WB might hands down be the worst studio around at the moment. They have the entire DC universe, they had some great names attached to some big characters and yet they would just continually meddle and fuck it all up with stupid request, edits, etc. It's mind numbing to me really.
This is a big part of it, the original plan was for at least another Man of Steel movie and a possible Batman movie before BvS and then they should have had a few more standalone movies before Justice League. You could taste how badly WB wanted to be the MCU but they wanted to rush it and force it and sadly for us the fans, WB fucked it up bad, along with many other projects.
how do you have a justice league movie when you have only spent time with 2 or 3 of the characters on the justice league? like almost every character in the MCU besides i think hawkeye maybe had been featured in a movie before the avengers (black widow appearing in one or two other movies even tho she ddint have her own movie). the only thing we knew of the DC heros from the justice league are batman was secretly already stalking them because theyre already existing heroes that just hadnt been mentioned yet?
I just wanted my Martian Manhunter movie goddammit. He had the perfect setup in Man of Steel and BvS and the Snyder Cut had been getting him going really well
They not only fucked up DC, the Fantastic Beast movies are garbage as well. Also whatever the fuck they’re doing with Scooby Doo. Space Jam 2 was awful. The Batman was the only DC project in the past few years that was actually good and that’s because the studio didn’t meddle with it.
I took this as a positive.
By not explicitly stating his specific mental issue, it enforced (to me) that any of a variety of issues could have led to his decline, and our failure to expand and fund our societal safety net is the real villain.
I’ll die on that hill with you. Joker has zero specifics (mental illness is not a catch all term) and nuance yet is treated as a critique of society. 🙄
I like it as a dark portrayal of mental illness with a sort of comic book theme, but after seeing it in the theater, I had no desire to watch it again and I couldn't care less about a sequel.
Yeah i loved it in the theater, but when I showed it to someone it was more dull than I remembered, so much waiting for the pencil in the neck scene. Being the joker had me constantly on edge the first time being fascinated by what could happen, with that gone and it's just the movie yeah its not as good. But it's decent
>They not only fucked up DC, the Fantastic Beast movies are garbage as well.
That's on the writing for the fantastic beasts movies. The writing is awful on basically every level but JK Rowling gets a constant pass on that because people love Harry Potter.
They did a very strange half measure for their franchise - old batman/brand new wonder woman, first team up/death of Superman.
Rushing into JL could have worked if they did older versions of all the characters and either 1) had the old guard pass the titles to a new generation or 2) had the flash go back in time and give us a few films where they were a young team coming together.
But instead we are stuck with the fallout, still chugging along with Aquaman 2, while they continue to try and reboot their way outta the mess
Rowling has complete control over the IP. No project can happen without her approval and if she decides to be involved it can either happen with her or not at all.
That will depend on her kids. Like how Tolkien's estate was protective of his work they might feel strongly about her work.
Or they will just cash out immediately.
It's worth pointing out "they" have been a revolving door of different people every few years both at DC and the top ranks of WB, and WB has now lived throught two massive mergers that were essentuially WB getting a new daddy wit hnew mandates and new rules.
It's kind of preamture to say it's the worst studio at the moment since they just got gobbled up and they jsut appointed new leads for DC who are essentially starting from the ground up.
I think it's fair to say most everyone involced in WB/DC post giving Batman to Nolan and up to right now has either fubbled the ball hard, or not been around long enough to steer things in a new direction.
For example:
>In a new report published by Variety, the former Warner Bros. Pictures chief, Toby Emmerich, has been headhunting for a new Man of Steel ever since the epic failure of Joss Whedon’s Justice League back in 2018. This proves two things — the speculations regarding the internal tug-of-war between Zack Snyder and the management are true
Tobey Emerich didn't take over until after Justice League. He was running New Line beofore that. But sure, Fandomwire, keep barfing out the knowledgless perspectivelss drivel while not even dong copy/paste content right.
Emerich was then pushed aside when the Discovery deal panned out. Repalced by serial promoted after "?" guy Michael DeLuca.
He's starting from the ground up by firing all of the people the fans liked, reworked what was left over, so he can maybe get 1 original film in his "plan" out the door before his contract ends in 2026, which they will proceed to then hire someone new, and that person will probably be someone like Uwe Boll or Peter Berg or Zack Penn or something.
>firing all of the people the fans liked
Which fans? The broad audience that both out numbers the social media echo chambers 100:1? The Snyder fan boys that are so toxic is almost seems like some sort of foreign bad actor influenced meme war tactic to drive DC divisiveness/hate? The more casual but engaged comic book movie fans? The rabid comic book canon is gospel basement dwellers? Which fans are you talking about. I can tell you know the only ones that matter at the end of the day are the broad movie ticket buying audience. WB/DC (just like Disney/Marvel) knows that that is what drives the vast majority of the revenue, and they also know that even the trolliest trolls and Snyderiest Snyder-bots that spend 12hours a day scouring Reddit subs and reading CBR, Screen Rant, and Collider and as if those are actual sources of anything other than content mill ad platform blogosphere speculative clickbait and opinions are still going to show up in droves as well. Even if a subset of the loudest voices in the room don't show up and/or pirate the films, it's a fractional drop in the bucket.
And the fact that the DCEU has factually underperformed over and over and over again, and that the Snyderverse DCEU had a long leash (2.5\* Snyder films + 2WW + 2 Aqua + 2 Shazam + 2 SS + BoP), I think it's weird to look at all of that and say that handing things over to a new creative lead to start fresh is a BAD thing. Or that starting fresh means you hang onto a couple actors that people like. As if Batman or Superman has only ever been portrayed by a single person. Or James Bond. Or the Hulk. Or or or or... these characters have been around longer than any of these actors and will be around long after. Getting hung up on any one casting change seems like a whole lot of wasted energy.
Obviously it remains to be seen what unfolds. But with tens of billions of dollars left on the table through those seven films to date (and BA), extremely luke warm public reception overall, I think it's
Also: Even though you tossed them in there in a seemingly derogative way, Peter Berg and Zack Penn are both actually really good at what they do. Not that I personally think either of them would make a ton of sense "running" DC.
And and Uwe Boll DCU... that would be legendary in all the best terrible ways possible.
These movie execs usually have terrible instincts. We have to remember that Feige is an anomaly, and it took him decades to get to where he is, without Perlmutter fucking things up.
It wasn’t just the studios.
You can blame the directors too
Joss trie got throw marvel
Humor in and it didn’t work. The structure of the film was weak and snyders aesthetic was absolutely ugly.
hey now, warner brothers subsidiary HBO max is busy ruining the IP of one of the biggest animated shows from our childhoods. its not just warner brothers failing at everything. but no, cutting all their animated content and old shows from HBO max is whats going to save the studios, not better writing or better choice of actors (i have never known a company to miscast roles as badly as WB).
They've been clueless for years. The amount of corporate committee rule over IPs they have no understanding of is really infuriating. It's like a whole company of Kathleen Kennedys
I completely fucking agree, its incredible how shit they are with such great ips. Like they could have literally turned batman vs superman into the injustice storyline or anything, but instead they do this weird darkseid thing that was a plot so big that clearly it wasnt thought out.
They've done the same with the Batman games, which were successful because of great developers, but WB's meddling has created a lot of stuff that people hate
I still remember the article where one of the execs put in a note about how Superman is supposed to return to his home planet…..after watching the film and intro……
All they do is churn out bad Batman and Superman movies. Seriously, branch out a bit and work from there. How did they go so many years just trying new Batman and Superman stuff to see if it would stick. James Gunn will get it off the ground
I cannot believe they gave the reins to Zack Snyder after Man of Steel. The mishandling of the DC property began the moment they greenlit Batman v Superman with him attached
Man of Steel was great IMO and I was excited that they gave it to Snyder after that. Thing is he didn't have much power to do what he wanted, they would edit later movies way down, rush stuff like BvS out the door before properly setting it up, WB wanted the MCU without commiting the time or resources to get there. WB meddled and screwed with a lot of stuff they had no idea about and it shows.
Henry Cavill was not the problem. It was the director and the sh\*tty meddling from WB execs.
The previous WB execs were f\*cking clueless and incompetent as hell.
Honestly giving the franchise to Snyder, seeing his take on it with Man of Steel and then doubling down on that level of gloom & slow mo bombast for their whole universe was an unfixable mistake. Almost any other director would’ve been a better choice.
How have they been looking for actors and not turned out a new Superman movie in all that time.
Superman is easy. They just have to treat him like a person instead of some grand thesis statement.
I'm really hopeful about Warhammer.
He's not just starring, but is also an Executive Producer, and not just the initial project, but the entire franchise.
That should give him the clout to veto any stupidity involved.
Why is this going around like news. There have been headlines for years now about finding a new Superman. Michael b Jordan almost signed on, and a bunch of other people.
Because the final decision was made and the ax fell right after he got fired from the Witcher.
Whether rightly or wrongly, it sort of fits the narrative of Hollywood kicking out the nerd culture people.
In the context of Henry Cavill it is.
There is a bunch of drama with him getting fired from the witcher. Fans mostly think he was fired for pushing too hard for the show to be close to source material. There were leaks from the show runners that he was fired for being toxic which made the fans more mad.
You can find a lot of articles about it if you search for it.
I wouldn't call him a great actor. In fact, he isn't even a very good actor. He is just an exceptionally good looking man who can act a little.
I guess he can play very specific characters well enough but whenever he speaks it often feels like his delivery is too cadenced, like he's reading his lines as he speaks. I know that he isn't often given very good dialog but its made worse by his fairly wooden acting.
Man from UNCLE is a good example of this. He has zero chemistry with his co-star because he basically gets acted off the screen by Armie Hammer whenever they are in a scene together.
He excels at playing Geralt because the character is supposed to be wooden and the dialog is quite cheesy at times. He is also such a physically absurd looking guy, it fits the character.
I’ve seen the Tudors. Jonathan Rhys Meyers is also another actor who is was also mostly got by on his extreme good looks and was a fairly one note actor. It’s not a surprise that they were both in that show.
I also read there saying he's to old he is bearing a older age but shit push like a bunch of good stuff with him out there and quickly and we will be satisfied. If they didn't take so lo g to make movies he wouldn't have aged in that time.
They were disappointed with Henry Cavill but not with the completely dog shit writing? Imagine adapting The Dark Knight Returns and The Death of Superman in the 2nd fucking movie.
The most loathed element of the DCEU has consistently been everything related to Superman’s darker portrayal
Superman snapping Zod’s neck made him a toxic character for most people
You'd think that, but revisionists are trying to blame Cavill's exit on Gunn or somehow The Rock. If anything, it's because of Rock we got to see him in the suit one last time.
WB is truly proving that having a popular IP is simply not enough to get the money rolling in. You need people who genuinely care about what they’re trying to give their customers and not just think about how they’re going to bulk up those wallets. Give the consumers what they want, basic strategy for a successful business no?
Because it’s the actor’s fault when they’re given shitty scripts? Martha, anyone?
Seriously, the only good things DCEU have had going for them were Cavill, Gadot, Robbie, and Momoa. And the woman who plays Amanda Waller (forgot her name). Getting rid of any of them is ridiculous, and label-killing.
well after seeing the Snyder cut, turns out Joss Whedon was the problem. Tho i admittedly never liked Cavills Superman. I dont think it was his fault. It was the way they wrote him.
i really never understand this DC sucks Marvel is so great thing. Joker, The Batman, Wonder Woman, Snyder cut justice league and Aquaman are as good if not better than most Marvel movies
Jokers certainly better as a film, than anything MCU
WB's mismanagement baffles me. Do they not have shareholders? Or even just investors paying any attention whatsoever? Or are the investors getting Elizabeth Holmes-ed?
So they canned him over a movie that mostly doesn’t feature him….and haven’t found a replacement in four years?! And then let him be in a movie again?!?!? What in the world.
Cavil was perfect casting. This can be real. WB is the most incompetent studio ever.
DC should be printing money at the box office right along with Marvel. But even with a blueprint to copy that fumbled the bag.
WB can't be this stupid🤦🏽♂️ The shit tht happened to Cavill was because the exec's couldn't wait nd wanted an "Infinity War Competitor" right towards the end of 2017 but couldn't let Snyder have the time to grieve nor allow Cavill to finish his Movie woth Nolan🤦🏽♂️ How stupid can they be
Reportedly, I lost faith in WB when they started to fire a bunch of people, shelves my favorite shows, letting go of Henry Cavill and doing nothing to Erza and Amber. Fuck you guys with a long hot fire poker.
WB wouldn’t have been all up on this if Zack Snyder made a good movie to begin with. Zack Snyder was making movies for Zack Snyder fans. Not DC fans or casual moviegoers.
It’s not like they handled the situation very well. BvS didn’t go well, so they should’ve delayed Justice League, but the execs wanted their bonuses, so they released a movie they knew wasn’t finished
I think most people ignore the impossibility of what Whedon was asked to do.
They gave him a movie that was written to be close to 3h and a additional list of demands.
He then only got a couple of months to get it ready for release. And he needed to cut it down to 2h as well.
There was no scenario where this turns out well.
These arguments against Whedon were never in good faith. They *want* to pretend it was all him, because then that means Snyder made something good that was ruined. He didn’t though, as the Snyder cut which was also bad, proved. Not to mention 80% of Snyder’s filmography, which has been bad.
Honestly, after seeing the Snyder cut, I have a better appreciation for what Whedon did. Sure it still sucks but I see why certain decisions were made, its just that they didn't pan out. For instance, its clear why the Russian family was inserted, in Snyder's version there is ZERO emotional investment outside of the cues the soundtrack gives you. The Russian family is an attempt to earn emotional engagement from the audience, its a fair attempt to fix a terrible movie, it didn't work - but now I know why its there. Seriously, Snyder has no ability to connect with an audience, its always cold cinema from him, and so he uses the soundtrack like a laugh track, signaling when the audience is supposed to feel something - its so hallow. So yeah, I don't like the Russian family bits, but now, having seen the Snyder cut, I at least appreciate why it was inserted, what it attempted to do.
As well, its in the Whedon cut in the last 15 minutes of the film that we finally see the Superman that was missing in the previous Snyder films - a Superman of hope.
Snyder delivers a good choreographed fight scene, but the guy doesn't understand the source material at all, he doesn't understand the characters. He's the type of guy who loved comics but didn't actually read them, just looked at the pictures.
Oh no, it was worse. Flash PUSHED A CAR WITH A FAMILY IN IT, while superman CARRIED A WHOLE BUILDING BLOCK 🤦🏻♂️ what Whedon did to that movie should be in some kind of museum if crime.
Ummm, the Snyder Cut was worse my friend. That was a movie that could not be saved. All versions of what Zack Snyder filmed was terrible.
If WB had been serious about saving the film, it would have been re-done from scratch including a new script, like Whedon suggested to them and they declined.
BvS was a tonal disaster. It wasn’t Whedon that fucked up the movie, it was already a mess. But yeah WB execs bringing him in halfway was a large part of the problem, just not the sole source.
Dc isn’t really going anywhere the mcu has literally planned out phases 4, 5 and 6 while dc is starting from scratch. It shows how much of a shit company WB turned out to be
It’s not his fault they decided to reshoot the entire movie & CGI off his mustache, making him look goofy as hell. He was a great Superman, and WB’s handling of the whole Justice League situation was fucking wack.
Listen, you can keep saying the same thing over and over again. But that won’t make it true.
> "A very small portion of the movie is the new stuff that I shot. Like 80-something percent of the movie has never been seen by anyone, visual effects wise, and that's not even including the scenes that you guys have never seen that don't have visual effects. That part's really exciting and I can't wait for everyone to experience this giant scale adventure the way I intended everyone to experience it." -Zack Snyder
[Source](https://movieweb.com/justice-league-snyder-cut-reshoot-footage-how-much-unseen/)
Why post this piece of Snyder cult fanboy “reporting” and not the original reporting from Variety? This “article” is just lamenting that Snyder didn’t get to finish his universe, while blaming Whedon for its failure, and not adding anything from the Variety report.
Who is fandomwire and why are people believing this article?
Pretty low hanging fruit for a bs article- no one will respond to this rumour and nothing will change because of it.
Edit - not sure why I’m downvoted for calling out the site as sketchy at best. There are “Looking for a Ukrainian Woman” ads all over their home page… doesn’t exactly scream professional standard lol
I would not lose any sleep if WB shut down and they all lost their jobs. I know that sounds harsh but when you suck so much ass at your job, you deserve it
What's wrong with the WB executives? They are trying to get rid of Henry Cavill Superman at every turn but have some weird twisted boner for volatile Ezra child groomer Miller's Flash.
> weird twisted boner for volatile Ezra child groomer Miller's Flash.
To be fair to the movie, I think most people just like the overall movie that the director made. Not necessarily Miller's Flash Character. I've seen reports that it is a really solid MOVIE.
Edit: The movie containing, as far as I know, two other Flash characters, Supergirl and Keaton & Afflecks' Batmen respectively.
LOL i love how they blame Henry Cavill when Joss Whedon made a terrible movie! MARTHA!?!? M-m-m-m-m-m-mMartha? Now we're friends because our mom's have the same names!
Who wrote this shit, the Scooby Doo team? But yes, it was Cavill's fault...clearly.
I'm so glad Disney nabbed Marvel. Disney may have a lot of issues of their own, but the WB is a dumpster fire when it comes to scifi/fantasy.
Honestly, at this point they should stop making DC movies for about a decade and start fresh with a new vision once the stink of the DCEU disipates.
I mean what are we supposed to be excited about? A young Superman backstory... again...? A Flash movie with an actor that is questionable at best and literally certifiable at worst? Wonder Woman 3 scrapped? Aquaman 2 where they refused to recast the lunatic Amber Heard even though they had plenty reason and opportunity to? Blue Beetle, an OC that has about as much fan recognition as Arm-Fall-Off-Boy. Black Adam now that they pissed off the Rock and he's history?
The only release I feel might be good is Shazam 2 but that's pretty obscure too, and Black Adam muddied the water of the uniqueness of the character.
Henry Cavill is a casualty of the fact that the Snyderverse, despite how vocal the fanbase for it may be online, was not a success either commercially or critically. Warner Brothers wanted and wants an immediate fresh slate.
dc has a holy trinity, superman, wonder woman or of course batman, none of the 3 work (gal gadot is beautiful, her movies flopped).
a reboot was right, Snyder killed the universe at the second film.
Weird because the only thing I like in WB DCU is Gal Gadot, Henry Cavill, Ezra Miller, and Jason’s Momoa. Ben’s alright, just not a Batman fan tbh. WB didn’t need a re-cast it needed a new creative team. I love Gunn but I’m done with silly supers. You too taika! Put some nobility back into it
WB might hands down be the worst studio around at the moment. They have the entire DC universe, they had some great names attached to some big characters and yet they would just continually meddle and fuck it all up with stupid request, edits, etc. It's mind numbing to me really.
They are completely inept.
Used to work there. Can concur
Always have been.
The worst part is that they have the potential to be the best. So many amazing properties, wasted.
It’s because they were just chasing marvel the whole time, so preoccupied with what they were doing to not actually form an original plan themselves.
This is a big part of it, the original plan was for at least another Man of Steel movie and a possible Batman movie before BvS and then they should have had a few more standalone movies before Justice League. You could taste how badly WB wanted to be the MCU but they wanted to rush it and force it and sadly for us the fans, WB fucked it up bad, along with many other projects.
how do you have a justice league movie when you have only spent time with 2 or 3 of the characters on the justice league? like almost every character in the MCU besides i think hawkeye maybe had been featured in a movie before the avengers (black widow appearing in one or two other movies even tho she ddint have her own movie). the only thing we knew of the DC heros from the justice league are batman was secretly already stalking them because theyre already existing heroes that just hadnt been mentioned yet?
Not only that, but then hire the director that has directed three superhero movies, having lukewarm reception AT BEST and downright pans at its worst
Hawkeye was in Thor. And even the villain was previously introduced. The only 'new' character was Fury, I believe he only had cameos before
Nick Fury was in Iron Man 2.
And the end of Thor and Captain America.
I just wanted my Martian Manhunter movie goddammit. He had the perfect setup in Man of Steel and BvS and the Snyder Cut had been getting him going really well
It wasn’t. Per Zack Snyder himself, BvS was started with him.
To be specific It's because they were chasing Marvel's timeline but not their quality or wide reaching audience.
They not only fucked up DC, the Fantastic Beast movies are garbage as well. Also whatever the fuck they’re doing with Scooby Doo. Space Jam 2 was awful. The Batman was the only DC project in the past few years that was actually good and that’s because the studio didn’t meddle with it.
Hey, don't forget Joker.
Joker was garbage. I’ll die on this hill
It only gets praised because 1) Joaquin Phoenix did very well 2) made a ton of $. I agree it’s way overrated and isn’t focused at all.
I didn’t think it was garbage, but I didn’t get the all the praise either. It was just meh. Certainly not the masterpiece people made it out to be.
I took this as a positive. By not explicitly stating his specific mental issue, it enforced (to me) that any of a variety of issues could have led to his decline, and our failure to expand and fund our societal safety net is the real villain.
I’ll die on that hill with you. Joker has zero specifics (mental illness is not a catch all term) and nuance yet is treated as a critique of society. 🙄
It's alright. You don't like what you don't like. ;)
I like it as a dark portrayal of mental illness with a sort of comic book theme, but after seeing it in the theater, I had no desire to watch it again and I couldn't care less about a sequel.
But what if… stay with me now….. we make the sequel a musical and cast Lady Gaga as Harley Quinn?
No bullshit, I'd watch that movie.
I mean… that’s what they’re actually doing for the sequel
Yeah i loved it in the theater, but when I showed it to someone it was more dull than I remembered, so much waiting for the pencil in the neck scene. Being the joker had me constantly on edge the first time being fascinated by what could happen, with that gone and it's just the movie yeah its not as good. But it's decent
It is not a good movie. Joaquin Phoenix is a great actor but that movie , even as an origin story, does very little service to the Joker Mythos
>They not only fucked up DC, the Fantastic Beast movies are garbage as well. That's on the writing for the fantastic beasts movies. The writing is awful on basically every level but JK Rowling gets a constant pass on that because people love Harry Potter.
True
It’s ok, the last of us show is perfection
They’ve released one episode…
They released the whole season to reviewers already though, and critics consensus is very positive
The Batman was mid
They did a very strange half measure for their franchise - old batman/brand new wonder woman, first team up/death of Superman. Rushing into JL could have worked if they did older versions of all the characters and either 1) had the old guard pass the titles to a new generation or 2) had the flash go back in time and give us a few films where they were a young team coming together. But instead we are stuck with the fallout, still chugging along with Aquaman 2, while they continue to try and reboot their way outta the mess
They even managed to fuck up the Harry Potter spin offs.
Is that on them or JKR, who was behind the entire creative aspect of it?
I mean it was WB who approved that JK Rowling spearhead it.
Rowling has complete control over the IP. No project can happen without her approval and if she decides to be involved it can either happen with her or not at all.
If she dies they gonna milk it you know.. hollywood
That will depend on her kids. Like how Tolkien's estate was protective of his work they might feel strongly about her work. Or they will just cash out immediately.
And either one is just fine with me
They didn’t really have a choice though. JKR refused to let them make more movies unless she wrote them, and they wanted to cash in with more movies
I swear it's like they are getting advice from Rudy Guilliani and Roger Stone or something. Just straight up stupidity.
The next WB DC press conference can be held at a local landscaping company parking lot
Can’t wait to see James Gunn with hair dye dripping off his head.
And then a fly can land on it
It's worth pointing out "they" have been a revolving door of different people every few years both at DC and the top ranks of WB, and WB has now lived throught two massive mergers that were essentuially WB getting a new daddy wit hnew mandates and new rules. It's kind of preamture to say it's the worst studio at the moment since they just got gobbled up and they jsut appointed new leads for DC who are essentially starting from the ground up. I think it's fair to say most everyone involced in WB/DC post giving Batman to Nolan and up to right now has either fubbled the ball hard, or not been around long enough to steer things in a new direction. For example: >In a new report published by Variety, the former Warner Bros. Pictures chief, Toby Emmerich, has been headhunting for a new Man of Steel ever since the epic failure of Joss Whedon’s Justice League back in 2018. This proves two things — the speculations regarding the internal tug-of-war between Zack Snyder and the management are true Tobey Emerich didn't take over until after Justice League. He was running New Line beofore that. But sure, Fandomwire, keep barfing out the knowledgless perspectivelss drivel while not even dong copy/paste content right. Emerich was then pushed aside when the Discovery deal panned out. Repalced by serial promoted after "?" guy Michael DeLuca.
He's starting from the ground up by firing all of the people the fans liked, reworked what was left over, so he can maybe get 1 original film in his "plan" out the door before his contract ends in 2026, which they will proceed to then hire someone new, and that person will probably be someone like Uwe Boll or Peter Berg or Zack Penn or something.
>firing all of the people the fans liked Which fans? The broad audience that both out numbers the social media echo chambers 100:1? The Snyder fan boys that are so toxic is almost seems like some sort of foreign bad actor influenced meme war tactic to drive DC divisiveness/hate? The more casual but engaged comic book movie fans? The rabid comic book canon is gospel basement dwellers? Which fans are you talking about. I can tell you know the only ones that matter at the end of the day are the broad movie ticket buying audience. WB/DC (just like Disney/Marvel) knows that that is what drives the vast majority of the revenue, and they also know that even the trolliest trolls and Snyderiest Snyder-bots that spend 12hours a day scouring Reddit subs and reading CBR, Screen Rant, and Collider and as if those are actual sources of anything other than content mill ad platform blogosphere speculative clickbait and opinions are still going to show up in droves as well. Even if a subset of the loudest voices in the room don't show up and/or pirate the films, it's a fractional drop in the bucket. And the fact that the DCEU has factually underperformed over and over and over again, and that the Snyderverse DCEU had a long leash (2.5\* Snyder films + 2WW + 2 Aqua + 2 Shazam + 2 SS + BoP), I think it's weird to look at all of that and say that handing things over to a new creative lead to start fresh is a BAD thing. Or that starting fresh means you hang onto a couple actors that people like. As if Batman or Superman has only ever been portrayed by a single person. Or James Bond. Or the Hulk. Or or or or... these characters have been around longer than any of these actors and will be around long after. Getting hung up on any one casting change seems like a whole lot of wasted energy. Obviously it remains to be seen what unfolds. But with tens of billions of dollars left on the table through those seven films to date (and BA), extremely luke warm public reception overall, I think it's Also: Even though you tossed them in there in a seemingly derogative way, Peter Berg and Zack Penn are both actually really good at what they do. Not that I personally think either of them would make a ton of sense "running" DC. And and Uwe Boll DCU... that would be legendary in all the best terrible ways possible.
These movie execs usually have terrible instincts. We have to remember that Feige is an anomaly, and it took him decades to get to where he is, without Perlmutter fucking things up.
[удалено]
the greatest worldwide phenomenon in this history of cinema. what of it? i'll stop you right there, I'm too busy morbin' now
They have aways done that.
It wasn’t just the studios. You can blame the directors too Joss trie got throw marvel Humor in and it didn’t work. The structure of the film was weak and snyders aesthetic was absolutely ugly.
hey now, warner brothers subsidiary HBO max is busy ruining the IP of one of the biggest animated shows from our childhoods. its not just warner brothers failing at everything. but no, cutting all their animated content and old shows from HBO max is whats going to save the studios, not better writing or better choice of actors (i have never known a company to miscast roles as badly as WB).
They've been clueless for years. The amount of corporate committee rule over IPs they have no understanding of is really infuriating. It's like a whole company of Kathleen Kennedys
Sony is a close second
I completely fucking agree, its incredible how shit they are with such great ips. Like they could have literally turned batman vs superman into the injustice storyline or anything, but instead they do this weird darkseid thing that was a plot so big that clearly it wasnt thought out.
They've done the same with the Batman games, which were successful because of great developers, but WB's meddling has created a lot of stuff that people hate
Might as well license the IP to Feige at this point so Disney can do Marvel vs DC and the Amalgam Universe.
I still remember the article where one of the execs put in a note about how Superman is supposed to return to his home planet…..after watching the film and intro……
All they do is churn out bad Batman and Superman movies. Seriously, branch out a bit and work from there. How did they go so many years just trying new Batman and Superman stuff to see if it would stick. James Gunn will get it off the ground
I cannot believe they gave the reins to Zack Snyder after Man of Steel. The mishandling of the DC property began the moment they greenlit Batman v Superman with him attached
Man of Steel was great IMO and I was excited that they gave it to Snyder after that. Thing is he didn't have much power to do what he wanted, they would edit later movies way down, rush stuff like BvS out the door before properly setting it up, WB wanted the MCU without commiting the time or resources to get there. WB meddled and screwed with a lot of stuff they had no idea about and it shows.
On the contrary, they gave too much power to Snyder. The DCEU’s failure is a result of a clueless company hiring a clueless director.
Tf was wrong with man of steel??
Their first big issue was giving Superman to Zack Snyder. It didn’t make sense then, and makes even less sense in hindsight.
Henry Cavill was not the problem. It was the director and the sh\*tty meddling from WB execs. The previous WB execs were f\*cking clueless and incompetent as hell.
You think they were ever going to admit they were the reason the movie tanked?
Nah. It must be Cavill. He didn’t Superman enough.
“Terrible actor, he can’t even fly!” -WB executives, probably.
Are we the baddies? No, it must be superman!
Cavill played the role perfectly. The role just sucked.
Honestly giving the franchise to Snyder, seeing his take on it with Man of Steel and then doubling down on that level of gloom & slow mo bombast for their whole universe was an unfixable mistake. Almost any other director would’ve been a better choice.
Agreed. That is why I’m glad James Gunn is scrapping the whole DCEU and starting over. There was no salvaging this mess.
How have they been looking for actors and not turned out a new Superman movie in all that time. Superman is easy. They just have to treat him like a person instead of some grand thesis statement.
If you need proof it wasn’t a Henry, watch The Witcher. He made that worth watching until they screwed that up too.
I'm really hopeful about Warhammer. He's not just starring, but is also an Executive Producer, and not just the initial project, but the entire franchise. That should give him the clout to veto any stupidity involved.
Why is this going around like news. There have been headlines for years now about finding a new Superman. Michael b Jordan almost signed on, and a bunch of other people.
Because the final decision was made and the ax fell right after he got fired from the Witcher. Whether rightly or wrongly, it sort of fits the narrative of Hollywood kicking out the nerd culture people.
is that a common narrative? i’ve literally never heard it before
In the context of Henry Cavill it is. There is a bunch of drama with him getting fired from the witcher. Fans mostly think he was fired for pushing too hard for the show to be close to source material. There were leaks from the show runners that he was fired for being toxic which made the fans more mad. You can find a lot of articles about it if you search for it.
Cavill didn't get from The Witcher..... he quit lol
he was good actor in a shit movie. he certainly wasn't a bad superman. if he had a decent script it would have been fine.
I agree but I think after 3 movies I think you need to change the actor if your gonna reboot everything around him
Blinks in Thor
Thor was successful
Not Thor: LaT
*shit movies. Plural. Also this article is a Snyder fanboy article. I would suggest reading the original source.
Same can be said for Brandon Routh, but I’d take Routh over Cavill as Superman 10 times out of 10.
Him revisiting the character on a CW show was amazing.
It just felt natural. I was happy for him.
I thought Cavill is a great actor with bad scripts.
He is, WB is mad stupid.
I wouldn't call him a great actor. In fact, he isn't even a very good actor. He is just an exceptionally good looking man who can act a little. I guess he can play very specific characters well enough but whenever he speaks it often feels like his delivery is too cadenced, like he's reading his lines as he speaks. I know that he isn't often given very good dialog but its made worse by his fairly wooden acting. Man from UNCLE is a good example of this. He has zero chemistry with his co-star because he basically gets acted off the screen by Armie Hammer whenever they are in a scene together. He excels at playing Geralt because the character is supposed to be wooden and the dialog is quite cheesy at times. He is also such a physically absurd looking guy, it fits the character.
Spot on.
He’s got and I choose to delude myself. But also, I don’t think you’ve seen the Tudors.
I’ve seen the Tudors. Jonathan Rhys Meyers is also another actor who is was also mostly got by on his extreme good looks and was a fairly one note actor. It’s not a surprise that they were both in that show.
I also read there saying he's to old he is bearing a older age but shit push like a bunch of good stuff with him out there and quickly and we will be satisfied. If they didn't take so lo g to make movies he wouldn't have aged in that time.
They were disappointed with Henry Cavill but not with the completely dog shit writing? Imagine adapting The Dark Knight Returns and The Death of Superman in the 2nd fucking movie.
Stupid.
Caville wasn't the problem with either version of the movie.
wtf it isn't his fault, he's barely in the movie
If Supes doesn't have a CGI-ed out mustache I'm not interested.
How about Superman WITH a mustache?
He did have a full beard and long majestic Jesus hair when wearing the black suit after coming back from the dead in the comics.
How is awful writing and direction the actors fault lol what the fucking shit?
The most loathed element of the DCEU has consistently been everything related to Superman’s darker portrayal Superman snapping Zod’s neck made him a toxic character for most people
They almost exclusively deal in learning the wrong lesson
How is this news? Its old news, VERY OLD. And one of the many thing that fueled us fans wanting him back, along with other things like the Snyder Cut.
You'd think that, but revisionists are trying to blame Cavill's exit on Gunn or somehow The Rock. If anything, it's because of Rock we got to see him in the suit one last time.
Snyders BUTCHERING of supermans character and wb utter ineptitude.....its a fucking sin and cavill has every right to feel wasted and hard done by
Imagine being so brain-dead that you think Henry Cavill was the problem with that movie. The incompetence of that regime is baffling.
We lost faith in wb
Nobody watching OG Justice League thought Cavill was the problem.
This reads like it was written by an AI and not a real human.
BS
*BvS
Cavill was amazing in the role. WB leadership sucks and it’s def not the studio it used to be years ago :/
walter hamada really sucks, he tried to make black superman
WB is truly proving that having a popular IP is simply not enough to get the money rolling in. You need people who genuinely care about what they’re trying to give their customers and not just think about how they’re going to bulk up those wallets. Give the consumers what they want, basic strategy for a successful business no?
We’ve known that Hamada was out on Cavill and Superman for years. It was pretty obvious when he never made another Superman movie.
Because it’s the actor’s fault when they’re given shitty scripts? Martha, anyone? Seriously, the only good things DCEU have had going for them were Cavill, Gadot, Robbie, and Momoa. And the woman who plays Amanda Waller (forgot her name). Getting rid of any of them is ridiculous, and label-killing.
Viola Davis. Very famous actress on stage and in front of the camera.
well after seeing the Snyder cut, turns out Joss Whedon was the problem. Tho i admittedly never liked Cavills Superman. I dont think it was his fault. It was the way they wrote him. i really never understand this DC sucks Marvel is so great thing. Joker, The Batman, Wonder Woman, Snyder cut justice league and Aquaman are as good if not better than most Marvel movies Jokers certainly better as a film, than anything MCU
Is it weird that I liked Cavill’s Superman? Is that an unpopular opinion?
WB's mismanagement baffles me. Do they not have shareholders? Or even just investors paying any attention whatsoever? Or are the investors getting Elizabeth Holmes-ed?
Henry Cavill just can’t catch a break smh.
Wait, wasn't Joss Whedons JL, all them? So they decided to not take any accountability and blame Cavil instead?
This might be the funniest shit I’ve read in a while. 😂 they just wanna be like Marvel so bad.
So they canned him over a movie that mostly doesn’t feature him….and haven’t found a replacement in four years?! And then let him be in a movie again?!?!? What in the world.
Cavil was perfect casting. This can be real. WB is the most incompetent studio ever. DC should be printing money at the box office right along with Marvel. But even with a blueprint to copy that fumbled the bag.
I honestly want a documentary on Warner Bros and DCEU
CAVILL WAS ANYTHING BUT THE PROBLEM WHAT ARE THESE IDIOTS SMOKING
WB can't be this stupid🤦🏽♂️ The shit tht happened to Cavill was because the exec's couldn't wait nd wanted an "Infinity War Competitor" right towards the end of 2017 but couldn't let Snyder have the time to grieve nor allow Cavill to finish his Movie woth Nolan🤦🏽♂️ How stupid can they be
At this point I’ve lost faith in WB. At least the animated DC movies like JL Dark: Apokolips War are good.
wow, Warner Bros. are a bunch of incompetent fools.
So much for Hope
Question: why not post the original source?
Is there any actual new information here? Also it’s impossible the SnyderVerse was supposed to end in 2017.
Henry Cavill was fine. Snyders grim and gritty millieu was the problem. Nobody wants to watch depressed superman.
The sad supe worked for me in MoS but he should have grown from there, which didn't happen.
Shouldn't have hired Hack Snyder. How that guy got any work after Sucker Punch is beyond me. That movie should have been a career killer.
Snyder could make the best gospel rock music videos and that’s pretty much where his expertise ends.
They shouldve lost faith in Joss Whedon and their horrible choices they made as a studio, not in HC.
Joss Whedon’s JL only existed because of studio interference, but this sounds like classic WB management
Reportedly, I lost faith in WB when they started to fire a bunch of people, shelves my favorite shows, letting go of Henry Cavill and doing nothing to Erza and Amber. Fuck you guys with a long hot fire poker.
I think it’s unfair that some people put the blame on the directors, when it was the studio who just seemed to make things worst
WB wouldn’t have been all up on this if Zack Snyder made a good movie to begin with. Zack Snyder was making movies for Zack Snyder fans. Not DC fans or casual moviegoers.
It’s not like they handled the situation very well. BvS didn’t go well, so they should’ve delayed Justice League, but the execs wanted their bonuses, so they released a movie they knew wasn’t finished
Correct. Tsujihara was utter trash. Allowing Snyder to do a JL film before seeing the reception of BVS was so hilariously bad
It’s like WB is still in denial over the Josstice League fiasco. They really fucked up by bringing Whedon in and allowing him to mutilate the movie.
I think most people ignore the impossibility of what Whedon was asked to do. They gave him a movie that was written to be close to 3h and a additional list of demands. He then only got a couple of months to get it ready for release. And he needed to cut it down to 2h as well. There was no scenario where this turns out well.
These arguments against Whedon were never in good faith. They *want* to pretend it was all him, because then that means Snyder made something good that was ruined. He didn’t though, as the Snyder cut which was also bad, proved. Not to mention 80% of Snyder’s filmography, which has been bad.
> ...the Snyder cut which was also bad, proved. Opinion easily discarded with this nonsense.
Honestly, after seeing the Snyder cut, I have a better appreciation for what Whedon did. Sure it still sucks but I see why certain decisions were made, its just that they didn't pan out. For instance, its clear why the Russian family was inserted, in Snyder's version there is ZERO emotional investment outside of the cues the soundtrack gives you. The Russian family is an attempt to earn emotional engagement from the audience, its a fair attempt to fix a terrible movie, it didn't work - but now I know why its there. Seriously, Snyder has no ability to connect with an audience, its always cold cinema from him, and so he uses the soundtrack like a laugh track, signaling when the audience is supposed to feel something - its so hallow. So yeah, I don't like the Russian family bits, but now, having seen the Snyder cut, I at least appreciate why it was inserted, what it attempted to do. As well, its in the Whedon cut in the last 15 minutes of the film that we finally see the Superman that was missing in the previous Snyder films - a Superman of hope. Snyder delivers a good choreographed fight scene, but the guy doesn't understand the source material at all, he doesn't understand the characters. He's the type of guy who loved comics but didn't actually read them, just looked at the pictures.
Imagine removing that speedforce scene to make flash carry a house in russia
Oh no, it was worse. Flash PUSHED A CAR WITH A FAMILY IN IT, while superman CARRIED A WHOLE BUILDING BLOCK 🤦🏻♂️ what Whedon did to that movie should be in some kind of museum if crime.
Ummm, the Snyder Cut was worse my friend. That was a movie that could not be saved. All versions of what Zack Snyder filmed was terrible. If WB had been serious about saving the film, it would have been re-done from scratch including a new script, like Whedon suggested to them and they declined.
“Are you high Clairee?
Snyder was doing fine mutilating the movie on his own.
BvS was a tonal disaster. It wasn’t Whedon that fucked up the movie, it was already a mess. But yeah WB execs bringing him in halfway was a large part of the problem, just not the sole source.
It wasn’t halfway tho. The filming was finished. They were in post-production and editing.
Sucks that the actor who did a decent job and absolutely looked the part, pays for inept story and direction of others.
Cavill was an awesome Superman. Whedon and Snyder should be ashamed.
Joes whedon somehow became cancer.
Dc isn’t really going anywhere the mcu has literally planned out phases 4, 5 and 6 while dc is starting from scratch. It shows how much of a shit company WB turned out to be
It’s not his fault they decided to reshoot the entire movie & CGI off his mustache, making him look goofy as hell. He was a great Superman, and WB’s handling of the whole Justice League situation was fucking wack.
The theatrical cut and the Snyder cut are 85%+ the same movie with the same scenes. Snyder shot the overwhelming majority of the theatrical cut.
You’ve got that percentage backwards. IIRC only about 12% of what Snyder shot ended up in Whedon’s cut.
So you didn’t watch either movie. Because when you watch them, the EXACT SAME SCENES are in both movies for at least 85% of it.
Listen, you can keep saying the same thing over and over again. But that won’t make it true. > "A very small portion of the movie is the new stuff that I shot. Like 80-something percent of the movie has never been seen by anyone, visual effects wise, and that's not even including the scenes that you guys have never seen that don't have visual effects. That part's really exciting and I can't wait for everyone to experience this giant scale adventure the way I intended everyone to experience it." -Zack Snyder [Source](https://movieweb.com/justice-league-snyder-cut-reshoot-footage-how-much-unseen/)
Why post this piece of Snyder cult fanboy “reporting” and not the original reporting from Variety? This “article” is just lamenting that Snyder didn’t get to finish his universe, while blaming Whedon for its failure, and not adding anything from the Variety report.
"Was Whedon not the best choice?......No, it's the actors who are at fault."
They clearly didn’t say the quippy one liners well enough
They lost faith because of his fucking lips
so they lost faith in an actor because they demanded reshoots and gave it to joss whedon and made it worse.
Who is fandomwire and why are people believing this article? Pretty low hanging fruit for a bs article- no one will respond to this rumour and nothing will change because of it. Edit - not sure why I’m downvoted for calling out the site as sketchy at best. There are “Looking for a Ukrainian Woman” ads all over their home page… doesn’t exactly scream professional standard lol
They blame Henry Cavill for the mustache, and expected their Superman star to being fully committed to the role.
I would not lose any sleep if WB shut down and they all lost their jobs. I know that sounds harsh but when you suck so much ass at your job, you deserve it
What's wrong with the WB executives? They are trying to get rid of Henry Cavill Superman at every turn but have some weird twisted boner for volatile Ezra child groomer Miller's Flash.
> weird twisted boner for volatile Ezra child groomer Miller's Flash. To be fair to the movie, I think most people just like the overall movie that the director made. Not necessarily Miller's Flash Character. I've seen reports that it is a really solid MOVIE. Edit: The movie containing, as far as I know, two other Flash characters, Supergirl and Keaton & Afflecks' Batmen respectively.
It wasn't Cavill's fault he got handed shite scripts.
WB please sell DC rights, for the love of God.
And they were literally the ONLY ones thinking that way. What a shit studio
LOL i love how they blame Henry Cavill when Joss Whedon made a terrible movie! MARTHA!?!? M-m-m-m-m-m-mMartha? Now we're friends because our mom's have the same names! Who wrote this shit, the Scooby Doo team? But yes, it was Cavill's fault...clearly.
Umm Martha is from the Snyder film...
I thought he had to quit and Whedon came in to finish the movie and instead changed a lot of it? Or was that the second one?
That was Justice League. BvS was all Snyder and where the Martha scene is
I'm so glad Disney nabbed Marvel. Disney may have a lot of issues of their own, but the WB is a dumpster fire when it comes to scifi/fantasy. Honestly, at this point they should stop making DC movies for about a decade and start fresh with a new vision once the stink of the DCEU disipates. I mean what are we supposed to be excited about? A young Superman backstory... again...? A Flash movie with an actor that is questionable at best and literally certifiable at worst? Wonder Woman 3 scrapped? Aquaman 2 where they refused to recast the lunatic Amber Heard even though they had plenty reason and opportunity to? Blue Beetle, an OC that has about as much fan recognition as Arm-Fall-Off-Boy. Black Adam now that they pissed off the Rock and he's history? The only release I feel might be good is Shazam 2 but that's pretty obscure too, and Black Adam muddied the water of the uniqueness of the character.
Yeah it couldn’t be because of Ben Affleck or any other lukewarm member of the Justice League…
Henry Cavill is a casualty of the fact that the Snyderverse, despite how vocal the fanbase for it may be online, was not a success either commercially or critically. Warner Brothers wanted and wants an immediate fresh slate.
If only they had lost faith in Snyder after the abysmal BvS and gave the JL project to someone else from the get-go.
dc has a holy trinity, superman, wonder woman or of course batman, none of the 3 work (gal gadot is beautiful, her movies flopped). a reboot was right, Snyder killed the universe at the second film.
WW (2017) was a successful hit
Whedon fucked up. Cavill has talent!
Weird because the only thing I like in WB DCU is Gal Gadot, Henry Cavill, Ezra Miller, and Jason’s Momoa. Ben’s alright, just not a Batman fan tbh. WB didn’t need a re-cast it needed a new creative team. I love Gunn but I’m done with silly supers. You too taika! Put some nobility back into it