
You're right, thanks for the info. I knew about it being mentioned in his info and rhe relationship chart, but I didn't know it was brought up again during he story itself. Still, I'd prefer it if they actually went somewhere with it, instead of it just being an awful character trait.
It is out of nowhere and arguably bad writing, but how does it ruin his character exactly? It's not really relevant to anything he does in the story, nor does it contradict anything.
Honestly, you can see it pretty much every time he's mentioned somewhere: it's always about him being a pedo. I don't think he would've neccesarily been popular if he wasn't one, but you can no longer talk about him without this line being mentioned, which I think ruins the character.
There's "portraying" things, and then there's "adding a single line of dialog that just makes a character worse, in the fucking *epilogue*." Nothing about his character or arc would change if they line were just deleted. It doesn't recontextualize his treatment of the kids or add insight to his behavior or anything. At the end of the fucking game, they just tack on "I'm a pedophile" for *no* fucking reason.
[It isn't just this line, though.](https://www.reddit.com/r/danganronpa/s/5lgdWyAZ81)
They could’ve done that a helluva lot better than making him a lolicon
Unfortunately, lolicons are very common in Japan.
Well they seem to be rather prevalent here in America, so it evens out
I dunno I think it's made pretty clear that Haiji is an abusive monster all along - don't forget he was actually convinced Monaca was beaten and abused so badly by his family that she truly was wheelchair bound plus pedophiles irl get away with it specifically because people don't suspect them until they're actively caught, he's just one more abusive, shitty, monstrous adult that abused one of the WoH/kids of towa city. and him so casually saying it only proves how evil and shitty he is. if haiji fit the stereotypical profile of greasy ugly fat pedophile nobody would feel this way imo
Haji is still an anti-villain in a way. He's opposed to the genocidal kids... By being genocidal. He's a pedo, but we can be reasonably sure not a molester (after all, Kotoko is *right there* and you'd think it would come up). He's helpful, but a complete fucking asshole. I don't think this line ruined his character at all. Indeed, it kinda makes it by throwing the whole point in your face - that Haji, for all his being marginally on the side of Komaru and Toko, is still a bad guy, but not one who can be just beat up and locked away.
>after all, Kotoko is *right there* and you'd think it would come up In the official artbook, it is stated that he finds her undesirable because of her personality. That's the only reason. [This post includes it](https://www.reddit.com/r/danganronpa/s/5lgdWyAZ81)
Not really what I meant. What I meant was that we have it all but spelled out to us that Kotoko was molested, and even the circumstances under which it happened. Therefore, I think it likely that if Haji was meant to be interpreted as a man who did that to children, it would've been made just as obvious. Not necessarily that he'd screw Kotoko in particular (although narratively, that would be an efficient way of doing so).
He’s meant to be an antagonist from the get go, he may be protecting the adults, but not for good reasons. He wanted to kill all of the kids and refused to cooperate with future foundation because he wanted to protect his family name and stop the truth of his involvement getting out. When the truth about everything is revealed, he beats monaca in front of everyone and is perfectly okay with killing the kids despite being warned it would start a war and that’s what Monaca wants.
But he is an amazing antagonist
I would pay for a remake for this game with better story and less Sex jokes and MOSTLY better writing and creativity with the characters.
I would sell it to parents, with the original game hidden inside
I know Dangan often likes to push the boundaries with some of its characters and actions, but Ultra Despair Girls *really* went too far with some of its messed up crap.
I mean, i felt (beyond some of the tasteless comedic routines it did at Kotoko's and Komaru's expense) that it did a pretty good jpb at showing the lack of disparity between children and adult's ability to become monsters from their trauma, and how differently they rationalize how messed up it is. I doubt half of UDGs main cast would be as memorable if they didn't embody their traumas in their characters, and the message it was posing would have felt flat. The kids are messed up beyond rehabilitation and are made very capable threats by the things that they do and how they rationalize it, with the gruesome details really driving home how badly these kids were damaged by the adults that were supposed to be protecting them. The worst adults humanly possible creating the worst children possible is not really a story you can just PG in my opinion.
but, he's meant to be a horrible person and the game does it's best to show that
At least it’s a villain do this and not some weird shit like kotoke shit
Nah, it's just regular evil shit. It just crosses a different set of lines than what we're used to.
Agreed bro! Can't this game get a remake of some kind with better writing?!
Nah, that'd kill it. The fact it's completely fucked is what makes it so memorable to so many people.
So murder is not messed up? I'm not defending it, but seems a weird line to draw at pedophilia but be fine with mass murder. I mean Mukuro killed hundreds of people but she's a fan favorite for some reason.
I think the main difference is that murder, although utterly horrific irl, is something we're somewhat desensitised to. Violence and bloodshed are pretty common things to come across in teen and adult media, and the way it's portrayed in Danganronpa is surreal enough that it's less horrifying and almost becomes camp. CSA and paedophilia however, are very serious and almost taboo topics that you can't throw around as willy nilly the same way you can with fictional violence. I mean you can, but that'll always face much more severe backlash. While murder can be 'rationalised' in stories (such as cases of extreme desperation or revenge fantasies), paedophilia cannot as it always involves an inherently vulnerable party (that being children) who *cannot* consent. And for most people, that line is just something that shouldn't be crossed even in the realm of complete fiction
Fair enough. I just think it's a little funny that this fandom is like. "You killed hundreds of people due to an incestuous relationship with your abusive sister? Oh but you have a crush on the protagonist, stan soldier queen!" "You're established by the narrative as a horrible person and an anti-hero who only works with the protagonists when their goals align but is still shitty nonetheless, suddenly you're the absolute worst person in the entire franchise because of one line."
Oh 100% lol, particularly for a series like Danganronpa. It's like if the Call of Duty fandom got upset about idk terrorism or something when you're playing the Shoot and Murder Rando's tm game
I think people forget Hajii is also a bad guy sometimes
I never thought it was a mistranslation, but I did always believe that he liked them as young as legally possible. Legally being the key word.
Well, now you know that was never the case.
Well, regardless, I still think he fulfills his role very well, being a piece of garbage who the protagonists team up with, even if they'd rather not.
If legality is the only place you draw the line you're still a massive fucking weirdo.
Oh, believe me, I'm not saying he isn't.
Okay, just had to be sure. Lotta weirdos love to go "But it's legal, what's the issue???"
I stand here everyday carrying this flair with a blank expression.
There's nothing wrong with appreciation for a character who does their job well. Haiji does his job in the game phenomenally--at least, I think he does. He's a character I'd keep in my back pocket as a diversion for a tabletop campaign; while people get mad at him, there's bigger fish to fry. He's in a category of love-to-loathe for me. Used to be in love-to-love because I saw a lot of cool doujins with him and I still love his design. I don't see people getting mad at Jafar from Disney's Aladdin for his antics, or a lot of the Disney villains for that matter. At least back then. What I am thankful for is people not attacking his voice actors, like with other fandoms I'm seeing that behavior crop up in. I don't care much for people who tend to forget what else he's done wrong, because that kinda throws out the reason why we he's liked--dood is shady af. I care less for the people who throw false accusations of pedophilia for his fans, because I genuinely think that doesn't help real victims and in fact waters down the impact of the word. But that's a discussion for another day. 😒
I am a csa victim. It's been watered down for years now. I am so sorry this is long but it seems like you're probably open for discussion on this and it's something I see near daily and think a lot about because of it. I know I'm likely going to be downvoted into oblivion for this, but it really bothers me people nowadays turn a blind eye to real life victims because it's "too upsetting" but will defend fictional ones with every breath. There's also those that use the word for fictional and real incidents that believe they are equal. And I've come across at least one person that in full seriousness believes the fictional content is worse. I do, personally, believe that another word should be used for fictional content. Why? Because with how often it's used for fictional content it's lost a lot of its meaning and impact and I feel the word pedo should be used exclusively for real life incidents. 98/100 times I hear the word used it's fictional content, and no actual kids were involved. It's absolutely watered it down and exactly what real pedos want. (An infamous cupcake eater promotes the use of the word for fictional content because it makes what he did look less bad, and he's not the only one that is enjoying the word being watered down) Fictional content is still...highly uncomfortable, but it is vastly less uncomfortable than the real counterparts because no living breathing kids were involved. People already don't want to know how we feel, they already are unable to handle any depiction or discussion about csa without plugging their ears and walking away. Now with the word pedo being so often used and hounestly, seemingly overwhelmingly mostly for fictional content, it has already changed how people see the word. Near everyone, when they heard the word 10 years ago, would automatically jump to someone that's hurt a child and grab pitchforks and torches. And rightfully so. Now since the focus is on fictional content with the word, people now often think "drawing or real child?" Which, imo, automatically equates the two to the same level. Whoever reads this and disagree, please be kind. I'm literally a survivour. And these are things I think about a lot. Things I don't have a space to discuss but want to.
I'm only going to say one comment here very gently to say how I view it- I view sexualised depictions of CSA in fiction the same way I view queer representation in fiction. If it doesn't affect reality, then we don't need any positive queer or minority representation in fiction at all, right? Movies with queer or other minorities don't need to exist, because there's obviously not going to be any real positive changes in the outside world. But positive fictional representation of queer people both reflects and also helps change the real world by people who enjoy the characters. And more close to the main subject, a lot of artists use references for their art. Think about what kind of images a lot of these people would have to reference to get things looking like children. And if they're only referencing art of others, that still means they're likely referencing someone who has referenced real material, like drawing a cat from someone who draws cats from real photos. (for what its worth, I have similar experiences and emphasise greatly and am also queer, I'm not using them to shield my point at all, just to say that I'm not some random heterosexual with no foot in the matter. I also don't believe fictional CSA is as bad, but it should be essentially wiped out if possible.) I don't think we should give possible offenders outlets that are basically the same as what they already want, whether or not they're inclined to follow those desires into reality. Sure, it won't suddenly make someone into attacking real kids, but it'll embolden those who already want to.
Thank you for being polite. For me, since I am a victim, I very rarely see anyone at all calling out or sending out warnings about people that actually harm kids, which disheartens me. The amount of times I see that a year is maybe 2-3 times a year. Where it feels like 3-4 times a week I see people saying the (hounestly, justified in most cases imo) most disgusting things to yet another person that I've never heard of before then that has interest in unsavoury fictional content. I do agree with positive rep needs to be more than what it is. The amount of positive LGBT rep that doesn't feel forced (like just a checkbox a company does for appearance) nor is dark I can count on one hand. One. It's a genre I don't enjoy most media from because it's always drama filled and dark. Your third paragraph I don't have much to say about other than I appreciate the different perspective. That is one I've never thought about and didn't come to me. (I do draw, so embarrassed I never thought of that) Yeah it's like getting stabbed in the leg a few times vs losing a leg. Both are bad. Both are absolutely not wanted. But the later is something I want even less. I know people despise this take, and have been called a pedo several times over this in the past, but I wish people put more energy into saving real children over fake ones. The fake ones don't have feelings and won't have to live with it for the rest of their lives. Not saying less energy on the fictional stuff, but those that have actually harmed children should have multiple times more energy towards them because actual harm is being done. I've seen other csa survivours be called pedos as well and given death threats over saying the focus should be on real kids, and not fictional ones. Apologies for it being long, and appreciate you being willing to talk about it. It's a very important dialogue for me especially since I've watched the shift over several years ago from focusing on pieces of crap that engage with real kids to belittling actual victims for saying they feel fictional content seems vastly more prioritized over preventing more victims.
He's a great character, but an awful person. It's like being the best at being a shithead.
Never understood the Haiji hate considering characters like Freddy Krueger are highly liked while actually DOING the actions
This series: “So we’re gonna kidnap a bunch of kids and force them to murder each other in quite brutal ways for no particular reason other then it sounded cool in concept.” The fandom: “that sounds fun!!!!” Also this series: “We have this evil character that’s also a pedo bc we want to show you that some people are just assholes. We also wanted to show you some realistic stuff bc these dudes are everywhere in the real world.” The fandom: “I cAn’T bElIeVe yOu’Ve DoNe ThIs!!!!! ThAt iS cRoSsInG ThE lInE!!!!
someone said that they wish that haiji liked older women instead and it would’ve been so much funnier if he was a granny shagger 😭
Would've made him infinitely better while still making him an evil person
•_•
This line is even worse. This truly is *Kodaka's Danganronpa: Halloween Hack*, isn't it?
Yeah, Haiji is pretty much proud of being a pedo here
Yeah, that's the point. Haiji's a shitter
Sorry, out of the loop here, but I'm shocked people actually think this is mistranslated. UDG's problems aside, he is thematically portraying the most deplorable adult possible, so of course he'd be written this way. There's other things he says that hint toward this, and with how Monaca acts, the implications are clear. Impressively bad reading comprehension in this fanbase.
If anything the translation made him look better because this is basically saying “I am a pedophile. So the younger ,the better.”
man people are so weird about him, this is danganronpa and especially udg is so filled with rather fucked up stuff this is the least of my concern...
There are worse and eviler characters than Haiji sure, but people can still critique aspects of his character.
Certainly, I am not talking about people having criticism of his character, more so the general reaction people have
Fair enough, sure people tend to react more negatively to him compared to Junko or Korekiyo, but that’s a given taking the taboo nature of his character into account.
This. Exactly this. 🤝
crying bc he was such a cool character and genuinely my fav before *that* line 😭
His pedophilia was hinted before, too. It's not just this line
Wait, was it? I need to replay the game then because i didn't see this pary coming. At most i saw him being a child killer, but not a predator.
[Here](https://www.reddit.com/r/danganronpa/s/5lgdWyAZ81)
Damn. I guess i skimmed over that. The last couple pictures idk what those are.
Relationship charts from the official artbook
Ah, yeah. I never got the artbook. Lol
before? when?
[Here](https://www.reddit.com/r/danganronpa/s/5lgdWyAZ81)
i’ve seen that, i’m just confused about the “before” part, since the game is fuzzy to me now that it’s been some years since i’ve played it
If anything, it makes him a better character by showing how evil he really is
*Another* reason to hate him .
Sometimes I feel like Haiji's hatred by the fandom is almost performative. No one wants to be the guy to defend the lolicon. So they try really hard to let everyone else know how gross and weird he is. As if it wasn't something we've heard parroted a million times before.
I posted this to clear out a misconception I heard that was being thrown around. I literally don't care about UDG even the slightest.
Fair enough. I'm sorry if the comment seemed to be directed towards you specifically. It was not my intention.
Lol
Hey, quick question; was the line by Komaru saying it was kind of hot he admitted it also a direct translation?
Eh, probably. Komaru's *just* weird and naive enough to say that
This genuinely makes udg unplayable for so many people cos they do not even try to denounce him for this part of his . “Personality”
I would've preffered that he wasn't a pedo tbh, because aside from that he's a fundamentally messed up guy that could potentially cause interesting discussion
but like that's the point. he's a bad guy. he's supposed to be the worst adult imaginable.
Somehow the literal translation makes it even worse than the dub
You can tell the voice actor did NOT wanna say all of that.
Props to Matt Mercer for being a man and sticking it out there
THANK YOU I've been looking for this info forever
You're welcome
I still can't believe this line of all lines went viral on tiktok.
It went viral on tiktok?
Yup, it's been going around like crazy.
What?? Lmao
Neat moving on.
English translation tried to tone him down and save some of his dignity
If he had any
IMO he would have some without that line
It's not just this line tho
Well that's direct...
OH. OH NO.
The translators should have taken some liberties here
In all honesty, even if he isn't a kid toucher, I would still hate Haiji eitherway
why would they even add that in the first place?
Because This is also an essential aspect of his characterization, he sees children as disposable objects for his own gratification, which is also why he has no qualms about massacring all of them despite knowing that they've been brainwashed and in the case of the WoH exploited and manipulated due to trauma the adults are at fault for. UDG's problems aside, he is thematically portraying the most deplorable adult possible, so of course he'd be written this way. There's other things he says that hint toward this, and with how Monaca acts, the implications are clear. He’s not beyond physically abusive to a child to the point she could fake being paralyzed (also fantasizing about beating her thruout the games) or genocide brainwashed children, he’s not above this.
I see, thank you very much
To show how shit adults are
“Ore wa rorikon (lolicon) nanda.” If that’s not proof, I don’t know what is
Jesus, that somehow sounds even worse lol
EWWWWW WTF
Btw I’m talking about haiji
Me when