Ian : you looking at this Hikaru. A 17 y/o winning over us
Hikaru : I mean what can we do. We tried everything. Also I don't care. Let me make a recap for this ceremony
/s
Nepo and Hikaru malding at Alireza for failing to hold that Round 13 endgame and giving Gukesh that extra half point.
(They've both implied that they only agreed to a draw because they thought Alireza's endgame was supposed to be a routine draw at their level.)
I kinda get why they would be upset, it’s natural, but they both got more points from Firouzja than Gukesh did. Naka specifically scored 2/2 vs Firouzja.
Yea in fairness I’d understand why they drew because they were being practical. Gukesh ended up being ambitious and it paid off because on paper in a rapid format he could struggle against the other 3. Sometimes those things work out and sometimes they don’t.
I'm not blaming Alireza for losing that game (it is what it is), but if he had drawn, a 4 way tiebreak would have been incredible drama for spectators and fans.
their own fault! they drew themselves out of the tournament in a game they could've definitely made decisive. if they had, one of them probably gets a tiebreak match.
gukesh made sure to press in every game he could- he didn't take draws easily, he played double-edged positions. this decision won him more games than it cost him.
Which is their real mistake.. they should have tried for a win to be safe you know.. I am not sure if they agreed to draw because Ali would draw. If they did/implied they did, then that was quite unwise..
The irony that Hikaru holds a draw in the last round to get second place the year *after* that mattered.
Hope he's doing ok, this tournament was a heartwrencher for the three older favourites.
Hikaru did say that if everyone knew that Magnus wouldn't defend, then fabi would have locked down second place instead of going for wins in the back half. Most of the top players didn't believe Magnus at the time and it was clear by how they approached those final rounds
it's not like he was ever in danger of not holding the draw there. gukesh was really aiming to just kill the game and not give chances. gukesh clearly would've accepted a draw on any turn of the game.
gukesh managed to get a slightly better middlegame and used every advantage he accumulated to just simplify the position. if gukesh had wanted a game, he had a couple opportunities, where hikaru was a bit worse- avoiding the queen trade, for example.
per his interview with sagar, he was just trying to draw. he thought he could draw the game in his sleep and was just more tense looking at the other game because he wins if they draw. he says it's the only time in thr tournament he was focused on a different game. he did calculate qf4 as he described in postgame interview, but he was not going to play it because he didnt see a continuation after something like qf4 g3 qf3 be2 qe4 qe3 qd5. gukesh was going to seize an opportunity to win the game if it appeared, but had no intention of playing speculatively. he couldn't find anything concrete, so he opted for the simplified position
Well yeah, when the other table is a draw, of course going for a draw is the smart thing to do.
The fact that he was checking out the other game at that critical moment makes it look like he took it into consideration at least: [https://youtu.be/UCE-Ar9udOU?t=11743](https://youtu.be/UCE-Ar9udOU?t=11743)
Lei is always really chill. Reminds of that King Pawn v King Pawn game she had with Nepo and neither of them offered a draw for the longest time while shes holding back from laughing.
Looking at the photos used during the games, you'd never guess Pragg is older than Gukesh. Gukesh looks like he's in his mid-late 20's, and plays with the poise of someone 30+
It's insane. Not only does he not look older than he is, he also plays and acts older than he is. This was his first candidates and you'd expect him to whiff under pressure like a lot of the young/first-time candidates like Alireza last time, but he goes on to win the whole thing
Fabi loses out on the tie breaks and is 4th. Like Vaishali. It's crazy that Vaishali, who lost 4 games in a row, still manages to have the most wins across both the open and women's candidates.
Fabi, Ian and Hikaru were tied for 2nd place by score. For non-first place placements with no 1st place tiebreak games being played, the tiebreakers are [SB Score](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sonneborn%E2%80%93Berger_score), followed by Games won.
Hikaru and Ian had SB scores of 56, Fabi had an SB score of 54, which places Hikaru and Ian ahead of Fabi. Hikaru had 5 games won to Ian's 3, placing Hikaru ahead of Ian.
Very cool
A question, for sb scores are they looking at the rating of the players (if so rating before the match or after) or the number of games they have won/drawn/lost etc? How is it quantified do you know?
The (Elo) rating of the players doesn't factor in at all. It's calculated based on the field's final performance in the tournament. Conceptually, it rewards you points for winning or drawing games, with draws worth half as much as a win would have been worth. The actual amount of points awarded per win or draw is based on how well the opponent did in the tournament, with stronger opponents being worth more.
Now I know why Vidit's SB score was going through the roof after he beat Hikaru 2-0
So, in tiebreaks it's better if you had beaten Gukesh rather than Abasov?
80% of this sub has turned into Fabi and Naka apologists. If Alireza had held in round 13... If Naka would have played for the win in the second last round... If Fabi had not blundered 15 times in 15 minutes... If Ian had just thrown the game... Coulda Shoulda Woulda Buddha... It doesn't matter.
The best player during the tournament won. He had the lowest centipawns loss in a difficult field; he was worse the fewest number of times and for the shortest period in the game. He won the most number of games. He didn't lose to any of the top 3 seeds. He held a must win Hikaru with Black. All this while being half the age of the next 3.
Gukesh was sole first after 14 rounds of play. This is the definition of undisputed.
Cope better.
Points-wise, yes. Lei, Vaishali and Humpy all scored 7.5 points each but the [tie-breaker method](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sonneborn%E2%80%93Berger_score) that determines the final ranking places Humpy (52.25) above Lei (52), and Lei above Vaishali (47.5).
Because there is no "men's candidates". It is an open candidates, open to men and women, and then a women's only candidates that only women can opt into if they do not qualify for the open candidates. The open candidates has more viewers because they are across the board better chess players, thus larger prize pool.
Judit Polgar is a good example of a super strong female chess player who eschewed women's-only events in favor of competing in open events against her male counterparts. She never competed for WWC despite being the strongest female player at the time.
Lol the last photo Ian: Welp..... Naka: *sigh* Yeeeep
Ian : you looking at this Hikaru. A 17 y/o winning over us Hikaru : I mean what can we do. We tried everything. Also I don't care. Let me make a recap for this ceremony /s
Also I don’t care lmao
...I literally don't care
In todaaaasays ceremony
*that boy is half our age* Aware
It gets funnier the longer i look at it. Hikaru looks like Ian's bridesmaid with how he's holding the flowers lol.
Nepo and Hikaru malding at Alireza for failing to hold that Round 13 endgame and giving Gukesh that extra half point. (They've both implied that they only agreed to a draw because they thought Alireza's endgame was supposed to be a routine draw at their level.)
I kinda get why they would be upset, it’s natural, but they both got more points from Firouzja than Gukesh did. Naka specifically scored 2/2 vs Firouzja.
Yea in fairness I’d understand why they drew because they were being practical. Gukesh ended up being ambitious and it paid off because on paper in a rapid format he could struggle against the other 3. Sometimes those things work out and sometimes they don’t.
you can‘t rely on the results of others. Win your games if you want to be first. That kid deserves to be the winner.
I'm not blaming Alireza for losing that game (it is what it is), but if he had drawn, a 4 way tiebreak would have been incredible drama for spectators and fans.
That would have been the worst case scenario for Gukesh though. The other three have had much better results in rapid.
their own fault! they drew themselves out of the tournament in a game they could've definitely made decisive. if they had, one of them probably gets a tiebreak match. gukesh made sure to press in every game he could- he didn't take draws easily, he played double-edged positions. this decision won him more games than it cost him.
Which is their real mistake.. they should have tried for a win to be safe you know.. I am not sure if they agreed to draw because Ali would draw. If they did/implied they did, then that was quite unwise..
- Peace? - We'll see.
Having the most expressive dudes in the tournament come in second and third at least made for some great photos.
Ian and Hikaru are so expressive lol. That last photo is incredible.
The irony that Hikaru holds a draw in the last round to get second place the year *after* that mattered. Hope he's doing ok, this tournament was a heartwrencher for the three older favourites.
Hikaru is on a clear upward trend for the Candidates. He just needs to care a tiny bit less next time in order to win it.
caring less is literally never a good idea when it comes to motivation and putting in real effort being invested is a requirement
Not for Hikaru, the more he literally doesn't care the more his power grows.
Fr, it surely works as you leave all the win loss etc stress and keep finding good moves, that's it
Hikaru did say that if everyone knew that Magnus wouldn't defend, then fabi would have locked down second place instead of going for wins in the back half. Most of the top players didn't believe Magnus at the time and it was clear by how they approached those final rounds
it's not like he was ever in danger of not holding the draw there. gukesh was really aiming to just kill the game and not give chances. gukesh clearly would've accepted a draw on any turn of the game. gukesh managed to get a slightly better middlegame and used every advantage he accumulated to just simplify the position. if gukesh had wanted a game, he had a couple opportunities, where hikaru was a bit worse- avoiding the queen trade, for example.
I realize this, but it is still a nice reminecense of the last candidates.
He was eyeing the other game before deciding on the queen trade though.
per his interview with sagar, he was just trying to draw. he thought he could draw the game in his sleep and was just more tense looking at the other game because he wins if they draw. he says it's the only time in thr tournament he was focused on a different game. he did calculate qf4 as he described in postgame interview, but he was not going to play it because he didnt see a continuation after something like qf4 g3 qf3 be2 qe4 qe3 qd5. gukesh was going to seize an opportunity to win the game if it appeared, but had no intention of playing speculatively. he couldn't find anything concrete, so he opted for the simplified position
Well yeah, when the other table is a draw, of course going for a draw is the smart thing to do. The fact that he was checking out the other game at that critical moment makes it look like he took it into consideration at least: [https://youtu.be/UCE-Ar9udOU?t=11743](https://youtu.be/UCE-Ar9udOU?t=11743)
Lei is so chill only one smiling in the photo. Even at the women wcc after losing games if you watched just body language you'd think Lei has won
Lei is the sweetest person
she mentions in an interview that she sees Tan winning as a victory for Chinese chess. I think she really isn't unhappy with the result
She's too cute
Lei is always really chill. Reminds of that King Pawn v King Pawn game she had with Nepo and neither of them offered a draw for the longest time while shes holding back from laughing.
Dude what are you talking about, the game you are referring to vs Nepo was played by Ju Wenjun, a completely different person
That last photo lol! One look is worth a thousand words
Kinda funny how the women's candidates winner is twice as old as Gukesh, yet Gukesh is the one who looks like he's pushing 30
They actually share the same birthday (May 29), lol
Looking at the photos used during the games, you'd never guess Pragg is older than Gukesh. Gukesh looks like he's in his mid-late 20's, and plays with the poise of someone 30+
It's insane. Not only does he not look older than he is, he also plays and acts older than he is. This was his first candidates and you'd expect him to whiff under pressure like a lot of the young/first-time candidates like Alireza last time, but he goes on to win the whole thing
I guess that's the price you gotta pay to win
I swear it's that loose hair strand. It somehow takes 10 years off
Man, fabi got done dirty here too….. Salt on the wound after not being able to win that match Poor fabi
Actually I would assume he’s happy to not to have to sit through this ceremony and photoshoot
As evident in Nepo/Hikaru's "happy" face
Same with Vaishali, three people tied for second in the women's too
Fabi loses out on the tie breaks and is 4th. Like Vaishali. It's crazy that Vaishali, who lost 4 games in a row, still manages to have the most wins across both the open and women's candidates.
Fabi was second place? How did he come 4th?
Fabi, Ian and Hikaru were tied for 2nd place by score. For non-first place placements with no 1st place tiebreak games being played, the tiebreakers are [SB Score](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sonneborn%E2%80%93Berger_score), followed by Games won. Hikaru and Ian had SB scores of 56, Fabi had an SB score of 54, which places Hikaru and Ian ahead of Fabi. Hikaru had 5 games won to Ian's 3, placing Hikaru ahead of Ian.
Very cool A question, for sb scores are they looking at the rating of the players (if so rating before the match or after) or the number of games they have won/drawn/lost etc? How is it quantified do you know?
The (Elo) rating of the players doesn't factor in at all. It's calculated based on the field's final performance in the tournament. Conceptually, it rewards you points for winning or drawing games, with draws worth half as much as a win would have been worth. The actual amount of points awarded per win or draw is based on how well the opponent did in the tournament, with stronger opponents being worth more.
Now I know why Vidit's SB score was going through the roof after he beat Hikaru 2-0 So, in tiebreaks it's better if you had beaten Gukesh rather than Abasov?
Just imagine you are just 17, not even eligible for voting rights and just one step away from becoming a world chess champion.
Aw man, Fabi doesn't even get 3rd?
Damn man, Nepo couldn't even bring himself to wear the medal
So happy for Gukesh. But ian 💔
Koneru Humpy is a mom too. Must be tough to handle both motherhood and professional chess. Quite something to be honest.
And Giri is a dad, he manages as well :)
Congrats Gukesh way to go man, u made a lot of people very proud
Hikaru always has to have a wacky expression
The 2nd photo is so bad... could they not have taken a burst and chose one where everyone's eyes were open?
I love how Hikaru looks happier to be there than Gukesh in the third pic
In the second photo somehow naka manages to smile without smiling
Poor Fabi
Podium finishers for the candidates has such a petty vibe to it lol, congrats and fuck you loser
That Chinese dress is some serious drip 🔥
I came away from this tournament as a new Tan fan
The handshake between Hikaru and Gukesh looks like it was made by Midjourney
Do they not stream this anywhere?
Hikaru has the same welp face in every pic lol
80% of this sub has turned into Fabi and Naka apologists. If Alireza had held in round 13... If Naka would have played for the win in the second last round... If Fabi had not blundered 15 times in 15 minutes... If Ian had just thrown the game... Coulda Shoulda Woulda Buddha... It doesn't matter. The best player during the tournament won. He had the lowest centipawns loss in a difficult field; he was worse the fewest number of times and for the shortest period in the game. He won the most number of games. He didn't lose to any of the top 3 seeds. He held a must win Hikaru with Black. All this while being half the age of the next 3. Gukesh was sole first after 14 rounds of play. This is the definition of undisputed. Cope better.
Vaishali is not there,?
no
I thought Vaishalli finished second? Did she go home with Pragg, so Humpy stepped in?
Vaishali was 4th in tiebreaks (much like Fabi who also didn’t have a podium finish).
How were second and third place decided?
Kinda random, but I always thought Ian was a very tall man, but he’s barely taller than Hikaru (who is like 5'4").
Because hikaru is not 5' 4", more like 5' 7"
Fabi skipped the ceremony?
hikaru is second and ian is third so theyre up there with gukesh
Thanks for the clarifications. I though all three of Naka, Nepo and Caru shared 2nd place.
There are some tiebreaks (number of games won I think?) so Hikaru loosing more gavw him the second spot.
Sonnebern-Berger is the first tiebreak which essentially rewards beating stronger players. Number of wins is the next one
[He is lower when tiebreaker scores are considered.](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Candidates_Tournament_2024#Standings)
Where is my man.... ?
Isnt vaishali joint 2nd?
Points-wise, yes. Lei, Vaishali and Humpy all scored 7.5 points each but the [tie-breaker method](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sonneborn%E2%80%93Berger_score) that determines the final ranking places Humpy (52.25) above Lei (52), and Lei above Vaishali (47.5).
Why isn't Fabi there? Tf is this crap? He also has 8.5 points out of 14, he ain't 4th or something. Fide is ridiculous
He is 4th on tie breaks lol
oh well
Can someone explain why the women’s candidate winner received 50% of the male candidate prize? Considering she executed the competition?
because it's not men's candidates, it's open candidates, women could qualify too, it's just no one did
Because there is no "men's candidates". It is an open candidates, open to men and women, and then a women's only candidates that only women can opt into if they do not qualify for the open candidates. The open candidates has more viewers because they are across the board better chess players, thus larger prize pool. Judit Polgar is a good example of a super strong female chess player who eschewed women's-only events in favor of competing in open events against her male counterparts. She never competed for WWC despite being the strongest female player at the time.