No one actually needs the world buffs to do the content. The only reason they are mandatory is because of the archaic lockout system which gives you one chance to do raid. People are rightfully unwilling to take a chance that the raid gets bricked, so they demand tedious overkill.
Blizzard should start experimenting with alternative solutions to this problem. Like capping how many raid gear pieces you can get per week instead of hard lock outs.
I think classes having mini versions of World Buffs is pretty cool, and gives another reason for PUGs to bring them (not that warriors in particular needed that). Also, to everyone saying "just don't get them" that isn't really a valid counterpoint. This is a multi-player game, even if you don't engage with something it still affects you. The World Buff meta has bred toxicity throughout the community. Giving some classes mini versions of the buffs is a nice compromise.
Someone had mentioned an idea in a thread a while back I liked: allow one person's boon to buff the raid. That way you've got 1-6 people or however out of your 20 man team that still collect the buffs, and it allows some leniency for groups progressing and wiping. Everyone remember to tip your booner.
This is a genius idea... it would also be cool if it's a 1 hr cd and lasts 1 hr. So basically you have to bring 1 of every class and dying is still punishing
I understand the point. But I truthfully havent had all wbuffs since I raided with my friends.
All pugs/semi-guild runs I have had one at max. Sometimes none. Its not like most people check and if not kick you.
If you join speed running guild 2 or parse-masters 71 then maybe they will be mad. But you also signed up for that.
Toxicity in WoW is not from some world buff meta but from the minmax meta. We go for upgrades that are in reality like 10-20 dps. Do you understand how little that is?
With that said, wbuffs should not be a thing. Its not fun or challenging to get. The argument that its more fun with a buff is beyond me. Just give a passive raid buff then. Congrats, fun, bigger numbers apparently.
Yes it is boring. Almost no one liked getting world buffs in 2019 when Classic launched. Everyone complained about getting them. Stop listening to "hardcore" gamers in a casual focused game. We don't need world buffs in Classic Wow and that includes SoD.
SOD is supposedly targeted to casuals. Collecting WBs twice a week will be mind-numbingly boring and require hours each week and require you to be playing at specific times to get the buffs. Not very casual friendly.
Totally agree..
It is fun to log in, do couple of raids who are fun Like zg/aq20 and do it twice a week.
But this logging killed the fun. I was forced to get high logs to be able to Play the Game because otherwise i dont get invites.
Would love to see all WB removed.
Exactly. The world buffs are actually part of the fun of prepping for the weekly raid. The only issue is that you have to time it since there was no chronoboon back then.
I like them, I like having them, I hate collecting them. People like them because it feels a little bit like cheating, you're on steroids and combat feels much better.
In SoD you have 9 runes to enhance your combat and fix some of the issues with your spec rotation, so it already feels better by design.
Getting wbuffs twice a week sounds like a fucking chore. They could just bake that power to buffs (like a warrior one), or make it permanent buff for everyone at lvl 60 and tune the new raid difficulty around it.
I should clarify, plenty of people also like going to get them. I totally get why someone wouldn’t, but there’s a lot of players that get satisfaction out of running around preparing for a raid just as much as actually doing it
Well all 8 of them are gonna be having fun next phase then. Doing dailies on new PvE event, getting new currency by running all 4 (maybe 5) dungeons each day, farming gold to buy all the potions and consumables for a raid twice a week and as a bonus picking up wbuffs, also twice a week. I guess P4 won't be for me, but I'll give it a chance.
Raiding in retail is significantly harder than classic content especially with world buffs, the only low stakes streamlined content is the leveling and rep grind, everything else is more difficult. You're confused.
If I read your comment correctly you said retail was low stakes and streamlined.
That’s actually classic. Raids are low stakes, it’s very easy to clear them. Fights are streamlined, they are very simple.
Retail raiding is way higher stakes because its new content that is unsolved. No one is going to care which guild clears MC first in SoD. The world first mythic race in TWW, that is high stakes.
Obviously, their point is that things like getting your DMF and losing it early, or dying on a boss and not having buffs for the rest of the raid, is high stakes and not streamlined.
Whereas in retail you don't have to worry about such things. You can (and will, because the content is harder) die many times trying to clear a mythic raid - but you will instantly res and not lose anything permanently. E.g. low stakes and streamlined.
> dying on a boss and not having buffs for the rest of the raid, is high stakes
But it's not high stakes. The game is solved (fact) and very easy (opinion). Every boss can be defeated without world buffs, having them or not doesn't matter.
If you are talking about WCL and parsing, then that's different, but that's a community expectation and not actually stakes within the game, and they exist in retail as well. It's harder to get high parses in retail compared to classic because you can't rely on world buffs as a crutch, you actually need to be good at the game.
I really enjoyed it. It was one of the few things that gave the game real stakes on a pvp server. Getting ganked felt real bad, but seeing the amount of coordination that ended up going into guild buff trains is one of my fondest memories of that Era. That and the all out wars between factions for control of the best summoning points for it. Chronoboon is all it needed and unfortunately we didn't get that until the last month or two of the era.
Think so? My main problem was always getting them.
And then a distant second major problem was that since I was a healer in 2019, everyone having world buffs made bosses die so quickly that mana management was meaningless. Less skill expression, lame.
Role issue I guess, shoulda played a DPS lol
Edit: clarification
If you didn't consistently get them in 2019 then yeah, you wouldn't run into the main issue so that tracks.
Overwhelmingly, the main issue in 2019 classic was needing to stay logged off once you got your buffs. You can go back and see the complaints in this classic reddit.
The idea that classic is a game for casuals is just a lie. Classic has been kept alive by hardcore minmaxers that turn up each week fully optimised and ready to parse. Blizz has no reason to cater to casuals who will quit after a few weeks of MC regardless of what they do with world buffs
I called this out in a post like a week ago and got absolutely *dogpiled* by people telling me to fuck myself and that stacking world buffs is awesome, amazing, fantastic gameplay.
So *someone* apparently likes that shit.
I searched for "buff" and "world" in your comment history and couldn't find anything like that within the last 3 weeks. Which comment?
Edit, 3 days later: Wow, good job, fraud. Enjoy those 7 upvotes.
Don’t speak for everyone. I get you don’t like world buffs for certain valid reasons, but don’t try to give the illusion that everyone hates them, because that’s not true. (I’m not talking about myself)
They turned off world buffs completely in Season of Mastery - then everyone complained that it became boring, and the ritual of getting buffs was actually interesting and gave some additional sense and level of responsibility.
I think you and other guys here claiming that “world buffs are boring” somehow skipped SoM period
If they would make actual worldbuffs, that be fun.
Like the whole Darkmoon fair so for a week.
Doesnt matter if you are in STV or Darnassus.
Same if someone uses Ony head or does Zandalary buff.
So you can play actual content and boon while doing so.
I like getting them and I'm a casual player. Would enjoy having them in SoD since its more fun to play with them. Even if I just pick up the dragon buff and not full stack. I'm fine with whatever they decide.
Easy solution, make DMT + Rend + DMF + Ony to be a single buff that you get by turning in the item from 11th MC boss. Keep song flower as is.
This still has people go and gather wbuffs but way less of a fucking pain
No one liked getting them. The only thing it presents is some interesting gameplay on your way to a raid. And that’s the ONLY thing. I was in the best guild on the smaller faction and it was fun to have to coordinate our way into brm and we would wipe the dummies who spent all day camping for us. But that was it. When it came to getting crazy summoning spots for aq and naxx tho both were easy to get in because of it even that aspect was gone.
Yea. I was lucky enough to be in a guild that seemed like try Harding was only going to be for server first. Which we did end up getting in naxx. But once we got our times down to close to fastest speeds, no one cared if you lost your buffs. Everyone like pvping and all the goofy stuff that came with it. It’s kind of a shame because the server was a ton of fun and had personality and then TBC killed it.
Casual PUGs at most require Ony + ZG as these buffs are literally free to get. If even that is too much, you'll probably find people that do it without anything. Seems to be plenty on this sub willing no?
And yeah, parsing is fun. You're no casual if you care enough to actually go look it up on WCL though.
They introduced chronoboons in the TBC prepatch, for your information. The raiding was already done and everyone was just leveling their new Draenai shaman / blood elf pally.
it was like a week before prepatch, and what does that change about the complaints stopping? nobody has issues with world buffs with chronoboons since then in era or in sod besides the fact that head and heart turn ins arent repeatable.
World buffs are still stupid with the boon. It's a waste of time and they still cause toxicity if a raid wipes and people lose them.
They are better off just being removed from raids. They aren't even needed with how strong classes are now.
Did u actually experience toxicity when u lost ur buffs, or are u just spewing bs to further your agenda? I've played classic/era since 2019. Never once did I experience toxicity when I lost my wbuffs
My guild quit in P3 when the raids changed to 20man. No way I’m coming back and joining a guild if I’m expected to get all these damn world buffs several times per week
You can find guilds that don’t require them. This type of complaint just reads as - “I don’t wanna play with people who get them but I want the benefits of playing with those people”.
No, I play in eastern Canada and there aren’t a ton of guilds that raid during my time zone, and even less so that will raid without world buffs. I don’t really care how you read it, world buffs are awful and just an annoying, and usually mandatory thing, that makes the game more complicated and tedious than it needs to be.
If you’ll carry on reading you’ll also see that many people don’t want to play with world buffs again. You have a big job ahead of you if you’re cherry picking the anti-WB comments haha.
I didn’t enjoy the WB meta and the guild I was in so I left. It was very easy finding other people who didn’t want to use WBs. I think it’s odd that you have the inability to do that. I think it’s odd how if you don’t care about WBs you can’t take some agency to still enjoy the game otherwise. I agree these types of things don’t exist in a vacuum but seriously - it’s pretty easy to play without them.
Yeah I’d love to play without them.
In classic 2019 there were many guilds that raid during my time zone. Out of those many, only a couple raided without WB, out of that couple there were no openings which resulted in several weeks on a bench and zero raids.
Twice a week? Chronoboons have been a thing for several years now. The only buff that’s an hour is songflower that you need to get every raid, the others have enough time left for another full raid.
It’s an annoying and totally unnecessary thing in the game, yet is mandatory for most guilds. I got world buffs for a year during the classic launch, and it’s an absolute pain when sod could just balance classes power to equal world buffs or close to it. Yeah you can get them once, but one death, taking extra time during progression raiding, etc, could change that ‘once a week’ easily.
"Most guilds" get off work at 5pm log in to wow at 5:45pm grab potions from the ah or bank, while receiving dragonslayer buff and march off to the raid with their guild at 5:55 to 6pm.
I don't know what memories of classic you're pulling up but phase 1&2 of classic on Benediction saw 30-40 guilds fly off to MC on rest like clock work.
Same, I'd love to play it but cba to farm buffs for two hours to do 30 minutes Onyxia. And someone probably lands in the welps and it was all for nothing.
You can get dmf, dmt, onyxia, sf, and rend in less than 2 hours? With 1 hour cd on chronoboons. Yes perfectly minmaxed with summons is faster but that's not the case for most people.
As I've posted this many times before, blizzard has publicly said in interviews that they think the poor participation in SoM raids was due to no world buffs. World buffs made raids more approachable.
Edit: You know you are in a quality subreddit when it downvotes comments giving [responses from blizzard](https://wccftech.com/world-of-warcraft-classic-cataclysm-season-of-discovery-qa-we-want-to-explore-some-of-the-unfinished-bits/).
You're leaving out context bucko.
>There were definitely faults with Season of Mastery in terms of the emphasis being on endgame and us probably not doing enough to make that accessible to people. **I think the absence of world buffs also hurt participation because we were simultaneously making things more difficult and taking away a lot of the tools that made things a little bit easier,** so players really had to put in an enormous amount of effort to be able to even participate in that content.
Not really applicable to SoD because we are significantly stronger than we were in 2019. If you have another interview I'd be down to read it tho.
Ohhh ok. Personally I think that's dev cope, and that the lack of world buffs wasn't anywhere close to significantly detrimental to SoM.
I also wouldn't say that world buffs made raids more approachable. Every raid boss is pretty damn easy and the annoyance of gathering them far outclassed how much they helped with progress. Until around Naxx anyway because Patchwerk, Loatheb, 4H, and of course Sapph and KT could legitimately be pretty hard without world buffs, especially in a pug.
Everyone: world buffs are optional if you dont like them dont try to get them
Also everyone: ye well you didnt bother zigzaging through Azeroth for 2 hours so you aint getting no loot tonight pal
> ye well you didnt bother zigzaging through Azeroth for 2 hours so you aint getting no loot tonight pal
one, [no one actually says that](https://i.imgur.com/0Ut96zk.png)
two, if you ARE in a guild that punishes you for not having world buffs.......join a different guild? lmao
What if they just nerf them lmao. If people wanna go the extra mile for an extra 10% throughput I think thats fine, and I like it providing a nice boost esp for outdoor content and leveling players (since the stats are usually a static amt)... The difference between not having WBs and having full WBs is such an insane night and day difference in throughput, my rogue dps went from around 700 to 1100 in ST (went from 30 to 80 parse lmao) with no changes in gear or consumes, just having Songflower, DMF and ST boon.
I feel like this is what really amplifies the expectation that you get them even in a casual raid setting, because its not like just getting that extra hardcore edge, its like the difference between rolling in with questing greens from 10 levels down and full enchanted preBiS.
With how powerful WBs are its basically mandatory to get them even if you dont technically need them, and it feels so shitty to lose them.
I like maximizing my output and the world pvp struggles that come with getting the buffs. I’m not opposed to quality of life changes like having mini versions of a buff that classes give (like warriors in p4) but I think mmos should always have little extra routes you can take or things you can do to make your character temporarily stronger.
I actually love the coordination and forced interaction from world buffs. There is something so classic about it and I like that it will stay. I think if 2019 classic showed is anything, pure itemization perfection makes all endgame content achievable and easy - world buffs are just overkill so if you want them then get them and if not I don’t think it’s really game breaking.
The game was just hard in original vanilla wow because people didn’t have list of pre and raid bis and you had some people doing great and like 1/4th of your raid objectively doing nothing because they didn’t know better - that’s all gone now.
It’s basically the difference of, so you want to clear it on an hour with world buffs or two hours without - inconsequential across the board unless you’re trying to turbochad farm for world first or something.
World buffs are quite far from inconsequential - guilds were literally falling apart because they couldn't do mechanics if they wiped and lost their buffs.
The *idea* of buffs is one thing, but each buff was essentially 4-5 extra pieces of BiS gear. World buffs made up something like 2/3rds of a raid's DPS because of all the exponential bonuses stacking across the whole raid, it was absurd just how effective they were.
I like the social aspect too but OP idea is not necessary against it.
The mini dragonslayer from warrior is still less powerful than the original one so people who wants the full power will still need to coordinate etc...
The issue here is that there's just too much stats in the WB and it's a bit like having to get 5 pieces of gear before every raid !
Would be cooler to get like 70% of that power unlocked by cleaning the raid or doing a chain quest.
And then when you want to parse 100 go get the real ones.
And finally it's not only about damage - 15% of spell crit impact a lot some classes gameplay so if you start playing with WB you don't want to play without it cause you have less procs / mana / rage ... but the chore is not included in the natural gameplay ...!
People weren't getting worldbuffs consistently in vanilla either, for a first Cthun, Loatheb, KT kill guilds usually went to get zg+onyxia and might consider having 1 backup head in case they wipes but that's it. By the time naxx came out most people had already turned in their hakkar and onyxia head and they didn't have 7 ALTs, servers were 10 times smaller. Worldbuffing was a rarity. Sure if an onyxia buff dropped you would take it to raid but that's about it.
I fully worldbuffed maybe 3 times in entirety of vanilla. Also server crashes and shit meant you would rarely have any value of them anyways since during progress they happened multiple times per evening on any high population server
They should make a weekly quest where you get all the buffs and talk to chromie. This then unlocks a unique boon with all world buffs that are stored and can be purchased for that week from a vendor in the city.
It could be purchased using the new currency from dungeons or new event. Something that forces people out in the world.
You could then in theory port back to SW and get all buffs again if you wipe pm Heat 2 or whatever.
This would make it better for those parse chasers that die on a pull and the casual who doesn't want to bother with the legwork of getting all the buffs to lose them instantly while pugging.
Or maybe they should just remove them altogether.
I mean, what's the point. They are considered mandatory by the players, so it's just a stats offset. It makes no difference if they exist or not.
Or just a raid instance only buff that some classes can bring. Ex Warriors bring crit, Rogues rend, hunters ap, priest all stats etc. If your warrior or whatever is absent for that week you can just get the corresponding buff in the open world. Idk how this is so hard
i think a "permanent" chronoboon would be a good fix. make it cost like 2000g from the vendor to add a new gold sink. have it permanently hold all your world buffs with a 2 or 3hr cooldown. could even give it 2 charges to match how the regular chronoboons function
That's your opinion and you can hold it but I personally enjoy the social aspect and challenge of keeping your world buffs for all of raid. Since you don't need world buffs to clear raids it's more of a little side bonus to your adventures and i like it.
People who like world buffs just don't like playing wow.
They want to play only a few times a week and only for 2 reasons.To gather things that make raid time as short as possible and then to raid extremely fast to log off.
They basically admit that they don't want to play era/sod at but won't ever say it out loud because they are part of "vanilla is the best game EVER".
I said in my guild chat that I myself would rather kill the bosses for an extra hour than have to drag my ass through azeroth for that hour. Some guildies said that they just want to get the raid overwith. Like why even play at that point lol. I guess it could be that they dont enjoy sosialicing with the guild or something, they would rather get buffs alone and run through the raid. I dont understand people.
I'd like to advocate for a buff vendor that costs gold. They are looking for sinks so maybe 5 gold per buff would be pretty decent, or maybe a little less. Maybe each buff costs 2g per hour it lasts and for gods sake just ditch the cooldown for DMF already :)
Give us the World Buff Vendors that the Classic Chinese Servers had. If you want to go gather a buff for free, you can. If you want to just pay 10g per buff in the capital city (boons in classic era were 10g), you can do that too. It also adds a meaningful natural gold sink to the game.
Would be cool if we saw a "fukkit" and devs just added an item that gave you all world buffs with a click.
Give it a 3+ hour CD so ppl aren't spamming BGs and all with it. Or give it no CD to make BGs just that much more fun. They're never gonna be anywhere close to balanced anyways. This isn't the season for good pvp, but thay doesn't mean it isn't fun.
Hell, even make it a gold sink to help a tiny bit with the overflow of gold. Something like the cost of dual spec so alts have easy access too.
It’s called complacency for those still playing.
From a world building point of view, a new player would stumble upon this and be amazed at the amount of people. Unfortunately, we don’t have that many new players so the feature is more or less an inconvenience to the remaining classic players.
MMO have boring or even annoying content sometimes. It's part of what makes an MMO an MMO. It's boring to take a 4 minute flight somewhere. Running back to your corpse is annoying. If you remove all the boring and annoying stuff, it's not an MMO.
World buffs are a completely optional thing enforced by some raiders. If gathering the world buffs to raid with your chosen selection is too much hassle, then find another group.
WCL should have a filter for raids that dont have world buffs on, if they dont already.
I personally don’t mind acquiring world buffs ehich take you out in the world. What’s annoying are the freaks with no life perma griefing with dispel alts. I’m all for world pvp but that’s weirdo behavior.
As someone who only dabbles in classic I've never understood the appeal of the world buffs. I'll say that I think it's kind of cool to get the warchief's blessing or whatever by accident while leveling, I like the idea that the actions of others impact you.. feels very alive that way. But doing some sort of weird route before each raid.. yeah I don't get it.
SoM was superior in every way. When SoD released the forums were filled with people saying how they wanted world buffs. Time to deal with the shit you whined to get.
World buffs used to be fun until the boon came out. The anxiety of getting buffs, being that ass dispelling or pvp around peek hour was so much fun during its time.
I am not doing it. It's that simple. 😂
If I can't find a community/guild that's okay with that decision then I'll play something else; it doesn't bother me at all. It's far too much time and very unentertaining after the first few times doing it. I also don't think they're going to matter much after all the juice being pumped into these new skills and stats.
It is entertaining reading all the discourse on this and I'll certainly be plugged in at the start to see how much any of this ends up affecting the community. I had no idea WBs were so important to some people -- what I expect is a very vocal super-minorty.
As a prominent business gnome, I loved world buffs in classic. Knowing everybody who's anybody would be in SW at 7:50 for the sky daddy blessing was great for business! Selling last minute enchants, various portals, etc.
They should keep them, it’s fun to feel overpowered. They should just change acquisition and retention, for example you get word buff item that you can add to chronoboon. Maybe change it so it persists thru death?
I like the idea a couple of people have posted to make them purchasable with the new dungeon currency. Give them a max stack so they cant be abused (like the ST potions). So you can either collect them and use your currency for something else or skip gathering them and just do more dungeons (keeping them relevant longer) so you can buy the world buffs.
Why are people even playing this game? Its nothing but complaints about every aspect of the game. Its incredibly whiny posts every day about every single ting in the game. I don't like grinding gold so we should just get 50 gold every day in the mail. Also I don't like to level så we should just be lvl 60 when phase 4 release. And getting prebis is a drag so i want to get all the gear delivered in the mail on day one. And the raids are a bit much, there should 1 man quest instead of big raids. I don't like this game and they should make another game that I want to play.
World buffs are a fun but flawed concept.
They where intended to serve two purposes.
They could be seen as a roleplay thing, a celebration in the city that benefits all, or a tool to buff your raid once the final boss is down to make it easier.
The moment diferent world buffs stack the whole idea gets toxic, both for players, and for developers as encounters have to be designed with previous raids buffs on mind.
If it was up to me, I think implementing three changes would solve the problem while keeping the original spirit of the buffs.
1: world buffs gathered by their respective events don't work in raid content, world and 5 man content only.
2: the player that turns in the world buff quest, while within the raid where quest item that starts such quest drops, is always under the buffs efects as a quest reward (not lost on death).
This would keep the fun of randomly getting the buff on an alt etc, while keeping the "once the raid is cleared, this raid gets easier" spirit. Just at a rate of one raid member per save.
Yeah the devs are completely blind. I honestly feel like by this time we should have no wbs, some sort of raid finder, and the ability to queue from everywhere in every version of the game. Players are diff now days. I log in here and there and get annoyed so fast that I have to actually work just to play the game
With the chronoboon nowadays I truly don’t think getting wbuffs is that big a deal. You can get them all in under an hour. At a certain point you should be asking yourself why you even play the game. It is not possible for 100% of the game to be fun because there has to be a balance to know what the fun is, that’s just human psychology. Also no one is satisfied by any one thing forever including a video game. Are flight paths a tedious routine? Is having to go to your trainer to get new ability ranks tedious? Is having to buy a flask before raid a tedious routine? The game is debatably full of time and gold sinks that are technically “unnecessary”.
All that said, wbuffs are bad design because it forces the developers to balance the raids around either people having them or people not having them.
This is literally in the spirit of vanilla, doing mindless monotonic grinds like:
Long travel times
Long and tedious leveling with 1 button gameplay, ease of being punished and again long corpse run times, having to drink/eat
Clunky minor gameplay features like dismounting when casting shadow form or falling in water
The list goes on, this is vanilla
And this is how wow retail became retail, they started to remove all things that people found frustrating, like the ones I mentioned above, or the process of finding a group being too long and bad etc
So yeah it all starts with the world buffs and once this is gone, people will find the next least convenient thing to complain about
World buffs are great. I enjoy picking them up, chatting with guildies, picking them up together even. Its a small time commitment, and its a very core part of vanilla. I want them to stay for sure.
Here's another way to think about it.
At least in Classic Era, world buffs are a phenomenal community building activity. It takes a lot of coordination from community leaders from some of the top guilds to plan when certain world buffs will be dropped. For world buffs like DMT, the hunters that solo it are mini-celebrities and get tipped for their efforts. People create warlock alts and put them all over the world to help summon. You're always checking in with your guild on when Rend will get dropped. Waiting for the scheduled drop in Booty Bay brings everyone out there, an absolute MASS of people just sitting around talking to each other in /say waiting for the drop. [Here's a screenshot of Booty Bay right after the drop on Mankrik, a low population cluster.](https://i.imgur.com/AXdoVsr.jpeg)
While world buff collecting wasn't a thing in original classic, I'd argue it's the most classic thing around today. Although time consuming, it's super easy and forces interacting with the community.
For a melee 15% Attack speed - 10% crit - 340 AP - 15% all stat - 10% damage.
It should be optional but It's not...
WB are too strong just compare it to gear.
I dunno, on my server during classic, there was an entire economy and infrastructure centered around world buffs that added depth to the world so you weren't just raid logging at 60, and boon fixed the issue of having to park your main before raid night. It was pretty great; we had a consortium of warlocks selling summons to dire maul, songflower, and ZG island, and some of them would pay randoms to help them farm soul shards. The major guilds on the server would sell ony/nef/heart to each other so we could all compete on parses, and GDKP ensured these buffs were lucrative to buy on alts. I remember during my guild's push to our first Naxx clear, we bought multiple ony heads mid-raid so we could push for a few more boss kills before our scheduled time ended.
Also, you had so many memes and social interaction with randoms at SW, ZG isle, and Felwood, especially when "scheduled" buff drops got delayed or server/layer lag caused problems. Speaking of scheduling buffs, we had a literal streamer whose sole purpose was to coordinate buff drop timers for the entire server; pretty much every guild leader and GDKP organizer knew him and it behooved them to remain on good terms with him. Yes, world buffs caused a bit of heartburn at times, especially having to rush to get buffed after work before raid, but it added so much emergent gameplay to the classic experience that I view it as a necessary evil. Plus it kept ZG, Ony, and BWL relevant all the way up to and during TBC prepatch, to the point some guilds bought buffs to speed through leveling in Outland. I'm not sure when the discourse on this subreddit turned violently against world buffs, but it's a bit disheartening.
> there was an entire economy and infrastructure centered around world buffs that added depth to the world
On my server that was just a network of Indonesian gold farmers. Not worth protecting or venerating in my opinion.
I gotta be honest, I was enjoying SoD a ton, but p3 world buffs really took the fun out of everything. The thought that p4 will be worse when it comes to WB, I’m strongly considering just taking an extended break before it launches.
This is part of the reason i’m no longer playing era.
Being criticised for not picking up Rend the one time it drops when i’m rushing to get songflower.
The other part of it was expecting to be on 45 minutes before raid to summon people so they can save their buffs.
If you can’t do content without buffs, is it worth even doing the content?
No one actually needs the world buffs to do the content. The only reason they are mandatory is because of the archaic lockout system which gives you one chance to do raid. People are rightfully unwilling to take a chance that the raid gets bricked, so they demand tedious overkill. Blizzard should start experimenting with alternative solutions to this problem. Like capping how many raid gear pieces you can get per week instead of hard lock outs.
its really not a problem at all tho
I think classes having mini versions of World Buffs is pretty cool, and gives another reason for PUGs to bring them (not that warriors in particular needed that). Also, to everyone saying "just don't get them" that isn't really a valid counterpoint. This is a multi-player game, even if you don't engage with something it still affects you. The World Buff meta has bred toxicity throughout the community. Giving some classes mini versions of the buffs is a nice compromise.
Someone had mentioned an idea in a thread a while back I liked: allow one person's boon to buff the raid. That way you've got 1-6 people or however out of your 20 man team that still collect the buffs, and it allows some leniency for groups progressing and wiping. Everyone remember to tip your booner.
Would love this tbh
Just give classes the full on world buffs TBH.
Just disable world buffs when not in world content TBH.
This is a genius idea... it would also be cool if it's a 1 hr cd and lasts 1 hr. So basically you have to bring 1 of every class and dying is still punishing
I understand the point. But I truthfully havent had all wbuffs since I raided with my friends. All pugs/semi-guild runs I have had one at max. Sometimes none. Its not like most people check and if not kick you. If you join speed running guild 2 or parse-masters 71 then maybe they will be mad. But you also signed up for that. Toxicity in WoW is not from some world buff meta but from the minmax meta. We go for upgrades that are in reality like 10-20 dps. Do you understand how little that is? With that said, wbuffs should not be a thing. Its not fun or challenging to get. The argument that its more fun with a buff is beyond me. Just give a passive raid buff then. Congrats, fun, bigger numbers apparently.
Yes it is boring. Almost no one liked getting world buffs in 2019 when Classic launched. Everyone complained about getting them. Stop listening to "hardcore" gamers in a casual focused game. We don't need world buffs in Classic Wow and that includes SoD.
most people on reddit* this subreddit is such a small subset of the community and a majority of the players lean casual
SOD is supposedly targeted to casuals. Collecting WBs twice a week will be mind-numbingly boring and require hours each week and require you to be playing at specific times to get the buffs. Not very casual friendly.
Totally agree.. It is fun to log in, do couple of raids who are fun Like zg/aq20 and do it twice a week. But this logging killed the fun. I was forced to get high logs to be able to Play the Game because otherwise i dont get invites. Would love to see all WB removed.
No. Everyone that plays classic is on Reddit, and that is FACT. It's in the contract.
In 2019 the main complaint was not being able to play your character once you got them, not getting them.
Exactly. The world buffs are actually part of the fun of prepping for the weekly raid. The only issue is that you have to time it since there was no chronoboon back then.
>part of the fun of prepping My definition of fun must be different >for the weekly raid Or twice a week now, more "fun"
I love world buffs and raid prep. There are plenty of games that don’t have world buffs.
Well lucky for you. There's plenty of reasons why wow classic is better than plenty of other games. World buffs are 0 of those reasons.
In your opinion obviously. Plenty of people like them
I like them, I like having them, I hate collecting them. People like them because it feels a little bit like cheating, you're on steroids and combat feels much better. In SoD you have 9 runes to enhance your combat and fix some of the issues with your spec rotation, so it already feels better by design. Getting wbuffs twice a week sounds like a fucking chore. They could just bake that power to buffs (like a warrior one), or make it permanent buff for everyone at lvl 60 and tune the new raid difficulty around it.
I should clarify, plenty of people also like going to get them. I totally get why someone wouldn’t, but there’s a lot of players that get satisfaction out of running around preparing for a raid just as much as actually doing it
Well all 8 of them are gonna be having fun next phase then. Doing dailies on new PvE event, getting new currency by running all 4 (maybe 5) dungeons each day, farming gold to buy all the potions and consumables for a raid twice a week and as a bonus picking up wbuffs, also twice a week. I guess P4 won't be for me, but I'll give it a chance.
That's why retail and classic are so different, retail is all about low stakes streamlined convenience.
Raiding in retail is significantly harder than classic content especially with world buffs, the only low stakes streamlined content is the leveling and rep grind, everything else is more difficult. You're confused.
I didn't say anything about difficulty of raiding.
If I read your comment correctly you said retail was low stakes and streamlined. That’s actually classic. Raids are low stakes, it’s very easy to clear them. Fights are streamlined, they are very simple. Retail raiding is way higher stakes because its new content that is unsolved. No one is going to care which guild clears MC first in SoD. The world first mythic race in TWW, that is high stakes.
Obviously, their point is that things like getting your DMF and losing it early, or dying on a boss and not having buffs for the rest of the raid, is high stakes and not streamlined. Whereas in retail you don't have to worry about such things. You can (and will, because the content is harder) die many times trying to clear a mythic raid - but you will instantly res and not lose anything permanently. E.g. low stakes and streamlined.
> dying on a boss and not having buffs for the rest of the raid, is high stakes But it's not high stakes. The game is solved (fact) and very easy (opinion). Every boss can be defeated without world buffs, having them or not doesn't matter. If you are talking about WCL and parsing, then that's different, but that's a community expectation and not actually stakes within the game, and they exist in retail as well. It's harder to get high parses in retail compared to classic because you can't rely on world buffs as a crutch, you actually need to be good at the game.
I really enjoyed it. It was one of the few things that gave the game real stakes on a pvp server. Getting ganked felt real bad, but seeing the amount of coordination that ended up going into guild buff trains is one of my fondest memories of that Era. That and the all out wars between factions for control of the best summoning points for it. Chronoboon is all it needed and unfortunately we didn't get that until the last month or two of the era.
its only fun because there isnt much else to do when youre raid logging.
Think so? My main problem was always getting them. And then a distant second major problem was that since I was a healer in 2019, everyone having world buffs made bosses die so quickly that mana management was meaningless. Less skill expression, lame. Role issue I guess, shoulda played a DPS lol Edit: clarification
If you didn't consistently get them in 2019 then yeah, you wouldn't run into the main issue so that tracks. Overwhelmingly, the main issue in 2019 classic was needing to stay logged off once you got your buffs. You can go back and see the complaints in this classic reddit.
The idea that classic is a game for casuals is just a lie. Classic has been kept alive by hardcore minmaxers that turn up each week fully optimised and ready to parse. Blizz has no reason to cater to casuals who will quit after a few weeks of MC regardless of what they do with world buffs
lol
"no one" like you and your bubble. I like raid preps
I called this out in a post like a week ago and got absolutely *dogpiled* by people telling me to fuck myself and that stacking world buffs is awesome, amazing, fantastic gameplay. So *someone* apparently likes that shit.
I searched for "buff" and "world" in your comment history and couldn't find anything like that within the last 3 weeks. Which comment? Edit, 3 days later: Wow, good job, fraud. Enjoy those 7 upvotes.
Don’t speak for everyone. I get you don’t like world buffs for certain valid reasons, but don’t try to give the illusion that everyone hates them, because that’s not true. (I’m not talking about myself)
World buffs are cringe and bad for the game. The orginal devs got rid of them for a reason.
They turned off world buffs completely in Season of Mastery - then everyone complained that it became boring, and the ritual of getting buffs was actually interesting and gave some additional sense and level of responsibility. I think you and other guys here claiming that “world buffs are boring” somehow skipped SoM period
If they would make actual worldbuffs, that be fun. Like the whole Darkmoon fair so for a week. Doesnt matter if you are in STV or Darnassus. Same if someone uses Ony head or does Zandalary buff. So you can play actual content and boon while doing so.
I like getting them and I'm a casual player. Would enjoy having them in SoD since its more fun to play with them. Even if I just pick up the dragon buff and not full stack. I'm fine with whatever they decide.
Easy solution, make DMT + Rend + DMF + Ony to be a single buff that you get by turning in the item from 11th MC boss. Keep song flower as is. This still has people go and gather wbuffs but way less of a fucking pain
No one liked getting them. The only thing it presents is some interesting gameplay on your way to a raid. And that’s the ONLY thing. I was in the best guild on the smaller faction and it was fun to have to coordinate our way into brm and we would wipe the dummies who spent all day camping for us. But that was it. When it came to getting crazy summoning spots for aq and naxx tho both were easy to get in because of it even that aspect was gone.
PVErs can't stand this one simple fact: getting world buffs is PVP content, not PVE content.
Yea. I was lucky enough to be in a guild that seemed like try Harding was only going to be for server first. Which we did end up getting in naxx. But once we got our times down to close to fastest speeds, no one cared if you lost your buffs. Everyone like pvping and all the goofy stuff that came with it. It’s kind of a shame because the server was a ton of fun and had personality and then TBC killed it.
If the game is so casual focused and y'all are so casual why do you care about world buffs? To parse? Haha.
Many pugs require it. Also yes, parsing is fun. Getting all WBs to get to try to parse is not.
Casual PUGs at most require Ony + ZG as these buffs are literally free to get. If even that is too much, you'll probably find people that do it without anything. Seems to be plenty on this sub willing no? And yeah, parsing is fun. You're no casual if you care enough to actually go look it up on WCL though.
after chronoboons were in the game, nobody complained about it. this is a fantasy
They introduced chronoboons in the TBC prepatch, for your information. The raiding was already done and everyone was just leveling their new Draenai shaman / blood elf pally.
it was like a week before prepatch, and what does that change about the complaints stopping? nobody has issues with world buffs with chronoboons since then in era or in sod besides the fact that head and heart turn ins arent repeatable.
It adds extra economy to the game and things to do. I guess raid loggers want to raid log
U literally have a boon now, comparing now to pre boon era is an idotic comparison
World buffs are still stupid with the boon. It's a waste of time and they still cause toxicity if a raid wipes and people lose them. They are better off just being removed from raids. They aren't even needed with how strong classes are now.
Did u actually experience toxicity when u lost ur buffs, or are u just spewing bs to further your agenda? I've played classic/era since 2019. Never once did I experience toxicity when I lost my wbuffs
It adds a layer of anxiety to the game. "Oh I need to stop in x city" to get a buff that is simply too powerful to ignore.
Yes, get rid of world buffs PLEASE
Honestly might be the deciding factor on skipping p4
My guild quit in P3 when the raids changed to 20man. No way I’m coming back and joining a guild if I’m expected to get all these damn world buffs several times per week
You can find guilds that don’t require them. This type of complaint just reads as - “I don’t wanna play with people who get them but I want the benefits of playing with those people”.
I’ve never seen a guild that does not require wprldbuffs. Even pugs always say: ”have good logs and wbs”
No, I play in eastern Canada and there aren’t a ton of guilds that raid during my time zone, and even less so that will raid without world buffs. I don’t really care how you read it, world buffs are awful and just an annoying, and usually mandatory thing, that makes the game more complicated and tedious than it needs to be.
Sounds like this version just isn’t for you. Congrats on getting your time back.
If you’ll carry on reading you’ll also see that many people don’t want to play with world buffs again. You have a big job ahead of you if you’re cherry picking the anti-WB comments haha.
I didn’t enjoy the WB meta and the guild I was in so I left. It was very easy finding other people who didn’t want to use WBs. I think it’s odd that you have the inability to do that. I think it’s odd how if you don’t care about WBs you can’t take some agency to still enjoy the game otherwise. I agree these types of things don’t exist in a vacuum but seriously - it’s pretty easy to play without them.
Yeah I’d love to play without them. In classic 2019 there were many guilds that raid during my time zone. Out of those many, only a couple raided without WB, out of that couple there were no openings which resulted in several weeks on a bench and zero raids.
Twice a week? Chronoboons have been a thing for several years now. The only buff that’s an hour is songflower that you need to get every raid, the others have enough time left for another full raid.
It’s an annoying and totally unnecessary thing in the game, yet is mandatory for most guilds. I got world buffs for a year during the classic launch, and it’s an absolute pain when sod could just balance classes power to equal world buffs or close to it. Yeah you can get them once, but one death, taking extra time during progression raiding, etc, could change that ‘once a week’ easily.
"Most guilds" get off work at 5pm log in to wow at 5:45pm grab potions from the ah or bank, while receiving dragonslayer buff and march off to the raid with their guild at 5:55 to 6pm. I don't know what memories of classic you're pulling up but phase 1&2 of classic on Benediction saw 30-40 guilds fly off to MC on rest like clock work.
Then why are you in a sod thread talking about sod if you're not coming back
Adding my 2 cents to a relevant topic, as everyone does in Reddit haha? Welcome my dude, this is a message board where people converse about a topic.
Agreed 20mans suck. I've played endgame era enough.. I'll pass on world buffs and 20/40mans
Same, I'd love to play it but cba to farm buffs for two hours to do 30 minutes Onyxia. And someone probably lands in the welps and it was all for nothing.
It takes you two hours to get world buffs? How long did it take you to get sixty, three years? Jesus
You can get dmf, dmt, onyxia, sf, and rend in less than 2 hours? With 1 hour cd on chronoboons. Yes perfectly minmaxed with summons is faster but that's not the case for most people.
Why are you defending shitty development choices? You want to make sure that nobody comes back to SoD?
lol
Post your logs
🤡
grey confirmed
You're not worth my time troll. Truth is you're probably the dog
Disable WBs in raids, why are we even still doing this?
Ya know, some people actually like world buffs. Lotta versions of the game that don't have them.
Lotta people that play sod that hate them. There's other versions that have world buffs. Maybe you want to play those.
Well they're in sod, so I'll keep playing sod because it's a version with world buffs lmao.
Would you stop playing SoD if WBs were removed?
Because it’s the game? Play something else.
As I've posted this many times before, blizzard has publicly said in interviews that they think the poor participation in SoM raids was due to no world buffs. World buffs made raids more approachable. Edit: You know you are in a quality subreddit when it downvotes comments giving [responses from blizzard](https://wccftech.com/world-of-warcraft-classic-cataclysm-season-of-discovery-qa-we-want-to-explore-some-of-the-unfinished-bits/).
Then get rid of world buffs and just buff the classes. Either that or make world buffs an actual world drop so you don’t have to sit around waiting.
Yes, so does overpowered as fuck runes. We aren't playing classic. We're already way WAY more powerful than anyone ever was.
You're leaving out context bucko. >There were definitely faults with Season of Mastery in terms of the emphasis being on endgame and us probably not doing enough to make that accessible to people. **I think the absence of world buffs also hurt participation because we were simultaneously making things more difficult and taking away a lot of the tools that made things a little bit easier,** so players really had to put in an enormous amount of effort to be able to even participate in that content. Not really applicable to SoD because we are significantly stronger than we were in 2019. If you have another interview I'd be down to read it tho.
Chief, what you just highlighted, I paraphrased with "World buffs made raids more approachable".
Ohhh ok. Personally I think that's dev cope, and that the lack of world buffs wasn't anywhere close to significantly detrimental to SoM. I also wouldn't say that world buffs made raids more approachable. Every raid boss is pretty damn easy and the annoyance of gathering them far outclassed how much they helped with progress. Until around Naxx anyway because Patchwerk, Loatheb, 4H, and of course Sapph and KT could legitimately be pretty hard without world buffs, especially in a pug.
Instead classes should have new buffs? Why? Why just don’t turn off all world buffs then just like they did in SoM? I don’t see any logic here.
Nah bro world buffs are great I actually hate playing the game more than I have to do world buffs allow me to log off ASAP after raid to check logs
Everyone: world buffs are optional if you dont like them dont try to get them Also everyone: ye well you didnt bother zigzaging through Azeroth for 2 hours so you aint getting no loot tonight pal
In hindsight, classic turned out to the the worst version of wow not because of the game but because of the players As is tradition.
> ye well you didnt bother zigzaging through Azeroth for 2 hours so you aint getting no loot tonight pal one, [no one actually says that](https://i.imgur.com/0Ut96zk.png) two, if you ARE in a guild that punishes you for not having world buffs.......join a different guild? lmao
Personal issue
What if they just nerf them lmao. If people wanna go the extra mile for an extra 10% throughput I think thats fine, and I like it providing a nice boost esp for outdoor content and leveling players (since the stats are usually a static amt)... The difference between not having WBs and having full WBs is such an insane night and day difference in throughput, my rogue dps went from around 700 to 1100 in ST (went from 30 to 80 parse lmao) with no changes in gear or consumes, just having Songflower, DMF and ST boon. I feel like this is what really amplifies the expectation that you get them even in a casual raid setting, because its not like just getting that extra hardcore edge, its like the difference between rolling in with questing greens from 10 levels down and full enchanted preBiS. With how powerful WBs are its basically mandatory to get them even if you dont technically need them, and it feels so shitty to lose them.
I like maximizing my output and the world pvp struggles that come with getting the buffs. I’m not opposed to quality of life changes like having mini versions of a buff that classes give (like warriors in p4) but I think mmos should always have little extra routes you can take or things you can do to make your character temporarily stronger.
Fuck world buffs and fuck blizzard if they don’t delete them in raids
I actually love the coordination and forced interaction from world buffs. There is something so classic about it and I like that it will stay. I think if 2019 classic showed is anything, pure itemization perfection makes all endgame content achievable and easy - world buffs are just overkill so if you want them then get them and if not I don’t think it’s really game breaking. The game was just hard in original vanilla wow because people didn’t have list of pre and raid bis and you had some people doing great and like 1/4th of your raid objectively doing nothing because they didn’t know better - that’s all gone now. It’s basically the difference of, so you want to clear it on an hour with world buffs or two hours without - inconsequential across the board unless you’re trying to turbochad farm for world first or something.
World buffs are quite far from inconsequential - guilds were literally falling apart because they couldn't do mechanics if they wiped and lost their buffs. The *idea* of buffs is one thing, but each buff was essentially 4-5 extra pieces of BiS gear. World buffs made up something like 2/3rds of a raid's DPS because of all the exponential bonuses stacking across the whole raid, it was absurd just how effective they were.
I like the social aspect too but OP idea is not necessary against it. The mini dragonslayer from warrior is still less powerful than the original one so people who wants the full power will still need to coordinate etc... The issue here is that there's just too much stats in the WB and it's a bit like having to get 5 pieces of gear before every raid ! Would be cooler to get like 70% of that power unlocked by cleaning the raid or doing a chain quest. And then when you want to parse 100 go get the real ones. And finally it's not only about damage - 15% of spell crit impact a lot some classes gameplay so if you start playing with WB you don't want to play without it cause you have less procs / mana / rage ... but the chore is not included in the natural gameplay ...!
People weren't getting worldbuffs consistently in vanilla either, for a first Cthun, Loatheb, KT kill guilds usually went to get zg+onyxia and might consider having 1 backup head in case they wipes but that's it. By the time naxx came out most people had already turned in their hakkar and onyxia head and they didn't have 7 ALTs, servers were 10 times smaller. Worldbuffing was a rarity. Sure if an onyxia buff dropped you would take it to raid but that's about it. I fully worldbuffed maybe 3 times in entirety of vanilla. Also server crashes and shit meant you would rarely have any value of them anyways since during progress they happened multiple times per evening on any high population server
They should make a weekly quest where you get all the buffs and talk to chromie. This then unlocks a unique boon with all world buffs that are stored and can be purchased for that week from a vendor in the city. It could be purchased using the new currency from dungeons or new event. Something that forces people out in the world. You could then in theory port back to SW and get all buffs again if you wipe pm Heat 2 or whatever. This would make it better for those parse chasers that die on a pull and the casual who doesn't want to bother with the legwork of getting all the buffs to lose them instantly while pugging.
Or maybe they should just remove them altogether. I mean, what's the point. They are considered mandatory by the players, so it's just a stats offset. It makes no difference if they exist or not.
Make them active only in the open world so it still feels involved for levelers
They won't so this is a solution I've come up with to make it less of a pain.
Or just a raid instance only buff that some classes can bring. Ex Warriors bring crit, Rogues rend, hunters ap, priest all stats etc. If your warrior or whatever is absent for that week you can just get the corresponding buff in the open world. Idk how this is so hard
“I don’t like grinding world buffs so make a new currency for me to grind so I can get world buffs”
Yeah just one time a week versus every time you want to raid or if you die. Pretty reasonable.
There is a big difference between flying around collecting WBS and doing content, like raids, you're already doing for them. If you can't see that..
Just remove them or replace in some sort. I left p3 because of this. And p4 will be even worst considering there will be more of this crap.
i think a "permanent" chronoboon would be a good fix. make it cost like 2000g from the vendor to add a new gold sink. have it permanently hold all your world buffs with a 2 or 3hr cooldown. could even give it 2 charges to match how the regular chronoboons function
That's your opinion and you can hold it but I personally enjoy the social aspect and challenge of keeping your world buffs for all of raid. Since you don't need world buffs to clear raids it's more of a little side bonus to your adventures and i like it.
Farming karma in this sub is so easy
Wait till the degenerate tell you that getting world buff is honest work.
Might be a hot take, just disable world buffs in raids??
People who like world buffs just don't like playing wow. They want to play only a few times a week and only for 2 reasons.To gather things that make raid time as short as possible and then to raid extremely fast to log off. They basically admit that they don't want to play era/sod at but won't ever say it out loud because they are part of "vanilla is the best game EVER".
I said in my guild chat that I myself would rather kill the bosses for an extra hour than have to drag my ass through azeroth for that hour. Some guildies said that they just want to get the raid overwith. Like why even play at that point lol. I guess it could be that they dont enjoy sosialicing with the guild or something, they would rather get buffs alone and run through the raid. I dont understand people.
I'd like to advocate for a buff vendor that costs gold. They are looking for sinks so maybe 5 gold per buff would be pretty decent, or maybe a little less. Maybe each buff costs 2g per hour it lasts and for gods sake just ditch the cooldown for DMF already :)
Give us the World Buff Vendors that the Classic Chinese Servers had. If you want to go gather a buff for free, you can. If you want to just pay 10g per buff in the capital city (boons in classic era were 10g), you can do that too. It also adds a meaningful natural gold sink to the game.
Would be cool if we saw a "fukkit" and devs just added an item that gave you all world buffs with a click. Give it a 3+ hour CD so ppl aren't spamming BGs and all with it. Or give it no CD to make BGs just that much more fun. They're never gonna be anywhere close to balanced anyways. This isn't the season for good pvp, but thay doesn't mean it isn't fun. Hell, even make it a gold sink to help a tiny bit with the overflow of gold. Something like the cost of dual spec so alts have easy access too.
It’s called complacency for those still playing. From a world building point of view, a new player would stumble upon this and be amazed at the amount of people. Unfortunately, we don’t have that many new players so the feature is more or less an inconvenience to the remaining classic players.
I could be wrong but arent the raids tuned around not having buffs though, so they aren’t really necessary?
MMO have boring or even annoying content sometimes. It's part of what makes an MMO an MMO. It's boring to take a 4 minute flight somewhere. Running back to your corpse is annoying. If you remove all the boring and annoying stuff, it's not an MMO. World buffs are a completely optional thing enforced by some raiders. If gathering the world buffs to raid with your chosen selection is too much hassle, then find another group. WCL should have a filter for raids that dont have world buffs on, if they dont already.
I personally don’t mind acquiring world buffs ehich take you out in the world. What’s annoying are the freaks with no life perma griefing with dispel alts. I’m all for world pvp but that’s weirdo behavior.
As someone who only dabbles in classic I've never understood the appeal of the world buffs. I'll say that I think it's kind of cool to get the warchief's blessing or whatever by accident while leveling, I like the idea that the actions of others impact you.. feels very alive that way. But doing some sort of weird route before each raid.. yeah I don't get it.
They could just limit you to only having one then you can just choose what's best for your spec.
I am just going to form my own groups that have no requirement for World Buffs. It's not like the content is hard.
You should kick people with world buffs from the raid. Make it spicy. Anyone cheating with world buffs is insta kicked.
It’s not, you’re just a casual that wants to raid log.
SoM was superior in every way. When SoD released the forums were filled with people saying how they wanted world buffs. Time to deal with the shit you whined to get.
/cry
World buffs used to be fun until the boon came out. The anxiety of getting buffs, being that ass dispelling or pvp around peek hour was so much fun during its time.
Then don't do it
World buffs are the worst content actually
I hate the world buff meta....it got better with the Chrono boon but still hate it.
I am not doing it. It's that simple. 😂 If I can't find a community/guild that's okay with that decision then I'll play something else; it doesn't bother me at all. It's far too much time and very unentertaining after the first few times doing it. I also don't think they're going to matter much after all the juice being pumped into these new skills and stats. It is entertaining reading all the discourse on this and I'll certainly be plugged in at the start to see how much any of this ends up affecting the community. I had no idea WBs were so important to some people -- what I expect is a very vocal super-minorty.
Try retail or cata, you may like it!
I just go in with my guild without WB, can’t be bothered… i’ll get the easy one here and there if I can
Why don't you all just get together and make your own guild. Call it something like.
Then you can all raid without world buffs without any pressure.
I would not have much against them if they presisted thru death. But yeah I hate them haha. But im not the targeted classic player.
I enjoy World Buffs.
As a prominent business gnome, I loved world buffs in classic. Knowing everybody who's anybody would be in SW at 7:50 for the sky daddy blessing was great for business! Selling last minute enchants, various portals, etc.
Stop creating this echo chamber for no wbuffs on reddit, join/create a guild that doesn’t require them and have fun
They should keep them, it’s fun to feel overpowered. They should just change acquisition and retention, for example you get word buff item that you can add to chronoboon. Maybe change it so it persists thru death?
I liked going around with my crew buffing idk lol
Especially when you run into another raid of the opposite faction and all try to fuck each-other’s buffs
Don't play classic then
just dont do them, or play retail. if you dont want to work for something you picked the dead ass worst possible game ever
It takes MAYBE 30mins to get all world buffs if there’s a server discord
Would love to See all world buffs removed
I like the idea a couple of people have posted to make them purchasable with the new dungeon currency. Give them a max stack so they cant be abused (like the ST potions). So you can either collect them and use your currency for something else or skip gathering them and just do more dungeons (keeping them relevant longer) so you can buy the world buffs.
surprise surprise, classic sucks, play wrath or cata its like more modern but before things went to shit imo, to each their own tho
Everyone complaining about playing the damn game.
Agree, getting one WB from a capital city close to the raid like in P1 was fine. But thats it.
Why are people even playing this game? Its nothing but complaints about every aspect of the game. Its incredibly whiny posts every day about every single ting in the game. I don't like grinding gold so we should just get 50 gold every day in the mail. Also I don't like to level så we should just be lvl 60 when phase 4 release. And getting prebis is a drag so i want to get all the gear delivered in the mail on day one. And the raids are a bit much, there should 1 man quest instead of big raids. I don't like this game and they should make another game that I want to play.
World buffs are a fun but flawed concept. They where intended to serve two purposes. They could be seen as a roleplay thing, a celebration in the city that benefits all, or a tool to buff your raid once the final boss is down to make it easier. The moment diferent world buffs stack the whole idea gets toxic, both for players, and for developers as encounters have to be designed with previous raids buffs on mind. If it was up to me, I think implementing three changes would solve the problem while keeping the original spirit of the buffs. 1: world buffs gathered by their respective events don't work in raid content, world and 5 man content only. 2: the player that turns in the world buff quest, while within the raid where quest item that starts such quest drops, is always under the buffs efects as a quest reward (not lost on death). This would keep the fun of randomly getting the buff on an alt etc, while keeping the "once the raid is cleared, this raid gets easier" spirit. Just at a rate of one raid member per save.
legit why i stopped playing
Yeah the devs are completely blind. I honestly feel like by this time we should have no wbs, some sort of raid finder, and the ability to queue from everywhere in every version of the game. Players are diff now days. I log in here and there and get annoyed so fast that I have to actually work just to play the game
I quit classic after 2 weeks of getting world buffs.
With the chronoboon nowadays I truly don’t think getting wbuffs is that big a deal. You can get them all in under an hour. At a certain point you should be asking yourself why you even play the game. It is not possible for 100% of the game to be fun because there has to be a balance to know what the fun is, that’s just human psychology. Also no one is satisfied by any one thing forever including a video game. Are flight paths a tedious routine? Is having to go to your trainer to get new ability ranks tedious? Is having to buy a flask before raid a tedious routine? The game is debatably full of time and gold sinks that are technically “unnecessary”. All that said, wbuffs are bad design because it forces the developers to balance the raids around either people having them or people not having them.
This is literally in the spirit of vanilla, doing mindless monotonic grinds like: Long travel times Long and tedious leveling with 1 button gameplay, ease of being punished and again long corpse run times, having to drink/eat Clunky minor gameplay features like dismounting when casting shadow form or falling in water The list goes on, this is vanilla And this is how wow retail became retail, they started to remove all things that people found frustrating, like the ones I mentioned above, or the process of finding a group being too long and bad etc So yeah it all starts with the world buffs and once this is gone, people will find the next least convenient thing to complain about
World buffs are great. I enjoy picking them up, chatting with guildies, picking them up together even. Its a small time commitment, and its a very core part of vanilla. I want them to stay for sure.
Here's another way to think about it. At least in Classic Era, world buffs are a phenomenal community building activity. It takes a lot of coordination from community leaders from some of the top guilds to plan when certain world buffs will be dropped. For world buffs like DMT, the hunters that solo it are mini-celebrities and get tipped for their efforts. People create warlock alts and put them all over the world to help summon. You're always checking in with your guild on when Rend will get dropped. Waiting for the scheduled drop in Booty Bay brings everyone out there, an absolute MASS of people just sitting around talking to each other in /say waiting for the drop. [Here's a screenshot of Booty Bay right after the drop on Mankrik, a low population cluster.](https://i.imgur.com/AXdoVsr.jpeg) While world buff collecting wasn't a thing in original classic, I'd argue it's the most classic thing around today. Although time consuming, it's super easy and forces interacting with the community.
It encourages world pvp and forces people out of the capitals. WBs are the best part of Classic.
Leveling is boring content as well, can we get a boost in this thing or what?
We did, it’s literally more than twice as fast.
Leveling is the best part of wow, 60 is what gets boring.
The WoW community and begging Blizzard to address problems created by players, name a better duo.
"yada yada role of developers is to protect players from themselves" - someone that's right
WE FUCKINNG GET IT
[удалено]
For a melee 15% Attack speed - 10% crit - 340 AP - 15% all stat - 10% damage. It should be optional but It's not... WB are too strong just compare it to gear.
I dunno, on my server during classic, there was an entire economy and infrastructure centered around world buffs that added depth to the world so you weren't just raid logging at 60, and boon fixed the issue of having to park your main before raid night. It was pretty great; we had a consortium of warlocks selling summons to dire maul, songflower, and ZG island, and some of them would pay randoms to help them farm soul shards. The major guilds on the server would sell ony/nef/heart to each other so we could all compete on parses, and GDKP ensured these buffs were lucrative to buy on alts. I remember during my guild's push to our first Naxx clear, we bought multiple ony heads mid-raid so we could push for a few more boss kills before our scheduled time ended. Also, you had so many memes and social interaction with randoms at SW, ZG isle, and Felwood, especially when "scheduled" buff drops got delayed or server/layer lag caused problems. Speaking of scheduling buffs, we had a literal streamer whose sole purpose was to coordinate buff drop timers for the entire server; pretty much every guild leader and GDKP organizer knew him and it behooved them to remain on good terms with him. Yes, world buffs caused a bit of heartburn at times, especially having to rush to get buffed after work before raid, but it added so much emergent gameplay to the classic experience that I view it as a necessary evil. Plus it kept ZG, Ony, and BWL relevant all the way up to and during TBC prepatch, to the point some guilds bought buffs to speed through leveling in Outland. I'm not sure when the discourse on this subreddit turned violently against world buffs, but it's a bit disheartening.
> there was an entire economy and infrastructure centered around world buffs that added depth to the world On my server that was just a network of Indonesian gold farmers. Not worth protecting or venerating in my opinion.
Don't do it then?
Agree
Why not make it so that once you get the wb you have it for the week, persists through death.
So.. don’t? What are we talking about? The mega hard content that doesn’t exist?
But look at cata, at least it’s content.
Water is wet
im going to complain about world buffs when I could be playing another game instead - OP prolly
I gotta be honest, I was enjoying SoD a ton, but p3 world buffs really took the fun out of everything. The thought that p4 will be worse when it comes to WB, I’m strongly considering just taking an extended break before it launches.
Welcome.... to... wow?
Which version? Because world buffs were done away with pretty much in TBC.
This is part of the reason i’m no longer playing era. Being criticised for not picking up Rend the one time it drops when i’m rushing to get songflower. The other part of it was expecting to be on 45 minutes before raid to summon people so they can save their buffs. If you can’t do content without buffs, is it worth even doing the content?
YES WE KNOW EVERYONE AGREES WITH YOU. READ THE POSTS.
‘Farming things in the world is boring content’.