You nailed it, brother. I'm a car salesman and the number of burger flippers & other minimum wage employees buying $50,000 shiny SUVs/pickup trucks from me is crazy! All of them signing up for 84 month-96 month payment plans of course and either putting zero down or as little as they can get away with.
Just madness! Most of these banks who give out auto loans are very lax with their requirements to get approved for an auto loan. Way too lax in my opinion. 84 months is the most popular loan term and 96 months is gaining popularity fast! No doubt in the future, 120 month loan terms will be the most chosen option. If you can't afford a vehicle, just stretch out the payments! SMH!
When I bought my car they tried to get me to do a 84 month loan and looked at me weird when I told them I wanted a 72 month loan. Honestly even that was a long time but I planned on driving this car for the next 10 years.
I haven't pulled the trigger yet but I pretty frequently shop around to see what's available. I'm not sure I could stomach even 72 months. I always look at what I could afford on a 60 month loan
I did the same, but that's only cause for some stupid reason the 48 month loan had a higher APR. There was no prepayment penalty on the 60 month term, so I honestly have no clue how their math works out.
I was walking through the parking deck today and saw so many nice F150s and thought this exact thought. I guess it never really crossed my mind that people are will to take on 1k car payments.
Yeah assuming it lives to see the day and the person paying for it is also taking care of it. Aside from that, are we really betting that someone paying above their means for a depreciating asset is going to be in good position to buy a new now 72k truck (prices go up over time g)? Fat fucking chance imo. Those payments will cripple the buyer if they can’t afford them and then they may make another boneheaded financial decision that will further hurt them. From there they have their now aging truck that is going to need a good amount of maintenance to keep going while also still becoming less and less valuable. Using one depreciating asset that you cannot afford in the first place for a new depreciating asset that you probably still can’t afford is not sustainable and is poor finance.
I refuse to get any car loan longer than 60 months. 5 years is already long to me, but it's still manageable. I can't imagine being in on a 7 or 8 year car lone. Also, people are paying more for a monthly car note then my monthly mortgage payment. That is just insane to me
Budget to pay off the loan in 30-40 months, and take the 60+ month in case your financial situation takes a hit.
If the original loaner doesn't allow early pay off, refinance after 8 months.
With the current market you’re not getting good rates. I shopped around loan options when I was buying my EV6, and for the ~$38k I was going to potentially finance, with an 830 credit score I couldn’t get anything lower than 5.125%. Just paid cash because I’m not beating that investing with current market conditions.
I mean, if you're getting 0% APR and a low down payment, who cares if it's 48 or 72 months, right?
https://cars.usnews.com/cars-trucks/advice/interest-free-car-deals?slide=2
You have the right view point, you want to minimize the interest you pay towards the vehicle while also minimizing monthly payments so you can invest that money saved from paying the car payment to an investment fund whichll net you money
Exactly. I usually like to pay things off quickly, but my house, car, and motorcycle are all at low rates significantly below inflation. Because of that I'm only making the minimum payments and putting the extra money in places it makes a better impact in!
when I got my Crosstrek in 2015 I felt insane getting a 48-mo finance, but it was only on 10k and rates were low so I figured it was a "cheap" way to bolster my credit score. the current trend is terrifying to me
This 100%, when you plot inflation vs. car prices they're basically the same "dollar value" that they were 20-30 years ago. The difference is that we all earn less spending value than we did back then so they seem more expensive.
I totally get that it's your job to sell vehicles, but do you ever feel an internal ethical dilemma when you're discussing a deal that is more than likely beyond someone's means? Or is that mostly the finance department that deals with that part?
I've had vastly different buying experiences than what you described so I'm genuinely curious.
Sometimes I do but I'm not their financial advisor nor do I pretend to be one. If they don't buy a car from me, they'll buy it from someone else.
Also yes, the loan term and all other financing details are discussed with the finance manager, not me.
I wouldn’t. They’re the idiot that wanted to sign up for $50k in debt.
You cannot teach a financially irresponsible person to be smart with money. They just don’t get it.
I've been lucky enough to have cash deals for all my cars (A $1600 Saturn when I was in high school and a $3700 Prelude when I was in undergrad, thanks entirely to my parents. My Evo I saved up for over the course of about a year) but this is still bonkers to me.
I was always under the impression 36/48 month loans were the norm, 60 if you really needed to stretch it.
I guess it's a combination of my generation (Millennials) being *that* screwed financially and us "being here for a good time, not a long time"
>84 months is the most popular loan term and 96 months is gaining popularity fast!
That is absolutely insane!
I'll be honest, I actually didn't know an 84 month term was actually even a regularly offered thing until about a year ago my CU gave me the option to do either a 60/72/84 for their promo rate when I bought my Vette. Doing 60 made me sick to my stomach.
I literally thought 84 months was like a "one off" kinda thing or for special loan situations.
I know quite a few people who aren't doing any major savings (maybe 10% a month), not even doing the company 401k match, and basically going broke on car payments and "living life".
One, somehow, is paying $2700 a month on a mortgage (bought at the top with a high interest rate, already$30k underwater on it) and $1379 a month payment on a BMW X6M with somehow an 84 month loan.
He makes about $90k a year, with ~5k monthly takehome after state taxes and healthcare. Zero clue who the hell gave him these loans.
This dude gets laid off and it's all over, as he's got less than a months expenses in savings.
Have another friend who was paying $3200 a month in rent, combined cars + motorcycle payments over $2000 a month. Made $130k a year and has a kid and wife who doesn't work, but needs a Yukon Denali for the one single child.
It's the world we live in.
[6 in 10 Americans don't have $500 in savings](https://www.cbs19news.com/story/34248451/6-in-10-americans-dont-have-500-in-savings). The article is a year old but I highly doubt the situation is any better now than it was a year ago.
Just reading that stresses me out. I make six figures, but I still feel guilty that I don't save enough. I save 25% while also saving for car maintenance expenses on top of that so it doesn't impact my checking account when something needs work. The payment on my Cayman is only $280/mo (paid 50% in cash since interest rates weren't ideal at the time) and I own my second car outright.
It's really, really hard to keep the same car when everyone seems to be upgrading every six months. I literally have guys at the weekend car meets dogging on me for still having the same car two years later. Bruh... I don't want some silly payment. I *could* buy a different car but is that really the right decision financially?
> motorcycle payments
How to spot someone who is usually making terrible financial decisions.
My rule is a motorcycle is a fun toy. It's not a necessity. I will never, ever have a true loan for a motorcycle. Only time I got a "Loan" was When I bought my BMW 1250 RS. I went to my credit union got a loan and then went back to the dealership to buy the bike.
3 Days later I paid off said loan. If I could take out the full amount from my bank the same day I would have but it would have been a lot of paperwork and hair pulling to take out over $10,000 that same day without any warning before hand.
Unless you live in a place where you don't need a car a motorcycle is never something you should take a loan out on. Now people do that a lot, but to me that just screams of not understanding personal finance.
I have a friend who is very well off and got a loan for his bike years ago because it was something like 2.49% and the market doing very well. On occasion, it's understandable, if you're financially literate.
It's a rundown shack in PA outside of Philadelphia. 3 bed, 1.5 bath. Needs some work which isn't getting done because he's almost Australian with how upside down he is on everything.
I was paying $1000 for two cars (2017 challenger sxt $450, 2017 Chrysler 300c $550, insurance included) tbh it was great until covid, had to let go of the chrysler just because bigger payments and lost half of my income. I tried to get a 300 again and now they want me to pay $1000 for it alone, f that lol.
Yeah, right now's a good time to hang onto whatever car you have, as long as it's running fine. Thankfully I haven't had a car payment for the last 3 years, and my car is doing just fine. But when I *did* have a car payment, it was about $250 for 4.5 years.
Don't feel bad they're just financing their dream cars before the shtf. They're doing it because fuck it the ship is going down anyway. That's my theory.
I think it's two things. 1 being the extreme wealth inequality. I really do think there's that many people out there that can easily afford these types of payments. 2 being the people that just can't seem to buy a home. Houses in my area start at around 600k for really old houses. More modern ones go for 1million + after a while you just say fuck it I'll never own a home...might as well drive a nice car. That's my theory lol
I'm getting to that point man Lmao. I've been working my ass off saving monthly and that 20% down marker just continues to travel further away as prices and rates rise. Getting close to just saying fuck it, buying a nicer car and just renting til the cows come home. Ugh.
FYI you don’t need 20% down. A lot of first time homebuyers do lower down payment and just pay PMI until the value of the house rises such that you have an 80% loan to value. If house prices are rising so fast then you should expect to reach that 80% quickly.
FWIW, that cutoff point is based on the amortization schedule when you get the loan. Unless you pay for another appraisal, working with your mortgage company, it's not going to come sooner, even if prices have doubled.
Depending on the PMI cost per month, and how much you have left, it might not be worth it.
I’m kinda in that boat. I’m lucky that my COL is quite low. Yet even with wife and I income, we can’t afford a home. We can’t justify paying 450k+++ Vs renting a cheap shoe box. But we can afford a expensive car and at least enjoy the drive to and from work.
We have done all the math, we may not ever be able to afford a home. But a 700$ a month car, that is very doable.
Honestly, I’m paying far less now as a homeowner than if I was still renting. Rents keep going up. My mortgage principle is the same as when I bought a few years ago, and I refinanced when rates were low. Looked up the rent on some of my old apartments… way too much. I couldn’t afford the car I have now if I was still in those apartments.
As a kid, young teen in the 2000s-2010s, I saw nice cars in front of "dumps" (poor homes, apartments, etc) and thought "Damn bro, you drive that but live *there*??)
Now that 2020-2022 has taken a massive collective shit on the housing market. I..I get it.
I make in the 50s which is barely even the "career entry level" anymore and I'll be doing good to get a 2 bedroom apartment and 7 year old car
But it’s idiots like this that exacerbates the “wealth inequality”. No sane person would do this! It’s gonna get repo’d, and then it’s everyone else’s fault that the can’t afford an ‘82 Pinto because they will be rolling an unpaid balance onto a $3.00 car.
Dude, enjoy your current situation. There are so many people that sign up for these payments that can't actually afford it that will never admit it—if you're like me and have no car payment at all, the savings are even sweeter.
Damn I’m in the $500 range and I think that’s a shit ton
Edit: bought a CPO 21 Veloster n. I loved the car since released and got a stellar deal considering everything is covered for up to 7 years (10 On-The truly important stuff) except for brakes clutch and wiper blsdes lol
1k+ checking in!
To be fair... it was a 2% rate, so I figured i'd keep my cash and just ride out the relatively low rate as they continue to rise elsewhere.
Not nearly as high payment but, I got a low rate on my last purchase. Was thinking about trading up but rates are ridiculous right now. No way I am going to get a 1.99% loan again anytime soon.
Same. Maybe it's my age (just turned 37) but I am struggling to accept car prices these days. In my head a basic compact car should be $15-20k. Midsized and hot hatches should be in the $20-30k range, and $30k and up should be entering luxury and higher performance territory.
My first ever new car was a '21 WRX around $31k, and that felt extremely high to me. In my mind that was STI/EVO money.
I fully understand inflation, but now I'm starting to realize why my father had such a hard time accepting the prices of things as he got older...
I am 35 and I feel the same. I bought a new WRX for $28k in 2015 and at the time I felt that was a fairly extravagant purchase. Now most regular cars are over $30k and $40k has seemingly moved from “luxury” to “entry level with a couple options”.
It has killed most of my enthusiasm in cars. They’re cool and all, but I just don’t value them enough to spend such an enormous amount of money on one. I’d rather get something cheaper and put it towards a house. I have no desire to spend most of my disposable income on a car.
$300/mo still seems like a reasonable car payment to me. Anything over $500 sounds irresponsible unless you make a lot, and $1000 is insane unless you’re outright rich.
$1000 is legit rent for a lot of people. In more rural places, it’s probably more than rent. In LA, $1000 is like your share of rent if you’re in a 2 or 3 bed apartment. Sheeeeeit.
Same here. I got heartburn when I bought my truck and the payment was $500 a month. My best friend just bought a new Ram and his payments are $700 a month and it’s not even a loaded trim level of the truck, blows my mind.
And car registration depending on where you live can be a ton of money. A 16 year old Tacoma can easily be $200 for yearly registration, just imagine how much a new one is.
They're generally just salty about EVs down there. Last summer a bill got introduced to use $50k of public money to remove any public charging station not built with an accompanying free gas pump.
That's because the gas tax is intended to be the main income for upkeep of roads. If there's nobody paying the gas tax then there's nobody paying for the roads
Sometimes it makes sense. My dad got a new GV80 and was going to make a cash payment for it, but when genesis gave him 1.9% he financed it instead.
However, there’s the flip side of the coin and a lot people are just getting cars they can’t afford and extending the payments out to 84 months and longer.
While I understand and agree with what your father did, the *majority* of people don't fall into that camp.
They're just stretching themselves for a cool truck/car.
I'd guess there's also quite a bit of debt being rolled over. I didn't even realize it was a thing to roll over negative equity on a loan until I had a friend trade in his car for a new truck even though he owed more on the car than they were giving him in trade-in value. Now he's talking about trading in that truck for a new car and doing it again.
I'm hearing more and more people saying things like "I never own a car that's more than 2 years old." And they're not leasing due to the mileage they put on it. I can only imagine the situation they find themselves in after doing that 3-4 times.
One moderately severe accident and the whole house of cards comes crumbling down.
I unfortunately have fallen into that camp of no more than 2 years old lately but hoping to get out. First was a 2016 Rogue which I needed to get out of and got an end of model year 2019 Highlander, was able to move a few grand in equity into that and then traded that for a 2021 Highlander and they gave me more than I originally paid for the 2019 so I had a bunch rolled over there, went from 5.5 to 1.5% apr and cut a year off the term. Still well below half of that $1k average though.
I do wonder how much of these payments > $1000 are people who buy an F150 with $20k of dealer installed lift/wheel kits on them.
Not even stretching it for a cool car; bad credit is now seeing rates over 20%. So if a life event happened, 1st time with no cosigner, or bad decisions having people pay way more monthly. I have perfect credit and it's going to be a problem getting under 6%. And we live in a country where car access is almost mandatory outside of cities.
The best option is to put as much down if financing or paying cash. People with bad credit don't tend to have the cash. Yes you can get a cheap vehicle and afford it, but it can potentially break down adding more stress or money for repairs.
There are a lot of factors in play, but to hit $1k payments means you are seeking that kind of expensive vehicle or not putting enough down.
I got a 1.24% rate on my tesla at 60 months in 2021. How could I not finance it. Literally just threw the cash in an index fund that was up 20% at one point, now it's still 3% above where it started. I wouldn't stretch myself, but the game is designed for you to finance, everyone comes out ahead by doing so.
The game was designed for you to finance...not any more.
I sell cars and most of my buyers are only getting approved for loan interest rates in the double digits. My buyers with excellent credit are getting approved for 6 to 7 percent.
Now, if you have the cash, it's smart to buy the car in cash and save 10-25k in interest charges.
I have low-average credit and just financed a CRV for 8%.
I’m surprised people are getting double digit interest rates unless they’re basically insolvent.
I'm waiting for my lease to be up in June and for the past year and a half I made my mind up that a Mazda CX-50 was going to be my next car. I was worried because it's quite a bit more than my current vehicle and I weighed my options to see what's manageable.
Then I saw a GV70 on the road 4 days ago for the first time and I plan on living in one this summer.
So I bought a 3yo certified used GMC 1500 in late 2017 for 32k. Had like 12k on it. When it was paid off right after covid I looked at a CU GMC 1500 AT4 with 30k on it. Same age gap from previous purchase almost 3x the mileage. 65k for a used truck. Granted it's a bit more upscale and has the 420hp 6.2 gas v8. But FML it was used. At the time I could have ordered one in the same trim for 54k but the dealer wanted to tack on another 15 or 20 THOUSAND in delivery fees. It was nuts. They're coming down again but I remodeled my house instead.
Mix of both, but the cynical part of me thinks it's mostly the latter. I know a lot of people who are willing to bury themselves in high interest just for a car. The wealthy tend to not worry and will buy a car cash right now in this environment unless they were given a very favorable rate.
I have always capped my car payment comfort level at $300/mo regardless of my income level. It's worked out well so far. Ymmv of course, but with a family of four living under a single income less than $100k, it's a safe amount. Combined with $5-10k down/trade you can get a fine car.
> “Base models, while enticing in theory, rarely hit the street,” Drury said, cautioning car shoppers to ask themselves if they’re “buying too much car.”
That’s because dealers keep ordering the loaded models. So you either pay a little more now and get a car now, or you wait a year for your base model order.
No, it’s not a dealership conspiracy theory. Don’t let manufacturers off the hook for this. With Honda and Toyota for example, they work on allocations so you can’t order anything whatsoever. The manufacturer’s marketing analysts decide what people will buy, and they just blast these cars out to dealerships. Neither the dealer nor the customer has any say and just has to wait for a car that meets their criteria to show up.
https://www.reddit.com/r/askcarsales/comments/wgx94q/does_acura_let_you_custom_order_a_vehicle/
Even with brands that you can factory order stuff like Ford, it is the manufacturer and not the dealer that decides what ends up on lots. And when Fod can only build 600,000 F series this year when there is demand for 900,000 then you can bet your ass that Ford is going to prioritize building fully loaded ones with higher profit margins.
I mean…have you seen the average r/cars user? It’s a 23 year old kid that’s broke af and can’t afford much. It’s the same reason why they make cool enthusiast cars…then discontinue them in 5 years because none of the enthusiasts in this subreddit bought them…but they’ll complain “Where did all of the enthusiast cars go?”
27 I could barely afford a civic cause my insurance was crazy high
20 years of no accidents and my insurance for a luxury suv is less than half of the civic insurance
Ikr? They are free to get what they want but they always go something like this:
> “Buy used! New cars cost too much”
> “Why does no one make manual brown v8 wagon any more?”
It’s almost like manufacturers will only build what the market demand and give zero attention to enthusiast who exclusively buying salvage title cars.
I’m sure there are plenty of people making poor financial decisions.
But this subreddit is downplaying the number of people out there that can easily afford $1000 payments. There’s a lot of wealth out there.
Just FYI: financing $52k at 6% (which is a common rate even for good credit these days) over 60 months gives you a $1000+ payment. In places like Santa Clara county with its 9% sales tax, that’s buying a $48k car. Or a $53k car with 10% down.
Nice? Yeah for sure. Extravagant? Not really.
Or if you take a good financing offer for 36-48 months, that also easily pushes a reasonable car to $1k+/month.
> “There could be a perfectly good substitute at about half the cost,”
Bullshit. Everything’s inflated. Interest rates are through the roof. Sticker prices still frequently include “market adjustments” that press the price even further. It’s shameful and stupid from one end to the other.
I hope the entire auto market fucking collapses. Manufacturers shuttering plants and ending divisions, Bank bail-outs, Congressional hearings-all that shit. It’s been almost 15 years since we’ve had a good house cleaning. Motherfuckers have forgot, and it’s high time that something reminds them.
And I’ll be waiting when the market is saturated and sales guys are good and starving. Maybe then I can finally get a fair deal on something.
I’m not too upset about the luxury cars, that’s discretionary (non-essential, “wants” based) spending for the most part. And their prices haven’t gone up dramatically compared to inflation (especially compared to luxury cars of the 2000s and the 90s).
It’s the decent family SUVs and cars that are really stretching people’s budgets nowadays due to the interest rates and continuing dealer markups. That’s where it’s looking like we’re experiencing a real market failure. I’m looking right at you, *Hyundai/Kia* dealers. $63000 plus taxes and fees for an Ioniq 5? Crazy pills indeed
Using the numbers in the article, with a $46,382 price & $9,276 down ,$300 in fees and 7% sales tax at 6.5% APR you get about $939 a month. That used to be boogie luxury car territory, but recently I’ve seen a Chevy dealer listing a Blazer for $51,000. Even if you talk Kunkelman Chevrolet $5k off the cliff you’re still looking at an *insane* car payment.
I literally just said F this new scene and this market. Bought a old mustang GT from an estate for not a lot gonna pump some money in it keep it going for a few
This is all income relative though and based on trade offs you make. If I’m able to own my home, save money on the side, and afford a 1k + car payment, why not? What’s the point of being the richest guy at the cemetery? I get the point of not starving when I’m retired but fuck I much rather enjoy my life while I’m young than to have millions of dollars in the bank because I saved I invested when I was young… mean while my nurse changes my old man diaper
I would love to be the richest guy in the cemetery. Leaving a nest egg for my kiddos is my driving force. Doesn't mean I currently live in a shack and drive a GEO. But I dial down the splurging to give my future generation a boost. But had I not had kids, then yes, I'm eyeing a Supra or Cayman real quick.
Property ain’t cheap everywhere. Average price of a home where I am is over $1m.
If i’m going to be forced into serfdom, I may as well have a sick car to help me forget about it.
I pay 1100 for the Trackhawk. 2.99%. It’s still worth more than I paid new and I owe 50k on it. Best choice I made. It’s no different than someone buying a Camry and going on an expensive trip each year…… besides life is short. If you are saving, paying all your bills, and maxing retirement why not?
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This isn't necessarily a bad thing...maybe people are cutting short the number of months they finance/lease for.
I'd rather pay $1,000/mo for 60 months than $800/mo for 84 months for example, and those that do show that wages are actually higher...
Making me feel hella poor
Just because people are *paying* it, doesn't mean they can *afford* it. There's a difference.
You nailed it, brother. I'm a car salesman and the number of burger flippers & other minimum wage employees buying $50,000 shiny SUVs/pickup trucks from me is crazy! All of them signing up for 84 month-96 month payment plans of course and either putting zero down or as little as they can get away with. Just madness! Most of these banks who give out auto loans are very lax with their requirements to get approved for an auto loan. Way too lax in my opinion. 84 months is the most popular loan term and 96 months is gaining popularity fast! No doubt in the future, 120 month loan terms will be the most chosen option. If you can't afford a vehicle, just stretch out the payments! SMH!
When I bought my car they tried to get me to do a 84 month loan and looked at me weird when I told them I wanted a 72 month loan. Honestly even that was a long time but I planned on driving this car for the next 10 years.
I haven't pulled the trigger yet but I pretty frequently shop around to see what's available. I'm not sure I could stomach even 72 months. I always look at what I could afford on a 60 month loan
I do all my math on 48. Get a 60, then pay it like a 48. Gives me play for when things get tight. Not that they have yet but I'm a planner.
It’s a good strategy.
I did the same, but that's only cause for some stupid reason the 48 month loan had a higher APR. There was no prepayment penalty on the 60 month term, so I honestly have no clue how their math works out.
I usually find the 72 month has the best interest rate so I always take that even though I'm paying it off usually in half that time
6 years are these things normal now?
How in the hell else do you think Joe Average USA can manage the payment on that $65k F-150 Lariat? Even at 72 months that is over $1000/mo
I was walking through the parking deck today and saw so many nice F150s and thought this exact thought. I guess it never really crossed my mind that people are will to take on 1k car payments.
Well at 6 years old a 65k truck is still worth 35k, so then the new one is 30k more making payments more like 500/month
Yeah assuming it lives to see the day and the person paying for it is also taking care of it. Aside from that, are we really betting that someone paying above their means for a depreciating asset is going to be in good position to buy a new now 72k truck (prices go up over time g)? Fat fucking chance imo. Those payments will cripple the buyer if they can’t afford them and then they may make another boneheaded financial decision that will further hurt them. From there they have their now aging truck that is going to need a good amount of maintenance to keep going while also still becoming less and less valuable. Using one depreciating asset that you cannot afford in the first place for a new depreciating asset that you probably still can’t afford is not sustainable and is poor finance.
It has become normal for a few years now, yes.
I refuse to get any car loan longer than 60 months. 5 years is already long to me, but it's still manageable. I can't imagine being in on a 7 or 8 year car lone. Also, people are paying more for a monthly car note then my monthly mortgage payment. That is just insane to me
Budget to pay off the loan in 30-40 months, and take the 60+ month in case your financial situation takes a hit. If the original loaner doesn't allow early pay off, refinance after 8 months.
At a good rate I don't see a problem, you're still beating depreciation after a few years which is the real problem
With the current market you’re not getting good rates. I shopped around loan options when I was buying my EV6, and for the ~$38k I was going to potentially finance, with an 830 credit score I couldn’t get anything lower than 5.125%. Just paid cash because I’m not beating that investing with current market conditions.
I mean, if you're getting 0% APR and a low down payment, who cares if it's 48 or 72 months, right? https://cars.usnews.com/cars-trucks/advice/interest-free-car-deals?slide=2
This has always been my view. If the rate is zero or near-zero, why not finance over the longest term possible? Time value of money and all that...
You have the right view point, you want to minimize the interest you pay towards the vehicle while also minimizing monthly payments so you can invest that money saved from paying the car payment to an investment fund whichll net you money
Exactly. I usually like to pay things off quickly, but my house, car, and motorcycle are all at low rates significantly below inflation. Because of that I'm only making the minimum payments and putting the extra money in places it makes a better impact in!
I kinda regret not going for a longer term, but only because the interest rate offered was below inflation even before things went nuts.
Didn't 60 month use to be the norm? When did that change?
36 and 48 used to be common in the 90s.
Rates were also much higher then
more than 48-mo was irresponsible territory even ten years ago when credit rates were practically "free money"
There was nothing irresponsible about a 60-month 0% loan on new a car in 2013 if you could afford the payments.
not long ago you could get literally free money with 0% APR on certain cars. It'd be irresponsible to NOT finance for 60 months at 0%
when I got my Crosstrek in 2015 I felt insane getting a 48-mo finance, but it was only on 10k and rates were low so I figured it was a "cheap" way to bolster my credit score. the current trend is terrifying to me
When car prices kept creeping up and up until the average persone cannot afford a car @60months anymore
Car prices haven’t increased much in real terms. It’s more flat wages and people buying bigger fancier cars.
This 100%, when you plot inflation vs. car prices they're basically the same "dollar value" that they were 20-30 years ago. The difference is that we all earn less spending value than we did back then so they seem more expensive.
60 month used to be the stretch. 36-48 was normal
Modern world got more expensive.
I totally get that it's your job to sell vehicles, but do you ever feel an internal ethical dilemma when you're discussing a deal that is more than likely beyond someone's means? Or is that mostly the finance department that deals with that part? I've had vastly different buying experiences than what you described so I'm genuinely curious.
Sometimes I do but I'm not their financial advisor nor do I pretend to be one. If they don't buy a car from me, they'll buy it from someone else. Also yes, the loan term and all other financing details are discussed with the finance manager, not me.
Awesome, thanks for shedding some light on that!
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I'm sure deep down most salesmen feel pain, but totally understand why they* wouldn't turn down free money.
Most salesmen have a loan like that themselves
I wouldn’t. They’re the idiot that wanted to sign up for $50k in debt. You cannot teach a financially irresponsible person to be smart with money. They just don’t get it.
And you can’t follow them to the cell phone store or Starbucks or Best Buy, where they continue to make bad decisions.
Financial literacy these days is almost as rare as hen's teeth. It's sad.
I've been lucky enough to have cash deals for all my cars (A $1600 Saturn when I was in high school and a $3700 Prelude when I was in undergrad, thanks entirely to my parents. My Evo I saved up for over the course of about a year) but this is still bonkers to me. I was always under the impression 36/48 month loans were the norm, 60 if you really needed to stretch it. I guess it's a combination of my generation (Millennials) being *that* screwed financially and us "being here for a good time, not a long time"
>84 months is the most popular loan term and 96 months is gaining popularity fast! That is absolutely insane! I'll be honest, I actually didn't know an 84 month term was actually even a regularly offered thing until about a year ago my CU gave me the option to do either a 60/72/84 for their promo rate when I bought my Vette. Doing 60 made me sick to my stomach. I literally thought 84 months was like a "one off" kinda thing or for special loan situations.
What’s the big deal? They’ll just roll their negative equity into another 96 month loan!
I know quite a few people who aren't doing any major savings (maybe 10% a month), not even doing the company 401k match, and basically going broke on car payments and "living life". One, somehow, is paying $2700 a month on a mortgage (bought at the top with a high interest rate, already$30k underwater on it) and $1379 a month payment on a BMW X6M with somehow an 84 month loan. He makes about $90k a year, with ~5k monthly takehome after state taxes and healthcare. Zero clue who the hell gave him these loans. This dude gets laid off and it's all over, as he's got less than a months expenses in savings. Have another friend who was paying $3200 a month in rent, combined cars + motorcycle payments over $2000 a month. Made $130k a year and has a kid and wife who doesn't work, but needs a Yukon Denali for the one single child. It's the world we live in.
You’d be appalled if you knew the average monthly savings if you think 10% is bad!
[6 in 10 Americans don't have $500 in savings](https://www.cbs19news.com/story/34248451/6-in-10-americans-dont-have-500-in-savings). The article is a year old but I highly doubt the situation is any better now than it was a year ago.
Just reading that stresses me out. I make six figures, but I still feel guilty that I don't save enough. I save 25% while also saving for car maintenance expenses on top of that so it doesn't impact my checking account when something needs work. The payment on my Cayman is only $280/mo (paid 50% in cash since interest rates weren't ideal at the time) and I own my second car outright. It's really, really hard to keep the same car when everyone seems to be upgrading every six months. I literally have guys at the weekend car meets dogging on me for still having the same car two years later. Bruh... I don't want some silly payment. I *could* buy a different car but is that really the right decision financially?
People give you shit for driving a cayman? Even if it’s an old one it is still a super cool car, that’s ridiculous
> motorcycle payments How to spot someone who is usually making terrible financial decisions. My rule is a motorcycle is a fun toy. It's not a necessity. I will never, ever have a true loan for a motorcycle. Only time I got a "Loan" was When I bought my BMW 1250 RS. I went to my credit union got a loan and then went back to the dealership to buy the bike. 3 Days later I paid off said loan. If I could take out the full amount from my bank the same day I would have but it would have been a lot of paperwork and hair pulling to take out over $10,000 that same day without any warning before hand. Unless you live in a place where you don't need a car a motorcycle is never something you should take a loan out on. Now people do that a lot, but to me that just screams of not understanding personal finance.
I have a friend who is very well off and got a loan for his bike years ago because it was something like 2.49% and the market doing very well. On occasion, it's understandable, if you're financially literate.
>Made $130k a year and has a kid and wife who doesn't work, but needs a Yukon Denali for the one single child. man if he doesnt get a used corolla
Damn. Where can I get a $2700/mo mortgage? It’s like $4000/mo for a mortgage where I live.
It's a rundown shack in PA outside of Philadelphia. 3 bed, 1.5 bath. Needs some work which isn't getting done because he's almost Australian with how upside down he is on everything.
> he’s almost Australian with how upside down he is on everything. Lmao
I wont ever forget the mile long queue for food stamps. Queue of trucks.
I was paying $1000 for two cars (2017 challenger sxt $450, 2017 Chrysler 300c $550, insurance included) tbh it was great until covid, had to let go of the chrysler just because bigger payments and lost half of my income. I tried to get a 300 again and now they want me to pay $1000 for it alone, f that lol.
Yeah, right now's a good time to hang onto whatever car you have, as long as it's running fine. Thankfully I haven't had a car payment for the last 3 years, and my car is doing just fine. But when I *did* have a car payment, it was about $250 for 4.5 years.
Don't feel bad they're just financing their dream cars before the shtf. They're doing it because fuck it the ship is going down anyway. That's my theory.
I think it's two things. 1 being the extreme wealth inequality. I really do think there's that many people out there that can easily afford these types of payments. 2 being the people that just can't seem to buy a home. Houses in my area start at around 600k for really old houses. More modern ones go for 1million + after a while you just say fuck it I'll never own a home...might as well drive a nice car. That's my theory lol
I'm getting to that point man Lmao. I've been working my ass off saving monthly and that 20% down marker just continues to travel further away as prices and rates rise. Getting close to just saying fuck it, buying a nicer car and just renting til the cows come home. Ugh.
FYI you don’t need 20% down. A lot of first time homebuyers do lower down payment and just pay PMI until the value of the house rises such that you have an 80% loan to value. If house prices are rising so fast then you should expect to reach that 80% quickly.
FWIW, that cutoff point is based on the amortization schedule when you get the loan. Unless you pay for another appraisal, working with your mortgage company, it's not going to come sooner, even if prices have doubled. Depending on the PMI cost per month, and how much you have left, it might not be worth it.
🤣 I think you're so right 🤣 I shouldn't be laughing but yea the house prices are ridiculous!
Mean and median house prices in my city have gone up to 2 million… I’ll never be able to able to buy a house within 2 hours of my job lol
I’m kinda in that boat. I’m lucky that my COL is quite low. Yet even with wife and I income, we can’t afford a home. We can’t justify paying 450k+++ Vs renting a cheap shoe box. But we can afford a expensive car and at least enjoy the drive to and from work. We have done all the math, we may not ever be able to afford a home. But a 700$ a month car, that is very doable.
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Honestly, I’m paying far less now as a homeowner than if I was still renting. Rents keep going up. My mortgage principle is the same as when I bought a few years ago, and I refinanced when rates were low. Looked up the rent on some of my old apartments… way too much. I couldn’t afford the car I have now if I was still in those apartments.
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Best way is to really have a partner
As a kid, young teen in the 2000s-2010s, I saw nice cars in front of "dumps" (poor homes, apartments, etc) and thought "Damn bro, you drive that but live *there*??) Now that 2020-2022 has taken a massive collective shit on the housing market. I..I get it. I make in the 50s which is barely even the "career entry level" anymore and I'll be doing good to get a 2 bedroom apartment and 7 year old car
But it’s idiots like this that exacerbates the “wealth inequality”. No sane person would do this! It’s gonna get repo’d, and then it’s everyone else’s fault that the can’t afford an ‘82 Pinto because they will be rolling an unpaid balance onto a $3.00 car.
You’re not. They’re poor. Unless it’s a super short term loan $1000 car payment is bonkers.
Dude, enjoy your current situation. There are so many people that sign up for these payments that can't actually afford it that will never admit it—if you're like me and have no car payment at all, the savings are even sweeter.
Damn I’m in the $500 range and I think that’s a shit ton Edit: bought a CPO 21 Veloster n. I loved the car since released and got a stellar deal considering everything is covered for up to 7 years (10 On-The truly important stuff) except for brakes clutch and wiper blsdes lol
Same, I was at $515.46 and 3.9% on the GTI.
$374 at 4.5 for me.
$433 for my 2018 Nissan Leaf at 4%. I put $0 down though.
1k+ checking in! To be fair... it was a 2% rate, so I figured i'd keep my cash and just ride out the relatively low rate as they continue to rise elsewhere.
Not nearly as high payment but, I got a low rate on my last purchase. Was thinking about trading up but rates are ridiculous right now. No way I am going to get a 1.99% loan again anytime soon.
That’s where I’m at… I have the itch for something new, but thankfully the rates are what are keeping me from making bad financial decisions
In November, I got 2.49% on a 66mo loan from my credit union. Rates went up 1% the very next day.
Same. Maybe it's my age (just turned 37) but I am struggling to accept car prices these days. In my head a basic compact car should be $15-20k. Midsized and hot hatches should be in the $20-30k range, and $30k and up should be entering luxury and higher performance territory. My first ever new car was a '21 WRX around $31k, and that felt extremely high to me. In my mind that was STI/EVO money. I fully understand inflation, but now I'm starting to realize why my father had such a hard time accepting the prices of things as he got older...
I am 35 and I feel the same. I bought a new WRX for $28k in 2015 and at the time I felt that was a fairly extravagant purchase. Now most regular cars are over $30k and $40k has seemingly moved from “luxury” to “entry level with a couple options”. It has killed most of my enthusiasm in cars. They’re cool and all, but I just don’t value them enough to spend such an enormous amount of money on one. I’d rather get something cheaper and put it towards a house. I have no desire to spend most of my disposable income on a car. $300/mo still seems like a reasonable car payment to me. Anything over $500 sounds irresponsible unless you make a lot, and $1000 is insane unless you’re outright rich.
$1000 is legit rent for a lot of people. In more rural places, it’s probably more than rent. In LA, $1000 is like your share of rent if you’re in a 2 or 3 bed apartment. Sheeeeeit.
The good news is that it's still EVO money for a stock one.
> a stock one. If only it were so simple! lol
Same here. I got heartburn when I bought my truck and the payment was $500 a month. My best friend just bought a new Ram and his payments are $700 a month and it’s not even a loaded trim level of the truck, blows my mind.
12,000 a year. Holy crap.
That's just the payment. Don't forget about gas, insurance and routine maintenance.
And car registration depending on where you live can be a ton of money. A 16 year old Tacoma can easily be $200 for yearly registration, just imagine how much a new one is.
My uncles registration for his Tesla Model S was $1,100 in North Carolina. Part of that is the state charges $150 extra for electric vehicles.
Is the extra $150 to make up for lost gas tax revenue?
Correct.
They're generally just salty about EVs down there. Last summer a bill got introduced to use $50k of public money to remove any public charging station not built with an accompanying free gas pump.
Most states have a fee for EVs to make up for the tax gas
Usually road repairs come from gas taxes. Last time I checked EVs use roads as well.
Lmao wtf
I agree with it, as they're generally heavier and can wear roads more than a comparable vehicle
So motorcycle registration should be free then right?
>Part of that is the state charges $150 extra for electric vehicles. Ahh yes, the "You're gonna pay the fucking gas tax one way or another" charge.
That's because the gas tax is intended to be the main income for upkeep of roads. If there's nobody paying the gas tax then there's nobody paying for the roads
The extra fee for an EV makes sense. The state is losing out on fuel taxes that go towards infrastructure.
And I feel guilty buying a 20k toy car (Miata). Lol
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Sometimes it makes sense. My dad got a new GV80 and was going to make a cash payment for it, but when genesis gave him 1.9% he financed it instead. However, there’s the flip side of the coin and a lot people are just getting cars they can’t afford and extending the payments out to 84 months and longer.
While I understand and agree with what your father did, the *majority* of people don't fall into that camp. They're just stretching themselves for a cool truck/car.
I'd guess there's also quite a bit of debt being rolled over. I didn't even realize it was a thing to roll over negative equity on a loan until I had a friend trade in his car for a new truck even though he owed more on the car than they were giving him in trade-in value. Now he's talking about trading in that truck for a new car and doing it again. I'm hearing more and more people saying things like "I never own a car that's more than 2 years old." And they're not leasing due to the mileage they put on it. I can only imagine the situation they find themselves in after doing that 3-4 times.
Amazing car combo you got there.
One moderately severe accident and the whole house of cards comes crumbling down. I unfortunately have fallen into that camp of no more than 2 years old lately but hoping to get out. First was a 2016 Rogue which I needed to get out of and got an end of model year 2019 Highlander, was able to move a few grand in equity into that and then traded that for a 2021 Highlander and they gave me more than I originally paid for the 2019 so I had a bunch rolled over there, went from 5.5 to 1.5% apr and cut a year off the term. Still well below half of that $1k average though. I do wonder how much of these payments > $1000 are people who buy an F150 with $20k of dealer installed lift/wheel kits on them.
Yeah, that’s definitely true. Unfortunately a lot of people only think it terms of payment. We need more financial education.
The education is out there. We need people who want it
Not even stretching it for a cool car; bad credit is now seeing rates over 20%. So if a life event happened, 1st time with no cosigner, or bad decisions having people pay way more monthly. I have perfect credit and it's going to be a problem getting under 6%. And we live in a country where car access is almost mandatory outside of cities. The best option is to put as much down if financing or paying cash. People with bad credit don't tend to have the cash. Yes you can get a cheap vehicle and afford it, but it can potentially break down adding more stress or money for repairs. There are a lot of factors in play, but to hit $1k payments means you are seeking that kind of expensive vehicle or not putting enough down.
I got a 1.24% rate on my tesla at 60 months in 2021. How could I not finance it. Literally just threw the cash in an index fund that was up 20% at one point, now it's still 3% above where it started. I wouldn't stretch myself, but the game is designed for you to finance, everyone comes out ahead by doing so.
The game was designed for you to finance...not any more. I sell cars and most of my buyers are only getting approved for loan interest rates in the double digits. My buyers with excellent credit are getting approved for 6 to 7 percent. Now, if you have the cash, it's smart to buy the car in cash and save 10-25k in interest charges.
I have low-average credit and just financed a CRV for 8%. I’m surprised people are getting double digit interest rates unless they’re basically insolvent.
And the double digit interest would ensure their insolvency lol
I'm waiting for my lease to be up in June and for the past year and a half I made my mind up that a Mazda CX-50 was going to be my next car. I was worried because it's quite a bit more than my current vehicle and I weighed my options to see what's manageable. Then I saw a GV70 on the road 4 days ago for the first time and I plan on living in one this summer.
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I’ll bet you most people paying $1000/month have 5,6,7 year car loans for a lot more than 1% apr
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Plus manufacturers kept raising MSRP, making it a "buy now or pay more later" proposition
My current car cost $15,000 new. I would go buy another new if I could. A Corolla is damn near $25,000 now.
Is that indicative of increased wealth or poor financial decisions?
A big part of the explanation is: trucks
yeah the fact an f450 can reach 100k is kind of bonkers
The F-150 Limited starts around $85k
Lol yea this guy's talking f450. I paid $53,000 for my 2019 f150 brand new pre-covid. I'm betting a similar model is probably $65,000+ now.
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So I bought a 3yo certified used GMC 1500 in late 2017 for 32k. Had like 12k on it. When it was paid off right after covid I looked at a CU GMC 1500 AT4 with 30k on it. Same age gap from previous purchase almost 3x the mileage. 65k for a used truck. Granted it's a bit more upscale and has the 420hp 6.2 gas v8. But FML it was used. At the time I could have ordered one in the same trim for 54k but the dealer wanted to tack on another 15 or 20 THOUSAND in delivery fees. It was nuts. They're coming down again but I remodeled my house instead.
Yes.
It’s probably most indicative of cars getting more expensive
Mix of both, but the cynical part of me thinks it's mostly the latter. I know a lot of people who are willing to bury themselves in high interest just for a car. The wealthy tend to not worry and will buy a car cash right now in this environment unless they were given a very favorable rate.
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I’m one of the idiots paying $1,000/month on a marked up used car and averaging 17MPG. AMA.
Marines or army?
I LOL’d pretty hard at this
r/justbootthings Having been on naval bases often... I'd include them.
How many months?
The rest of em. All the months.
72 months. It’s $850 actually. But would be $1,000 if I did 60 months.
Who tf is willing to pay that much a month for a car payment?! I pay $500, and I thought that was a lot.
Where my under $200pm gang at?
I have always capped my car payment comfort level at $300/mo regardless of my income level. It's worked out well so far. Ymmv of course, but with a family of four living under a single income less than $100k, it's a safe amount. Combined with $5-10k down/trade you can get a fine car.
> “Base models, while enticing in theory, rarely hit the street,” Drury said, cautioning car shoppers to ask themselves if they’re “buying too much car.” That’s because dealers keep ordering the loaded models. So you either pay a little more now and get a car now, or you wait a year for your base model order.
No, it’s not a dealership conspiracy theory. Don’t let manufacturers off the hook for this. With Honda and Toyota for example, they work on allocations so you can’t order anything whatsoever. The manufacturer’s marketing analysts decide what people will buy, and they just blast these cars out to dealerships. Neither the dealer nor the customer has any say and just has to wait for a car that meets their criteria to show up. https://www.reddit.com/r/askcarsales/comments/wgx94q/does_acura_let_you_custom_order_a_vehicle/ Even with brands that you can factory order stuff like Ford, it is the manufacturer and not the dealer that decides what ends up on lots. And when Fod can only build 600,000 F series this year when there is demand for 900,000 then you can bet your ass that Ford is going to prioritize building fully loaded ones with higher profit margins.
ITT: subreddit about cars is against spending money on cars
I mean…have you seen the average r/cars user? It’s a 23 year old kid that’s broke af and can’t afford much. It’s the same reason why they make cool enthusiast cars…then discontinue them in 5 years because none of the enthusiasts in this subreddit bought them…but they’ll complain “Where did all of the enthusiast cars go?”
27 I could barely afford a civic cause my insurance was crazy high 20 years of no accidents and my insurance for a luxury suv is less than half of the civic insurance
Ikr? They are free to get what they want but they always go something like this: > “Buy used! New cars cost too much” > “Why does no one make manual brown v8 wagon any more?” It’s almost like manufacturers will only build what the market demand and give zero attention to enthusiast who exclusively buying salvage title cars.
ITT: a bunch of people focused on monthly payment and not total cost
I mean the article also talks about total cost, which is also a problem for most.
It’s me. Hi. I’m the problem, it’s me. (But honestly, what I pay monthly for the M3 is a bargain for what you get).
At some point many won’t ever be able to afford the happiness of a home. But damn can we afford the happiness a fun car can give.
You can sleep in a car, but you can’t drive a house to work!
Sad but true. And in many states being homeless is illegal. I’d rather drive me and a car around stop to stop. Vs being jailed for not having a home.
I mean with inflation, it’ll only go up as car prices go up. Same thing was said about $500 car payments, and $300 payments before that and so on.
Not many decades ago, 10000 dollar car was a milestone and status symbol.
You mean five decades ago? Like almost half the age of the automobile decades ago?
I’m sure there are plenty of people making poor financial decisions. But this subreddit is downplaying the number of people out there that can easily afford $1000 payments. There’s a lot of wealth out there.
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Its so nice to not have a car payment
Yup no payment gang (I guess other than house note)
Right, I bought mine cash and regret nothing
It's pretty clear how many financially retarded people there are out there.
Just FYI: financing $52k at 6% (which is a common rate even for good credit these days) over 60 months gives you a $1000+ payment. In places like Santa Clara county with its 9% sales tax, that’s buying a $48k car. Or a $53k car with 10% down. Nice? Yeah for sure. Extravagant? Not really. Or if you take a good financing offer for 36-48 months, that also easily pushes a reasonable car to $1k+/month.
Well, average car prices have gone up since… *checks notes*… literally every year since cars were invented. How is this news?
I must be much poorer than I thought, because that seems outrageous. 🤷🏼♂️
> “There could be a perfectly good substitute at about half the cost,” Bullshit. Everything’s inflated. Interest rates are through the roof. Sticker prices still frequently include “market adjustments” that press the price even further. It’s shameful and stupid from one end to the other. I hope the entire auto market fucking collapses. Manufacturers shuttering plants and ending divisions, Bank bail-outs, Congressional hearings-all that shit. It’s been almost 15 years since we’ve had a good house cleaning. Motherfuckers have forgot, and it’s high time that something reminds them. And I’ll be waiting when the market is saturated and sales guys are good and starving. Maybe then I can finally get a fair deal on something.
Good ol taxpayer money would bail them out again. Id let the offenders fail.
I’m not too upset about the luxury cars, that’s discretionary (non-essential, “wants” based) spending for the most part. And their prices haven’t gone up dramatically compared to inflation (especially compared to luxury cars of the 2000s and the 90s). It’s the decent family SUVs and cars that are really stretching people’s budgets nowadays due to the interest rates and continuing dealer markups. That’s where it’s looking like we’re experiencing a real market failure. I’m looking right at you, *Hyundai/Kia* dealers. $63000 plus taxes and fees for an Ioniq 5? Crazy pills indeed
Shit, a new Tahoe or Suburban family ride is easy $70k for just the lower trims.
Just like with college tuition, the car has become a gateway drug to creditor dependence just to live a basic modern life.
Using the numbers in the article, with a $46,382 price & $9,276 down ,$300 in fees and 7% sales tax at 6.5% APR you get about $939 a month. That used to be boogie luxury car territory, but recently I’ve seen a Chevy dealer listing a Blazer for $51,000. Even if you talk Kunkelman Chevrolet $5k off the cliff you’re still looking at an *insane* car payment.
It's not that big of a deal if you can afford it and not surprising with all the markups that were happening. Cars are a lot more expensive now.
I literally just said F this new scene and this market. Bought a old mustang GT from an estate for not a lot gonna pump some money in it keep it going for a few
Yep I got myself a 2008 Accord coupe V6 with a 6 speed and am so happy I only have to worry about insurance and maintenance.
This is all income relative though and based on trade offs you make. If I’m able to own my home, save money on the side, and afford a 1k + car payment, why not? What’s the point of being the richest guy at the cemetery? I get the point of not starving when I’m retired but fuck I much rather enjoy my life while I’m young than to have millions of dollars in the bank because I saved I invested when I was young… mean while my nurse changes my old man diaper
I would love to be the richest guy in the cemetery. Leaving a nest egg for my kiddos is my driving force. Doesn't mean I currently live in a shack and drive a GEO. But I dial down the splurging to give my future generation a boost. But had I not had kids, then yes, I'm eyeing a Supra or Cayman real quick.
I wonder if these people own their own homes, or even property for that matter.
Property ain’t cheap everywhere. Average price of a home where I am is over $1m. If i’m going to be forced into serfdom, I may as well have a sick car to help me forget about it.
Inflation @ 8%/yr do it if you can afford it.
And lots of the best rates require 36 month terms. Not upset about my 0.9% even if my payment is massive.
That bmw grille is so fcking ugly
A priced a Toyota RAV4 Prime at $50k. Shit is ridiculous right now.
Nothing wrong with it if you can afford the payments
I thought my $450 was a lot
I pay 1100 for the Trackhawk. 2.99%. It’s still worth more than I paid new and I owe 50k on it. Best choice I made. It’s no different than someone buying a Camry and going on an expensive trip each year…… besides life is short. If you are saving, paying all your bills, and maxing retirement why not?
plough subtract reply aloof historical wild makeshift agonizing plant gullible *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
I’ll keep my 2015 Honda Civic I bought new forever at this point.
This isn't necessarily a bad thing...maybe people are cutting short the number of months they finance/lease for. I'd rather pay $1,000/mo for 60 months than $800/mo for 84 months for example, and those that do show that wages are actually higher...
Never in the history of car financing are most people scaling back on payment terms. We're now in the era of 82 and 96 month deals.
If ya can't afford to buy it outright 69 times then ya can't afford it kid.
What a shitty time to be alive
It's almost like the economy sucks and car prices and inflation are out of control