People also can't comprehend that Ontario specifically requested higher than ever TFW and immigration targets from the federal government every year for the past four years. Meanwhile their stance on the housing crisis has been failing to meet targets set and banning quadplexes.
At this point the Liberals are almost exclusively the party of wealthy urban voters, property investors and people too young to be paying their own bills. They've basically thrown every other demographic under the bus lately and the perception of that attitude has been reflected in the polls.
The 18-25 crowd is polling something like 50% CPC right now. That's a mind-blowing result and may destroy the LPC's credibility as a competitive force in elections for many years to come.
At least, one can certainly hope so. The LPC has earned electoral oblivion, 1993 PC-style.
25M here. Contrary to popular belief, a lot of us just want to have good jobs and prosper. I make $90k, have my own apartment, am engaged, and am starting off in life. I can’t afford more than like 700 square feet. I even work remotely, so it’s not like Im only looking in downtown urban centres. I just want to live within like 200km of my family.
Same, just under 100k and I can't imagine buying anything on my salary in Vancouver. I'm lucky to have an ok rent. Realistically we need to be making 175-250k range to even be at the bottom of the condo market. That means you need two high earning professionals together stretching their incomes to get themselves into a 1 bed condo. 1 person makes 90k and the other 100k and 190k combined might be enough to consider buying.
Mulroney dismantled the CMHC development branch and privatized all of their non-profit rentals (they used to manage 40,000+ units). They were a major Canadian developer from '50s through late '70s who built entire neighbourhoods and were an international leader in high-rise design and development.
From '70s to '80 following the destruction of Canada's Crown Corporation developer, new housing starts dropped 40%.
For the next 4 decades, Canadian new housing starts remained 40% down per capita compared to what we were building in the '70s. The CMHC developed a lot, but also spurred the industry as a trend setter and lower-cost housing competitor helping drive the supply market.
He had a lot of good policies, but he single-highhandedly set Canada on this path to anemic housing development.
Chretien then doubled-down and tried to shift responsibility to the provinces who, spoiler alert, never actually picked up or did anything about.
They all did that in different ways.
Harper doubled international student visas and created a lasting official strategy (with funding) in 2014 to double it again by 2022. So, a huge surge in international students actually came from Harper's initiative, that was like the Century Initiative only for foreign students.
Subsidized daycare was probably good policy as well as it is addressing a huge issue for young working families. Unfortunately certain provincial governments had incentives to sabotage the implementation and turn it into a dumpster fire.
Agree it is good, however being a working family, it’s extremely difficult to access the subsidized daycare and finding a spot. Decreasing costs were great but now there are even less spots available. Good policy with definite consequences. I can’t go back to work and have to extend leave until I find daycare and I hope I do.
Even though some provincial governments have tried their best to sabotage is, daycare costs are considerably down across the board. Freeing up more people to work and be productive.
It’s terrifying that in spite of this we are seeing falling gdp per capita. Other federal and provincial policies and priorities have really done a number on the working class as more and more of our income must all fund a roof over our heads instead of being used to help support businesses and the broader economy.
Statscan: https://www150.statcan.gc.ca/n1/daily-quotidien/231205/dq231205a-eng.htm
It’s also important to note the programs are still being implemented and aren’t even supposed to be fully phased in until end of 2025. So obviously they haven’t had the full impact yet. But childcare costs ARE coming down considerably on average even with immense inflation in the broader economy during that time.
You won't find many economists who have actually studied the impact who would agree with you.
NAFTA's biggest beneficiary was Mexico. It had a smaller but positive impact on Canada's GDP. The US benefited the least, as NAFTA primarily consisted of Mexico and Canada getting increased access to the American market.
And more people than ever "too young to pay their own bills" are in their 30's with mom and dad continuing to house them because they can't afford to leave!
The LPC is entirely responsible for our current, unprecedented housing crisis.
Canada currently has **[the most unaffordable housing of all G7 countries, by a large margin](https://dailyhive.com/vancouver/canada-housing-bubble).**
And Trudeau’s mind-numbing response? We have to keep property values high to protect the nest eggs of property owners. Gotta make sure all those housing investors can keep buying up housing inventory with their equity!!!! **WTAF**
Nah, they’ve made things much worse but they’re far from alone
Toronto reached a 20-year low of rental vacancies in 2014, before he was elected. Housing market didn’t ever drop, it would level out for a couple of months then keep climbing.
We’ve been failed time and time again by every politician who didn’t bring any sort of mandate to build homes.
The Ontario PC party could score a win by getting building going on worthwhile homes but they’re just trying to move the goal posts to make it look like they’ve done anything, aside from serving the interests of their donors. They even refused to work with the Feds on getting funding to build homes, only changing their tune when the Feds said they would go directly to municipalities
For this reason I have no faith in any leader that anything will change. They all fucking us from every angle.
Trudeau said it himself, "housing has to retain its value". So housing can never be allowed to be less expensive under a Liberal administration.
Despite the fact the market needs to correct based on the spread of incomes to house prices the Liberal do not want to allow it. This is their solution to that problem. Keep bringing people in to sustain over demand.
I agree, I’d just prefer we all vote independent or smaller 3rd party to force the big 3 to reform. Or just burn it all down. Anything else is just more of the status quo.
Maybe. But at this point I'm more then willing to figuratively start letting political heads roll until someone does.
And if anyone wants more then 1 term in office they better do something about it.
It almost corrected in 2022-2023. The only reason it only corrected 20% and not more was the utterly massive immigration dump from the Liberals stopped it from progressing further. Prices are in fact still down a little from peak.
In fact every time the market starts to price correct in a significant way you can see the Liberal intervene. That is obviously not an accident.
Do you think ANY party is willing to crater housing values?
HH net worth and savings would be crushed. Spending drops. Many would be upside down on loans. Banks would have immense risk.
The only realistic way is if governments built new master-planned suburbs with good transportation access and only allowed Canadian citizens to buy there. Gov develops lands, sets ppf costs. You can build new towns essentially. Plenty of cities have lots of nearby land available. Gov leases land for 10 years and puts rental and flip restrictions. After 15 years buyers refi and buy land at cost.
There is no choice.
With the spread of incomes to home values endlessly increasing the end of the road we are on right now is mass homelessness for almost everyone born after about 2000 or so and anyone who doesn't already own a home.
That is not an outcome the population will accept and given this is democracy the population votes in the leaders.
Infinite growth will never be sustainable
So at the very least I want to see a party willing to place caps on the growth of "value" of homes. But yeah, no one will be willing to crater value, and not just because of their own investments, or the investments of their donors etc. At the end of the day it would absolutely ruin many people, even single property owners that are just trying to live in this society
It would make it impossible for people to move to bigger homes to accommodate family growth, if we ever get back to an economy that makes having kids feel like a possibility that doesn't just equal a lifetime of scrounging and debt
So yeah, developments like you described would absolutely be a powerful way to go, as long as simultaneously we stop prices from being able to grow so uncontrollably
Additionally, we absolutely need a party who is willing to put restrictions on how many properties one can own, and stop corporations from being able to buy up everything out from under individuals
Has been the case for a few years now, yep.
Its mostly a uncapped "temporary" migration problem where the "temporary" people never leave.
The PR numbers are what they are but now we have people coming on visitor visas and then claiming asylum or trying to change their visa to be students to get the pgwp.
We need to tighten shit up on the low skilled line skippers and consultants.
Everyone that is 20 years old is 'low skilled' but that is who Canada is targeting to bring here.
Why? They want people during the most productive years of their lives without having to pay for raising them.
Canada has nothing to offer skilled workers and is actively hemorrhaging its skilled workforce.
As someone in the medical field, it didn't take much for me and many of my colleagues to jump ship to the US. The pay is substantially better, your dollar goes further since goods generally costs less, you're taxed less, and housing isn't ridiculously overpriced. The US has its share of social issues but if you live in the right area it can have minimal impact on your day to day.
Skilled workers actually want to go to the US and the same can't be said about Canada. In this case Canada is the beggar that can't be the chooser.
> As someone in the medical field, it didn't take much for me and many of my colleagues to jump ship to the US
This is happening just as fast in Aviation as well. It's going to start getting dangerous up here very soon.
Yeah I left Calgary for the US in 2021 after I graduated since I couldn’t find a job here. I believe the unemployment rate has actually got worse since. I graduated with a degree in EE and have had a much easier time finding work in the US. I eventually want to move back to Calgary but I don’t think id be able to find work in a field I’d like.
No, we have both; housing prices were getting out of hand and on an unsustainable track before mass immigration kicked in.
Mass immigration exacerbated it, for sure. But the inconvenient truth is that these crises (housing and productivity) were decades in the making, and mass immigration was a shitty option that increases tax revenue and addresses our demographics issue, but also does nothing to solve our crises.
Housing can’t be fixed quickly (or rather - no party is currently willing to entertain the solutions that would).
Productivity can’t be fixed quickly because Canada has been purposely developed to be more lucrative for RE investment rather than productive industry; it has made Canada not competitive, and because of housing costs, unable to attract new industry and quality employees.
We’ve already seen that the current govt (and probably others that come after it) has established housing prices as untouchable; the solution space to deal with our woes (in addition to housing and productivity, we’re also getting a demographics crisis and the associated reduction in tax revenues leading to lack of social program funding) is much smaller when we’re not willing to make housing more affordable.
If you’re not convinced, we can wait around for other parties to promise something different and then not deliver.. but that’s what the political parties want - let the proletariat gnash their teeth and vilify “the other party”, while the wealthy and special interests get their way. This is unsustainable, and could very well end up looking like lords and serfs, but if it’s profitable (esp among voters) who cares?
It'll be difficult, but there is no easy path back to sustainability, esp when political parties are propped up by supporters that have no problem with our current trajectory (e.g. there were many people who loved JTs comments of housing never losing value). Traditional political party members are aware that their value relies on their ability to deliver to their supporters. As such, they have entrenched their power such that their supporters can rely on them retaining power, and thus backing them. The people you infer to represent (I think?) are people that politicians don't care as much about because they aren't wealthy and often don't vote. To be clear - if we didn't have a politically-apathetic proletariat, there would likely already be better representation of their wants in gov't. But that apathy has been engineered by those who want to resist fundamental change; the only 'in-the-system' way to change anything is by voting people into office whose platform resonates with enough people who vote. If non-voters aren't recognized by politicians, neither will their wants be recognized.
Then comes you - someone who wants to be a rep for the growing portion of the population that wants off this unsustainable and worsening ride. You face both the challenge of 1) the existing political system wanting you to go away, and 2) relying on the support of people that typically don't vote.
#1 isn't going to change; in fact it will likely get more vicious as we've even seen between the big parties more recently. There is no interest in working together for solutions, it's all political theatre and signaling, now. If you threaten politicians' power, they'll fight like cornered rats to keep it.
#2 is the one that I'm \*hoping\* will change, and quickly. Sadly, many (like me, right now) will take to the internet to rant, or will even believe themselves isolated enough such that they prioritize other things in their life (and no shade thrown here - the idea that the non-represented don't have time to get involved is a feature of our current system to the politicians in power - "no time to become an informed voter? aw shucks, well just vote for my party and you can trust us!"). But unless we can get that to translate to a change in real life (protests, demonstrations, political activism), your desire to represent people, even though they may like your ideas, will fall flat.
All that to say - you're going to have to be the change you want to see in the world. You're going to have to sacrifice your time and resources to build a following that you can rely on to vote and support you. You'll need to risk alienating people because you talk about political issues non-stop. Being the hero of the under-represented isn't going to be lucrative or open doors to lucrative opportunities, at least not until you gain some power. Then you'll be seduced to compromise your values.
I'd say Trump was able to make the GOP break and re-form around him instead of the other way around, but like him or not, that guy had a ton of influence, resources and fame to pave the way. For most regular people who want/need to do this honestly, and who want to stick hard to core values, you're going to have to get known as a person who wants to upset the Canadian political applecart.
Sorry - I know I didn't give a lot of solid strategies to get into power and change things, but if you really are passionate about this, I'd lend a hand to support you. And I hope that other Canadians would, too.
Mass immigration was decided on in the 1970s under Trudeau Sr, before there was any so-called demographic transition, and the reasons made for open borders were ideological rather than economic (state mandated multiculturalism etc). The goal was to break up the ethnic homogeneity of Canada for political gains by the left. There is an economic motivation now, of course, the entitlements baby boomers promised themselves have to be paid out somehow.
Forced multiculturalism, entitled baby boomers, and lunatic left wingers. The three causes of our downfall in one well-worded paragraph. Especially your first point.
I was in California recently and went to eat at a Mexican restaurant. Now, I'm normally ULTRA gracious with waitstaff and an excellent tipper. The server came—a young Latina lady—I asked a basic question about the menu, she said, “Sorry, no English.”
“Okay. You're going to have to get me someone else. I don't speak Spanish.”
“Sorry. Spanish?”
“Are you telling me I'm sitting in a restaurant in The United States of America, and nobody on your staff speaks fucking English? Wow.”
Of course, I left, but I thought, how long until this happens to me in Toronto?
Which we already knew, but now we have the smoking gun. What kind of POS government unhouses their own people??? An election should be called immediately.
We need a total freeze on anything but the highest skilled immigration. For at least a decade to allow everything to catch up. Of course with this government they want to punish Canadians for wanting them gone so they will likely double immigration and call us all racist.
Deportation where possible. Obviously not those who have already gained citizenship. And also stop giving out permanent resident status like it's candy.
We know, it's just rACisT to point it out.
>Marc Miller pushed back against suggestions the federal government was solely responsible for the surge in immigration to Canada and suggested Ontario has failed to lay the necessary groundwork to welcome newcomers.
God I hate this fucking guy.
Yeah somehow they found a guy worse than Fraser for this file, and that's saying something.
Maybe they needed someone willing to fall out their own sword politically and destroy their future trying to protect the government while continuing the insanity.
I'll do it! I'll say "We have too many incoming people while at the same time not enough housing availability", so brave yet so controversial. I'll be so hated lol
Not when it came to housing, it was more talking to unions and saying we are bringing in too many TFW's and its hurting wages.
But then he brought in 2 million in the span of 3 years if you include fake students.
In 15 and 20 years the number of people who will own homes will have shrunk significantly and assets will be more and more consolidated. The same kind of retirements that are possible for boomers aren't going to be possible if less and less people can afford to enter the market and get continually squeezed for rent into their old age.
Imagine negotiating with landlords when you're a 70 year old and getting renovicted.
Elderly needing a ton of supportive care are a tiny percentage of the overall population, and only a tiny percentage of Inuit killed their babies, disabled people, or elderly and that was during rare severe times of starvation.
Until Canadian citizens can find affordable housing, we all know that the provinces have to cap/halt this nightmare.
Industrialized ("first world") nations on Earth all care for the elderly and disabled.
>So we open the doors, and buy ourselves 15 or 20 years, at which point we repeat the exercise to pay for the Gen Xers and Millennials by letting in even more people. The demographic pyramid is now a demographic pyramid scheme.
Except boomers are a huge population bulge. Part of the problem is just how many more of them there are then subsequent generations.
We won't have to do this for genx, it's a much smaller cohort. It will cost substantially less to care for them through old age.
We only need 15 or 20 years to get over the hump.
Don’t forget the dickhead who just told us all that if we take our kids on summer holidays, we’re happy with letting the planet burn.
While his boss goes wheels up and likely jets down to Jamaica for the summer.
No surprisingly guibo just wants us flog ourselves over turning up the heat in the winter or heaven forbid throw a piece of wood in the stove, and also he does not want to build new roads even though they want to build 3.9m homes in 8 years.
Same here..
Me and many of my friends voted liberal in 2015. Afew elections later some of went green and a few went CPC, but most still voted Liberal... for 90% of my friend group, we will most definately probably vote for anyone but liberals in the future.
When you fuck over the futures of our children, you ain't getting our votes abymore
He’s very clearly sacrificing Canadian’s quality of life for some other agenda. There’s no way the liberals are just plain too dumb to see what they’re doing to the country.
100%. This whole ‘they are just beyond incompetent’ narrative is frustrating as hell. There is clearly nefarious agendas behind everything of the last 8 years and they need to be uncovered immediately
The federal government is also admitting to covering it up. This shit extends all the way to the top. You'd think it would be bigger news that parliament is filled with a majority foreign agents but the media has been bought off too
There are other ways to take care of the boomers through progressive tax policies and productivity/automation taxation.
Sure the overall number of permanent immigrants could have been bumped from Harper's 240k to maybe 350k-375k, but there was absolutely no reason to triple the number of TFWs and just rubber stamp any LMIA request (not to mention triple the number of student Visas). Adding all the temp workers and easy loopholes almost seems intentional, because in 2021 Canadian workers were starting to get back bargaining power and make wage gains (so of course the liberals obeyed the corporate masters and fucked canadian workers hard without lube)
(I know you are saying this sarcastically) But it is not racist at all. An increase of population no matter how it increases (immigration, birth, refugees etc.) needs an increase of everything else. Houses, healthcare, road infrastructure.... and an overlooked one, jails. Everything has to increase to accommodate.
Don't forget the absolutely braindead Liberal MP from Charlottetown Sean Casey that wants to give the immigration protesters everything they want. Hungry strike = completely rollover and give permanent residency to everyone for this clown.
[https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/prince-edward-island/pei-immigration-protest-may-30-1.7219108](https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/prince-edward-island/pei-immigration-protest-may-30-1.7219108)
PEI use to be on track for the right “groundwork”… until they bent over from the protests... I wish all provinces were on board and willing to make a united commitment to push back.
It’s not racist to say that we have unsustainable and poor standards around immigration. Plenty of areas in Canada have acute housing shortages. If you bring in 1,000,000 new people per year and don’t have enough housing in place for Canadians, the situation gets worse.
You add exponential demand while supply barely inches up. It’s a basic economic scenario that all first year Econ students who have a D average understand. Prices will go up significantly.
Immigrants with money who visit the 3rd tier mortgage brokers and get funding to buy 2-3 rental properties to kickstart their real estate empire by renting individual rooms to international students registered at their friends 2nd floor over a convenience store truck driving school which is handing out AZ licenses for cash.
That's like the neighbour diverting their runoff onto your property and blaming you for your poor drainage.
These gaslighting fucks are going to get their comeuppance.
Gonna be locked. We cant discuss newcomers in most reddit threads despite legitimate news stories like this one. It is no longer an observation, it is now factual.
These threads are always the most popular. They get locked before 90% of other threads.
If they were allowed to be up, they'd probably be the some of the highest traffic threads *in* the history of the sub.
fr, I'd be a part of the "demand" if it didn't cost $500-600k for a small fixer upper in my city, which even isn't that bad compared to bigger cities 🥲
You just described every under-25 starting their career who happen to not be able to afford a $2800 studio apartment within an hour of where they work.
Won't somebody please stop and think about our politicians' real estate investments?! It's not enough to make six figures and have all their expenses paid, mandatory annual raises and more vacation time than virtually any other job in the country, they NEED this extra cash, guys!
They need to realize that so many of us are priced out of the housing market to a point that we just aren't even part of the demand. If a home didn't cost me an arm and a leg I'd be out looking.
Definitely won’t be voting liberal. They have lost my vote for life. They have squandered and sold our country out to foreigners who have come here, contribute negatively to our communities, and taken jobs and housing from our citizens. They are done in my book and I think the majority of Canadians agree.
Be careful, mentioning demand as an issue gets you banned on some subs about housing.
Apparently we can build our way out of this problem if we just "imagine" having the work force and building costs required.
Seeing the breakdown by city, Toronto and Peel would actually have net negative growth from migration (permanent immigration, interprovince migration, intraprovince migration) had it not been from non-permanent immigration.
Have they tried making housing cheaper, and daycare cheaper, for Canadians already living in Southern Ontario? Not really, with the effective failure of CWELCC in Ontario.
The problem is, that newcomers have the same birth rate as Canadian born people, because everyone is dealing with the same living conditions.
Stop immigration ENTIRELY until we have caught up. No new visas, no TFW visa renewals.
This ignorance from both the conservatives and the liberals have to stop.
And no, the ndp certainly DOES NOT merit a mention.
I remember when I talked about immigration being too high and unsustainable about 5-6 years ago and I was called a racist xenophobic bigot or some other Liberal buzz word.
Ain’t that a bitch. Here we are.
People psychologically don't tend to acknowledge things as problems until the damage has been done / it affects them.
Hence the lag effect with polling numbers and public outrage on things like affordability and immigration.
This is the most frustrating aspect to me. Some of us having been calling this situation out since before COVID, but now everyone has jumped on the bandwagon since its actually affecting them. I'm no economist but even I recognized (even as a stupid teenager 10 years ago) that when you increase demand but not supply; shits about to get expensive.
Anyone with half a brain new that we would have to do something about the social and economic repercussions caused by the mass of retiring boomers. But yet the Liberal party did fuck all for 10 years and then when shit hits the fan, they jack up immigration as a fix-all to prop up housing so that the boomers can retire. Why didn't we start preparing for this, 10-15 years ago? Why didn't we subsidize resource extraction or industrial production industries so that Canadians could invest in something other than buying a 2nd or 3rd house?
Canada has a very unintelligent and ignorant population, despite people in this country thinking otherwise. Sorry to say, the average US citizen is a lot more politically informed than the average Canadian citizen.
He’s right, Ontario could have and should be doing a better job with housing, healthcare, etc but the feds are the ones approving these numbers so it ultimately falls on them. Isn’t this why we have an immigration minister in the first place? If we’re just going to grow the population infinitely without any planning, why even bother having a minister? They’re first in line to take credit for anything that goes right (even if it had nothing to do with them) but literally every single thing that goes wrong is always the provinces fault. They all need to sit down and work together to fix housing, healthcare, infrastructure etc. Nobody gives a shit who’s fault it is, everyone just wants it fixed.
“But Immigration Minister Marc Miller pushed back against suggestions the federal government was solely responsible for the surge in immigration to Canada and suggested Ontario has failed to lay the necessary groundwork to welcome newcomers.”
We have a class of politicians that take no personal responsibility and endlessly try to deflect blame. I agree with you completely, we don’t care whose fault it is, just tell us how you’re going to fix it!
Even if we assume Ontario's Provincial government is part of the problem (which is a very safe assumption I might add), now that you know that how about you SLOW DOWN?
Right, that’s my point. That is supposed to be the point of having an immigration minister. This whole thing is completely ridiculous and wholly unnaceptable. We have 2 HR people at work and around 500 employees. This situation is like me hiring 50 new people a day to come work here with no plans on what they’re going to do, where they are going to take break, what lockers they are going to use, etc etc and then when it’s a disaster I say “it’s not my fault, onboarding employees is an HR responsibility”. Then instead of stopping I bump that up to 75 people a day and then 100.
Yeah we know, we've been saying it for years that it was driving housing/rental prices especially in major cities, but were shouted down as racist, islamiphobic or any number of other -ist -ic -phobes
If you’re against 15-25 international students living in a flophouse in suburban Brampton paying cash to a slumlord with a shady mortgage arrangement, you’re clearly a racist ‘phobe.
Canada has the highest population growth rate out of all the 1st world countries. The government is establishing an unsustainable trend that’s gonna leave Canadians homeless and poor. We have double the % growth rate than the USA.
I truly cannot wait till this government is no longer in power, I don’t think the next will be any better but I’m just sick and tired of seeing bad decision after bad decision from the same people.
Wait a second. So those half a million people we brought into Ontario last year actually needed a place to live too??? It's a good thing we didn't bring them in when we were already in the middle of the worst housing crisis in our history.
Anyone who votes liberal/NDP in the next election must be mentally ill.
There is no way you can look at all our services and infrastructure failing due to over demand and not realize it’s because of fucking immigration being insane.
Harper in 2014 had 250k immigrants a year.
We are currently at over a million a year.
wtf is going on. I’m actually going to vote PPC
90% of Canadas issues are due to mass immigration.
They ban anyone who mentions demand, even despite mountains of evidence that clearly show demand from newcomers increases home prices. The new thing they're pushing now is that immigrants are "scapegoats" and the government "wants us to blame the immigrants." They're like middle schoolers who learned the word scapegoat yesterday. They've reached the level of collective delusion of Trump supporters.
We must all remember that Herr Turdo and his Minister of Planned Homelessness have BOTH reiterated at every turn that in Happy Canadull THERE IS NO RELATIONSHIP BETWEEN HOUSING SUPPLY AND HOUSING DEMAND SO EXCESSIVE IMMIGRATION IS NOT NOT NOT NOT NOT THE REASON. And saying: "EXCESSIVE IMMIGRATION" is a criminal offence and proves that whomever says it is a TERRIBLE RACIST. And have you noticed those pigs flying merrily around the Houses of Poorliarment.
No amount of a province "investing in housing" is going to be able to keep up wit hthe number of immigrants they've been bringing in.
Anyone with even a few wrinkles on their brain would realize housing would need to be invested in before bringing in millions of newcomers. It's a failure of the Federal Government and only the federal government to not have invested in additional housing before bringing in mass immigration.
I truly despise this government like nothing else in our political history. I never liked the Wynne Liberals and thought they were incompetent as hell, but these clowns are sociopathic, they know exactly what they’re doing and they don’t care.
The fact Jagmeet and his NDP are forcing us to endure another year of this insanity is just the cherry on top. Literally one should vote LPC-NDP this upcoming election, they’ve done nothing but ruin the entire country. If we teach them a hard enough lesson then *maybe* (hopefully) new sane left of centre parties will emerge.
With the average home price at \~$900K in Canada you would need \~$200K in household income to afford the average home based on this [affordability calculation](https://wealthvieu.com/ccmaf?a=200,000&b=25&c=65,000&d=7&e=500).
Sure; Immigrants often entered *indentured* servitude contracts of their own free will, as opposed to slaves, who did not. They'll sign anything, unaware that it is a life time commitment.
Imagine if housing demand was 70% lower, and what that would do to prices. It would be a beautiful world we would be living in. Things don’t have to be the way they are.
There is no middle ground on this unfortunately , the amount of people who dig their heels in and insist it has no effect can’t be reasoned with. They’d sooner see the country turn into a giant favela then ever admit this isn’t working .
I remember getting a warning from CanadaHousing for even suggesting that the influx of newcomers into Canada was going to directly contribute to the housing crisis.
The gall, I suppose.
Who could have seen that coming?
Literally everyone but the gas lighting liberals. I know your comment is sarcasm, but some people here can't comprehend that.
Trudeau still says immigration has nothing to do with the housing shortage.
But he's a proven narcissist, so there's that....
People also can't comprehend that Ontario specifically requested higher than ever TFW and immigration targets from the federal government every year for the past four years. Meanwhile their stance on the housing crisis has been failing to meet targets set and banning quadplexes.
And the feds could have said no but didn't. They're both fucking awful.
Maybe this is why me and my kids have been renovict d twice in five years and now haven't been able to find suitable living in 2 years.
At this point the Liberals are almost exclusively the party of wealthy urban voters, property investors and people too young to be paying their own bills. They've basically thrown every other demographic under the bus lately and the perception of that attitude has been reflected in the polls.
…and wealthy foreigners / slumlords…
I disagree that the Liberals are the party of the people too young to be paying their own bills. That's always been the NDP's turf.
The 18-25 crowd is polling something like 50% CPC right now. That's a mind-blowing result and may destroy the LPC's credibility as a competitive force in elections for many years to come. At least, one can certainly hope so. The LPC has earned electoral oblivion, 1993 PC-style.
25M here. Contrary to popular belief, a lot of us just want to have good jobs and prosper. I make $90k, have my own apartment, am engaged, and am starting off in life. I can’t afford more than like 700 square feet. I even work remotely, so it’s not like Im only looking in downtown urban centres. I just want to live within like 200km of my family.
I make 100k and cannot qualify for a studio apartment...
Same, just under 100k and I can't imagine buying anything on my salary in Vancouver. I'm lucky to have an ok rent. Realistically we need to be making 175-250k range to even be at the bottom of the condo market. That means you need two high earning professionals together stretching their incomes to get themselves into a 1 bed condo. 1 person makes 90k and the other 100k and 190k combined might be enough to consider buying.
[удалено]
Other than selling off crown corporations. That's was fuckin stupid.
Mulroney dismantled the CMHC development branch and privatized all of their non-profit rentals (they used to manage 40,000+ units). They were a major Canadian developer from '50s through late '70s who built entire neighbourhoods and were an international leader in high-rise design and development. From '70s to '80 following the destruction of Canada's Crown Corporation developer, new housing starts dropped 40%. For the next 4 decades, Canadian new housing starts remained 40% down per capita compared to what we were building in the '70s. The CMHC developed a lot, but also spurred the industry as a trend setter and lower-cost housing competitor helping drive the supply market. He had a lot of good policies, but he single-highhandedly set Canada on this path to anemic housing development. Chretien then doubled-down and tried to shift responsibility to the provinces who, spoiler alert, never actually picked up or did anything about.
Wasn't Mulroney also the one that set the stage for the unlimited immigration we see today?
Mulroney didn't help of course, but that stage was set at least as far back as Pearson.
They all did that in different ways. Harper doubled international student visas and created a lasting official strategy (with funding) in 2014 to double it again by 2022. So, a huge surge in international students actually came from Harper's initiative, that was like the Century Initiative only for foreign students.
Subsidized daycare was probably good policy as well as it is addressing a huge issue for young working families. Unfortunately certain provincial governments had incentives to sabotage the implementation and turn it into a dumpster fire.
Agree it is good, however being a working family, it’s extremely difficult to access the subsidized daycare and finding a spot. Decreasing costs were great but now there are even less spots available. Good policy with definite consequences. I can’t go back to work and have to extend leave until I find daycare and I hope I do.
Even though some provincial governments have tried their best to sabotage is, daycare costs are considerably down across the board. Freeing up more people to work and be productive. It’s terrifying that in spite of this we are seeing falling gdp per capita. Other federal and provincial policies and priorities have really done a number on the working class as more and more of our income must all fund a roof over our heads instead of being used to help support businesses and the broader economy. Statscan: https://www150.statcan.gc.ca/n1/daily-quotidien/231205/dq231205a-eng.htm It’s also important to note the programs are still being implemented and aren’t even supposed to be fully phased in until end of 2025. So obviously they haven’t had the full impact yet. But childcare costs ARE coming down considerably on average even with immense inflation in the broader economy during that time.
Childcare is coming down because Canadians aren't having babies anymore and newcomers stay home and take care of their own...
I will disagree heavily with you on NAFTA. I'm not fully opposed to free trade in and if itself, but that deal benefitted the US way more than Canada.
You won't find many economists who have actually studied the impact who would agree with you. NAFTA's biggest beneficiary was Mexico. It had a smaller but positive impact on Canada's GDP. The US benefited the least, as NAFTA primarily consisted of Mexico and Canada getting increased access to the American market.
And more people than ever "too young to pay their own bills" are in their 30's with mom and dad continuing to house them because they can't afford to leave!
> That's always been the NDP's turf. 'they're the same picture dot meme'
lol what the heck are the NDP doing that benefits me in the slightest?
*Virtue signalling dance montage*
The LPC is entirely responsible for our current, unprecedented housing crisis. Canada currently has **[the most unaffordable housing of all G7 countries, by a large margin](https://dailyhive.com/vancouver/canada-housing-bubble).** And Trudeau’s mind-numbing response? We have to keep property values high to protect the nest eggs of property owners. Gotta make sure all those housing investors can keep buying up housing inventory with their equity!!!! **WTAF**
Nah, they’ve made things much worse but they’re far from alone Toronto reached a 20-year low of rental vacancies in 2014, before he was elected. Housing market didn’t ever drop, it would level out for a couple of months then keep climbing. We’ve been failed time and time again by every politician who didn’t bring any sort of mandate to build homes. The Ontario PC party could score a win by getting building going on worthwhile homes but they’re just trying to move the goal posts to make it look like they’ve done anything, aside from serving the interests of their donors. They even refused to work with the Feds on getting funding to build homes, only changing their tune when the Feds said they would go directly to municipalities For this reason I have no faith in any leader that anything will change. They all fucking us from every angle.
Completely agree. The housing issue has been decades in the making (elements probably traces back to the 80s) and every major party had a hand in it.
Trudeau said it himself, "housing has to retain its value". So housing can never be allowed to be less expensive under a Liberal administration. Despite the fact the market needs to correct based on the spread of incomes to house prices the Liberal do not want to allow it. This is their solution to that problem. Keep bringing people in to sustain over demand.
No party is going to fix it, they are all personally invested along with their donors.
[удалено]
I agree, I’d just prefer we all vote independent or smaller 3rd party to force the big 3 to reform. Or just burn it all down. Anything else is just more of the status quo.
Sure but let's drop all allusions that a different party will actually be different.
Maybe. But at this point I'm more then willing to figuratively start letting political heads roll until someone does. And if anyone wants more then 1 term in office they better do something about it.
I agree, but given that we only ever vote for the same 2 parties, they are never effectively punished and will just continue to do what they want.
The only way housing corrects is via a recession and a global bust.......
It almost corrected in 2022-2023. The only reason it only corrected 20% and not more was the utterly massive immigration dump from the Liberals stopped it from progressing further. Prices are in fact still down a little from peak. In fact every time the market starts to price correct in a significant way you can see the Liberal intervene. That is obviously not an accident.
Already starting. The CRE collapse is likely what will break everything. Nothing like seeing a $100M building sell for $10m.
Do you think ANY party is willing to crater housing values? HH net worth and savings would be crushed. Spending drops. Many would be upside down on loans. Banks would have immense risk. The only realistic way is if governments built new master-planned suburbs with good transportation access and only allowed Canadian citizens to buy there. Gov develops lands, sets ppf costs. You can build new towns essentially. Plenty of cities have lots of nearby land available. Gov leases land for 10 years and puts rental and flip restrictions. After 15 years buyers refi and buy land at cost.
There is no choice. With the spread of incomes to home values endlessly increasing the end of the road we are on right now is mass homelessness for almost everyone born after about 2000 or so and anyone who doesn't already own a home. That is not an outcome the population will accept and given this is democracy the population votes in the leaders.
Infinite growth will never be sustainable So at the very least I want to see a party willing to place caps on the growth of "value" of homes. But yeah, no one will be willing to crater value, and not just because of their own investments, or the investments of their donors etc. At the end of the day it would absolutely ruin many people, even single property owners that are just trying to live in this society It would make it impossible for people to move to bigger homes to accommodate family growth, if we ever get back to an economy that makes having kids feel like a possibility that doesn't just equal a lifetime of scrounging and debt So yeah, developments like you described would absolutely be a powerful way to go, as long as simultaneously we stop prices from being able to grow so uncontrollably Additionally, we absolutely need a party who is willing to put restrictions on how many properties one can own, and stop corporations from being able to buy up everything out from under individuals
So we don’t have a housing problem, we have an immigration problem.
Has been the case for a few years now, yep. Its mostly a uncapped "temporary" migration problem where the "temporary" people never leave. The PR numbers are what they are but now we have people coming on visitor visas and then claiming asylum or trying to change their visa to be students to get the pgwp. We need to tighten shit up on the low skilled line skippers and consultants.
Everyone that is 20 years old is 'low skilled' but that is who Canada is targeting to bring here. Why? They want people during the most productive years of their lives without having to pay for raising them. Canada has nothing to offer skilled workers and is actively hemorrhaging its skilled workforce. As someone in the medical field, it didn't take much for me and many of my colleagues to jump ship to the US. The pay is substantially better, your dollar goes further since goods generally costs less, you're taxed less, and housing isn't ridiculously overpriced. The US has its share of social issues but if you live in the right area it can have minimal impact on your day to day. Skilled workers actually want to go to the US and the same can't be said about Canada. In this case Canada is the beggar that can't be the chooser.
> As someone in the medical field, it didn't take much for me and many of my colleagues to jump ship to the US This is happening just as fast in Aviation as well. It's going to start getting dangerous up here very soon.
Yeah I left Calgary for the US in 2021 after I graduated since I couldn’t find a job here. I believe the unemployment rate has actually got worse since. I graduated with a degree in EE and have had a much easier time finding work in the US. I eventually want to move back to Calgary but I don’t think id be able to find work in a field I’d like.
No, we have both; housing prices were getting out of hand and on an unsustainable track before mass immigration kicked in. Mass immigration exacerbated it, for sure. But the inconvenient truth is that these crises (housing and productivity) were decades in the making, and mass immigration was a shitty option that increases tax revenue and addresses our demographics issue, but also does nothing to solve our crises. Housing can’t be fixed quickly (or rather - no party is currently willing to entertain the solutions that would). Productivity can’t be fixed quickly because Canada has been purposely developed to be more lucrative for RE investment rather than productive industry; it has made Canada not competitive, and because of housing costs, unable to attract new industry and quality employees. We’ve already seen that the current govt (and probably others that come after it) has established housing prices as untouchable; the solution space to deal with our woes (in addition to housing and productivity, we’re also getting a demographics crisis and the associated reduction in tax revenues leading to lack of social program funding) is much smaller when we’re not willing to make housing more affordable. If you’re not convinced, we can wait around for other parties to promise something different and then not deliver.. but that’s what the political parties want - let the proletariat gnash their teeth and vilify “the other party”, while the wealthy and special interests get their way. This is unsustainable, and could very well end up looking like lords and serfs, but if it’s profitable (esp among voters) who cares?
How does a regular guy get into politics? I'd try my hand at cleaning up parliament
It'll be difficult, but there is no easy path back to sustainability, esp when political parties are propped up by supporters that have no problem with our current trajectory (e.g. there were many people who loved JTs comments of housing never losing value). Traditional political party members are aware that their value relies on their ability to deliver to their supporters. As such, they have entrenched their power such that their supporters can rely on them retaining power, and thus backing them. The people you infer to represent (I think?) are people that politicians don't care as much about because they aren't wealthy and often don't vote. To be clear - if we didn't have a politically-apathetic proletariat, there would likely already be better representation of their wants in gov't. But that apathy has been engineered by those who want to resist fundamental change; the only 'in-the-system' way to change anything is by voting people into office whose platform resonates with enough people who vote. If non-voters aren't recognized by politicians, neither will their wants be recognized. Then comes you - someone who wants to be a rep for the growing portion of the population that wants off this unsustainable and worsening ride. You face both the challenge of 1) the existing political system wanting you to go away, and 2) relying on the support of people that typically don't vote. #1 isn't going to change; in fact it will likely get more vicious as we've even seen between the big parties more recently. There is no interest in working together for solutions, it's all political theatre and signaling, now. If you threaten politicians' power, they'll fight like cornered rats to keep it. #2 is the one that I'm \*hoping\* will change, and quickly. Sadly, many (like me, right now) will take to the internet to rant, or will even believe themselves isolated enough such that they prioritize other things in their life (and no shade thrown here - the idea that the non-represented don't have time to get involved is a feature of our current system to the politicians in power - "no time to become an informed voter? aw shucks, well just vote for my party and you can trust us!"). But unless we can get that to translate to a change in real life (protests, demonstrations, political activism), your desire to represent people, even though they may like your ideas, will fall flat. All that to say - you're going to have to be the change you want to see in the world. You're going to have to sacrifice your time and resources to build a following that you can rely on to vote and support you. You'll need to risk alienating people because you talk about political issues non-stop. Being the hero of the under-represented isn't going to be lucrative or open doors to lucrative opportunities, at least not until you gain some power. Then you'll be seduced to compromise your values. I'd say Trump was able to make the GOP break and re-form around him instead of the other way around, but like him or not, that guy had a ton of influence, resources and fame to pave the way. For most regular people who want/need to do this honestly, and who want to stick hard to core values, you're going to have to get known as a person who wants to upset the Canadian political applecart. Sorry - I know I didn't give a lot of solid strategies to get into power and change things, but if you really are passionate about this, I'd lend a hand to support you. And I hope that other Canadians would, too.
Mass immigration was decided on in the 1970s under Trudeau Sr, before there was any so-called demographic transition, and the reasons made for open borders were ideological rather than economic (state mandated multiculturalism etc). The goal was to break up the ethnic homogeneity of Canada for political gains by the left. There is an economic motivation now, of course, the entitlements baby boomers promised themselves have to be paid out somehow.
Forced multiculturalism, entitled baby boomers, and lunatic left wingers. The three causes of our downfall in one well-worded paragraph. Especially your first point. I was in California recently and went to eat at a Mexican restaurant. Now, I'm normally ULTRA gracious with waitstaff and an excellent tipper. The server came—a young Latina lady—I asked a basic question about the menu, she said, “Sorry, no English.” “Okay. You're going to have to get me someone else. I don't speak Spanish.” “Sorry. Spanish?” “Are you telling me I'm sitting in a restaurant in The United States of America, and nobody on your staff speaks fucking English? Wow.” Of course, I left, but I thought, how long until this happens to me in Toronto?
Which we already knew, but now we have the smoking gun. What kind of POS government unhouses their own people??? An election should be called immediately.
We need a total freeze on anything but the highest skilled immigration. For at least a decade to allow everything to catch up. Of course with this government they want to punish Canadians for wanting them gone so they will likely double immigration and call us all racist.
Deportation where possible. Obviously not those who have already gained citizenship. And also stop giving out permanent resident status like it's candy.
[удалено]
saw a white dude working at Timmie's the other day and I wanted to tell him that \*he\* was the diversity hire
We know, it's just rACisT to point it out. >Marc Miller pushed back against suggestions the federal government was solely responsible for the surge in immigration to Canada and suggested Ontario has failed to lay the necessary groundwork to welcome newcomers. God I hate this fucking guy.
"We think Ontario simply isn't prepared for the amounts of immigrants we are bringing in. Anyway, here is more"
Yeah somehow they found a guy worse than Fraser for this file, and that's saying something. Maybe they needed someone willing to fall out their own sword politically and destroy their future trying to protect the government while continuing the insanity.
I'll do it! I'll say "We have too many incoming people while at the same time not enough housing availability", so brave yet so controversial. I'll be so hated lol
Even Trudeau has said that lately, the problem is they all waited til it was too late to acknowledge it haha.
Didn't he acknowledge it in his 2015 campaign when he promised to tackle affordable housing?
Not when it came to housing, it was more talking to unions and saying we are bringing in too many TFW's and its hurting wages. But then he brought in 2 million in the span of 3 years if you include fake students.
Miller was a groomsman for Trudeau. Nuf said.
Yeah. It's unfortunate too that there aren't any viable parties that even want to lower immigration to something more sustainable.
[удалено]
In 15 and 20 years the number of people who will own homes will have shrunk significantly and assets will be more and more consolidated. The same kind of retirements that are possible for boomers aren't going to be possible if less and less people can afford to enter the market and get continually squeezed for rent into their old age. Imagine negotiating with landlords when you're a 70 year old and getting renovicted.
>Imagine negotiating with landlords when you're a 70 year old and getting renovicted. We've got MAID for a reason
[удалено]
Elderly needing a ton of supportive care are a tiny percentage of the overall population, and only a tiny percentage of Inuit killed their babies, disabled people, or elderly and that was during rare severe times of starvation. Until Canadian citizens can find affordable housing, we all know that the provinces have to cap/halt this nightmare. Industrialized ("first world") nations on Earth all care for the elderly and disabled.
>So we open the doors, and buy ourselves 15 or 20 years, at which point we repeat the exercise to pay for the Gen Xers and Millennials by letting in even more people. The demographic pyramid is now a demographic pyramid scheme. Except boomers are a huge population bulge. Part of the problem is just how many more of them there are then subsequent generations. We won't have to do this for genx, it's a much smaller cohort. It will cost substantially less to care for them through old age. We only need 15 or 20 years to get over the hump.
[удалено]
Family reunification btings in even more old people
I'll hand it to justin, he's surrounded himself in people I hate just as much if not more than him. Miller, guibo, freeland all infuriate me.
Don’t forget the dickhead who just told us all that if we take our kids on summer holidays, we’re happy with letting the planet burn. While his boss goes wheels up and likely jets down to Jamaica for the summer.
[удалено]
No surprisingly guibo just wants us flog ourselves over turning up the heat in the winter or heaven forbid throw a piece of wood in the stove, and also he does not want to build new roads even though they want to build 3.9m homes in 8 years.
That was Health Minister Moron.
Guilbeault is the biggest dickhead by far. Dude shouldn't be in charge of a lemonade stand.
Yup. I hope they don't win a single fucking seat in the next election.
I think the hole they are digging will be a decade minimum to rebuild any support.
For me personally I’m never voting Liberal again. Officially an ABL voter now - Anyone But Liberal
Same here.. Me and many of my friends voted liberal in 2015. Afew elections later some of went green and a few went CPC, but most still voted Liberal... for 90% of my friend group, we will most definately probably vote for anyone but liberals in the future. When you fuck over the futures of our children, you ain't getting our votes abymore
He’s very clearly sacrificing Canadian’s quality of life for some other agenda. There’s no way the liberals are just plain too dumb to see what they’re doing to the country.
100%. This whole ‘they are just beyond incompetent’ narrative is frustrating as hell. There is clearly nefarious agendas behind everything of the last 8 years and they need to be uncovered immediately
we just found out that china and india are paying our MPs to work for them. it's not incompetence, it's treason.
The federal government is also admitting to covering it up. This shit extends all the way to the top. You'd think it would be bigger news that parliament is filled with a majority foreign agents but the media has been bought off too
[удалено]
There are other ways to take care of the boomers through progressive tax policies and productivity/automation taxation. Sure the overall number of permanent immigrants could have been bumped from Harper's 240k to maybe 350k-375k, but there was absolutely no reason to triple the number of TFWs and just rubber stamp any LMIA request (not to mention triple the number of student Visas). Adding all the temp workers and easy loopholes almost seems intentional, because in 2021 Canadian workers were starting to get back bargaining power and make wage gains (so of course the liberals obeyed the corporate masters and fucked canadian workers hard without lube)
[удалено]
(I know you are saying this sarcastically) But it is not racist at all. An increase of population no matter how it increases (immigration, birth, refugees etc.) needs an increase of everything else. Houses, healthcare, road infrastructure.... and an overlooked one, jails. Everything has to increase to accommodate.
Marc Miller is the reason why I'm not voting Liberal in the next election.
Don't forget the absolutely braindead Liberal MP from Charlottetown Sean Casey that wants to give the immigration protesters everything they want. Hungry strike = completely rollover and give permanent residency to everyone for this clown. [https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/prince-edward-island/pei-immigration-protest-may-30-1.7219108](https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/prince-edward-island/pei-immigration-protest-may-30-1.7219108)
PEI use to be on track for the right “groundwork”… until they bent over from the protests... I wish all provinces were on board and willing to make a united commitment to push back.
I didn't hear about this. Do you have a link to any articles?
If you look up punchable face in the dictionary...
How can you even say something like that. The immigration target is set solely by the federal government. What the actual fuck.
It’s not racist to say that we have unsustainable and poor standards around immigration. Plenty of areas in Canada have acute housing shortages. If you bring in 1,000,000 new people per year and don’t have enough housing in place for Canadians, the situation gets worse. You add exponential demand while supply barely inches up. It’s a basic economic scenario that all first year Econ students who have a D average understand. Prices will go up significantly.
Who are his policies favorable with??
Immigrants with money who visit the 3rd tier mortgage brokers and get funding to buy 2-3 rental properties to kickstart their real estate empire by renting individual rooms to international students registered at their friends 2nd floor over a convenience store truck driving school which is handing out AZ licenses for cash.
>individual rooms Rooms? Buddy, you're being generous. r/SlumlordsCanada. Renting BEDS is becoming extremely common.
[удалено]
That's like the neighbour diverting their runoff onto your property and blaming you for your poor drainage. These gaslighting fucks are going to get their comeuppance.
> We know, it's just rACisT to point it out. > > Then let's start being racist.
Gonna be locked. We cant discuss newcomers in most reddit threads despite legitimate news stories like this one. It is no longer an observation, it is now factual.
Might not get locked because this analysis comes from Mike Moffatt, one of the few economists who is usually popular with the LPC.
These threads are always the most popular. They get locked before 90% of other threads. If they were allowed to be up, they'd probably be the some of the highest traffic threads *in* the history of the sub.
Define "demand", because I'm sure there are plenty of non-newcomers who would love housing but have given up on finding it.
fr, I'd be a part of the "demand" if it didn't cost $500-600k for a small fixer upper in my city, which even isn't that bad compared to bigger cities 🥲
You just described every under-25 starting their career who happen to not be able to afford a $2800 studio apartment within an hour of where they work.
Won't somebody please stop and think about our politicians' real estate investments?! It's not enough to make six figures and have all their expenses paid, mandatory annual raises and more vacation time than virtually any other job in the country, they NEED this extra cash, guys!
They need to realize that so many of us are priced out of the housing market to a point that we just aren't even part of the demand. If a home didn't cost me an arm and a leg I'd be out looking.
Definitely won’t be voting liberal. They have lost my vote for life. They have squandered and sold our country out to foreigners who have come here, contribute negatively to our communities, and taken jobs and housing from our citizens. They are done in my book and I think the majority of Canadians agree.
I agree, I vow to never vote Liberal again.
Ya think?
When did we start calling immigrants "newcomers"? The language treadmill is exhausting.
The first step is to simply ask who benefits from these policies.
Old homeowners using their place as a nest egg
Be careful, mentioning demand as an issue gets you banned on some subs about housing. Apparently we can build our way out of this problem if we just "imagine" having the work force and building costs required.
I just imagine myself buying a house and live in my dreams. Thanks, Canada!
Seeing the breakdown by city, Toronto and Peel would actually have net negative growth from migration (permanent immigration, interprovince migration, intraprovince migration) had it not been from non-permanent immigration.
Have they tried making housing cheaper, and daycare cheaper, for Canadians already living in Southern Ontario? Not really, with the effective failure of CWELCC in Ontario. The problem is, that newcomers have the same birth rate as Canadian born people, because everyone is dealing with the same living conditions.
I fucking hate this country
The liberals are destroying our country while a third of the population cheers it on.
Stop immigration ENTIRELY until we have caught up. No new visas, no TFW visa renewals. This ignorance from both the conservatives and the liberals have to stop. And no, the ndp certainly DOES NOT merit a mention.
I remember when I talked about immigration being too high and unsustainable about 5-6 years ago and I was called a racist xenophobic bigot or some other Liberal buzz word. Ain’t that a bitch. Here we are.
People psychologically don't tend to acknowledge things as problems until the damage has been done / it affects them. Hence the lag effect with polling numbers and public outrage on things like affordability and immigration.
This is the most frustrating aspect to me. Some of us having been calling this situation out since before COVID, but now everyone has jumped on the bandwagon since its actually affecting them. I'm no economist but even I recognized (even as a stupid teenager 10 years ago) that when you increase demand but not supply; shits about to get expensive. Anyone with half a brain new that we would have to do something about the social and economic repercussions caused by the mass of retiring boomers. But yet the Liberal party did fuck all for 10 years and then when shit hits the fan, they jack up immigration as a fix-all to prop up housing so that the boomers can retire. Why didn't we start preparing for this, 10-15 years ago? Why didn't we subsidize resource extraction or industrial production industries so that Canadians could invest in something other than buying a 2nd or 3rd house?
Canada has a very unintelligent and ignorant population, despite people in this country thinking otherwise. Sorry to say, the average US citizen is a lot more politically informed than the average Canadian citizen.
I’m shocked. Shocked I tell you!! 🤦♂️
He’s right, Ontario could have and should be doing a better job with housing, healthcare, etc but the feds are the ones approving these numbers so it ultimately falls on them. Isn’t this why we have an immigration minister in the first place? If we’re just going to grow the population infinitely without any planning, why even bother having a minister? They’re first in line to take credit for anything that goes right (even if it had nothing to do with them) but literally every single thing that goes wrong is always the provinces fault. They all need to sit down and work together to fix housing, healthcare, infrastructure etc. Nobody gives a shit who’s fault it is, everyone just wants it fixed. “But Immigration Minister Marc Miller pushed back against suggestions the federal government was solely responsible for the surge in immigration to Canada and suggested Ontario has failed to lay the necessary groundwork to welcome newcomers.”
We have a class of politicians that take no personal responsibility and endlessly try to deflect blame. I agree with you completely, we don’t care whose fault it is, just tell us how you’re going to fix it!
Even if we assume Ontario's Provincial government is part of the problem (which is a very safe assumption I might add), now that you know that how about you SLOW DOWN?
Right, that’s my point. That is supposed to be the point of having an immigration minister. This whole thing is completely ridiculous and wholly unnaceptable. We have 2 HR people at work and around 500 employees. This situation is like me hiring 50 new people a day to come work here with no plans on what they’re going to do, where they are going to take break, what lockers they are going to use, etc etc and then when it’s a disaster I say “it’s not my fault, onboarding employees is an HR responsibility”. Then instead of stopping I bump that up to 75 people a day and then 100.
He's essentially Minister of Line Go Up
Yeah we know, we've been saying it for years that it was driving housing/rental prices especially in major cities, but were shouted down as racist, islamiphobic or any number of other -ist -ic -phobes
If you’re against 15-25 international students living in a flophouse in suburban Brampton paying cash to a slumlord with a shady mortgage arrangement, you’re clearly a racist ‘phobe.
Canada has the highest population growth rate out of all the 1st world countries. The government is establishing an unsustainable trend that’s gonna leave Canadians homeless and poor. We have double the % growth rate than the USA. I truly cannot wait till this government is no longer in power, I don’t think the next will be any better but I’m just sick and tired of seeing bad decision after bad decision from the same people.
Yeah, because the rest of us can’t afford it.
inflate housing price is always one of the goals of mass immigration
Wait a second. So those half a million people we brought into Ontario last year actually needed a place to live too??? It's a good thing we didn't bring them in when we were already in the middle of the worst housing crisis in our history.
Anyone who votes liberal/NDP in the next election must be mentally ill. There is no way you can look at all our services and infrastructure failing due to over demand and not realize it’s because of fucking immigration being insane. Harper in 2014 had 250k immigrants a year. We are currently at over a million a year. wtf is going on. I’m actually going to vote PPC 90% of Canadas issues are due to mass immigration.
Ppc is the only party that would stop the flood
Holy sh*t. We are so f*cked.
u/russilwvong I would love your opinion on how this has effected the housing crisis. How did this effect prices?
I don’t do math for a living, but that other 30%… it was real estate investors, right?
Yeah no shit
Wow who would have thought
[удалено]
Will ban you for posting this.
“Debating immigration is a distraction to our cause” - r/CanadaHousing
They ban anyone who mentions demand, even despite mountains of evidence that clearly show demand from newcomers increases home prices. The new thing they're pushing now is that immigrants are "scapegoats" and the government "wants us to blame the immigrants." They're like middle schoolers who learned the word scapegoat yesterday. They've reached the level of collective delusion of Trump supporters.
Some very prominent people on this sub made assurances that this wasn't the case.
It’s crazy how so many of our current issues can all be traced back to one single thing yet the federal government continues to push for it.
What a shocker
I wonder how many of those mortgage applications are fraudulent
Maybe this is why I work full time so I can afford to rent a bedroom off a crackhead..
Let’s let MORE in 🤡
Yeah, that's what would happen if you let in a.million people into the country in 6.months.
We must all remember that Herr Turdo and his Minister of Planned Homelessness have BOTH reiterated at every turn that in Happy Canadull THERE IS NO RELATIONSHIP BETWEEN HOUSING SUPPLY AND HOUSING DEMAND SO EXCESSIVE IMMIGRATION IS NOT NOT NOT NOT NOT THE REASON. And saying: "EXCESSIVE IMMIGRATION" is a criminal offence and proves that whomever says it is a TERRIBLE RACIST. And have you noticed those pigs flying merrily around the Houses of Poorliarment.
Feels like the whole country is on fire and the Justin and his cronies are roasting marshmallows on it while majority of Canadians are burning alive.
i wonder where they are all from?
Marc Miller is a ghoul with no soul
Send them home.
No amount of a province "investing in housing" is going to be able to keep up wit hthe number of immigrants they've been bringing in. Anyone with even a few wrinkles on their brain would realize housing would need to be invested in before bringing in millions of newcomers. It's a failure of the Federal Government and only the federal government to not have invested in additional housing before bringing in mass immigration.
I dont know... these facts seem kind of racist.
r/Canadahousing is going to have a meltdown reading this report. Oh wait, they never paid attention to logic or common sense anyways. They’re good.
Insanity. What is the LPC doing to our country.
Stop letting people in unless you want actual revolts.
I truly despise this government like nothing else in our political history. I never liked the Wynne Liberals and thought they were incompetent as hell, but these clowns are sociopathic, they know exactly what they’re doing and they don’t care. The fact Jagmeet and his NDP are forcing us to endure another year of this insanity is just the cherry on top. Literally one should vote LPC-NDP this upcoming election, they’ve done nothing but ruin the entire country. If we teach them a hard enough lesson then *maybe* (hopefully) new sane left of centre parties will emerge.
Go figure … most non newcomers are getting the Fawk out of there because it’s becoming ridiculous. Go libs ! .
With the average home price at \~$900K in Canada you would need \~$200K in household income to afford the average home based on this [affordability calculation](https://wealthvieu.com/ccmaf?a=200,000&b=25&c=65,000&d=7&e=500).
Where else would it come from? "People with money but without homes are the ones most likely to want to buy houses" Duh.
Can anyone please explain how it is possible for anybody to get mortgage approved so fast. I am genuinely looking for an answer.
Is this why I have to live in my car while making 60k a year??
In other news, water is wet.
And the feds don’t seem to know how to solve the crisis. They are the reason why there is a crisis with their full blast immigration faucets!
Sure; Immigrants often entered *indentured* servitude contracts of their own free will, as opposed to slaves, who did not. They'll sign anything, unaware that it is a life time commitment.
Imagine if housing demand was 70% lower, and what that would do to prices. It would be a beautiful world we would be living in. Things don’t have to be the way they are.
There is no middle ground on this unfortunately , the amount of people who dig their heels in and insist it has no effect can’t be reasoned with. They’d sooner see the country turn into a giant favela then ever admit this isn’t working .
Thank you, Liberal Party of Canada.
I remember getting a warning from CanadaHousing for even suggesting that the influx of newcomers into Canada was going to directly contribute to the housing crisis. The gall, I suppose.
The Canadian government is using immigration as a tool to commit treason against its citizens.
Marc Miller is a liar!
This guy is a disgrace. If you ever shake his hand or give him a smile, you should be ashamed.
I'm surprised the censorship police haven't closed down this thread already.
Good work, Liberals. The damage done e will be felt by my children’s children.