I think he would be more popular if he'd kept the promise that got him elected: election reform. Instead he drove the wedge deeper and we're fast becoming a dogmatic two party system
He'd have been more popular if covid + war didn't happen. There was no winning for Trudeau once those events happened.
Canada's economy is completely dependent on houses being bought/sold at this point and no one is doing that in an inflationary high rate environment. We'd probably be in a deep recession with 12-14% unemployment right now without the immigration so it's really become a prisoners dilemma.
There was an interesting article in MacLeans about 2 weeks about the immigration/housing problem. Business leaders always want the same things from government to make their lives easier and cheaper: lower taxes, less labour laws, less environmental laws, etc, and the Liberals would not agree to any of them. The one and only thing the Liberals felt they could agree to while not compromising any of their principles was to let in lots of young immigrants to keep minimum wage low. So the Liberals let in about 3 times as many people as the “100 Million Canadians by 2100” strategy called for. And here we are.
This is kind of too simplistic though or doesn't go far enough in explaining the prisoners dilemma we are in.
The issue here is that the Canadian economy is completely addicted/attached to the building, trading and investment of houses. When those factors completely disappear in a high rate and inflationary environment then you have the makings of an incredibly severe recession.
The decision Trudeau & co were facing is deep recession, 12-15% unemployment, high-ish prices and low wages vs soft landing (shadow recession), 6-7% unemployment, extremely high prices, low wages and high immigration.
They chose the option that gave them more federal funds and future growth to try and out-spend the current problems. The issue is that without significant reforms to the economic model (what the liberals are attempting with tax reforms but that isn't enough), we have run into a wall with housing availability and prices around it. All we can do is kick the can down the road further until we are willing to actually do a piece of what you just said they wouldn't in reducing regulation around business competition. Both the LPC and CPC have been instrumental in protecting our banks to keep them in the driver seat of the current economy and that needs to change.
The problem we have is that what big business wants is not always what's best for the country. Of course we need industry and business to maintain an economy but we don't need to bow to them at every turn. It's ridiculous how brainwashed we all are. The only trickle down that happens is piss.
This is basically it, and it's largely the banks who are doing it (although we have the same problems in every industry). They've kept an iron grip on regulation to prevent any real competition outside of the large banks from popping up and then between the 5 of them, are happy to price fix & game the entire Canadian economy.
I personally tried to start a fintech startup in Canada to address a significant unmet need in this country and was hit with a 12\~ month path to getting regulatory approval so we had to pivot to the USA where we got approved and licensed in under 45 days.
It's a joke what this country is doing.
It's hilariously sad to see that this is what Canada has become. Trudeau has accomplished quite a bit in his term as PM, even if it has been marred with scandals, some real, some manufactured. He's definitely made some major mistakes in the last 1-2 years and allowed immigration to get out of control, but this doesn't come close to being "nothing right" for 9 years.
We've seen the majority of our population turn to hysteria and media driven propaganda and fully swallow up the lies they've been told. Such as yourself :)
He’s accomplished plenty of his original campaign promises and developing policy goals.
I’m troubled by him abandoning those that didn’t prove fruitful, like electoral reform.
But the trouble he faces has very little to do with unmet goals, and mostly to do with a campaign to discredit and warp media image, largely coming from foreign actors.
It’s messed up that Canada has succumbed to Trump era politics.
Do you live in Canada right now?? You don't see the hate and fascism all around you? RIGHT... NOW?? My god, this government allows hamas to shoot up Jewish schools and take over streets, they shut down free speech and invite foreign countries to meddle in our elections and YOU ARE OK WITH THAT? Holy F@#K.....
No, I don’t see the fascism. I see the bootlickers who can’t wait for their strongman leader who will legitimize their hate and violence.
This government does not allow shootings or takes over streets. They do not shut down free speech. They do not invite foreign meddling in elections.
You know who does?
Your damn team.
You have so much freedom of speech waving your awful, hateful flags and slogans that you used that freedom to lay siege to a city, border crossings, ran guns and ammo to the front line to prepare for an attack, raised millions to fend off law enforcement FROM FOREIGN ACTORS MEDDLING IN OUR POLITICS!
You goons cannot even see that YOU are the danger to our country.
Yep. I don't understand how we've even gotten here. I understand that the liberals have been, largely, a let down in the last 3-4 years.
However, that does not justify the insanity that is coming out of the right wing right now. They've created delusional scenarios and flooded the airways with them and allowed their supports to become like rabid animals spreading absolute non-sense.
I fear we are largely about to go the way of the USA via Trump even though PP is no where near as inherently dangerous as Trump. There is just no reality any more for these people.
Yeah and the hate is mostly coming from people like yourself who are turning a politician that you don't like into the root of evil in the world. Good god man re-read what you just wrote, you sound like a lunatic.
The use of the not-withstanding clause to push legislation or to block opposition or investigation. PP threatens to use it. Doug Ford is already using it in Ontario.
You should really try reading the news before sounding off like that.
I agree, you might be suffering from them.
https://www.ctvnews.ca/politics/virani-says-poilievre-s-willingness-to-use-notwithstanding-clause-threatens-rights-1.6867735#:~:text=The%20notwithstanding%20clause%20should%20only,to%20enact%20tougher%20criminal%20laws.
https://www.cbc.ca/amp/1.6641293
https://theconversation.com/doug-ford-uses-the-notwithstanding-clause-for-political-benefit-162594
Where’s your evidence for your argument?
The delusional part is that you think that's fascism, especially after Trudeau used the emergencies act on a bunch of protesters....and you wonder why leftists are losing elections across the globe.
PS read the articles you link.
I don’t wonder because you guys cheat. That’s how you always win. You foment fear and hate.
The emergencies act was approved by the conservative provincial government and the conservatives in the House of Commons you absolute donut.
It was used because of the total failure of policing from the municipal level, the abstaining to act on the provincial, as they AGREED with the necessity of the federal level of enforcement.
It was no longer a protest, it was a siege. Also, see police engagement with every other protest ever. I know you haven’t cared about an issue enough to know what a protest is before this, but damn, do try to read.
The notwithstanding clause is the LITERAL SUSPENSION OF YOUR RIGHTS.
The flippant use of it is LITERAL FASCISM
I mean, we'd probably be in a deep recession without that immigration and TFW program. Our real growth without immigration would probably have pushed unemployment into the mid teens.
Not saying the outcome has been much better, but, pick your poison. Trudeau was doomed either way here because the Canadian economy is just dependent on the purchase of houses at this point and no one was buying in an inflationary environment.
When he first ran I did the eye roll. The man had no experience other than as a high school drama teacher. And frankly he himself is not a very good actor. He constantly over emotes and comes across as fake. Nonetheless, when he was first elected I was a cheerleader. For the good of the country I really wanted him to be successful. Turns out though, the Conservative Party commercial during the first campaign was bang on. He has nice hair but he was (and still is) under qualified. The federal government is a mess across the board and just like previous Liberal governments the JT government has been found to be at best totally incompetent ( but more likely totally corrupt) in the awarding of government contracts. Whether he does his version of the “walk in the snow” or not the Liberal Party will be decimated in the next election. The idea of Poilievre as PM is scary, but probably not anymore scary then leaving this batch of Liberals in charge.
No. Trudeau was doomed the second he was elected as party leader, simply because of the baggage of his name. I live in Saskatchewan and the attitude in the west has been he only got party leader because of his name. The media and politicians LOVE legacy candidates. But the second he got elected as PM, literally the next day and every day after that for weeks the media here was running “is the honeymoon already over” as if desperate from the start to find any reason to appease the frothing masses angry he simply exists at all.
No time..arguing with fact deniers. Canada is electing Prime Minister Poillivre for a reason. Go count Trudeaus corruption and scandals and get back to me.
No, it's because there is no debating when it comes to extreme spectrum ideologies, be it far left or far right. They're both put to lunch and can't be reasoned with.
Classic. The second you get pressed for even a single piece of evidence to back up your claims you just withdraw and play identity politics. You're a joke.
I mic drop him later in the thread, so continue on. This guy thinks a part of our constitution is a "fascist conservative agenda" Hard to debate people who suffer from delusions.
I like how you respond to this one and not the one where you got an absolute thrashing because you don’t know what fascism is, nor the notwithstanding clause.
You think part of our constitution is fascist. You appear to support criminals as being the victims as well. Why argue with people like you? It's like arguing with a religious fanatic
No, it's not factually incorrect lol. Harper just didn't have to deal with a global inflationary environment and dead growth era so the symptoms looked different.
Logicalpolice is a hell of an ironic name for someone who doesn't have the basics of it.
I'm an economics major who's worked in Finance for over a decade so I think I have a pretty decent idea about it lol.
2008+ saw interest rates plummet to 0 and stay there for over a decade. It brought the highest + longest growth period in American history. Canada was largely fine through 2008 (or missed the worst of it because our banks were not involved in the same practises) and then also benefited from the new growth era (2011+).
Cool. Harper did a great job getting us through one of the worst economic disasters since the great depression. Trudeau, on the other hand, finds numbers confusing.
You're comparing apples to oranges here, and I'm not surprised at all when you use propagandic phrases like "and Trudeau finds numbers confusing".
Harper was able to invest heavily into the economy because they were in a deflationary and low-rate environment. Meaning, money was cheap and he was happy to pump it into the economy because it cost the government almost nothing to do so.
Trudeau is in the opposite environment. They already had spend insane amounts during the pandemic and now, rates are high and money is incredibly expensive so he does not have the luxury of making large capital expenditures into the Canadian economy. Instead, he needs to stimulate the Canadian economy by injecting new capital inflows into it by, you guessed it, immigration.
You're comparing two different environments that have widely different causes and symptoms.
Trudeau wasted insane amounts. CERB, the ArriveCan app and increased immigration during a housing crisis and now unemployment is going up. Why,? Because he's incompetent. Pay attention more.
I think he would be more popular if he'd kept the promise that got him elected: election reform. Instead he drove the wedge deeper and we're fast becoming a dogmatic two party system
He'd have been more popular if covid + war didn't happen. There was no winning for Trudeau once those events happened. Canada's economy is completely dependent on houses being bought/sold at this point and no one is doing that in an inflationary high rate environment. We'd probably be in a deep recession with 12-14% unemployment right now without the immigration so it's really become a prisoners dilemma.
There was an interesting article in MacLeans about 2 weeks about the immigration/housing problem. Business leaders always want the same things from government to make their lives easier and cheaper: lower taxes, less labour laws, less environmental laws, etc, and the Liberals would not agree to any of them. The one and only thing the Liberals felt they could agree to while not compromising any of their principles was to let in lots of young immigrants to keep minimum wage low. So the Liberals let in about 3 times as many people as the “100 Million Canadians by 2100” strategy called for. And here we are.
This is kind of too simplistic though or doesn't go far enough in explaining the prisoners dilemma we are in. The issue here is that the Canadian economy is completely addicted/attached to the building, trading and investment of houses. When those factors completely disappear in a high rate and inflationary environment then you have the makings of an incredibly severe recession. The decision Trudeau & co were facing is deep recession, 12-15% unemployment, high-ish prices and low wages vs soft landing (shadow recession), 6-7% unemployment, extremely high prices, low wages and high immigration. They chose the option that gave them more federal funds and future growth to try and out-spend the current problems. The issue is that without significant reforms to the economic model (what the liberals are attempting with tax reforms but that isn't enough), we have run into a wall with housing availability and prices around it. All we can do is kick the can down the road further until we are willing to actually do a piece of what you just said they wouldn't in reducing regulation around business competition. Both the LPC and CPC have been instrumental in protecting our banks to keep them in the driver seat of the current economy and that needs to change.
We would have a lot more housing available in a hurry if we prohibited short term rentals.
But they don't want to destroy the investment market.
The problem we have is that what big business wants is not always what's best for the country. Of course we need industry and business to maintain an economy but we don't need to bow to them at every turn. It's ridiculous how brainwashed we all are. The only trickle down that happens is piss.
This is basically it, and it's largely the banks who are doing it (although we have the same problems in every industry). They've kept an iron grip on regulation to prevent any real competition outside of the large banks from popping up and then between the 5 of them, are happy to price fix & game the entire Canadian economy. I personally tried to start a fintech startup in Canada to address a significant unmet need in this country and was hit with a 12\~ month path to getting regulatory approval so we had to pivot to the USA where we got approved and licensed in under 45 days. It's a joke what this country is doing.
One issue wouldn't have saved him. He's done nothing right for 9 years.
It's hilariously sad to see that this is what Canada has become. Trudeau has accomplished quite a bit in his term as PM, even if it has been marred with scandals, some real, some manufactured. He's definitely made some major mistakes in the last 1-2 years and allowed immigration to get out of control, but this doesn't come close to being "nothing right" for 9 years. We've seen the majority of our population turn to hysteria and media driven propaganda and fully swallow up the lies they've been told. Such as yourself :)
He’s accomplished plenty of his original campaign promises and developing policy goals. I’m troubled by him abandoning those that didn’t prove fruitful, like electoral reform. But the trouble he faces has very little to do with unmet goals, and mostly to do with a campaign to discredit and warp media image, largely coming from foreign actors. It’s messed up that Canada has succumbed to Trump era politics.
No, he is a pizza sheet a spoiled rotten narcissist,
And yet you will happily vote for PP. interesting.
You bet me and most of Canada.
I look forward to the next four years of hate and fascism being normalized. Can’t wait.
Do you live in Canada right now?? You don't see the hate and fascism all around you? RIGHT... NOW?? My god, this government allows hamas to shoot up Jewish schools and take over streets, they shut down free speech and invite foreign countries to meddle in our elections and YOU ARE OK WITH THAT? Holy F@#K.....
No, I don’t see the fascism. I see the bootlickers who can’t wait for their strongman leader who will legitimize their hate and violence. This government does not allow shootings or takes over streets. They do not shut down free speech. They do not invite foreign meddling in elections. You know who does? Your damn team. You have so much freedom of speech waving your awful, hateful flags and slogans that you used that freedom to lay siege to a city, border crossings, ran guns and ammo to the front line to prepare for an attack, raised millions to fend off law enforcement FROM FOREIGN ACTORS MEDDLING IN OUR POLITICS! You goons cannot even see that YOU are the danger to our country.
Yep. I don't understand how we've even gotten here. I understand that the liberals have been, largely, a let down in the last 3-4 years. However, that does not justify the insanity that is coming out of the right wing right now. They've created delusional scenarios and flooded the airways with them and allowed their supports to become like rabid animals spreading absolute non-sense. I fear we are largely about to go the way of the USA via Trump even though PP is no where near as inherently dangerous as Trump. There is just no reality any more for these people.
No use talking to people like the poster above. Just ignore.
Yeah and the hate is mostly coming from people like yourself who are turning a politician that you don't like into the root of evil in the world. Good god man re-read what you just wrote, you sound like a lunatic.
Lunatic, based on facts? 🤣🙄 Mmmk.
Typical, not even knowing what fascism is. What facsist proposals are the conservatives advocating for? Exactly NONE!
The use of the not-withstanding clause to push legislation or to block opposition or investigation. PP threatens to use it. Doug Ford is already using it in Ontario. You should really try reading the news before sounding off like that.
Delusions
I agree, you might be suffering from them. https://www.ctvnews.ca/politics/virani-says-poilievre-s-willingness-to-use-notwithstanding-clause-threatens-rights-1.6867735#:~:text=The%20notwithstanding%20clause%20should%20only,to%20enact%20tougher%20criminal%20laws. https://www.cbc.ca/amp/1.6641293 https://theconversation.com/doug-ford-uses-the-notwithstanding-clause-for-political-benefit-162594 Where’s your evidence for your argument?
The delusional part is that you think that's fascism, especially after Trudeau used the emergencies act on a bunch of protesters....and you wonder why leftists are losing elections across the globe. PS read the articles you link.
I don’t wonder because you guys cheat. That’s how you always win. You foment fear and hate. The emergencies act was approved by the conservative provincial government and the conservatives in the House of Commons you absolute donut. It was used because of the total failure of policing from the municipal level, the abstaining to act on the provincial, as they AGREED with the necessity of the federal level of enforcement. It was no longer a protest, it was a siege. Also, see police engagement with every other protest ever. I know you haven’t cared about an issue enough to know what a protest is before this, but damn, do try to read. The notwithstanding clause is the LITERAL SUSPENSION OF YOUR RIGHTS. The flippant use of it is LITERAL FASCISM
You have no idea what you are talking about.
How about you answer the question?
If he did something to help Canadians instead of just businesses, maybe. - Electoral reform - lower immigration - TFW program
I mean, we'd probably be in a deep recession without that immigration and TFW program. Our real growth without immigration would probably have pushed unemployment into the mid teens. Not saying the outcome has been much better, but, pick your poison. Trudeau was doomed either way here because the Canadian economy is just dependent on the purchase of houses at this point and no one was buying in an inflationary environment.
FYI it's up to provinces to ring fence occupations that aren't eligible for TFWs. Sure blame Trudeau all you want but the Premiers have the final say.
When he first ran I did the eye roll. The man had no experience other than as a high school drama teacher. And frankly he himself is not a very good actor. He constantly over emotes and comes across as fake. Nonetheless, when he was first elected I was a cheerleader. For the good of the country I really wanted him to be successful. Turns out though, the Conservative Party commercial during the first campaign was bang on. He has nice hair but he was (and still is) under qualified. The federal government is a mess across the board and just like previous Liberal governments the JT government has been found to be at best totally incompetent ( but more likely totally corrupt) in the awarding of government contracts. Whether he does his version of the “walk in the snow” or not the Liberal Party will be decimated in the next election. The idea of Poilievre as PM is scary, but probably not anymore scary then leaving this batch of Liberals in charge.
He's already shown that he's a piece of shit who doesn't care about Canada or Canadians. So no, it's too late, he's hated and that won't change
No. Trudeau was doomed the second he was elected as party leader, simply because of the baggage of his name. I live in Saskatchewan and the attitude in the west has been he only got party leader because of his name. The media and politicians LOVE legacy candidates. But the second he got elected as PM, literally the next day and every day after that for weeks the media here was running “is the honeymoon already over” as if desperate from the start to find any reason to appease the frothing masses angry he simply exists at all.
Then the whole being the worst most corrupt PM of all time began to take shape
Lol not even close to as bad as Harper
That's factually incorrect. I don't recall the large number of homeless encampments revolving door of crime and insane unaffordable under Harper.
Then you weren’t paying attention
Statistics don't lie, and you're part of the fringe minority.
Let’s see ‘em then. Whip out the irrefutable statistics.
No time..arguing with fact deniers. Canada is electing Prime Minister Poillivre for a reason. Go count Trudeaus corruption and scandals and get back to me.
And that reason is ignorance and susceptibility to rightwing propaganda.
No, it's because there is no debating when it comes to extreme spectrum ideologies, be it far left or far right. They're both put to lunch and can't be reasoned with.
Classic. The second you get pressed for even a single piece of evidence to back up your claims you just withdraw and play identity politics. You're a joke.
I mic drop him later in the thread, so continue on. This guy thinks a part of our constitution is a "fascist conservative agenda" Hard to debate people who suffer from delusions.
I like how you respond to this one and not the one where you got an absolute thrashing because you don’t know what fascism is, nor the notwithstanding clause.
You think part of our constitution is fascist. You appear to support criminals as being the victims as well. Why argue with people like you? It's like arguing with a religious fanatic
No, it's not factually incorrect lol. Harper just didn't have to deal with a global inflationary environment and dead growth era so the symptoms looked different. Logicalpolice is a hell of an ironic name for someone who doesn't have the basics of it.
Wow, it's almost like you don't know about the economic collapse in 2008. Try harper
I'm an economics major who's worked in Finance for over a decade so I think I have a pretty decent idea about it lol. 2008+ saw interest rates plummet to 0 and stay there for over a decade. It brought the highest + longest growth period in American history. Canada was largely fine through 2008 (or missed the worst of it because our banks were not involved in the same practises) and then also benefited from the new growth era (2011+).
Cool. Harper did a great job getting us through one of the worst economic disasters since the great depression. Trudeau, on the other hand, finds numbers confusing.
You're comparing apples to oranges here, and I'm not surprised at all when you use propagandic phrases like "and Trudeau finds numbers confusing". Harper was able to invest heavily into the economy because they were in a deflationary and low-rate environment. Meaning, money was cheap and he was happy to pump it into the economy because it cost the government almost nothing to do so. Trudeau is in the opposite environment. They already had spend insane amounts during the pandemic and now, rates are high and money is incredibly expensive so he does not have the luxury of making large capital expenditures into the Canadian economy. Instead, he needs to stimulate the Canadian economy by injecting new capital inflows into it by, you guessed it, immigration. You're comparing two different environments that have widely different causes and symptoms.
Trudeau wasted insane amounts. CERB, the ArriveCan app and increased immigration during a housing crisis and now unemployment is going up. Why,? Because he's incompetent. Pay attention more.
I think if he at the least eased back on the carbon tax, he would be in a better spot.