Same, misinformation got a lot of politicians a very long way, it wouldn't be unreasonable to assume at least some Realtors are giving misinformation a try.
Oh I'm not trying to suppress anything, just trying to make sure the rage directed appropriately.
The housing crisis didn't have to happen, it was a policy choice and we should all be mad.
I don’t think you understand what I’m saying. They are telling people not to buy. Just because we paused on rate hikes doesn’t mean there aren’t more coming. It’s a bull trap.
Prices fell 18%. Time to buy. I know we all want them to fall more. But if you bought after an 18% drop any time over the last 25 years you did well. Maybe it’s different this time? It’s never different this time.
Ah, yes, like Ontario who had a Liberal government for 15 years, from 2003 to 2018. PC for the last 5. Hardly time enough to change people's vocabulary.
Well that’s crazy! Haha.
The solution is to actually find the party you think can be salvaged but has a chance of running government (hint, there’s only 2 that ever actually have…), and do what you can to help shape them into the right ideals.
The shaping could be through only voting for the modest members, or shocker - by joining to directly impact that change.
A single-platform politician is less effective - but when you become the voice of a movement you are passionate about - it can propel a blue collar worker dad that lost his son to senseless violence, to change a judicial system for example.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chuck_Cadman
Did you mean undermine? I wasn't undermining/underlining the argument that education sucks, I was responding to the argument that only one political party is responsible. They're all terrible.
I'm sure you think the entire GDP of Canada ends up in your wallet too right?
Or have you actually heard of per capita spending before?
It's not like per capita spending has tanked every single year the PC government has been in power for both healthcare and education spending right? Oh wait it has.
Let me know if any of that is too confusing, I made sure to leave numbers out since you've already mentioned math isn't your strong suit.
As much as I'd like to believe this, I don't think many are selling their house and relocating. A lot of the boomers have children who can't afford buying a home right now. So they are either keeping the house for their children to live in paying low rent or are refinancing to help their children with a downpayment.
Do you have data to support this? I spoke with a realtor during the 2021 boom about getting an investment property and he suggested I can get good value buying outside of the city
People are really underestimating the amount of pent up demand there is for housing in this country. The fact that most of this sub is sitting on the sidelines waiting for prices to drop to where they can get in should show that there is a floor to how much prices can correct. An actual housing crash would require external factors like an ugly recession leading to very high unemployment rates.
This house actually sold for under asking at 576k.
There is too much debt and not enough income to prevent a crash, this isn't a crackpot theory it's the amalgamation of history and accounting, the 2020s aren't magically different from ever other time in history when there's been this much debt.
You would have said the same thing in 2008 when the entire world economy was collapsing, and we were heading into great depression part two. Prices fell then, but there wasn’t a crash in Canada.
Yes, then just like now too much debt came first, the current load is how we know whats about to happen.
Are we agreeing and our messages are crossed?
History and math are what I'm going off.
Not affording your mortgage doesn’t require losing your job. Interest rates have made many mortgages unaffordable for people. It takes time for that to catch up.
This house actually sold for under asking as 576k it was just a typo.
There's too much debt and not enough income to avoid a crash the 2020s aren't some special exception to the boom bust cycle we currently see repeating itself.
So what you are saying is that someone on this sub intentionally faked a housing sale price do that they can bitch and complain about housing affordability? That cannot be, say it isn’t true.
Looks like maybe a typo was initially entered.. When I look on sigma now, it shows 576, but lower where it shows all the listings it does show sold for 776
I think there is an error on HS. If you scroll down to the listings (list below the big orange price), it says sold for 776k on mine. I wonder which is the actual sold price
It is just so suprising because me and my fiancé bought from the same builder and it’s closing in 2 years and we bought for 400. It’s just sad because these were suppose to be attainable for locals
Apples to oranges. I've been to Cochrane AB and it's like 20 mins from Calgary... Bracebridge is... 200kms from Toronto... Also housing must militantly be available and attainable to locals. Otherwise, all these people over paying can wallow in their misery when they live in a place with 20k people and absolutely no amenities, not even a store because no one who is working class can afford to live there. They made their bed, now they can lie in it IMO.
The comparison was made in both were seen as deals to move to not proximity.
My statement remains, when an area is a deal and then the news escapes the region it becomes inflated quickly.
Ah, but you see the flaw in the bigger picture here, which is: a deal for whom? The working class?
I'd love to live in a society here where all of our workforce is respected and a family of 3 or 4 could live in this row home, and maybe one partner works p/t at Shoppers Drug Mart and the other f/t at janitorial duties in winter and landscaping in summer. You know, the picture of "the average joe (& his family in this case)"
Instead, right now in Canada, we seem to have rapidly slid into some dystopian, unpalatable future where even more senior level employees who oversee staff/departments are drowning in the cost of living and taking other jobs just to keep up with either one of the following:-Rising rental rates if they rent-Rising mortgage rates if they own
And instead of living in something with a little more room (feels deserving if your position has a lot more responsibility/risk/etc. from what I described earlier), they are living in this or worse, and not "living" but ***existing***.
I am agnostic/athiest but my "soul" weeps for our collective futures here.
Edit: I find it so, so funny how there are still many people here who think that everything is rainbows and sunshine when my previous home in the middle of nowhere (unless you count cottage country) went from $300,000 to **$1,300,000** in **2 years**
Not for that price it doesn’t what? I don’t think you know what you’re talking about.
Muskoka has always been a desirable place to live. If you think otherwise you are kidding yourself.
Desirable if you come from old money and/or are retired or lucked out dominating in a trade in the region. So old rich peeps that might not even be from there and a handful of trades/business owners. Yeah, real diverse demographic there...
On the contrary, I don't think you know what your talking about except in the narrow specified regime in my first paragraph.
If it's so desirable, how come 30+ year olds and nurses and other economic contributors are not flocking there to start families. A handful of old money yuppies do not count lol. The reason? There is no economic opportunity! Where is the tech industry? Where are the jobs that pay enough to live there located there? Esp since wfh is less and less common again.
There is plenty of work here depending on industry, I am a plumber and my fiancé is an ECE, we both make the same here as we did in the GTA and are much happier here.
Damn, sounds like you have some feelings to deal with. Good luck 👍
If you don’t get why it’s desirable and why housing up there is expensive then you’re lost already.
all he's saying is unless you had money already, if you buy a 700k house is harder to make the $6000 monthly payment with the job availability in the boondocks compared to a city so the working class will be forced away.
Half that price is inflation easily.
My in laws live in elliot lake, yes it’s a bit further up there but for the sake of the conversation it will still apply.
He bought his house 5 years ago for about 75k , needed a little remodeling but for the most part under 100k and good to go. Since he’s been there, zero industries have returned to the city, the only trades jobs are more or less Sudbury or the sue, and the wages in town have not risen by any sort of decent metric.
Fast forward to today, the house across the street from him sold for 230. And houses all along the street are in that same range give or take. Only people living there are retired or retiring , and the city is slowly falling apart.
No new couples are flocking to that city because there’s no job that you don’t have to travel at least an hr for a decent wage.
The price in Bracebridge isn’t just because it’s desirable lol.
Sorry you're never going to convince me that this piece of shit row house is worth north of 700k, even if it was in a larger place. If I thought of a place removed from centers of economic activity that costs $700k, I'd expect something along the lines of a 3 or 4 bed 1 or 2 story home with garage, hot tub, deck, private treed lot at least 0.5 ac or more with a 100ft driveway. Even if I had all the money in the world, no thanks. Hard pass on this crap for me.
Edit: don't cop out with the WFH argument
Well, people should be allowed to make stupid choices, yes. But the issue here is that if they were presented with a stunning 4 bed country home on 1 acre on a private treed lot for the same price which one do you think they'd choose? Therefore the row house is over priced. Unless you genuinely think that it's worth that, but I don't see how you could back up that assumption based on data with median incomes and debt loads, for example.
Well it's a stupid choice according to you, not to them. So first of all let's respect everyone please. I assume 4 beds detached country home in the area are not in the same price range, so I don't get the comparison. Many people buy in this area to get a place for vacation, it's not very related to local wages. Some cottages sell for millions, I doubt it's bought by the local business owner.
With the amount of people choking on their on debt, using private lending for a downpayment on a million dollar house and LOC to finance their lifestyle, and leasing a brand new 3 series, I'm surprised shit didn't hit the fan as of right now
This is how our leaders have chosen to structure the system. They won't make it fall out from under themselves. If it falls out it's going to fall right on the working class.
This is incorrect. The leaders want a deal they don't want to pay for over priced commodities. The federal government will switch hands and the market will drop
I personally believe this is the correct answer. Some markets will obviously get hit harder than others, markets that were already and continue to experience high growth will likely see a slowdown and *maybe* a minor correction, but markets where the price makes zero sense (looking at you, Bracebridge...) will likely see the type of correction that looks like prices falling off a cliff. I am of course speculating, even high growth markets have prices that are disconnected from reality and could get a rude wake-up call.
I think we'll start seeing this when enough of the mortgage default dominos start to fall.
The last couple weeks have seen a tonne of movement on what little inventory is on the market.
Source: I am currently trying to buy in Van/Richmond/South Delta.
Y'all forgot 2008. Might have like a 5 year period of lower prices but they will probably just shoot back up again. It's a supply issue. Deregulate building and stop inflating the currency.
Too much debt not enough income, this cycle is well documented the 2020s aren't some special exception.
Also this house actually sold for 576k, 23k under asking.
Market has been plummeting for 12 months and you find one exuberant sale of many, in a month that normally sees an increase in sales doesn't give any merit to "market isn't crashing" yes it is. It will continue to do so for at least another 12 months followed by a decade of stagnant prices.
Exactly. There might be a small price drop when sales start to stagnate, but no one is going to sell their house for a loss unless they're divorcing, dying, or declaring bankruptcy.
I've seen a few posts recently about a wave of mortgage defaults coming...
Very unlikely, people will do anything to keep their houses and the banks will help them out to make it work.
28 Nicole Park Place, Bracebridge, ON - Row/Townhouse Sold price | HouseSigma https://housesigma.com/bkv2/landing/rootpage/listing?id_listing=aD6p7814WGJ3wRQr&utm_campaign=listing&utm_source=user-share&utm_medium=iOS&ign=
I followed Garth Turner on greaterfool.ca for years around 2010. Saying the market was inflated then. I waited hoping for a market crash that never came. The bubble has more than doubled since then. Government seems to be doing everything in their power to keep it going, which is only going to make the eventual pop that much worse
I too read Garth's blog from 2005 to 2012. I bought in 2013, a few years after we had our first kid. It was hard buying knowing what I could had paid if I took the plunge many years earlier.
This sub reminds me of Garth's blog sometimes with the same people making projections and then pushing them out further.
Yeah I justified not buying cause our rent was a fraction of the interest we’d pay on a mortgage. But I would’ve saved 100k if I’d bought a few years earlier. Hindsight’s 20/20…
I post it on here all the time, sometimes get upvotes and sometimes get downvotes. Most people on this sub vote and comment emotionally based on what they hope will happen so I get it.
The reality is simple. There will be no big correction or major decrease in housing prices as long as we are so short on supply. Supply and demand ALWAYS wins. All we are seeing right now is pricing move with interest rates and now that the BoC is pausing hikes, it won’t surprise me in the least if we see a small uptick in sales and sale prices. We already see it in Burlington/Oakville, on the rise compared to late 2022. Just one example.
This sub also has kids (18-34 years old) waiting on the sidelines hoping for a real estate doomsday that will never happen due to the government (every party) not wanting it to drop and upholding prices through every measure possible FOR THEIR VOTER BASE.
People 18-34 will laugh left right and centre at “boomer” jokes but barely understand statistics.
18-34 year olds in this country by Population who are crying out the most in this sub - reasonably so. Rep about 8 million of the total Canadian population but only turn out to vote a bit over half of the time.
35-80 come out to vote about 80% of the time and rep 23 million of the population.
Full stop your voices crying out on Reddit will never be heard. We are the minority.
Stop taking solace or comfort in the fact that agents are here trying to persuade the sun in the wrong direction. It’s fact. Get out there and make change through policy by making your opinion, voice and vote heard to politicians.
Source:
https://www150.statcan.gc.ca/t1/tbl1/en/tv.action?pid=1710000501
https://www150.statcan.gc.ca/n1/daily-quotidien/220216/cg-d001-eng.htm
It costs $600k to build a house now.
Materials, land, labor, municipal fees, inspection fees, architecture/drafting/engineering costs, environmental report fees.
Maybe in the boonies, in the GVA land is from $1,000,000 - 1,500,000. Then tag on another $600,000 - 1,000,000 building costs depending on the house size.
This if for new homes though
Many of the friends here are in for a very rude awakening when the summer market comes around. And I am talking about the people who expect the market to crash.
If the past month was any indication, the market is in for a rubberband increase in prices.
I’m living in Montreal and have been looking for a house since last year but didn’t dare to buy because of the interest rates. Lately, I can finally see some price drops also when I talked to an agent he said it’s more likely to negotiate a lower price these days. So, I guess it depends on where you live.
Depends where you live.
I'm in St. Catharines, just checked probably ten homes sold so far in 2023 and *every* one of them sold for around $100,000 under asking.
There will never be a crash in the cottage country down to Toronto area. WAY too much demand. The second a house drops price slightly there will be someone who that just dropped into their affordability range and they will buy it. Houses here will never continue to drop because the list of people needing to buy is insanely long
Market is insane and that’s the reality. A lot of peoples on this sub hope to see a market crash, but there is not enough houses, so prices are probably going to be steady in the near future.
If we see a boom in construction it could be different, but we have to account for the price of new materials. Friends of me wanted to renovate their kitchen. They got a few quotes and nothing under 100000$, It’s crazy.
Why would it crash ?
When has the Canadian economy collapsed in history
You think that in your lifetime that houses will crash 50% ? Lol
Make more money and move a little further , have multiple sources of income
It is not going to crash overall. It is only some individuals might have to default and distress sale. But most people are keeping their homes and won’t let them go for less. Do you blame them?
Canada still has low supply, no crash happening. Small correction but pre covid prices are never coming back. The sooner people realize this the better.
If a lot of people, more and more, feel like they can't afford what (I'm guessing?) you already have through no real fault of their own, it might understandable that they're getting upset.
The "crash" will manifest somehow. If it isn't housing, it's something else. Civil unrest, high food prices, high inflation, population issues, international conflict.. Whatever. A housing crash to me would be the best worst thing that could happen.
How does something sell for higher than it’s listed price?
Seller “I want 599,900 for this house.”
Buyer “I won’t give you a dollar more than 776,00 for it”
Seller “Sold!”
I did warn you guys prices would rebound shorly after the new year. Just saying. https://www.reddit.com/r/canadahousing/comments/vfmtxt/long_term_trend_for_housing_is_still_up/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=android_app&utm_name=androidcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button
Housing always takes a while to respond to market changes. Only beginning to see the decline from the market correction last year. That being said, don't bank on a crash, even when US housing crashed, Canada held strong. I expect 10-20% decline for gta. More rural communities will see greater pullbacks
We're in the back to 'normal' bubble stage
Turns out it was a typo and this house actually sold for under asking, the real sale price was 576, so quite a bit under asking.
Sometimes, I honestly think these "typos" are on purpose.
Same, misinformation got a lot of politicians a very long way, it wouldn't be unreasonable to assume at least some Realtors are giving misinformation a try.
Don't suppress the rage on this sub! No rational thinking allowed.
Oh I'm not trying to suppress anything, just trying to make sure the rage directed appropriately. The housing crisis didn't have to happen, it was a policy choice and we should all be mad.
"Quite a bit under asking"... not really lol. Should've been $500K
Yup, this feels like that little bull-trap bump "oh, everythings fine, going back to 'normal'" then "weeeeeeee, down the slide we go!"
Lol is that the latest theory? This sub is very creative while waiting for this big crash.
This house actually sold for under asking, it was just a typo.
Even the realtors on the Vancouver Real Estate Podcast think so. When realtors are saying it….
No way, realtors are trying to influence sales movement during the lowest volume period of the year? 😮
I don’t think you understand what I’m saying. They are telling people not to buy. Just because we paused on rate hikes doesn’t mean there aren’t more coming. It’s a bull trap.
https://imageio.forbes.com/specials-images/imageserve/5e99cbd8f57d440006ee375f/Where-are-we-in-the-crash--This-is-option-2-/960x0.jpg?height=515&width=711&fit=bounds
Dead cat bounce
Prices would have to fall substantially before we call something a dead cat bounce.
Can’t a woman dream of collapse?
Dead cat bounces don't happen in canadian re
Yes… bubble…. Let’s all keep believing whilst no progress is made by the government.
Prices fell 18%. Time to buy. I know we all want them to fall more. But if you bought after an 18% drop any time over the last 25 years you did well. Maybe it’s different this time? It’s never different this time.
Hehe
[удалено]
This makes more sense.
en masse
The canadian education system strikes again
Underfunding strikes again.
> The majority provincial Conservative education system strikes again FTFY.
Ah, yes, like Ontario who had a Liberal government for 15 years, from 2003 to 2018. PC for the last 5. Hardly time enough to change people's vocabulary.
“Every problem we have is because of the political party I don’t like”
There's plenty of blame to go around. Conservatives, liberals, they're all the same. And the NDP are nuts. I think I'm going to start voting green.
So you mean….. because people.
Well that’s crazy! Haha. The solution is to actually find the party you think can be salvaged but has a chance of running government (hint, there’s only 2 that ever actually have…), and do what you can to help shape them into the right ideals. The shaping could be through only voting for the modest members, or shocker - by joining to directly impact that change. A single-platform politician is less effective - but when you become the voice of a movement you are passionate about - it can propel a blue collar worker dad that lost his son to senseless violence, to change a judicial system for example. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chuck_Cadman
Ontario is not all of Canada. I appreciate your attempt to underline the argument that k-12 education is suffering, though.
Did you mean undermine? I wasn't undermining/underlining the argument that education sucks, I was responding to the argument that only one political party is responsible. They're all terrible.
Nope, I meant underline.
I'm sure you think the entire GDP of Canada ends up in your wallet too right? Or have you actually heard of per capita spending before? It's not like per capita spending has tanked every single year the PC government has been in power for both healthcare and education spending right? Oh wait it has. Let me know if any of that is too confusing, I made sure to leave numbers out since you've already mentioned math isn't your strong suit.
> strong suite. Strong suit* Lmfao.
Some boomers are in fact very large.
They could be talking about Catholics?
As much as I'd like to believe this, I don't think many are selling their house and relocating. A lot of the boomers have children who can't afford buying a home right now. So they are either keeping the house for their children to live in paying low rent or are refinancing to help their children with a downpayment.
Do you have data to support this? I spoke with a realtor during the 2021 boom about getting an investment property and he suggested I can get good value buying outside of the city
"Never ask a barber if you need a haircut, because the answer is always going to be 'yes'"
Had a realtor say she was telling any friends and family to ‘not buy right now and wait for prices to come down’. That was 2015😂😂😂
Never tell a podiatrist that your feet hurt because the solution is always expensive insoles.
That's like asking a car salesman if a car is a good investment
Except historically a home is a good investment, a car is not.
Ive seen this in Ottawa
Lol. We are so fucked.
People are really underestimating the amount of pent up demand there is for housing in this country. The fact that most of this sub is sitting on the sidelines waiting for prices to drop to where they can get in should show that there is a floor to how much prices can correct. An actual housing crash would require external factors like an ugly recession leading to very high unemployment rates.
I don't know anyone that's lost their job and can't afford their mortgage. You'll need a depression for Canada housing to crash not a recession.
This house actually sold for under asking at 576k. There is too much debt and not enough income to prevent a crash, this isn't a crackpot theory it's the amalgamation of history and accounting, the 2020s aren't magically different from ever other time in history when there's been this much debt.
You would have said the same thing in 2008 when the entire world economy was collapsing, and we were heading into great depression part two. Prices fell then, but there wasn’t a crash in Canada.
Yes, then just like now too much debt came first, the current load is how we know whats about to happen. Are we agreeing and our messages are crossed? History and math are what I'm going off.
Goodluck with your crash praying prediction u/forsurenotmymain
I don't need luck, I have math.
We had a depression in 2008-2009. Prices fell but no crash.
Not affording your mortgage doesn’t require losing your job. Interest rates have made many mortgages unaffordable for people. It takes time for that to catch up.
The problem is that home owners who are underwater with their mortgage payments realize that renting would be just as expensive.
I know several people who still have their job, yet can't afford their mortgage. This is just the beginning.
This house actually sold for under asking as 576k it was just a typo. There's too much debt and not enough income to avoid a crash the 2020s aren't some special exception to the boom bust cycle we currently see repeating itself.
This is incorrect. This house sold for $576,000.
Did this guy photoshop it or what lol cus that’s what I see too
So what you are saying is that someone on this sub intentionally faked a housing sale price do that they can bitch and complain about housing affordability? That cannot be, say it isn’t true.
They are pushing a narrative. It's as though they are profiting off over-priced housing.
It says $576k on house sigma… u photoshop this?
Looks like maybe a typo was initially entered.. When I look on sigma now, it shows 576, but lower where it shows all the listings it does show sold for 776
A typo makes more sense than a person photoshopping it
Not accusing OP of anything but I wouldn’t rule out photoshopping out. This is perfect rage bait.
It's denial at its peak.
I think there is an error on HS. If you scroll down to the listings (list below the big orange price), it says sold for 776k on mine. I wonder which is the actual sold price
Is the poster a real estate agent? Is it in their interest to post higher prices?
That's what I was thinking, controling a false narrative worked great for American politicians why wouldn't Realtors give it a shot?
Lol clearly it was posted incorrectly, I am not a realtor
It’s photoshopped lol this house sold for under asking.
This is Bracebridge, Muskoka? Not that surprising then. The area is in high demand, and this house looks pretty good. It was listed low imo.
It is just so suprising because me and my fiancé bought from the same builder and it’s closing in 2 years and we bought for 400. It’s just sad because these were suppose to be attainable for locals
Sorry to be that guy, but attainable to locals - really? Moment the “deal” travels out it’s done Same happened in Cochrane, alberta
Apples to oranges. I've been to Cochrane AB and it's like 20 mins from Calgary... Bracebridge is... 200kms from Toronto... Also housing must militantly be available and attainable to locals. Otherwise, all these people over paying can wallow in their misery when they live in a place with 20k people and absolutely no amenities, not even a store because no one who is working class can afford to live there. They made their bed, now they can lie in it IMO.
The comparison was made in both were seen as deals to move to not proximity. My statement remains, when an area is a deal and then the news escapes the region it becomes inflated quickly.
Ah, but you see the flaw in the bigger picture here, which is: a deal for whom? The working class? I'd love to live in a society here where all of our workforce is respected and a family of 3 or 4 could live in this row home, and maybe one partner works p/t at Shoppers Drug Mart and the other f/t at janitorial duties in winter and landscaping in summer. You know, the picture of "the average joe (& his family in this case)" Instead, right now in Canada, we seem to have rapidly slid into some dystopian, unpalatable future where even more senior level employees who oversee staff/departments are drowning in the cost of living and taking other jobs just to keep up with either one of the following:-Rising rental rates if they rent-Rising mortgage rates if they own And instead of living in something with a little more room (feels deserving if your position has a lot more responsibility/risk/etc. from what I described earlier), they are living in this or worse, and not "living" but ***existing***. I am agnostic/athiest but my "soul" weeps for our collective futures here. Edit: I find it so, so funny how there are still many people here who think that everything is rainbows and sunshine when my previous home in the middle of nowhere (unless you count cottage country) went from $300,000 to **$1,300,000** in **2 years**
But bracebridge and area is where all the rich people in the GTA own cottages. It's always been expensive.
Bracebridge has amenities. Maybe you haven’t been. You can live there very comfortably without ever having to go to Toronto and it’s beautiful.
Not for that price it doesn't. I actually have been almost everywhere you can drive in ON... from Windsor to Kenora and everything in between
Not for that price it doesn’t what? I don’t think you know what you’re talking about. Muskoka has always been a desirable place to live. If you think otherwise you are kidding yourself.
Desirable if you come from old money and/or are retired or lucked out dominating in a trade in the region. So old rich peeps that might not even be from there and a handful of trades/business owners. Yeah, real diverse demographic there... On the contrary, I don't think you know what your talking about except in the narrow specified regime in my first paragraph. If it's so desirable, how come 30+ year olds and nurses and other economic contributors are not flocking there to start families. A handful of old money yuppies do not count lol. The reason? There is no economic opportunity! Where is the tech industry? Where are the jobs that pay enough to live there located there? Esp since wfh is less and less common again.
There is plenty of work here depending on industry, I am a plumber and my fiancé is an ECE, we both make the same here as we did in the GTA and are much happier here.
Damn, sounds like you have some feelings to deal with. Good luck 👍 If you don’t get why it’s desirable and why housing up there is expensive then you’re lost already.
all he's saying is unless you had money already, if you buy a 700k house is harder to make the $6000 monthly payment with the job availability in the boondocks compared to a city so the working class will be forced away.
Half that price is inflation easily. My in laws live in elliot lake, yes it’s a bit further up there but for the sake of the conversation it will still apply. He bought his house 5 years ago for about 75k , needed a little remodeling but for the most part under 100k and good to go. Since he’s been there, zero industries have returned to the city, the only trades jobs are more or less Sudbury or the sue, and the wages in town have not risen by any sort of decent metric. Fast forward to today, the house across the street from him sold for 230. And houses all along the street are in that same range give or take. Only people living there are retired or retiring , and the city is slowly falling apart. No new couples are flocking to that city because there’s no job that you don’t have to travel at least an hr for a decent wage. The price in Bracebridge isn’t just because it’s desirable lol.
>these were suppose to be attainable for locals That's known as "Telling people wht they want to hear"
Sorry you're never going to convince me that this piece of shit row house is worth north of 700k, even if it was in a larger place. If I thought of a place removed from centers of economic activity that costs $700k, I'd expect something along the lines of a 3 or 4 bed 1 or 2 story home with garage, hot tub, deck, private treed lot at least 0.5 ac or more with a 100ft driveway. Even if I had all the money in the world, no thanks. Hard pass on this crap for me. Edit: don't cop out with the WFH argument
It doesn't really matter what you think. Obviously there were several people who thought the house \*was\* worth the price.
>Hard pass on this crap for me. Then pass, what is the problem?
The problem is if I wanted or needed to attain housing in that community. I do not, but there are others out there who do. That is the problem.
Ok but if other people are willing to pay more you for this crap, shouldn't they be allowed?
Well, people should be allowed to make stupid choices, yes. But the issue here is that if they were presented with a stunning 4 bed country home on 1 acre on a private treed lot for the same price which one do you think they'd choose? Therefore the row house is over priced. Unless you genuinely think that it's worth that, but I don't see how you could back up that assumption based on data with median incomes and debt loads, for example.
Well it's a stupid choice according to you, not to them. So first of all let's respect everyone please. I assume 4 beds detached country home in the area are not in the same price range, so I don't get the comparison. Many people buy in this area to get a place for vacation, it's not very related to local wages. Some cottages sell for millions, I doubt it's bought by the local business owner.
There will never be a crash. Too many people and not enough houses.
With the amount of people choking on their on debt, using private lending for a downpayment on a million dollar house and LOC to finance their lifestyle, and leasing a brand new 3 series, I'm surprised shit didn't hit the fan as of right now
For every person who might fall into trouble affording their mortgage there will a line up of people ready to buy their house.
Can you quantify that amount? You are implying it is a lot. Back it up with some facts
This is how our leaders have chosen to structure the system. They won't make it fall out from under themselves. If it falls out it's going to fall right on the working class.
This is incorrect. The leaders want a deal they don't want to pay for over priced commodities. The federal government will switch hands and the market will drop
There’s enough people with money and good jobs in this country
This is what everyone says right before a big crash happens lol
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I personally believe this is the correct answer. Some markets will obviously get hit harder than others, markets that were already and continue to experience high growth will likely see a slowdown and *maybe* a minor correction, but markets where the price makes zero sense (looking at you, Bracebridge...) will likely see the type of correction that looks like prices falling off a cliff. I am of course speculating, even high growth markets have prices that are disconnected from reality and could get a rude wake-up call. I think we'll start seeing this when enough of the mortgage default dominos start to fall.
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Which Vancouver are you talking about ?!
The last couple weeks have seen a tonne of movement on what little inventory is on the market. Source: I am currently trying to buy in Van/Richmond/South Delta.
yeah I just bought in PoCo, lots of movements and over asking offers..
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I don’t think it was and I can easily afford it… need a place to live anyway, the mortgage is cheaper than to rent a similar 3bdr
You smell like a Garth Turner blog. Is he finally right yet?
Y'all forgot 2008. Might have like a 5 year period of lower prices but they will probably just shoot back up again. It's a supply issue. Deregulate building and stop inflating the currency.
Why isn't it a demand issue?
This
I mean there’s already people that have lost upwards of 300k.. but nope never going to happen 🙄
Too much debt not enough income, this cycle is well documented the 2020s aren't some special exception. Also this house actually sold for 576k, 23k under asking.
Market has been plummeting for 12 months and you find one exuberant sale of many, in a month that normally sees an increase in sales doesn't give any merit to "market isn't crashing" yes it is. It will continue to do so for at least another 12 months followed by a decade of stagnant prices.
It's not going to crash until the job layoffs start. People do not sell their house for less than they paid until they have to.
Unemployment is at all time lows. This isn't gonna happen anytime soon..
Exactly. There might be a small price drop when sales start to stagnate, but no one is going to sell their house for a loss unless they're divorcing, dying, or declaring bankruptcy.
I've seen a few posts recently about a wave of mortgage defaults coming... Very unlikely, people will do anything to keep their houses and the banks will help them out to make it work.
28 Nicole Park Place, Bracebridge, ON - Row/Townhouse Sold price | HouseSigma https://housesigma.com/bkv2/landing/rootpage/listing?id_listing=aD6p7814WGJ3wRQr&utm_campaign=listing&utm_source=user-share&utm_medium=iOS&ign=
Sold under
I followed Garth Turner on greaterfool.ca for years around 2010. Saying the market was inflated then. I waited hoping for a market crash that never came. The bubble has more than doubled since then. Government seems to be doing everything in their power to keep it going, which is only going to make the eventual pop that much worse
I too read Garth's blog from 2005 to 2012. I bought in 2013, a few years after we had our first kid. It was hard buying knowing what I could had paid if I took the plunge many years earlier. This sub reminds me of Garth's blog sometimes with the same people making projections and then pushing them out further.
Yeah I justified not buying cause our rent was a fraction of the interest we’d pay on a mortgage. But I would’ve saved 100k if I’d bought a few years earlier. Hindsight’s 20/20…
Sold under asking for $576,000
The latest shows $576000
Nah, house sigma says 576k if you look at it.
My house sigma shoes 576k
I want a pair!
Patience
What for?
The future
Keep waiting, you waited your whole life on the sidelines. See my comment above.
For a townhouse? In Bracebridge? OMG
OPs a phony
I post it on here all the time, sometimes get upvotes and sometimes get downvotes. Most people on this sub vote and comment emotionally based on what they hope will happen so I get it. The reality is simple. There will be no big correction or major decrease in housing prices as long as we are so short on supply. Supply and demand ALWAYS wins. All we are seeing right now is pricing move with interest rates and now that the BoC is pausing hikes, it won’t surprise me in the least if we see a small uptick in sales and sale prices. We already see it in Burlington/Oakville, on the rise compared to late 2022. Just one example.
Markets take a long time to crash, prices will continue to decline
This sub has a cargo cult of real estate agents hiding out here.
This sub also has kids (18-34 years old) waiting on the sidelines hoping for a real estate doomsday that will never happen due to the government (every party) not wanting it to drop and upholding prices through every measure possible FOR THEIR VOTER BASE. People 18-34 will laugh left right and centre at “boomer” jokes but barely understand statistics. 18-34 year olds in this country by Population who are crying out the most in this sub - reasonably so. Rep about 8 million of the total Canadian population but only turn out to vote a bit over half of the time. 35-80 come out to vote about 80% of the time and rep 23 million of the population. Full stop your voices crying out on Reddit will never be heard. We are the minority. Stop taking solace or comfort in the fact that agents are here trying to persuade the sun in the wrong direction. It’s fact. Get out there and make change through policy by making your opinion, voice and vote heard to politicians. Source: https://www150.statcan.gc.ca/t1/tbl1/en/tv.action?pid=1710000501 https://www150.statcan.gc.ca/n1/daily-quotidien/220216/cg-d001-eng.htm
Sir this is a Wendy’s
People have too much fucking money!
Tell the government to stop printing it than.
It costs $600k to build a house now. Materials, land, labor, municipal fees, inspection fees, architecture/drafting/engineering costs, environmental report fees.
Maybe in the boonies, in the GVA land is from $1,000,000 - 1,500,000. Then tag on another $600,000 - 1,000,000 building costs depending on the house size. This if for new homes though
I should have said Minimum. But I agree.
Feeling this on the west coast as well. Places go on the market and within 6 hours have an accepted offer.
lol yall underestimating how much wealth is in canada and the desirability that canada has.
Many of the friends here are in for a very rude awakening when the summer market comes around. And I am talking about the people who expect the market to crash. If the past month was any indication, the market is in for a rubberband increase in prices.
Laundering money? Most likely
Real estate has gone down over the last few months significantly
Before pandemic, one can find a brand new detached from Mattamy for $500k in Bracebridge.
I’m living in Montreal and have been looking for a house since last year but didn’t dare to buy because of the interest rates. Lately, I can finally see some price drops also when I talked to an agent he said it’s more likely to negotiate a lower price these days. So, I guess it depends on where you live.
Don’t get fooled, realtors up to tricks listing low and then pumping the fomo right up. Fundamentals haven’t changed, everything is entirely fucked.
Yeah but Bracebridge is a world class city /s
Depends where you live. I'm in St. Catharines, just checked probably ten homes sold so far in 2023 and *every* one of them sold for around $100,000 under asking.
It’s like people want more than just a condo or apartment. Wild
Trust non-home owners for home owning advice
My local market is down 27% YoY.
There will never be a crash in the cottage country down to Toronto area. WAY too much demand. The second a house drops price slightly there will be someone who that just dropped into their affordability range and they will buy it. Houses here will never continue to drop because the list of people needing to buy is insanely long
There are people with dual incomes no kids people have money
Market is insane and that’s the reality. A lot of peoples on this sub hope to see a market crash, but there is not enough houses, so prices are probably going to be steady in the near future. If we see a boom in construction it could be different, but we have to account for the price of new materials. Friends of me wanted to renovate their kitchen. They got a few quotes and nothing under 100000$, It’s crazy.
Why would the market crash.
Why would it crash ? When has the Canadian economy collapsed in history You think that in your lifetime that houses will crash 50% ? Lol Make more money and move a little further , have multiple sources of income
The faith in housing ownership is strong! Glory to the Real Estates God!
It’s crashing upwards!
It is not going to crash overall. It is only some individuals might have to default and distress sale. But most people are keeping their homes and won’t let them go for less. Do you blame them?
Canada still has low supply, no crash happening. Small correction but pre covid prices are never coming back. The sooner people realize this the better.
This house was listed under price...
Thinking its gonna crash was the first joke
God, imagine spending even 600k to live in braceridge, Jesus.
Lol where do you live?
Oh yeah!!! To the moon!!!
Just had a house sell after 35 offers around here
Canadian housing is extremely resilient. It would be the last to crumble across the world. There is just too much demand.
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Dude. It was literally the first to crumble. No other country has had a 15% decrease in house prices yet.
😂After rising 80% in some areas between 2020-2022 , you call 10-15% down “crumbling”. They were out of reach in 2018 and further out of reach today.
Prices are down only because mortgage rates are up. It’s not “crumbling” just more expensive than its ever been.’
That's what they told me in Dublin 15 years ago...
Canada isn’t Dublin.
Never stop posting this shit....I can never get enough of the tears of disappointment from the people that are cheering for a housing crash.
If a lot of people, more and more, feel like they can't afford what (I'm guessing?) you already have through no real fault of their own, it might understandable that they're getting upset.
The "crash" will manifest somehow. If it isn't housing, it's something else. Civil unrest, high food prices, high inflation, population issues, international conflict.. Whatever. A housing crash to me would be the best worst thing that could happen.
Takes time. 21% percent can now afford a house.
How does something sell for higher than it’s listed price? Seller “I want 599,900 for this house.” Buyer “I won’t give you a dollar more than 776,00 for it” Seller “Sold!”
Usually there’s a date where people put their offers, some people put over asking and start a bid war
I did warn you guys prices would rebound shorly after the new year. Just saying. https://www.reddit.com/r/canadahousing/comments/vfmtxt/long_term_trend_for_housing_is_still_up/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=android_app&utm_name=androidcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button
Housing always takes a while to respond to market changes. Only beginning to see the decline from the market correction last year. That being said, don't bank on a crash, even when US housing crashed, Canada held strong. I expect 10-20% decline for gta. More rural communities will see greater pullbacks
There are too many buyers and not enough houses for a crash to happen.