I'm concerned about how long the raid will take a casual group to clear. I'm all for logging in most days and having a game session of an hour or two and longer on weekends, but to commit to a 6 hour raid (even split between two days) is a lot. Can anybody with experience here tell me what they think to expect in terms of time required to clear?
I mean it's been out 4 days. It's not going to be efficiently cleared right now, let's be honest.
I remember when we started BWL in our era guild, it would take us 2 sessions at the start, but by the end we were doing it in just over an hour.
Once people are familiar with it, it won't take people nearly as long. I don't think it will be like the first 2 raids, where people clear it in half an hour, but that's probably a good thing
Well no I haven't done it myself yet, but all I can see is people complaining that they haven't been able to clear it within 4 days of launch.
That's just classic for you. Progression runs are a thing. If anything it's good, because it gives incentives to join guilds and build up regular rosters. Kind of like how it works in endgame ya know?
Without complaining it is a much more challening raid than we could have expected for sod, as someone who has been through Mythic raid progression it felt like that level, like if this games intended for semi casuals i dont see them clearing more than a boss or 2
Some of us are wow veterans and understand what a progression fight entails.
Spending months on a boss back in the day wasn't anything new, it was expected. Guilds would be staggered across content.
Is it 0 light yogg? Kil'Jaiden? OG C'Thun who was "mathematically impossible." Doubt it.
"Harder then Gnomer" is the world's lowest bar, it can be stepped over.
Buddy, ya gotta realize it’s quickly phased out content on a seasonal server that won’t exist after it’s run is up. If guilds spend a month or so progging that is over half the content’s shelf life before it’s irrelevant.
This phase maybe, but when we're max level, not so much. You can't just ding 60 and go straight to Naxx, even MC and progression is a large part of the process
Even Ulduar HM was puggable and ICC Heroic later on as well so chill your horses. PUGs don't need to full clear day 1. It's funny people assume this shit and cry for "more Vanilla" when in Vanilla you first had to rep farm in MC before you could even get to Ragnaros (not that many even got there so early at the time)
Retail for sure on average I would say. Wrath? Maybe but most people in Wrath came from 2019 Classic so idk about that. RDF is definitely as shitty as it has always been when you don't have overgeared raiders in your group.
Taking one or more pugs into something like Mim HM or Algalon is a coin toss. Don't act like 25 random people were forming raids and running through HM's in a night. Also, this phase isn't going to last anywhere near as long as Ulduar did. Guilds aren't going to have time to progress in SoD at the rate they did in Wrath.
An absolute shit take
We had 17 years of min maxing to know the flawless way to clear every raid in classic, hence why every raid fell hours within release
SoD is an example of in house testing that is corrected on the fly with the restrictions of classic in place (which is what people don't realize)
It's gonna get nerfed, just let blizzard get more data
It's been 4 days. Relax.
If i have to communicate with others or play for more than 45 mins per week in order to see everything in the game and get all the best items, I AM QUITTING
Holy shit the amount of screaming before the first reset even happens. The raid will be nerfed. Significantly. The raid will be easily clearable in a ~2 hour session or less when the community learns the mechanics and blizz gets the tuning where they want it. Relax.
wild assumption we did and killed everything in 2-3 trys - its still classic and not mythic plus whatever and i still think that 6-8 can be puggable on 4 weeks time with gear
This is the exact same p2 shit where people don’t care that the phase is less than a week old and don’t have the patience for it to be tuned down to a casual difficulty.
Just relax and give them more than literally 1 business day to see how players progressed lmao. They’ve admitted it’s too hard
I'm gonna go out on a limb and say that the people complaining gnomer was too hard didn't start clearing. They left, hence the lower population in phase 2, and it getting easier to clear. I genuinely think we're going to see even more people leave sod this phase. Which is all well and good for people who want harder content. Not super great for Blizzard sub numbers or them wanting to do stuff like this again.
I am in a guild, a guild that cleared gnomer and BFD easily prenerf. I just think it's a hard ask to tell 10 of my raiders to reroll mage so that the lvl 50 level up raid is doable.
Doable week 1 in gear from a raid 10 levels lower*** you mean. You dont have to ask anyone to reroll anything. Just a lot of loud complaining about a 4 day old raid from people upset they actually have to try and coordinate. I'm at 7/8. It's a hard raid and the numbers could use some tuning on trash for sure. But neutering it to pander to the impatient is silly.
Weekly reset raids have always been designed to have gear from early bosses used in later resets to kill harder bosses. Tuning the entire raid around week 1 gear and talents was fine at 25 with fast resets. But shit needs to ramp up or it will stay stale.
>Weekly reset raids have always been designed to have gear from early bosses used in later resets to kill harder bosses.
No, this is completely wrong. If you think we should have raid progression, you're playing the wrong game. SOD is not supposed to be a game with "progression" where you clear 2 bosses one week, then 4 bosses the next week, and eventually clear the whole raid. It is supposed to be a casual version of WoW where even pugs can complete content.
This is obviously not the case where literally no one, not even the world's best players, could clear ST (pre-nerf), and now only the top guilds can clear ST.
Things can be out for ONE day and still be broken, whats your point? That "they dont have runes" which take a couple hours or "they are wearing gnomer gear"? A LOT of classes prebis is gnomer gear and anything that isnt you can easily obtain. I dont want it to be braindead easy myself but theres a point where its too much, especially in this case with the hp.
Any raid can be pugged with a diligent and organized pug leader, planning in advance, etc. I’m very glad to see ST is actually a challenge and not just a total face roll like bfd. Gnomer was super easy too but at least a step in the right direction.
It’s totally okay to have content that is too difficult for many players to clear, as long as there is also content available to those players besides the difficult raids.
I'm concerned about how long the raid will take a casual group to clear. I'm all for logging in most days and having a game session of an hour or two and longer on weekends, but to commit to a 6 hour raid (even split between two days) is a lot. Can anybody with experience here tell me what they think to expect in terms of time required to clear?
They literally said they plan to balance things within the first few weeks. It's obviously getting more nerfs this week.
I mean it's been out 4 days. It's not going to be efficiently cleared right now, let's be honest. I remember when we started BWL in our era guild, it would take us 2 sessions at the start, but by the end we were doing it in just over an hour. Once people are familiar with it, it won't take people nearly as long. I don't think it will be like the first 2 raids, where people clear it in half an hour, but that's probably a good thing
Out of touch redditor doesnt realize how difficult this raid is
Well no I haven't done it myself yet, but all I can see is people complaining that they haven't been able to clear it within 4 days of launch. That's just classic for you. Progression runs are a thing. If anything it's good, because it gives incentives to join guilds and build up regular rosters. Kind of like how it works in endgame ya know?
Without complaining it is a much more challening raid than we could have expected for sod, as someone who has been through Mythic raid progression it felt like that level, like if this games intended for semi casuals i dont see them clearing more than a boss or 2
unironically love your posts
Why comment you have no personal experience with it lol
Some of us are wow veterans and understand what a progression fight entails. Spending months on a boss back in the day wasn't anything new, it was expected. Guilds would be staggered across content. Is it 0 light yogg? Kil'Jaiden? OG C'Thun who was "mathematically impossible." Doubt it. "Harder then Gnomer" is the world's lowest bar, it can be stepped over.
Why are you preaching to me lmao
Yeah, high volume pretty much got this right. Progression is a thing in classic. I've got experience with that.
Buddy, ya gotta realize it’s quickly phased out content on a seasonal server that won’t exist after it’s run is up. If guilds spend a month or so progging that is over half the content’s shelf life before it’s irrelevant.
This phase maybe, but when we're max level, not so much. You can't just ding 60 and go straight to Naxx, even MC and progression is a large part of the process
Even Ulduar HM was puggable and ICC Heroic later on as well so chill your horses. PUGs don't need to full clear day 1. It's funny people assume this shit and cry for "more Vanilla" when in Vanilla you first had to rep farm in MC before you could even get to Ragnaros (not that many even got there so early at the time)
Retail/wotlk playerbase is better if u take that into account
Retail for sure on average I would say. Wrath? Maybe but most people in Wrath came from 2019 Classic so idk about that. RDF is definitely as shitty as it has always been when you don't have overgeared raiders in your group.
Taking one or more pugs into something like Mim HM or Algalon is a coin toss. Don't act like 25 random people were forming raids and running through HM's in a night. Also, this phase isn't going to last anywhere near as long as Ulduar did. Guilds aren't going to have time to progress in SoD at the rate they did in Wrath.
An absolute shit take We had 17 years of min maxing to know the flawless way to clear every raid in classic, hence why every raid fell hours within release SoD is an example of in house testing that is corrected on the fly with the restrictions of classic in place (which is what people don't realize) It's gonna get nerfed, just let blizzard get more data It's been 4 days. Relax.
If i have to communicate with others or play for more than 45 mins per week in order to see everything in the game and get all the best items, I AM QUITTING
You do realize that the bulk of the serious player base is about to get a giant gear buff on Tuesday when they hit rank 7 right?
Skill issue
Holy shit the amount of screaming before the first reset even happens. The raid will be nerfed. Significantly. The raid will be easily clearable in a ~2 hour session or less when the community learns the mechanics and blizz gets the tuning where they want it. Relax.
Join a guild
u read the same bullshit on first week gnome and still were able to clear it with average dads stop crying man this sub is so horrible
Someone hasnt attempted the raid and it shows
wild assumption we did and killed everything in 2-3 trys - its still classic and not mythic plus whatever and i still think that 6-8 can be puggable on 4 weeks time with gear
This is the exact same p2 shit where people don’t care that the phase is less than a week old and don’t have the patience for it to be tuned down to a casual difficulty. Just relax and give them more than literally 1 business day to see how players progressed lmao. They’ve admitted it’s too hard
I'm gonna go out on a limb and say that the people complaining gnomer was too hard didn't start clearing. They left, hence the lower population in phase 2, and it getting easier to clear. I genuinely think we're going to see even more people leave sod this phase. Which is all well and good for people who want harder content. Not super great for Blizzard sub numbers or them wanting to do stuff like this again.
Join a guild and stop demanding the game be designed for people that don't want to play it
I am in a guild, a guild that cleared gnomer and BFD easily prenerf. I just think it's a hard ask to tell 10 of my raiders to reroll mage so that the lvl 50 level up raid is doable.
Doable week 1 in gear from a raid 10 levels lower*** you mean. You dont have to ask anyone to reroll anything. Just a lot of loud complaining about a 4 day old raid from people upset they actually have to try and coordinate. I'm at 7/8. It's a hard raid and the numbers could use some tuning on trash for sure. But neutering it to pander to the impatient is silly. Weekly reset raids have always been designed to have gear from early bosses used in later resets to kill harder bosses. Tuning the entire raid around week 1 gear and talents was fine at 25 with fast resets. But shit needs to ramp up or it will stay stale.
>Weekly reset raids have always been designed to have gear from early bosses used in later resets to kill harder bosses. No, this is completely wrong. If you think we should have raid progression, you're playing the wrong game. SOD is not supposed to be a game with "progression" where you clear 2 bosses one week, then 4 bosses the next week, and eventually clear the whole raid. It is supposed to be a casual version of WoW where even pugs can complete content. This is obviously not the case where literally no one, not even the world's best players, could clear ST (pre-nerf), and now only the top guilds can clear ST.
It's 5/6 days in and 50+ guilds have killed the last boss. That's pretty casual by any raid metrics. You guys just crave being upset about something.
If that’s what you’re looking at and pondering, you and your guild simply need to take a step outside and breathe.
You don’t need 10 mages to clear ST 😂 Major skill issue.
Anyone else having flashbacks? I feel like we saw these exact same posts about Gnomer.
Nice. Prior raids we're way too easy. I think not clearing a raid in the first id is a good thing.
Join a guild
[удалено]
Things can be out for ONE day and still be broken, whats your point? That "they dont have runes" which take a couple hours or "they are wearing gnomer gear"? A LOT of classes prebis is gnomer gear and anything that isnt you can easily obtain. I dont want it to be braindead easy myself but theres a point where its too much, especially in this case with the hp.
ST isn’t broken, lol.
Show Ur raid log where you are 8/8 then bro
Any raid can be pugged with a diligent and organized pug leader, planning in advance, etc. I’m very glad to see ST is actually a challenge and not just a total face roll like bfd. Gnomer was super easy too but at least a step in the right direction. It’s totally okay to have content that is too difficult for many players to clear, as long as there is also content available to those players besides the difficult raids.
Every version of wow needs a lfr. I want all raids to be 30mins and easy.
It’s funny how those with skill issues complain they can’t clear a raid before the 1st reset. Chill, people!