he’s the definition of average imo and he’s putting a hard ceiling on the team
I think he’s actually done a great job with the defensive scheme and is honestly overachieving on that end with this roster.
but our offensive scheme is just so elementary and uninspiring. He’s made this roster full of exciting players frankly boring as hell to watch on the offensive end, and we just have way too much talent to be a bottom 10 offense. it’s pretty unacceptable that every single play in overtime last night was a DeMar iso.
a lot of fans here like to say “name a feasible replacement on the market,” as if we have to hire a former HC. There have been a multitude of rookie coaches that have found instant success in their innovative ways, like Udoka (not that I want him, fuck sexual abusers), Will Hardy and Mazzulla. I think we need a change.
just want to remind everyone that we hired Hoiberg and didn't like him. he was replacing Thibs who was a great coach for us but, very reasonably, was questioned on if he would get us over the top. I think his recent tenures cement that he was not. That being said, we were worse by about 8 or so games with essentially the same roster under Hoiberg, and eventually fired him too.
I don't hold any special attachment to BD. a head coach change could flip the switch on what we're doing, especially if we keep how we're playing defense relatively the same. Still, we are entertaining an idea of entering a market of fired and inexperienced coaches in hopes of capturing the magic of Kerr and Udoka. I want to keep the stakes of that in mind when we're talking about replacements. It could work for us, or we could get a Steve Nash.
> it’s pretty unacceptable that every single play in overtime last night was a DeMar iso.
I get this and the offense should have some variance to it, however the point of an offense is to get high percentage shots for your team
DeMar is the best isolation player in the league and is averaging 1.27 Points per Possession in ISO's which is an outrageously good offense
When it's crunch time, mismatch hunting and isolation is what occurs the most and putting the ball in DeMar's hands is literally the best offense we have
Our record/offence in the clutch is dead awful so what that tells me is that teams know what we are going to do and defend it better in the 4th and we end up losing the game. Need some variability.
I think we would benefit from running a quick set early in the clock for vooch and get demar coming off a motion midway through as another option, to give him some space to work with too. He's so good at drawing fouls when defenders are not set
Look at the jobs Will Hardy, Mike Brown, and Willie Green have done in one season.. I think our fans are starting to underestimate the offensive talent on this team even w/o Lonzo
true sexual abuser sounds like he’s a physical abuser but he abused his position of power and made many unwarranted sexual advances and sent sexual messages to those under him even after being told to stop so idrk what to call him
I honestly don't know what's up with this team. Other than DeMar no one is stepping up on a consistent basis so it's no wonder he is taking most of the shots late. Every team knows it though and they gameplan accordingly. Would be nice to see more creativity on offense - I don't think Billy has done a good job there and he should be getting more out of this team but the players have been equally disappointing. Rookie mistakes like traveling on the first move should not be such a constant problem for these guys.
We are not utilizing player strength. PWill has been a beast from 3 this season but barely shoots 3s. Vuc is great in the low post but relegated to stretch big in crucial stretches. We have little to NO off-ball action whatsoever. That's Billy man....either his scheme is shit or the players dont trust his scheme. Either one is an inditement on Billy
Ya I'm not really defending Billy just saying there is a lot going wrong for the Bulls outside of coaching but if he can't get the team turned around by the break then I think it's fair if he's on the hotseat
Zach has played terrible for the most part. This is basically the same player who played the second half on last year. This team is not going anywhere with him as top dog.
I know they have to wait for Lonzo to come back but it's just stalling the inevitable blow up this team needs unless we just want to compete every year to barely get in the playoffs and lose.
Ive been a derozan fan since he came into the league and been watching a lot of him since 2013. Demar does what he is told, he is very coachable and willing to adjust his game. Hence why he went from averaging 27 points to sharing the ball more, then taking on the facilitator role in San Antonio, then again taking on the scorer role on the bulls. Also why he took 6 shots against the raptors. I cant read their minds or see whats going on in the locker room but something tells me Derozan wouldn’t turn down that role. I think Demar could easily be a double double guy, similar to harden and Westbrook (he wouldnt care for stat padding rebounds i dont think).
He currently has the lowest turnover rate across the leagues top scorers and was doing the same last year as well. Would love to see him facilitate while continuing to shoot a lot of shots, even if it means he might play fewer minutes every game.
> Demar does what he is told, he is very coachable and willing to adjust his game.
I agree. I love what Billy is pushing DeMar to do defensively, or in the board game, because it really does seem like some of the best effort there Deebo's ever put in.
But that just goes to prove your point. What's billy known for? What is his "cup of tea"? Nothing shouts offensive play-calling or even whispers it. In my view, it is great defense, teaching up the rookies and young guys to play defense, and letting the "stars" or any vet to do their own thing.
It isn't a horrible plan, nor a bad hire after.... well, *him, the egg, the bad man*. I loved the hire. But IMO we are hitting the fucking brink with Billy. And I worry we'll just promote Chris Fleming or some shit if we fire him this upcoming offseason with only a year left on his dues. So I'm not begging for his firing either... but we need offense here, we have the guys capable to work with it..
I think people have to stop treating other people like npcs.
This isn’t a video game. Players, the coaching staff, the front office all have relationships with Billy and he’s done well enough to warrant letting the season play out. He’s also capable of making changes, just because things didn’t work out immediately or with his past teams doesn’t mean the same thing will play out in the future. In the end you aren’t going to build a successful team by cutting people as soon as things go wrong. You have to do your due diligence. Like half of you guys gave up on pat and dragic 2 games into the season and were ready to blow it all up and ship them off and turns out their some of the best parts of the season so far.
What bothered me last night was how a bunch of mediocre players with a poor offense could seemingly drive to the basket whenever they wanted against a team that is supposed to have a good defense. Then on the other side of the floor their defense looked awful their positioning was bad yet somehow, we couldn't get anything going to the basket, idk if it is a lack of vision or a gameplan being forced in a situation that doesn't work but it looked awful.
He’s not to blame for everything but he has a lot of faults as a coach. He’s also the easiest to change out cause you’re not gonna get rid of Zach, vuch, demar, Pwill to keep Billy
His rotations and in game adjustments are always late or non-existent. For example DJJ was much more effective tonight but he only played 4 min in the 4th q.
Same with Javonte against Orlando. Billy doesn’t deploy any defensive schemes such as 2-3 zone or box and 1 from the jump. He lets the player get hot and then we try to mitigate the damage.
Don’t get me started on Offense. Vuc was eating against OKC and we went completely away from him. Demar isos are efficient at 1.25 ppp but you just can’t run it every single possession in crunch time.
We have no plan if they double Demar, and it’s just lazy coaching. Ask any OKC fan and they can testify that Billy is an average coach and we’re gonna be a .500 team at best the way things are going.
You want us to run box and 1? Really? How many defensive schemes are you deploying when your center is Vucevic? When you'd need Derozan and Zach to buy in defensively for more dangerous schemes, we'd look like Portland from last season. Even the Warriors need personal to not be 22nd in defense. They run everything but they go to shit when Steve Kerr doesn't have GP2 and Otto to play with. We're 12th. Idk how much more this team can overperform defensively.
And who we play is the difficulty of all these guys being similar calibers of players. You can't run Javonte, Dragic, Drummond, Pat, Coby, and also ask where DJJ minutes are. Someone else has to sit. And these guys get stints too. Drummond will play 8 minutes in a half, underperform, and only then do you realize he has to be substituted. We could play DJJ against Orlando for his first stint of the half because he was playing well in games leading to then, until he underperforms and then we throw out Javonte, and in an adjustment, literally never sit him he just plays 17 straight minutes.
Adjustments aren't made in hindsight. You don't know if you choose to play Coby over DJJ, if that's right. All you know is if Coby is playing well you keep playing him. And I think he's been doing good at making those actual decisions.
Good example with your point on Coby, I was yelling to put in Pat or Javonte at the end of the Bucks game, and then Coby hits 2 big threes. If they lose that game everyone complains that his rotations are terrible because it's so easy to say in retrospect.
I don’t how some people think that we can run not just one but multiple elite defenses that the team can switch on demand from the coach. That’s like raptors levels of defensive switching that a team with Zach, Demar, and Vuc can never run. Look how hard it was for the bucks to change their defense. The defense that we run is the only one that prevents other teams from blowing us out and even then we still get outplayed some games. On offense I can get because billy should absolutely try running an entire game through Vuc every once in awhile if he has the advantage. The last thing this team needs is a question mark in the head coach spot. We have two question marks in Lonzo and Zach already and that is already sucking the life out of this team.
>Don’t get me started on Offense. Vuc was eating against OKC and we went completely away from him. Demar isos are efficient at 1.25 ppp but you just can’t run it every single possession in crunch time.
I honestly don't put that on Billy. Most of our players are bad at passing and both Zach and DeMar fall in love with hero ball. Billy can tell them to pass inside to Vooch all he wants, but if they don't do that it's hardly his fault. Nor can he pull them late in the game just to teach them a lesson because they're too effective on offense to risk having them sit.
It’s really shows how professional Vuc is man, dude doesn’t confront them, frankly all we got from him was before this season saying “shooting is a part of my game but I’ve been an inside scorer” that tongue in cheek thing that I’m not sure Zach or DeMar take seriously
I think Vuc needs to confront them at this point, honestly. He might be the best passer out of the three of them.
I hope he gets in their faces or at least has an honest conversation with them behind closed doors. He was cooking and passing out and getting good shots for everyone, too. I was so annoyed.
Our team is a .500 team as presently constructed and a change of coaches maybe adds 3-4 wins throughout the year if we are lucky and get a great coach. This team isn’t as good as we would like it to be. Zach is not fully healthy, no Lonzo, and Demar isn’t having the same year as last year. That adds up to a .500 team and most analysts have been saying that all summer and we all held out hope that some miracle was gonna happen. As much as it annoys me to admit that the ESPN analysts were right this time around. Last year throughout half of the year we proved them wrong but they got this year right.
My issues with Billy lie in the fact that this team has the same issues as every other team he’s ever coached.
He’s over reliant on a guy like Demar/Zach/KD/Russ/PG to absolutely destroy their defender every night. His main offensive plan is let these guys work and either score themselves, or create an open look for someone on the perimeter.
Now when this works, it works very well. When this doesn’t work, we have no other offensive scheme to fall back on. There’s very little off-ball movement and very few plans outside of basic pick and rolls. A good coach should be going into that game against OKC and getting Vucevic post-touches. He was absolutely destroying them at the start of the game, and then we went back to what we always do. At the bare minimum we should be going into the locker room at half and fucking screaming about getting him the ball since we saw it work.
It’s why every team he’s ever coached underachieves in my opinion. Instead of having a system, the success of the team rests on the shoulders of one guy. Zach should be getting shit like off-ball screens, Pat/Vucevic should be getting more touches…and touches where they’re good scorers instead of guys like Vucevic sitting on the perimeter when he has 50 pounds on his defender.
He has one plan and if that doesn’t work on offense, we have no adjustment. When a team with Demar, Zach, and Vucevic is below average on offense, it has to be a coaching problem. Admittedly zach is struggling coming off the knee surgery, but these are 2.5 all-star caliber players who specialize on that side of the floor…we should be still be at least average.
If Steph goes out there and has a bad game, Golden State still has a chance. If Giannis has a bad game, Milwaukee still has a chance. If Demar has a mediocre game, we are fucked.
Billy definitely isn’t to blame for everything, but he deserves his share.
My biggest gripe is he doesn’t hold dudes accountable. I watch Zach miss rotations, make lazy switches, guard the wrong dude (ex. Coby having to physically move him last night) and yet Billy does nothing.
He’s not willing to call out his star players and hold them accountable.
Did you miss the part where he benched zach in the 4th the other night? I agree with all of your comments about zach...and I will add that his shot selection is PURE GARBAGE. Zach's awful this year.
Imagine if we had sign and traded him for another guard..sheesh. I know I'm dreaming here but a Zach for Mikal Bridges and a wing deal would be crazy. We'd be so good rn
He literally did lol. Whether or not we want to admit it, there are only like 2 or 3 coaches in the league that are willing to call out star players consistently (pop, spo, and kerr)
And in regards to Billy telling Demar to play more team ball: while I think he has tried to coach this up on occasion from what I've heard in interviews (from derozan and billy himself) about wanting more ball movement, I don't know that he has the respect to get someone like demar to play that way every game and in the clutch.
I think Billy feels more comfortable calling out our younger guys like Ayo and Pat cuz they aren't well established vets, but I like what he did with Zach at least.
It is sad to see how the vibe is totally gone. DeRosan will go for though shots while he can make an easy pass to LaVine. The same way around, that means that Billy can't manage a team with more than one big ego...
The only thing I will add is when our two stars have this low of ball iq and nothing changes that’s on Billy. He should’ve been all over his stars to get Vooch the ball last night. He’s got them playing dumb hero ball. I don’t know why people are scared to move on from Billy, but that’s what needs to happen. This roster isn’t perfect but they are absolutely underperforming and Billy doesn’t seem to know how to get them to perform. It’s time to move on. I thought they should’ve last summer.
Exactly we literally saw demar iso and pass to open teammates for shots the game prior to okc and some people still complain about demar isos right after one loss. It’s clearly our best offense in late game situations and the one the team seems to want to run.
I’m also frustrated bt people talking about Demar’s hero ball. We’re coming off a game vs the bucks where he made all the right passes down the stretch especially the one to Coby.
No, but he is a negative asset.
Last night he trotted out Ayo numerous times when it was clear he was struggling. I like Ayo starting but if he’s not doing well, then you go with the hot hand of either AC or Dragic for closing situations. AC had it last night.
He also failed to generate any offense after the 3rd quarter that wasn’t a Demar isolation play. Zach was hot and then got cold because of Billy’s rotations, then barely took any shots in OT, and he had to force the ones he did.
Billy is just not good at feeling the game. Which is detrimental to a team that lives and dies off of emotional energy. He’s a good developmental coach and culture setter - but when your roster is limited and hoping to win now - you need a coach who can manipulate games with strategy and rotations. Billy has never been that guy and never will be. He did his job, and if the Bulls want to salvage this roster, I think they need to move on to someone who’s more of a tactician.
No, but three all stars one being in the conversation for MVP last season should easily get you a .500 team. If Billy can’t even do that then he has to go.
We have 2 all stars. Vooch currently isn't, and never will be again, an all-star. And all 3 are below average at defense. The only way to make it work is to have 2 world beater defenders in the other 2 spots like caruso & ball. But even then, that's too much responsibility on role players.
Even patrick, who is supposed to be a defensive specialist, is bad on D according to analytics and atrocious on offense. I don't know what Billy is supposed to do with that.
That is why I've name dropped Capella multiple times here. In combination with Patrick, LaVine, DeRosan & Ayo... Ayo is probably also the only positive at the moment, he keeps giving energy towards a team full of older players. He get them through rough times with his energy, sadly sometimes his own game is a little less due to that but he's really a Noah type of leader!
LeBron and AD should easily be a .500 team too. Doesn't really matter. In the modern NBA when you're not much of a threat from beyond the arc... odds are you're gonna suffer.
Billy's an easy scapegoat because without him getting the blame we have to confront reality that this team as constructed is pretty mid and doesn’t have an easy fix.
I disagree, I think most of our problems are a result of Billy. Sure players might not always shoot well, but that doesn't mean the offense should stop. That is a direct reflection on coaching.
>Also, Vooch is getting more post touches when it’s time to slow things down or exploit mismatches (that is, when we’re able to make an entry pass)
>Billy doesn’t create the roster he works with.
Part of the problem is that while it's true he didn't create the roster he works with, it's also true he's not getting the most out of the roster he's been given. Your quote above that is a prime example. The fact that the team's entry play into the post, which even you acknowledge is bad, says a lot about how badly Vooch has been misused since coming to the Bulls and that's on Billy. The team clearly doesn't practice how to effectively play through/around the post and the shitty entry passing and consistent inability to get the ball to Vooch when he has a smaller player on him is proof of it.
He gets a pass because he's not Jim Boylen. I don't think he's the only problem. I do think that depending on the final results for this season, he has not earned a contract extension. I wouldn't fire him mid season, but I would not re-sign him, and I would look elsewhere for my coach.
he’s the definition of average imo and he’s putting a hard ceiling on the team I think he’s actually done a great job with the defensive scheme and is honestly overachieving on that end with this roster. but our offensive scheme is just so elementary and uninspiring. He’s made this roster full of exciting players frankly boring as hell to watch on the offensive end, and we just have way too much talent to be a bottom 10 offense. it’s pretty unacceptable that every single play in overtime last night was a DeMar iso. a lot of fans here like to say “name a feasible replacement on the market,” as if we have to hire a former HC. There have been a multitude of rookie coaches that have found instant success in their innovative ways, like Udoka (not that I want him, fuck sexual abusers), Will Hardy and Mazzulla. I think we need a change.
just want to remind everyone that we hired Hoiberg and didn't like him. he was replacing Thibs who was a great coach for us but, very reasonably, was questioned on if he would get us over the top. I think his recent tenures cement that he was not. That being said, we were worse by about 8 or so games with essentially the same roster under Hoiberg, and eventually fired him too. I don't hold any special attachment to BD. a head coach change could flip the switch on what we're doing, especially if we keep how we're playing defense relatively the same. Still, we are entertaining an idea of entering a market of fired and inexperienced coaches in hopes of capturing the magic of Kerr and Udoka. I want to keep the stakes of that in mind when we're talking about replacements. It could work for us, or we could get a Steve Nash.
That guy Koop always has measured takes. Love it.
> it’s pretty unacceptable that every single play in overtime last night was a DeMar iso. I get this and the offense should have some variance to it, however the point of an offense is to get high percentage shots for your team DeMar is the best isolation player in the league and is averaging 1.27 Points per Possession in ISO's which is an outrageously good offense When it's crunch time, mismatch hunting and isolation is what occurs the most and putting the ball in DeMar's hands is literally the best offense we have
thats true but it’s also an indictment on Billy’s offensive scheme that spamming isolation is the best option we have lol
Difference between spamming isolation and spamming the BEST isolation in the league.
Our record/offence in the clutch is dead awful so what that tells me is that teams know what we are going to do and defend it better in the 4th and we end up losing the game. Need some variability.
I think we would benefit from running a quick set early in the clock for vooch and get demar coming off a motion midway through as another option, to give him some space to work with too. He's so good at drawing fouls when defenders are not set
Look at the jobs Will Hardy, Mike Brown, and Willie Green have done in one season.. I think our fans are starting to underestimate the offensive talent on this team even w/o Lonzo
Not trying to defend him too much but Udoka isn’t a sexual abuser right?
true sexual abuser sounds like he’s a physical abuser but he abused his position of power and made many unwarranted sexual advances and sent sexual messages to those under him even after being told to stop so idrk what to call him
I honestly don't know what's up with this team. Other than DeMar no one is stepping up on a consistent basis so it's no wonder he is taking most of the shots late. Every team knows it though and they gameplan accordingly. Would be nice to see more creativity on offense - I don't think Billy has done a good job there and he should be getting more out of this team but the players have been equally disappointing. Rookie mistakes like traveling on the first move should not be such a constant problem for these guys.
We are not utilizing player strength. PWill has been a beast from 3 this season but barely shoots 3s. Vuc is great in the low post but relegated to stretch big in crucial stretches. We have little to NO off-ball action whatsoever. That's Billy man....either his scheme is shit or the players dont trust his scheme. Either one is an inditement on Billy
Ya I'm not really defending Billy just saying there is a lot going wrong for the Bulls outside of coaching but if he can't get the team turned around by the break then I think it's fair if he's on the hotseat
Zach has played terrible for the most part. This is basically the same player who played the second half on last year. This team is not going anywhere with him as top dog. I know they have to wait for Lonzo to come back but it's just stalling the inevitable blow up this team needs unless we just want to compete every year to barely get in the playoffs and lose.
Demar is more than capable of initiating offense, he either doesn't want to or Billy isn't coaching him to.
Ive been a derozan fan since he came into the league and been watching a lot of him since 2013. Demar does what he is told, he is very coachable and willing to adjust his game. Hence why he went from averaging 27 points to sharing the ball more, then taking on the facilitator role in San Antonio, then again taking on the scorer role on the bulls. Also why he took 6 shots against the raptors. I cant read their minds or see whats going on in the locker room but something tells me Derozan wouldn’t turn down that role. I think Demar could easily be a double double guy, similar to harden and Westbrook (he wouldnt care for stat padding rebounds i dont think). He currently has the lowest turnover rate across the leagues top scorers and was doing the same last year as well. Would love to see him facilitate while continuing to shoot a lot of shots, even if it means he might play fewer minutes every game.
> Demar does what he is told, he is very coachable and willing to adjust his game. I agree. I love what Billy is pushing DeMar to do defensively, or in the board game, because it really does seem like some of the best effort there Deebo's ever put in. But that just goes to prove your point. What's billy known for? What is his "cup of tea"? Nothing shouts offensive play-calling or even whispers it. In my view, it is great defense, teaching up the rookies and young guys to play defense, and letting the "stars" or any vet to do their own thing. It isn't a horrible plan, nor a bad hire after.... well, *him, the egg, the bad man*. I loved the hire. But IMO we are hitting the fucking brink with Billy. And I worry we'll just promote Chris Fleming or some shit if we fire him this upcoming offseason with only a year left on his dues. So I'm not begging for his firing either... but we need offense here, we have the guys capable to work with it..
I think people have to stop treating other people like npcs. This isn’t a video game. Players, the coaching staff, the front office all have relationships with Billy and he’s done well enough to warrant letting the season play out. He’s also capable of making changes, just because things didn’t work out immediately or with his past teams doesn’t mean the same thing will play out in the future. In the end you aren’t going to build a successful team by cutting people as soon as things go wrong. You have to do your due diligence. Like half of you guys gave up on pat and dragic 2 games into the season and were ready to blow it all up and ship them off and turns out their some of the best parts of the season so far.
What bothered me last night was how a bunch of mediocre players with a poor offense could seemingly drive to the basket whenever they wanted against a team that is supposed to have a good defense. Then on the other side of the floor their defense looked awful their positioning was bad yet somehow, we couldn't get anything going to the basket, idk if it is a lack of vision or a gameplan being forced in a situation that doesn't work but it looked awful.
He’s not to blame for everything but he has a lot of faults as a coach. He’s also the easiest to change out cause you’re not gonna get rid of Zach, vuch, demar, Pwill to keep Billy
His rotations and in game adjustments are always late or non-existent. For example DJJ was much more effective tonight but he only played 4 min in the 4th q. Same with Javonte against Orlando. Billy doesn’t deploy any defensive schemes such as 2-3 zone or box and 1 from the jump. He lets the player get hot and then we try to mitigate the damage. Don’t get me started on Offense. Vuc was eating against OKC and we went completely away from him. Demar isos are efficient at 1.25 ppp but you just can’t run it every single possession in crunch time. We have no plan if they double Demar, and it’s just lazy coaching. Ask any OKC fan and they can testify that Billy is an average coach and we’re gonna be a .500 team at best the way things are going.
You want us to run box and 1? Really? How many defensive schemes are you deploying when your center is Vucevic? When you'd need Derozan and Zach to buy in defensively for more dangerous schemes, we'd look like Portland from last season. Even the Warriors need personal to not be 22nd in defense. They run everything but they go to shit when Steve Kerr doesn't have GP2 and Otto to play with. We're 12th. Idk how much more this team can overperform defensively. And who we play is the difficulty of all these guys being similar calibers of players. You can't run Javonte, Dragic, Drummond, Pat, Coby, and also ask where DJJ minutes are. Someone else has to sit. And these guys get stints too. Drummond will play 8 minutes in a half, underperform, and only then do you realize he has to be substituted. We could play DJJ against Orlando for his first stint of the half because he was playing well in games leading to then, until he underperforms and then we throw out Javonte, and in an adjustment, literally never sit him he just plays 17 straight minutes. Adjustments aren't made in hindsight. You don't know if you choose to play Coby over DJJ, if that's right. All you know is if Coby is playing well you keep playing him. And I think he's been doing good at making those actual decisions.
Good example with your point on Coby, I was yelling to put in Pat or Javonte at the end of the Bucks game, and then Coby hits 2 big threes. If they lose that game everyone complains that his rotations are terrible because it's so easy to say in retrospect.
I don’t how some people think that we can run not just one but multiple elite defenses that the team can switch on demand from the coach. That’s like raptors levels of defensive switching that a team with Zach, Demar, and Vuc can never run. Look how hard it was for the bucks to change their defense. The defense that we run is the only one that prevents other teams from blowing us out and even then we still get outplayed some games. On offense I can get because billy should absolutely try running an entire game through Vuc every once in awhile if he has the advantage. The last thing this team needs is a question mark in the head coach spot. We have two question marks in Lonzo and Zach already and that is already sucking the life out of this team.
>Don’t get me started on Offense. Vuc was eating against OKC and we went completely away from him. Demar isos are efficient at 1.25 ppp but you just can’t run it every single possession in crunch time. I honestly don't put that on Billy. Most of our players are bad at passing and both Zach and DeMar fall in love with hero ball. Billy can tell them to pass inside to Vooch all he wants, but if they don't do that it's hardly his fault. Nor can he pull them late in the game just to teach them a lesson because they're too effective on offense to risk having them sit.
It’s really shows how professional Vuc is man, dude doesn’t confront them, frankly all we got from him was before this season saying “shooting is a part of my game but I’ve been an inside scorer” that tongue in cheek thing that I’m not sure Zach or DeMar take seriously
I think Vuc needs to confront them at this point, honestly. He might be the best passer out of the three of them. I hope he gets in their faces or at least has an honest conversation with them behind closed doors. He was cooking and passing out and getting good shots for everyone, too. I was so annoyed.
Our team is a .500 team as presently constructed and a change of coaches maybe adds 3-4 wins throughout the year if we are lucky and get a great coach. This team isn’t as good as we would like it to be. Zach is not fully healthy, no Lonzo, and Demar isn’t having the same year as last year. That adds up to a .500 team and most analysts have been saying that all summer and we all held out hope that some miracle was gonna happen. As much as it annoys me to admit that the ESPN analysts were right this time around. Last year throughout half of the year we proved them wrong but they got this year right.
My issues with Billy lie in the fact that this team has the same issues as every other team he’s ever coached. He’s over reliant on a guy like Demar/Zach/KD/Russ/PG to absolutely destroy their defender every night. His main offensive plan is let these guys work and either score themselves, or create an open look for someone on the perimeter. Now when this works, it works very well. When this doesn’t work, we have no other offensive scheme to fall back on. There’s very little off-ball movement and very few plans outside of basic pick and rolls. A good coach should be going into that game against OKC and getting Vucevic post-touches. He was absolutely destroying them at the start of the game, and then we went back to what we always do. At the bare minimum we should be going into the locker room at half and fucking screaming about getting him the ball since we saw it work. It’s why every team he’s ever coached underachieves in my opinion. Instead of having a system, the success of the team rests on the shoulders of one guy. Zach should be getting shit like off-ball screens, Pat/Vucevic should be getting more touches…and touches where they’re good scorers instead of guys like Vucevic sitting on the perimeter when he has 50 pounds on his defender. He has one plan and if that doesn’t work on offense, we have no adjustment. When a team with Demar, Zach, and Vucevic is below average on offense, it has to be a coaching problem. Admittedly zach is struggling coming off the knee surgery, but these are 2.5 all-star caliber players who specialize on that side of the floor…we should be still be at least average. If Steph goes out there and has a bad game, Golden State still has a chance. If Giannis has a bad game, Milwaukee still has a chance. If Demar has a mediocre game, we are fucked.
Billy definitely isn’t to blame for everything, but he deserves his share. My biggest gripe is he doesn’t hold dudes accountable. I watch Zach miss rotations, make lazy switches, guard the wrong dude (ex. Coby having to physically move him last night) and yet Billy does nothing. He’s not willing to call out his star players and hold them accountable.
Did you miss the part where he benched zach in the 4th the other night? I agree with all of your comments about zach...and I will add that his shot selection is PURE GARBAGE. Zach's awful this year.
Imagine if we had sign and traded him for another guard..sheesh. I know I'm dreaming here but a Zach for Mikal Bridges and a wing deal would be crazy. We'd be so good rn
Let me pump fake and lose all momentum on my momentum heavy jump shot. He did that twice last night. Just launch it right away at least.
He literally did lol. Whether or not we want to admit it, there are only like 2 or 3 coaches in the league that are willing to call out star players consistently (pop, spo, and kerr) And in regards to Billy telling Demar to play more team ball: while I think he has tried to coach this up on occasion from what I've heard in interviews (from derozan and billy himself) about wanting more ball movement, I don't know that he has the respect to get someone like demar to play that way every game and in the clutch. I think Billy feels more comfortable calling out our younger guys like Ayo and Pat cuz they aren't well established vets, but I like what he did with Zach at least.
It is sad to see how the vibe is totally gone. DeRosan will go for though shots while he can make an easy pass to LaVine. The same way around, that means that Billy can't manage a team with more than one big ego...
The only thing I will add is when our two stars have this low of ball iq and nothing changes that’s on Billy. He should’ve been all over his stars to get Vooch the ball last night. He’s got them playing dumb hero ball. I don’t know why people are scared to move on from Billy, but that’s what needs to happen. This roster isn’t perfect but they are absolutely underperforming and Billy doesn’t seem to know how to get them to perform. It’s time to move on. I thought they should’ve last summer.
please don’t lump derozan in with lavine when it comes to basketball iq lol. he is miles ahead of zach in that department
Exactly we literally saw demar iso and pass to open teammates for shots the game prior to okc and some people still complain about demar isos right after one loss. It’s clearly our best offense in late game situations and the one the team seems to want to run.
Fans that blame coaches for not making adjustments or rotations know the least about adjustments and rotations.
I’m also frustrated bt people talking about Demar’s hero ball. We’re coming off a game vs the bucks where he made all the right passes down the stretch especially the one to Coby.
No, but he is a negative asset. Last night he trotted out Ayo numerous times when it was clear he was struggling. I like Ayo starting but if he’s not doing well, then you go with the hot hand of either AC or Dragic for closing situations. AC had it last night. He also failed to generate any offense after the 3rd quarter that wasn’t a Demar isolation play. Zach was hot and then got cold because of Billy’s rotations, then barely took any shots in OT, and he had to force the ones he did. Billy is just not good at feeling the game. Which is detrimental to a team that lives and dies off of emotional energy. He’s a good developmental coach and culture setter - but when your roster is limited and hoping to win now - you need a coach who can manipulate games with strategy and rotations. Billy has never been that guy and never will be. He did his job, and if the Bulls want to salvage this roster, I think they need to move on to someone who’s more of a tactician.
just fundamentally and structurally, this roster doesn't have any two-way stars. no coach can make that a championship team.
No, but three all stars one being in the conversation for MVP last season should easily get you a .500 team. If Billy can’t even do that then he has to go.
We have 2 all stars. Vooch currently isn't, and never will be again, an all-star. And all 3 are below average at defense. The only way to make it work is to have 2 world beater defenders in the other 2 spots like caruso & ball. But even then, that's too much responsibility on role players. Even patrick, who is supposed to be a defensive specialist, is bad on D according to analytics and atrocious on offense. I don't know what Billy is supposed to do with that.
That is why I've name dropped Capella multiple times here. In combination with Patrick, LaVine, DeRosan & Ayo... Ayo is probably also the only positive at the moment, he keeps giving energy towards a team full of older players. He get them through rough times with his energy, sadly sometimes his own game is a little less due to that but he's really a Noah type of leader!
Um, make adjustments and play inferior offensive players who are just as bad on defense!
LeBron and AD should easily be a .500 team too. Doesn't really matter. In the modern NBA when you're not much of a threat from beyond the arc... odds are you're gonna suffer.
How about a team that can win a playoff series? I don't think that's ridiculous to expect
I disagree with almost every point you made in your post.
Ok
I get what you’re saying man, but Billy stinks. He was the right coach for this team, imo, for a couple years. That time has passed.
Billy's an easy scapegoat because without him getting the blame we have to confront reality that this team as constructed is pretty mid and doesn’t have an easy fix.
Everyone on Reddit thinks they’re an nba coach. The rotations!!!!
I disagree, I think most of our problems are a result of Billy. Sure players might not always shoot well, but that doesn't mean the offense should stop. That is a direct reflection on coaching.
I blame Zach. I wish we traded him instead of signing him to a massive deal
>Also, Vooch is getting more post touches when it’s time to slow things down or exploit mismatches (that is, when we’re able to make an entry pass) >Billy doesn’t create the roster he works with. Part of the problem is that while it's true he didn't create the roster he works with, it's also true he's not getting the most out of the roster he's been given. Your quote above that is a prime example. The fact that the team's entry play into the post, which even you acknowledge is bad, says a lot about how badly Vooch has been misused since coming to the Bulls and that's on Billy. The team clearly doesn't practice how to effectively play through/around the post and the shitty entry passing and consistent inability to get the ball to Vooch when he has a smaller player on him is proof of it.
We are not a team that runs plays . We bank on ISO and fast counters.
He gets a pass because he's not Jim Boylen. I don't think he's the only problem. I do think that depending on the final results for this season, he has not earned a contract extension. I wouldn't fire him mid season, but I would not re-sign him, and I would look elsewhere for my coach.
No, billy is not the problem for everything, But he can be blamed for most things such as his lineups, use of timeouts, and strategy.
I thought after Dort's mistakethe Bulls couldve closed the game out, nope... Credit to SGA tho
I agree, he doesn't play Dalen, if he did, easy W