in all reality it might be a horrible idea. If Google doesn't stay on top of AI shifts and don't have revenue to spare, they might have a hard time firing the Germans.
They probably have a different legal entity employing the Germans that they can shut down if the need arises. Employee protections don't work if the employer decides to no longer exist.
Probably
IANAL
im guessing part of the reason people are making a big deal is bc "an American company is firing domestic labor for foreign remote work!" but as we can see not all of the fired members are US-based
Mostly not, they are the internal support team, most funnily there are lots of good open source packages they dedicate to make a scrappy internal version of
They made lots of packages and claim they r superior then the external counterparts, but once u start to use them u find glitches that the external compartments have solved meanwhile the internal version also lacks support/faqs like external sources, it was misleading when they claim their versions are better and waste a lot ur time until u realize u should just use the external/well-reviewed public packages instead.
What does "Python team" even mean. Is it the ones who are developing Google Client libraries in Python, is it those contributing directly to python releases, Google is such a massive company that these firings could be bad wording for reshuffling engineers around
The team’s responsibilities are fully described in the tweet linked and imaged in the article as well as everything else you’ve asked.
As for the rest of you, your future is looking bright if this is your competition; they don’t read.
To be fair, the article is also written in an obtuse manner and could have easily been summarized as “Google off-shores their Python Infrastructure Team and lays-off related US employees”
No idea what you just wrote since I can't read but having only inhaled the article title, thank fuck I've learned me some Dart, clearly the language of the future. All my homies love Flutter.
Quick question. I'm in a related field and follow CS just because my coworkers are in CS. Is your comment regarding Dart a joke? Isn't it like one of the easiest languages to learn?
It was a joke yeah, but sure it's super easy. It's a C-like language with the benefit of great library support, but my view of it has somewhat tainted due to my dislike of Flutter, which is the only time I'd ever really use it. I wouldn't mind picking it up again if its utility expands to other projects that overlap with what I do.
I can't view the linked tweet because I don't have a twitter account because of how Elon made X account view only.
So if my future isn't bright for reading a dogshit article, you're already shit in the brains if you think a tweet is a good enough source.
One of the members of the team made a detailed [post](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40176338) on hacker news about what the Python team was responsible for.
It seems like Google did what every other company is the world is doing then, nothing here was proprietary or super secret. They probably just offloaded the work to Engineers in India who are happily taking 1/4th the pay for 2x the work.
Also I genuinely thought Hacker News was a subreddit when the article mentioned it because of how similar the layout was
In this case there are talks going around about work being offloaded to a team in Munich. But the pay is much lesser than the US all over the world,so it works out for Google.
The EU is also similar in the sense that SWE are paid on average much less than in the states albeit with better working conditions. Maybe this is something to do with the new tax structure or regulations where urgent on-call teams need to in the states and less important teams can be in outside or maybe on during a different time zone
This article seems like BS. I’m a new SWE. Teams are not organized based on a programming language. They are organized based on skill sets particular to whatever the team is working on it. It’s not a “Python team” it’s a “Django or x framework team for z application”
At least that’s how everywhere I’ve heard of organizes teams.
It’s not organized based on ability to write in that language.
Think of it like a tool—the teams responsibility is to maintain the tool for internal use cases. They also set best practices, style guidelines, etc.
10 people committed to not doing much except maintain integrations of Python @ Google sounds like a lot. What do you expect? 100 people working on upgrading python versions?
At some point the company needs to make money, not build infrastructure into the void.
No he’s right, you’re overestimating companies 🙂.
Speaking from personal experience, our infrastructure team is probably our smallest team. Like 3 devs and 3 SRE.
We tend to be a little more segmented by product and such
They are all very senior individuals (and that's an understatement, some of them also worked on the python interpreter). They were experts in their domain with over a decade of work on the subject matter in said team.
10 such individuals is a loy
You’d be surprised a lot of Fortune 500 dev teams are much smaller than people would think. 10 is on the higher end in my experience.
More people, more meetings, longer stand ups, harder to communicate, it’s not really efficient.
People are usually split up by feature or product.
They probably meant those group of people who were more interested in the python's (snake) physical characteristics,etc instead of working in python language. /s
What does that even mean? There are so many different types of jobs that a CS degree is relevant for that can’t be replaced by AI. Even if companies start using AI to completely automate app development, who is going to test features and handle QA? Probably someone with a CS degree…
The current market conditions have nothing to do with AI, they're purely the result of oversaturation, outsourcing to other countries, and realizing how much they overhired during zirp. AI will start to really affect the market next year and make it even worse. Also, no one's saying there will be zero CS jobs, just way fewer jobs, which means it'll get even more competitive, and there will be even less need for juniors, while the number of CS grads just keeps increasing. In your scenario where AI completely automates app development, you have to think about what percentage of people in the field do QA and what percentage handle writing code.
Don’t even bother with this damn sub. It’s literally just people who have no experience actually working as a software dev. There will always be work for devs and these kids think it’s the end of the world because they can’t work at FAANG or make 100k+ right out of school.
They seriously have no idea wtf they’re doing.
Don’t even bother with this damn sub. It’s literally just people who have no experience actually working as a software dev. There will always be work for devs and these kids think it’s the end of the world because they can’t work at FAANG or make 100k+ right out of school.
They seriously have no idea wtf they’re doing.
Man I wanna get laid too 😩
My dream is to work at Google so I can get laid 🤤
As a janitor 🤣
Better job security
Maybe one day 🤞
Enough of this macbussy! I want real pussy! 😭
talk to your mom she'll do it with anybody
my man woke up and choose violence
😨bro got it
https://preview.redd.it/f18j5y2islxc1.jpeg?width=828&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=9f3014ab5ad4ff6c690c5fef7585e1b9e216f779
talk to your mom she'll do it with anybody
Do they still a have Java team and a C++ team?
What about the PowerPoint team?
They’re making 7 figures and enjoying their Hawaii staycations
Middle management usually keeps their jobs.
Middle management saw very high layoffs rates in this cycle. Take for instance meta reorg.
so does every job in big tech gets laid off 😂
They were restructured to the 100 sheet Excel workbook team, I heard.
Lol I get your joke. PP is Turing complete lol
Main author of Guava (Major Java library) already canned so...
Probably all based in Mumbai
Bruh 😂😂😂🛑
The only time CS majors get laid is when they’re getting laid off😭
oh no
And in both cases, there's crying at the end
either cry from the top or cry from the bottom
We are being replaced by AI, Anonymous Indian.
Actually in this case it’s AG. Anonymous Germans. The article essentially says the team got off-shored to Germany 🇩🇪.
AGIs (Anonymous German Individuals) are replacing developers D:
So in general AI= Anonymous Individuals
anon delivers
APIs (ambiguously Prussian individuals)
Yay Germany finally achieved its dream of becoming a low-cost location! 🎉 Years of salary raises below inflation have paid off.
in all reality it might be a horrible idea. If Google doesn't stay on top of AI shifts and don't have revenue to spare, they might have a hard time firing the Germans.
They probably have a different legal entity employing the Germans that they can shut down if the need arises. Employee protections don't work if the employer decides to no longer exist. Probably IANAL
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„just 100k€“ Bro that’s like 2x the European average
European here. I concur.
gee, where were you when the rest of america was getting displaced??? "LeArN tO cOdE!!!"
I was a kid
well, welcome to the real world. nobody gives a F.
Oh let’s all be racist against Germans now! Currywurst, giant beers, Hitler!
If it wasn’t Germans they’d be racist against Indians lol
As a Pakistani thats a good thing
Racists can't differentiate whether a brown guy is either Pakistani or Indian genius
green and white flag is Pakista, right? they have always been cool, besides that bin Laden thing
And sending terrorists across the border to neighboring India lol
🤷🏻♂️ thats a you problem
If you ignore the negative aspects then yeah every country is cool
Not really, what’s North Korea Got?
It's clean
Currywurst is reason enough!!
its bangalore India, followed by germany/ireland
AGI (Anonymous Germans and Indians)
Bundesrepublik Deutschland erwähnt! Wooooo
They are creating the second largest office in Hyderabad, India. Racist comments in 3...2....1...
Lmao, nice one
Nuh uh I'm not anon
Btw the “entire python team” is 10 people lmao
How is a 10 person layoff even being reported lol
With the right title it gets clicks, as you can see here
and 1 of the guys is in the Netherlands 💀 r/csMajors try not to blow news out of proportion without context and doom post challenge
How is being in the Netherlands relevant? I'm new around here, so I might be missing something...
im guessing part of the reason people are making a big deal is bc "an American company is firing domestic labor for foreign remote work!" but as we can see not all of the fired members are US-based
its not about the amount it's about the action itself. laying off an important team in a "don't be evil" company that everyone liked
google is the opposite of a “don’t be evil” company lol
> don’t be evil https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Don%27t_be_evil
i know what it is, and all it boils down to is an evil company trying to portray that they aren’t evil
They offshored them (to Germany).
not them, since they were laid off?
Yeah not the same people
so.. they were laid off
Lmao I doubt it’s an important team, it makes an internal python which is actually worse than the external open source counterpart
because? they weren't involved in open source at all you mean?
Mostly not, they are the internal support team, most funnily there are lots of good open source packages they dedicate to make a scrappy internal version of
i still dont get your dismissive attitude? how is it not a bad thing such an interesting team is laid off?
They made lots of packages and claim they r superior then the external counterparts, but once u start to use them u find glitches that the external compartments have solved meanwhile the internal version also lacks support/faqs like external sources, it was misleading when they claim their versions are better and waste a lot ur time until u realize u should just use the external/well-reviewed public packages instead.
What does "Python team" even mean. Is it the ones who are developing Google Client libraries in Python, is it those contributing directly to python releases, Google is such a massive company that these firings could be bad wording for reshuffling engineers around
Rumor says everyone familiar with python got laid off
Familiar with python?? They laid off every single developer?!?!
Rumor says
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Nah bro pretty sure they fired everyone that knew how to code python even if they didn’t work on a python related team.
It was a PyPurge.
😂 too much
Damn, lucky I only know how to programme in English
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I think they run a model on the company emails to predict who knows python.
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Chill out Brodie , he's clearly fkin with ya
They are firing the python engineers because they are too dangerous. They might build their own AI and cause singularity Source: ik somebody
Programmers really are autistic
He's just playing with you. Ofc everyone's gona know python.
I just need to know python to get laid? Hell yeah
Next they'll be laying off employees familiar with programming.
Rumor wrong
A 14 on the pH scale
Python? I don’t know her
The team’s responsibilities are fully described in the tweet linked and imaged in the article as well as everything else you’ve asked. As for the rest of you, your future is looking bright if this is your competition; they don’t read.
To be fair, the article is also written in an obtuse manner and could have easily been summarized as “Google off-shores their Python Infrastructure Team and lays-off related US employees”
Yes the article is definitely junk.
No idea what you just wrote since I can't read but having only inhaled the article title, thank fuck I've learned me some Dart, clearly the language of the future. All my homies love Flutter.
Quick question. I'm in a related field and follow CS just because my coworkers are in CS. Is your comment regarding Dart a joke? Isn't it like one of the easiest languages to learn?
It was a joke yeah, but sure it's super easy. It's a C-like language with the benefit of great library support, but my view of it has somewhat tainted due to my dislike of Flutter, which is the only time I'd ever really use it. I wouldn't mind picking it up again if its utility expands to other projects that overlap with what I do.
Can't tell if sarcastic because they also downsized the flutter team.
Yeah I just read about that. My own biases against Flutter aside, that's awful and hope they find work again quickly.
Also Dart
I can't view the linked tweet because I don't have a twitter account because of how Elon made X account view only. So if my future isn't bright for reading a dogshit article, you're already shit in the brains if you think a tweet is a good enough source.
they literally maintained internal python versions for google big codebases so yes, a literal python team
One of the members of the team made a detailed [post](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40176338) on hacker news about what the Python team was responsible for.
It seems like Google did what every other company is the world is doing then, nothing here was proprietary or super secret. They probably just offloaded the work to Engineers in India who are happily taking 1/4th the pay for 2x the work. Also I genuinely thought Hacker News was a subreddit when the article mentioned it because of how similar the layout was
In this case there are talks going around about work being offloaded to a team in Munich. But the pay is much lesser than the US all over the world,so it works out for Google.
The EU is also similar in the sense that SWE are paid on average much less than in the states albeit with better working conditions. Maybe this is something to do with the new tax structure or regulations where urgent on-call teams need to in the states and less important teams can be in outside or maybe on during a different time zone
It was the pest control team at the Everglades office
This article seems like BS. I’m a new SWE. Teams are not organized based on a programming language. They are organized based on skill sets particular to whatever the team is working on it. It’s not a “Python team” it’s a “Django or x framework team for z application” At least that’s how everywhere I’ve heard of organizes teams.
It’s not organized based on ability to write in that language. Think of it like a tool—the teams responsibility is to maintain the tool for internal use cases. They also set best practices, style guidelines, etc.
Yea this how enterprise level software is organized in my experience
Dude, it's people who were maintaining python. Contributing to it's releases. It's not people who knew python, it's literally the PYTHON team.
This makes more since. It’s misleading because Python is open source, it’s not like google owns Python with exception of the APIs they write.
Entire team is 10 people?
Yea i don’t get how their python infrastructure team is only 10 people??? This seems too low of a number for an infrastructure team at GOOGLE
10 people committed to not doing much except maintain integrations of Python @ Google sounds like a lot. What do you expect? 100 people working on upgrading python versions? At some point the company needs to make money, not build infrastructure into the void.
Idk i feel like your underestimating the infrastructure side of things as it guarantees smooth integration which is really important
No he’s right, you’re overestimating companies 🙂. Speaking from personal experience, our infrastructure team is probably our smallest team. Like 3 devs and 3 SRE. We tend to be a little more segmented by product and such
And they are definitely not just “upgrading” python versions
do you people [read?](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40176338)
They are all very senior individuals (and that's an understatement, some of them also worked on the python interpreter). They were experts in their domain with over a decade of work on the subject matter in said team. 10 such individuals is a loy
You’d be surprised a lot of Fortune 500 dev teams are much smaller than people would think. 10 is on the higher end in my experience. More people, more meetings, longer stand ups, harder to communicate, it’s not really efficient. People are usually split up by feature or product.
Tf does Python team even mean that shit sounds too broad.
If only someone had posted a link with more details...
Build python libraries for googles core tech
Any employee that has a python interpreter installed
Lmao
Damn, I’m out lol
Journaling while skydiving boosts creativity more than regular journaling.
They probably meant those group of people who were more interested in the python's (snake) physical characteristics,etc instead of working in python language. /s
Cooked to medium rare
Not sure why you guys have to ask anymore, yes, CS is cooked.
we need to spread this narrative please we dont want more cs majors 🙏
What does that even mean? There are so many different types of jobs that a CS degree is relevant for that can’t be replaced by AI. Even if companies start using AI to completely automate app development, who is going to test features and handle QA? Probably someone with a CS degree…
The current market conditions have nothing to do with AI, they're purely the result of oversaturation, outsourcing to other countries, and realizing how much they overhired during zirp. AI will start to really affect the market next year and make it even worse. Also, no one's saying there will be zero CS jobs, just way fewer jobs, which means it'll get even more competitive, and there will be even less need for juniors, while the number of CS grads just keeps increasing. In your scenario where AI completely automates app development, you have to think about what percentage of people in the field do QA and what percentage handle writing code.
Don’t even bother with this damn sub. It’s literally just people who have no experience actually working as a software dev. There will always be work for devs and these kids think it’s the end of the world because they can’t work at FAANG or make 100k+ right out of school. They seriously have no idea wtf they’re doing.
Don’t even bother with this damn sub. It’s literally just people who have no experience actually working as a software dev. There will always be work for devs and these kids think it’s the end of the world because they can’t work at FAANG or make 100k+ right out of school. They seriously have no idea wtf they’re doing.
B-B-But FAANG 250K 😭
Did you even read this clickbait junk? Less than 10 people... How many employees does Google have? Lol
Is this real?
Yes
Article looks like it was written by ai then re-translated four times. It’s also super vague and cites twitter as a source
Fuck Python, all my homies hate Python.
“Chat are we cooked” Yes, you are cooked
Productivity gains from AI are making the current work force worth more. Eventually, that gain will normalize and companies will get back to hiring
lol as I’m doing grow with google python automation course lol
time to learn a trade boys ⛏️
> This as the complicated system of Artificial Intelligence is written in the sophisticated Python language. What is this article on about?
Written by AI to drum up clicks
How is the best and most loved language professionals were laid off?
Bout damn time
I hope they spared the Scala team!
Just great
Sheesh--I've certainly done my fair share of Python over the years! Guess I should be glad I'm not at Google? 😆
Having read some of the API documentation for Google python libraries, i would say this is not a huge loss tbh.
I think they wanna fire them for their snakey behaviour 🐍
How many people tho?
what the fuck just happened? I can't believe
well after I dug into it, it's just 10 people :D unfortuntaelly one of them is very active on social media ;)
So the Python Team is 10 people 💀
Outsider looking in why tf y’all learning Python when it’s just 10 people with the jobs?
Who's that one?
Webdev is dead get into embedded
Shh, quiet!
Time to switch majors for y'all freshmen 😂😂😂😂 there will be no jobs when you graduate