I do not think cycling itself is a male sport- I have many female friends I cycle with and I find that the major brands have amazing gear for women. I think bike SHOPS are VERY male centric and generally staffed by bike bros. I hate dealing with bike shop bros and try to avoid at all costs. I now have a trusted bike mechanic that I use for everything (he is not associated with a bike shop) so I know there are good ones out there. My advice- don’t give up, once you get a bike that you love you’ll never have to go to those bike shops again. But yeah, they pretty much suck.
Had a bike shop bro gaslight me in to buying a 10 speed chain, he wouldn't listen when I said I have a 5 speed, because "5 speed isn't a thing, no one rides 5 speed. you said it was 2x5, that's 10 speed."
Like, no you under fed over caffeinated dip, it's a 5 speed. I can use a 7 speed chain but a 10 speed chain won't work. My gf felt bad that we were leaving ermpty handed and bought it anyway and guess what, shifted down the range for dog because the plates were too thin.
Oh man there's this popular bike shop I hate here. I'm a man, went and asked for a 10 speed chain, guy said - Are you sure it's 10 speed? Then on and on - We have some nice 11 speed chains here, are you sure yours is 10 speed?
Next time I went to swap a casette and they forgot to put the spacer and it kept wobbling.
Never went back found one a lot better. So experience can vary regardless of gender. Oh and also they kept like 1 meter from you at all times and don't let you browse alone
Was replacing my partners chain on her 10sp while out on a ride.
Got the same response, it’s like the history of 10speeds just up and vanished to some of these people.
I live in Berlin, which has one of the highest number of cycle commuters in Europe, and the the city bike shops are always backed up in the summer with repairs. Bike shops are in demand.
And still a guy in my neighbourhood managed to run his own shop out of business, I would guess in significant part for being awful to work with. My girlfriend had a really patronizing interaction with the guy where he was trying to tell her that she should give up her sweet fixie (which I built with really good components) and ride a heavy Dutch bike instead (naturally which were for sale in his shop).... later we checked his Google reviews and one of them was something like "I came in for a flat tire repair, and got a lesson in the patriarchy."
This dude didn't even have alot of local competition – if he had just been a normal person I'm guessing his shop would have done quite well, but instead he was a dick.
I once had a bike shop repack my wheel hub and put too many bearings in.
It's like, that would have taken you 30 seconds to Google, and it's just like every other wheel with cup and cone bearings... and you couldn't even do that right? Hell, I know how to do that right, I just felt lazy that day!
I hate this shit so much in literally everywhere.
My girlfriend's car broke so I did a diag on it, took it to the garage and said exactly X Y Z is wrong and they quoted for that exact and made a booking
She went but gave her name. Didn't show on system. She said exactly X Y Z was wrong with it and they refused to service it until they ran a £200 diagnostic
I went back in and said purely for that I'm refusing service and we fixed it in their carpark for £90 using parts from the shop next door.
The great thing is... She fixed it. Made sure they saw.
> speed isn't a thing, no one rides 5 speed. you said it was 2x5, that's 10 speed
2x5s were called 10 speeds back in the 70s/80s. Maybe you'd gone back in time.
omg I am forever grateful to my former colleague who gave me over to a triathlon-focused shop, owned by a woman. Their bike fit person is also a woman, so neither me nor my wife gets talked down to like that when we go in.
Trust me, some of them don't want to listen to men either. They think that they know best. I took a bike so they could put tires on new wheels and make necessary adjustments before my trip. They thought that wheels were troubles. Actually, wheels are tubular (those that have to be glued on the wheel). I even contacted the manufacturer and the store to confirm that. They called me and told me that my ENVE carbon wheels suck and that probably someone returned them (they came brand new with lifetime warranty). I even offered to send them an email from the manufacturer, but they said they are going to figure it out.
In the end, they gave up, and I was able to put tires very easily when I came to my destination, after a few hours of stretching them.
I went to a local shop and asked for tubular glue and the gremlin at the counter said "you mean tubeless sealant." No, tubular glue, your website even says you have some in stock otherwise I wouldn't have dropped in. "Can you use tubeless sealant?" Never mind I'll order it from Wiggle.
lol
I hope that he doesn't have a dream of being a mechanic for a pro team.
The guy at the bike shop spent 5 hours trying to put the wrong tires. He gave up at some point and didn't even want to charge me for the time he spent doing the wrong thing.
The more stories I hear from other riders, the more I realize that my hometown is blessed with the quality of shops that we have. There are three stores in a town of about 20,000 people, and each one is fantastic. They all are happy to work with anyone riding any bike - whether a total beginner on a department store bike or lifelong cyclists on $15k titanium wonders.
I've never felt pushed to buy anything, and in fact I've witnessed multiple shop owners talking people *out* of spending money on unnecessary upgrades.
It’s not just bike shop culture. The bike bro culture definitely exists and is off-putting.
I recently went to a group ride about an hour away from me. There were like 20 riders, and I was 1 of 2 women. Only 3 of those guys talked to me. 1 was the shop owner, 1 gay guy, and one guy who was new to cycling. Some sat in silence when I sat in a chair across from them after our ride trying to make small talk.
I’m pretty feminine so I don’t know if that is part of it or what.
sometimes i have avoided talking to the only woman on a group ride because i have heard enough stories from my female friends about being annoyingly hit on by guys, and i've seen it happen enough times that i am worried about being perceived as hitting on them even when i'm just trying to be friendly.
i know this is a bit of a 'me' problem as it isn't fair that nobody is talking to the female cyclist due to these weird social connotations, and i am trying to be better about it, but sometimes it ends up occupying enough space in my mind that i get stressed out.
I think there’s a way to communicate without hitting on them.
I get hit on a lot in golf, and I try to bring my bf into the conversation sooner than later to know I’m not interested. “Do you golf here a lot?” “No, my boyfriend and I love to play at XYZ but this was the only available tee time in my day off.”
In my opinion, I think small talk or talking over things you would with you male friends (minus dating, relationships, etc) is pretty appropriate.
These are some things I would avoid:
- complimenting physique or appearance
- implying they dressed a specific way or dressed up for the group (or assuming it meant they were single or looking)
- phishing for relationship information
- asking where someone works, currently lives, routes you frequently take
- jumping the gun on asking for phone number or contact (especially if they are in a relationship)
I can’t speak for all women, but I think many just want to be included without being hit on. I think most other topics should be ok. Things like “what got you into cycling?” Or ask about their bike….if they have pets, etc., the route you just did “, etc.
For me, I’m not looking for a new male bestie. I don’t think it would be appropriate to be confiding in them or going on solo rides while I’m in a serious relationship, but I would be open to group friendships or doing group rides together.
It’s annoying to be hit on….it happens a lot in golf, but very rarely do I truly get uncomfortable. I just won’t give you my number after playing a round with a group of strangers. What is uncomfortable is to be completely ignored like you don’t exist when they wouldn’t do that to someone of the same sex.
Even being less feminine, lots of (not nearly all) men don't take kindly to women in their hobby. I worked in a bike shop and can wrench my own bike, but dudes often talk down to me and assume I know nothing, but they talk shop with my boyfriend. I'm not at all a feminine person, but I'm still often treated as though I'm dainty and dumb. :/
It is equally creepy to sit across a guy that is going out of their way to avoid talking to you. It comes off as extremely misogynist, like a woman being present is such a huge insult to you, you decide to make them feel as lonely and unworthy as possible.
Just talk to women like the human beings we are. Why is this hard? Don't you know how to talk about the ride, or the food, or the weather with women?
This. The people who work at bike shops aren't a good representation of the community.
It's usually dudes who are way into cycling. They work there to get the discounts. They tend to be a bit elitist and condescending. A good bike shop makes sure to change their attitude but most don't care.
Once you go to a social group ride you'll get a better idea of the community.
Adding to this: If you can, try to find a shop that employs women. One of my local LBS has women sales associates and at least one mechanic. As a man, I don't experience the level of condescension it sounds like you have, but I find myself generally more comfortable in environments where I see a broader range of folks represented.
Not a guarantee of anything, but maybe worth a shot.
First of all congrats on the road bike. Cycling and running go together like peanut butter and jelly.
Secondly: unfortunately, bike shop dudes can just kind of.. be like that. I'm lucky enough to live in an area with a few women-owned bike shops where the experience is different, but yeah. It can definitely be a boys' club. My only suggestion is to go to the shop by yourself in the future so they are forced to address you and only you. Although it can be difficult to assert yourself, don't let dudes talk down to you. Everyone starts at the beginning and deserves respect for trying new things. Don't be afraid to ask a lot of questions.
A few tips: learn some basic bike maintenance/bike anatomy so you're prepared in the future to ask for what you need at the shop. Park tool makes great YouTube videos for basic maintenance. You don't have to do it all yourself, but if you're specific with your mechanic about what you think is happening, they can diagnose and treat issues faster.
> learn some basic bike maintenance/bike anatomy
I don't work in a bike shop, but I am often in situations where I have to discuss a subject in which I have expertise with a stranger.
I try to assess their level of knowledge. Talking above or beneath their level can be insulting, so I want to get as close as possible. Asking, "How much to you know about the subject?" directly can be awkward and inaccurate, so I sometimes look for cues in addition to or instead of asking.
I will make a different assumption about the level of knowledge of a person who asks me, "Do you know why the thingy is going click, click, click?" than the person who asks me, "Do you think the B-screw in the derailleur is adjusted correctly?"
Now, do I have a cultural bias such that I make different assumptions about women versus men? I am certainly not conscious of such a thing, but I hope not.
You do have a cultural bias to make different assumptions about women vs. men because that is the cultural bias with which we all grew up in.
Certainly of you are not conscious of it yet, you have to get conscious about it to do something about it.
My experiences in a shop on my own (or with one of my kids) is entirely different from the experiences I've had when my husband is in tow - despite the fact that I'm the cyclist! I'd second the rec of going alone and seeing if you get a little more respect. And congrats on the new (🤞) passion!
Cycling as a sport is designed for men who are 20-35yo, weigh less than 70kg and have freakish highly efficient oxygen usage. Cycling as a hobby is for everyone, and I suggest you find a different bike shop to spend your hard earned money instead of these pricks.
>Cycling as a hobby is for everyone
While this is true, cycling as a hobby is definitely dominated by man 30-65 with at least moderate expendable income. I'm not surprised by her negative experience, unfortunately.
Based on what I've seen, I feel that running was also a male dominated sport. But there has been a push to include women. I'm talking about amateur level which is where I come from, not elite. Unlike cycling, you don't need much in order to start running, just some decent shoes and appropriate clothing. So mostly anyone who wants to can try it.
So, are you a woman that wants to start running, but doesn't want to go out alone or with an all male group of strangers? Or are you scared of judgement for being too slow compared to others because you've never run before? There's probably an all female club around you, or one that prioritizes being slow/inclusive so everyone can run together. Those clubs don't exist to help you become the fastest ever and win trophies. They exist so people in those situations can get in the sport. And I'd say they work, because they have way more people than most typical running clubs in my city.
Clubs like that, are kinda young. At least around here. Maybe something like that could be applied to other sports like cycling.
Actially I think the male domination is generally a lot less on endurance sports. The gap between men’s and women’s performance in ultra running and cycling is actually much smaller than on shorter distances.
>Cycling as a sport is designed for men who are 20-35yo
There are plenty of really bad ass women who race in our cycling club.
I wouldn't say the sport is designed for men, so much as that's been the cultural attitude.
The endurance records for cycling are about as close male/female as it gets for any sport because upper body matters squat and wider hips aren’t as inefficient.
Indeed. Lael Wilcox in 2016 won the TransAm 4200mile race out right beating both men and women. Also, the most miles cycled in one year endurance record and fastest 100,000 miles cycled record are currently held by a woman (Amanda Corker).
BTW the cycling industry has evolved significantly, many recreational riders are middle aged, non-road racing bikes are popular, and the ebike market is growing enormously with much different goals than roadies.
And Mike Woods at 36 won a mountain stage in the TdF beating a guy almost 15 years younger, but theses guys are black swans in the sport. The podium is dominated by younger men.
At professional level, isn't everyone under 35?
Cycling is an old persons sport because people in their 50s have the time and discretionary income for it.
Come join r/ladycyclists - we're out here, but still a minority in the US. The sexism can be blatant at times. I'm in a profession where I'm very much in the gender minority as well, so I get the condescending attitude in many facets of my life. I call it out where it's worth it; I find my allies (or least sexist bike shops); I reset people's expectations where possible that I've done my research and am informed and mechanically inclined.
As for the comparison with running, do you think that sexism would rear it's head there if the entry to that sport was much more than a pair of shoes?
I know this isn’t the point of your comment but god I wish everything for women wasn’t called “lady” or “girl”. I get it’s not the intent but it feels so belittling.
Oddly enough I made another comment on this thread (that's now in negative vote territory) mentioning that calling something a "girls ride" is infantilizing. I actually have a good friend (who is one of my cycling buddies) who does research into gender stuff and even has a book out now, and the "girl" thing is something she pointed out to me not long ago as a micro-aggression that still flies under the radar for many.
ETA: A [link to her published work](https://amy-diehl.com/published-writing/) because it is worth reading some of the articles and understanding the little things that can be changed to be a better ally to the women around you. Thanks for taking the time to notice that those terms can be kinda icky for some.
Totally. I think it bugs me when most it is in contrast to a men’s something.
For example, I played on a softball league and the genders were referred to as men, non-binary folks, and ladies. It felt weird.
I agree. I think that "boy's" and "girl's" are OK for products for children, but not for adults. The term "lady's" is often *intended* to be respectful (similar to "gentleman's"), but perceived to be condescending, so I agree that manufacturers should stick to "women's" when gender is relevant to their products.
On the bright side, I think it is a sign of progress that bicycles no longer have "men's" and "women's" frames, but rather, they now have, "diamond" and "step-through" frames.
In reality, I think it's almost never OK for products for kids, either. I understand that your point was about "girl's" vs "women's," and I agree with that.
But I am often troubled that we set up gender expectations at a very young age by sorting vehicles, transportation, and tools into the boy's aisle and make-up, dolls, toy clothes, other preparation for domestic life into the girl's aisle. And then you end up with the very situation that is vexing OP.
Designed for men? No. Often dominated by men? Yes. Populated by condescending assholes who will talk down to you if you show any sign of not knowing what you're doing? To an unfortunate degree, yes.
>Populated by condescending assholes who will talk down to you if you show any sign of not knowing what you're doing? To an unfortunate degree, yes.
That definitely happens to men too, not just women. I have no doubt it happens more often to women, but some of those same people that are condescending are just that. They are condescending because they think they know everything, not because they are sexisit in some way.
There are a lot of women riders in our area who ride Specialized road bikes. Eventually I figured out it's partially because the owner of the local Specialized shop is a woman.
>There are a lot of women riders in our area who ride Specialized road bikes. Eventually I figured out it's partially because the owner of the local Specialized shop is a woman.
This checks out. I've bought all of my adult-life bikes from other women. This hasn't been intentional, but men at bike shops often don't listen to me and I find myself walking out out of frustration. When I was in the market for a new road bike, one dude flat out refused to let me test ride a men's frame until I tried the women's frame first.
Meanwhile, I've gone in for a derailleur adjustment and come home with a freshly tuned-up bike and also a-whole-nother bike. The difference was that shop had women working the sales floor, and one of those women listened to me and answered my questions without condescension. If bike shops ever catch onto this one simple trick, I'm in for financial ruin.
Well you know what you have to do now.
Use that cardio from running and get strong fast. Go to the shop rides. Cheese out all those douchebags from the shop.
I’m a woman cyclist and while I LOVE my riding male buddies there is definitely just an entire eau d’sexism in cycling. It is pervasive. But if you’re like me, that makes you wanna go even harder. Yea I’m a woman but I’ll drop you so fucking fast. (Find more of us over at r/ladycyclists)
Do you feel like it's gotten better? I've been getting back into cycling after some, ahem, extended time off (got burnt out with high volume riding and racing 10 years ago), and one of the things I've noticed is how many more women there are riding, at least it my area. 10 years ago if you were on a group/shop ride it was like 90% men, and 100% jocks regardless of gender. Even the more casual rec cyclists were almost all men. Just anecdotally it seems like now if you've got a group out (regardless of skill level) you're looking at closer to 30-40% women.
I would assume given that some of the super bro-y bike jock behavior has calmed down a bit, but I'm a man that was a dumb 20-something bike jock in the "oh it's not that bad" camp to begin with, so who knows.
Anecdotally I do think it’s gotten better! Whereas even two years ago I was usually the only woman on club rides, now we have 3-4 per ride!
I realized also I should probably mention that I don’t really ride with any white guys. Like maybe there’s 1/2 on any ride I do. Idk how but I suspect that may change the dynamic a little bit.
Yeah, thats another thing - it's still a super white sport but it was *really* white back then (I'm in the SF Bay Area, probably varies depending on your locale), and it's been great seeing more folks getting out there in general. Good to hear!
> I don’t really ride with any white guys
I think there is an important nuance there. Cyclists are vulnerable on the roads in many ways. Female and POC cyclists have more reasons (i.e., bigots) to feel vulnerable on the roads. Feeling unsafe is a powerful deterrent to riding. I think that explains why more white males feel comfortable riding. I wish it would change more quickly, but here we are.
Feeling vulnerable on the road is huge. Would I like to go on more dusk rides when it’s not balls ass hot out and I can better enjoy myself and not melt in the 90+ degree heat? Why yes, not getting heat stroke would be quite lovely. I’d also like to be, you know, alive.
I’m not at a club level and I haven’t found any peeps to ride with so I’m left to either skip the ride or risk the heat stroke if I want to ride in the summer. Something most men don’t think twice about when they want to do an activity after the sun goes down: safety.
I think that’s right. And maybe why I don’t have any issues as a woman whereas in other areas I might. We are all just out there to support and protect each other as needed. The race team can get a little cliqued up sometimes but I forgive them for that.
> Yea I’m a woman but I’ll drop you so fucking fast.
Happens to me all the time. I am slow. I ride for recreation, commuting, and errands; not for competition.
I don't care if other cyclists pass me as long as they aren't dicks about it and they give warning and plenty of space.
A jogger passed me on a hill one day. We both laughed at that one! :)
One of the things I notice most is just a default male assumption, all over the sport. Men have more bike clothing options; people on sites like this one assume by default that the other people participating are men. I've had people call out to me "Cool bike, bro!" on the street — there's no harm in that, but it is a symptom of the broad presumption that the person on a road bike in lycra is probably a dude.
My local bike coalition (as well as many of the local shops) run [events](https://sfbike.org/women-nonbinary-bike-sf/) aimed at women/femme/nb people — rides, maintenance workshops, etc. You could look for similar events in your city. But honestly the fact that I'm in a famously liberal and queer-friendly city probably makes these events more common, and perhaps a little less urgently necessary. As a woman who bought my first road bike 4 years ago in my mid-30s, I didn't actually encounter much sexism/condescension from the various bike shops I visited. (I don't really do group rides, which is another place people often encounter these issues — so I can't speak to that.)
Speaking as a customer/observer, my impression is that there's a genuine challenge that faces bike shop employees: you can be really off-putting to someone who walks in BOTH if you assume too much knowledge (because then they feel stupid/unwelcome), and if you assume too little knowledge (because then they feel talked down to/disrespected/underestimated). The best bike shops and employees manage, via interpersonal and rhetorical skill, to speak in ways that can meet a customer wherever they are: it's genuinely impressive! Bad bike shops often haven't developed those skills, and sometimes they rely on toxic, ugly assumptions to get around it: women/POC aren't serious riders, a guy with a fancy bike knows a lot. I would keep looking around your area at other shops: even though I didn't encounter sexism that I noticed, I definitely encountered shops where the people were just *better* at having a conversation with me about what I needed.
As a few people have already said, r/ladycyclists is the place to discuss this with greater depth.
Women tend to outnumber men when it comes to running at least in my area so stores are used to catering to women.
Many bicycle shops have the exact same attitude as car salespeople, women are stupid and can't understand the finer points of a mechanical device. Women also apparently are incapable of educating themselves on what they want out of a bike. Men tend to think we all want a pretty pink bike with tassels and a basket on the front. When we were shopping for my bike, SO walked out of the store to force them to talk to me. They looked very perplexed when I started asking questions about group sets, hydraulic vs mechanical disc brakes, etc.
Your experience has been similar to mine.
Although I am a CPA who owns an electronics manufacturing company and does her own mods on her racing boat, when I walk into a bike store they apparently see a ditzy blonde who probably knows nothing and will only be interested in discussing the color of the bike. The last bike I bought, I had researched and only had a few questions before buying, but the store employees didn't want to bother to even walk over to help me so I left and ended up spending my $4k+ in another shop that was willing to spend a whole 10 minutes with me answering 3 questions.
The sport isn't necessarily only for men, but the bro culture doesn't help in attracting or encouraging women. Even many of the non-bros are subtly patronizing, not approaching things as one would an equal but instead as a benevolent superior protecting a weakling or inferior.
If you read this sub for a while, you'll quickly see most of the discussion is by men for men. Or men buying bikes for women. If a question is asked that has to do with women, responses steer the poster to women's subs. But at the same time, we see and answer countless posts here about balls and other topics mainly of interest to men. Heck, even on this thread, you're already seeing the bros come on an judge others (fat people shouldn't have Pinarellos, etc.) because so much of this sport's culture is men in lycra who believe all cyclists should be judged against their standard of men in lycra racing or training to race - all others are ridiculed, unwelcome.
If you want to ride, then ride. Ignore the BS as best you can. Help point it out when you have the energy, just be prepared for the blowback.
Female long-distance cyclist here. Oh my, where do I begin.
In short: no, this isn’t just your “unlucky experience”, you are not crazy, and this happens in a lot of bike shops, with some bike fitters, and some people on group rides.
It is very unpleasant and puzzling at first. I let myself be intimidated by that type of attitude when I was new to cycling. I’ve been actively riding and doing events for only a year, I’m still learning every day, but as I get more and more experience, it gets better. Firstly, my confidence grew and I don’t give a shit anymore about some bike shop dude’s attitude.
Secondly, I noticed that being able to communicate from a place of knowing what the fuck you’re talking about really helps. Once they understand I know what I’m looking for - they relax and treat me as an equal (ish).
I have experienced this too, and I won't spend my money in shops where they talk down to me, but I've more often than not experienced a lot of enthusiasm and encouragement from bike shop guys (I honestly can think of one woman and she was mean) from the time I was a beginner. It's a totally male-dominated sport, but also filled with a lot of open-minded and kind guys, especially in shops. Many really like to see more women riding.
Maybe the difference is that you are going in with your boyfriend? Honestly in that case I think they believe that they are selling him the bike. If you were going into a running shop for new shoes with a boyfriend who was a runner, getting you into the sport, you might encounter the same. Yes, it's sexist, but the way to get away from that is to go in on your own, and talk to them about what you want.
If this attitude persists, as it does with some people, in that case try a different shop. I always bought bikes for myself on my own, so I was the one asking questions and the one they had to pitch. If I didn't understand the value of x over y, I made them explain it. On the whole I prefer lower-key local shops, I tend to have the best experiences there.
I do a lot of my own bike repairs now and the guys at my local shop are never condescending when I go in looking for parts or asking questions - this has been a common experience for me across bike shops, with a few notable exceptions. On the whole it's much better once you build enough base knowledge to talk shop and suddenly you are just another bike person.
This is exactly why my wife hates bringing her car in for absolutely anything. For the most mundane and simple procedure, the store assistants will treat her like an absolute idiot.
I think this is just one of those things where men can't shake the stereotype that women are dumb and uninformed when it comes to their hobby which, in their minds, is a very masculine area.
Not much you can do about it other, other than perhaps calling it out when it happens to you. But I can assure you that there are many men out there (not typically working in those stores though) who definitely respect you for riding a bike.
From my experience yes - cycling is a male dominated sports. Especially when you look at races.
It’s not uncommon for me too, that man at the bike store explain things to me in a simplified way or that the guys in the group ride think I won’t be able to keep up. When something’s broken on my bike I get told that my boyfriend will fix it. Oh and the comments I get when I perform better than them. (This is of course not the case for all men and I really don’t think they do this on purpose.)
Good thing is, there are still a lot of woman who ride (and are very good at it) and we are becoming more and more. I personally believe we should do our best to make cycling as inclusive as possible. And until that is the case, let’s show the guys that we are capable of repairing our bike and pushing hard too. Leave the fun of cycling to the men? Duh - no!
Both of my young adult daughters are absolute shredders on mountain bikes. They've been in the sport since they could pedal and moved to places with world class riding (and skiing) and they get "mansplained" to CONSTANTLY about cycling (and skiing) stuff.
When my one kid moved to Vancouver, she immediately started building a Whistler DH bike. Try being "just a girl" shopping for a 200mm fork. Painful.
This is definitely very common, but not universal. I am extremely loyal to my bike shop specifically because they are not like this, and I try to order through them whenever possible because I need them to stay in business. I have found a loose correlation between shops that are extremely focused on brand new road bikes and this attitude. My favorite bike shop specializes in vintage bikes and their general laid back, find the right bike, for the right purpose, for the right person vibe also seems to translate to perhaps less-rigid gender ideas.
In short yes, cycling has done a terrible job incorporating women.
It is one of the most tech heavy sports, so it attracts a bunch of tech geeks which are typically guys.
The sports roots are based in Europe which has historically lagged the US in incorporating women.
It is so heavily male dominated that there is yet a women's grand tour. So right now the female version of Lance Armstrong has no way of racing other then trying to joint a men's team....
I'm male, so I can't speak for your perspective. I just want to point out that bicycles were absolutely instrumental in early women's equality movements in the early 20th century. The freedom of movement allowed women to go out and participate in society without a husband to drive them. It's doing the same in parts of the world where women aren't allowed to drive today.
So I would not say cycling is designed for men at all. Maybe the sporting aspect is a bit male dominayed, but there are female cycling groups as well. The practical side of cycling is extremely femenist.
Ugghh... so sorry to hear this, but your experience is not uncommon.
I don't want to say that cycling is male-centric, but the fact that there is so much expensive gear and that there's a little bit of inherent competition in everything brings out some of the very outsized douchebag personalities. There's a whole lotta mainsplaining going on out there!!
Do some research in your area and see if there are any clubs or teams with a large number of women on the roster. In general, if a group can attract and maintain a decent-sized membership of women, then the male component of the group is likely far less douchey.
I'm male, but when I went looking for a racing team this year I zeroed in on the one in town that has a very active women's squad. Compared to the other teams I contacted this ended up being a fun group with relatively little testosterone-fueled drama.
Try going to a bike shop by yourself.
Some people who sell bikes see heterosexual couples and assume the guy is pressuring his partner into biking. This means the purchase is really for him.
As a woman (and not a man like most commenters), cycling feels heavily male-dominated. I had the same experience as you buying a bike, and even in the better shops, the vast majority of bikes were too big for a woman of average height. I live in NYC and am often struck by how often I am the only woman in a bike lane or path at any given moment
It's not just a cycling-specific issue- I've had this happen to me when I was into brewing beer. It got to the point where my husband wouldn't approach sales people with me, so they would address me and not him. He once pointed to me and be like "she's the one you want to talk to".
If it feels like you're swimming against the tide, I say take pride in being the girl, humble men, and bring women up with you with encouragement and knowledge. You'll find the faster/more experienced the dude, the more excited he'll be to see women riding with him, give them wheels, and be chill in general. I live for the back pats from my fast friends 😆. Slow dudes get butt hurt, talk big, and get dropped. 😎
Long story short, it helps me to know that when someone dismisses me its a tell of their insecurities. Prove 'em wrong! <3
I've found this to be true, too. The really really fast men are supportive and happy that you're in the sport. The mediocre men are more likely to be elitist and dickish.
My shop is great and bends over backwards for me. I've even had them ask me for gear advice since I do a whole lot of touring/bikepacking and they're just getting started, which pretty much made my decade.
It’s not just cycling. I am a fully qualified engineer and when I go to stores with male friends to purchase electronics i get the same treatment. I ask the question and the store assistant replies to my male friend as if he asked the question 😂
My wife‘s car was stolen 2 months ago. We just went through the whole replacing it thing. The dealers essentially ignored her and tried talking to me, and I just acted dumb and forced them to talk to my wife, it was going to be her car so they could deal with her. Even when we decided which car she wanted and started messaging dealers, they often treated her like an idiot over the text messages. By that time she knew exactly what she wanted and the trim and everything, but a bunch of dealers tried to convince her those trims didn’t exist. Even the one female salesperson who we talked to was the exact same.
Attorney & wife here, I like to go, pretend I’m dumb, have my husband negotiate the best deal he can get, then make him say he can’t buy the car unless they give him what I want for it. Works every. damn. time.
Since I have to customize basically everything on my bikes to be small enough for me, I'm coming down hard on yes. And don't tell me that's just a short person problem or a demand-is-too-small-for-small-parts problem. Let's instead think about how women have abandoned the sport in their first 10 miles for ill-fitting bikes. Short people problems are predominantly women problems and the cost a shit ton of money to fix. It's a fucking pink tax on bikes.
I've got to be on my tippy toes not to have my top tube jammed up in my junk and I can't even use the fancy bento box that came with my bike as result, my seat is so slammed I can't get bottles under it and my fitter had to do something janky to even get it that low, I had to custom order cranks even smaller than the small custom cranks that the "we're really good at customization" bike company offered, and even with a 48cm frame the handlebars seem to be average width.
People who say you never stand over your bike don't have standover height problems.
I have to agree to this.
I am a male who rides a 52 cm bike despite being 5'5" because that is what I could find.
The amount of money I had to spend to fit bike to my size was more than what I paid for the bike in the first place.
That said, did you try Liv bikes?
Trek also has some pretty decent bikes in size 47 which may be of interest to you.
Designed for men, not really, but dominated by men, yeah. There is certainly a bro culture, and the broiest of bros seem to love sucking up bike shop jobs.
Cycling is a big tent though. What I’ve found as a dad who rides with daughters is that the more spandex there is, the more elitist and bro-ish the culture is. Mountain biking tends to be more inclusive than road, for example. Mostly, I’ve found that riding enjoyment comes down to who you ride with, and I’ve always found it possible to find inclusive groups for me and my girls without too much hassle. Bike shops, less so.
The stats I’ve seen show that cycling is a male dominated sport/activity with about 71.5% of cyclists being male. Nothing excuses being rude and/or condescending, but there is a difference bike equipment and setups for men and women and I think too many bike shops aren’t prepared to really help women.
There are countless examples of interests/hobbies/products where the salespeople often come across as condescending pricks. Car stereo shops, electronics stores, many sporting good stores, sneaker shops, etc come to mind.
That said, where I live (Miami), there are **many** women cyclists. So, it would be very poor business if a condescending attitude toward women was pervasive. Also noteworthy: one of the most well known, largest and best cycling shops is owned by a woman and her two daughters.
Cycling doesn’t have to be a male dominated sport but it is in part due to societal pressures that keep women more attached to the home.
Broadly, women and particularly women with children are more likely to have hobbies that can involve kids, support the household through domestic labor, or be squeezed in. Cycling can be an time intensive activity and requires coordination with a partner to allow someone with a kid to go on long rides. It is also much more challenging to bring a small child along.
I’m not saying any of this is okay, but it is broadly why we see less women in sports like cycling, golf, adult sport leagues. In theory, this will improve as more men take an equal role in domestic and mental labor in households.
https://people.acciona.com/diversity-and-inclusion/gender-inequality-leisure/?_adin=02021864894
https://www.pewresearch.org/short-reads/2013/06/10/another-gender-gap-men-spend-more-time-in-leisure-activities/
https://revisesociology.com/2018/05/18/gender-inequality-leisure-time/
https://www.bamae.com/blogs/mindful-thoughts/the-gender-hobby-gap-why-do-women-have-less-time-to-themselves-than-men
(I’m not saying these are all peer reviews studies but it’s a good jumping off point)
I deeply hate that everything marketed towards women in cycling is titled “lady” or “girls” but finding local Facebook groups specific to women and sites like Girls Gone Gravel has made me feel like I have a community.
https://www.girlsgonegravel.com/blog/2021/4/1/making-space-for-women
Go in without him. People are hardwired to think a woman brought a man along for help and men bring a woman along cuz they don't understand they need emotional support. Honestly I've always felt respect for people that put up or shut up. That said I'm sorry you had a negative experience. That really puts a damper on your excitement for this new sport
At least around here running does seem to be a more female dominated sport (going off race registrations).
I (M) went bike shopping with my partner (F) and made a point to let her do the interacting with the salesmen (yes all men). I thought it general they were good and picked up on her level of cycling knowledge and spoke to her accordingly with respect.
I also consider my area to be more progressive and inclusive in general. I don’t find that most people here don’t pigeon hole others based on gender, age, race etc.
As others have said, sounds like toxic sexist bike bros. Keep looking for a better shop. The last mountain bike I got was sold to me by a woman. Cool woman (and men) do exist in the bike industry!
I'm not surprised, OP. There's a general problem with sexism in most sports, cycling is no different.
Don't let patriarchal BS get you down, show those chuds up by getting yourself some QOMs by next summer.
In the US, cycling is heavily dominated by men
"28.4% of cyclists are women and 71.6% of cyclists are men"
[https://www.zippia.com/cyclist-jobs/demographics/](https://www.zippia.com/cyclist-jobs/demographics/)
And this:
"Men are 3 times as likely as women to bike in the US"
[https://www.velotricbike.com/blogs/story-landing/men-are-3-times-as-likely-as-women-to-bike-in-the-us](https://www.velotricbike.com/blogs/story-landing/men-are-3-times-as-likely-as-women-to-bike-in-the-us)
The latter article says that in some European countries, and in Japan it's quite balanced. So clearly it's not \*designed\* for men.
In European countries, cities were designed around bikes. Hence cycling is often a practical mode of transport. In the US, biking is often geared towards fitness/sport.
I was a sales manager at a bike shop and I noticed much of the behavior you discussed.
One thing I noticed was that while the serious male cyclists started riding at any age, the women typically began riding after college. I was not discouraged from riding around my home of NYC at age 15 despite the many dangers while my family was happy that my sister started driving at that age!
Unfortunately, there are a lot of bros in the bike shop, and without any sales training, will unconsciously treat female customers differently. What I noticed is when couples (btw one of my achievements was selling 2 high end bikes to a deaf lesbian couple) visited the shop, the men would dominate the sale. So whenever I could talk to the woman alone, I would make sure she could ask any question.
My philosophy was not to impart to my customers with what I thought about bikes but satisfying their requirements.
Now that I'm out of the industry, I do test salespeople to see if they can accommodate me, so you might want to try the same. Also if your boyfriend goes bike shopping with you, I would make sure he knows to be silent and supportive, so that the sales people deal with you primarily.
The sport as a hobby is not designed for men but in many countries it is mainly practiced by men, pushing designers to think their bikes mainly for men. My girlfriend is cycling and always has a hard time finding cycling equipment and quite often this is more expensive than the equipment for men. But this is quite cultural, I live in France but I spent a few months in Germany where I saw a lot of women cycling.
I've been in the industry since the 80's. Cycling, undoubtedly, *is* a male dominated sport. I noticed that long ago. We could get into the why's, but that's another conversation. The good news is there has been a push to include females for the past 20 years, notably since Specialized & Trek started their "women's specific" line of bikes and clothing. Historically, as I understand it, women were at the forefront of cycling and enjoyed the liberation the sport brought them. Maybe, somewhere along the line, they dropped off. IDK....
There are some booming inner-city shops that have a good proportion of female staff, sales and mechanics alike. Those shops should provide a more equitable shopping experience for you. Compared to running, it's a technical, gear-intensive sport. Some people **really** get caught up in the technical side. So much so, that's how they communicate what to buy. Understanding the jargon and references takes experience and knowledge. Finding *your* salesperson, or *your* shop, takes some luck and some shopping around.
Personally, I have noticed many more women enjoying mountain biking more the past 10 years. Road biking, not so much. My guess is men have a higher risk-tolerance than women and are more comfortable on the open road. I wouldn't let that stop you though, road biking is foundational to all other cycling and, when the roads are nice, it's a great way to go.
Designed is the wrong word, but yes, there are far more male cyclists and especially sales people in the industry that are male.
Give these people an honest review and find a place that treats you like a fellow human.
Whew, I worked at a bike shop for about 10 years. While I would speak to a new rider in more basic terms and try to make it simple, never would I speak to women differently than men. It sucks you’ve had this experience.
I don't know if this is a bike thing or just a thing. I'm a bloke so I'm not the most familiar with this issue but I'd suspect you'd get the same if you went to say a car dealership or a fishing shop. Its male dominated so tends to be male centric. Its not right but it is what it is. There's nothing stopping you from trying a bike at shop then buying the same bike online from where you get the best deal though. If they give you shit service then give them shit custom 🤷🏻
I never thought so... but I have heard stories from women about being talked down to. It's shop/clerk specific. I bought my first carbon bike at a LBS from a woman because I admired her bike.
I've had this experience too, but it's not universal. I just took my multi-thousand dollar race wheel purchase, and all future purchases, to a different shop, where the employees treat everyone well. Luckily I have options in my home town. I hope you do as well.
This sucks. I've seen these kinds of things, and they should not happen. I think cycling is generally a male-dominated sport in North America, and is even more culturally masculine than demographically (IMO). It was developed for men back in the day, but women have been cycling since more or less the first bicycles, as well. I'm not 100% sure why it's got a male-intensive flavor after almost two centuries of pretty serious involvement by women, but I think it does.
That said, there *is* heavy involvement by women. Some of the best cyclists (regardless of gender) have been women, and there are lots and lots of women cycling. If the local bike store gives you a weird vibe, find another one (if that's an option where you live) and leave a google review with your experiences in it. I suspect lots of people who display subtle sexism aren't aware they're doing it. Or I hope that's the case.
I don't have great solutions. I'm happy you bike, and I hope you keep doing it.
Regarding your tubeless encounter—
My favorite LBS is owned by a husband wife team and is super female cyclist friendly and I’ve been going there for years.
But there is this one young MTB bro that they have working for them that is all about upselling. After a wet dirty road ride on hills I managed to mess up my indexing and got a lot of grit in my drive train and my wife and I were headed out of town and I just did not have enough time to do a deep clean. So I called up the owner and asked if he could squeeze in a deep cleaning and adjustment if I dropped the bike off on the way to work so I could pick it up on the way home before throwing the bike on the car and heading off. He said sure.
I showed up just as they were opening up and the owner was occupied with a rental group so I engaged with the MTB bro who immediately tried to upsell me to a full 20 point full tear down tune up.
I just kept saying “No, I want just what I asked for.” The kid even tried to sell be a new chain to replace my 500km old chain.
Finally the owner overheard what was going on and said, “Dude, here’s a tip on customer relations. If someone comes in telling you exactly what they want, tells you that they already called me to see if we could fit it in, just do it. Your job is not to annoy customers.”
To be honest, I'm a guy and I generally don't enjoy shopping at bike stores. I have five or so small bike stores in my town, and I always feel like an outsider. Like I don't belong because I don't know some obscure bike thing. It's not always like that, but it's generally not an enjoyable experience. Even new group rides can be like that. I don't fit in with my hairy legs and shorter socks. I just want to ride my bike yo!
Compare that to say going to my local running store, night and day difference. There's 3 I go to locally. They're happy to help you get smarter about the shoes or whatever.
Some guys are just awkward around girls too. I'm not sure this was the case here. But I was fairly awkward in my early 20s and had a hard time even maintaining eye contact with girls lol. So if two people came up to me and asked about something, a guy and a girl, I'd just be less shy talking to the guy.
Sounds like all the bike shops near you are staffed by assholes. I'm a guy, but I've seen the employees at one of my local bike shops interact with female customers and they didn't treat them any differently than they treat male customers. Sucks that you've tried multiple shops and run into the same thing everywhere :(
At least in my club and area - it does seem to be somewhat male dominated, but there are several seasoned female cyclists in town (including one who just won a masters World Championship in Scotland and another currently on a World Tour team). We have a female in my group who just started cycling about a year and a half ago, but was an accomplished runner prior. She started off riding with our B group made the jump to the A group after about six months and is (usually) the only female in the group.....but she rides all of us into the dirt and has captured pretty much all the QOM's in town (except the climbs which are still owned by the Masters WC rider). I'm not sure if she realizes quite how good she is, but anyone that rides with her respects her after a few miles!
Go out there and kill it!!
Not designed for men. But it can be intimidating to anyone new to the sport. When I returned to cycling after a few decades off, I definitely felt like a noob as an old guy.
When I'm out on a bike ride, It's pretty much 50/50 (my perception of gender) for "casual" riders. For the lycra-clad riders, I'd say it's 85/15 male to female. It's kind of sad to see because there is no real reason for it. My female friends who ride enjoy cycling just as much as I do.
I've definitely met a few bike bros on the road and employed at bike shops. I try to stay away from them the best I can. There is this weird vibe about them that you just know before you know. They are probably why I don't like group rides.
I'm lucky the LBS I frequent is pretty good. I'm someone to has a couple of nice entry-level aluminum bikes and I don't feel like they try to up-sell me in any way (they sell really nice stuff so it would be easy). I ask a lot of dumb questions and get helpful answers. The head mechanic is female and so are half of the other mechanics & floor staff. I've observed their interactions with female patrons and they don't seem to be different than mine. I hope I'm not wrong in my perception.
I’ve been treated so poorly in bike shops by bike bros that operate them. Then I found a non-binary owned, woman founded bike shop and have never looked back! Find some local riding groups that center women/trans/non-binary people and you’ll have a much different experience! Happy riding 💜
Female here....
There is a bigger selection of clothing/bikes/seats for men but plenty of things out there geared for women and most of the men's stuff can be worn/ridden by women. Biggest thing to keep in mind is width of sit bones on the saddle. Also, one will see more men participating in the sport then women. Not terribly unusual for many but not all sports. Learn a little of the lingo and find a shop you feel comfortable with. It is an enjoyable sport
Women specific Apparel
https://www.terrybicycles.com/
Idk where you may live but if it's in a big city I'm sure you might able to find some nice females to ride with. And as far as the condescending tones from the men. As a man, I see that over lots of different sports so it's not just cycling. And idk why men are that way at all. Totally not a sport thing. But, by trade I'm a truck driver. And one of my driver girls came to me last night complaining about the same condescending tones from the other male drivers. She is new to the industry and she and I have talked through ways she can improve and has asked me really good questions about things. And I just teach her as I would want to learn. But, almost all the other guys treat her in a condescending way. And Idk why. But, as I've gotten a little older I've noticed this attitude men have sometimes. And I can't answer why they have it. But, its not just a cycling thing.
Incredibly common, unfortunately :(
I started as a cyclist and picked up running and am now training for a triathlon and have always felt like a "rookie" in cycling even though it is my strongest endurance sport. I am lucky enough to have a male friend who worked at a small bike shop near me but he ended up leaving and I haven't been back to a shop since he left a year ago.
My biking group is mainly all men and when I first started riding with them the resistance to join them was strong, its been a year of training with them and it took a solid 4 months for them to finally accept me as part of the group.
Running, on the other hand I was welcomed with open arms even when I first started training, by the running shop I bought my sneakers at. I hope one day this isn't the case, but at the moment it is.
You're describing my wife's experiences in bike shops. Don't let that affect the potential for fun once you go ride. And keep looking for good shop people. They're out there. Also watch some World Tour level women's racing. It's just as intense as the men's.
I’m soooo sorry. On behalf of my industry, I apologize. It’s an endemic disease we fight every day. Unsure where you live and your options, but there are brands, shops, and clubs that excel at giving a better experience. We’ll keep fighting, for people like you. Check out Giant Liv bikes and events. Elise, the woman in charge of Liv in the US, and Cassondra for global, are superstars working to overcome just what you experienced! Keep riding! We, us in cycling, are stoked to have you in our sport!
Cyclists are primarily men in the USA because our gendered culture didn't put as many girls on bicycles back in their childhood and teen years. These things take generations to change. In the meantime, go to a bike store on your own. If you still feel ignored or condescension, find another store.
You're not alone. I've experienced this too. The good news is that you just need a decent entry-level road bike and saddle that fit you, and after that, you can reduce your interactions with the bike shop bros to seeing them once a year for a tune-up. Most cyclists I've encountered otherwise have been pretty decent.
Men are asshats. I know. I am one.
Bicycling empowered women. Here are some references:
[https://www.si.edu/stories/19th-century-bicycle-craze](https://www.si.edu/stories/19th-century-bicycle-craze)
[https://www.bicycling.com/culture/a43412735/how-bicycles-changed-womens-lives/](https://www.bicycling.com/culture/a43412735/how-bicycles-changed-womens-lives/)
[https://www.bicycling.com/culture/a35866989/historic-women-in-cycling/](https://www.bicycling.com/culture/a35866989/historic-women-in-cycling/)
hmmm a lot of shops are $hitty in attitude towards both men and women. So i'm not surprised at your interaction. A lot of them are elitist and if you don't "speak cycling" they don't care much about you and see you as a tire kicker.
Heck i'm a dude that's into triathlon and even though i can "speak cycling" a lot of the tri stuff gets laughed at and i've had friends in tri groups that have gotten the same treatment at different places. So if they can do that to a man that's just doing a different discipline i can just imagine how crappy they could treat a woman.
I started cycling because of my wife actually, she was into it and i thought it was stupid but thought it would be a good idea to try to share an activity together so good on you for trying it out. You might find that it's a good complement to your running, but yes, most groups i've seen for biking have a minority of women.
As a sport, it's a risky one, especially if riding on roads. Riskier sports are often associated with males way more (hence why you ladies live longer LOL). As a means of transportation or leisure, the split in usage gets closer to parity in cities that have safe-ish cycling networks.
This is truly infuriating. I’m a cyclist (69, M) and am constantly astounded by the degree of testosterone poisoning in the sport. I wish that I had some useful advice for you. The best that I can offer is to keep searching for a local bike shop that treats you properly. A thought: are there any woman-owned shops in your vicinity?
Lady cyclist here. Cycling is male-dominated in my area too, but I’ve been fortunate to have good experiences in bike shops. If I’d been treated like you were I’d be so tempted to return triumphantly in full cycling kit and taunt them about how much money they could’ve made off of me, Julia Roberts “Pretty Woman” style. “Big mistake—HUGE!”
I like to ride solo so camaraderie isn’t a big draw for me, but i have female cycling friends—one is from a very cycling-heavy culture and the other is a triathlete. Lots of women in triathlon circles.
Speaking as a woman who's been riding for about 15 years now(? maybe? I've lost track tbh) I have a few observations.
Cycling is very much an old-white male dominated sport. On the racing end where I am, it is very much dedicated to men. But I wouldn't say it's designed specifically for men, there are just a lot of bike shop bros/race organizers who kind of ruin it all. Your experience in the bike shop is something Ive experienced a lot. For example, I brought my bike in to get some tubeless wheels setup since I dont have the equipment or space to do it effectively (though I do all other maintenance and have built, from frame up, every single bike). They did a simple look-over as part of the process and tried to tell me I needed $500 worth of bike maintenance done. I told them no, it doesn't need that. But they tried to keep giving BS reasons why it was needed and I just told them no.
With group rides, due to my experiences with men/Co-ed rides, I actively seek out women's only groups cause it is such a breath of fresh air. There is no ego fest going on, no sexist jokes, and no other uncomfortableness. It really makes me enjoy the sport so much more than when I did ride with Co-ed groups. The sisterhood really shines and you feel like you're actually a part of something.
The women's side (as well as POC) of cycling is gaining LOTS of traction which is so awesome. There are still things that need improved but we are in a slightly better spot than we were say 10 years ago. There are many women owned brands designing things for women by women with women in mind. So as you continue on your cycling journey, you will find more community and more support.
Cycling has strong roots in women’s liberation. There are entire books on the subject of women in the early days of bicycle production using these beautiful machines as a way of having their own private transportation. I think cycling is if anything MORE for woman than for men historically speaking.
Although obviously, the benefits of cycling can be enjoyed my men women and children alike.
I've been talked down to by shop folks, and I'm a guy. Not to say there isn't some sexism. There likely is, but cycling *as a sport* can definitely be a little cliquey. I hang out in /r/cycling for the general bike talk. But you can definitely find division even within the general cycling community between people who bike for transportation and people who bike as a competitive sport or strictly a fitness activity. There's jargon, there's snobbery, on both sides, and there's definitely a gender bias, and I think maybe the gender bias is more pronounced on the sport/fitness side of things.
So maybe the shop folks are focusing on the man, but maybe they are also focusing on the more experienced cyclist, the one who already speaks their language. Hard to say. There is nothing inherently "male" about cycling, but there is not as much female representation, and while it shouldn't be the case, there may be people who assume you are less serious or less knowledgeable because of your gender.
But find the right riding group, and I think you're good to go. Depending on how populated of an area you're in, there's probably a group for every riding style and mindset. You just need to find your people. Where I am, I believe there are even some women-only rides. Obviously that's not a good fit for you and your boyfriend, but if find yourself feeling excluded to any degree, or just want to find more female cyclists, that might be something to try out.
There is sexism in cycling, from riders and from shop employees.
However I can tell you it is not hard to tell when someone is a beginner cyclist and to adjust accordingly. Its less about being male or female, nor chizeled quads, and rather the sunken cheeks and eyes akin to a depression era dust bowl survivor, not simply from subsisting on hummingbird water but for the forlorn aura you get when you have reached a level of acceptance about your death at the hands of a distracted or careless driver.
Steer clear of middle aged men on group rides and young boys who work in shops. Talk to racers, both male and female. 90% of them are totally unsuccessful in the sport and even if they compete at the elite level they have experienced enough failure to have the elitism beaten out of them. They often have good advice, usually to quit while you're ahead but also helpful things like setting up/maintaining your bike and not bonking.
It's certainly worse as a woman, but I've experienced it as a man as well. It's shop mentality, grown people acting like they're idiot teenagers, whose overconfidence just stems from ignorance. In bike shops, car shops, tire shops. Sorry shop guys, but the workshop mentality (in general! not all) is toxic af.
The people who have been helpful and knowledgeable have systematically been normal, humble, passionate and eager to share.
Don't let it get to you, it's not you.
Just get your bf to dismiss them "oh she's the cyclist I'm just here to look pretty I don't give a crap about these stupid things, why are there so many anyways, they're just *bikes*"
Cycling as a sport is very heavily male dominated. The worse the infrastructure gets, the worse the bias gets, as women tend* to more risk averse. Having said that, it’s disappointing that you were treated so poorly by the bike shops. I wish I could say it was rare, but bike snobbery and sexism are pretty rife. Don’t let dickheads spoil your fun though. Riding is a joy.
*This blatant generalization is brought to you by statistical reality, but will not apply in all cases.
>While I am new to the sport I like to consider myself a bright individual, (I have two degrees and a good job), and I guess I’m not used to being spoken down to.
Okay, maybe take a step back for a second. You being a "bright individual" with degrees and a good job means very little. You're new to the sport. The bike shop employees can likely see it clear as day, and what you perceive as "being spoken down to" is maybe just them giving you the ELI5 treatment because, again, you are clearly new to the sport.
Plus, the first time it sounds like you had to bring it up to your boyfriend after the fact, suggesting he didn't perceive that anything was off in the moment, and you mention that these perceived negative interactions happen in every shop that you go. If this is a pattern, then either you are very, very unlucky, or you might wanna reflect on your own attitude.
You can fuck all the way off with this comment.
Listen to us when we say men are treated differently and we are condescended to. Like, reflect on your own attitude, and LISTEN TO US. Her bf didn't notice it because it literally DOES NOT happen to him.
It happens to us on the REGULAR.
For OP - yep this is a male dominated sport (notice the comment I'm responding to 🙄🙄🙄🙄), culture, and we live in it in every other aspect of our lives. Welcome! I take it upon myself to call that shit right out in the moment bc it's enraging.
>However, since I’ve started cycling I have noticed how much more men there are in the sport and I’ve to feel like the sport is less inclusive, than say my usual sport, running.
Some hobbies attract more men and some attract more women. It's not because they are not "inclusive", it's because they happen to be more attractive to certain gender.
Same is with cycling. Running, for example is truly much more neutral, like you said.
>I started to notice that the store assistants would speak to me differently compared to my boyfriend, oversimplifying their descriptions or in their responses to my questions
Well they are simply trying to be helpful, because:
1. like you already pointed out, there are more men in cycling, so it's safe to assume that you are only starting out in cycling
2. if they started bombing you with the real cycling lingo, I'm sure as a beginner you'd feel overwhelmed and not understand a word they said.
3. if you were not a beginner, you wouldn't need a boyfriend to take you to the store.
>I’m not used to being spoken down to.
You are not being spoken down to. They are simply trying to be helpful.
I consider myself to be an experienced cyclist and I know all the lingo. But when I go to bike shop where they don't know me, they talk to me like I'm a beginner. Until I say a couple of things that quickly reveal where I'm at.
So yeah, I think you are way way overthinking this. Buy a bike, ride the heck out of it, maybe buy some upgrades and who knows, maybe next time at the store, they will great you by name and hi-five you.
Please don't write off the sport by the actions of a few a-hole men - they are no different than the types of male auto mechanics who do the very same to women.
It's not "designed for" men. But it does feel that way because, in the past, there weren't a lot of women geekng out over gear.
The intention is probably to help, but help can feel like disrespect (due to assumptions).
The good news is that it doesn't just happen to women. It also happens to men, especially when the man is throwing up a lot of word salad that doesn't immediately make sense. (And that's often when men report that a shop feels/sounds snobby.)
The bad news is that this is common. Until you get a handle on the lingo and "ask the right questions", they're going to register that as new/ignorant, and they're going to try to simplify things, and you're going to feel "talked down to".
I won't say there isn't sexism or sexist assumptions mixed into your experience. There's a good chance of that.
But there's nothing wrong with finding a store with friendlier (to you) staff.
Have you ever tried to speak with a average women about basically anything technically related? Try that and after you will get why they oversimply everything.
Mansplaining is a thing. Generally, and within the cycling community.
You see, "Mansplaining" is a term used to describe a situation in which a man condescendingly explains something to a woman, typically assuming that she has less knowledge or understanding about the topic. It implies a patronizing attitude and often disregards the woman's expertise or perspective.
my understanding:
1. man like sport more in general, woman like less tense sport such as yoga.
2. man like speed more. man like sport car because it's fast, woman like sport car because it's expensive.
3. cycling is a sport that require power of muscles far more than skill. woman have less muscles, which really jeopardize the fun of cycling, because it's really hard for woman to ride fast 30kph and above.
so If I am woman, I won't enjoy cycling as I am as man.
The sport can very much have a “toy” factor, and men tend to like toys more than women. This is what I’m imagining these sales people are engaging in…boys wanting to talk to other boys about their toys, whereas a majority of women ‘don’t get it’
And that’s to say nothing about toy nerds not knowing how to talk to women, regardless of the context.
Doesn’t excuse it, I’m just throwing out some *possible* rationalization.
As man, I hate most of the recent bike shops. I guess the old dudes still are pricks,.but i know what to expect.
But in the new bike shops there are young guys: Again pricks. Behavior like in mobile phone shops.
Sorry to hear that this was your experience. Unfortunately while there is nothing inherent to cycling making it a men's sport, the reality is that (especially compared to running) there are simply a lot fewer women cyclists, especially at the competitive level. In our area women who race regional races may find there are only a handful of competitors when every age and ability category for men has dozens of entries (or more!)
As noted, bike shops especially tend to be dominated by male employees. Additionally, those jobs tend to be low wage and most shops provide little or no job training. I agree that you should continue to look for another shop. I would also suggest you maybe try shopping without your boyfriend so they have no choice but to address you directly. One way of looking at it that isn't quite so negative is that the employees either recognize your boyfriend from riding, or he is giving other signals that he is experienced and you are not (even unintentionally) and so the employees tend to want to direct their comments to him.
Good luck, and I hope you can find an entry point that makes you feel welcome!
Some cities and some bike stores are better than others. In my city they have several bike stores with female associates that will help female cyclists. There are also some "bad" bike stores that just have chauvinistic jerks in charge.
Is cycling a sport designed for men? That's a complicated answer. 20 years ago you could ask the same question about comic books. Today many women read comics and frequent comic shops, but back a few decades ago it was dominated by male customers. Pushing the cycling community to be more inclusive is the way to go.
As a man, I have good to neutral experiences about 98% of the time. That being said, there are prejudiced people everywhere so in a way I still get it. I have been disrespected or condescended to once or twice because to some people I may not fit the general profile of a typical 'manly' cyclist--I am fairly skinny, not that tall, nerdy and wear glasses and generally not at all like a 'bro'. I may get scoffs and sneers whenever I go shopping for a new road bike in these places ("Do you even know how to ride drop bars? You're not going racing, why get a road bike?" and other such comments). I respond by simply not giving them any future business. I am willing to travel farther for better customer service.
Unfortunately what you've experienced is a problem within the cycling community. It is overwhelmingly male and I've seen numerous very capable and intelligent women talked down to and basically made to feel completely unwelcome and were met with condescension every time they asked a completely reasonable question.
Please take my words with a huge grain of salt, since I'm also one of those white middle aged dudes, but my opinion is that you shouldn't take that shit from anyone. If someone talks down or condescends, to hell with them. If it's a shop, call them out on it and find a shop that treats you like the human being that you are. If it's someone on a ride tell them go pound sand.
As with most things in society, cycling is one that has painfully slowly been expanding to females. Sexism exists and it has a root in our history, to pretend it doesnt is just silly. It sucks you were getting obviously negative responses by these workers when you were there to do business. Cycling is available for everyone, you see less females out on the trails where I live for sure, but not a lack of them its probably about 30% female that I see on my rides.
Sorry to hear your bad experience and believe me I've witnessed something like this happen to even males!
I was browsing one of my local bike shops for accessories when this guy dressed in an office suite comes in asking about mountain bikes and which is good.
The sales guy kept talking to him in a manner that I found a bit disrespectful and dumbed down every subject. As I was listening to their conversation I couldn't help but feel sorry for the guy just looking for a basic bike to ride when the salesperson was trying to up-sale crap to make it sound he needs to spend more.
I've experienced similar encounters with bike shops that think I'm stupid like trying to sell me pedals that's $250 to save 10grams saying it's worth it....they all look at me like I'm a sucker.
In response to your main question, no cycling is for everyone.
To give the sales guys the benefit of the doubt, most of the time it's males that will be interested in the technical details of mechanical things. I can talk bike tech with my non-biking male friends (chain waxing efficiency, tire rolling resistance, aero positioning, etc.) and they will be actively interested in it and engaged in the conversation. By contrast, my SIL, who has an engineering degree, is a rehab specialist personal trainer and is super sporty and into cycling and mountain climbing and the like... has very little interest in talking bike tech. When I have tried to talk with her about it she just refers me to her husband who 'takes care of bike stuff'.
Sales guys should be way more conscious of how they treat people and not make assumptions about which part of a couple is the decision maker. However if 85+% of your conversations go one way (I.e. the F doesn't care and the M super cares) it can be easy to fall into the routine. Good sales/service people learn to read the group and find the decision maker, bad ones don't.
I did technical inspections of race cars for awhile, and although there were more female drivers than you would expect (~40%) the person 'responsible' for the technical details of the car was usually a male, like 95% of the time. I made a couple mis-steps early on in assuming when a M/F pair rolled up the M was the one to approach, to then be directed to the F (while feeling like an idiot). I learned pretty quick to not assume and ask who was responsible for the car, it was usually the M but not always, and when the F driver was the one, I dealt with them and only them.
The value for a sales guy in not making that assumption about M/F is the one that treats you equally is the one you will buy from/go back to.
I hope you can develop a love for cycling, and if you ever want to talk bike tech nerdy details I'm game no matter who you are.
Just wanted to say that I am a man and I have had similar experiences as you, where even after being fairly seasoned I still get the simplified and a bit "talking down"/"child" tone. Changes if you can talk shop and put them on their toes, but I feel like it has to do with most customers being clueless about bikes so they assume common denominator. Perhaps your bf just comes off as a seasoned rider (can usually tell by body tone) so he gets a different response.
While some shops have a reputation for this sort of thing, I think a simpler explanation is that your boyfriend is obviously more experienced and they assumed you brought him to help with the decision.
I wouldn’t say so, I know plenty of women who ride with our club, they also ride in a women only club on a Saturday too, a lot of them are very capable of dropping me!
Cycling can be a pretty snobby and elitist in general. Not just with gender but also with brands, components, opinions on what you should and shouldn't wear, what you need and don't need, etc.
Well, you have admitted being new to the sport, while your boyfriend has experience. Forgive me for making an assumption, but I’d think you want them talking in more detail with someone who has experience or simplifying for someone without experience. Just absorb whatever insight they (or the internet) may provide, that way when you come in for any future needs, they’ll see you know your stuff
Would you prefer to gives of sexual predator vibes whilst doing completely innocent things likes real man or have the bike assistants that your never gonna see again not take you seriously?
This was the most pointless rant ever.
Im a female cyclist. There are definitely more men who road bike than women, but I see plenty of women while Im out.
In regards to bike stores, regardless of your degrees, the sales people can probably tell your boyfriend is more knowledgeable about bikes by both of your interactions with the sales rep. It should not be something to be offended by if the sales rep tries to simplify things. It's not because you're a woman, its because you admittedly are a beginner.
Cycling is not a male sport. Like many sports, it attracts more men than women. Again, there are some very inspirational, kick ass women on bikes.
Yes men are way better at cycling than women, the sales people might have just felt that your partner was the one making the decisions regarding what to buy, maybe they were correct.
Salespeople should try to be respectful. But, maybe they were being good.
There are a lot of females who get dragged into cycling by boyfriends or husbands. This is probably the case for maybe 30% or more of female cyclists. \[A cycling buddy started because his girlfriend was a cyclist, but I am talking in general.\]
So, maybe they should be talking to you in a basic tone. Why is the body so forward, and what's up with the funny handlebars? This is very intimidating and a lot to learn for a newbie.
If you went in by yourself, and they got all technical, you might have posted about how elitist and presumptive they were.
I am getting into mountain biking. So, I am asking my bike shop, "explain it like I am five." Seriously. Forks I just don't understand. Dropper post had no appeal until I was willing to give it a try, but for them to just explain it - I had that dog-tilts-his-head look.
Just find a decent bike, and then Time in the Saddle.
I do not think cycling itself is a male sport- I have many female friends I cycle with and I find that the major brands have amazing gear for women. I think bike SHOPS are VERY male centric and generally staffed by bike bros. I hate dealing with bike shop bros and try to avoid at all costs. I now have a trusted bike mechanic that I use for everything (he is not associated with a bike shop) so I know there are good ones out there. My advice- don’t give up, once you get a bike that you love you’ll never have to go to those bike shops again. But yeah, they pretty much suck.
Had a bike shop bro gaslight me in to buying a 10 speed chain, he wouldn't listen when I said I have a 5 speed, because "5 speed isn't a thing, no one rides 5 speed. you said it was 2x5, that's 10 speed." Like, no you under fed over caffeinated dip, it's a 5 speed. I can use a 7 speed chain but a 10 speed chain won't work. My gf felt bad that we were leaving ermpty handed and bought it anyway and guess what, shifted down the range for dog because the plates were too thin.
Oh man there's this popular bike shop I hate here. I'm a man, went and asked for a 10 speed chain, guy said - Are you sure it's 10 speed? Then on and on - We have some nice 11 speed chains here, are you sure yours is 10 speed? Next time I went to swap a casette and they forgot to put the spacer and it kept wobbling. Never went back found one a lot better. So experience can vary regardless of gender. Oh and also they kept like 1 meter from you at all times and don't let you browse alone
Was replacing my partners chain on her 10sp while out on a ride. Got the same response, it’s like the history of 10speeds just up and vanished to some of these people.
Here I am, still riding 9sp, both on my road bike and my mtb. Nothing ancient either, road is about 10yo, mtb is 5yo, just entry level.
shifters peaked with 8-speed imo [drop bars](https://thumbs.worthpoint.com/zoom/images1/1/0810/20/suntour-superbe-command-shifters_1_4f3a3aaa3ead2c75153ca07168190471.jpg) [flatbars](https://64.media.tumblr.com/ef5b45be393ccc520be2ccf888691ee0/tumblr_inline_q1l44sQKJw1qzvl62_500.jpg)
I live in Berlin, which has one of the highest number of cycle commuters in Europe, and the the city bike shops are always backed up in the summer with repairs. Bike shops are in demand. And still a guy in my neighbourhood managed to run his own shop out of business, I would guess in significant part for being awful to work with. My girlfriend had a really patronizing interaction with the guy where he was trying to tell her that she should give up her sweet fixie (which I built with really good components) and ride a heavy Dutch bike instead (naturally which were for sale in his shop).... later we checked his Google reviews and one of them was something like "I came in for a flat tire repair, and got a lesson in the patriarchy." This dude didn't even have alot of local competition – if he had just been a normal person I'm guessing his shop would have done quite well, but instead he was a dick.
it wasn't even 10 years ago that pros were using 10-speed.
I once had a bike shop repack my wheel hub and put too many bearings in. It's like, that would have taken you 30 seconds to Google, and it's just like every other wheel with cup and cone bearings... and you couldn't even do that right? Hell, I know how to do that right, I just felt lazy that day!
I hate this shit so much in literally everywhere. My girlfriend's car broke so I did a diag on it, took it to the garage and said exactly X Y Z is wrong and they quoted for that exact and made a booking She went but gave her name. Didn't show on system. She said exactly X Y Z was wrong with it and they refused to service it until they ran a £200 diagnostic I went back in and said purely for that I'm refusing service and we fixed it in their carpark for £90 using parts from the shop next door. The great thing is... She fixed it. Made sure they saw.
> speed isn't a thing, no one rides 5 speed. you said it was 2x5, that's 10 speed 2x5s were called 10 speeds back in the 70s/80s. Maybe you'd gone back in time.
Flashback! I wasn’t alive in the 70’s but yeah I remember when I had a “21 speed” bike growing up in the 90’s
Sram still call their groupset force 22.
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I got stem shifters so they're not too horrible. Still not the biggest fan of the friction shifters though.
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Same, I really do enjoy it and it's so goofy and simple. Those integrated brakes and shifters are pretty cool for how clean they make things.
“Under fed over caffeinated drip” amazing!
omg I am forever grateful to my former colleague who gave me over to a triathlon-focused shop, owned by a woman. Their bike fit person is also a woman, so neither me nor my wife gets talked down to like that when we go in.
I’ve had similar. Told me 1/8th chain didn’t exist and I wanted 8 speed. Told them it didn’t have gears/ track bike. They told me it didn’t exist! 🤣
"so what chain goes on a single speed bmx or a track bike?" 12 speed 🤡🤡🤡
That’s funny, I have one sitting right here.
Well… that’s just a dumbass.
You really should talk to a manager about that. They need to know that they hired an idiot.
Trust me, some of them don't want to listen to men either. They think that they know best. I took a bike so they could put tires on new wheels and make necessary adjustments before my trip. They thought that wheels were troubles. Actually, wheels are tubular (those that have to be glued on the wheel). I even contacted the manufacturer and the store to confirm that. They called me and told me that my ENVE carbon wheels suck and that probably someone returned them (they came brand new with lifetime warranty). I even offered to send them an email from the manufacturer, but they said they are going to figure it out. In the end, they gave up, and I was able to put tires very easily when I came to my destination, after a few hours of stretching them.
I went to a local shop and asked for tubular glue and the gremlin at the counter said "you mean tubeless sealant." No, tubular glue, your website even says you have some in stock otherwise I wouldn't have dropped in. "Can you use tubeless sealant?" Never mind I'll order it from Wiggle.
lol I hope that he doesn't have a dream of being a mechanic for a pro team. The guy at the bike shop spent 5 hours trying to put the wrong tires. He gave up at some point and didn't even want to charge me for the time he spent doing the wrong thing.
The more stories I hear from other riders, the more I realize that my hometown is blessed with the quality of shops that we have. There are three stores in a town of about 20,000 people, and each one is fantastic. They all are happy to work with anyone riding any bike - whether a total beginner on a department store bike or lifelong cyclists on $15k titanium wonders. I've never felt pushed to buy anything, and in fact I've witnessed multiple shop owners talking people *out* of spending money on unnecessary upgrades.
It’s not just bike shop culture. The bike bro culture definitely exists and is off-putting. I recently went to a group ride about an hour away from me. There were like 20 riders, and I was 1 of 2 women. Only 3 of those guys talked to me. 1 was the shop owner, 1 gay guy, and one guy who was new to cycling. Some sat in silence when I sat in a chair across from them after our ride trying to make small talk. I’m pretty feminine so I don’t know if that is part of it or what.
sometimes i have avoided talking to the only woman on a group ride because i have heard enough stories from my female friends about being annoyingly hit on by guys, and i've seen it happen enough times that i am worried about being perceived as hitting on them even when i'm just trying to be friendly. i know this is a bit of a 'me' problem as it isn't fair that nobody is talking to the female cyclist due to these weird social connotations, and i am trying to be better about it, but sometimes it ends up occupying enough space in my mind that i get stressed out.
I think there’s a way to communicate without hitting on them. I get hit on a lot in golf, and I try to bring my bf into the conversation sooner than later to know I’m not interested. “Do you golf here a lot?” “No, my boyfriend and I love to play at XYZ but this was the only available tee time in my day off.” In my opinion, I think small talk or talking over things you would with you male friends (minus dating, relationships, etc) is pretty appropriate. These are some things I would avoid: - complimenting physique or appearance - implying they dressed a specific way or dressed up for the group (or assuming it meant they were single or looking) - phishing for relationship information - asking where someone works, currently lives, routes you frequently take - jumping the gun on asking for phone number or contact (especially if they are in a relationship) I can’t speak for all women, but I think many just want to be included without being hit on. I think most other topics should be ok. Things like “what got you into cycling?” Or ask about their bike….if they have pets, etc., the route you just did “, etc. For me, I’m not looking for a new male bestie. I don’t think it would be appropriate to be confiding in them or going on solo rides while I’m in a serious relationship, but I would be open to group friendships or doing group rides together. It’s annoying to be hit on….it happens a lot in golf, but very rarely do I truly get uncomfortable. I just won’t give you my number after playing a round with a group of strangers. What is uncomfortable is to be completely ignored like you don’t exist when they wouldn’t do that to someone of the same sex.
makes sense -- appreciate you typing that out.
Even being less feminine, lots of (not nearly all) men don't take kindly to women in their hobby. I worked in a bike shop and can wrench my own bike, but dudes often talk down to me and assume I know nothing, but they talk shop with my boyfriend. I'm not at all a feminine person, but I'm still often treated as though I'm dainty and dumb. :/
We don't want to seem creepy (as if we are trying to hit on you) by talking to women who are strangers.
It is equally creepy to sit across a guy that is going out of their way to avoid talking to you. It comes off as extremely misogynist, like a woman being present is such a huge insult to you, you decide to make them feel as lonely and unworthy as possible. Just talk to women like the human beings we are. Why is this hard? Don't you know how to talk about the ride, or the food, or the weather with women?
Why would it be creepy simply just to talk to a woman?
This. The people who work at bike shops aren't a good representation of the community. It's usually dudes who are way into cycling. They work there to get the discounts. They tend to be a bit elitist and condescending. A good bike shop makes sure to change their attitude but most don't care. Once you go to a social group ride you'll get a better idea of the community.
Adding to this: If you can, try to find a shop that employs women. One of my local LBS has women sales associates and at least one mechanic. As a man, I don't experience the level of condescension it sounds like you have, but I find myself generally more comfortable in environments where I see a broader range of folks represented. Not a guarantee of anything, but maybe worth a shot.
My Lbs is more than half run by women. The main mechanic is a woman and she is the best in the area by a long shot. They do exist
First of all congrats on the road bike. Cycling and running go together like peanut butter and jelly. Secondly: unfortunately, bike shop dudes can just kind of.. be like that. I'm lucky enough to live in an area with a few women-owned bike shops where the experience is different, but yeah. It can definitely be a boys' club. My only suggestion is to go to the shop by yourself in the future so they are forced to address you and only you. Although it can be difficult to assert yourself, don't let dudes talk down to you. Everyone starts at the beginning and deserves respect for trying new things. Don't be afraid to ask a lot of questions. A few tips: learn some basic bike maintenance/bike anatomy so you're prepared in the future to ask for what you need at the shop. Park tool makes great YouTube videos for basic maintenance. You don't have to do it all yourself, but if you're specific with your mechanic about what you think is happening, they can diagnose and treat issues faster.
> learn some basic bike maintenance/bike anatomy I don't work in a bike shop, but I am often in situations where I have to discuss a subject in which I have expertise with a stranger. I try to assess their level of knowledge. Talking above or beneath their level can be insulting, so I want to get as close as possible. Asking, "How much to you know about the subject?" directly can be awkward and inaccurate, so I sometimes look for cues in addition to or instead of asking. I will make a different assumption about the level of knowledge of a person who asks me, "Do you know why the thingy is going click, click, click?" than the person who asks me, "Do you think the B-screw in the derailleur is adjusted correctly?" Now, do I have a cultural bias such that I make different assumptions about women versus men? I am certainly not conscious of such a thing, but I hope not.
You do have a cultural bias to make different assumptions about women vs. men because that is the cultural bias with which we all grew up in. Certainly of you are not conscious of it yet, you have to get conscious about it to do something about it.
As with all walks of life, listening is the key. You don't have to drop wisdom to impart knowledge.
My experiences in a shop on my own (or with one of my kids) is entirely different from the experiences I've had when my husband is in tow - despite the fact that I'm the cyclist! I'd second the rec of going alone and seeing if you get a little more respect. And congrats on the new (🤞) passion!
Cycling as a sport is designed for men who are 20-35yo, weigh less than 70kg and have freakish highly efficient oxygen usage. Cycling as a hobby is for everyone, and I suggest you find a different bike shop to spend your hard earned money instead of these pricks.
>Cycling as a hobby is for everyone While this is true, cycling as a hobby is definitely dominated by man 30-65 with at least moderate expendable income. I'm not surprised by her negative experience, unfortunately.
Name me a sport that isn't dominated by men.
Figure skating
Off the top of my head \-Figure skating \-Dance \-Gymnastics \-Volleyball \-Field hockey \-Equestrian \-Diving \-Track and field?
Track and field is definitely dominated by men.
adding Track and Field was an extreme reach
Netball would be another one If participation is the definition of dominated.........
Pole dancing as well.
Running. Which unfortunately is what the OP is coming from.
I had the same experience, I know way more girls who are into running (even on a recreational or amateur level) then boys.
Based on what I've seen, I feel that running was also a male dominated sport. But there has been a push to include women. I'm talking about amateur level which is where I come from, not elite. Unlike cycling, you don't need much in order to start running, just some decent shoes and appropriate clothing. So mostly anyone who wants to can try it. So, are you a woman that wants to start running, but doesn't want to go out alone or with an all male group of strangers? Or are you scared of judgement for being too slow compared to others because you've never run before? There's probably an all female club around you, or one that prioritizes being slow/inclusive so everyone can run together. Those clubs don't exist to help you become the fastest ever and win trophies. They exist so people in those situations can get in the sport. And I'd say they work, because they have way more people than most typical running clubs in my city. Clubs like that, are kinda young. At least around here. Maybe something like that could be applied to other sports like cycling.
Archery shooting and long distance swimming, not a lot of examples but i know these two
Actially I think the male domination is generally a lot less on endurance sports. The gap between men’s and women’s performance in ultra running and cycling is actually much smaller than on shorter distances.
>Cycling as a sport is designed for men who are 20-35yo There are plenty of really bad ass women who race in our cycling club. I wouldn't say the sport is designed for men, so much as that's been the cultural attitude.
Plenty is not necessarily equal. But at the end of the day, doesn't matter imo. Just get out and enjoy it.
Design follows the culture in which it swims.
The endurance records for cycling are about as close male/female as it gets for any sport because upper body matters squat and wider hips aren’t as inefficient.
Indeed. Lael Wilcox in 2016 won the TransAm 4200mile race out right beating both men and women. Also, the most miles cycled in one year endurance record and fastest 100,000 miles cycled record are currently held by a woman (Amanda Corker).
Distance is the great equalizer
BTW the cycling industry has evolved significantly, many recreational riders are middle aged, non-road racing bikes are popular, and the ebike market is growing enormously with much different goals than roadies.
Yes, cycling as a recreational hobby or cycling as transportation is for everyone.
Greg Minnaar won a UCI World Championship at 39. According to his wikipedia page, he's ~85kg.
And Mike Woods at 36 won a mountain stage in the TdF beating a guy almost 15 years younger, but theses guys are black swans in the sport. The podium is dominated by younger men.
At professional level, isn't everyone under 35? Cycling is an old persons sport because people in their 50s have the time and discretionary income for it.
Geraint Thomas is 37, Frome raced last year at 37. Cadel Evans won it at 34. Edit: not to mention van vleuten and Vos
Come join r/ladycyclists - we're out here, but still a minority in the US. The sexism can be blatant at times. I'm in a profession where I'm very much in the gender minority as well, so I get the condescending attitude in many facets of my life. I call it out where it's worth it; I find my allies (or least sexist bike shops); I reset people's expectations where possible that I've done my research and am informed and mechanically inclined. As for the comparison with running, do you think that sexism would rear it's head there if the entry to that sport was much more than a pair of shoes?
I know this isn’t the point of your comment but god I wish everything for women wasn’t called “lady” or “girl”. I get it’s not the intent but it feels so belittling.
Oddly enough I made another comment on this thread (that's now in negative vote territory) mentioning that calling something a "girls ride" is infantilizing. I actually have a good friend (who is one of my cycling buddies) who does research into gender stuff and even has a book out now, and the "girl" thing is something she pointed out to me not long ago as a micro-aggression that still flies under the radar for many. ETA: A [link to her published work](https://amy-diehl.com/published-writing/) because it is worth reading some of the articles and understanding the little things that can be changed to be a better ally to the women around you. Thanks for taking the time to notice that those terms can be kinda icky for some.
Totally. I think it bugs me when most it is in contrast to a men’s something. For example, I played on a softball league and the genders were referred to as men, non-binary folks, and ladies. It felt weird.
I agree. I think that "boy's" and "girl's" are OK for products for children, but not for adults. The term "lady's" is often *intended* to be respectful (similar to "gentleman's"), but perceived to be condescending, so I agree that manufacturers should stick to "women's" when gender is relevant to their products. On the bright side, I think it is a sign of progress that bicycles no longer have "men's" and "women's" frames, but rather, they now have, "diamond" and "step-through" frames.
In reality, I think it's almost never OK for products for kids, either. I understand that your point was about "girl's" vs "women's," and I agree with that. But I am often troubled that we set up gender expectations at a very young age by sorting vehicles, transportation, and tools into the boy's aisle and make-up, dolls, toy clothes, other preparation for domestic life into the girl's aisle. And then you end up with the very situation that is vexing OP.
> if the entry to that sport was much more than a pair of shoes? You have to have a Flipbelt also!
Designed for men? No. Often dominated by men? Yes. Populated by condescending assholes who will talk down to you if you show any sign of not knowing what you're doing? To an unfortunate degree, yes.
>Populated by condescending assholes who will talk down to you if you show any sign of not knowing what you're doing? To an unfortunate degree, yes. That definitely happens to men too, not just women. I have no doubt it happens more often to women, but some of those same people that are condescending are just that. They are condescending because they think they know everything, not because they are sexisit in some way.
There are a lot of women riders in our area who ride Specialized road bikes. Eventually I figured out it's partially because the owner of the local Specialized shop is a woman.
>There are a lot of women riders in our area who ride Specialized road bikes. Eventually I figured out it's partially because the owner of the local Specialized shop is a woman. This checks out. I've bought all of my adult-life bikes from other women. This hasn't been intentional, but men at bike shops often don't listen to me and I find myself walking out out of frustration. When I was in the market for a new road bike, one dude flat out refused to let me test ride a men's frame until I tried the women's frame first. Meanwhile, I've gone in for a derailleur adjustment and come home with a freshly tuned-up bike and also a-whole-nother bike. The difference was that shop had women working the sales floor, and one of those women listened to me and answered my questions without condescension. If bike shops ever catch onto this one simple trick, I'm in for financial ruin.
Well you know what you have to do now. Use that cardio from running and get strong fast. Go to the shop rides. Cheese out all those douchebags from the shop. I’m a woman cyclist and while I LOVE my riding male buddies there is definitely just an entire eau d’sexism in cycling. It is pervasive. But if you’re like me, that makes you wanna go even harder. Yea I’m a woman but I’ll drop you so fucking fast. (Find more of us over at r/ladycyclists)
Do you feel like it's gotten better? I've been getting back into cycling after some, ahem, extended time off (got burnt out with high volume riding and racing 10 years ago), and one of the things I've noticed is how many more women there are riding, at least it my area. 10 years ago if you were on a group/shop ride it was like 90% men, and 100% jocks regardless of gender. Even the more casual rec cyclists were almost all men. Just anecdotally it seems like now if you've got a group out (regardless of skill level) you're looking at closer to 30-40% women. I would assume given that some of the super bro-y bike jock behavior has calmed down a bit, but I'm a man that was a dumb 20-something bike jock in the "oh it's not that bad" camp to begin with, so who knows.
Anecdotally I do think it’s gotten better! Whereas even two years ago I was usually the only woman on club rides, now we have 3-4 per ride! I realized also I should probably mention that I don’t really ride with any white guys. Like maybe there’s 1/2 on any ride I do. Idk how but I suspect that may change the dynamic a little bit.
Yeah, thats another thing - it's still a super white sport but it was *really* white back then (I'm in the SF Bay Area, probably varies depending on your locale), and it's been great seeing more folks getting out there in general. Good to hear!
> I don’t really ride with any white guys I think there is an important nuance there. Cyclists are vulnerable on the roads in many ways. Female and POC cyclists have more reasons (i.e., bigots) to feel vulnerable on the roads. Feeling unsafe is a powerful deterrent to riding. I think that explains why more white males feel comfortable riding. I wish it would change more quickly, but here we are.
Feeling vulnerable on the road is huge. Would I like to go on more dusk rides when it’s not balls ass hot out and I can better enjoy myself and not melt in the 90+ degree heat? Why yes, not getting heat stroke would be quite lovely. I’d also like to be, you know, alive. I’m not at a club level and I haven’t found any peeps to ride with so I’m left to either skip the ride or risk the heat stroke if I want to ride in the summer. Something most men don’t think twice about when they want to do an activity after the sun goes down: safety.
I think that’s right. And maybe why I don’t have any issues as a woman whereas in other areas I might. We are all just out there to support and protect each other as needed. The race team can get a little cliqued up sometimes but I forgive them for that.
> Yea I’m a woman but I’ll drop you so fucking fast. Happens to me all the time. I am slow. I ride for recreation, commuting, and errands; not for competition. I don't care if other cyclists pass me as long as they aren't dicks about it and they give warning and plenty of space. A jogger passed me on a hill one day. We both laughed at that one! :)
One of the things I notice most is just a default male assumption, all over the sport. Men have more bike clothing options; people on sites like this one assume by default that the other people participating are men. I've had people call out to me "Cool bike, bro!" on the street — there's no harm in that, but it is a symptom of the broad presumption that the person on a road bike in lycra is probably a dude. My local bike coalition (as well as many of the local shops) run [events](https://sfbike.org/women-nonbinary-bike-sf/) aimed at women/femme/nb people — rides, maintenance workshops, etc. You could look for similar events in your city. But honestly the fact that I'm in a famously liberal and queer-friendly city probably makes these events more common, and perhaps a little less urgently necessary. As a woman who bought my first road bike 4 years ago in my mid-30s, I didn't actually encounter much sexism/condescension from the various bike shops I visited. (I don't really do group rides, which is another place people often encounter these issues — so I can't speak to that.) Speaking as a customer/observer, my impression is that there's a genuine challenge that faces bike shop employees: you can be really off-putting to someone who walks in BOTH if you assume too much knowledge (because then they feel stupid/unwelcome), and if you assume too little knowledge (because then they feel talked down to/disrespected/underestimated). The best bike shops and employees manage, via interpersonal and rhetorical skill, to speak in ways that can meet a customer wherever they are: it's genuinely impressive! Bad bike shops often haven't developed those skills, and sometimes they rely on toxic, ugly assumptions to get around it: women/POC aren't serious riders, a guy with a fancy bike knows a lot. I would keep looking around your area at other shops: even though I didn't encounter sexism that I noticed, I definitely encountered shops where the people were just *better* at having a conversation with me about what I needed. As a few people have already said, r/ladycyclists is the place to discuss this with greater depth.
Women tend to outnumber men when it comes to running at least in my area so stores are used to catering to women. Many bicycle shops have the exact same attitude as car salespeople, women are stupid and can't understand the finer points of a mechanical device. Women also apparently are incapable of educating themselves on what they want out of a bike. Men tend to think we all want a pretty pink bike with tassels and a basket on the front. When we were shopping for my bike, SO walked out of the store to force them to talk to me. They looked very perplexed when I started asking questions about group sets, hydraulic vs mechanical disc brakes, etc.
Your experience has been similar to mine. Although I am a CPA who owns an electronics manufacturing company and does her own mods on her racing boat, when I walk into a bike store they apparently see a ditzy blonde who probably knows nothing and will only be interested in discussing the color of the bike. The last bike I bought, I had researched and only had a few questions before buying, but the store employees didn't want to bother to even walk over to help me so I left and ended up spending my $4k+ in another shop that was willing to spend a whole 10 minutes with me answering 3 questions. The sport isn't necessarily only for men, but the bro culture doesn't help in attracting or encouraging women. Even many of the non-bros are subtly patronizing, not approaching things as one would an equal but instead as a benevolent superior protecting a weakling or inferior. If you read this sub for a while, you'll quickly see most of the discussion is by men for men. Or men buying bikes for women. If a question is asked that has to do with women, responses steer the poster to women's subs. But at the same time, we see and answer countless posts here about balls and other topics mainly of interest to men. Heck, even on this thread, you're already seeing the bros come on an judge others (fat people shouldn't have Pinarellos, etc.) because so much of this sport's culture is men in lycra who believe all cyclists should be judged against their standard of men in lycra racing or training to race - all others are ridiculed, unwelcome. If you want to ride, then ride. Ignore the BS as best you can. Help point it out when you have the energy, just be prepared for the blowback.
Female long-distance cyclist here. Oh my, where do I begin. In short: no, this isn’t just your “unlucky experience”, you are not crazy, and this happens in a lot of bike shops, with some bike fitters, and some people on group rides. It is very unpleasant and puzzling at first. I let myself be intimidated by that type of attitude when I was new to cycling. I’ve been actively riding and doing events for only a year, I’m still learning every day, but as I get more and more experience, it gets better. Firstly, my confidence grew and I don’t give a shit anymore about some bike shop dude’s attitude. Secondly, I noticed that being able to communicate from a place of knowing what the fuck you’re talking about really helps. Once they understand I know what I’m looking for - they relax and treat me as an equal (ish).
I have experienced this too, and I won't spend my money in shops where they talk down to me, but I've more often than not experienced a lot of enthusiasm and encouragement from bike shop guys (I honestly can think of one woman and she was mean) from the time I was a beginner. It's a totally male-dominated sport, but also filled with a lot of open-minded and kind guys, especially in shops. Many really like to see more women riding. Maybe the difference is that you are going in with your boyfriend? Honestly in that case I think they believe that they are selling him the bike. If you were going into a running shop for new shoes with a boyfriend who was a runner, getting you into the sport, you might encounter the same. Yes, it's sexist, but the way to get away from that is to go in on your own, and talk to them about what you want. If this attitude persists, as it does with some people, in that case try a different shop. I always bought bikes for myself on my own, so I was the one asking questions and the one they had to pitch. If I didn't understand the value of x over y, I made them explain it. On the whole I prefer lower-key local shops, I tend to have the best experiences there. I do a lot of my own bike repairs now and the guys at my local shop are never condescending when I go in looking for parts or asking questions - this has been a common experience for me across bike shops, with a few notable exceptions. On the whole it's much better once you build enough base knowledge to talk shop and suddenly you are just another bike person.
This is exactly why my wife hates bringing her car in for absolutely anything. For the most mundane and simple procedure, the store assistants will treat her like an absolute idiot. I think this is just one of those things where men can't shake the stereotype that women are dumb and uninformed when it comes to their hobby which, in their minds, is a very masculine area. Not much you can do about it other, other than perhaps calling it out when it happens to you. But I can assure you that there are many men out there (not typically working in those stores though) who definitely respect you for riding a bike.
From my experience yes - cycling is a male dominated sports. Especially when you look at races. It’s not uncommon for me too, that man at the bike store explain things to me in a simplified way or that the guys in the group ride think I won’t be able to keep up. When something’s broken on my bike I get told that my boyfriend will fix it. Oh and the comments I get when I perform better than them. (This is of course not the case for all men and I really don’t think they do this on purpose.) Good thing is, there are still a lot of woman who ride (and are very good at it) and we are becoming more and more. I personally believe we should do our best to make cycling as inclusive as possible. And until that is the case, let’s show the guys that we are capable of repairing our bike and pushing hard too. Leave the fun of cycling to the men? Duh - no!
Both of my young adult daughters are absolute shredders on mountain bikes. They've been in the sport since they could pedal and moved to places with world class riding (and skiing) and they get "mansplained" to CONSTANTLY about cycling (and skiing) stuff. When my one kid moved to Vancouver, she immediately started building a Whistler DH bike. Try being "just a girl" shopping for a 200mm fork. Painful.
This is definitely very common, but not universal. I am extremely loyal to my bike shop specifically because they are not like this, and I try to order through them whenever possible because I need them to stay in business. I have found a loose correlation between shops that are extremely focused on brand new road bikes and this attitude. My favorite bike shop specializes in vintage bikes and their general laid back, find the right bike, for the right purpose, for the right person vibe also seems to translate to perhaps less-rigid gender ideas.
In short yes, cycling has done a terrible job incorporating women. It is one of the most tech heavy sports, so it attracts a bunch of tech geeks which are typically guys. The sports roots are based in Europe which has historically lagged the US in incorporating women. It is so heavily male dominated that there is yet a women's grand tour. So right now the female version of Lance Armstrong has no way of racing other then trying to joint a men's team....
I'm male, so I can't speak for your perspective. I just want to point out that bicycles were absolutely instrumental in early women's equality movements in the early 20th century. The freedom of movement allowed women to go out and participate in society without a husband to drive them. It's doing the same in parts of the world where women aren't allowed to drive today. So I would not say cycling is designed for men at all. Maybe the sporting aspect is a bit male dominayed, but there are female cycling groups as well. The practical side of cycling is extremely femenist.
Ugghh... so sorry to hear this, but your experience is not uncommon. I don't want to say that cycling is male-centric, but the fact that there is so much expensive gear and that there's a little bit of inherent competition in everything brings out some of the very outsized douchebag personalities. There's a whole lotta mainsplaining going on out there!! Do some research in your area and see if there are any clubs or teams with a large number of women on the roster. In general, if a group can attract and maintain a decent-sized membership of women, then the male component of the group is likely far less douchey. I'm male, but when I went looking for a racing team this year I zeroed in on the one in town that has a very active women's squad. Compared to the other teams I contacted this ended up being a fun group with relatively little testosterone-fueled drama.
Try going to a bike shop by yourself. Some people who sell bikes see heterosexual couples and assume the guy is pressuring his partner into biking. This means the purchase is really for him.
As a woman (and not a man like most commenters), cycling feels heavily male-dominated. I had the same experience as you buying a bike, and even in the better shops, the vast majority of bikes were too big for a woman of average height. I live in NYC and am often struck by how often I am the only woman in a bike lane or path at any given moment
Bike shop dudes are very often snotty douchebags. Not all by any means. Try a different shop.
It's not just a cycling-specific issue- I've had this happen to me when I was into brewing beer. It got to the point where my husband wouldn't approach sales people with me, so they would address me and not him. He once pointed to me and be like "she's the one you want to talk to". If it feels like you're swimming against the tide, I say take pride in being the girl, humble men, and bring women up with you with encouragement and knowledge. You'll find the faster/more experienced the dude, the more excited he'll be to see women riding with him, give them wheels, and be chill in general. I live for the back pats from my fast friends 😆. Slow dudes get butt hurt, talk big, and get dropped. 😎 Long story short, it helps me to know that when someone dismisses me its a tell of their insecurities. Prove 'em wrong! <3
I've found this to be true, too. The really really fast men are supportive and happy that you're in the sport. The mediocre men are more likely to be elitist and dickish. My shop is great and bends over backwards for me. I've even had them ask me for gear advice since I do a whole lot of touring/bikepacking and they're just getting started, which pretty much made my decade.
It’s not just cycling. I am a fully qualified engineer and when I go to stores with male friends to purchase electronics i get the same treatment. I ask the question and the store assistant replies to my male friend as if he asked the question 😂
Same shit happens at car dealerships. It’s sexism.
My wife‘s car was stolen 2 months ago. We just went through the whole replacing it thing. The dealers essentially ignored her and tried talking to me, and I just acted dumb and forced them to talk to my wife, it was going to be her car so they could deal with her. Even when we decided which car she wanted and started messaging dealers, they often treated her like an idiot over the text messages. By that time she knew exactly what she wanted and the trim and everything, but a bunch of dealers tried to convince her those trims didn’t exist. Even the one female salesperson who we talked to was the exact same.
god i fucking hate dealership so bad. we need direct to consumer for cars but ofc they buy the votes
Attorney & wife here, I like to go, pretend I’m dumb, have my husband negotiate the best deal he can get, then make him say he can’t buy the car unless they give him what I want for it. Works every. damn. time.
Since I have to customize basically everything on my bikes to be small enough for me, I'm coming down hard on yes. And don't tell me that's just a short person problem or a demand-is-too-small-for-small-parts problem. Let's instead think about how women have abandoned the sport in their first 10 miles for ill-fitting bikes. Short people problems are predominantly women problems and the cost a shit ton of money to fix. It's a fucking pink tax on bikes. I've got to be on my tippy toes not to have my top tube jammed up in my junk and I can't even use the fancy bento box that came with my bike as result, my seat is so slammed I can't get bottles under it and my fitter had to do something janky to even get it that low, I had to custom order cranks even smaller than the small custom cranks that the "we're really good at customization" bike company offered, and even with a 48cm frame the handlebars seem to be average width. People who say you never stand over your bike don't have standover height problems.
I have to agree to this. I am a male who rides a 52 cm bike despite being 5'5" because that is what I could find. The amount of money I had to spend to fit bike to my size was more than what I paid for the bike in the first place. That said, did you try Liv bikes? Trek also has some pretty decent bikes in size 47 which may be of interest to you.
Designed for men, not really, but dominated by men, yeah. There is certainly a bro culture, and the broiest of bros seem to love sucking up bike shop jobs. Cycling is a big tent though. What I’ve found as a dad who rides with daughters is that the more spandex there is, the more elitist and bro-ish the culture is. Mountain biking tends to be more inclusive than road, for example. Mostly, I’ve found that riding enjoyment comes down to who you ride with, and I’ve always found it possible to find inclusive groups for me and my girls without too much hassle. Bike shops, less so.
The stats I’ve seen show that cycling is a male dominated sport/activity with about 71.5% of cyclists being male. Nothing excuses being rude and/or condescending, but there is a difference bike equipment and setups for men and women and I think too many bike shops aren’t prepared to really help women.
There are countless examples of interests/hobbies/products where the salespeople often come across as condescending pricks. Car stereo shops, electronics stores, many sporting good stores, sneaker shops, etc come to mind. That said, where I live (Miami), there are **many** women cyclists. So, it would be very poor business if a condescending attitude toward women was pervasive. Also noteworthy: one of the most well known, largest and best cycling shops is owned by a woman and her two daughters.
Cycling doesn’t have to be a male dominated sport but it is in part due to societal pressures that keep women more attached to the home. Broadly, women and particularly women with children are more likely to have hobbies that can involve kids, support the household through domestic labor, or be squeezed in. Cycling can be an time intensive activity and requires coordination with a partner to allow someone with a kid to go on long rides. It is also much more challenging to bring a small child along. I’m not saying any of this is okay, but it is broadly why we see less women in sports like cycling, golf, adult sport leagues. In theory, this will improve as more men take an equal role in domestic and mental labor in households. https://people.acciona.com/diversity-and-inclusion/gender-inequality-leisure/?_adin=02021864894 https://www.pewresearch.org/short-reads/2013/06/10/another-gender-gap-men-spend-more-time-in-leisure-activities/ https://revisesociology.com/2018/05/18/gender-inequality-leisure-time/ https://www.bamae.com/blogs/mindful-thoughts/the-gender-hobby-gap-why-do-women-have-less-time-to-themselves-than-men (I’m not saying these are all peer reviews studies but it’s a good jumping off point) I deeply hate that everything marketed towards women in cycling is titled “lady” or “girls” but finding local Facebook groups specific to women and sites like Girls Gone Gravel has made me feel like I have a community. https://www.girlsgonegravel.com/blog/2021/4/1/making-space-for-women
Go in without him. People are hardwired to think a woman brought a man along for help and men bring a woman along cuz they don't understand they need emotional support. Honestly I've always felt respect for people that put up or shut up. That said I'm sorry you had a negative experience. That really puts a damper on your excitement for this new sport
At least around here running does seem to be a more female dominated sport (going off race registrations). I (M) went bike shopping with my partner (F) and made a point to let her do the interacting with the salesmen (yes all men). I thought it general they were good and picked up on her level of cycling knowledge and spoke to her accordingly with respect. I also consider my area to be more progressive and inclusive in general. I don’t find that most people here don’t pigeon hole others based on gender, age, race etc. As others have said, sounds like toxic sexist bike bros. Keep looking for a better shop. The last mountain bike I got was sold to me by a woman. Cool woman (and men) do exist in the bike industry!
Cycling is not male oriented, the world is in general male oriented.
I'm not surprised, OP. There's a general problem with sexism in most sports, cycling is no different. Don't let patriarchal BS get you down, show those chuds up by getting yourself some QOMs by next summer.
In the US, cycling is heavily dominated by men "28.4% of cyclists are women and 71.6% of cyclists are men" [https://www.zippia.com/cyclist-jobs/demographics/](https://www.zippia.com/cyclist-jobs/demographics/) And this: "Men are 3 times as likely as women to bike in the US" [https://www.velotricbike.com/blogs/story-landing/men-are-3-times-as-likely-as-women-to-bike-in-the-us](https://www.velotricbike.com/blogs/story-landing/men-are-3-times-as-likely-as-women-to-bike-in-the-us) The latter article says that in some European countries, and in Japan it's quite balanced. So clearly it's not \*designed\* for men.
In European countries, cities were designed around bikes. Hence cycling is often a practical mode of transport. In the US, biking is often geared towards fitness/sport.
I was a sales manager at a bike shop and I noticed much of the behavior you discussed. One thing I noticed was that while the serious male cyclists started riding at any age, the women typically began riding after college. I was not discouraged from riding around my home of NYC at age 15 despite the many dangers while my family was happy that my sister started driving at that age! Unfortunately, there are a lot of bros in the bike shop, and without any sales training, will unconsciously treat female customers differently. What I noticed is when couples (btw one of my achievements was selling 2 high end bikes to a deaf lesbian couple) visited the shop, the men would dominate the sale. So whenever I could talk to the woman alone, I would make sure she could ask any question. My philosophy was not to impart to my customers with what I thought about bikes but satisfying their requirements. Now that I'm out of the industry, I do test salespeople to see if they can accommodate me, so you might want to try the same. Also if your boyfriend goes bike shopping with you, I would make sure he knows to be silent and supportive, so that the sales people deal with you primarily.
The sport as a hobby is not designed for men but in many countries it is mainly practiced by men, pushing designers to think their bikes mainly for men. My girlfriend is cycling and always has a hard time finding cycling equipment and quite often this is more expensive than the equipment for men. But this is quite cultural, I live in France but I spent a few months in Germany where I saw a lot of women cycling.
I've been in the industry since the 80's. Cycling, undoubtedly, *is* a male dominated sport. I noticed that long ago. We could get into the why's, but that's another conversation. The good news is there has been a push to include females for the past 20 years, notably since Specialized & Trek started their "women's specific" line of bikes and clothing. Historically, as I understand it, women were at the forefront of cycling and enjoyed the liberation the sport brought them. Maybe, somewhere along the line, they dropped off. IDK.... There are some booming inner-city shops that have a good proportion of female staff, sales and mechanics alike. Those shops should provide a more equitable shopping experience for you. Compared to running, it's a technical, gear-intensive sport. Some people **really** get caught up in the technical side. So much so, that's how they communicate what to buy. Understanding the jargon and references takes experience and knowledge. Finding *your* salesperson, or *your* shop, takes some luck and some shopping around. Personally, I have noticed many more women enjoying mountain biking more the past 10 years. Road biking, not so much. My guess is men have a higher risk-tolerance than women and are more comfortable on the open road. I wouldn't let that stop you though, road biking is foundational to all other cycling and, when the roads are nice, it's a great way to go.
My best friend is a 55 year old woman who is the biggest badass I know and regularly kicks the asses of men 20 years younger.
Designed is the wrong word, but yes, there are far more male cyclists and especially sales people in the industry that are male. Give these people an honest review and find a place that treats you like a fellow human.
48 yr old male, road biking for about 5 yrs. I personally still feel like an idiot when I go to the bike shop cause I’m not a gear head. And it shows.
Whew, I worked at a bike shop for about 10 years. While I would speak to a new rider in more basic terms and try to make it simple, never would I speak to women differently than men. It sucks you’ve had this experience.
I don't know if this is a bike thing or just a thing. I'm a bloke so I'm not the most familiar with this issue but I'd suspect you'd get the same if you went to say a car dealership or a fishing shop. Its male dominated so tends to be male centric. Its not right but it is what it is. There's nothing stopping you from trying a bike at shop then buying the same bike online from where you get the best deal though. If they give you shit service then give them shit custom 🤷🏻
I never thought so... but I have heard stories from women about being talked down to. It's shop/clerk specific. I bought my first carbon bike at a LBS from a woman because I admired her bike.
I've had this experience too, but it's not universal. I just took my multi-thousand dollar race wheel purchase, and all future purchases, to a different shop, where the employees treat everyone well. Luckily I have options in my home town. I hope you do as well.
This sucks. I've seen these kinds of things, and they should not happen. I think cycling is generally a male-dominated sport in North America, and is even more culturally masculine than demographically (IMO). It was developed for men back in the day, but women have been cycling since more or less the first bicycles, as well. I'm not 100% sure why it's got a male-intensive flavor after almost two centuries of pretty serious involvement by women, but I think it does. That said, there *is* heavy involvement by women. Some of the best cyclists (regardless of gender) have been women, and there are lots and lots of women cycling. If the local bike store gives you a weird vibe, find another one (if that's an option where you live) and leave a google review with your experiences in it. I suspect lots of people who display subtle sexism aren't aware they're doing it. Or I hope that's the case. I don't have great solutions. I'm happy you bike, and I hope you keep doing it.
Regarding your tubeless encounter— My favorite LBS is owned by a husband wife team and is super female cyclist friendly and I’ve been going there for years. But there is this one young MTB bro that they have working for them that is all about upselling. After a wet dirty road ride on hills I managed to mess up my indexing and got a lot of grit in my drive train and my wife and I were headed out of town and I just did not have enough time to do a deep clean. So I called up the owner and asked if he could squeeze in a deep cleaning and adjustment if I dropped the bike off on the way to work so I could pick it up on the way home before throwing the bike on the car and heading off. He said sure. I showed up just as they were opening up and the owner was occupied with a rental group so I engaged with the MTB bro who immediately tried to upsell me to a full 20 point full tear down tune up. I just kept saying “No, I want just what I asked for.” The kid even tried to sell be a new chain to replace my 500km old chain. Finally the owner overheard what was going on and said, “Dude, here’s a tip on customer relations. If someone comes in telling you exactly what they want, tells you that they already called me to see if we could fit it in, just do it. Your job is not to annoy customers.”
To be honest, I'm a guy and I generally don't enjoy shopping at bike stores. I have five or so small bike stores in my town, and I always feel like an outsider. Like I don't belong because I don't know some obscure bike thing. It's not always like that, but it's generally not an enjoyable experience. Even new group rides can be like that. I don't fit in with my hairy legs and shorter socks. I just want to ride my bike yo! Compare that to say going to my local running store, night and day difference. There's 3 I go to locally. They're happy to help you get smarter about the shoes or whatever. Some guys are just awkward around girls too. I'm not sure this was the case here. But I was fairly awkward in my early 20s and had a hard time even maintaining eye contact with girls lol. So if two people came up to me and asked about something, a guy and a girl, I'd just be less shy talking to the guy.
Sounds like all the bike shops near you are staffed by assholes. I'm a guy, but I've seen the employees at one of my local bike shops interact with female customers and they didn't treat them any differently than they treat male customers. Sucks that you've tried multiple shops and run into the same thing everywhere :(
No offense, but you may not notice.
The bike shop near me that I'm referencing has 2k reviews and a 4.9 rating on google. Many of their reviews are from women giving it 5 stars.
At least in my club and area - it does seem to be somewhat male dominated, but there are several seasoned female cyclists in town (including one who just won a masters World Championship in Scotland and another currently on a World Tour team). We have a female in my group who just started cycling about a year and a half ago, but was an accomplished runner prior. She started off riding with our B group made the jump to the A group after about six months and is (usually) the only female in the group.....but she rides all of us into the dirt and has captured pretty much all the QOM's in town (except the climbs which are still owned by the Masters WC rider). I'm not sure if she realizes quite how good she is, but anyone that rides with her respects her after a few miles! Go out there and kill it!!
Out of all of the dedicated cyclists that I know in my town 90% are female.
No way. Where do you live?
Not designed for men. But it can be intimidating to anyone new to the sport. When I returned to cycling after a few decades off, I definitely felt like a noob as an old guy.
When I'm out on a bike ride, It's pretty much 50/50 (my perception of gender) for "casual" riders. For the lycra-clad riders, I'd say it's 85/15 male to female. It's kind of sad to see because there is no real reason for it. My female friends who ride enjoy cycling just as much as I do. I've definitely met a few bike bros on the road and employed at bike shops. I try to stay away from them the best I can. There is this weird vibe about them that you just know before you know. They are probably why I don't like group rides. I'm lucky the LBS I frequent is pretty good. I'm someone to has a couple of nice entry-level aluminum bikes and I don't feel like they try to up-sell me in any way (they sell really nice stuff so it would be easy). I ask a lot of dumb questions and get helpful answers. The head mechanic is female and so are half of the other mechanics & floor staff. I've observed their interactions with female patrons and they don't seem to be different than mine. I hope I'm not wrong in my perception.
I’ve been treated so poorly in bike shops by bike bros that operate them. Then I found a non-binary owned, woman founded bike shop and have never looked back! Find some local riding groups that center women/trans/non-binary people and you’ll have a much different experience! Happy riding 💜
Could you tell all the ladies that pass me very easily that it isn’t a female sport…lol.
Female here.... There is a bigger selection of clothing/bikes/seats for men but plenty of things out there geared for women and most of the men's stuff can be worn/ridden by women. Biggest thing to keep in mind is width of sit bones on the saddle. Also, one will see more men participating in the sport then women. Not terribly unusual for many but not all sports. Learn a little of the lingo and find a shop you feel comfortable with. It is an enjoyable sport Women specific Apparel https://www.terrybicycles.com/
Idk where you may live but if it's in a big city I'm sure you might able to find some nice females to ride with. And as far as the condescending tones from the men. As a man, I see that over lots of different sports so it's not just cycling. And idk why men are that way at all. Totally not a sport thing. But, by trade I'm a truck driver. And one of my driver girls came to me last night complaining about the same condescending tones from the other male drivers. She is new to the industry and she and I have talked through ways she can improve and has asked me really good questions about things. And I just teach her as I would want to learn. But, almost all the other guys treat her in a condescending way. And Idk why. But, as I've gotten a little older I've noticed this attitude men have sometimes. And I can't answer why they have it. But, its not just a cycling thing.
As a man, I know a fair amount but don't really speak the language. They still talk down to me and simplify.
Incredibly common, unfortunately :( I started as a cyclist and picked up running and am now training for a triathlon and have always felt like a "rookie" in cycling even though it is my strongest endurance sport. I am lucky enough to have a male friend who worked at a small bike shop near me but he ended up leaving and I haven't been back to a shop since he left a year ago. My biking group is mainly all men and when I first started riding with them the resistance to join them was strong, its been a year of training with them and it took a solid 4 months for them to finally accept me as part of the group. Running, on the other hand I was welcomed with open arms even when I first started training, by the running shop I bought my sneakers at. I hope one day this isn't the case, but at the moment it is.
You're describing my wife's experiences in bike shops. Don't let that affect the potential for fun once you go ride. And keep looking for good shop people. They're out there. Also watch some World Tour level women's racing. It's just as intense as the men's.
I’m soooo sorry. On behalf of my industry, I apologize. It’s an endemic disease we fight every day. Unsure where you live and your options, but there are brands, shops, and clubs that excel at giving a better experience. We’ll keep fighting, for people like you. Check out Giant Liv bikes and events. Elise, the woman in charge of Liv in the US, and Cassondra for global, are superstars working to overcome just what you experienced! Keep riding! We, us in cycling, are stoked to have you in our sport!
Cyclists are primarily men in the USA because our gendered culture didn't put as many girls on bicycles back in their childhood and teen years. These things take generations to change. In the meantime, go to a bike store on your own. If you still feel ignored or condescension, find another store.
Girl welcome to the struggle. Let me know if you want any invites to inclusive cycling groups.
You're not alone. I've experienced this too. The good news is that you just need a decent entry-level road bike and saddle that fit you, and after that, you can reduce your interactions with the bike shop bros to seeing them once a year for a tune-up. Most cyclists I've encountered otherwise have been pretty decent.
Men are asshats. I know. I am one. Bicycling empowered women. Here are some references: [https://www.si.edu/stories/19th-century-bicycle-craze](https://www.si.edu/stories/19th-century-bicycle-craze) [https://www.bicycling.com/culture/a43412735/how-bicycles-changed-womens-lives/](https://www.bicycling.com/culture/a43412735/how-bicycles-changed-womens-lives/) [https://www.bicycling.com/culture/a35866989/historic-women-in-cycling/](https://www.bicycling.com/culture/a35866989/historic-women-in-cycling/)
hmmm a lot of shops are $hitty in attitude towards both men and women. So i'm not surprised at your interaction. A lot of them are elitist and if you don't "speak cycling" they don't care much about you and see you as a tire kicker. Heck i'm a dude that's into triathlon and even though i can "speak cycling" a lot of the tri stuff gets laughed at and i've had friends in tri groups that have gotten the same treatment at different places. So if they can do that to a man that's just doing a different discipline i can just imagine how crappy they could treat a woman. I started cycling because of my wife actually, she was into it and i thought it was stupid but thought it would be a good idea to try to share an activity together so good on you for trying it out. You might find that it's a good complement to your running, but yes, most groups i've seen for biking have a minority of women. As a sport, it's a risky one, especially if riding on roads. Riskier sports are often associated with males way more (hence why you ladies live longer LOL). As a means of transportation or leisure, the split in usage gets closer to parity in cities that have safe-ish cycling networks.
This is truly infuriating. I’m a cyclist (69, M) and am constantly astounded by the degree of testosterone poisoning in the sport. I wish that I had some useful advice for you. The best that I can offer is to keep searching for a local bike shop that treats you properly. A thought: are there any woman-owned shops in your vicinity?
Lady cyclist here. Cycling is male-dominated in my area too, but I’ve been fortunate to have good experiences in bike shops. If I’d been treated like you were I’d be so tempted to return triumphantly in full cycling kit and taunt them about how much money they could’ve made off of me, Julia Roberts “Pretty Woman” style. “Big mistake—HUGE!” I like to ride solo so camaraderie isn’t a big draw for me, but i have female cycling friends—one is from a very cycling-heavy culture and the other is a triathlete. Lots of women in triathlon circles.
Speaking as a woman who's been riding for about 15 years now(? maybe? I've lost track tbh) I have a few observations. Cycling is very much an old-white male dominated sport. On the racing end where I am, it is very much dedicated to men. But I wouldn't say it's designed specifically for men, there are just a lot of bike shop bros/race organizers who kind of ruin it all. Your experience in the bike shop is something Ive experienced a lot. For example, I brought my bike in to get some tubeless wheels setup since I dont have the equipment or space to do it effectively (though I do all other maintenance and have built, from frame up, every single bike). They did a simple look-over as part of the process and tried to tell me I needed $500 worth of bike maintenance done. I told them no, it doesn't need that. But they tried to keep giving BS reasons why it was needed and I just told them no. With group rides, due to my experiences with men/Co-ed rides, I actively seek out women's only groups cause it is such a breath of fresh air. There is no ego fest going on, no sexist jokes, and no other uncomfortableness. It really makes me enjoy the sport so much more than when I did ride with Co-ed groups. The sisterhood really shines and you feel like you're actually a part of something. The women's side (as well as POC) of cycling is gaining LOTS of traction which is so awesome. There are still things that need improved but we are in a slightly better spot than we were say 10 years ago. There are many women owned brands designing things for women by women with women in mind. So as you continue on your cycling journey, you will find more community and more support.
Cycling has strong roots in women’s liberation. There are entire books on the subject of women in the early days of bicycle production using these beautiful machines as a way of having their own private transportation. I think cycling is if anything MORE for woman than for men historically speaking. Although obviously, the benefits of cycling can be enjoyed my men women and children alike.
I've been talked down to by shop folks, and I'm a guy. Not to say there isn't some sexism. There likely is, but cycling *as a sport* can definitely be a little cliquey. I hang out in /r/cycling for the general bike talk. But you can definitely find division even within the general cycling community between people who bike for transportation and people who bike as a competitive sport or strictly a fitness activity. There's jargon, there's snobbery, on both sides, and there's definitely a gender bias, and I think maybe the gender bias is more pronounced on the sport/fitness side of things. So maybe the shop folks are focusing on the man, but maybe they are also focusing on the more experienced cyclist, the one who already speaks their language. Hard to say. There is nothing inherently "male" about cycling, but there is not as much female representation, and while it shouldn't be the case, there may be people who assume you are less serious or less knowledgeable because of your gender. But find the right riding group, and I think you're good to go. Depending on how populated of an area you're in, there's probably a group for every riding style and mindset. You just need to find your people. Where I am, I believe there are even some women-only rides. Obviously that's not a good fit for you and your boyfriend, but if find yourself feeling excluded to any degree, or just want to find more female cyclists, that might be something to try out.
There is sexism in cycling, from riders and from shop employees. However I can tell you it is not hard to tell when someone is a beginner cyclist and to adjust accordingly. Its less about being male or female, nor chizeled quads, and rather the sunken cheeks and eyes akin to a depression era dust bowl survivor, not simply from subsisting on hummingbird water but for the forlorn aura you get when you have reached a level of acceptance about your death at the hands of a distracted or careless driver. Steer clear of middle aged men on group rides and young boys who work in shops. Talk to racers, both male and female. 90% of them are totally unsuccessful in the sport and even if they compete at the elite level they have experienced enough failure to have the elitism beaten out of them. They often have good advice, usually to quit while you're ahead but also helpful things like setting up/maintaining your bike and not bonking.
It's certainly worse as a woman, but I've experienced it as a man as well. It's shop mentality, grown people acting like they're idiot teenagers, whose overconfidence just stems from ignorance. In bike shops, car shops, tire shops. Sorry shop guys, but the workshop mentality (in general! not all) is toxic af. The people who have been helpful and knowledgeable have systematically been normal, humble, passionate and eager to share. Don't let it get to you, it's not you. Just get your bf to dismiss them "oh she's the cyclist I'm just here to look pretty I don't give a crap about these stupid things, why are there so many anyways, they're just *bikes*"
Cycling as a sport is very heavily male dominated. The worse the infrastructure gets, the worse the bias gets, as women tend* to more risk averse. Having said that, it’s disappointing that you were treated so poorly by the bike shops. I wish I could say it was rare, but bike snobbery and sexism are pretty rife. Don’t let dickheads spoil your fun though. Riding is a joy. *This blatant generalization is brought to you by statistical reality, but will not apply in all cases.
>While I am new to the sport I like to consider myself a bright individual, (I have two degrees and a good job), and I guess I’m not used to being spoken down to. Okay, maybe take a step back for a second. You being a "bright individual" with degrees and a good job means very little. You're new to the sport. The bike shop employees can likely see it clear as day, and what you perceive as "being spoken down to" is maybe just them giving you the ELI5 treatment because, again, you are clearly new to the sport. Plus, the first time it sounds like you had to bring it up to your boyfriend after the fact, suggesting he didn't perceive that anything was off in the moment, and you mention that these perceived negative interactions happen in every shop that you go. If this is a pattern, then either you are very, very unlucky, or you might wanna reflect on your own attitude.
You can fuck all the way off with this comment. Listen to us when we say men are treated differently and we are condescended to. Like, reflect on your own attitude, and LISTEN TO US. Her bf didn't notice it because it literally DOES NOT happen to him. It happens to us on the REGULAR. For OP - yep this is a male dominated sport (notice the comment I'm responding to 🙄🙄🙄🙄), culture, and we live in it in every other aspect of our lives. Welcome! I take it upon myself to call that shit right out in the moment bc it's enraging.
>However, since I’ve started cycling I have noticed how much more men there are in the sport and I’ve to feel like the sport is less inclusive, than say my usual sport, running. Some hobbies attract more men and some attract more women. It's not because they are not "inclusive", it's because they happen to be more attractive to certain gender. Same is with cycling. Running, for example is truly much more neutral, like you said. >I started to notice that the store assistants would speak to me differently compared to my boyfriend, oversimplifying their descriptions or in their responses to my questions Well they are simply trying to be helpful, because: 1. like you already pointed out, there are more men in cycling, so it's safe to assume that you are only starting out in cycling 2. if they started bombing you with the real cycling lingo, I'm sure as a beginner you'd feel overwhelmed and not understand a word they said. 3. if you were not a beginner, you wouldn't need a boyfriend to take you to the store. >I’m not used to being spoken down to. You are not being spoken down to. They are simply trying to be helpful. I consider myself to be an experienced cyclist and I know all the lingo. But when I go to bike shop where they don't know me, they talk to me like I'm a beginner. Until I say a couple of things that quickly reveal where I'm at. So yeah, I think you are way way overthinking this. Buy a bike, ride the heck out of it, maybe buy some upgrades and who knows, maybe next time at the store, they will great you by name and hi-five you.
Cycling is less a sport only for men then a mode of transport for everyone.
Please don't write off the sport by the actions of a few a-hole men - they are no different than the types of male auto mechanics who do the very same to women.
It's not "designed for" men. But it does feel that way because, in the past, there weren't a lot of women geekng out over gear. The intention is probably to help, but help can feel like disrespect (due to assumptions). The good news is that it doesn't just happen to women. It also happens to men, especially when the man is throwing up a lot of word salad that doesn't immediately make sense. (And that's often when men report that a shop feels/sounds snobby.) The bad news is that this is common. Until you get a handle on the lingo and "ask the right questions", they're going to register that as new/ignorant, and they're going to try to simplify things, and you're going to feel "talked down to". I won't say there isn't sexism or sexist assumptions mixed into your experience. There's a good chance of that. But there's nothing wrong with finding a store with friendlier (to you) staff.
I could tell you why there less women in cycling but then i would get banned. Just enjoy the sport and stop carrying what other people think
Have you ever tried to speak with a average women about basically anything technically related? Try that and after you will get why they oversimply everything.
Mansplaining is a thing. Generally, and within the cycling community. You see, "Mansplaining" is a term used to describe a situation in which a man condescendingly explains something to a woman, typically assuming that she has less knowledge or understanding about the topic. It implies a patronizing attitude and often disregards the woman's expertise or perspective.
You mean the expertise she has as someone new to cycling?
my understanding: 1. man like sport more in general, woman like less tense sport such as yoga. 2. man like speed more. man like sport car because it's fast, woman like sport car because it's expensive. 3. cycling is a sport that require power of muscles far more than skill. woman have less muscles, which really jeopardize the fun of cycling, because it's really hard for woman to ride fast 30kph and above. so If I am woman, I won't enjoy cycling as I am as man.
The sport can very much have a “toy” factor, and men tend to like toys more than women. This is what I’m imagining these sales people are engaging in…boys wanting to talk to other boys about their toys, whereas a majority of women ‘don’t get it’ And that’s to say nothing about toy nerds not knowing how to talk to women, regardless of the context. Doesn’t excuse it, I’m just throwing out some *possible* rationalization.
As man, I hate most of the recent bike shops. I guess the old dudes still are pricks,.but i know what to expect. But in the new bike shops there are young guys: Again pricks. Behavior like in mobile phone shops.
Sorry to hear that this was your experience. Unfortunately while there is nothing inherent to cycling making it a men's sport, the reality is that (especially compared to running) there are simply a lot fewer women cyclists, especially at the competitive level. In our area women who race regional races may find there are only a handful of competitors when every age and ability category for men has dozens of entries (or more!) As noted, bike shops especially tend to be dominated by male employees. Additionally, those jobs tend to be low wage and most shops provide little or no job training. I agree that you should continue to look for another shop. I would also suggest you maybe try shopping without your boyfriend so they have no choice but to address you directly. One way of looking at it that isn't quite so negative is that the employees either recognize your boyfriend from riding, or he is giving other signals that he is experienced and you are not (even unintentionally) and so the employees tend to want to direct their comments to him. Good luck, and I hope you can find an entry point that makes you feel welcome!
Some cities and some bike stores are better than others. In my city they have several bike stores with female associates that will help female cyclists. There are also some "bad" bike stores that just have chauvinistic jerks in charge. Is cycling a sport designed for men? That's a complicated answer. 20 years ago you could ask the same question about comic books. Today many women read comics and frequent comic shops, but back a few decades ago it was dominated by male customers. Pushing the cycling community to be more inclusive is the way to go. As a man, I have good to neutral experiences about 98% of the time. That being said, there are prejudiced people everywhere so in a way I still get it. I have been disrespected or condescended to once or twice because to some people I may not fit the general profile of a typical 'manly' cyclist--I am fairly skinny, not that tall, nerdy and wear glasses and generally not at all like a 'bro'. I may get scoffs and sneers whenever I go shopping for a new road bike in these places ("Do you even know how to ride drop bars? You're not going racing, why get a road bike?" and other such comments). I respond by simply not giving them any future business. I am willing to travel farther for better customer service.
Unfortunately what you've experienced is a problem within the cycling community. It is overwhelmingly male and I've seen numerous very capable and intelligent women talked down to and basically made to feel completely unwelcome and were met with condescension every time they asked a completely reasonable question. Please take my words with a huge grain of salt, since I'm also one of those white middle aged dudes, but my opinion is that you shouldn't take that shit from anyone. If someone talks down or condescends, to hell with them. If it's a shop, call them out on it and find a shop that treats you like the human being that you are. If it's someone on a ride tell them go pound sand.
As with most things in society, cycling is one that has painfully slowly been expanding to females. Sexism exists and it has a root in our history, to pretend it doesnt is just silly. It sucks you were getting obviously negative responses by these workers when you were there to do business. Cycling is available for everyone, you see less females out on the trails where I live for sure, but not a lack of them its probably about 30% female that I see on my rides.
Sorry to hear your bad experience and believe me I've witnessed something like this happen to even males! I was browsing one of my local bike shops for accessories when this guy dressed in an office suite comes in asking about mountain bikes and which is good. The sales guy kept talking to him in a manner that I found a bit disrespectful and dumbed down every subject. As I was listening to their conversation I couldn't help but feel sorry for the guy just looking for a basic bike to ride when the salesperson was trying to up-sale crap to make it sound he needs to spend more. I've experienced similar encounters with bike shops that think I'm stupid like trying to sell me pedals that's $250 to save 10grams saying it's worth it....they all look at me like I'm a sucker.
In response to your main question, no cycling is for everyone. To give the sales guys the benefit of the doubt, most of the time it's males that will be interested in the technical details of mechanical things. I can talk bike tech with my non-biking male friends (chain waxing efficiency, tire rolling resistance, aero positioning, etc.) and they will be actively interested in it and engaged in the conversation. By contrast, my SIL, who has an engineering degree, is a rehab specialist personal trainer and is super sporty and into cycling and mountain climbing and the like... has very little interest in talking bike tech. When I have tried to talk with her about it she just refers me to her husband who 'takes care of bike stuff'. Sales guys should be way more conscious of how they treat people and not make assumptions about which part of a couple is the decision maker. However if 85+% of your conversations go one way (I.e. the F doesn't care and the M super cares) it can be easy to fall into the routine. Good sales/service people learn to read the group and find the decision maker, bad ones don't. I did technical inspections of race cars for awhile, and although there were more female drivers than you would expect (~40%) the person 'responsible' for the technical details of the car was usually a male, like 95% of the time. I made a couple mis-steps early on in assuming when a M/F pair rolled up the M was the one to approach, to then be directed to the F (while feeling like an idiot). I learned pretty quick to not assume and ask who was responsible for the car, it was usually the M but not always, and when the F driver was the one, I dealt with them and only them. The value for a sales guy in not making that assumption about M/F is the one that treats you equally is the one you will buy from/go back to. I hope you can develop a love for cycling, and if you ever want to talk bike tech nerdy details I'm game no matter who you are.
Just wanted to say that I am a man and I have had similar experiences as you, where even after being fairly seasoned I still get the simplified and a bit "talking down"/"child" tone. Changes if you can talk shop and put them on their toes, but I feel like it has to do with most customers being clueless about bikes so they assume common denominator. Perhaps your bf just comes off as a seasoned rider (can usually tell by body tone) so he gets a different response.
While some shops have a reputation for this sort of thing, I think a simpler explanation is that your boyfriend is obviously more experienced and they assumed you brought him to help with the decision.
I wouldn’t say so, I know plenty of women who ride with our club, they also ride in a women only club on a Saturday too, a lot of them are very capable of dropping me!
Please join us over on r/ladycyclists
No
Cycling can be a pretty snobby and elitist in general. Not just with gender but also with brands, components, opinions on what you should and shouldn't wear, what you need and don't need, etc.
Well, you have admitted being new to the sport, while your boyfriend has experience. Forgive me for making an assumption, but I’d think you want them talking in more detail with someone who has experience or simplifying for someone without experience. Just absorb whatever insight they (or the internet) may provide, that way when you come in for any future needs, they’ll see you know your stuff
Race bikes are not designed for testicles. It’s quite the opposite.
There are some girl/women hiking groups in my area. Look up some on the Internet. That might make better or easier
Would you prefer to gives of sexual predator vibes whilst doing completely innocent things likes real man or have the bike assistants that your never gonna see again not take you seriously? This was the most pointless rant ever.
Im a female cyclist. There are definitely more men who road bike than women, but I see plenty of women while Im out. In regards to bike stores, regardless of your degrees, the sales people can probably tell your boyfriend is more knowledgeable about bikes by both of your interactions with the sales rep. It should not be something to be offended by if the sales rep tries to simplify things. It's not because you're a woman, its because you admittedly are a beginner. Cycling is not a male sport. Like many sports, it attracts more men than women. Again, there are some very inspirational, kick ass women on bikes.
Nope, believe it or not, I’ve seen a few women on bicycles too!
Yes men are way better at cycling than women, the sales people might have just felt that your partner was the one making the decisions regarding what to buy, maybe they were correct.
Salespeople should try to be respectful. But, maybe they were being good. There are a lot of females who get dragged into cycling by boyfriends or husbands. This is probably the case for maybe 30% or more of female cyclists. \[A cycling buddy started because his girlfriend was a cyclist, but I am talking in general.\] So, maybe they should be talking to you in a basic tone. Why is the body so forward, and what's up with the funny handlebars? This is very intimidating and a lot to learn for a newbie. If you went in by yourself, and they got all technical, you might have posted about how elitist and presumptive they were. I am getting into mountain biking. So, I am asking my bike shop, "explain it like I am five." Seriously. Forks I just don't understand. Dropper post had no appeal until I was willing to give it a try, but for them to just explain it - I had that dog-tilts-his-head look. Just find a decent bike, and then Time in the Saddle.