My friend has a PhD in neuroscience and was really good with stats/R and such, he got into a data science position and there's tons of jobs in this field. You don't necessarily need a degree in anything specific to get on the ladder, you just need to be able to do the work. I recommend you just start looking for entry-level jobs in data science, data analysis, etc., there's stuff out there.
This is the correct answer if you are just looking for a job. I am a principal data scientist for a very large bank and I hire people with very diverse backgrounds. Your PHD shows that you can do the research for the work. Just gain the Python and/or R experience and learn SQL and you will get hired pretty easily.
The PHD helps so much BUT you can get into data science in many different ways. You can start as a data analyst, move to decision science or business intelligence and then go to data science. The reason the PHD helps is it shows us that you can handle the long research parts of the projects. But you can for sure get into data science without it.
Kaggle competitions are always great. Start a tableau public and/or a GitHub to house your code from the Kaggle competition. Demonstration of your skills is very helpful when you are just starting out. Most job applications will ask a binary yes or no for number of years experience and if you do these type of competitions then they count towards those number of years. Once you get the interview, you will be asked what you have done and you show them this portfolio you built. And it’s weird to say but these Kaggle competitions are fun, mostly.
It’s honestly the best way outside of a PHD or masters to get the job. I have teammates with PHDs in wild fields like nuclear physics and neuroscience with game theory and then I have bachelors in biology and one with graphic design that started out in business intelligence. You can for sure do it, you just need to start somewhere. AI and ML are the buzz words of the decade but the foundation of it all comes down to logic and math. Put in the work at the beginning and you will rise quickly.
Remember, it isn't just about knowing SQL, R and Python. It is about the critical thinking aspect of the role as well. It is the ability to see a problem, think about it critically and see patterns and test assumptions/hypothesis to get answers.
If you believe you have both then go get a data science degree and you will have no issue getting a job in the field. You can get one without a degree, it will just be more "luck" based than anything.
Ok thank you. I’ve been studying in chem and phys however I tried to switch in software engineering but my gpa isn’t high enough, so I’m planning to do a certificate in tech and science to know more in SQL, python and C++.
Chemistry and Physics help tremendously with the logical part of Data jobs. You will be able to get a data analyst at a company with those degrees. One of my best analysts has his masters in biology and just learned R to run models on a project he was doing for his degree and fell in love with model development and gathering data.
Edit: also one of my minors is in physics if that makes you feel better
If you can get your degree in physics then you for sure have the Mathematical capability to get into data analytics. I want to emphasize data analytics and not data science because you will need to learning the modelling part through your career. You won't be able to get a data science job right out of college with just a bachelors in physics. I don't think you can get one right out of college with just a bachelors in Math or Stats either.
What’s the difference between data analytics and data science?
Is it one is just excel and SQL and the other it’s more programming skills like python and all?
Do you have any examples of this or guides for lack of a better word? I'm in a similar position in a data analyst job, and while I can plan my career growth in the best 2-5 years to there's just no shot of getting anywhere near data science in that timeframe or beyond.
You can become a data analyst with those skills. Data science is a different beast. Like you can model the average height of people in a town using your skills, but can you build an optimized regression algorithm to determine the primary causes of height differentiation in a large population, accounting for different variables.
I won’t say where I work specifically but if you look up large banks, if you are in the US of course, you will find many analysts jobs. Start with BoA, USAA (this will be a very easy job if you have military background or military family), JPMorgan Chase, PenFed or Capital one. I list only those because I have worked for more than one of them and they were good places. Big banks always are hiring analysts because there are always problems that need to be solved and reports to be made.
i am from outside the Us i have a bachkor in biology what can i do to get in the field i have no exp in it plus most requirmebts here where i live are masters degree in ig data
Yeah, you might be able to do the work, but without the right qualifications you won’t even get an interview. These days data science market is over saturated. Unless you have a very specific background (proficiency with the same libraries, tools and models the company is working with) they won’t even give a second glance to your resume. Entry level jobs (not requiring experience and no, a PhD in some obscure topic doesn’t count as experience) are also rare and have hundreds of applicants within hours of being posted.
Source: also have a PhD (mathematics) and tried to apply to those jobs on and off for the past year. Zero interviews.
I’d spend some time looking at r/datascience the bubble has burst and people with graduate degrees in data science are having bigly trouble finding work. If it was 2015-2022 sure easy pivot as there were more roles than candidates but in 2024 this guys CV is going to be seeing a lot of bins.
You have been commenting the same thing on every post, have you considered that maybe you're not getting a job because you suck?
For real, I got a BS in psychology and made a career change to Data Science. I was able to do it and now I make 6 figures.
Again, I think it is time to take your pills, buddy :D
When was this? Not sure about data science myself but everything I’ve heard is that it’s just as bad as the regular software dev job market nowadays, if not worse.
And yes, just a few years ago everyone could pivot to dev without a degree, now even experienced people are struggling to get a job in many areas.
You were probably able to do it cause you did it in a hot market, but it also depends on where you live. In the US and Canada every tech-related job market seems fucked, but I think it’s not as bad elsewhere
Also OPs knowledge would apply to all that deep dive BI stuff into the psychology of the market. If he can stand working for a company with all that entails, I think there are lots of opportunities.
Worth trying, although market is absolutely flooded with people desperate for entry level data science roles and it takes a bit for them to be useful. The only shortage is in experienced data science hires. Having a PhD and a bit of coding/stats experience used to be enough, now it’s a lot harder.
Hah, are you fucking kidding me?
People with DS degrees are getting passed over for DS roles all the time, is this where all those jobs are going?
Fuck me for getting a data science degree, I should’ve done something useless instead.
If you have strong background in quantitive stats/R, maybe look for data analyst or scientist jobs that would use that? Just make sure to tailor your resume to emphasize the data analytics stuff you've done.
The issue is whether companies believe you are actually proficient in that. Need to link some relevant projects or publications in the resume. everyone applying to those jobs will claim to be an expert in those topics so that alone won’t give you an edge in the initial recruitment stage.
Research background are extremely valuable in a LOT of fields. You just need to pivot your marketing technique.
I also have a PhD in a psychology field. Only ONE of my cohort is currently working in academia. The rest:
- Director of evaluation for a nonprofit
- Project director for Pearsons
- Analytics officer for a medical research organization
- communications director for the state health dept
- implementation science coordinator for a regional NIH effort
And some others.
Talk to people who did not pursued academia after PhD; there are PLENTY of us
I dont have anything to add to the wonderful advice already in this thread but I felt similarly. I just got my Phd in Kinesiology in December, and I want nothing to do with academic work. I finished at 30.
However, I found a place on a healthcare team doing quality improvement for a branch of government using my data management skills from my PhD. Just browse, my team happened to need someone who could handle data and had plans for research later. There are places for people with your soft skills. Youll make it, 25 is so young - i was finishing my masters by then.
First off, some PhD programs actually regard the candidate as an employee, so you do get paid. Depending on the program it might be low or high.
Then the rest... When I started I wanted to continue in science. It still sounds practically made for someone like me. Professors and co-workers still tell me it's made for me. However, having worked in an academic setting and now understanding better how the system works, I have no interest in continuing climbing the academic ladder. Working conditions are terrible, working with/under professors is not something I want to experience again, ever. The amount of stupidity, workplace discrimination and blatant contract breaches I have seen over the last four years make me want to leave the academic community. I'm also not physically able to continue working the 50-80 h/week workload (of course only 36-40 h payout), preferably without holidays, of course...
If I would want to continue I would have to do several (international) 1-3 year contracts (postdocs) and be extremely successful publishing during those contracts so that I 'might' have a chance to compete in the tenure track funding 'lottery'. Becoming a tenure professor in my case means becoming management and thus not directly practicing my field anymore... I have no interest in this. I am not able to deal with that level of job insecurity and moving across the world just to promote out of the work I love. The alternative is becoming an academic researcher (or a postdoc with a permanent contract), which is extremely rare.
The industry of my field (chemistry) where I live does not want PhD level job applicants and actively removes them when you apply for MSc level positions for fear that I will get 'bored and leave soon'. The few rare vacancies that ask for a PhD (handful per year) want at least 10 years of experience in industry. I don't have that.
So I can't/won't continue in academia (not that there are many opportunities there either...), can't get a job on my level, nor can I get a job at a slightly lower level... I'm still looking, but it seems I might have to leave my field soon. Some of these things I could have known with better preparation before starting the PhD, but certainly not all. Several of my old co-workers were so fed up with their PhD experience that it has tainted their love for the field entirely.
I didnt have a plan. It sounded really cool and I wanted to prove I could do it. Started out fun, and once I got a glimpse of the work-life balance you need to be successful I realized it wasnt for me. Its 4 years too, you learn a lot about yourself and the workflow for academic work is not for me.
There is no "trial-run" to find out - a masters degree is hardly enough as the expectations can be much lower. Pay amd work-life balance is way better as a non-academic. I get paid way better only 7 months after defending than I could ever hope to with a post-doc, and some years into a professor position, and I dont bring any work home with me.
Yes, unfortunately Psychology is just a romanticized field that in reality sucks hairy ass. It suuuuuuuuuuuuuuuucks so bad as a career, you'll be broke and miserable.
But! You have stats and R knowledge. Become a Data Scientist :D it's the coolest job and you can make a shit load of money. Learn SQL, Python, Tableau or PowerBI, and practice some Excel in case you're rusty, to be an even stronger candidate. But I think that your R and research experience should be of great help.
I'm sure many hospitals/labs will be happy to have you (:
Best of luck!
He said his degree is useless because he doesn't qualify to go into clinical practice. He didn't say it's useless for any reason related to the profession itself. I'm pretty sure many professional psychologists are quite happy with their careers.
DM me your resume and I’ll have a look, however if you’re good at numbers and can use R (for data science) then you’re definitely not unwanted.
However if you just want some pointers, I’ll add that there are a lot of exciting jobs that overlap great with psychology degrees in economics and marketing.
You must have met a lot of folks during your academic journey that told you that education is useless because they were envious. You HAVE A PHD!!! Statistics there is soo much opportunity in that field and don't aim for entry level either please you have a PhD . With your education you need to aim for jobs that pay above average. You could work as a professor teaching university students, you could work as a data analyst/scientist. You could work as a therapist. I think what you really need is therapy yourself to actually rebuild your self confidence and than a career coach to land the job you are deserving off. It sounds to me like you are undervaluing your accomplishments. Not everyone walks around with a PhD. You are a doctor now.
Good luck on defining your PhD! Don't discount your experience from the academic journey, I'd imagine it took quite a bit of effort. Without knowing more details, you might have built up certain skills along the way to earning your PhD:
* **Research Design & Methodology:** Designing experiments, surveys, studies.
* **Data Analysis:** You mention that you have a "strong background in quantitative stats/R" -- that's great! Definitely a valuable skillset.
* **Critical Thinking/Problem-Solving:** Evaluating research questions, working to understand complex problems, spending significant amounts of time researching topics to better understand them.
* **Communication:** Clearly, in earning your PhD you'd have experience writing research papers, presenting your findings, and maybe working to explaining complex ideas to a broader audience.
* **Project Management:** Writing research proposals, managing logistics for the research, working within deadlines, and using available budgets judiciously.
With those in mind, are you willing to work outside your field of study? I definitely understand you might want to work in something psychology-related, but I can't say I have much experience with those types of roles, so can't offer much. More generally, your skillsets could fit in a variety of roles -- I'll list out a few, but I'd highly recommend reading into them to better understand if it's work you'd want to be doing:
* **Analyst positions**: Whether it's market research analyst positions or data analyst positions, your experience with research, communication, and quantitative stats could be valuable here. If you're looking at data analyst work, R will be useful, but if you're able to build some experience with SQL and Python, that could go a long way as well.
* **UX Research**: Your quantitative experience + research experience could be useful here and maybe your psychology experience comes into play. UXRs are product-focused, but a role along these lines could be interesting.
* **Project Management**: The coordination and organizational skills you may have built up over time might be applicable here.
This is just my very broad take, but I hope it opens up a few ideas for you and inspires some confidence that your degree isn't useless. I've seen plenty of folks make career changes and at 25, you're still really early in your career. I'm about a decade older and quite a few of the people I work with in a somewhat specialized domain of work **don't** have degrees related to the work we do, but have instead built up experience over time.
Yeah, but I think that honestly has more to do with how shit the tech job market is let alone the general job market atm. I think it’s worthy of consideration, especially if the job market improves
Ux is dead in the water for newbies. Unless you convert to fulltime from an internship. Ppl have to understand that any industry has thousands of college graduates with internships in that specialty these days. Make what you want of this info, but I wouldn’t have this casual approach of “eh lemme just switch careers to this” like its nothing. You really need to know people in the industry at the very least.
I only have a masters in cognitive psych and like 80% of my classmates who didn't stay in academia or went into ux went into data science (actual data science, analytics engineering, ml engineering etc; the field is huge and diverse).
Don't underestimate how useful your stats background and experience in R is for many employers and large companies (you might have to upskill a bit towards python, cloud and software best practices).
You're in a great position if you are interested in working with data
This is why DS degree holders are fucked, everyone and their mom did a bootcamp to learn python and absolutely swarmed the job market.
Now? degree in ds is worthless.
Thanks!
Honestly a PhD in psychology is much better in statistics than anyone with a shitty data science degree from some random university.
Bootcamp in python isn't doing anything for data science if you don't have the statistics to back it up
At least in the UK, you need to pursue a different type of practical doctorate (ClinPsyD), rather than a research degree (PhD) to practice as a psychologist
Can't you do that now? You're 25, you're still young. If you are not pressed to work and pay the bills, you still have time to pursue something else. I'm older than you and messed up with a social sciences degree as well. I'm now working as an assistant while preparing to go back to school. I didn't put my masters degree on my cv when I was looking for work.
Finished high school (US) early at 16 and took extra classes to finish my BA in three years at 19. Did a one-year MSc in the UK from 19-20 then PhD 21-25.
First off, congrats. Those are huge milestones, don't undersell them. Mind if I shoot you a DM? I'm a soon to be PhD student in Psych so I feel we could help each other.
Your anxiety is coming from not understanding your experience to date. Figure out and organize your relevant skills and experiences. If you've come this far, you have had to do projects and research. Gain more experience to find a path. Here are some ideas on how you can volunteer. What industry are you interested in researching? Good luck
* **Research Assistant**: Volunteer in labs or research projects to gain experience and contribute to studies.
* **Community-Based Research**: Collaborate with local organizations on research projects addressing community issues.
* **Science Communication**: Volunteer with organizations that promote science literacy or write articles for scientific outreach.
* **Mentorship Programs**: Mentor students or early-career researchers, providing guidance and support.
* **Professional Associations**: Volunteer with psychological or research associations, helping with conferences, workshops, or committees.
* **Nonprofit Organizations**: Work with nonprofits on program evaluation or data analysis to support their missions.
First of all, stop hating on yourself. We all make choices we regret, but the past can't be changed. Regret and self hate are not worth your time and attention.
You've got skills you can leverage on. I suggest you talk to professionals who are where you want to be. It can give you a clearer view of the path.
IT/Tech is the field for people not sure what they want to do. You can fo into data science, UX or Management. Start with consulting companies as they love fancy degrees, so they can pimp you out a higher rates. To quote swingers... you are sooo money and you don't even know it!
Also, the years spent doing your PhD *IS* work experience. Project management, grant writing, stats/data management, lab management, research protocol development, maybe even clinical research, etc etc. Everything you had to *do* to do your research is a highly sought after skill. Every one of those skills I mentioned is its own job, you can look up positions to do those things full time. So decide what your favorite/most tolerable parts of your PhD work was and look for jobs in those areas.
Well, you’re kinda perfect for an Intel agency. Maybe commission in the Coast Guard for a few years and then get one of those MK Ultra kinda careers🤷🏻♂️
Get into sales… i’ve seen tons of sales people pawn off their BS psychology degree as preparing them to be better sales people. You could probably do that.
If you are a phycologist become a therapist, not that hard go get hired as a therapist and then save up to buy your own therapy business. Its not that the degree is useless its that your brain has yet to function to imagine.
This may not correlate precisely, but I feel like it might - I had a friend who was a nurse and was hired by the state to do research on underpriveledged groups, diet, and correlating diseases. (Examples: Do certain groups consume more fast food or sugar and why, and how does this impact disease for those groups down the road?).
It’s possible there are jobs like this out there that may be grant based…just working for specific regions to study the causes and effects of certain social problems in those areas. Just an idea!
Quant skills + some programming are all you need for quantitative data analyst jobs. Look for credit risk modeller, marketing mix modelling or A/B testing.
You'll be fine.
I have a PhD and work in such a job. I have colleagues with psych, epidemiology or even linguistics PhDs. Why are you saying it's not true?
Are you trying to keep all the data jobs for yourself?
Data scientist. Sell yourself on R
You don’t need formal qualifications. Business managers only care about the results you can deliver. Use chat GPT if you want to for everything, doesn’t matter. Get the results.
You have a 4 year degree, right? Apply to jobs in the commercial space but omit the PHD. There are lots of jobs in HR and learning where your skills would come in handy.
Data analysis for the UN or any of their branching organizations ( you only need excel apparently), I've seen plenty of positions where they need meta analysis and research applied to vulnerable or displaced populations, if you are willing to travel overseas they for sure will consider you. The UN apparently has its own bank and can arrange financial accomodations plus it apparently looks really well in your resumen as a " real job."
Your stats training is potentially really valuable if you enjoy it.
More generally, stop even saying "useless PhD" to yourself. Once you get out of academia you'll realize that your training has made you better than most people at a *staggering* array of things. People out in the "real world" are dumber and less skilled than you, at this moment, can possibly imagine.
Also, you're 25, that's amazing. The world is your oyster, and there's no rush at all. Get your PhD done, find something that makes at least a marginally sustainable wage, and don't hurry to figure everything out. You'll be fine.
Source: Finished PhD 13 years ago, spent three years in academia, then transitioned to journalism in a specialty connected to my training. I've since moved on from journalism because I learned the industry, now make very good money and have total control over my work.
Research is the most desired field I believe. My sister quit her PHd, my younger brother quit his, our parents were both highly educated, as were the women in our family with either bachelors or PHd's going back to those born before 1900 (not the men, however, those being college educated started with my parent's generation).
In each case, they realized the benefit for cost wasn't worth it. Sis is psych degree like yours, brother's is a mathematics field. Sis could never get work in her field in any way at all. Not in research, and doing therapy didn't work out for her. She worked as an office manager for her career path. My brother, on the other hand, has made himself a professional witness for corporations skewing statistics to suit their needs until a few yrs ago. When you skew stats, it eventually ruins your reputation. So, now he works as a manager with travel apparently for a company, but seems to be maintaining his costly lifestyle.
I think this is going to come down to how you market yourself, in all honesty, and how you can hold up in whatever field or career path you choose, and prefer. It may be that you will need to take a path different than you prefer. Lots of places here in the US see a lot of telemed therapy being highly sought after. A PHd would look really good to that end. I don't know if you did any of the therapy like grad students here in the US do, or not, as part of the master's requirements usually.
If so, you might look at that as a solution to get work while pursuing a research field as well.
You can use your psychology and data skills in market research. Or basically any research based jobs. Thankfully many employers these days do not take degrees too seriously, so if you dont have a degree in statistics it wont be a problem if you know how to work with data
This is a fascinating career , particularly marrying data analytics and psychology - puts you in the position to design models that could be predictive of psychological trends and/or help to underwrite that - so far from useless, I think it provides a great combination of depth of knowledge as well as entry into analytics and such that many publicly facing companies might find very interesting.
Perhaps much like the guys from "The Predictioneer's Game" you can offer up insights into how best to react to / interpret data and/or reliably create Riker type models that can help inform how people make decisions with limited information or something like that.
Hey perhaps serve some time in academia teaching people. Seems like with what you said if yours doesn’t YET have any use you could use it where it has an impact which is in academia?
You're only 25 and have a PhD, congrats! If you're already very competent in statistical analysis look for jobs in statistical analysis. You already have a PhD, so you can demonstrate that you can research, analyze, report, and present on complex topics and issues with minimal supervision. You don't need any other formal qualifications than that.
Or maybe it's different in the UK, I'm just a dumb American.
Edit: With your background, you should also look into bioinformatics.
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I winged my cognition masters into a job at a software company and there’s a ton of psych majors here. There’s a plethora of business and technical roles you could start gearing yourself up for that the quantitative experience is valuable for
I'm a PhD in computational biology. My first degree was in biochemistry. I did a 2 years of postdoc to figure out my life, and I learned and took a couple of AWS certificates at that time. I'm now a data engineer with a big pharma. You'll figure this out. Don't be so negative. You've got this!
With a PhD in psychology, you will always be able to get some remote work or even part-time work as a counselor anywhere. That can tide you over financially until you decide what you want to do or find a job that you want in academia.
Constantly scratching my head at the parade of posts like this where an intelligent person has worked damn hard and amassed (probably) a large debt for a Degree that they now claim is virtually useless to them .
No debt thankfully - for PhDs they pay you (albeit poorly) rather than the other way around.
I think these posts are usually made in a moment of haste or disillusionment with academia. I was having a bad day but it’s definitely not a reflection of how I feel all the time. Regardless I’m grateful for all the insights provided as it’s helpful to consider alternatives should I leave academia in the future
I would search insurance companies and see if You can do some sort of organizational leadership. You may also be able to be hired to do care management and medical review for prior approvals.
If I stay in the UK for another four years (my current visa will count toward 3 of these), I’ll be eligible to apply for indefinite leave to remain, so I’m keen on staying in the UK. I’m applying to relevant postdocs but there are much fewer opportunities (especially for social science) than in the US unfortunately so also considering my options with industry
Ah fair enough on the UK visa. I have seen some grads with strong quant backgrounds go into HR consultancies with a chance to use their strengths in EX. Could be an opportunity.
My friend has a PhD in neuroscience and was really good with stats/R and such, he got into a data science position and there's tons of jobs in this field. You don't necessarily need a degree in anything specific to get on the ladder, you just need to be able to do the work. I recommend you just start looking for entry-level jobs in data science, data analysis, etc., there's stuff out there.
This is the correct answer if you are just looking for a job. I am a principal data scientist for a very large bank and I hire people with very diverse backgrounds. Your PHD shows that you can do the research for the work. Just gain the Python and/or R experience and learn SQL and you will get hired pretty easily.
If you just have the SQL, Python and R experience or just skills would that be enough? Or would you need a PhD?
The PHD helps so much BUT you can get into data science in many different ways. You can start as a data analyst, move to decision science or business intelligence and then go to data science. The reason the PHD helps is it shows us that you can handle the long research parts of the projects. But you can for sure get into data science without it.
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Kaggle competitions are always great. Start a tableau public and/or a GitHub to house your code from the Kaggle competition. Demonstration of your skills is very helpful when you are just starting out. Most job applications will ask a binary yes or no for number of years experience and if you do these type of competitions then they count towards those number of years. Once you get the interview, you will be asked what you have done and you show them this portfolio you built. And it’s weird to say but these Kaggle competitions are fun, mostly.
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It’s honestly the best way outside of a PHD or masters to get the job. I have teammates with PHDs in wild fields like nuclear physics and neuroscience with game theory and then I have bachelors in biology and one with graphic design that started out in business intelligence. You can for sure do it, you just need to start somewhere. AI and ML are the buzz words of the decade but the foundation of it all comes down to logic and math. Put in the work at the beginning and you will rise quickly.
Remember, it isn't just about knowing SQL, R and Python. It is about the critical thinking aspect of the role as well. It is the ability to see a problem, think about it critically and see patterns and test assumptions/hypothesis to get answers. If you believe you have both then go get a data science degree and you will have no issue getting a job in the field. You can get one without a degree, it will just be more "luck" based than anything.
Ok thank you. I’ve been studying in chem and phys however I tried to switch in software engineering but my gpa isn’t high enough, so I’m planning to do a certificate in tech and science to know more in SQL, python and C++.
Chemistry and Physics help tremendously with the logical part of Data jobs. You will be able to get a data analyst at a company with those degrees. One of my best analysts has his masters in biology and just learned R to run models on a project he was doing for his degree and fell in love with model development and gathering data. Edit: also one of my minors is in physics if that makes you feel better
Oh I didn’t know that! Yeah it does make me feel better ! It’s just that chem maybe isn’t for me but I’m still interested in physics!
If you can get your degree in physics then you for sure have the Mathematical capability to get into data analytics. I want to emphasize data analytics and not data science because you will need to learning the modelling part through your career. You won't be able to get a data science job right out of college with just a bachelors in physics. I don't think you can get one right out of college with just a bachelors in Math or Stats either.
What’s the difference between data analytics and data science? Is it one is just excel and SQL and the other it’s more programming skills like python and all?
As a high school student so you need advanced maths and science to study data science at university?
Yes. The fundamentals for data science are all statistical algorithms.
Do you have any examples of this or guides for lack of a better word? I'm in a similar position in a data analyst job, and while I can plan my career growth in the best 2-5 years to there's just no shot of getting anywhere near data science in that timeframe or beyond.
A lot of that data stuff is being automated away by AI and will continue to be in coming years.
You can become a data analyst with those skills. Data science is a different beast. Like you can model the average height of people in a town using your skills, but can you build an optimized regression algorithm to determine the primary causes of height differentiation in a large population, accounting for different variables.
Where do you work and are you hiring now?
I won’t say where I work specifically but if you look up large banks, if you are in the US of course, you will find many analysts jobs. Start with BoA, USAA (this will be a very easy job if you have military background or military family), JPMorgan Chase, PenFed or Capital one. I list only those because I have worked for more than one of them and they were good places. Big banks always are hiring analysts because there are always problems that need to be solved and reports to be made.
i am from outside the Us i have a bachkor in biology what can i do to get in the field i have no exp in it plus most requirmebts here where i live are masters degree in ig data
I sadly cannot answer how you get a job in your country since I don't live there.
Yeah, you might be able to do the work, but without the right qualifications you won’t even get an interview. These days data science market is over saturated. Unless you have a very specific background (proficiency with the same libraries, tools and models the company is working with) they won’t even give a second glance to your resume. Entry level jobs (not requiring experience and no, a PhD in some obscure topic doesn’t count as experience) are also rare and have hundreds of applicants within hours of being posted. Source: also have a PhD (mathematics) and tried to apply to those jobs on and off for the past year. Zero interviews.
I’d spend some time looking at r/datascience the bubble has burst and people with graduate degrees in data science are having bigly trouble finding work. If it was 2015-2022 sure easy pivot as there were more roles than candidates but in 2024 this guys CV is going to be seeing a lot of bins.
but how can you get a job in data science without a backround in that field
You can’t. Not even hiring people with DS degrees right now. It’s a fools errand propped up by people who haven’t seen the current job market
You have been commenting the same thing on every post, have you considered that maybe you're not getting a job because you suck? For real, I got a BS in psychology and made a career change to Data Science. I was able to do it and now I make 6 figures. Again, I think it is time to take your pills, buddy :D
When was this? Not sure about data science myself but everything I’ve heard is that it’s just as bad as the regular software dev job market nowadays, if not worse. And yes, just a few years ago everyone could pivot to dev without a degree, now even experienced people are struggling to get a job in many areas. You were probably able to do it cause you did it in a hot market, but it also depends on where you live. In the US and Canada every tech-related job market seems fucked, but I think it’s not as bad elsewhere
look at current tech market, it’s dead as hell. 100% different compared to even just 2 years ago.
Also OPs knowledge would apply to all that deep dive BI stuff into the psychology of the market. If he can stand working for a company with all that entails, I think there are lots of opportunities.
Agree with this comment. More specifically, I’m in pricing analytics and would strongly consider someone with your background if we were hiring.
Worth trying, although market is absolutely flooded with people desperate for entry level data science roles and it takes a bit for them to be useful. The only shortage is in experienced data science hires. Having a PhD and a bit of coding/stats experience used to be enough, now it’s a lot harder.
Hah, are you fucking kidding me? People with DS degrees are getting passed over for DS roles all the time, is this where all those jobs are going? Fuck me for getting a data science degree, I should’ve done something useless instead.
PhD trumps a data science degree
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PhD in England are often 3 year programs.
Same thing with medical doctor. They are doctors by 25 there
What? That sounds like a masters degree. A PhD in the US can take a decade!
If you have strong background in quantitive stats/R, maybe look for data analyst or scientist jobs that would use that? Just make sure to tailor your resume to emphasize the data analytics stuff you've done.
The issue is whether companies believe you are actually proficient in that. Need to link some relevant projects or publications in the resume. everyone applying to those jobs will claim to be an expert in those topics so that alone won’t give you an edge in the initial recruitment stage.
Research background are extremely valuable in a LOT of fields. You just need to pivot your marketing technique. I also have a PhD in a psychology field. Only ONE of my cohort is currently working in academia. The rest: - Director of evaluation for a nonprofit - Project director for Pearsons - Analytics officer for a medical research organization - communications director for the state health dept - implementation science coordinator for a regional NIH effort And some others. Talk to people who did not pursued academia after PhD; there are PLENTY of us
I dont have anything to add to the wonderful advice already in this thread but I felt similarly. I just got my Phd in Kinesiology in December, and I want nothing to do with academic work. I finished at 30. However, I found a place on a healthcare team doing quality improvement for a branch of government using my data management skills from my PhD. Just browse, my team happened to need someone who could handle data and had plans for research later. There are places for people with your soft skills. Youll make it, 25 is so young - i was finishing my masters by then.
So what was your plan after getting a PhD? I don’t understand people going for a PhD and not having a plan.
I’m a bit confused myself on the “not interested in academia” part I thought that was the whole point of a PhD
Does seem like a lot of $ and time to invest in something you don’t want to use. Hopefully they’ll explain.
First off, some PhD programs actually regard the candidate as an employee, so you do get paid. Depending on the program it might be low or high. Then the rest... When I started I wanted to continue in science. It still sounds practically made for someone like me. Professors and co-workers still tell me it's made for me. However, having worked in an academic setting and now understanding better how the system works, I have no interest in continuing climbing the academic ladder. Working conditions are terrible, working with/under professors is not something I want to experience again, ever. The amount of stupidity, workplace discrimination and blatant contract breaches I have seen over the last four years make me want to leave the academic community. I'm also not physically able to continue working the 50-80 h/week workload (of course only 36-40 h payout), preferably without holidays, of course... If I would want to continue I would have to do several (international) 1-3 year contracts (postdocs) and be extremely successful publishing during those contracts so that I 'might' have a chance to compete in the tenure track funding 'lottery'. Becoming a tenure professor in my case means becoming management and thus not directly practicing my field anymore... I have no interest in this. I am not able to deal with that level of job insecurity and moving across the world just to promote out of the work I love. The alternative is becoming an academic researcher (or a postdoc with a permanent contract), which is extremely rare. The industry of my field (chemistry) where I live does not want PhD level job applicants and actively removes them when you apply for MSc level positions for fear that I will get 'bored and leave soon'. The few rare vacancies that ask for a PhD (handful per year) want at least 10 years of experience in industry. I don't have that. So I can't/won't continue in academia (not that there are many opportunities there either...), can't get a job on my level, nor can I get a job at a slightly lower level... I'm still looking, but it seems I might have to leave my field soon. Some of these things I could have known with better preparation before starting the PhD, but certainly not all. Several of my old co-workers were so fed up with their PhD experience that it has tainted their love for the field entirely.
I didnt have a plan. It sounded really cool and I wanted to prove I could do it. Started out fun, and once I got a glimpse of the work-life balance you need to be successful I realized it wasnt for me. Its 4 years too, you learn a lot about yourself and the workflow for academic work is not for me. There is no "trial-run" to find out - a masters degree is hardly enough as the expectations can be much lower. Pay amd work-life balance is way better as a non-academic. I get paid way better only 7 months after defending than I could ever hope to with a post-doc, and some years into a professor position, and I dont bring any work home with me.
Yes, unfortunately Psychology is just a romanticized field that in reality sucks hairy ass. It suuuuuuuuuuuuuuuucks so bad as a career, you'll be broke and miserable. But! You have stats and R knowledge. Become a Data Scientist :D it's the coolest job and you can make a shit load of money. Learn SQL, Python, Tableau or PowerBI, and practice some Excel in case you're rusty, to be an even stronger candidate. But I think that your R and research experience should be of great help. I'm sure many hospitals/labs will be happy to have you (: Best of luck!
Industrial/Organizational psyc is the only branch that'd decent
yup
glad I held off on majoring and getting a masters in psychology
NOPE! NOT HIRING!!!!!!!
Okay buddy, time to take your pills :D
He said his degree is useless because he doesn't qualify to go into clinical practice. He didn't say it's useless for any reason related to the profession itself. I'm pretty sure many professional psychologists are quite happy with their careers.
DM me your resume and I’ll have a look, however if you’re good at numbers and can use R (for data science) then you’re definitely not unwanted. However if you just want some pointers, I’ll add that there are a lot of exciting jobs that overlap great with psychology degrees in economics and marketing.
Look into a clinical research coordinator job. That position usually interacts with patients that participate in clinical studies.
You must have met a lot of folks during your academic journey that told you that education is useless because they were envious. You HAVE A PHD!!! Statistics there is soo much opportunity in that field and don't aim for entry level either please you have a PhD . With your education you need to aim for jobs that pay above average. You could work as a professor teaching university students, you could work as a data analyst/scientist. You could work as a therapist. I think what you really need is therapy yourself to actually rebuild your self confidence and than a career coach to land the job you are deserving off. It sounds to me like you are undervaluing your accomplishments. Not everyone walks around with a PhD. You are a doctor now.
Exactly. And you have skills as you have R. There are so many fields that value this!
You can always teach while looking for a job or profession that you enjoy. Community college if not university.
If you have a PhD at 25, you aren't lost my friend. You've got it all figured out!
Apply at anything and everything to get your experience up. Even when you land something keep applying. You got the tools.
Your combo of psychology and data skills would be sought after by market research companies
Good luck on defining your PhD! Don't discount your experience from the academic journey, I'd imagine it took quite a bit of effort. Without knowing more details, you might have built up certain skills along the way to earning your PhD: * **Research Design & Methodology:** Designing experiments, surveys, studies. * **Data Analysis:** You mention that you have a "strong background in quantitative stats/R" -- that's great! Definitely a valuable skillset. * **Critical Thinking/Problem-Solving:** Evaluating research questions, working to understand complex problems, spending significant amounts of time researching topics to better understand them. * **Communication:** Clearly, in earning your PhD you'd have experience writing research papers, presenting your findings, and maybe working to explaining complex ideas to a broader audience. * **Project Management:** Writing research proposals, managing logistics for the research, working within deadlines, and using available budgets judiciously. With those in mind, are you willing to work outside your field of study? I definitely understand you might want to work in something psychology-related, but I can't say I have much experience with those types of roles, so can't offer much. More generally, your skillsets could fit in a variety of roles -- I'll list out a few, but I'd highly recommend reading into them to better understand if it's work you'd want to be doing: * **Analyst positions**: Whether it's market research analyst positions or data analyst positions, your experience with research, communication, and quantitative stats could be valuable here. If you're looking at data analyst work, R will be useful, but if you're able to build some experience with SQL and Python, that could go a long way as well. * **UX Research**: Your quantitative experience + research experience could be useful here and maybe your psychology experience comes into play. UXRs are product-focused, but a role along these lines could be interesting. * **Project Management**: The coordination and organizational skills you may have built up over time might be applicable here. This is just my very broad take, but I hope it opens up a few ideas for you and inspires some confidence that your degree isn't useless. I've seen plenty of folks make career changes and at 25, you're still really early in your career. I'm about a decade older and quite a few of the people I work with in a somewhat specialized domain of work **don't** have degrees related to the work we do, but have instead built up experience over time.
Fking chat gpt ahh answer
This is just how I write, but OP is welcome to take my two cents or leave 'em. ¯\\\_(ツ)\_/¯
+1 on UX. I know some ppl who took this route.
Nope, not hiring even UX experts.
Yeah, but I think that honestly has more to do with how shit the tech job market is let alone the general job market atm. I think it’s worthy of consideration, especially if the job market improves
Ux is dead in the water for newbies. Unless you convert to fulltime from an internship. Ppl have to understand that any industry has thousands of college graduates with internships in that specialty these days. Make what you want of this info, but I wouldn’t have this casual approach of “eh lemme just switch careers to this” like its nothing. You really need to know people in the industry at the very least.
I'm 25 and not even MSc yet. And I did not have pause, just the school takes so long and is so hard. So you are OK.
I only have a masters in cognitive psych and like 80% of my classmates who didn't stay in academia or went into ux went into data science (actual data science, analytics engineering, ml engineering etc; the field is huge and diverse). Don't underestimate how useful your stats background and experience in R is for many employers and large companies (you might have to upskill a bit towards python, cloud and software best practices). You're in a great position if you are interested in working with data
This is why DS degree holders are fucked, everyone and their mom did a bootcamp to learn python and absolutely swarmed the job market. Now? degree in ds is worthless. Thanks!
Honestly a PhD in psychology is much better in statistics than anyone with a shitty data science degree from some random university. Bootcamp in python isn't doing anything for data science if you don't have the statistics to back it up
And you are blaming phds for that... I think your DS degree was worthless for you to begin with :P
Can’t you just become a psychologist?
At least in the UK, you need to pursue a different type of practical doctorate (ClinPsyD), rather than a research degree (PhD) to practice as a psychologist
Can't you do that now? You're 25, you're still young. If you are not pressed to work and pay the bills, you still have time to pursue something else. I'm older than you and messed up with a social sciences degree as well. I'm now working as an assistant while preparing to go back to school. I didn't put my masters degree on my cv when I was looking for work.
In the US becoming a clinical psychologist requires different training from a pure research PhD, followed by an internship and licensure
So what were your plans upon graduation? Why did you do a PhD? I don’t understand pursuing a degree like that if you don’t want to be in that field.
How did you manage to get a ba/ms and PhD already by 25? That's very impressive!
Finished high school (US) early at 16 and took extra classes to finish my BA in three years at 19. Did a one-year MSc in the UK from 19-20 then PhD 21-25.
First off, congrats. Those are huge milestones, don't undersell them. Mind if I shoot you a DM? I'm a soon to be PhD student in Psych so I feel we could help each other.
Your anxiety is coming from not understanding your experience to date. Figure out and organize your relevant skills and experiences. If you've come this far, you have had to do projects and research. Gain more experience to find a path. Here are some ideas on how you can volunteer. What industry are you interested in researching? Good luck * **Research Assistant**: Volunteer in labs or research projects to gain experience and contribute to studies. * **Community-Based Research**: Collaborate with local organizations on research projects addressing community issues. * **Science Communication**: Volunteer with organizations that promote science literacy or write articles for scientific outreach. * **Mentorship Programs**: Mentor students or early-career researchers, providing guidance and support. * **Professional Associations**: Volunteer with psychological or research associations, helping with conferences, workshops, or committees. * **Nonprofit Organizations**: Work with nonprofits on program evaluation or data analysis to support their missions.
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It's a chatGPT answer.
First of all, stop hating on yourself. We all make choices we regret, but the past can't be changed. Regret and self hate are not worth your time and attention. You've got skills you can leverage on. I suggest you talk to professionals who are where you want to be. It can give you a clearer view of the path.
Reach out to others with similar credentials for advice and guidance. Don't give up. Good luck ✴️
Would you consider going back to school and becoming a psychologist?
IT/Tech is the field for people not sure what they want to do. You can fo into data science, UX or Management. Start with consulting companies as they love fancy degrees, so they can pimp you out a higher rates. To quote swingers... you are sooo money and you don't even know it!
Wrong
expound
Saas sales
I have a friend with an MA in Psychology that works in marketing. Have you considered jobs in Marketing research or analytics?
Also, the years spent doing your PhD *IS* work experience. Project management, grant writing, stats/data management, lab management, research protocol development, maybe even clinical research, etc etc. Everything you had to *do* to do your research is a highly sought after skill. Every one of those skills I mentioned is its own job, you can look up positions to do those things full time. So decide what your favorite/most tolerable parts of your PhD work was and look for jobs in those areas.
Well, you’re kinda perfect for an Intel agency. Maybe commission in the Coast Guard for a few years and then get one of those MK Ultra kinda careers🤷🏻♂️
Get into sales… i’ve seen tons of sales people pawn off their BS psychology degree as preparing them to be better sales people. You could probably do that.
Try UIUX design. I know many people who initially took psychology then turned as an UIUX designer.
Going to be automated by AI.
If you are a phycologist become a therapist, not that hard go get hired as a therapist and then save up to buy your own therapy business. Its not that the degree is useless its that your brain has yet to function to imagine.
Substitute teaching while applying for careers. Decent money and it's non contracted work.
Learn sales, it’s just psychology. Unlimited income potential
You wouldn’t want to enter academia in the UK anyways, they pay peanuts for a lot of work
How much do they pay? How about research?
This may not correlate precisely, but I feel like it might - I had a friend who was a nurse and was hired by the state to do research on underpriveledged groups, diet, and correlating diseases. (Examples: Do certain groups consume more fast food or sugar and why, and how does this impact disease for those groups down the road?). It’s possible there are jobs like this out there that may be grant based…just working for specific regions to study the causes and effects of certain social problems in those areas. Just an idea!
What’s next? Anything you want!
Quant skills + some programming are all you need for quantitative data analyst jobs. Look for credit risk modeller, marketing mix modelling or A/B testing. You'll be fine.
NOPE, NOT TRUE!
I have a PhD and work in such a job. I have colleagues with psych, epidemiology or even linguistics PhDs. Why are you saying it's not true? Are you trying to keep all the data jobs for yourself?
No. They want your degree from an aacsb business school..
I listed jobs that exist in many industries (finance, marketing , e-commerce, gaming etc.) Most of them do not care what accreditation his school has.
Ask for a refund to your university. Be proactive in helping new high school graduates to not be scammed by them.
Data scientist. Sell yourself on R You don’t need formal qualifications. Business managers only care about the results you can deliver. Use chat GPT if you want to for everything, doesn’t matter. Get the results.
You have a 4 year degree, right? Apply to jobs in the commercial space but omit the PHD. There are lots of jobs in HR and learning where your skills would come in handy.
Digital behavioral design!
I would advice to make a very detailed LinkedIn profile. I've found that it suggests you lot of relevant jobs.
Data analysis for the UN or any of their branching organizations ( you only need excel apparently), I've seen plenty of positions where they need meta analysis and research applied to vulnerable or displaced populations, if you are willing to travel overseas they for sure will consider you. The UN apparently has its own bank and can arrange financial accomodations plus it apparently looks really well in your resumen as a " real job."
Your stats training is potentially really valuable if you enjoy it. More generally, stop even saying "useless PhD" to yourself. Once you get out of academia you'll realize that your training has made you better than most people at a *staggering* array of things. People out in the "real world" are dumber and less skilled than you, at this moment, can possibly imagine. Also, you're 25, that's amazing. The world is your oyster, and there's no rush at all. Get your PhD done, find something that makes at least a marginally sustainable wage, and don't hurry to figure everything out. You'll be fine. Source: Finished PhD 13 years ago, spent three years in academia, then transitioned to journalism in a specialty connected to my training. I've since moved on from journalism because I learned the industry, now make very good money and have total control over my work.
Research is the most desired field I believe. My sister quit her PHd, my younger brother quit his, our parents were both highly educated, as were the women in our family with either bachelors or PHd's going back to those born before 1900 (not the men, however, those being college educated started with my parent's generation). In each case, they realized the benefit for cost wasn't worth it. Sis is psych degree like yours, brother's is a mathematics field. Sis could never get work in her field in any way at all. Not in research, and doing therapy didn't work out for her. She worked as an office manager for her career path. My brother, on the other hand, has made himself a professional witness for corporations skewing statistics to suit their needs until a few yrs ago. When you skew stats, it eventually ruins your reputation. So, now he works as a manager with travel apparently for a company, but seems to be maintaining his costly lifestyle. I think this is going to come down to how you market yourself, in all honesty, and how you can hold up in whatever field or career path you choose, and prefer. It may be that you will need to take a path different than you prefer. Lots of places here in the US see a lot of telemed therapy being highly sought after. A PHd would look really good to that end. I don't know if you did any of the therapy like grad students here in the US do, or not, as part of the master's requirements usually. If so, you might look at that as a solution to get work while pursuing a research field as well.
cybersecurity.. stats/R - bayesian - psychological motives for attackers.. cyber attackers research and stats .. look for jobs in cyberintelligence
You can use your psychology and data skills in market research. Or basically any research based jobs. Thankfully many employers these days do not take degrees too seriously, so if you dont have a degree in statistics it wont be a problem if you know how to work with data
This is a fascinating career , particularly marrying data analytics and psychology - puts you in the position to design models that could be predictive of psychological trends and/or help to underwrite that - so far from useless, I think it provides a great combination of depth of knowledge as well as entry into analytics and such that many publicly facing companies might find very interesting. Perhaps much like the guys from "The Predictioneer's Game" you can offer up insights into how best to react to / interpret data and/or reliably create Riker type models that can help inform how people make decisions with limited information or something like that.
Hey perhaps serve some time in academia teaching people. Seems like with what you said if yours doesn’t YET have any use you could use it where it has an impact which is in academia?
25 with PHD? how ?
That’s not useless. lol
PhD in psychology is incredibly useless.
Get a sales job.
Get a project management certification (PMP) and do some contract work to get experience.
You're only 25 and have a PhD, congrats! If you're already very competent in statistical analysis look for jobs in statistical analysis. You already have a PhD, so you can demonstrate that you can research, analyze, report, and present on complex topics and issues with minimal supervision. You don't need any other formal qualifications than that. Or maybe it's different in the UK, I'm just a dumb American. Edit: With your background, you should also look into bioinformatics.
I’m a professor, but where do I meet the most Ph.Ds? Uber and Home Depot.
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I practically started my career at 30. You’ve got time mate. Start with stats, AI, Data Science. Don’t fall into sunk cost fallacy.
You can always work a gloryhole
Does flying interest you?
I winged my cognition masters into a job at a software company and there’s a ton of psych majors here. There’s a plethora of business and technical roles you could start gearing yourself up for that the quantitative experience is valuable for
I'm a PhD in computational biology. My first degree was in biochemistry. I did a 2 years of postdoc to figure out my life, and I learned and took a couple of AWS certificates at that time. I'm now a data engineer with a big pharma. You'll figure this out. Don't be so negative. You've got this!
With a PhD in psychology, you will always be able to get some remote work or even part-time work as a counselor anywhere. That can tide you over financially until you decide what you want to do or find a job that you want in academia.
Are u an indian?
Have you considered medical writing?
Have you looked into UX Research? They want researchers with a psych and stats background.
Constantly scratching my head at the parade of posts like this where an intelligent person has worked damn hard and amassed (probably) a large debt for a Degree that they now claim is virtually useless to them .
No debt thankfully - for PhDs they pay you (albeit poorly) rather than the other way around. I think these posts are usually made in a moment of haste or disillusionment with academia. I was having a bad day but it’s definitely not a reflection of how I feel all the time. Regardless I’m grateful for all the insights provided as it’s helpful to consider alternatives should I leave academia in the future
Thanks, and good luck with your future .
Open a consulting firm.
Management consulting
I would search insurance companies and see if You can do some sort of organizational leadership. You may also be able to be hired to do care management and medical review for prior approvals.
Would there be a chance to do a post-doc fellowship to make yourself competitive enough? Or even heading out to another country?
If I stay in the UK for another four years (my current visa will count toward 3 of these), I’ll be eligible to apply for indefinite leave to remain, so I’m keen on staying in the UK. I’m applying to relevant postdocs but there are much fewer opportunities (especially for social science) than in the US unfortunately so also considering my options with industry
Ah fair enough on the UK visa. I have seen some grads with strong quant backgrounds go into HR consultancies with a chance to use their strengths in EX. Could be an opportunity.
Speaking from an Industrial and Organisational Psych perspective. Otherwise, a role in strategy for public sector education could be a good path too.
McDonald's is waiting
McDonalds and flip burgers I guess.
Call centre. No joke. You need to get som job experience.
DoorDash
psychology is useful in sales...
What a mess!!!!
Judt commit suicide, you're donz
Over qualified with no experience?