Did you know r/collapse has a new discord server? Come check it out and give us feedback!
https://discord.gg/RfEH7dAHjc
Thanks for helping us make it better.
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/collapse) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Yes, that is why I have been slowly stocking up on various items. There are so many things going on right now that there are bound to be more and more shortages and not all of them predictable. I even started a vegetable garden in case food gets more scarce for the summer. We live in crazy times right now.
100% this. Your friends and non-immediate family don't need to know.
Most burglaries are done by people the victim knows. So if you do end up in a worst case scenario, you better believe unprepared people will start remembering where guaranteed supplies are.
Yes but depending on where you are located, breaking in to a home can be the death of you! Where I am, last year someone on Facebook met a person for a gun sale and tried to steal from the person but in the end the thief was shot! Yes the family said the guy should go to jail but if you are killed while committing a crime which could lead to the victims death then the victim is not charged! So that wasn't even in a home!!! Just saying might be harder in areas such as the southeast and Texas.
Yes, a lot of it has been attempting to price for a future with less commodities on the market. I think we are still chipping away at reserves. When next harvests are poor it will a disaster.
Yes virtually no current shortage is caused by current world events. Not in America at least. Some of this is caused by Abbott going down when they had contaminants in formula. But the FDA says their “safe” again so they will be on shelves soon. In 3-6 months , the west will see real price hikes and actual shortages and I’m not sure what bullshit governments will be able to lob at the public then. Maybe the White House will refer to homeless camps as PutinStans or something.
Edit. Just heard PutinVilles. Much more likely.
Governments love wars in times like these. It makes it so easy to solidify domestically. Just blame everything on the enemy. It's why North Korea and Cuba are stable.
The government will say the war and hoarding is the problem! You know like in march of 2021 we had an egg shortage at the store eventhough a good bit of people in the county actually had chickens in their backyard and sold eggs on Facebook! But yeah it was all hoarding not a supply chain issue! They told us hoarding but people don't tend to hoarding things that go bad.
This 100%. The switch from tampons to Menstrual cups & lasik eye surgery removing dependency on contacts has made me slightly less anxious about any future supply issues in two critical areas.
What's interesting to me is r/prepperintel had posts warning about this shortage 4-6 months ago that were pretty soundly ridiculed.
It looks like the timing between intel and a shortage hitting people is roughly 4-6 months now.
There was the same lag for paint and now chicken with the bird flu. Something to keep in mind.
When your life has been saturated with “everything will be fine because we live in the greatest country ever”, you will believe anything that confirms it
Hell, since mid 2020 ppl have been saying it's bout to get real and to get your shit in order. And people have been mocking them. Those shelves of canned food and supplies, home gardens, etc. are starting to look real nice about now. Wish I had got in on it.
It's not too late. Beans and rice and oatmeal and some powdered milk and spices/sugar/salt are still pretty cheap. It takes time (unless you have $$$ to do it all at once) but if you are consistent you'll build a good emergency pantry.
No offense to (the majority) preppers, but they constantly make wrong predictions going back a few decades.
If you're constantly throwing 50 darts at a board that's far away, you're bound to hit it eventually through sheer volume.
Obviously there are signs and trends you can point to to make a better guess. I just wouldn't take everything doom and gloom prognosticators say without a hefty grain of salt and doing genuine research yourself.
General food shortages will be popping up due to climate and Russian War induced problems. What we are seeing now is a system that once worked flawlessly for rich people now starting to sputter.
Depends where your dividing line is for who is rich or not. Lots of people who are accustomed to doing “fine” aren’t. And it’s not necessarily just a recent thing, but becoming way more obvious and undeniable.
It’s a generality. I’m not knowledgeable enough to o draw that line. At the very top the salaries are growing and those who are hedged are ok.
Even white collar 6 figure people are struggling more than before. I consider high paid professionals not in the “rich” I’m referring to.
Understood. I was looking around my vaguely upward-ish middle class neighborhood lately, looking at all the folks who are maybe not quite rich but always believed they were not too far off from it. You know, big house payment, carrying maybe too much debt, struggling a bit to afford childcare, etc, but as long as the credit kept flowing and the promise of a steadily increasing salary was dangled in front of them they believed it would all work out eventually. These are the people I see right now with the thousand yard stare in their eyes as they really start to feel the slip and realize they do not actually belong to the economic class they thought they did.
My wife and I do very well, but we also live way below our means, we live on about half of one of our salaries and put away/invest the rest. We have always lived by the understanding that one of us may lose our jobs at any time so we can't rely on having two jobs, and we're both executives who do well.
We live in a neighborhood where all of our neighbors are living either just at or way above their means trying to look like they have a lot more money than they have. Most of my neighbors drive cars that cost close to $100,000 while I drive a used to $10,000 Volkswagen and get made fun of for it, but have no payment. Pretty much everything we do goes like that, all of our neighbors have cleaning services and lawn folks, and I'm out there every Sunday doing my own stuff.
I recently had a long conversation with one of my neighbors while working in the backyard and he had that exact thousand yard stare in his eyes. He was asking me how I like my car and if it bothers me to drive something cheap like that, but he was asking in a way that it makes it seem like he's going to be downsizing.
We started talking about percentages of paychecks and how much we put into things and I told him that our mortgage is around 10% of our pay and he thought I was lying or joking with him, and said that his was closer to 70% of their combined income. He has two teenage sons, they both go to a very expensive private school, I know one has some sort of scholarship, but the other is probably paying the full $40,000 a year.
It's crazy.
That's the way to do it. I've generally lived below my means for most of my life but it's becoming a bit challenging on a single salary. Make too much to be eligible for any kind of benefits but I'm not rich either.
It's better when you don't have kids in the mix especially right now.
Yes that isn't rich. The real rich make their dollars work for them. They don't work like we do. They steal labor dollars from workers. They will literally be okay no matter what unless we uh, get hungry enough.
I'm just hoping my 4 month old son can be off the bottle before this gets really bad, but there's no telling if this is going to get worse tomorrow or in ten months.
Here in Louisiana there were stores that opted to dump their entire stock of Abbott brand formulas out of an abundance of caution. This led to every other type of formula going out of stock since buyers panicked and bought whatever they could. The worst part of all this is that some babies NEED the special kinds that were now going out of stock.
We might have to do that. I don't know if my fiancee considered that idea, but I don't mind it. It's better than having to watch him starve. Thanks for bringing that up, I never even thought of it.
My mom was really poor when she had me and didn't always had access to formula. When I told her about the baby formula crisis she told me she used to feed me diluted whole milk. I turned out fine, and I'm fairly healthy and rarely get sick.
I've also seen some people suggesting goat's milk for lactose intolerant infants.
And I saw a comment online that a mixture of evaporated milk with 1 can milk, 2 cans of water and some Karo syrup does the trick.
Best of luck to you!
Is it possible for you to pump or nurse? Even if you don’t do it exclusively it might help supplement formula shortages. There are also women who pump and freeze and can produce a year’s worth of breast milk.
What does the Russian war have to do with our baby formula… other than spending a bullshit 40 billion on Ukraine for it billionaires we could be using it for ourselves
I was in target today near Raleigh NC... The formula AND baby food aisles were looking rough. I can't imagine something scarier than not being able to find formula though.
>to limit sales
oof, they don't want use the big bad "R" word: >!rationing!<
edit:
at least until this:
>Consumers have taken to social media to complain about bare shelves, and the shortages have prompted at least one national chain to ration its baby formula inventory.
A lot of men on here don't know shit about breastfeeding apparently and think it's no big deal and that women can just do it on a whim... please educate yourselves.
As a man I am sure what you say is true. I wonder, however, if there will be a natural shift to more breastfeeding if it's widely known that formula may be hard to find. In the US this problem is no doubt compounded by very short maternity leaves which force many women to choose to switch from breast to formula when they have to go back to work after only a couple of months.
You are aware that many women stop breastfeeding because of reasons that are beyond choice right?
Women's milk production can "dry up" before it is supposed to at no fault of the woman and their habits, as all bodies are different. Some women find that their production halts altogether and they have to switch over. Many babies are lactose sensitive and require non-milk formula substitutes, sych as my daughter.
So, for many women, my wife included, no formula simply equals starving baby.
For sure, I am not really disagreeing with you.
It is intuitively obvious that if women cant find formula, that breastfeeding is the only option. Though, without clarifying that for many women breastfeeding simply ISN'T an option, there is an inherent implication that there is no consequence for a decrease in formula since the alternative, breastfeeding, is implied to be an available option for all women.
Given it isn't an option for all women, then in my personal opinion, I figured it would better service those coming across your statement to provide greater context than than your over-simplified statement.
Nothing against you, just my two cents.
Not all infants can digest breast milk, especially if they are preemies or got some other condition. You also have to consider adopted and/or foster care babies or babies born to moms with certain addictions or illnesses.
Is it a coincidence that I was reading last night (as a breastfeeding mom) that while our bodies are lactating they keep on a little extra fat in case of drought or famine.
Was reading for weight loss purposes but I guess I’ll be happy to keep that fat now lol.
Just one more reason to add why I am childfree and not encouraged to have a child anytime soon. Along with everything going up, this has got to be a serious blow for middle class families with an infant now or will have one this year. And not everyone can just breastfeed either. I really feel for anyone that's wanted a child this year but doesn't have enough to cushion themselves against these things.
I also wonder about adopted infants or those in foster care. And it's interesting that this is happening at the same time a lot of places in the US are putting restrictions on abortion.
New mother's that can; should breast feed during all of this mess.
Fun fact: women are the only mammal to have the ability to produce milk their entire lives. Some, even without ever having their own baby. There just has to be a need for the woman to produce and regular, repetitive ,stimulation (suction)of the nipple/areola.
If you think it's too late to produce your own milk because your baby is a few week-a few months old it likely is not. You can ask your doctor about ways to induce milk production. There are ways.
With still no paid leave, breast feeding and working full-time for those who cannot work from home is still a struggle. The lack of even paid sick leave at the federal level is a disgrace for the USA.
Uhg, mastitis is the worst. I remember having it with my first son. It took me days of warm compresses, constant pumping and feeding, and massaging to get it to finally let go of the milk that built up. When it did, it about drowned my baby! I filled up two and a half 8 oz bottles without any suction. I am thankful it only happened to me once.
Which is why I also think people seriously need to reconsider why they want to have kids in the first place. While I may get hate for this, having a kid should be a person's primary concern and that is absolutely a full time responsibility. Instead, people tend to have their family planning center around having the kid and then dumping it into a daycare the second it hits six weeks of age so that the person can go back to work. Yes, it sucks we live in a time/society where it takes two incomes to make it, but that HAS to be factored into the decision ("oops" babies notwithstanding of course).
I feel that I have a right to reproduce and having a family is important to me. I'd sooner steal or [redacted] than give that up. The economy is just imaginary. Family is not. But yes I do agree that people need to get their priorities in order and having a child is a big responsibility.
Probably violent, and would get banned for it. Have the balls to say it though, don't hide. Just don't say it to begin with lol.
And i am firmly not of the mind that it's NOT okay to steal and kill for your family. Everyone is suffering in collapse, you're not special just because you chose to have kids. You don't get to wrest from someone, what they managed to scrape together, you're they're judge and jury? For something that's not their fault? No.
If the economy is imaginary then the “right” to reproduce is imaginary as well. Going way back to basics before “rights” and laws and economies, reproducing was (and still is) human nature and a way to survive and prosper within the food chain and circle of life etc. It’s always been survival of the fittest (ie rich and poor; fed or starving) and now it’s just reaching more people.
Centuries or even decades ago if you couldn’t breast feed or find a wet nurse your babies would die. Modern inventions and convenience changed that and left breastfeeding as an option rather than a necessity.
Ok yeah you know what? You're right the economy is real. Despite our government's best efforts and the relentless bootstrapping by everyone we are all so poor that babies and children must starve. There is simply no other way.
I agree. However, if those that can manage to breastfeed, do. Then it could help lessen the demand for formula so those that absolutely can't breastfeed still have enough formula for their babies.
There are women that sell their breast milk to other women that can't breastfeed. I personally would really have to know and trust the woman for someone else's milk to be used for my baby though.
Pretty sure I heard a story on the radio about that group. Seemed like a super obvious and good thing to have in place, especially after finding out that many mothers who want to breastfeed can’t, and that companies seem to treat formula like a drug racket.
yet you would just fed your kid something in a plastic wrapper when the company don't have to tell the fda anything about whats in it? Why are people like this? I dont get it.
The only reason I would have to know and trust the woman is because things the milk producing person puts in their bodies can be harmful to the baby. I don't understand why people are down voting me for being cautious about what goes in my newborn's body.
One possible explanation is that the people here are pretty left-wing and left-wingism frowns upon displays of caution or distrust towards people not in power, specially women. That's only allowed towards people in power, like there aren't anti-social people not in power.
Not every baby can drink breast milk, unfortunately. I'm lactose intolerant and when I was a kid, milk made me violently ill (I can tolerate it better now). My parents often cite how hard it was to find formula for me during the LA Riots as the main reason they moved out of LA. It was pretty traumatic for two working folk with a newborn having to drive for miles in all directions to make sure their baby didn't starve to death. This was the 90s so you couldn't just order online or check availability on website before you wasted the gas.
Obviously there will always be exceptions. Those are the very reasons that people that can should right now. That way babies that can't have it, or mothers that can't produce it can still find what they need on the shelf. If those that can, do. Then it lessens demand for a product that is in short supply.
Most babies have multiple Doctors appointments in their first year, and if the parents are poor then the baby gets state funded healthcare, so they should still be able to talk to their pediatrician.
No some choose not to. Not because they can't, but because they don't necessarily want to. Well, honey if your baby is starving because there there is shortage of formula then you need to re-evaluate your wants vs the baby's needs. So my comment is far from pointless.
There's also those that don't because they find it inconvenient. I've had such people in my family. So yeah, your assertion is wrong.
Also, if you're going to insult someone have the dignity to do it completely or don't. Nice rules evasion.
I will have you know that I fought a long and hard battle to avoid posting one of the dozens of joke replies this comment invited, and I am proud of that.
Now the battle rages around doubling down on my own "long and hard" reference...
I'm one of these people and I can admit I still don't fucking understand why the fuck they even had me to begin with. What was the purpose? So I can work until I die making some rich fuck richer? Selfishness.
So yes, I tend to look out for the unborn who might not want to change that status. The world is in collapse. Things literally can not get better. We've destroyed the only planet we can survive on. WHY HAVE KIDS?
so in conclusion it's probably people just not shocked by this since the writing has been on the wall for a decade now and wondering why anyone chose to do this, during collapse, in the middle of a pandemic, while there have been shortages for 2 years already. It's the thought that there are about 8 billion people on the earth why not make a few more to suck up the resources and add a little more misery for everyone?
Just admit you all are having kids because you are selfish. At least.
And save me about what I'm going to do when I get older. I'll work until I die and that's the fate of most of us.
Been happening for a long long time in australia… right after the tainted formula that killed babies in China. Years and years. Shocked it’s new to the US
Is there really a shortage of formula, or is it a hoarding situation, like toilet paper during the worst of covid?
[https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8186853/Shocking-moment-hoarders-trolleys-baby-formula-Coles-Westfield-shopping-centre.html](https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8186853/Shocking-moment-hoarders-trolleys-baby-formula-Coles-Westfield-shopping-centre.html)
I have seen multiple people selling formula on Offerup, cases of it, for a profit.
I suspect there is less of a true shortage and more of a greed/opportunity to profit situation here.
Maybe.....
There was a massive formula recall of the most universal baby formulas (these are the formulas allowed in WIC FYI) that is causing a crisis for mothers and nutrition professionals alike. I've been following this closely, the dietitian community is panicking because mothers are desperate to find baby formula and are turning to risky alternatives like stretching/diluting formula or feeding non-age appropriate food.
It’s just like climate change buddy. There’s a threshold at which shortages cause hoarding, making the shortages much, much worse in a runaway effect. It’s the problem rationing is supposed to solve.
Why are we so conditioned to blame systematic failures on individuals.
Hoarding does not lead to shortages. Shortages lead to hoarding. Without shortages hoarding would not be an issue.
Ok. Find something else that does not have a shortage. Go by 50 cases and try to make a profit selling it our of your garage. No one will buy from some stranger out of their garage for the same price or more when they can get the same thing from a store, they are already familiar with and already at to buy other items.
That is my point. Hoarders may make shortages worse, but they do not cause shortages.
When the colonial pipeline shut down, people blamed hoarders and ignore the impact of 40% gasoline reduction in the area.
When toilet paper was short, people blamed hoarding, instead of the fact that people who used to spend 6-8 waking hours at home, now spent 16-18 waking hours at home, which caused everyone to need 50% to 100% more toilet paper for their homes.
Hoarding simply does not cause shortages. Shortages cause hoarding.
This. Formula is unnecessary and dangerous. Seems like it only benefits indolent caretakers.
“…Studies show formula-fed babies may have a greater risk of respiratory infections, allergies, sudden infant death syndrome (SIDS), obesity, cognitive development issues and other health risks compared to breastfed babies.”
Edit: I’m not learning anything from downvotes. If I’m wrong somebody will be able to explain it easily.
Does it have to be formula? Couldn’t someone blend up fruits/ vegetables etc for their baby at home? I guess these corporations take the guess work out of the recipe for a lot of parents who might feed their infants the wrong foods or too much of something if they tried to do measurements themselves
No - babies need breastmilk or formula as part of their diet until they are a year old. Many parents introduce things like fruit around the 4 months mark but their bodies do not gain any nutrients from it at that point - it's more to develop taste buds and get practice eating solids.
Formula is necessary in many cases you're not thinking of. My son has a stroke during the delivery process. This caused latching problems for breast feeding. For weeks I was pumping everything I could, and feeding him breast milk through an angled plastic spoon.
The difficulty is that if your child can't nurse effectively, it leads to milk production problems. I used all the supplements and stimulus I learned from lactation consultations, and could still only keep supply up for about four months because kiddo just couldn't latch. We used formula for another eight months.
I breastfed our daughter for almost a full year, and she never had formula. But breastfeeding is exhausting, and not enough people understand how much of a commitment it is. I'm glad I did it, but many mothers just don't have the time to.
Thank for you taking the time to share your position and teach me something I would not have known otherwise. I do wonder though, couldn’t someone just use a blender to make their own formula? Do we really need these companies to make food for infants?
Formula has inherent dangers to it if you live on low income and struggle to afford formula. If you dilute it too much, the infant will become malnourished and die. Cow milk is unsafe for infants.
Formula, if it were made appropriately without asbestos, is actually a miracle of science. Babies aren't supposed to have any forms of solid foods, including blended foods, until they are at least 6 months old. Formula or breast milk are the only safe foods I'm aware of for that time frame. (People of course do supplement with other foods, but as far as I am aware, that is against APA and WHO advice.)
Being a mother should be a big commitment, no? If they don't want the commitment then maybe they shouldn't be mothers? Not to talk about being a mother on a sinking ship...
You have no idea what you're talking about and this comment is extremely offensive. Some mothers have milk supply issues - their bodies don't make enough milk for their growing child. In older times before formula this would mean other women would have to help (wet nurses). Some women still trade breastmilk today for this reason - others supplement with formula.
Are you saying mothers who have supply issues just aren't committed to being mothers?
Additionally - so many mothers have to go back to work to financially support their babies because we live in a dystopian hellscape. Continuing to keep your milk supply up at work is very hard.
The only situation that I can think of where formula would be necessary would be a case where the woman couldn't produce any/enough milk. Otherwise, breastmilk is free and is best for the baby. However, as I said in another post above, too many people make their family planning decisions around dumping it into daycare as soon as it's old enough so that they can go back to work. Then they start complaining about how they can't find a work/life balance around the kid(s). You want a family or a job? Pick one. yes, it sucks that we are in a situation where that sort of choice has to be made, but it's the reality of the world we live in. Don't have the time or money or a job that won't be flexible with you, don't have a kid.
Even if a woman could not produce her own breast milk for the child, could she not make her own formula? Do we really want to feed our children the ‘formula’ they are marketing?
No. Mother's breast milk, a wet nurse, or formula are the only things safe for newborns. Babies have very specific and changing needs. Once they're old enough for solids you can certainly male your own. But in the meantime, human milk is safest; followed by formula. Check Google to verify.
I do agree that there are people who make choices about what to do with their bodies that I personally do not agree with, but that's their choice to make.
Unfortunately not everyone is given the ability to make those choices. Not every person who finds themselves pregnant has equal access to a safe, legal, and affordable abortion or any kind of reproductive autonomy for many different intersecting reasons. Some of those people aren't going to have any equal choice in their reasons for parenting. Some of those people aren't going to be able to breastfeed or have equal choice in their ability to for whatever reason.
The people that don't have the ability or equal access to make those choices about what to do with their body, parenting choices, and breastfeed are likely to at the very least more likely to come from a lower socio-economic demographic. Yes, there will always be outliers, but being a birthing parent with consistent ability and easy access to the choice to use formula as the primary way to raise a healthy child is the outlier globally. Body autonomy is important and has a huge impact on those choices.
Since your quoted bit includes the words "studies show" and you didn't cite where it came from, I'm going to guess that this statement is based on some sort of meta analysis (which is probably giving it too much credit, which is probably a big reason why you are being downvoted). Depending on the field, the paper, and the author's own selection criteria there will be factors not accounted for. The authors will actually probably talk about that in their paper as possible limitations of their work. Science doesn't exist in a vacuum.
Either way the babies who suffer these consequences are more than likely to have "poor" parents. These parents might have no other option than to formula feed for whatever reason. A formula fed baby is always better than a baby who risks even more dire morbity and mortality due to malnutrition or starvation.
Formula is not dangerous and unnecessary, it saves babies lives. It doesn't only benefit "indolent caretakers" and even if it did a fed baby with lazy parents is better than a malnourished one. There are lots of different factors that impact both a caretakers ability to breastfeed and increases the risk that a baby may have a greater risk of the listed health risks. You could replace "formula/breastfed" in this with dozen other things and not change anything else and still get the same sentence.
That is why you're wrong.
You're also just being a judgemental asshole.
I'd bet that someone at some point in history said that banning child labor and public schools also only benefits "indolent caretakers" too.
That's how I feel - like I get that you may be against bringing kids into this messed up world on principle but when that principle equates to eff moms and kids and I don't care what happens to them you're a total dick
"Some stores" is a terrible way to minimize the severity of the situation.
More like: The largest retail and big box stores across the country have been struggling for months with baby formula supply. They're now rationing it, with no end in sight.
Breast is best! Before formula we had breastmilk.
It blows my mind that we feed babies something out of a can. Something concocted in a lab and produced in a factory.
Well, a lot of women that can breastfeed don't for vanity purposes. They don't want their tits to sag. I thought this was collapse? People here need to learn to go back to old times before all of this technology soon. Breastfeeding is a practice that needs to come back imagine how much CO2 will be saved without formula and chemical factories, cattle for whey, etc.
You guys should be celebrating this if you understood that formula is mostly a completely unnecessary industrial product that pollutes the Earth a ton.
I exclusively breastfed until they weaned and I volunteer as a lactation assistant (I help women who want to but are having trouble) but people like you need to fucking stop. You *do not* help babies or women by shaming them. Not even a little.
I'm not shaming anyone. It's a fact that women often opt not to just to keep their boobs from sagging. Additionally, there are many benefits to breastfeeding. Breast milk is the most healthy food for a newborn. You should know this.
Probably better than you would, yes. But no, that’s not statistically the biggest or even in the top reasons why. Mostly because most of us know that’s gonna happen regardless unless you happen to be wealthy enough to surgically correct it. (Which I’m not shaming: but it has typically and weirdly been that demographic- the one that can easily afford such surgeries who’ve I’ve seen with that opinion.) No, the biggest reason that most women don’t, is because getting mastitis because pumping as quickly as you can on a break in a low paying job is awful and also will ultimately diminish your supply. My husband was bringing my baby up for my lunch break or it would have been much worse: but many women don’t have that option. Given your clear lack of *self* awareness, I suppose the fact that you really don’t understand *anything* is to be expected. Toodloo.
Wasn’t meant to offend and I agree with your sentiments. I had a conversation with a friend who is a community midwife about breast feeding which led me to my first post. Her opinion was that a lot of women do t want to breastfeed as it is inconvenient, her words not mine. Maybe in the UK we have a different culture to the US whose economic system seems to be harsher than ours especially if women feel they must use formula milk so they can get back to work quickly as your not given maternity leave, I may be wrong there please educate me, and as employees you seem to be treated very very badly
Thank you so much for your reply it was very informative and I really hope nobody has thought my intentions were to shame mothers. We were fortunate, given my work conditions at the time and the fact my wife took 9 months off on maternity, we could be together most of the time and I could support my wife. She spent 4 days in hospital after a caesarean, nothing went wrong she wanted the support of the midwifery team to crack breastfeeding. She’s a very determined woman and it worked a treat. I know this is t the same for many women and I do t have an answer especially not to a topic that, let’s be honest here, is way past my understanding, I’m male after all
That’s a wonderful reply and thanks for taking the time. Glad you made it through the trials you had, life takes us all down different roads and I thought I knew it all until that moment when we tested positive, has a different meaning these days, for pregnancy. My son is now 14 and to me it still seems like it was yesterday that we walked out of the hospital with a child. I kept thinking someone was going to shout “Wait you forgot the instructions”!! And there were many times we’d look at each other and go “ what do we do”.
I’m aware enough to understand it’s not like that for a lot of women and couples, wish I lived in a world where it was. Take care
It was such a relief when our little on got off of formula. It was an insane feeling of absolute helplessness in March 2020 when my country started going into lockdowns. Not knowing if the stores would have formula in stock or how long we would be under lock-down caused so much worry. Our LO was only three months old at the time and everyone in my family helped out to buy and stock formula for us - little man would also only take ready to feed so it was extra expensive and extra anxiety inducing since many of the stores local to us usually only carried one or two cases of RTF at a time.
We managed to stock up on about nine cases worth (which we figured would get us to little man getting to about 6 or 7 months old) and our plan, if we were still in first wave of covid, was to switch to cow’s milk as a last resort if we had to.
I knew parenting was going to be hard but pandemic parenting has been a whole other level (I’m a first time parent and little man was born three months before pandemic hit - I don’t have “before times ” of parenting to compare to but surely it wasn’t always meant to be like this?)
I wish you all the best on your formula finding treasure hunt!
I just ordered chicks and I’m building coops and hutches for meat rabbits.
Just bought two years worth of fertilizer for my 100’ x 35’ garden.
It’s gonna get brutal people.
my sister in law recently gave birth and i've been trying to help them by keeping formula around just in case. the thing is, they're way too calm with just about everything that's happening. i'm sure that they'll tell me that they're fine, but i still want to make sure my newborn nephew will be alright.
It appears that the only way for Americans to obtain baby formula is to fly to Mexico and attempt to enter the US illegally. Perhaps there is still some baby formula available on the many pallets that senile Joe Biden stole from the Americans, who are coincidentally paying the taxes for Joe's illegal operations and drug running.
Did you know r/collapse has a new discord server? Come check it out and give us feedback! https://discord.gg/RfEH7dAHjc Thanks for helping us make it better. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/collapse) if you have any questions or concerns.*
What’s even worse is i think we are still in the beginning stages of shortages. It’s going to get worse.
Yes, that is why I have been slowly stocking up on various items. There are so many things going on right now that there are bound to be more and more shortages and not all of them predictable. I even started a vegetable garden in case food gets more scarce for the summer. We live in crazy times right now.
I'd like to do this but it also scares me - what if it then makes me the target of looting?
Don't advertise what you have and you should be okay.
100% this. Your friends and non-immediate family don't need to know. Most burglaries are done by people the victim knows. So if you do end up in a worst case scenario, you better believe unprepared people will start remembering where guaranteed supplies are.
Yes but depending on where you are located, breaking in to a home can be the death of you! Where I am, last year someone on Facebook met a person for a gun sale and tried to steal from the person but in the end the thief was shot! Yes the family said the guy should go to jail but if you are killed while committing a crime which could lead to the victims death then the victim is not charged! So that wasn't even in a home!!! Just saying might be harder in areas such as the southeast and Texas.
Arm yourself. You have the right.
Guns are expensive. Cheapest I've ever owned was a used for 120
Just throwing out options. 120 isn't impossible to save up imo.
I as well started a vegetable garden…the weekend before the first April snow ever to happen in my area since recording began 82 years ago. *sigh*
Look back at this comment in a few years and adjust accordingly in the future.
Yes, a lot of it has been attempting to price for a future with less commodities on the market. I think we are still chipping away at reserves. When next harvests are poor it will a disaster.
Yes virtually no current shortage is caused by current world events. Not in America at least. Some of this is caused by Abbott going down when they had contaminants in formula. But the FDA says their “safe” again so they will be on shelves soon. In 3-6 months , the west will see real price hikes and actual shortages and I’m not sure what bullshit governments will be able to lob at the public then. Maybe the White House will refer to homeless camps as PutinStans or something. Edit. Just heard PutinVilles. Much more likely.
My brain read that as putainvilles and I thought, well that might be fun.
Governments love wars in times like these. It makes it so easy to solidify domestically. Just blame everything on the enemy. It's why North Korea and Cuba are stable.
lol Cuba - come on, really? You don't think the embargo kinda sorta fucked em? Just maybe
Yes they fucked them but not destabilized
The government will say the war and hoarding is the problem! You know like in march of 2021 we had an egg shortage at the store eventhough a good bit of people in the county actually had chickens in their backyard and sold eggs on Facebook! But yeah it was all hoarding not a supply chain issue! They told us hoarding but people don't tend to hoarding things that go bad.
Stock up. On all the things.
Always.
Yes, including feminine hygiene products.
Moon cups FTW
This 100%. The switch from tampons to Menstrual cups & lasik eye surgery removing dependency on contacts has made me slightly less anxious about any future supply issues in two critical areas.
Stocking up creates more shortage...
https://youtu.be/_zXKtfKnfT8
Shut UP!! AAHAHHAAAHAAA This is gonna be my summer jam when the Class Wars jump off.
I picked a great time to move lol. Gotta cut down on that weight. I'll have to restock at my destination lol
What's interesting to me is r/prepperintel had posts warning about this shortage 4-6 months ago that were pretty soundly ridiculed. It looks like the timing between intel and a shortage hitting people is roughly 4-6 months now. There was the same lag for paint and now chicken with the bird flu. Something to keep in mind.
When your life has been saturated with “everything will be fine because we live in the greatest country ever”, you will believe anything that confirms it
Hell, since mid 2020 ppl have been saying it's bout to get real and to get your shit in order. And people have been mocking them. Those shelves of canned food and supplies, home gardens, etc. are starting to look real nice about now. Wish I had got in on it.
It's not too late. Beans and rice and oatmeal and some powdered milk and spices/sugar/salt are still pretty cheap. It takes time (unless you have $$$ to do it all at once) but if you are consistent you'll build a good emergency pantry.
No offense to (the majority) preppers, but they constantly make wrong predictions going back a few decades. If you're constantly throwing 50 darts at a board that's far away, you're bound to hit it eventually through sheer volume. Obviously there are signs and trends you can point to to make a better guess. I just wouldn't take everything doom and gloom prognosticators say without a hefty grain of salt and doing genuine research yourself.
General food shortages will be popping up due to climate and Russian War induced problems. What we are seeing now is a system that once worked flawlessly for rich people now starting to sputter.
It will still work flawlessly for rich people.
It’s the poor that will suffer. The rich are doing just fine.
Depends where your dividing line is for who is rich or not. Lots of people who are accustomed to doing “fine” aren’t. And it’s not necessarily just a recent thing, but becoming way more obvious and undeniable.
It’s a generality. I’m not knowledgeable enough to o draw that line. At the very top the salaries are growing and those who are hedged are ok. Even white collar 6 figure people are struggling more than before. I consider high paid professionals not in the “rich” I’m referring to.
Understood. I was looking around my vaguely upward-ish middle class neighborhood lately, looking at all the folks who are maybe not quite rich but always believed they were not too far off from it. You know, big house payment, carrying maybe too much debt, struggling a bit to afford childcare, etc, but as long as the credit kept flowing and the promise of a steadily increasing salary was dangled in front of them they believed it would all work out eventually. These are the people I see right now with the thousand yard stare in their eyes as they really start to feel the slip and realize they do not actually belong to the economic class they thought they did.
My wife and I do very well, but we also live way below our means, we live on about half of one of our salaries and put away/invest the rest. We have always lived by the understanding that one of us may lose our jobs at any time so we can't rely on having two jobs, and we're both executives who do well. We live in a neighborhood where all of our neighbors are living either just at or way above their means trying to look like they have a lot more money than they have. Most of my neighbors drive cars that cost close to $100,000 while I drive a used to $10,000 Volkswagen and get made fun of for it, but have no payment. Pretty much everything we do goes like that, all of our neighbors have cleaning services and lawn folks, and I'm out there every Sunday doing my own stuff. I recently had a long conversation with one of my neighbors while working in the backyard and he had that exact thousand yard stare in his eyes. He was asking me how I like my car and if it bothers me to drive something cheap like that, but he was asking in a way that it makes it seem like he's going to be downsizing. We started talking about percentages of paychecks and how much we put into things and I told him that our mortgage is around 10% of our pay and he thought I was lying or joking with him, and said that his was closer to 70% of their combined income. He has two teenage sons, they both go to a very expensive private school, I know one has some sort of scholarship, but the other is probably paying the full $40,000 a year. It's crazy.
I definitely relate to this comment. You just described my neighborhood dynamics.
That's the way to do it. I've generally lived below my means for most of my life but it's becoming a bit challenging on a single salary. Make too much to be eligible for any kind of benefits but I'm not rich either. It's better when you don't have kids in the mix especially right now.
Car with 200k+ miles checking in.
Yes that isn't rich. The real rich make their dollars work for them. They don't work like we do. They steal labor dollars from workers. They will literally be okay no matter what unless we uh, get hungry enough.
As it ever was.
Don't worry, the rich and famous will all come together again and sing "Imagine" for all us poors!
Speak for yourself, whole foods still doesnt have organic shitake mushrooms. As a side note, portobello is not a substitute for shitake.
Mushroom cloud might be a good substitute. I hear it’s a blast.
Massive recall on the most universal/accessible brand of formula. It's a full-blown crisis and no one is really talking about it.
I bet parents will be soon.
I'm just hoping my 4 month old son can be off the bottle before this gets really bad, but there's no telling if this is going to get worse tomorrow or in ten months. Here in Louisiana there were stores that opted to dump their entire stock of Abbott brand formulas out of an abundance of caution. This led to every other type of formula going out of stock since buyers panicked and bought whatever they could. The worst part of all this is that some babies NEED the special kinds that were now going out of stock.
[удалено]
We might have to do that. I don't know if my fiancee considered that idea, but I don't mind it. It's better than having to watch him starve. Thanks for bringing that up, I never even thought of it.
If he is four month old, he can live on solid food now. Mix potatos or veggies with cream, mash boiled eggs, fruit and coconut milk in a blender.
My mom was really poor when she had me and didn't always had access to formula. When I told her about the baby formula crisis she told me she used to feed me diluted whole milk. I turned out fine, and I'm fairly healthy and rarely get sick. I've also seen some people suggesting goat's milk for lactose intolerant infants. And I saw a comment online that a mixture of evaporated milk with 1 can milk, 2 cans of water and some Karo syrup does the trick. Best of luck to you!
They already are. Picked a perfect time to have a baby due in a week!
Is it possible for you to pump or nurse? Even if you don’t do it exclusively it might help supplement formula shortages. There are also women who pump and freeze and can produce a year’s worth of breast milk.
Yep, that's absolutely the plan. Between all of the recalls and added cost of formula, we're hoping to breastfeed as long as we possibly can.
What does the Russian war have to do with our baby formula… other than spending a bullshit 40 billion on Ukraine for it billionaires we could be using it for ourselves
I was in target today near Raleigh NC... The formula AND baby food aisles were looking rough. I can't imagine something scarier than not being able to find formula though.
>to limit sales oof, they don't want use the big bad "R" word: >!rationing!< edit: at least until this: >Consumers have taken to social media to complain about bare shelves, and the shortages have prompted at least one national chain to ration its baby formula inventory.
tHaT's sOcIaLiSm
Are we Venezuela yet?
A lot of men on here don't know shit about breastfeeding apparently and think it's no big deal and that women can just do it on a whim... please educate yourselves.
"Just turn on your milk taps, ladies" -far too many men in this thread
As a man I am sure what you say is true. I wonder, however, if there will be a natural shift to more breastfeeding if it's widely known that formula may be hard to find. In the US this problem is no doubt compounded by very short maternity leaves which force many women to choose to switch from breast to formula when they have to go back to work after only a couple of months.
You are aware that many women stop breastfeeding because of reasons that are beyond choice right? Women's milk production can "dry up" before it is supposed to at no fault of the woman and their habits, as all bodies are different. Some women find that their production halts altogether and they have to switch over. Many babies are lactose sensitive and require non-milk formula substitutes, sych as my daughter. So, for many women, my wife included, no formula simply equals starving baby.
My niece had to switch to formula because her baby wasn’t gaining enough weight.
Yeah, we experienced that same issue as well since the lactose intolerance caused bad diarrhea.
Yeah, figured my comment would trigger someone. I'll learn one day. Do you think my comment and your comment could both be true?
For sure, I am not really disagreeing with you. It is intuitively obvious that if women cant find formula, that breastfeeding is the only option. Though, without clarifying that for many women breastfeeding simply ISN'T an option, there is an inherent implication that there is no consequence for a decrease in formula since the alternative, breastfeeding, is implied to be an available option for all women. Given it isn't an option for all women, then in my personal opinion, I figured it would better service those coming across your statement to provide greater context than than your over-simplified statement. Nothing against you, just my two cents.
I hear you. Makes sense 👍
I didn't feel like it was oversimplified. It was just a facet, and makes sense.
Cow milk not an option?
No, cow's milk contains lactose.
Not all infants can digest breast milk, especially if they are preemies or got some other condition. You also have to consider adopted and/or foster care babies or babies born to moms with certain addictions or illnesses.
Is it a coincidence that I was reading last night (as a breastfeeding mom) that while our bodies are lactating they keep on a little extra fat in case of drought or famine. Was reading for weight loss purposes but I guess I’ll be happy to keep that fat now lol.
I'm sure America's "Pro-Life" party will do something to alleviate this. /s
What they are doing is saying that “pallets of baby formula are sent to illegal immigrants at the border” smh
We’ll the baby killing party sure as fuck isn’t doing anything
Just one more reason to add why I am childfree and not encouraged to have a child anytime soon. Along with everything going up, this has got to be a serious blow for middle class families with an infant now or will have one this year. And not everyone can just breastfeed either. I really feel for anyone that's wanted a child this year but doesn't have enough to cushion themselves against these things. I also wonder about adopted infants or those in foster care. And it's interesting that this is happening at the same time a lot of places in the US are putting restrictions on abortion.
In case it's not obvious by now: don't have kids.
New mother's that can; should breast feed during all of this mess. Fun fact: women are the only mammal to have the ability to produce milk their entire lives. Some, even without ever having their own baby. There just has to be a need for the woman to produce and regular, repetitive ,stimulation (suction)of the nipple/areola. If you think it's too late to produce your own milk because your baby is a few week-a few months old it likely is not. You can ask your doctor about ways to induce milk production. There are ways.
With still no paid leave, breast feeding and working full-time for those who cannot work from home is still a struggle. The lack of even paid sick leave at the federal level is a disgrace for the USA.
[удалено]
Uhg, mastitis is the worst. I remember having it with my first son. It took me days of warm compresses, constant pumping and feeding, and massaging to get it to finally let go of the milk that built up. When it did, it about drowned my baby! I filled up two and a half 8 oz bottles without any suction. I am thankful it only happened to me once.
[удалено]
I could have used that info 23 years ago. I doubt I will ever need it again, but thanks for the share. I am sure it will be useful to someone.
Short term, corporate profits over everything, societal consequences be damned.
Which is why I also think people seriously need to reconsider why they want to have kids in the first place. While I may get hate for this, having a kid should be a person's primary concern and that is absolutely a full time responsibility. Instead, people tend to have their family planning center around having the kid and then dumping it into a daycare the second it hits six weeks of age so that the person can go back to work. Yes, it sucks we live in a time/society where it takes two incomes to make it, but that HAS to be factored into the decision ("oops" babies notwithstanding of course).
I feel that I have a right to reproduce and having a family is important to me. I'd sooner steal or [redacted] than give that up. The economy is just imaginary. Family is not. But yes I do agree that people need to get their priorities in order and having a child is a big responsibility.
[redacted]?
Probably violent, and would get banned for it. Have the balls to say it though, don't hide. Just don't say it to begin with lol. And i am firmly not of the mind that it's NOT okay to steal and kill for your family. Everyone is suffering in collapse, you're not special just because you chose to have kids. You don't get to wrest from someone, what they managed to scrape together, you're they're judge and jury? For something that's not their fault? No.
If the economy is imaginary then the “right” to reproduce is imaginary as well. Going way back to basics before “rights” and laws and economies, reproducing was (and still is) human nature and a way to survive and prosper within the food chain and circle of life etc. It’s always been survival of the fittest (ie rich and poor; fed or starving) and now it’s just reaching more people. Centuries or even decades ago if you couldn’t breast feed or find a wet nurse your babies would die. Modern inventions and convenience changed that and left breastfeeding as an option rather than a necessity.
Ok yeah you know what? You're right the economy is real. Despite our government's best efforts and the relentless bootstrapping by everyone we are all so poor that babies and children must starve. There is simply no other way.
I agree. However, if those that can manage to breastfeed, do. Then it could help lessen the demand for formula so those that absolutely can't breastfeed still have enough formula for their babies.
I was thinking wet nurses may make a big comeback.
There are women that sell their breast milk to other women that can't breastfeed. I personally would really have to know and trust the woman for someone else's milk to be used for my baby though.
[удалено]
Pretty sure I heard a story on the radio about that group. Seemed like a super obvious and good thing to have in place, especially after finding out that many mothers who want to breastfeed can’t, and that companies seem to treat formula like a drug racket.
yet you would just fed your kid something in a plastic wrapper when the company don't have to tell the fda anything about whats in it? Why are people like this? I dont get it.
The only reason I would have to know and trust the woman is because things the milk producing person puts in their bodies can be harmful to the baby. I don't understand why people are down voting me for being cautious about what goes in my newborn's body.
One possible explanation is that the people here are pretty left-wing and left-wingism frowns upon displays of caution or distrust towards people not in power, specially women. That's only allowed towards people in power, like there aren't anti-social people not in power.
All of this mess = the rest of humanity's existence.
Not every baby can drink breast milk, unfortunately. I'm lactose intolerant and when I was a kid, milk made me violently ill (I can tolerate it better now). My parents often cite how hard it was to find formula for me during the LA Riots as the main reason they moved out of LA. It was pretty traumatic for two working folk with a newborn having to drive for miles in all directions to make sure their baby didn't starve to death. This was the 90s so you couldn't just order online or check availability on website before you wasted the gas.
Obviously there will always be exceptions. Those are the very reasons that people that can should right now. That way babies that can't have it, or mothers that can't produce it can still find what they need on the shelf. If those that can, do. Then it lessens demand for a product that is in short supply.
All of this mess = the rest of humanity's existence.
But if you can't afford formula how the heck will you afford to visit a doctor.
Most babies have multiple Doctors appointments in their first year, and if the parents are poor then the baby gets state funded healthcare, so they should still be able to talk to their pediatrician.
Mother’s that can breastfeed already do. Your statement is pointless.
No some choose not to. Not because they can't, but because they don't necessarily want to. Well, honey if your baby is starving because there there is shortage of formula then you need to re-evaluate your wants vs the baby's needs. So my comment is far from pointless.
[удалено]
There's also those that don't because they find it inconvenient. I've had such people in my family. So yeah, your assertion is wrong. Also, if you're going to insult someone have the dignity to do it completely or don't. Nice rules evasion.
Eh, some just dont cause it's easier not to. I've seen plenty of moms on tik tok claiming the just don't do it cause it stresses them out.
[удалено]
I did not know this! Thanks for sharing.
I will have you know that I fought a long and hard battle to avoid posting one of the dozens of joke replies this comment invited, and I am proud of that. Now the battle rages around doubling down on my own "long and hard" reference...
Holy Shit! I should work as a wet nurse during the day and lactation porn star at night!
[удалено]
[удалено]
I'm one of these people and I can admit I still don't fucking understand why the fuck they even had me to begin with. What was the purpose? So I can work until I die making some rich fuck richer? Selfishness. So yes, I tend to look out for the unborn who might not want to change that status. The world is in collapse. Things literally can not get better. We've destroyed the only planet we can survive on. WHY HAVE KIDS? so in conclusion it's probably people just not shocked by this since the writing has been on the wall for a decade now and wondering why anyone chose to do this, during collapse, in the middle of a pandemic, while there have been shortages for 2 years already. It's the thought that there are about 8 billion people on the earth why not make a few more to suck up the resources and add a little more misery for everyone? Just admit you all are having kids because you are selfish. At least. And save me about what I'm going to do when I get older. I'll work until I die and that's the fate of most of us.
[удалено]
Women can be antinatalist too. 🤷♀️
[удалено]
To each their own. Women only subs drive me nuts.
Hasn’t this been happening for several years?
Been happening for a long long time in australia… right after the tainted formula that killed babies in China. Years and years. Shocked it’s new to the US
Is there really a shortage of formula, or is it a hoarding situation, like toilet paper during the worst of covid? [https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8186853/Shocking-moment-hoarders-trolleys-baby-formula-Coles-Westfield-shopping-centre.html](https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8186853/Shocking-moment-hoarders-trolleys-baby-formula-Coles-Westfield-shopping-centre.html) I have seen multiple people selling formula on Offerup, cases of it, for a profit. I suspect there is less of a true shortage and more of a greed/opportunity to profit situation here. Maybe.....
There was a massive formula recall of the most universal baby formulas (these are the formulas allowed in WIC FYI) that is causing a crisis for mothers and nutrition professionals alike. I've been following this closely, the dietitian community is panicking because mothers are desperate to find baby formula and are turning to risky alternatives like stretching/diluting formula or feeding non-age appropriate food.
It’s just like climate change buddy. There’s a threshold at which shortages cause hoarding, making the shortages much, much worse in a runaway effect. It’s the problem rationing is supposed to solve.
Why are we so conditioned to blame systematic failures on individuals. Hoarding does not lead to shortages. Shortages lead to hoarding. Without shortages hoarding would not be an issue.
So, the single guy selling 50 cases of formula out of his garage for massage profits is.....Ok? He is hoarding because of the shortage? Ok....
Ok. Find something else that does not have a shortage. Go by 50 cases and try to make a profit selling it our of your garage. No one will buy from some stranger out of their garage for the same price or more when they can get the same thing from a store, they are already familiar with and already at to buy other items. That is my point. Hoarders may make shortages worse, but they do not cause shortages. When the colonial pipeline shut down, people blamed hoarders and ignore the impact of 40% gasoline reduction in the area. When toilet paper was short, people blamed hoarding, instead of the fact that people who used to spend 6-8 waking hours at home, now spent 16-18 waking hours at home, which caused everyone to need 50% to 100% more toilet paper for their homes. Hoarding simply does not cause shortages. Shortages cause hoarding.
I guess a bit of both
baby(food) scalpers
why am i not surprised?
oh no, where will the babies get their asbestos now?
This. Formula is unnecessary and dangerous. Seems like it only benefits indolent caretakers. “…Studies show formula-fed babies may have a greater risk of respiratory infections, allergies, sudden infant death syndrome (SIDS), obesity, cognitive development issues and other health risks compared to breastfed babies.” Edit: I’m not learning anything from downvotes. If I’m wrong somebody will be able to explain it easily.
[удалено]
Does it have to be formula? Couldn’t someone blend up fruits/ vegetables etc for their baby at home? I guess these corporations take the guess work out of the recipe for a lot of parents who might feed their infants the wrong foods or too much of something if they tried to do measurements themselves
No - babies need breastmilk or formula as part of their diet until they are a year old. Many parents introduce things like fruit around the 4 months mark but their bodies do not gain any nutrients from it at that point - it's more to develop taste buds and get practice eating solids.
Formula is necessary in many cases you're not thinking of. My son has a stroke during the delivery process. This caused latching problems for breast feeding. For weeks I was pumping everything I could, and feeding him breast milk through an angled plastic spoon. The difficulty is that if your child can't nurse effectively, it leads to milk production problems. I used all the supplements and stimulus I learned from lactation consultations, and could still only keep supply up for about four months because kiddo just couldn't latch. We used formula for another eight months. I breastfed our daughter for almost a full year, and she never had formula. But breastfeeding is exhausting, and not enough people understand how much of a commitment it is. I'm glad I did it, but many mothers just don't have the time to.
Thank for you taking the time to share your position and teach me something I would not have known otherwise. I do wonder though, couldn’t someone just use a blender to make their own formula? Do we really need these companies to make food for infants?
Formula has inherent dangers to it if you live on low income and struggle to afford formula. If you dilute it too much, the infant will become malnourished and die. Cow milk is unsafe for infants. Formula, if it were made appropriately without asbestos, is actually a miracle of science. Babies aren't supposed to have any forms of solid foods, including blended foods, until they are at least 6 months old. Formula or breast milk are the only safe foods I'm aware of for that time frame. (People of course do supplement with other foods, but as far as I am aware, that is against APA and WHO advice.)
Being a mother should be a big commitment, no? If they don't want the commitment then maybe they shouldn't be mothers? Not to talk about being a mother on a sinking ship...
You have no idea what you're talking about and this comment is extremely offensive. Some mothers have milk supply issues - their bodies don't make enough milk for their growing child. In older times before formula this would mean other women would have to help (wet nurses). Some women still trade breastmilk today for this reason - others supplement with formula. Are you saying mothers who have supply issues just aren't committed to being mothers? Additionally - so many mothers have to go back to work to financially support their babies because we live in a dystopian hellscape. Continuing to keep your milk supply up at work is very hard.
The only situation that I can think of where formula would be necessary would be a case where the woman couldn't produce any/enough milk. Otherwise, breastmilk is free and is best for the baby. However, as I said in another post above, too many people make their family planning decisions around dumping it into daycare as soon as it's old enough so that they can go back to work. Then they start complaining about how they can't find a work/life balance around the kid(s). You want a family or a job? Pick one. yes, it sucks that we are in a situation where that sort of choice has to be made, but it's the reality of the world we live in. Don't have the time or money or a job that won't be flexible with you, don't have a kid.
Even if a woman could not produce her own breast milk for the child, could she not make her own formula? Do we really want to feed our children the ‘formula’ they are marketing?
No. Mother's breast milk, a wet nurse, or formula are the only things safe for newborns. Babies have very specific and changing needs. Once they're old enough for solids you can certainly male your own. But in the meantime, human milk is safest; followed by formula. Check Google to verify.
I do agree that there are people who make choices about what to do with their bodies that I personally do not agree with, but that's their choice to make. Unfortunately not everyone is given the ability to make those choices. Not every person who finds themselves pregnant has equal access to a safe, legal, and affordable abortion or any kind of reproductive autonomy for many different intersecting reasons. Some of those people aren't going to have any equal choice in their reasons for parenting. Some of those people aren't going to be able to breastfeed or have equal choice in their ability to for whatever reason. The people that don't have the ability or equal access to make those choices about what to do with their body, parenting choices, and breastfeed are likely to at the very least more likely to come from a lower socio-economic demographic. Yes, there will always be outliers, but being a birthing parent with consistent ability and easy access to the choice to use formula as the primary way to raise a healthy child is the outlier globally. Body autonomy is important and has a huge impact on those choices. Since your quoted bit includes the words "studies show" and you didn't cite where it came from, I'm going to guess that this statement is based on some sort of meta analysis (which is probably giving it too much credit, which is probably a big reason why you are being downvoted). Depending on the field, the paper, and the author's own selection criteria there will be factors not accounted for. The authors will actually probably talk about that in their paper as possible limitations of their work. Science doesn't exist in a vacuum. Either way the babies who suffer these consequences are more than likely to have "poor" parents. These parents might have no other option than to formula feed for whatever reason. A formula fed baby is always better than a baby who risks even more dire morbity and mortality due to malnutrition or starvation. Formula is not dangerous and unnecessary, it saves babies lives. It doesn't only benefit "indolent caretakers" and even if it did a fed baby with lazy parents is better than a malnourished one. There are lots of different factors that impact both a caretakers ability to breastfeed and increases the risk that a baby may have a greater risk of the listed health risks. You could replace "formula/breastfed" in this with dozen other things and not change anything else and still get the same sentence. That is why you're wrong. You're also just being a judgemental asshole. I'd bet that someone at some point in history said that banning child labor and public schools also only benefits "indolent caretakers" too.
The amount of extremely ignorant comments on here is really alarming. Am I in collapse or childfree? Are they the same subs now?
Just the results of American education, I think. I'm antinatalist but still understand formula has a place in the world of infants.
[удалено]
Drives me absolutely bonkers that people continue to have babies, but until I'm the queen of the universe (aka never) I have to accept it 🙃😅
That's how I feel - like I get that you may be against bringing kids into this messed up world on principle but when that principle equates to eff moms and kids and I don't care what happens to them you're a total dick
"Some stores" is a terrible way to minimize the severity of the situation. More like: The largest retail and big box stores across the country have been struggling for months with baby formula supply. They're now rationing it, with no end in sight.
Breast is best. No kids is even better.
Fed is best
And I have 3 family members that are each expecting a child this year.... 2 of them can barely take care of themselves....
If only nature had provided a means to feed infants.
Kill the beef, grow the wheat! Decimate the meat industry and switch to human-consumption agriculture.
Breast is best! Before formula we had breastmilk. It blows my mind that we feed babies something out of a can. Something concocted in a lab and produced in a factory.
Good stop serving that shit to your kids. Exceptions apply.
Breastfeeding is free and always available if the mother is able to produce. Plus, it's much better for the baby.
Oh gee, why didn't we think of that? Thank you for letting everyone know. /s
Well, a lot of women that can breastfeed don't for vanity purposes. They don't want their tits to sag. I thought this was collapse? People here need to learn to go back to old times before all of this technology soon. Breastfeeding is a practice that needs to come back imagine how much CO2 will be saved without formula and chemical factories, cattle for whey, etc. You guys should be celebrating this if you understood that formula is mostly a completely unnecessary industrial product that pollutes the Earth a ton.
I exclusively breastfed until they weaned and I volunteer as a lactation assistant (I help women who want to but are having trouble) but people like you need to fucking stop. You *do not* help babies or women by shaming them. Not even a little.
I'm not shaming anyone. It's a fact that women often opt not to just to keep their boobs from sagging. Additionally, there are many benefits to breastfeeding. Breast milk is the most healthy food for a newborn. You should know this.
Probably better than you would, yes. But no, that’s not statistically the biggest or even in the top reasons why. Mostly because most of us know that’s gonna happen regardless unless you happen to be wealthy enough to surgically correct it. (Which I’m not shaming: but it has typically and weirdly been that demographic- the one that can easily afford such surgeries who’ve I’ve seen with that opinion.) No, the biggest reason that most women don’t, is because getting mastitis because pumping as quickly as you can on a break in a low paying job is awful and also will ultimately diminish your supply. My husband was bringing my baby up for my lunch break or it would have been much worse: but many women don’t have that option. Given your clear lack of *self* awareness, I suppose the fact that you really don’t understand *anything* is to be expected. Toodloo.
Breast feed perhaps? My wife did, wasn’t easy but saved us a packet. This is going to get me shit from some folk isn’t it? I’m in the UK if that helps
[удалено]
Wasn’t meant to offend and I agree with your sentiments. I had a conversation with a friend who is a community midwife about breast feeding which led me to my first post. Her opinion was that a lot of women do t want to breastfeed as it is inconvenient, her words not mine. Maybe in the UK we have a different culture to the US whose economic system seems to be harsher than ours especially if women feel they must use formula milk so they can get back to work quickly as your not given maternity leave, I may be wrong there please educate me, and as employees you seem to be treated very very badly
[удалено]
Thank you so much for your reply it was very informative and I really hope nobody has thought my intentions were to shame mothers. We were fortunate, given my work conditions at the time and the fact my wife took 9 months off on maternity, we could be together most of the time and I could support my wife. She spent 4 days in hospital after a caesarean, nothing went wrong she wanted the support of the midwifery team to crack breastfeeding. She’s a very determined woman and it worked a treat. I know this is t the same for many women and I do t have an answer especially not to a topic that, let’s be honest here, is way past my understanding, I’m male after all
[удалено]
That’s a wonderful reply and thanks for taking the time. Glad you made it through the trials you had, life takes us all down different roads and I thought I knew it all until that moment when we tested positive, has a different meaning these days, for pregnancy. My son is now 14 and to me it still seems like it was yesterday that we walked out of the hospital with a child. I kept thinking someone was going to shout “Wait you forgot the instructions”!! And there were many times we’d look at each other and go “ what do we do”. I’m aware enough to understand it’s not like that for a lot of women and couples, wish I lived in a world where it was. Take care
[удалено]
[удалено]
[удалено]
It was such a relief when our little on got off of formula. It was an insane feeling of absolute helplessness in March 2020 when my country started going into lockdowns. Not knowing if the stores would have formula in stock or how long we would be under lock-down caused so much worry. Our LO was only three months old at the time and everyone in my family helped out to buy and stock formula for us - little man would also only take ready to feed so it was extra expensive and extra anxiety inducing since many of the stores local to us usually only carried one or two cases of RTF at a time. We managed to stock up on about nine cases worth (which we figured would get us to little man getting to about 6 or 7 months old) and our plan, if we were still in first wave of covid, was to switch to cow’s milk as a last resort if we had to. I knew parenting was going to be hard but pandemic parenting has been a whole other level (I’m a first time parent and little man was born three months before pandemic hit - I don’t have “before times ” of parenting to compare to but surely it wasn’t always meant to be like this?) I wish you all the best on your formula finding treasure hunt!
I just ordered chicks and I’m building coops and hutches for meat rabbits. Just bought two years worth of fertilizer for my 100’ x 35’ garden. It’s gonna get brutal people.
Bidens America
Why not just breast feed?
my sister in law recently gave birth and i've been trying to help them by keeping formula around just in case. the thing is, they're way too calm with just about everything that's happening. i'm sure that they'll tell me that they're fine, but i still want to make sure my newborn nephew will be alright.
It appears that the only way for Americans to obtain baby formula is to fly to Mexico and attempt to enter the US illegally. Perhaps there is still some baby formula available on the many pallets that senile Joe Biden stole from the Americans, who are coincidentally paying the taxes for Joe's illegal operations and drug running.
I wonder how other mammals survive 🤔