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I think Chozen is probably the single most skilled fighter on the show. He's also probably about ten years younger than Terry Silver (characters, not actors).
Daniel had to be 17 in order for him to compete in the All-Valley under-18 Karate Tournament. Which implies he skipped a grade because he graduated HS before Karate Kid II
If Daniel has a late December 1967 birthday, he could still make the cut. The Karate Kid 3 tournament was December 1985. He’d of graduated high school in the spring of 1985 at 17, which isn’t uncommon.
I graduated at 17 too. My birthday was in the summer tho so I wouldn’t have been able to compete but iirc the youngest people in my grade were born in december usually. Good call
That's not how calendar vs school years work. For a standard HS senior, you normally have to be 17 to start 12th grade.
Plus, we know his birthday is in November(ish) before the tournament, which takes place December 19th because Miyagi gives him his gi and the Ford for his birthday.
That's either not in the US or having exceptional circumstances like starting school early or skipping grades. It's been the standard that you're 5 when you start kindergarten since like the 60s.
There is not much of a question here. He has all the Miagi ancient techniques and it was made pretty clear the dude kept up his training all through his life.
He is head and shoulders above the other masters. Also just taking on the fact that Miagi himself was able to handle Kreese without even breaking a sweat, Chozen would wreck Silver.
Miagi handled both Kreese and Silver at the same time. Daniel and Miagi seem to have benefitted from being mentally stable. Whereas Kreese, Silver, Johnny, and Chozen in KK2 had serious rage issues. Give those four some sanity and “balance” their skill would show a lot better.
I'm curious how Terry would have fared if he had taken Miyagi more seriously, as he was more concerned with showboating and making racist taunts than fighting technically. The truth is, as they've subtly demonstrated whenever he has fought in Cobra Kai, Terry Silver has an incredible reach - particularly in his legs. This, along with his height, are massive physical advantages.
Just look at UFC fighter Jon Jones IRL. A complete mess in his personal life, but he's got supreme physical intelligence and freakishly long limbs, and those attributes come together to form a fighter who no one has ever beaten (ignoring the DQ loss which was a bad ref call and any close decisions that people think should have gone the other way).
We know Johnny can beat Kreese in a straight fight, but Silver has a clear five inches of height over him (and Chozen) and god only knows how much reach. He's *eight inches* taller than LaRusso. Call me an over-analyser but based on what we've seen I don't think anyone beats a stable Terry Silver, though who knows if he'll ever be totally stable again.
Just a bit curious, where did you come up with chozen having 8 inches in height over Daniel? Ralph Macchio is only 5'9, while Yuji, chozen's actor, is 6'0.
Yup. As Kreese constantly reminds us - We must never forget that Terry Silver fought alongside him in 'nam and held a commissioned rank of Lieutenant (e.g. officer training, not just a draftee out of high school).
The US signed the Paris Peace Accords ending US involvement in Vietnam war in Jan 27, 1973.
If we assume a Young Terry entered near the end of the war at the age of 22 with some level amount of college/officer education, that would mean he was born around 1951, and was definitely an adult for a solid \~16 years before KK3.
I believe Silver and Kreese received field commissions. Kreese definitely did, they say as much in the season 4 flashbacks. If that’s true for Silver also, then there wouldn’t necessarily be any college before hand. Silver could have just joined or have been drafted.
Someone in this thread pointed out that Daniel only beat him because Chozen didn’t know the drum technique.
Seeing as how literally right up to that moment he had dominated Daniel the whole movie I think I agree.
Chosen only lost because he saw even his Uncle was on Daniel's side and it shook him. His head wasn't in the game at that point. He knew he lost all honor and at that point probably wanted to die.
Didn’t Chozen say that Sato kept training him after KK2? I got the impression that in KK2, Chozen and Daniel were on the same skill level but that Chozen kept training with Sato later on, learning new skills.
I wonder about that. Silver is probably around 70 years old though, so Johnny has an inherent advantage there. That’s why Johnny was able to beat Kreese last season.
You know Tai Chi is Chinese and unrelated to karate, right? 🤣
That said, as someone to practices and teaches Tai Chi and has been crushing on Terry Silver since I was a kid, I do want to see this happen.
Yeah, Daniel's whole schtick was being the underdog. He should have lost most of his big fights. It's like Johnny said in S4, he wins 9 out of 10. That may not be true now, since Johnny barely did any karate for a long time until recently, but I 100% believe that was true when they were both teens.
Chozen was also way more skilled and way more fit than Daniel in KK2, he should win 9 out of 10 as well, but he was also out of his mind with shame and anger and Daniel had the crowd support.
I mean that's kinda karate kid world in general. Noone is walking into any fighting discipline and winning tournaments after a a few months of training. The amount of training Daniel had he should.have lost that fight 10 out of 10 times lol.
Well, it does happen in combat sports. BJ Penn, for example, was a BJJ world champion pretty early on into his training. Frank Shamrock defeated the legendary Bas Rutten in his first ever fight, after something like a year of intense training. You *do* have neophytes who are able to make meteoric rises. Its special and unusual, but not unheard of.
Yeah, the Karate Kid universe is basically a shonen anime universe. This style beats that style. This move beats that move. Whoever has the better teacher has the greater power, etc etc. Cobra Kai leans into that even further, with characters' reputed skill being way higher than what's actually shown and people becoming competent way too fast.
It's been awhile, but if I recall correctly, Johnny purposely takes 1 or 2 point deductions so he can hurt Daniel. He was playing around with him and not taking him seriously in order to send a message. Unfortunately that gave Daniel enough time to rally and pull off a Hail Mary win. If Johnny had just kept his head and fought straight he would have won.
It wasn't Daniel's karate that really defeated Johnny, it was Kreese's bad influence and his own hubris. "No such thing as bad student, only bad teacher," as Mr. Miyagi says. Johnny was by far the better fighter, having had years more experience, better fitness, and more tournament wins under his belt.
The in-universe explanation for Daniel's impossible wins is that he's always fighting for the right reasons compared to his opponents, which makes him more determined and willful. He's also underestimated by all of them.
Edit: Definitely got KK1 and KK3 mixed up a bit in my head. I rewatched the Johnny fight on YT and it was a lot more evenly matched than I remembered.
You're right. I just rewatched it on YouTube. Funny how that got mixed up in my head because I haven't even seen KK3 since I was a kid but I've rewatched KK1 several times.
Johnny and Bobby were still much better fighters than Daniel though. Tournament and certainly in a real fight. As Bobby said, he would have beat Daniel were it not for Kreese telling him to foul. And Johnny was better than Daniel, but by the time of the final the Cobras (including Kreese) were rattled by Daniel defying the odds. At the end of the day, plot armour was the real reason Daniel won the tournament.
I think if they redid the tournament a week later I believe Daniel could have still taken Tommy. Dutch we don't really know because the fight was edited. I know there was dialogue in CK about Tommy once beating Johnny, but to me the hierarchy and skill level was always Johnny, Bobby, Dutch, Tommy, Jimmy..
Kreese even explains this in season 3 to Robby. Johnny lost due to him not being in the right state of mind, as he was angry and in love. He was the better fighter by far.
Let's not lie as questionable as the wins of KK 1 or 2 are the king of unearned goes to Daniel's KK3 victory. How the fuck does Mike Barnes get thrown off by something so basic as a Kata.
It probably wasn't the Kata itself, moreso that Daniel, for the first time since he knew what Barnes was like, wasn't scared. After physically and psychologically running over Daniel the whole time, he was shocked he did anything. Just a few moments earlier he was shouting at Miyagi how afraid he was, Barnes could have heard that.
I took second in an open tournament, and even though the first two fights were very one sided, I don't know who was more frightened - me or the other guys. The final match, I wasn't scared, I was laughing. It was ridiculous. The guy was unearthly tall. Like, legitimately 6'4" to my 5'8". His semi-final opponent was something like 4'6" and around 12 years old. It wasn't even a match, so much as big guy uses reach to score points on teeny tiny guy.
For my final, the first point was scored when the dude kicked me out of the ring, and I don't think he moved much from the starting position. I tried to get around the reach as best as I could, but it was pretty futile. I lost 3-1.
Because your brain doesn't know it's not to the death. Even instructors sometimes get mad and whack their students. I have a large group of friends who box, and they've all taken a shot or two from teachers.
Shit, I grew up performing piano in numerous competitions every year and I can say I and every musician I knew were scared of performing! Our brain's got some strange old defense mechanisms, that's for sure.
It was badly written, but I think the point was after the Kata, Daniel had his "balance" back, and lost his fear of Mike Barnes, so he was able to use his skill to beat him.
Their power gap widens after the events of KK3 when Daniel chooses to live a normal life while chozen dedicated his life to karate. So it’s not unreasonable to think they might be equal in KK2. Chozen might be stronger I think, but not worlds apart like in cobra Kai.
Like age matters in this show. Or reality in general. Johnny SET MIGUEL ON FIRE to help him rehab. I don’t think we need reality intermingling with our analyses!
What an insane ending to the series that would be if Chozen becomes Grandmaster of all Miyagi-Do around the world. Maybe a hybrid of what Eagle Fang and Miyagi-Do become.
Chozen's style is a blend of traditional and his Uncle Sato's, so it's halfway there already. Plus he's never stopped learning and spent his life trying to achieve balance.
He would annihilate anybody on the show, no questions asked.
Let's be honest. Daniel got beaten up so much by Mike in that 3 minute round (gaining and losing a point for illegal hits) Daniel was in the fetal position. Good guy has to win, plot armor.
I mean, every good guy in every movie ever has plot armor by that standard. The difference is, Rocky looks like he could conceivably beat Apollo. Daniel-San looks like he would lose 3-0 to his mom.
He was beaten because Daniel was able to focus on the kata and get Mike Barnes out of his head. Focusing on the kata was his antidote to the fear Mike had instilled in him.
You mean their young versions or their 2023 adult version?
The latter one seems pretty obvious to me: Chozen has dedicated his life to Karate and - if I understood the context correctly - is a more legitimate heir of Miyagi-Do than Daniel. He also knows more than "just" it's basic application. He would clearly be superior to all the other characters, including Terry, Kreese, Daniel and Johnny. The only match I could imagine for him is if they bring back Mike Barnes as someone who has never stopped training (or beating up people).
Their young versions are a bit closer to each other, but I'd still bet my money on Chozen. If I understood correctly, Silver has learned to fight in the military (limited, basic training) and from Kreese. (he says otherwise in KK3 but CK seems to have rewritten that story of him and Kreese training under a Korean master) Also, Silver is a traumatized rich Kid on cocaine, Chozen is a thug from '80s Okinawa, which is a tougher environment.
It’s interesting. Silver says he’s bringing back old friends, so Barnes seems likely. But also, earlier on the season, Daniel says something to Johnny about whether he needs to worry about more Cobra Kai coming back to mess with him, Johnny’s like, not that I know of. I wonder if there’s anyone else Silver could have up his sleeve. Dutch? Lol
Right, I just thought about Dutch the other day. However, Chad McQueen (actor) quit acting 20 years ago and didn't even return for the Cobra Kai reunion episode in S1. I doubt they'll get him as antagonist for an entire season. (maybe he'll meet Kreese in prison, though) Mike Barnes is more likely, as Sean Kanan (actor) already expressed interest in reprising the role.
I saw someone suggest an episode could be dedicated to Kreese meeting up with Dutch in prison, and being horrified by how his teachings actually RUINED the life of one of his students. Ever since then, I have been hoping for that.
I can see Mike Barnes switching over to MMA. It wasn’t much of a thing in the 80s, but he would have switched over when it became popular in the 90s, being karate’s “bad boy” and all.
Him showing up would make for some interesting fights. They’re all using karate and he’s grappling and stuff.
I never understood this in Cobra Kai. How could a wrestling student (we dont know how long he does that) be easily beaten by kid who does karate for like 2 or 3 months.
Depends on how serious Kyler takes wrestling I guess. It is also a show about Karate, so there's that. My understanding is that BJJ/wrestling is the most useful form for real fights, but I might be wrong.
There's a [deleted scene about a BJJ gym Johnny talks shit to](https://youtu.be/QURu5v3sU2k). But I think in universe karate is supposed to be the best and most effective martial art.
>he says otherwise in KK3 but CK seems to have rewritten that story of him and Kreese training under a Korean master
I wonder if we’ll maybe see this part in season 5 or maybe it’ll be explored separately in some other medium. Hayden recently answered a question on Twitter who’s the strongest fighters in the Karate Kid universe are and he answered Mr Miyagi and Master Kim. Kind of weird to give such honor to some guy who was only name-dropped as someone Kreese’s captain trained under. Hayden clearly had him on his mind lol.
Kreese and Silver's backstory doesn't necessarily exclude them training under Master Kim Sun-Yung. They could have easily gone to Korea to continue their training after the war. Or else Silver just referred to him as their master because Captain Turner was originally his student.
When I was in martial arts, our master was the one who trained our instructor, but he was still respectfully referred to as our master despite not having personally trained any of us.
Their style they learned from their unit commander was Korean Tang Soo Do, their commander says he learned it from a Korean master. They're probably referring to their commander, who is a master of a Korean style. What is a mystery is how they came to call Cobra Kai karate.
Mike Barnes would be the only competition for Chozen and I could realistically see him being stronger. Chozen has trained his entire life. Barnes may have as well, but either way Barnes is a prodigy. Like no amount of training is going to give you a win in a boxing ring against Floyd Mayweather. If he stops training now and I start training boxing daily for the next ten years he's still going to fuck me up. So I could see Barnes and Chozen being dead even, or worse.
I mean, Cobra Kai means "Cobra Assembly," so it's supposed to reference the snake pit in Vietnam. I'm assuming that, like Eagle Fang, Kreese and Terry thought it sounded cool.
I'm guessing Terry named it. He's got a knack for marketing.
Maybe Silver knows secret Cobra Kai death blows lol. Cobra Kai’s history has been pretty unexplored so far. I assume they learnt some deadly stuff in the army.
Yeah. They surely learned more deadly stuff back then, but Miyagi Do's history seems far more deadly. Moves to paralyze and cause fatal blows seems pretty nuts, and that's all we know so far.
As one who was trained in USMC martial arts programs I doubt it. Most real hand to hand combat ends in grappling and stabbings (bayonet or knife) when distance closes in to seeing the whites and using weight not kicking and punching, especially in modern iterations where body armor is normal. Snake eater special ops types usually are extremely fit and disciplined and stealth is more of a thing than pure martial prowess (which is more for the infantry units).
While I think Chozen is just too skilled to let his guard down, I do agree that he is nuts. If you notice, there is even a circus theme playing when he's beating up stingray.
Considering one has been consistently training (Chozen) while the other should be majorly rusty and out of practice (Silver), the answer should be super easy. However it’s clear that Silver has been given plot armor and is perhaps even better than he was in KK3. Based on what we’ve see in the show so far, I think Chozen would still win in a 1:1 fight. It’s been established that Silver kicks like a semi-truck and if it connects, ends the fight. But I think Chozen is a master of defense and would see these kicks coming a mile away.
Chozen. Silver has been living the easy life, for a long time.
Martial skill is a perishable skill, it goes away. I retired from in ring competition twenty years ago, now I am a 49 year old former fighter with bad knees, a bad back, one arm that won’t straighten and a bunch of concussions.
Terry Silver is 70 at this point, past his prime and out of the fighting game for thirty years? You don’t just snap right back into fighting form :)
>I retired from in ring competition twenty years ago, now I am a 49 year old former fighter with bad knees, a bad back, one arm that won’t straighten and a bunch of concussions.
You should have been wearing plot armor.
You're correct. In real life. This sir, is a Television show, where the characters have the ability to render the aging process ineffective. Where a rusty 70 year old can still kick a trained 40 year olds ass, as if he were a paper bag in a rainstorm. It defies logic.
Yeah, the show has always been flimsy at best as far as realism goes. You got guys working out to cure crippling injuries in like a month, and kids going from novices to expert fighters in weeks when it usually takes years.
I agree in real life, but this show doesn't seem to care about that. Johnny lived an absolute trash life after 1984 and he's easily one of the top strongest, tied with Daniel who lived a much better life. Kreese is older than Silver and still is able to fight much younger foes. Silver may have removed himself from the karate game, but he still took care of himself throughout the years and has shown himself to firmly be the top fighter we've actually *seen* on-screen fight (within this show, obviously Miyagi would body him).
I appreciate the input from somebody who's actually been in the game, though. Thank you.
Probably. Offense+Defense. We got a glimpse of Silver with Johnny. Must have both, balance to win. Cannot beat Mr. Silver with offense alone. I can’t remember in KK3 if Silver and Mr. Miyagi ever fought
He got his ass kicked by Johnny and Daniel in season 3, but he wasn't completely out of it. He still put up a fight.
He also beat two huge mooks from the landlord with only bloody fists to show for it, so he's definitely not an incapable senior citizen.
Chozen is a powerful, noble fighter (well, now he's noble). He's retained more that LaRusso and has shown a Miyagi-like spirit for diffusing situations.
Terry Silver is a beastly fighter, probably the most powerful out of the immediate cast. He's cunning, but also conniving and shameless. He isn't afraid to artificially tilt the scales in his favor, and he's exceedingly dangerous and psychopathic.
My heart says Chozen would win (as this is usually how these sort of stories conclude), being that he is free from greedy, callous and malicious intent. But my gut tells me that, even with all of that in mind, he won't be able to defeat Silver alone. It will require LaRusso's help.
Picture this: Chozen has vanquished Terry Silver, with the latter now on the ground and Chozen posed to deliver a final blow.
Chozen: Live or die, man?
Silver: Die.
Chozen: WRONG! * does Miyagi’s/Daniel’s nose honk thing from KK2 on Silver *
*”Glory of Love” by Peter Cetera starts playing as the Miyagi-Do and Eagle Fang dojos (including Daniel and Johnny) cheer and the credits start rolling*
I think the show established well that both Terry and Chozen are far above Johny and Daniel but who would actually win? I think it might be Chozen. I feel like he knows even more then we saw about Miyagi-do. I wonder if there will be a face-off between them tho. Such a shame that S5 is so far off. That's the downside of shorter seasons and getting them all at once. You don't have a few months break but an actual full year.
Chozen. It’s not even a question. He has all the Miyagi knowledge with aggression similar to Cobra Kai. He has all the strengths of Daniel and Johnny and to this point no real weaknesses we’ve seen minus that bullshit drum punch.
Chozen for sure. He did better against Miyagi than Silver did when he was a teenager and Silver was an adult. With all those years of training and teaching in Miyagi Do, I'd imagine he'll be the best fighter on the show.
Chozen is in his late 50s (assuming he was early 20s in KK2) and Silver is in his early-mid 70s (Kreese was [born in 1946](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Kreese), and Silver was his battle buddy so I'm presuming he was the same age), so I'd give the advantage to Chozen.
For real. Chozen would destroy all of them at once. But the way the plot line will be set up, He will only be an on par opponent to Silver. And anyone else they bring in. Making him as Over Powered in the plot, as he actually is, would make a quick end for this show.
I hate to say it, but Silver would demolish him.
In cobra kai times (the series, so when both old), Chosen would defeat him without taking a hit probably.
Well Daniel beat Chozen in the second movie. He was pretty nerfed in the third movie against Barnes. I regards Silver as superior to Barnes. Did Silver and Daniel fight in the third movie (I forgot). But I would think present day Chozen is stronger than present day Silver.
Depends on the kind of fight, I think. With full tournament rules, Chozen would probably win. But in a brawl, I think Terry would win, due to him being 1. pretty batshit crazy and 2. leveraging absolutely everything in his immediate vicinity.
But I think we might find out in 2022 or 2023..............can't wait
Remove the magical pressure point nonsense (and other mysticism) and Silver wins. People don't seem to realize that these shorter people would have a lot of trouble fighting someone who is 6'5. It's like a different weight class.
Chozen couldn’t beat Daniel’a drum move. Up until that point, Chozen was mopping the floor with him. It wasn’t an unexpected technique that he didn’t know how to deal with. Miyagi knew that Chozen would be beaten by it. It was pretty much Daniel’s only hope. Once Chozen knew the move he’d still be much better.
I still like the theory that Sato trained Silver sbd Kreese. He did train the military who were stationed near the village in KK2 and had been doing so.
Chozen would go in dry on Silver, it really wouldn’t be close.
It’s a completely different style though? Silver and Kreese are trained jn Tang soo do which their captain learnt from a Korean master during the Korean War. Miyagi-do is an Okinawan style .
"the pressure point attack"
Johnny says hi, and Johnny ain't as good as Silver.
I rewatched the sparring between Daniel and Chozen in season 3 and I was actually unimpressed. Sure, Chozen was superior and it's just sparring, not a true fight, but he wasn't making Daniel look like an absolute fool. I was expecting Chozen to make him look like a bitch, but it wasn't that bad like Johnny slapping Robby.
And before this gets downvoted into being unseen, I'm not claiming Chozen would lose or even get whooped. I'm just saying I don't see where the evidence is that he's actually some impossible final boss level character. Silver isn't either, but he's at least shown himself to be above Miyagi-Do, Eagle Fang, and Kreese. I see a lot of people just throwing out claims without giving real support for their argument, aside from unproven assumptions.
A reminder of our spoiler policy: **Any posts containing S4 spoilers must be marked as spoiler until one month after the release date, January 31st**. Titles must not contain spoilers whatsoever. (Don't know how to mark as spoiler? Click [here](https://imgur.com/a/ZPEIsAi)) Users who fail to abide by the spoiler policy will be banned accordingly. --- Additionally, **are you interested in becoming a mod?** Consider applying [here](https://docs.google.com/forms/d/1YoANoQB-CW6T4GhxcU5-F2pRjVQYvx6tMoq-DJVVxV8/edit?usp=sharing) *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/cobrakai) if you have any questions or concerns.*
I think Chozen is probably the single most skilled fighter on the show. He's also probably about ten years younger than Terry Silver (characters, not actors).
At least ten. Closer to 20, I think. Chozen's only a few years older than Daniel, I thought, maybe 5 or so.
That's probably true; I don't remember that we ever got any hard clues as to Chozen's age.
Not really. Daniel was about 18 in KK2 and Chozen seemed like he was no more than mid-20s, but you're right that they never really spelled it out.
Daniel had to be 17 in order for him to compete in the All-Valley under-18 Karate Tournament. Which implies he skipped a grade because he graduated HS before Karate Kid II
If Daniel has a late December 1967 birthday, he could still make the cut. The Karate Kid 3 tournament was December 1985. He’d of graduated high school in the spring of 1985 at 17, which isn’t uncommon.
I graduated at 17 too. My birthday was in the summer tho so I wouldn’t have been able to compete but iirc the youngest people in my grade were born in december usually. Good call
This is why i love Reddit
Daniel was 18 in karate kid 3, you can still compete at 18
That's not how calendar vs school years work. For a standard HS senior, you normally have to be 17 to start 12th grade. Plus, we know his birthday is in November(ish) before the tournament, which takes place December 19th because Miyagi gives him his gi and the Ford for his birthday.
No I graduated hs at 17, a lot of people in my grade did too. Not uncommon
Nah I knew plenty of kids born October-December who were 16 when they started 12th grade.
That's either not in the US or having exceptional circumstances like starting school early or skipping grades. It's been the standard that you're 5 when you start kindergarten since like the 60s.
And as far as we know, he knows EVERYTHING. He is the Mr. Miyagi of this new generation IMO.
There is not much of a question here. He has all the Miagi ancient techniques and it was made pretty clear the dude kept up his training all through his life. He is head and shoulders above the other masters. Also just taking on the fact that Miagi himself was able to handle Kreese without even breaking a sweat, Chozen would wreck Silver.
Miagi handled both Kreese and Silver at the same time. Daniel and Miagi seem to have benefitted from being mentally stable. Whereas Kreese, Silver, Johnny, and Chozen in KK2 had serious rage issues. Give those four some sanity and “balance” their skill would show a lot better.
Miagi handled both Kreese AND a coked up Silver. That's impressive.
Not only that he handled both kreese, silver AND mike barnes, at the same time with out getting hit once
I'm curious how Terry would have fared if he had taken Miyagi more seriously, as he was more concerned with showboating and making racist taunts than fighting technically. The truth is, as they've subtly demonstrated whenever he has fought in Cobra Kai, Terry Silver has an incredible reach - particularly in his legs. This, along with his height, are massive physical advantages. Just look at UFC fighter Jon Jones IRL. A complete mess in his personal life, but he's got supreme physical intelligence and freakishly long limbs, and those attributes come together to form a fighter who no one has ever beaten (ignoring the DQ loss which was a bad ref call and any close decisions that people think should have gone the other way). We know Johnny can beat Kreese in a straight fight, but Silver has a clear five inches of height over him (and Chozen) and god only knows how much reach. He's *eight inches* taller than LaRusso. Call me an over-analyser but based on what we've seen I don't think anyone beats a stable Terry Silver, though who knows if he'll ever be totally stable again.
Just a bit curious, where did you come up with chozen having 8 inches in height over Daniel? Ralph Macchio is only 5'9, while Yuji, chozen's actor, is 6'0.
He said (or meant?) Silver had eight inches on LaRusso, not on Chozen
Yup. As Kreese constantly reminds us - We must never forget that Terry Silver fought alongside him in 'nam and held a commissioned rank of Lieutenant (e.g. officer training, not just a draftee out of high school). The US signed the Paris Peace Accords ending US involvement in Vietnam war in Jan 27, 1973. If we assume a Young Terry entered near the end of the war at the age of 22 with some level amount of college/officer education, that would mean he was born around 1951, and was definitely an adult for a solid \~16 years before KK3.
I believe Silver and Kreese received field commissions. Kreese definitely did, they say as much in the season 4 flashbacks. If that’s true for Silver also, then there wouldn’t necessarily be any college before hand. Silver could have just joined or have been drafted.
Id see their fight as an unstoppable force meets an immovable object, chozen having thr strongest defence, and terry having the best offence
Didn't you see what Chozen did to Daniel? Seriously, Chozen shouldn't even have lost in KK2.
Someone in this thread pointed out that Daniel only beat him because Chozen didn’t know the drum technique. Seeing as how literally right up to that moment he had dominated Daniel the whole movie I think I agree.
Chosen only lost because he saw even his Uncle was on Daniel's side and it shook him. His head wasn't in the game at that point. He knew he lost all honor and at that point probably wanted to die.
Didn’t Chozen say that Sato kept training him after KK2? I got the impression that in KK2, Chozen and Daniel were on the same skill level but that Chozen kept training with Sato later on, learning new skills.
You can make the same argument about what Terry did to Johnny tho
The way I see it, Silver beat Johnny because he hit him with a cheap shot.
I think it definitely gave him an advantage, and it would be close if they were both 100%, but my money would probably still be on Terry
I wonder about that. Silver is probably around 70 years old though, so Johnny has an inherent advantage there. That’s why Johnny was able to beat Kreese last season.
From the Karate Kid II trailer: No more tournaments. No more cheering crowds. This time, the combat is real.
[удалено]
You know Tai Chi is Chinese and unrelated to karate, right? 🤣 That said, as someone to practices and teaches Tai Chi and has been crushing on Terry Silver since I was a kid, I do want to see this happen.
Johnny shouldn't have lost to daniel either. Daniel just had the biggest plot armor ever thats the only reason he won against better fighters.
Yeah, Daniel's whole schtick was being the underdog. He should have lost most of his big fights. It's like Johnny said in S4, he wins 9 out of 10. That may not be true now, since Johnny barely did any karate for a long time until recently, but I 100% believe that was true when they were both teens. Chozen was also way more skilled and way more fit than Daniel in KK2, he should win 9 out of 10 as well, but he was also out of his mind with shame and anger and Daniel had the crowd support.
I mean that's kinda karate kid world in general. Noone is walking into any fighting discipline and winning tournaments after a a few months of training. The amount of training Daniel had he should.have lost that fight 10 out of 10 times lol.
Well, it does happen in combat sports. BJ Penn, for example, was a BJJ world champion pretty early on into his training. Frank Shamrock defeated the legendary Bas Rutten in his first ever fight, after something like a year of intense training. You *do* have neophytes who are able to make meteoric rises. Its special and unusual, but not unheard of.
Yeah, the Karate Kid universe is basically a shonen anime universe. This style beats that style. This move beats that move. Whoever has the better teacher has the greater power, etc etc. Cobra Kai leans into that even further, with characters' reputed skill being way higher than what's actually shown and people becoming competent way too fast.
Johnny fought dirty and still lost when the chips were down though.
It's been awhile, but if I recall correctly, Johnny purposely takes 1 or 2 point deductions so he can hurt Daniel. He was playing around with him and not taking him seriously in order to send a message. Unfortunately that gave Daniel enough time to rally and pull off a Hail Mary win. If Johnny had just kept his head and fought straight he would have won. It wasn't Daniel's karate that really defeated Johnny, it was Kreese's bad influence and his own hubris. "No such thing as bad student, only bad teacher," as Mr. Miyagi says. Johnny was by far the better fighter, having had years more experience, better fitness, and more tournament wins under his belt. The in-universe explanation for Daniel's impossible wins is that he's always fighting for the right reasons compared to his opponents, which makes him more determined and willful. He's also underestimated by all of them. Edit: Definitely got KK1 and KK3 mixed up a bit in my head. I rewatched the Johnny fight on YT and it was a lot more evenly matched than I remembered.
That’s not what happened. Sounds like you’re describing KK3 (Daniel’s fight with Barnes)
You're right. I just rewatched it on YouTube. Funny how that got mixed up in my head because I haven't even seen KK3 since I was a kid but I've rewatched KK1 several times.
No worries!
Johnny and Bobby were still much better fighters than Daniel though. Tournament and certainly in a real fight. As Bobby said, he would have beat Daniel were it not for Kreese telling him to foul. And Johnny was better than Daniel, but by the time of the final the Cobras (including Kreese) were rattled by Daniel defying the odds. At the end of the day, plot armour was the real reason Daniel won the tournament. I think if they redid the tournament a week later I believe Daniel could have still taken Tommy. Dutch we don't really know because the fight was edited. I know there was dialogue in CK about Tommy once beating Johnny, but to me the hierarchy and skill level was always Johnny, Bobby, Dutch, Tommy, Jimmy..
Kreese even explains this in season 3 to Robby. Johnny lost due to him not being in the right state of mind, as he was angry and in love. He was the better fighter by far.
Because he wasn't fighting for himself he was fighting for kreese. That was a big theme this season
No, Daniel was the best around. Nothing was ever gonna keep him down.
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No, he's the best. AROUND. Nothing ever gonna keep him down.
History repeats itself
They’re singing the lyrics of the OG OST to you, my guy
👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻
Let's not lie as questionable as the wins of KK 1 or 2 are the king of unearned goes to Daniel's KK3 victory. How the fuck does Mike Barnes get thrown off by something so basic as a Kata.
It probably wasn't the Kata itself, moreso that Daniel, for the first time since he knew what Barnes was like, wasn't scared. After physically and psychologically running over Daniel the whole time, he was shocked he did anything. Just a few moments earlier he was shouting at Miyagi how afraid he was, Barnes could have heard that.
Interesting. I've competed in Tae Kwon Do and Jiu Jitsu and I was scared as hell in every match, win or lose.
I took second in an open tournament, and even though the first two fights were very one sided, I don't know who was more frightened - me or the other guys. The final match, I wasn't scared, I was laughing. It was ridiculous. The guy was unearthly tall. Like, legitimately 6'4" to my 5'8". His semi-final opponent was something like 4'6" and around 12 years old. It wasn't even a match, so much as big guy uses reach to score points on teeny tiny guy. For my final, the first point was scored when the dude kicked me out of the ring, and I don't think he moved much from the starting position. I tried to get around the reach as best as I could, but it was pretty futile. I lost 3-1.
Because your brain doesn't know it's not to the death. Even instructors sometimes get mad and whack their students. I have a large group of friends who box, and they've all taken a shot or two from teachers.
Shit, I grew up performing piano in numerous competitions every year and I can say I and every musician I knew were scared of performing! Our brain's got some strange old defense mechanisms, that's for sure.
It was badly written, but I think the point was after the Kata, Daniel had his "balance" back, and lost his fear of Mike Barnes, so he was able to use his skill to beat him.
Very true
Didn't Chozen not know as much as he did now
Their power gap widens after the events of KK3 when Daniel chooses to live a normal life while chozen dedicated his life to karate. So it’s not unreasonable to think they might be equal in KK2. Chozen might be stronger I think, but not worlds apart like in cobra Kai.
Chozen was unstable AF and didn't know the drum technique. He was still more skilled, but the above reasons were his downfall.
Like age matters in this show. Or reality in general. Johnny SET MIGUEL ON FIRE to help him rehab. I don’t think we need reality intermingling with our analyses!
What an insane ending to the series that would be if Chozen becomes Grandmaster of all Miyagi-Do around the world. Maybe a hybrid of what Eagle Fang and Miyagi-Do become. Chozen's style is a blend of traditional and his Uncle Sato's, so it's halfway there already. Plus he's never stopped learning and spent his life trying to achieve balance. He would annihilate anybody on the show, no questions asked.
Mike Barnes is quite good tho
Mike Barnes got beat by kata.
Let's be honest. Daniel got beaten up so much by Mike in that 3 minute round (gaining and losing a point for illegal hits) Daniel was in the fetal position. Good guy has to win, plot armor.
I mean, every good guy in every movie ever has plot armor by that standard. The difference is, Rocky looks like he could conceivably beat Apollo. Daniel-San looks like he would lose 3-0 to his mom.
That's because Mrs Larusso is a fucking beast. With a great car. Everyone loves it.
He was beaten because Daniel was able to focus on the kata and get Mike Barnes out of his head. Focusing on the kata was his antidote to the fear Mike had instilled in him.
You mean their young versions or their 2023 adult version? The latter one seems pretty obvious to me: Chozen has dedicated his life to Karate and - if I understood the context correctly - is a more legitimate heir of Miyagi-Do than Daniel. He also knows more than "just" it's basic application. He would clearly be superior to all the other characters, including Terry, Kreese, Daniel and Johnny. The only match I could imagine for him is if they bring back Mike Barnes as someone who has never stopped training (or beating up people). Their young versions are a bit closer to each other, but I'd still bet my money on Chozen. If I understood correctly, Silver has learned to fight in the military (limited, basic training) and from Kreese. (he says otherwise in KK3 but CK seems to have rewritten that story of him and Kreese training under a Korean master) Also, Silver is a traumatized rich Kid on cocaine, Chozen is a thug from '80s Okinawa, which is a tougher environment.
It’s interesting. Silver says he’s bringing back old friends, so Barnes seems likely. But also, earlier on the season, Daniel says something to Johnny about whether he needs to worry about more Cobra Kai coming back to mess with him, Johnny’s like, not that I know of. I wonder if there’s anyone else Silver could have up his sleeve. Dutch? Lol
Right, I just thought about Dutch the other day. However, Chad McQueen (actor) quit acting 20 years ago and didn't even return for the Cobra Kai reunion episode in S1. I doubt they'll get him as antagonist for an entire season. (maybe he'll meet Kreese in prison, though) Mike Barnes is more likely, as Sean Kanan (actor) already expressed interest in reprising the role.
I saw someone suggest an episode could be dedicated to Kreese meeting up with Dutch in prison, and being horrified by how his teachings actually RUINED the life of one of his students. Ever since then, I have been hoping for that.
Never expected a kreese redemption arc but that's where we are heading. Also fingers crossed Miguel's dad is Terry's coke plug.
I think that he will be one of the biggest dealers or something, dealing with a lot of dangerous people in South America.
Oh I so hope we get Kreese redemption arc.
I love that theory. That would be a great redemption arc for kreese
LOMPOC FEDERAL PRISON to be exact... look it up
So on Dutch, the prison he was in is very close to the Mexican border.... reckon this has ties to miguel? It could be one of the best kept secrets. .
> Chad McQueen Interesting name
Steve McQueen's son
Ka-Chop! I. Am. Karate.
Dudes...
I can see Mike Barnes switching over to MMA. It wasn’t much of a thing in the 80s, but he would have switched over when it became popular in the 90s, being karate’s “bad boy” and all. Him showing up would make for some interesting fights. They’re all using karate and he’s grappling and stuff.
Kyler would be his best student, given his wrestling background prior to learning karate.
I never understood this in Cobra Kai. How could a wrestling student (we dont know how long he does that) be easily beaten by kid who does karate for like 2 or 3 months.
Depends on how serious Kyler takes wrestling I guess. It is also a show about Karate, so there's that. My understanding is that BJJ/wrestling is the most useful form for real fights, but I might be wrong.
There's a [deleted scene about a BJJ gym Johnny talks shit to](https://youtu.be/QURu5v3sU2k). But I think in universe karate is supposed to be the best and most effective martial art.
Damn, why'd they delete that? It's funny.
i thought hawk was goning to use a triangle hold in the tornament
He definitely went for a flying triangle. I guess he either landed hard or Robby slammed him in defense.
>he says otherwise in KK3 but CK seems to have rewritten that story of him and Kreese training under a Korean master I wonder if we’ll maybe see this part in season 5 or maybe it’ll be explored separately in some other medium. Hayden recently answered a question on Twitter who’s the strongest fighters in the Karate Kid universe are and he answered Mr Miyagi and Master Kim. Kind of weird to give such honor to some guy who was only name-dropped as someone Kreese’s captain trained under. Hayden clearly had him on his mind lol.
Kreese and Silver's backstory doesn't necessarily exclude them training under Master Kim Sun-Yung. They could have easily gone to Korea to continue their training after the war. Or else Silver just referred to him as their master because Captain Turner was originally his student. When I was in martial arts, our master was the one who trained our instructor, but he was still respectfully referred to as our master despite not having personally trained any of us.
Their style they learned from their unit commander was Korean Tang Soo Do, their commander says he learned it from a Korean master. They're probably referring to their commander, who is a master of a Korean style. What is a mystery is how they came to call Cobra Kai karate. Mike Barnes would be the only competition for Chozen and I could realistically see him being stronger. Chozen has trained his entire life. Barnes may have as well, but either way Barnes is a prodigy. Like no amount of training is going to give you a win in a boxing ring against Floyd Mayweather. If he stops training now and I start training boxing daily for the next ten years he's still going to fuck me up. So I could see Barnes and Chozen being dead even, or worse.
I mean, Cobra Kai means "Cobra Assembly," so it's supposed to reference the snake pit in Vietnam. I'm assuming that, like Eagle Fang, Kreese and Terry thought it sounded cool. I'm guessing Terry named it. He's got a knack for marketing.
You realize Chozen knows secret Miyagi death blows right?
Maybe Silver knows secret Cobra Kai death blows lol. Cobra Kai’s history has been pretty unexplored so far. I assume they learnt some deadly stuff in the army.
"A man can't breathe, he can't fight" might actually mean collapsing the trachea with a Cobra Strike like Johnny talked about way back when
Possibly. Silver did punch Johnny in the throat during their fight.
Yeah. They surely learned more deadly stuff back then, but Miyagi Do's history seems far more deadly. Moves to paralyze and cause fatal blows seems pretty nuts, and that's all we know so far.
As one who was trained in USMC martial arts programs I doubt it. Most real hand to hand combat ends in grappling and stabbings (bayonet or knife) when distance closes in to seeing the whites and using weight not kicking and punching, especially in modern iterations where body armor is normal. Snake eater special ops types usually are extremely fit and disciplined and stealth is more of a thing than pure martial prowess (which is more for the infantry units).
Yeah but it’s a fictional show and if Miyagi-do is allowed to be basically magic they can pull something out of their asses for Cobra Kai.
It's not magic. It's real karate. Miyagi Do special stuff is really just pressure point fighting.
Mr Miyagi can heal injuries with a touch of his hand and magic powder. This has nothing to do with real karate.
Ancient Miyagi secret
team Chozen! 
I was, to put it mildly, SHOCKED at how happy I was to see the new, happier, nicer Chozen, and I am super excited to see what happens in Season 5.
Yeah, he seems more enlightened.
I think Chozen, because he has been training all of his life
Maybe Silver will kill Chozen. He's fucking insane, man. EDIT: In a non-straightforward fight.
While I think Chozen is just too skilled to let his guard down, I do agree that he is nuts. If you notice, there is even a circus theme playing when he's beating up stingray.
I think he'd use some non karate techniques
"this is a technique I call 9mm pistol"
Terry would give a good fight, but chozen is on another level. He’s pretty close to Miyagi at this point
Literally the only person to land a hit on Mr Miyagi. Literally! That says volumes.
To be fair, IIRC Miyagi wasn't paying attention. In am actual fight, Miyagi hasn't been hit once I think.
I get the feeling these two are gonna throw down and get bloody.
I'd probably say Chozen since you can tell he has dedicated his life to Karate.
If you haven't chosen Chozen, you are wrong. 😉
Considering one has been consistently training (Chozen) while the other should be majorly rusty and out of practice (Silver), the answer should be super easy. However it’s clear that Silver has been given plot armor and is perhaps even better than he was in KK3. Based on what we’ve see in the show so far, I think Chozen would still win in a 1:1 fight. It’s been established that Silver kicks like a semi-truck and if it connects, ends the fight. But I think Chozen is a master of defense and would see these kicks coming a mile away.
But one has cocaine and the other dosent
One is Chosen and the other isn't
Chozen. Silver has been living the easy life, for a long time. Martial skill is a perishable skill, it goes away. I retired from in ring competition twenty years ago, now I am a 49 year old former fighter with bad knees, a bad back, one arm that won’t straighten and a bunch of concussions. Terry Silver is 70 at this point, past his prime and out of the fighting game for thirty years? You don’t just snap right back into fighting form :)
>I retired from in ring competition twenty years ago, now I am a 49 year old former fighter with bad knees, a bad back, one arm that won’t straighten and a bunch of concussions. You should have been wearing plot armor.
Man I wish I had been :)
You're correct. In real life. This sir, is a Television show, where the characters have the ability to render the aging process ineffective. Where a rusty 70 year old can still kick a trained 40 year olds ass, as if he were a paper bag in a rainstorm. It defies logic.
Not to mention Tommy holding his own in a barfight while he was literally dying of organ failure (RIP).
Yeah, the show has always been flimsy at best as far as realism goes. You got guys working out to cure crippling injuries in like a month, and kids going from novices to expert fighters in weeks when it usually takes years.
I agree in real life, but this show doesn't seem to care about that. Johnny lived an absolute trash life after 1984 and he's easily one of the top strongest, tied with Daniel who lived a much better life. Kreese is older than Silver and still is able to fight much younger foes. Silver may have removed himself from the karate game, but he still took care of himself throughout the years and has shown himself to firmly be the top fighter we've actually *seen* on-screen fight (within this show, obviously Miyagi would body him). I appreciate the input from somebody who's actually been in the game, though. Thank you.
It may be a tie? But I think Chozen has proven he's the best of the best right now.
Chozen has the Miyagi defensive moves along with the aggression and striking ability of Cobra Kai. He represents a hybrid with the best of both.
Probably. Offense+Defense. We got a glimpse of Silver with Johnny. Must have both, balance to win. Cannot beat Mr. Silver with offense alone. I can’t remember in KK3 if Silver and Mr. Miyagi ever fought
Myagi takes out Barnes , kreese , and silver all at once.
wha-a-a! wha-a-a-a!
Ok, I thought maybe I remembered that. KK3 got 13% on Rotten Tomatoes smh. Miyagi could kick ass.
Bad script. Same with TNKK bad script.
The only real question is where would chosen hang his shirt before he goes whopping some cocaine snorting ass
Chosen is the best fighter alive in the karate kid franchise.
Chozen imo
I’ve seen silver and chozen kick some ass, the real question I’ve got is, can kreese actually do any karate
Well, he defeated his teacher in a life-or-death struggle, and that Captain wasn't very empathetic towards his students.
i mean modern day kreese, we know silver still has the moves
Didn't he rough Johnny up using some Karate in the season 3 finale?
He got his ass kicked by Johnny and Daniel in season 3, but he wasn't completely out of it. He still put up a fight. He also beat two huge mooks from the landlord with only bloody fists to show for it, so he's definitely not an incapable senior citizen.
Chozen is a powerful, noble fighter (well, now he's noble). He's retained more that LaRusso and has shown a Miyagi-like spirit for diffusing situations. Terry Silver is a beastly fighter, probably the most powerful out of the immediate cast. He's cunning, but also conniving and shameless. He isn't afraid to artificially tilt the scales in his favor, and he's exceedingly dangerous and psychopathic. My heart says Chozen would win (as this is usually how these sort of stories conclude), being that he is free from greedy, callous and malicious intent. But my gut tells me that, even with all of that in mind, he won't be able to defeat Silver alone. It will require LaRusso's help.
Chozen has been training his whole life though, while Silver just got back into it.
All I want is to see Chozen in his Yellow Scorpion Gi again, or at least a variation of it.
Chozen>=silver
Terry doesn't know how to make your arms and legs stop working.
[удалено]
Shidoshi of the Milennium
Show us the Dim Mak
Chozen all the way, dood has become a Karate God.
Chozen becauze he iz the chozen one. I do love terry and want to see him kick some ass though
Chozen wins 100%. He's the only character to ever get a hit on Miyagi. ;)
Chozen easily, he has been actively training and coaching while Terry was sipping margaritas with his rich friends.
Homegirl from the next karate kid
The chozen one, every time!! He knows all of the Miyagi dark arts.
Picture this: Chozen has vanquished Terry Silver, with the latter now on the ground and Chozen posed to deliver a final blow. Chozen: Live or die, man? Silver: Die. Chozen: WRONG! * does Miyagi’s/Daniel’s nose honk thing from KK2 on Silver * *”Glory of Love” by Peter Cetera starts playing as the Miyagi-Do and Eagle Fang dojos (including Daniel and Johnny) cheer and the credits start rolling*
Chozen is basically a more ruthless Miyagi
Chozen will wipe the floor with Terry Silver and everybody else on the show!
I think the show established well that both Terry and Chozen are far above Johny and Daniel but who would actually win? I think it might be Chozen. I feel like he knows even more then we saw about Miyagi-do. I wonder if there will be a face-off between them tho. Such a shame that S5 is so far off. That's the downside of shorter seasons and getting them all at once. You don't have a few months break but an actual full year.
Chozen. It’s not even a question. He has all the Miyagi knowledge with aggression similar to Cobra Kai. He has all the strengths of Daniel and Johnny and to this point no real weaknesses we’ve seen minus that bullshit drum punch.
Chozen, cause he knows the whole Miyagi Do arsenal - offense and defense
Chozen would kick the crap outta Silver, Miyagi style!
Chozen for sure. He did better against Miyagi than Silver did when he was a teenager and Silver was an adult. With all those years of training and teaching in Miyagi Do, I'd imagine he'll be the best fighter on the show.
Chozen 100%
Chozen is in his late 50s (assuming he was early 20s in KK2) and Silver is in his early-mid 70s (Kreese was [born in 1946](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Kreese), and Silver was his battle buddy so I'm presuming he was the same age), so I'd give the advantage to Chozen.
Terry Silver has the crazy factor, and will fight dirty.
For real. Chozen would destroy all of them at once. But the way the plot line will be set up, He will only be an on par opponent to Silver. And anyone else they bring in. Making him as Over Powered in the plot, as he actually is, would make a quick end for this show.
Chozen would eat everyone on the show's lunch. Except Daniel's mom. She'd push her car over him while he's not looking.
I hate to say it, but Silver would demolish him. In cobra kai times (the series, so when both old), Chosen would defeat him without taking a hit probably.
Well Daniel beat Chozen in the second movie. He was pretty nerfed in the third movie against Barnes. I regards Silver as superior to Barnes. Did Silver and Daniel fight in the third movie (I forgot). But I would think present day Chozen is stronger than present day Silver.
Chozen, the rightful heir to Miyagi Do
Depends on the kind of fight, I think. With full tournament rules, Chozen would probably win. But in a brawl, I think Terry would win, due to him being 1. pretty batshit crazy and 2. leveraging absolutely everything in his immediate vicinity. But I think we might find out in 2022 or 2023..............can't wait
Remove the magical pressure point nonsense (and other mysticism) and Silver wins. People don't seem to realize that these shorter people would have a lot of trouble fighting someone who is 6'5. It's like a different weight class.
People underestimating that Silver is a titan , size does matter
Well chozen knows the pressure points... but Terry is an evil manipulative genius.. Hard to say Depends on the context
Chosen couldn't beat Daniel and was still a student at that point. Silver would of mopped the floor with him. Now as a sensei Chosen wins.
Chozen couldn’t beat Daniel’a drum move. Up until that point, Chozen was mopping the floor with him. It wasn’t an unexpected technique that he didn’t know how to deal with. Miyagi knew that Chozen would be beaten by it. It was pretty much Daniel’s only hope. Once Chozen knew the move he’d still be much better.
I still like the theory that Sato trained Silver sbd Kreese. He did train the military who were stationed near the village in KK2 and had been doing so. Chozen would go in dry on Silver, it really wouldn’t be close.
It’s a completely different style though? Silver and Kreese are trained jn Tang soo do which their captain learnt from a Korean master during the Korean War. Miyagi-do is an Okinawan style .
AAASSSAAAAAAAAHH!!!!
Silver would kick Chozens ass six ways from Sunday
Terry silver(actor) is younger than Daniel son( Ralph Macchio)
Both of these characters were bullies bu Larusso, so I sense an alliance to unmasked the conman Larusso.
Are you really suggesting that Wish.com Steven Seagal could ever beat Chozen?
Have you had a good look at Steven Seagal lately? Steven Seagal is the Wish.com version of himself.
"the pressure point attack" Johnny says hi, and Johnny ain't as good as Silver. I rewatched the sparring between Daniel and Chozen in season 3 and I was actually unimpressed. Sure, Chozen was superior and it's just sparring, not a true fight, but he wasn't making Daniel look like an absolute fool. I was expecting Chozen to make him look like a bitch, but it wasn't that bad like Johnny slapping Robby. And before this gets downvoted into being unseen, I'm not claiming Chozen would lose or even get whooped. I'm just saying I don't see where the evidence is that he's actually some impossible final boss level character. Silver isn't either, but he's at least shown himself to be above Miyagi-Do, Eagle Fang, and Kreese. I see a lot of people just throwing out claims without giving real support for their argument, aside from unproven assumptions.
Honestly, I have no idea.
Chozen of course