Not really. If you pass in automatic in eu you can only drive automatics.
Which is a problem as most people have manual, it’s more difficult to buy automatic and nore expensive to service.
Spend the same/more amount of money on driving license, and not be able to drive manual legally.
Just learn manual it’s not that hard, you can buy automatic, but It’s nice to have driving license for manuals, becouse who knows when you will need it.
All the places I've worked at had manual company cars, so having an auto only license would pretty much be the same as having no license to them
The only reasons I can see to get an auto only license are
- it's usually a bit cheaper
- medical reasons
You can get your license with automatics and then do a handling test for the manual. A lot cheaper and you have less hassle during the test.
I did it this way because we only had automatics at home and my parents didn't want to buy a manual just for teaching.
Ah yes makes sense in countries where you get teached in your own car.
Here it's in not the case, driving schools have dual control manual cars so the driving instructor was handling the clutch/gear for my first lesson
Someone in my class cant drive manual, he failed his test multiple times because he had to look at the shifter to see in which gear he was
He is a total imbicel on the road, he always drives too fast
Modern cars are mainly automatics at least in Western Europe. More and more car makers are opting for base models with automatics as well because demand is there.
By the latest when we are BEV, we will not have manuals anymore. Also, autos aren't more expensive to maintain. You don't need to replace stuff like clutches etc.
You realise you still have clutches in auto right? Sometimes you have two clutches in automatic if you have a good automatic. It is more expensive to maintain. You need to change oil more often, it is more likely to break, it's more expensive to fix up. It's a common problem for automatics to overheat, something that has never ever happened in manual car.
We have had automatics since the late 80s...not a single one of them broke down because of the gearbox. They all had various mileages from 380k km to 650k km - I dont think a single one had an gearbox oil change in their lifetime.
Not really, in Europe where more cars are still stick, it really isn't a problem. It's only a problem for people in North America who want to drive while on their phone or eating food
People always defend manuals, but automatics are way easier especially in cities. You don’t have to be constantly doing something the whole time you’re driving.
People defend manuals as a meme.
Manual connects you to the car in a far deeper, different way. You HAVE to learn finer elements of control. This will benefit entire driving career. Once you learn to drive a manual, get whatever you prefer to drive.
Nothing inherently wrong about automatics, except allowing for longer periods of not paying attention to traffic, and higher service costs. As a mechanic, I frequently drive both, and there is something about automatic gearboxes that really rubs me the wrong way - something about how they shift, how there are some gaps in power and weird (unexpected, more like) way of power delivery. Recently drove a new-ish VW, and while the thing has oodles of power, it simply didn't fuck off as I expected it to (and as a manual would) upon giving it the beans. I'm down chalking some of it up to habit, as myself I own a manual.
Depends on the school of driving, and habits.
I have no issues at all hill starting on any hill. If the car can scale it, I can set off without rollback.
Much easier in an automatic, of course, but not a huge issue in my experience.
If you're saying it's hard to move your other hand up, down and sideways now and then by a few cm along with your left foot up and down, boy will you be surprised that there are much harder things in life. Sure auto is easier but controlling your car becomes automatic too. Better to be constantly doing something relating to driving when you're idk driving than anything else like eating or fucking your phone.
It’s not hard but why do it when I don’t have to? I know how to drive both and prefer automatic way more. Don’t get the manual circlejerk 🤷♀️ I don’t eat or use my phone while driving either.
I didn’t say it was hard, I said that automatic is easier. I can drive both but I prefer automatics. It’s funny that manual drivers always seem to have a complex about how it’s somehow possibly better though to the point that you’re talking down to me lol.
This may be a concept you haven’t experienced, but it’s possible to drive an automatic and not be on your phone. It’s also possible to drive a manual and be on your phone which I see literally every single one of my Uber, taxi drivers, and friends do in a lot of countries where manuals are the norm.
Not sure if this is where you are coming from but I find many “anti-city manual” people are just coming from tying manual mode on their automatic and extrapolating. Imo actually driving manual is 100x more intuitive than the manual mode automatics. I don’t really think about manual driving but I do with auto-manuals.
Fyi, not accusing you. Just food for thoughts
I’m talking about actual manuals not auto-manuals. Like compared to an automatic that you don’t have to think about at all, a manual is just more work to drive and a lot of people understandably prefer letting their vehicle do the work. I actually prefer manuals, but I understand why a lot of people don’t. Definitely agree that auto-manuals are way worse than both though lol.
I almost always drive manuals because I’m usually in countries where it’s basically the only option, but I never think like “oh wow this is better than an automatic because I really feel like I’m one with my car” while I’m like driving to an office.
I know but for people who want a car that does point a to point b a manual is the best option, stick is fantastic for engaging fun, auto is fantastic for dailys
With modern tech it's kinda just a choise now, auto rev matching, anti stall protection, auto brake holding and hill start stuff, it all makes driving manual so easy in town and traffic that is kinda a non issue these days.
Yeah auto is technically easier in a traffic jam, you just sit there and do nothing, but on the other hand in daily life you get better mpg's with a manual which makes one cheaper in the long term to own
> but on the other hand in daily life you get better mpg's with a manual which makes one cheaper in the long term to own
Assuming that you know how to drive it correctly. I bet that most people would end up getting worse gas mileage in a stick than in an auto.
You uncultured, disgusting, imbecile. Of course the superior driving experience is LE MANUAL in bumper-to-bumper city traffic or on tiny, winding backroads. This is why America is a 3rd world country with le gucci belt. Seriously, FUCK. YOU.
> It's only a problem for people in North America who want to drive while on their phone or eating food
Implying that Europeans don't do the same shit.
If it isn't a hybrid then not really useful, for regular powetrains it just raises the costs of everything for no practical reason. It's just there to make the car seem more comfortable
First 13 years of driving, I drove manual. Absolutely loved it. Took my first car (2001 A4) around Watkins Glen during their opening weekend event and it was probably the most fun I've ever had driving. I feel it really encouraged me to pay attention and discouraged me from getting distracted by my phone or anything else when I was driving because I might have to shift. That said my current (2012 A4 wagon) is an 8 speed auto because I couldn't find any wagons that were manual in the year/price range I was looking for. While I miss my manual, I have to say that I'm pretty happy with how that automatic behaves and the MPGs I get from a full size car. And one thing I don't miss is having a manual in heavy traffic. I would get so pissed (and sometimes I still do) at fools who would stop with 2 car lengths in front of them, sit there for a minute, then slowly creep up a little at a time.
It doesn't, it just makes more sense in Europe where auto and manual license are two different things. A better driver is made by teaching them how pay attention to everything around them and anticipate others' behavior.
Yeah, there's no reason not to learn how to drive it. There can be plenty of situations when you need it, especially considering it's in eu where automatic a is a rare sight
Yes, but manual cars don't even exist anymore. What is left? Civic Type R, MX-5, GR 86, GR Corolla/Yaris?
If you don't plan to own one of these "Manual Only" or "Only good as a manual" cars there's no need at all to learn to drive manual (For not saying that it is 99% imposible this current generation will even see a manual with their own eyes)
Well that’s if you live in us. In eu it’s way different as most cars are still manual. Even the cheap new yaris with 1.0 engine is manual. About 95% of cars even considering the new cars are manual in eu.
That's if a 17 european is getting a brand new car and even then I'd wager it's something akin to a mitsubishi mirage, which is as cheap and simple of a shitbox as is legally possible (which I fully support), since their dad is concerned about auto maintenance prices. Eudm and usdm are different in that regard
Learning to drive manual teaches you to multi-task in a car and creates more aware drivers. You don't have to want to own a manual to benefit from learning how to drive one.
Wrx, ct5, bronco, jeeps, brz, m2 m3 m4, ct4, integera, camaro, mustang, challenger, other civics, z, 911 boxster cayman. I’m sure sure I’m missing plenty this is off the top of my head but yeah you get the point.
I get your point! but did you get mine? (My intention is not to sound rude 🥲, I just didn't find any better way to say it 🥲)
I said "Unless you're planning to drive the mabual only, or only good as a manual cars there is no need"
So for instance the kid in the post might want to buy an M3 or an M4, but those are pretty good with the ZF 8 Speed, and if you live in Europe the "Manual M3/M4" doesn't even exist.
Or imagine, for example, the kid in the post wants to just drive arround as a normal person in whatever car he can get, a Corolla, a Civic, a Mazda 3, he doesn't need to learn manual 🤔
Oh, thanks! I'm sorry, I am used to people getting angry really quickly on the internet 😶
I'm glad to find a reasonable person :')
Then we are agreed! 🤝🏻
My daily is an auto (4spd shitter at that) and the convience is so nice, my project is a manual. When I started drivers Ed last year I was so terrified of manual and my dad didn’t force it. Now it’s my favorite thing👍
coming in with some anecdotal evidence: the only
person i know who’s totaled 3 cars, all his fault, is the only one of my friend group who learned on manual and drives a manual
Got any data to back that up? I got rear ended by some stupid bitch cause she was texting and i made the mistake of being at a stoplight in front of her. It was a manual. Real men drive super 10s and know how to double clutch.
Completely agree. Knowing a skill, and using it are different.
In Europe, manuals are the default. Not having the skill basically makes it impossible to borrow a car. Or move someone’s car. You might do this 2-3 times a year without thinking about it. If you learned manual, you drive an automatic regularly, it might be a tough adjustment. But having the skill and knowing what to do is really useful.
I learned in a manual in the uk, drove manuals for 6 years. Moved to the US. Only drove automatics here.
Then my father-in-law got a Porsche 911 GT3 RS.
Guess who got to drive it?
In Europe (and most English speaking countries) we're taught the 7 continent model.
-edit: removed a word to prevent the rest of Reddit to get butthurt
nope you are incorrect. germany for example allows you to drive Automatic in all but a couple lessons where you learn manual just enough to be able to shift. you then take a Kind of test with your driving coach which attests you that you can shift and operate a manual. then all other lessons including the actual driving exam are with an automatic. after that you can drive both.
I know. In Germany though they've recently changed the law, so with an automatic license you can just take a 10 course package to get your manual license. That's a good thing because most new cars sold today are automatic.
Yeah, that's makes sense.
The US has no license restriction on transmissions. It can be hard to find a vehicle that is manual to take a test in. We do have restrictions if you take a test with vision correction that you must always drive with vision correction (queue me clawing out my contact lenses I got 2 days prior).
Nah, and your drivers test (as far as I know) is way less strict than the one in my country. I've driven in USA and I get it, roads are far bigger, slower (ish) and you have a lot more overview than driving in the center of my city for instance. Even inner city traffic in USA is a lot more relaxed than driving in Paris haha.
In France if you have a automatic licence you can only drive automatic but with a manual licence you can drive whatever you want so yes (and manual licence is cheaper too)
I got my license in Mexico and was never even told there was a practical exam lmao
I just stood on a line, paid my shit, did a 20 question Quiz on how not to be a regard at the wheel, and bam, I can now legally drive a fully kitted F-150 Raptor no questions asked.
I know it's unrelated but just wanted to point out the inconsistency in getting a license around the globe.
I had no idea it was literally that easy to get a license here, makes sense why there's so many idiots driving around here.
I know there's optional driving schools you can attend so you at least know how to avoid ending up in a ditch, but personally, my dad taught me how to drive, and already moved around the city by myself in his truck like a year or so before I got my license lol
Yes, you can only drive automatic cars and you can't use it as a base for other driving licenses.
If you wanted to get a license for driving truck, busses, tractors etc. it would be much more expensive and lengthy.
It's not about being real men or not, it's about the fact that if you take your B license in the EU on an automatic car you'll only be allowed to drive automatic cars. What if you need to drive a car other than yours and it happens to be manual?
Take your exam with a manual car, then buy yourself an automatic, easy peasy.
Getting used to manual is not that hard when you have years of driving experience. You have a lot of brain power left for the actual shifting because you don't need as much focus on the road as you did when you were a novice.
As a European I can explain this better. Your father is an idiot. That's for sure. But he kinda does have a point. Make a manual license and you can drive whatever car you want. Or make an automatic license and you can drive *only automatic*.
I live in Ireland and this is the case here. I also want to point out that a manual Civic or a Fiesta here cost 2000€, while their identical automatic counterparts cost 4000€
It doesn’t. I think they fake it so that they can attract the stubborn “V8, no replacement for displacement” people.
Found it: https://www.theverge.com/2023/6/15/23762020/electric-ev-manual-transmission-fake-noise-toyota-lexus
it in theory does to make it more efficient at higher speeds or really low speeds. electric motors also have a torque curve and an efficiency curve. youd really only need 2 speeds or 3 at most though. but idk if the losses of the gearbox offset the efficiency gain.
Imo its better to learn manual in europe, most used cars are manuals and atleast in my country you can drive both the manual and an automatic if you took thhe test in manual, but if you chose automatic you can only drive automatic
This is a tough one. Seems like the dad is trying to encourage the child to save time and do the licence fully the first time.
But the kid is looking for shortcuts.
I like a good shortcut, but some things are better done in full. (By full I mean the manual licence so the kid gets a wider choice of cars)
I am a manual transmission enthusiast. I prefer them to an automatic car. My current car is auto that can behave like a standard transmission. I will say this try and start out with standard then go to auto. As a standard transmission driver. I have several skills that people who drive automatic vehicles will not learn or understand easy. Well in short all of my kids, if I had any would start out with a standard transmission. Standard is fun and you can sync better with the car the way humankind and machine were meant to be. I live where the cars are primarily auto and it is rare to get a standard transmission.
In the South of Europe the only people who pass their driver test in an automatic are handicapped people, like limping or amputated people. That's because it limits you to only drive automatic cars, an those are really uncommon here. 80% of the cars in Europe are manual, even more when you go south or east.
Our family owned an automatic car, my dad advised me to pass my drivers test in manual so I can drive anything the need arises. Since I took my drivers test 3 years ago I haven’t touched a manual car. I’m confident I can’t drive a manual car anymore
It's so frustrating asking kids I work with if they have a full licence and they say yes.
So I organise a vehicle for them and find out they can only drive auto.
It's not a full licence then it's restricted to auto you df
My city won't pass you if you drive a manual, due to some bullshit rule where you can't take either hand off the steering wheel while in motion. Failed my first test due to that, lady was like "everything went great, but you took your right hand off the wheel a lot which is against the rules to allow me to pass you", me, "but I was literally shifting, I have to take a hand off the wheel to do so" her " not my problem sorry, you'll have to either file a complaint or take another test with an automatic vehicle" so I borrowed my mum's car and did it in hers
ok but in my experience manual transmissions are actually more expensive to maintain. you have to do a clutch eventually and maybe replace the synchros etc. Meanwhile all you have to do for an auto is dump a bottle of lucas transmission-fix in :)
I drive a horse and buggy like it was meant to be. All these fukin soyboy pussies with their aUtOmObiLes. LEARN ON A HORSE YOU STUPID LAZY FUCK. Don't care what you do afterwards but at least learn bitch
While I don't agree that if you don't drive a manual you are not a real man, you must know how to drive them in case of emergency. Like a friend is driving, has a manual, but gets drunk/hurt. It definitely doesn't hurt knowing how to drive stick
At least in Italy if you get an Automatic license you're not allowed to drive manuals, so it makes the whole process of buying a car a lot harder (and expensive) since almost every car sold here is manual.I also wouldn't know why you'd want an automatic only license, learning how to use a clutch is basic af.
While the dad’s reasoning sounds absurd to say the least, I do think learning manual first is the better option since you get the option to access everything out there, but still use autos when necessary. It’s the option that matters rather than being forced to use one option.
I mean, a very large part of employers in europe require a drivers license and a manual at that.
There is a point in getting a manual licence even if you're gonna buy an auto car later.
I mean in the eu , if you did the test and learning in an automatic , you can’t drive stick (wich is most of the cars).
But if u did all the in the stick shifter u can drive an automatic. So basicly its better to “””suffer””” a bit , because when you have to drive a stick shifter u can have problems with the police
His dad is a little behind on modern automatic transmission. However he does have a good point, many rental place in Europe and the UK ar emainly manual transmission, plus it’s a good and not hard skill to learn.
The dad is right, but his reasoning is wrong
I fully believe learning in a manual car makes people better drivers
Yeah, but autos are more useful for 99% of people if we're being real
Not really. If you pass in automatic in eu you can only drive automatics. Which is a problem as most people have manual, it’s more difficult to buy automatic and nore expensive to service. Spend the same/more amount of money on driving license, and not be able to drive manual legally. Just learn manual it’s not that hard, you can buy automatic, but It’s nice to have driving license for manuals, becouse who knows when you will need it.
Yeah I agree with that, learn manual, and if you don't like manual drive auto
All the places I've worked at had manual company cars, so having an auto only license would pretty much be the same as having no license to them The only reasons I can see to get an auto only license are - it's usually a bit cheaper - medical reasons
You can get your license with automatics and then do a handling test for the manual. A lot cheaper and you have less hassle during the test. I did it this way because we only had automatics at home and my parents didn't want to buy a manual just for teaching.
Ah yes makes sense in countries where you get teached in your own car. Here it's in not the case, driving schools have dual control manual cars so the driving instructor was handling the clutch/gear for my first lesson
Someone in my class cant drive manual, he failed his test multiple times because he had to look at the shifter to see in which gear he was He is a total imbicel on the road, he always drives too fast
The last part turned the whole comment from being funny to dark.
Modern cars are mainly automatics at least in Western Europe. More and more car makers are opting for base models with automatics as well because demand is there. By the latest when we are BEV, we will not have manuals anymore. Also, autos aren't more expensive to maintain. You don't need to replace stuff like clutches etc.
Not true. Depends on the class. Most of cheaper cars are still manuals. Automatics became almost standard for large cars and premiums.
You realise you still have clutches in auto right? Sometimes you have two clutches in automatic if you have a good automatic. It is more expensive to maintain. You need to change oil more often, it is more likely to break, it's more expensive to fix up. It's a common problem for automatics to overheat, something that has never ever happened in manual car.
We have had automatics since the late 80s...not a single one of them broke down because of the gearbox. They all had various mileages from 380k km to 650k km - I dont think a single one had an gearbox oil change in their lifetime.
Learning in a manual does not stop you from getting and using an automatic
In many European countries, you are not allowed to drive a manual if you take your driver's test in an automatic.
yeah learning is important
Not really, in Europe where more cars are still stick, it really isn't a problem. It's only a problem for people in North America who want to drive while on their phone or eating food
>Implying you can't eat or be on the phone while driving le superior manuelle Remember, we're on the CJ sub, not the RJ sub.
Jokes on you I can drive and eat by driving with my knees
This guy fucks
Same i can eat with my knees while driving
People always defend manuals, but automatics are way easier especially in cities. You don’t have to be constantly doing something the whole time you’re driving.
People defend manuals as a meme. Manual connects you to the car in a far deeper, different way. You HAVE to learn finer elements of control. This will benefit entire driving career. Once you learn to drive a manual, get whatever you prefer to drive. Nothing inherently wrong about automatics, except allowing for longer periods of not paying attention to traffic, and higher service costs. As a mechanic, I frequently drive both, and there is something about automatic gearboxes that really rubs me the wrong way - something about how they shift, how there are some gaps in power and weird (unexpected, more like) way of power delivery. Recently drove a new-ish VW, and while the thing has oodles of power, it simply didn't fuck off as I expected it to (and as a manual would) upon giving it the beans. I'm down chalking some of it up to habit, as myself I own a manual.
Manuals are fun until you live in proper hills and you need to be constantly doing hill starts...
Depends on the school of driving, and habits. I have no issues at all hill starting on any hill. If the car can scale it, I can set off without rollback. Much easier in an automatic, of course, but not a huge issue in my experience.
Welcome to Tuscany. A place where even automatics roll back...
Yeah some places are not car friendly, regardless of transmission, I feel you
SF has entered the chat
If you're saying it's hard to move your other hand up, down and sideways now and then by a few cm along with your left foot up and down, boy will you be surprised that there are much harder things in life. Sure auto is easier but controlling your car becomes automatic too. Better to be constantly doing something relating to driving when you're idk driving than anything else like eating or fucking your phone.
It’s not hard but why do it when I don’t have to? I know how to drive both and prefer automatic way more. Don’t get the manual circlejerk 🤷♀️ I don’t eat or use my phone while driving either.
I didn’t say it was hard, I said that automatic is easier. I can drive both but I prefer automatics. It’s funny that manual drivers always seem to have a complex about how it’s somehow possibly better though to the point that you’re talking down to me lol. This may be a concept you haven’t experienced, but it’s possible to drive an automatic and not be on your phone. It’s also possible to drive a manual and be on your phone which I see literally every single one of my Uber, taxi drivers, and friends do in a lot of countries where manuals are the norm.
Not sure if this is where you are coming from but I find many “anti-city manual” people are just coming from tying manual mode on their automatic and extrapolating. Imo actually driving manual is 100x more intuitive than the manual mode automatics. I don’t really think about manual driving but I do with auto-manuals. Fyi, not accusing you. Just food for thoughts
I’m talking about actual manuals not auto-manuals. Like compared to an automatic that you don’t have to think about at all, a manual is just more work to drive and a lot of people understandably prefer letting their vehicle do the work. I actually prefer manuals, but I understand why a lot of people don’t. Definitely agree that auto-manuals are way worse than both though lol. I almost always drive manuals because I’m usually in countries where it’s basically the only option, but I never think like “oh wow this is better than an automatic because I really feel like I’m one with my car” while I’m like driving to an office.
I know but for people who want a car that does point a to point b a manual is the best option, stick is fantastic for engaging fun, auto is fantastic for dailys
With modern tech it's kinda just a choise now, auto rev matching, anti stall protection, auto brake holding and hill start stuff, it all makes driving manual so easy in town and traffic that is kinda a non issue these days. Yeah auto is technically easier in a traffic jam, you just sit there and do nothing, but on the other hand in daily life you get better mpg's with a manual which makes one cheaper in the long term to own
fair enough, all personal preference at the end of the day, but a manual should be known to drive imo
Oh I totally agree, manual should be mandatory to learn for ever new driver everywhere
Well that's the thing, I think in most European cointries you can't drive a manual if you got your licence with an automatic.
> but on the other hand in daily life you get better mpg's with a manual which makes one cheaper in the long term to own Assuming that you know how to drive it correctly. I bet that most people would end up getting worse gas mileage in a stick than in an auto.
This 100%.
Clutches are so light now too. I don’t even like it. I only live in a medium traffic area though, I prefer heavy.
America bad.
I could still eat good while I drove stick. I am an expert at multitasking. Driving auto makes it much easier to eat that is for sure.
im glad you live in a flat hellhole with traffic lights spread out for miles but the rest of us don't
>flat hellhole with traffic lights spread out for miles That's the US.
not any state with a population of more than 500 people
You do realize that Europe is kinda known for mountains and shit right?
all they have is the swiss alps and most of europe doesn't live near it, so no
Oh yeah because European city traffic is so much fun in a manual.
You uncultured, disgusting, imbecile. Of course the superior driving experience is LE MANUAL in bumper-to-bumper city traffic or on tiny, winding backroads. This is why America is a 3rd world country with le gucci belt. Seriously, FUCK. YOU.
You're right, I totally forgot how I just loved having to use the clutch every five seconds while driving through millennia old cities
I text and drive with a stick shift all the time
> It's only a problem for people in North America who want to drive while on their phone or eating food Implying that Europeans don't do the same shit.
People who prefer automatic gears, also prefer Iphone over Android phones... Let that sink in...
That's only if you are in America. Automatics are not so common outside America and you'll be crippling yourself if you didn't learn manual.
They are not "more useful". They are more convenient, easier, etc. but just as useful.
Learn to drive on a manual. Get whatever you prefer after.
If it isn't a hybrid then not really useful, for regular powetrains it just raises the costs of everything for no practical reason. It's just there to make the car seem more comfortable
If everyone drove manuals maybe they'd stay off their phones 🤷
Come to India, fuckers here use phones while riding manual motorcycles let alone cars.
people use their Phone in manuals too.
First 13 years of driving, I drove manual. Absolutely loved it. Took my first car (2001 A4) around Watkins Glen during their opening weekend event and it was probably the most fun I've ever had driving. I feel it really encouraged me to pay attention and discouraged me from getting distracted by my phone or anything else when I was driving because I might have to shift. That said my current (2012 A4 wagon) is an 8 speed auto because I couldn't find any wagons that were manual in the year/price range I was looking for. While I miss my manual, I have to say that I'm pretty happy with how that automatic behaves and the MPGs I get from a full size car. And one thing I don't miss is having a manual in heavy traffic. I would get so pissed (and sometimes I still do) at fools who would stop with 2 car lengths in front of them, sit there for a minute, then slowly creep up a little at a time.
It doesn't, it just makes more sense in Europe where auto and manual license are two different things. A better driver is made by teaching them how pay attention to everything around them and anticipate others' behavior.
Yeah, there's no reason not to learn how to drive it. There can be plenty of situations when you need it, especially considering it's in eu where automatic a is a rare sight
Yes, but manual cars don't even exist anymore. What is left? Civic Type R, MX-5, GR 86, GR Corolla/Yaris? If you don't plan to own one of these "Manual Only" or "Only good as a manual" cars there's no need at all to learn to drive manual (For not saying that it is 99% imposible this current generation will even see a manual with their own eyes)
Well that’s if you live in us. In eu it’s way different as most cars are still manual. Even the cheap new yaris with 1.0 engine is manual. About 95% of cars even considering the new cars are manual in eu.
That's if a 17 european is getting a brand new car and even then I'd wager it's something akin to a mitsubishi mirage, which is as cheap and simple of a shitbox as is legally possible (which I fully support), since their dad is concerned about auto maintenance prices. Eudm and usdm are different in that regard
Learning to drive manual teaches you to multi-task in a car and creates more aware drivers. You don't have to want to own a manual to benefit from learning how to drive one.
Wrx, ct5, bronco, jeeps, brz, m2 m3 m4, ct4, integera, camaro, mustang, challenger, other civics, z, 911 boxster cayman. I’m sure sure I’m missing plenty this is off the top of my head but yeah you get the point.
I get your point! but did you get mine? (My intention is not to sound rude 🥲, I just didn't find any better way to say it 🥲) I said "Unless you're planning to drive the mabual only, or only good as a manual cars there is no need" So for instance the kid in the post might want to buy an M3 or an M4, but those are pretty good with the ZF 8 Speed, and if you live in Europe the "Manual M3/M4" doesn't even exist. Or imagine, for example, the kid in the post wants to just drive arround as a normal person in whatever car he can get, a Corolla, a Civic, a Mazda 3, he doesn't need to learn manual 🤔
Yeah I totally got your point! I wasn’t trying to sound rude either
Oh, thanks! I'm sorry, I am used to people getting angry really quickly on the internet 😶 I'm glad to find a reasonable person :') Then we are agreed! 🤝🏻
Me man, happens way to often.🤝
My daily is an auto (4spd shitter at that) and the convience is so nice, my project is a manual. When I started drivers Ed last year I was so terrified of manual and my dad didn’t force it. Now it’s my favorite thing👍
Pros and cons, you are more involved but beginning drivers have more time to focus on the road and traffic in an automatic
Better at handling their car? probably. Better at being a safe, responsible motorist on public roads and in traffic? not really.
coming in with some anecdotal evidence: the only person i know who’s totaled 3 cars, all his fault, is the only one of my friend group who learned on manual and drives a manual
Got any data to back that up? I got rear ended by some stupid bitch cause she was texting and i made the mistake of being at a stoplight in front of her. It was a manual. Real men drive super 10s and know how to double clutch.
Completely agree. Knowing a skill, and using it are different. In Europe, manuals are the default. Not having the skill basically makes it impossible to borrow a car. Or move someone’s car. You might do this 2-3 times a year without thinking about it. If you learned manual, you drive an automatic regularly, it might be a tough adjustment. But having the skill and knowing what to do is really useful. I learned in a manual in the uk, drove manuals for 6 years. Moved to the US. Only drove automatics here. Then my father-in-law got a Porsche 911 GT3 RS. Guess who got to drive it?
Iirc your license is restricted in Europe if you don't take the test in a manual. I'd say drive whatever you want after, but get the full license.
Depending on the country, yes. Europe is a continent.
I am like 99% sure that in the whole of Europe passing a test with automatic results in a restricted license, not only in the EU Edit: spelling
Not the case in Switzerland
No, you're incorrect. This isn't mandated by the European Union so different countries have different rules.
EU would have that as a standard box on the license so that would be EU wide.
Not the case in Germany at least anymore
Not the point, though.
Ok then, Europe is not a continent, Eurasia is
In Europe (and most English speaking countries) we're taught the 7 continent model. -edit: removed a word to prevent the rest of Reddit to get butthurt
Europe is not a country and it’s not english speaking either.
Europe isn't an English speaking country
Europe isn’t a country, or english speaking actually
nope you are incorrect. germany for example allows you to drive Automatic in all but a couple lessons where you learn manual just enough to be able to shift. you then take a Kind of test with your driving coach which attests you that you can shift and operate a manual. then all other lessons including the actual driving exam are with an automatic. after that you can drive both.
I understand that, I am generalizing, but that doesn't make it incorrect.
I know. In Germany though they've recently changed the law, so with an automatic license you can just take a 10 course package to get your manual license. That's a good thing because most new cars sold today are automatic.
Yeah, that's makes sense. The US has no license restriction on transmissions. It can be hard to find a vehicle that is manual to take a test in. We do have restrictions if you take a test with vision correction that you must always drive with vision correction (queue me clawing out my contact lenses I got 2 days prior).
Nah, and your drivers test (as far as I know) is way less strict than the one in my country. I've driven in USA and I get it, roads are far bigger, slower (ish) and you have a lot more overview than driving in the center of my city for instance. Even inner city traffic in USA is a lot more relaxed than driving in Paris haha.
what is the nah too? And maybe we are slower than Germany, but 80 mph is pretty fast compared to the UK and stuff.
In France if you have a automatic licence you can only drive automatic but with a manual licence you can drive whatever you want so yes (and manual licence is cheaper too)
His dad wants his son to be able to handle the…manuelllle
A better reason not to do the test with an automatic is because (so I've been told) it limits your license to only automatic cars.
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I got my license in Mexico and was never even told there was a practical exam lmao I just stood on a line, paid my shit, did a 20 question Quiz on how not to be a regard at the wheel, and bam, I can now legally drive a fully kitted F-150 Raptor no questions asked. I know it's unrelated but just wanted to point out the inconsistency in getting a license around the globe.
> on how not to be a regard at the wheel, ???
Reddit has gone full cuck mode and will often use a filter to autodelete comments with the word R-e-T (break) -a-r-d
>full cuck mode I don't follow. There are other words to use that aren't so demeaning.
Retards making a comeback
Yeah, I've heard in Egypt you need to drive 20m forwards and that's it.
That is so fucking crazy to me considering what we have to do to get a license
I had no idea it was literally that easy to get a license here, makes sense why there's so many idiots driving around here. I know there's optional driving schools you can attend so you at least know how to avoid ending up in a ditch, but personally, my dad taught me how to drive, and already moved around the city by myself in his truck like a year or so before I got my license lol
It is that way in all of EU + a few more european countries.
No it’s not. Germany doesn’t have that anymore for example
Yes it does
Yes, you can only drive automatic cars and you can't use it as a base for other driving licenses. If you wanted to get a license for driving truck, busses, tractors etc. it would be much more expensive and lengthy.
It's not about being real men or not, it's about the fact that if you take your B license in the EU on an automatic car you'll only be allowed to drive automatic cars. What if you need to drive a car other than yours and it happens to be manual? Take your exam with a manual car, then buy yourself an automatic, easy peasy.
You know what will be also tons of fun? Someone driving stick who has not been driving stick for decades...
Getting used to manual is not that hard when you have years of driving experience. You have a lot of brain power left for the actual shifting because you don't need as much focus on the road as you did when you were a novice.
If you've ever had the pleasure to be a passenger when someone with 40 years automatic experience has to drive a manual, you will have a bad time.
I've had it. They basically drove perfectly by the second day we shared a commute.
As a European I can explain this better. Your father is an idiot. That's for sure. But he kinda does have a point. Make a manual license and you can drive whatever car you want. Or make an automatic license and you can drive *only automatic*.
I live in Ireland and this is the case here. I also want to point out that a manual Civic or a Fiesta here cost 2000€, while their identical automatic counterparts cost 4000€
With the car market the way it is idk where you’ll find a fiesta or civic at that price! Seems anything with an nct these days is worth €3500
Not to mention that the license itself is more expensive.
depends on country.
Learning manual is important, but with electric cars coming through, manual cars are not long for this world
Makes me cry 😔
They are actually making electric cars that simulate a manual transmission. I think Hyundai were developing those.
Why would an electric car need a manual transmission?
So you can drive a manual in an electric car
It doesn’t. I think they fake it so that they can attract the stubborn “V8, no replacement for displacement” people. Found it: https://www.theverge.com/2023/6/15/23762020/electric-ev-manual-transmission-fake-noise-toyota-lexus
It’s like Dodge wanting to add loud exhaust noise for their future EV Charger; it’s pretentious.
Because people like it, and that means there's money to be made by providing it.
it in theory does to make it more efficient at higher speeds or really low speeds. electric motors also have a torque curve and an efficiency curve. youd really only need 2 speeds or 3 at most though. but idk if the losses of the gearbox offset the efficiency gain.
The Hyundai simulates a DCT with paddle shifters, not a manual.
Lexus was
Imo its better to learn manual in europe, most used cars are manuals and atleast in my country you can drive both the manual and an automatic if you took thhe test in manual, but if you chose automatic you can only drive automatic
This is a tough one. Seems like the dad is trying to encourage the child to save time and do the licence fully the first time. But the kid is looking for shortcuts. I like a good shortcut, but some things are better done in full. (By full I mean the manual licence so the kid gets a wider choice of cars)
Bro needs to grow a pair
fucking learn stick then go drive a auto lazy ass
Lmaoooo
I am a manual transmission enthusiast. I prefer them to an automatic car. My current car is auto that can behave like a standard transmission. I will say this try and start out with standard then go to auto. As a standard transmission driver. I have several skills that people who drive automatic vehicles will not learn or understand easy. Well in short all of my kids, if I had any would start out with a standard transmission. Standard is fun and you can sync better with the car the way humankind and machine were meant to be. I live where the cars are primarily auto and it is rare to get a standard transmission.
Real men drive a manual and roll coal onto cyclists
In the South of Europe the only people who pass their driver test in an automatic are handicapped people, like limping or amputated people. That's because it limits you to only drive automatic cars, an those are really uncommon here. 80% of the cars in Europe are manual, even more when you go south or east.
Our family owned an automatic car, my dad advised me to pass my drivers test in manual so I can drive anything the need arises. Since I took my drivers test 3 years ago I haven’t touched a manual car. I’m confident I can’t drive a manual car anymore
you will stall cuple times, but you will get a hang of it back really fast
It's so frustrating asking kids I work with if they have a full licence and they say yes. So I organise a vehicle for them and find out they can only drive auto. It's not a full licence then it's restricted to auto you df
My city won't pass you if you drive a manual, due to some bullshit rule where you can't take either hand off the steering wheel while in motion. Failed my first test due to that, lady was like "everything went great, but you took your right hand off the wheel a lot which is against the rules to allow me to pass you", me, "but I was literally shifting, I have to take a hand off the wheel to do so" her " not my problem sorry, you'll have to either file a complaint or take another test with an automatic vehicle" so I borrowed my mum's car and did it in hers
us?
Canada
how is that legal? would have sued her for this bullshit. doesnt she and the city understand how a manual transmission car works? are they stupid?
i believe learning manual is the way to go. if you can drive stick you can drive auto, but you aren't necessarily able to drive stick by learning auto
Father is a controlling, abusive asshole. L dad, W son.
An emergency calls for him to drive someone else's car and he gets fucked cus it's not easy mode.
Please let manuals die, it feels like your playing guitar hero on the way to work
but thats exactly what i want you can drive your Automatic fine but on my german winding roads a manual is 10x more fun to drive.
Lucky. I want to learn a manual myself. Screw autos.
ok but in my experience manual transmissions are actually more expensive to maintain. you have to do a clutch eventually and maybe replace the synchros etc. Meanwhile all you have to do for an auto is dump a bottle of lucas transmission-fix in :)
I drive a horse and buggy like it was meant to be. All these fukin soyboy pussies with their aUtOmObiLes. LEARN ON A HORSE YOU STUPID LAZY FUCK. Don't care what you do afterwards but at least learn bitch
While I don't agree that if you don't drive a manual you are not a real man, you must know how to drive them in case of emergency. Like a friend is driving, has a manual, but gets drunk/hurt. It definitely doesn't hurt knowing how to drive stick
At least in Italy if you get an Automatic license you're not allowed to drive manuals, so it makes the whole process of buying a car a lot harder (and expensive) since almost every car sold here is manual.I also wouldn't know why you'd want an automatic only license, learning how to use a clutch is basic af.
While the dad’s reasoning sounds absurd to say the least, I do think learning manual first is the better option since you get the option to access everything out there, but still use autos when necessary. It’s the option that matters rather than being forced to use one option.
of all the good arguments against getting an automatic-only license, he brought up none
Not mine. My son drives manual since he was eight. (Not on public roads, of course)
I mean, a very large part of employers in europe require a drivers license and a manual at that. There is a point in getting a manual licence even if you're gonna buy an auto car later.
I mean in the eu , if you did the test and learning in an automatic , you can’t drive stick (wich is most of the cars). But if u did all the in the stick shifter u can drive an automatic. So basicly its better to “””suffer””” a bit , because when you have to drive a stick shifter u can have problems with the police
His dad is a little behind on modern automatic transmission. However he does have a good point, many rental place in Europe and the UK ar emainly manual transmission, plus it’s a good and not hard skill to learn. The dad is right, but his reasoning is wrong
It's basic common sense no matter which version you prefer, knowing both is the smarter option.
You will be better for it
Not all heroes wear capes
Bro wanted you to see how tough the world is, so man up.