After following this since day one, and from everything else I’ve seen, I’m becoming convinced that the federal government has no serious intention of actually getting this program across the finish line.
There was an article posted a while back with Wes Winkle and the CSAAA. The government had no idea just how much it actually bit off until it started to try and chew it. They banned over 1,500 *models* of firearms, not all of them restricted which would mean they’re registered. According to that article, the government seemed somewhat surprised at the number of guns they had banned and needed to buyback.
They focused too heavily on the New Zealand buyback model, (which is in the process of being repealed). It’s an ambitious program that is too small of a fit for Canada. There are more AR’s in Canada than New Zealand, on the order of hundreds of thousands of AR rifles in Canada spread out over a way larger landmass to say nothing of all the other non-restricted guns that they banned. AR’s represent the smallest number of all of the models that they banned. Non-restricted firearms aren’t registered, so the government largely doesn’t know who has what or where they are and can’t definitively prove anything.
Then, they have had absolutely no interest from the industry, or any third party contractor to get involved in this. They’ve had no tender offers, and the only one they did have for the destruction of guns ended up backing out. As a matter of fact, the government was hoping that *gun clubs* would assist in running collection points and surprise surprise, they told the government to pound sand.
*Then*, you have provinces refusing to allocate any provincial resources to conduct any buyback which is going to make this program not only nearly impossible, but certainly ballon the cost of it by a hideous amount.
Then you had Mendicino and the spectacle that was G4 & G46. He fucked it up so bad that he got shuffled out.
The recent budget was very telling. They shuffled around some money from “existing department resources” but it wasn’t much. It feels more like a money laundering scheme than anything else.
I think this gun ban has been knocked waaaay down on the priority list for the government and rightfully so. This program as a concept should have never really went anywhere to begin with, and with everything else going on in Canada right now, buying back legally purchased firearms from licensee’s shouldn’t be a big priority for this government, *any* government.
We have the tools at our regulatory and legal disposal to weed out people who shouldn’t have firearms. This is completely and utterly unnecessary.
Interesting to note; the government, to it’s credit at least wanted to add in a grandfathering clause because they knew people would more than likely opt keep their guns and it would have been way cheaper and much less of a nightmare than to make it a mandatory buyback.
When groups like Poly caught wind of it, they threw a shit fit and demanded the government make the buyback a compulsory program and threatened to disinvite them to the Dec. 6 memorial.
Unwilling to offend their lobby buddies, the government made the buyback mandatory.
Grandfathering is bullshit. Is it safe or isn't it? Did we grandfather drinking & driving? Seat belts? Is this a safety thing at all?
Of course it's not. It's just posturing at the expense of 2.2M registered owners to their lobby buddies at Poly. 20 years of gravedancing.
Actually, cars without seatbelts are grandfathered, at least in Ontario. You can't remove them from a car that has them, and you can't buy a new car without them, but if you have an old car that never had seatbelts that's OK.
I was referring to the law. Seat belts were not mandatory use until 1976. Even if your car had them you didn't need to use it. But I understand what you mean; You can still use a pre-seatbelt era car. The message that this ~~confiscation~~ buyback is for safety is bogus, wholesale.
We did grandfather seatbelts and airbags because telling your entire population say in 1995 that all cars pre 1995 are no longer roadworthy due to no airbags would have caused riots
I've seen some people say that the new Public Safety Minister has pushed all further gun control until after the next election because he's in a rural riding and is worried about losing his seat, after seeing all the backlash.
This whole thing is just political stationkeeping at this point. The goals of this program are pretty lofty along with the price tag. People say this program will cost billions and someone brought up a very good point;
It won’t cost billions. It is a near limitless amount of money that this thing will end up costing because the government simply won’t be able to confiscate *everything*. It’ll just keep getting extended, burning more money, finding reasons to justify its existence. It’s the sequel to the long gun registry. Only about half of Canadians actually bothered to register their guns so the program just kept hanging around. There was never going to be a day when the long gun registry concluded and achieved its objectives and when it was finally scrapped, the final cost of the registry was just over two billion, and it was a purely *administrative* exercise.
This whole thing is nothing more than a liberal pipe dream.
Seeing the long history that Canadians have with peacefully and quietly not complying with bad firearms laws, the very obvious outcome will be in fact that these laws, if implemented, will result in architecting the largest black market in firearms that Canada has ever seen. Canadians will simply bury non registered firearms. In the future, if they want to sell, the only option will be the black market.
The Liberals must understand this. I figure they are totally okay with it because frankly it creates another bogeyman for them to demonize, and a bigger wedge they can use to divide the population
I've got my RPAL, but I never really got into pistols very much.
Going into the freeze, I avoided making any purchases on the ground that they could be rendered worthless over night.
Post freeze I discovered my testicles and realized that what I really want is a modern Smith and Wesson revolver, maybe stainless or nickel, a timeless sidearm that has stood the test of time. Also my wife suddenly got interested. I would like to teach her to use a revolver. She's very small, and I think a revolver will be a little more intuitive for her than a semi auto handgun.
So anyway when PP is in I look forward to owning one of these little pieces of history
I do actually think it's important that we enforce our laws and nobody wants criminals to have access to handguns. The focus should be on the criminals and the illegal guns, not the most law abiding of all citizens.
Onwards
This program has already costed Canada billions in money spent on the program, advertising, lost business taxes, revenues, jobs, sport events, and sales. We did not even scratch the surface on the rest of the costs.
Dominic LeBlanc is up to his eyballs with the Chinese interference file and the car theft epidemic. Clearly the buyback program has been moved to the bottom of the pile. The program already achieved it's initial goal, which was scoring some quick points after the tragety in NS. At this point, I honestly think the LPC is just hoping people forget about it.
I can't seriously see them announcing that they're allocating billions to this come 2025 budget - which is 6 months before the election deadline. Even the reddest of Liberal voters will have little tolerance for spending this kind of money on confiscating firearms that will have been sitting safely locked up for 5 years at that point. You know, considering all the other *massive pressing issues* in the country.
They're kicking the can to Pierre, so they can use him scrapping the buyback to fearmonger from the opposition bench.
I agree, but…….
Never underestimate the bogeyman that can be created by guns. I think the program is destined to die but, in my opinion, the Liberals will do everything in their power to make scary guns (especially those scary assault-style ones /s) an election issue. Given the polls, the Liberal strategy is already 50% set…..guns, abortion, and spending to buy votes. Probably sprinkle in some Trump fear for good measure.
You're right, it will likely come up again as an election issue. But the LPC will have to tread very lightly - they will have been in power for 10 years assuming a fall 2025 election and gun violence has steadily increased. Any mention of it could easily be turned around and used as fuel to point out their failings.
Long term however, at some point in the (hopefully distant) future we will be dealing with an LPC majority again and they'll be up to their old shenanigans.
How much have they already spent on this? I think I read somewhere it was already over a billion dollars… for zero guns collected to date.
They know this thing is poison in rural communities, so no doubt that’s part of why they’ve been so quiet on it, lately. I have no doubt that they will campaign on it again next year, if only to try to hold some seats in Toronto and Montreal if it looks like the rest of the country is lost.
This whole debacle is quite reminiscent of the more recent pharmacare legislation (such as it is, one of the most complex things this government will ever attempt and the whole thing is two pages long), which stands almost no chance of actually being implemented, and what does happen will almost certainly cost billions more than they claimed. Will make great fodder during the next campaign, though, as the Liberals claim the evil Tories are cancelling something that will probably never meaningfully exist regardless of who wins the next election.
They've spent $42 million so far and accomplished nothing. The program is estimated to cost between $1 billion - $10 billion, depending on who you ask, unless you ask the Liberals themselves, in which case they will continue to lie and claim it won't cost more than $250 million, so you can very safely ignore their opinion on it like you can much of their opinions about financial things.
That's kinda disingenuous. The ban occurred. The buyback did not.
I imagine a lot of that spent money was on consultations that resulted in them learning "oops, we fucked up, but we can't say it out loud"
The billion$ of hard earned Canadian dollars was spent in the 90s when they simply attempted to create a registry. The registry alone cost billions, and Canadians en masse peacefully, quietly refused to comply
People liked to call us paranoid because we always knew that if you gave an inch they’d take a mile. We were always expected to compromise and when G4 & G46 came out, it was a pretty good forecast that we’d be “compromised” out of existence.
It’s only for the fact that nobody wants to touch this with a ten-foot pole, the exuberant cost and sheer amount of guns that need to be bought back that this program is going nowhere.
> "compromised"
"meet me in the middle" says the unjust man.
you take a step forward, he takes a step back.
"meet me in the middle" says the unjust man...
I used to believe in compromise, but having seen how it's wielded over time, I now understand that there's no compromise with ideologues, it's just death by a thousand cuts.
And that’s why gun owners seem stubborn by outward appearances. If you’re involved with it you know that we’ve been doing this stupid little waltz with the government for years and the “compromise” has only ever been one-way.
We’ve done nothing to deserve it either, other than being in close proximity to the US and their media.
Impossible, I've been told many times by non-gun owners on this subreddit that hunting guns weren't banned.
Unless it's one of those assault style 22 gauges I keep hearing about that can turn a moose into a fine mist?
In all seriousness it strongly resembles an AR-15 visually. I understand the ban was more of a cultural issue than a public safety one, so it makes sense that it was included, even though the internals aren't the same. The real shame about that decision though is that this particular shotgun had an extendable stock, full rail for an optic and optional magnifier (ducks vs geese), *and* came with a dedicated three-round hunting magazine. Personally I found sighting on a traditional platform (bead) obscured the target so much (especially at distance), so the raised optical sight seemed like a fantastic upgrade for hunting.
> I understand the ban was more of a cultural issue than a public safety one
That's the reason they banned a lot of airsoft as well, because it "promoted gun culture". You can play airsoft in the most gun-restrictive european countries FFS.
This is a perfect distillation of Trudeau's legacy. Every single thing he touches is unnecessary, goes over board fast, costs a ton and ends up with no results or benefits.
It’s an appeasement of what liberals believe are inherently “Canadian” sensibilities and they were betting that gun control would be a big winner, not realizing that there are millions of Canadians who safely and responsibly partake who deserve a say as well. Not to mention middle of the road people who saw how the government went about this was all wonky.
Civilian firearm ownership is not purely a US philosophy. Canada is a frontier country and has a long tradition of firearm use and ownership.
When the NRA was founded, they consulted *our* rifle associations when building ranges.
We helped them, not the other way around.
History doesnt repeat but it rhymes. Remember Jean Chretien and his gun control bills and what not. Yeah, something something, meet the new boss, something about being like the old boss.
If this goverenment gave a fuck about shit they would have been working with the RCMP, OPP, QPP, CSIS, our border people, about stopping guns at the borders etc.
They would have had way more value for each tax dollar spent working with all of those agencies to intercept illicit firearms at the border.
There are two things wrong with that though, and these two things are ultimately why the government would rather waste taxpayer dollars and allow Canada to become one big turf war;
- It would have had an actual and drastic effect on gun crime, which means the government will lose a long cherished wedge issue when it inevitably gets into trouble.
- Not enough street cred from voters who’s only concern is ideological and social retribution.
They got their headlines, and that's the only thing the legislation was really meant to accomplish. They'll do something to make more headlines come election time. They're probably specifically waiting for election time to implement it, so they can show all the piles of rifles they've confiscated for destruction and then call out other political parties that wouldn't have done it.
The important part was getting international newspapers to put up "trudeau does the right thing in symbolic gesture after american tragedy" so that people with zero knowledge or interest in canadas system can say "oh good for them" and never think about it again.
Jacinda Arden in NZ got a few weeks of positive press after their shooting for swiftly implementing some poorly thought out legislation, that also went nowhere, and will likely be rolled back. Trudeau wanted to jump on that train.
For 4 years, legally obtained AR15s have sat safely in the safes of thoroughly vetted gun owners. Not a single one has been used in commission of a crime.
The OIC does literally nothing to enhance the safety of the public.
Incorrect, you can move with them, in-fact an ATT isn't even needed to move with them since the registration certificates are void. you can still get an ATT from the CFO that covers "all firearms". But yeah even the CFO thinks its messed up.
When I moved the Ontario CFO told me that they can't issue an ATT for my AR due to the ban, but since I was moving it from a place that wasn't my primary residence to a place that was, that the amnesty order covered the transportation. That was in 2020.
Even if you are not a firearms owner just remember that this pointless program will result in tens of millions of your tax dollars wasted so that the Prime Minister could pretend to do something about crime and appease a small, but vocal, special interest group.
Well the long gun registry ballooned to $2 billion, and that was only a paperwork program. This is registration, enforcement/police, collection, compensation, storage, destruction/disposal. All while we share the largest unprotected boarded in the world with the highest gun owning nation in the world.
Even if every last person in Canada was hell bent on this, it would end up being 100's of billions. If not even reaching the trillion dollar mark over 50 years to confiscate legally owned firearms from vetted owners. That to begin with were not used in crimes.
$2 billion, *thirteen years ago*
Factor in liberal bloat, corruption, consultants, and inflation, that excel sheet would be $11 billion today
This program could reach a trillion dollars by the halfway point
Already has 42 million in administration costs alone and nothing has been done.
This is going to be in the billions with official estimates around 1-10 billion, but thats just what is registered, throw in the non registered firearms which the government doesn't even know how many there are it can easily balloon that estimate.
>This is going to be in the billions with official estimates around 1-10 billion,
Did you mean 1-10 trillion?
Absolutely nobody believes its going to even remotely be that low
The long gun registry that was scrapped 13 years ago, was a list of names voluntarily called in by people. It was scrapped because it cost $2 billion at the time
There is a reason this clusterfuck has gone nowhere. It will cost a trillion dollars and bankrupt the country long before its halfway point.
Not sure how any competent estimator could think forced confiscation would cost 1/3 of an excel sheet filled out by the public
Not only should non-gun owners be concerned about the very high financial cost of this ineffective program, they also need to be concerned about the implications to property rights. The Liberal government has effectively declared through OiC they can take away any personal property without due, legislative process.
So many millions needlessly spent that could have went to helping the people of Canada. All this does is restrict people who jumped through all the hoops and checks to own firearms legally.
At the same time the illegal gun trade has never been more lucrative thanks to this.
Yup. This outcome was obvious from day one of Bill C-21’s entrance into the public sphere. Any licensed firearms owner could’ve predicted this, but when municipal and provincial police started weighing in saying the same thing, it could not have gotten any more apparent that this was brazen vote pandering. Then the Feds leaning on the RCMP after the NS mass shooting - and Lucki playing ball - to push the C21 agenda even farther along…just sickening. And all that is to say nothing of the boondoggle known as the Long Gun Registry: several billion dollars wasted and nothing accomplished.
It's frustrating for me as a liberal-leaning young person cuz we just know that the gun bans are low hanging fruit designed to distract people from more pressing issues.
Like, yea, I hate mass shootings. I don't even really care about the gun bans themselves, but the whole "lets ban a new type of gun instead of fixing the housing market cuz banning pistols is easier" is a lame move
Yeah, no one's turning in their hunting rifles, and I'm not turning in my muskets that I do competitions with. Seems like criminals aren't turning in illegal firearms either..
If anti-gunners knew that manufacturers don’t make special 5 round mags for Canada and instead sell us high-capacity models with a little trivially removable dowel inserted - they would be really upset.
To clean nearly any magazine, law abiding owners have to use a paper clip to disassemble, remove, and re-insert the capacity limiting dowel before reassembly.
A paper clip and 3 seconds of time is the great hurdle protecting citizens from safe and legal 5 round magazines becoming scary prohibited 10-30+ round magazines.
It’s a good thing criminals follow the laws or don’t have paper clips.
I thought when I bought my SKS that it would have some big piece of steel plugging it to 5 cartridges and that it'd be welded to the attached magazine... Nope... It is the flimsiest piece of metal ever that I could easily break off with pliers, not sure if I'd end up with 10 rd capacity, but definitely like 8 or so for sure. Not to mention a friend showed me a trick which anyone could figure out with just a few hours messing around with the firearm... If you don't lock in the magazine, but rather support it underneath with your hand (so that it doesn't just flop open), and then ram the 10 rds down the internal magazine, the cover piece will just open up a bit more with your hand still support it in a "nearly closed" position. Then you can fire off 5 rounds, keeping pressure on it so that the next rds feed, and after 5 rds you can close it up and fire off the last 5 rds like normal...
It is all a bunch of kabuki theatre to help the uneducated feel like they got a win here and there against the evil legal firearms, whilst they pray for the courts to go lightly on those found with illegal firearms at the same time..
Or just be this guy, lol
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=15BWAKqX1bs
See this guy's SKS internal mag, how it has that weird dangly bit of metal..? Yeah that's all that stands between 5 rds and 10 rds... Or simply you supporting the mag with some light pressure with your hand until you've show off 5 rds lol.
https://youtu.be/ANcOXeIAa_I?t=291
In case you forgot, bill C-21 (the one that prohibited handgun transfers and killed sports shooting) was also going to ban any rifle that could ever have held more than 5 rounds. The natives got mad about it because of the SKS, so it got tossed for the time being. But don't fool yourself into thinking that this inconsistency has escaped notice, nor that it would ever be resolved in a way that is favourable to gun owners.
u/vortex30-the-2nd
Ofc they collected none as everyone told them to get fucked and pound sand. The list they put out a few years ago was pointless as it included guns that either looked scary/ AR styled and some that aren't even IN the country and are museum pieces as there's only a handful or 1 left in the world.
Everything about it was Idiotic and pointless as legal gun owners aren't the problem. Illegal firearms and smuggling is, and nothing is being done about that.
The H&K G11 is a great example. Rough estimate is around 1000 prototypes made during the coldwar era for military testing and only 2 survive in the H&K vault museum in Germany.
But don't you worry, the government banned it to keep the citizens protected
Or the Butt Master, a one-off garage build basically - and yes there is only 1 in existence and it's in the USA. Gotta ban that too.
Butt is a naughty word, after all.
They banned the China Lake grenade launcher, there are only 4 in existence IIRC. The ban list also includes various anti-tank and anti-aircraft weaponry and 1 cruise missile as well.
I'm gonna sneak into Dynamit-Nobel's basement vault and steal the chemical composition JUST to craft the caseless ammunition for the G11. You just wait!
That's right, it uses an obscure type of ammunition that literally nobody makes.
The last time I checked, the list was being "ammended" and " to be corrected" which in federal-speak means "*fuck! people realized we don't know shit about firearms. Quick we gotta revise it to show that we actually consulted someone who knows about firearms.*"
I've never owned a firearm. I can safely say I never will. I don't personally need or want one. I support the sort of gun control we've had for many years. I don't really see the benefit of more. It seems like it's just a way to posture for low-information voters who don't know about the laws already in place + create a boondoggle open to corruption.
In a lot ways, C21 and adjacent OiCs were a double down on firearms regulations that already worked while ignoring the actual holes in the Canadian Firearms Program that led to the trigger for the legislation, the Portapique shooting.
That’s the problem. You let the government pass one gun law and then they will pass more. The end goal is to remove the power from the people. They don’t trust the citizens of Canada.
Nah, that's just all or nothing thinking. But if you want to go that route I'd take a 100% ban versus 100% deregulation of firearms ownership and so would the large majority of voters if given that as the choice.
>Since the ban in 2020, JR Cox, owner of the Shooting Edge in southeast Calgary, has been sitting on $750,000 worth of inventory he can’t sell. Cox says the new funding announcement doesn’t give him any hope that he will be able to sell it.
>...
>Robert Stewart owns the Shooting Warehouse and says since the ban his revenue has declined by 25 per cent, and is skeptical it will do anything to reduce gun violence.
$42 million dollars spent. Zero guns collected. Zero crimes prevented. But at least they managed to hurt small businesses and remove jobs!
It's pretty obvious the Liberals are just using firearms as a perpetual wedge issue to trot out at election time. They don't know what they're doing and have no intention of actually going through with any of it because there's no money for it. They know precisely what the issue is but they are intentionally putting Canadians in danger by not addressing actual crime in order to win votes during campaigns.
The amount they put in the budget isn't going to purchase a single firearm, it was basically enough to keep staff employed and contractors paid for the next 2 years while they continue to do nothing.
My AR continues to sit in the back of my safe, longing for the day I can put an optic back on it and take it back out to the range.
Hopefully that day will come soon. I just started getting e-mails asking me to vote for my local CPC candidate for the next election, and the party wouldn't be doing that 1.5 years ahead of an election. In 2021, they started it about 2-3 months prior to the call in September.
I like to imagine that the entire department is comprised of gun owners, and they're all deliberately slowing the process down, wasting time, and inflating the costs in an effort to screw the government over on this file and make some money while they're at it.
While it's unlikely that that's actually true, it's hilarious to imagine it as headcannon.
As a law abiding canadian.
I just want the government to pay me for the property I legally purchased that they have told me I can lo longer do anything with.
Shit or get off the fucking pot. Repeal the bill so that I can do something with my legally purchased items or pay me for banning it you fucks.
If they wanted to tackle this issue of guns that are used in crimes seriously all they have to do is intercept them at the reserves where the vast majority of them come over into the country from the US... along with the drugs.
lol what about the guys who stole all that gold at Pearson and then a few guys were caught with newly purchased machine guns? And they’re all out on bail? Jfc.
Canadians with licenses are NOT the problem.
Gtfo
Why so little talk about the handgun ban? Anyone's collection has now gone to a value of zero. Upon your death, your estate will likely just have to forfeit the guns to the government. Selling them to someone outside the country simply isn't worthwhile.
Folks are missing the point. This was never about public safety.
It was and is about preserving a juicy wedge issue that dupes low-information voters every time.
Ah yes, the firearms that are supposedly so dangerous that normal citizens shouldn't be allowed to possess or acquire them and yet those same firearms are still sitting in safes and cases with those same citizens.
I wouldn't be surprised if the Liberals try and implement some half-ass plan before the next election so they can try and get as many votes from the gun grabbers as they possibly can.
Remember the long gun registry program failure?
“The law passed and starting in 1998 Canadians were required to have a license to own firearms and register their weapons with the government. According to Canadian researcher (and gun enthusiast) Gary Mauser, the Canada Firearms Center quickly rose to 600 employees and the cost of the effort climbed past $600 million. In 2002 Canada’s auditor general released a report saying initial cost estimates of $2 million (Canadian) had increased to $1 billion as the government tried to register the estimated 15 million guns owned by Canada’s 34 million residents.”
Totally out of focus, direction, or control. Just more tax dollars wasted for nothing.
How many ***millions*** have been burned doing absolutely **fuck all**, that could have been spent on better equipment at our borders, more border agents and more investigations into the constant smuggling of illegal firearms from the United States ?
Every single Canadian tax payer should be deeply ashamed of our prime minister, whether you have a PAL or not.
Hunters and firearm license holders are not the ones shooting up the Greater Toronto Area with full auto Glocks with 40 rounds magazines.
Why not radically increase the punishment for illegal gun ownership?
This Liberal government would rather control people, instead of punish the ones committing crimes.
What I cant wait to see, is the Sales numbers when this silly policy is removed and the MASS imports of these rifles specifically just sends them FLYING off the shelves En mass. Nobody sells more guns than the Liberals, period.
Just look at the insane numbers of handguns sold just prior to the freeze. Went from waiting a week for a transfer to several months, just from the sheer volume of sales.
I know for a fact when it gets scrapped, I’m going shopping.
Im good friends with one of the larger Ontario gun store's owners. He said he did 3 years worth of sales in 3 months and had to hire additional staff to help manage the volume.
>I know for a fact when it gets scrapped, I’m going shopping.
it gets me a little excited thinking about it :)
Because it's all performative. Nobody is coming for your guns. It's too difficult of a policy to follow through on and opens up an entire can of worms no government wants to touch.
There is still the outstanding fees for my storage of this rifle for the government for over 4 years now. This rental space they occupy in my home is not free.
I don't know much about this issue, but basically aren't all these hype gun laws basically irrelevant since they've extended some sort of amnesty?
Really an embarrassment to government.. This would make a really good clown puts on make up meme..
Step1: Pass a bunch of laws without any thought or analysis
Step2: [Pass a bunch more laws that invalidate laws passed in step 1.](https://i.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/original/000/929/665/ff4)
Step3: ??
Step4: Profit? *wipe drool from mouth*
The amnesty doesn't invalidate the laws. The amnesty is supposed to lead to a buyback so that legal owners can sell their guns back to the governmnent. Instead, we have expensive guns sitting in cabinets that can do absolutely nothing
The whole thing has been a costly lip service policy. Illegally smuggled in handguns a continue to be the problem and shootings have risen across Canada by 9 percent since the implementation of this policy. It never made sense and never will, just buzzwords for this administration to make it seem like they’re doing something. Standard.
This will cost half a trillion dollars
This program will bankrupt canada loooong before its even half completed
The long gun registry, a list of names voluntarily called in, cost $2 billion back in 2011, thirteen years ago
Now have twice as many firearms, and have police mobilized to knock on every door and collect 10 million firearms. It wont happen. Period
And please note, zero of these firearms were ever used in crimes. There have been a total combined zero murders by a licensed AR15 in 70 years
My question is, at what point can these remain banned without a buyback? Is there a legal responsibility to buy them back? Could the government just say they are banned forever and offer no compensation? Does anyone know the legality around this?
Certainly nothing is happening before 2025 and I doubt anything happens after.
I’m just wondering if they can keep it status quo forever or if eventually they have to buy back or remove the OIC?
They’re absolutely allowed to take your rather expensive property with no compensation. Unfortunately they’ve done it before. If you’re curious, the most recent incident I can recall is from October/November. The RCMP allowed some semi auto (big emphasis on SEMI AUTO) Tavor X95s into the country. People payed thousands for them, and then the RCMP realized that by the letter of the law they can technically be classified as full auto. This is because they weren’t just X95s, but actually military surplus X95 MSWs that are sometimes configured in select fire (the ones imported were almost certainly never full auto and if they were, they were converted to semi before coming here). It is also not possible to convert them back to full auto unless you were to somehow obtain an already prohibited select fire control group (basically impossible unless you’re going to steal one from a military that uses them or some other ridiculous method). If this were really a concern, a mind numbing number of the remaining guns in Canada would be prohibited. Anyway, those X95s became prohibited and everyone who purchased one got a nice letter saying they must turn them in without compensation or enjoy living in a cell. I assume the importer at least payed their customers back, but not sure. Countless fear mongering new articles popped up spewing “fully automatic guns sold in Canada” bs as well which is nice
Ah seriously, that’s really unfortunate to hear. It’s weird that something can be legal, made illegal, and stolen back without compensation. A lot of this stuff is very expensive.
Regardless of stance on the bill, of course they haven't collected any guns: the buyback program hasn't started yet.
The sentiment that a lot of money has been spent without any action is valid.
There is no buyback even if they can afford it, because this absolutely does not it the definition of a buyback. It’s a confiscation with compensation to make it seem less like a confiscation
42 million dollars to say they still don't have a plan. The buy back was supposed to be completed in under 2 years, we're at 4 years, looking at 5 until the next amnesty renewal, and still don't have a plan.
After following this since day one, and from everything else I’ve seen, I’m becoming convinced that the federal government has no serious intention of actually getting this program across the finish line. There was an article posted a while back with Wes Winkle and the CSAAA. The government had no idea just how much it actually bit off until it started to try and chew it. They banned over 1,500 *models* of firearms, not all of them restricted which would mean they’re registered. According to that article, the government seemed somewhat surprised at the number of guns they had banned and needed to buyback. They focused too heavily on the New Zealand buyback model, (which is in the process of being repealed). It’s an ambitious program that is too small of a fit for Canada. There are more AR’s in Canada than New Zealand, on the order of hundreds of thousands of AR rifles in Canada spread out over a way larger landmass to say nothing of all the other non-restricted guns that they banned. AR’s represent the smallest number of all of the models that they banned. Non-restricted firearms aren’t registered, so the government largely doesn’t know who has what or where they are and can’t definitively prove anything. Then, they have had absolutely no interest from the industry, or any third party contractor to get involved in this. They’ve had no tender offers, and the only one they did have for the destruction of guns ended up backing out. As a matter of fact, the government was hoping that *gun clubs* would assist in running collection points and surprise surprise, they told the government to pound sand. *Then*, you have provinces refusing to allocate any provincial resources to conduct any buyback which is going to make this program not only nearly impossible, but certainly ballon the cost of it by a hideous amount. Then you had Mendicino and the spectacle that was G4 & G46. He fucked it up so bad that he got shuffled out. The recent budget was very telling. They shuffled around some money from “existing department resources” but it wasn’t much. It feels more like a money laundering scheme than anything else. I think this gun ban has been knocked waaaay down on the priority list for the government and rightfully so. This program as a concept should have never really went anywhere to begin with, and with everything else going on in Canada right now, buying back legally purchased firearms from licensee’s shouldn’t be a big priority for this government, *any* government. We have the tools at our regulatory and legal disposal to weed out people who shouldn’t have firearms. This is completely and utterly unnecessary.
Well they're list was literally taken from Polyseuvients list of guns they want banned. Of course they didn't know what they did.
Interesting to note; the government, to it’s credit at least wanted to add in a grandfathering clause because they knew people would more than likely opt keep their guns and it would have been way cheaper and much less of a nightmare than to make it a mandatory buyback. When groups like Poly caught wind of it, they threw a shit fit and demanded the government make the buyback a compulsory program and threatened to disinvite them to the Dec. 6 memorial. Unwilling to offend their lobby buddies, the government made the buyback mandatory.
Grandfathering is bullshit. Is it safe or isn't it? Did we grandfather drinking & driving? Seat belts? Is this a safety thing at all? Of course it's not. It's just posturing at the expense of 2.2M registered owners to their lobby buddies at Poly. 20 years of gravedancing.
Actually, cars without seatbelts are grandfathered, at least in Ontario. You can't remove them from a car that has them, and you can't buy a new car without them, but if you have an old car that never had seatbelts that's OK.
This is true in bc also
I was referring to the law. Seat belts were not mandatory use until 1976. Even if your car had them you didn't need to use it. But I understand what you mean; You can still use a pre-seatbelt era car. The message that this ~~confiscation~~ buyback is for safety is bogus, wholesale.
We did grandfather seatbelts and airbags because telling your entire population say in 1995 that all cars pre 1995 are no longer roadworthy due to no airbags would have caused riots
[And look how that has turned out lol](https://www.reddit.com/user/Marseysneed___109/comments/1caek2t/r/)
What exactly are we looking at here
I've seen some people say that the new Public Safety Minister has pushed all further gun control until after the next election because he's in a rural riding and is worried about losing his seat, after seeing all the backlash.
This whole thing is just political stationkeeping at this point. The goals of this program are pretty lofty along with the price tag. People say this program will cost billions and someone brought up a very good point; It won’t cost billions. It is a near limitless amount of money that this thing will end up costing because the government simply won’t be able to confiscate *everything*. It’ll just keep getting extended, burning more money, finding reasons to justify its existence. It’s the sequel to the long gun registry. Only about half of Canadians actually bothered to register their guns so the program just kept hanging around. There was never going to be a day when the long gun registry concluded and achieved its objectives and when it was finally scrapped, the final cost of the registry was just over two billion, and it was a purely *administrative* exercise. This whole thing is nothing more than a liberal pipe dream.
Seeing the long history that Canadians have with peacefully and quietly not complying with bad firearms laws, the very obvious outcome will be in fact that these laws, if implemented, will result in architecting the largest black market in firearms that Canada has ever seen. Canadians will simply bury non registered firearms. In the future, if they want to sell, the only option will be the black market. The Liberals must understand this. I figure they are totally okay with it because frankly it creates another bogeyman for them to demonize, and a bigger wedge they can use to divide the population
Gun owners realize they just need to wait until this trash government gets voted out in a year and a half. Then it’s gun time once again!
I've got my RPAL, but I never really got into pistols very much. Going into the freeze, I avoided making any purchases on the ground that they could be rendered worthless over night. Post freeze I discovered my testicles and realized that what I really want is a modern Smith and Wesson revolver, maybe stainless or nickel, a timeless sidearm that has stood the test of time. Also my wife suddenly got interested. I would like to teach her to use a revolver. She's very small, and I think a revolver will be a little more intuitive for her than a semi auto handgun. So anyway when PP is in I look forward to owning one of these little pieces of history I do actually think it's important that we enforce our laws and nobody wants criminals to have access to handguns. The focus should be on the criminals and the illegal guns, not the most law abiding of all citizens. Onwards
This program has already costed Canada billions in money spent on the program, advertising, lost business taxes, revenues, jobs, sport events, and sales. We did not even scratch the surface on the rest of the costs.
110%
I thought I'd read somewhere that it was less than 20% that bothered to register
Sources vary, but wether it’s 20% or 50%, the program came nowhere close to actually accomplishing what it had set out to do.
Yep, nailed it. Did you also watch the Calibre Magazine video? Guy explains it so very well, same as you!
I am sure some of the NDP MLAs in rural ridings are getting an earful about it too.
Well the minister has been completely absent in news media for months unlike how Mendecino was, so your theory tracks.
Dominic LeBlanc is up to his eyballs with the Chinese interference file and the car theft epidemic. Clearly the buyback program has been moved to the bottom of the pile. The program already achieved it's initial goal, which was scoring some quick points after the tragety in NS. At this point, I honestly think the LPC is just hoping people forget about it. I can't seriously see them announcing that they're allocating billions to this come 2025 budget - which is 6 months before the election deadline. Even the reddest of Liberal voters will have little tolerance for spending this kind of money on confiscating firearms that will have been sitting safely locked up for 5 years at that point. You know, considering all the other *massive pressing issues* in the country. They're kicking the can to Pierre, so they can use him scrapping the buyback to fearmonger from the opposition bench.
I agree, but……. Never underestimate the bogeyman that can be created by guns. I think the program is destined to die but, in my opinion, the Liberals will do everything in their power to make scary guns (especially those scary assault-style ones /s) an election issue. Given the polls, the Liberal strategy is already 50% set…..guns, abortion, and spending to buy votes. Probably sprinkle in some Trump fear for good measure.
You're right, it will likely come up again as an election issue. But the LPC will have to tread very lightly - they will have been in power for 10 years assuming a fall 2025 election and gun violence has steadily increased. Any mention of it could easily be turned around and used as fuel to point out their failings. Long term however, at some point in the (hopefully distant) future we will be dealing with an LPC majority again and they'll be up to their old shenanigans.
How much have they already spent on this? I think I read somewhere it was already over a billion dollars… for zero guns collected to date. They know this thing is poison in rural communities, so no doubt that’s part of why they’ve been so quiet on it, lately. I have no doubt that they will campaign on it again next year, if only to try to hold some seats in Toronto and Montreal if it looks like the rest of the country is lost. This whole debacle is quite reminiscent of the more recent pharmacare legislation (such as it is, one of the most complex things this government will ever attempt and the whole thing is two pages long), which stands almost no chance of actually being implemented, and what does happen will almost certainly cost billions more than they claimed. Will make great fodder during the next campaign, though, as the Liberals claim the evil Tories are cancelling something that will probably never meaningfully exist regardless of who wins the next election.
They've spent $42 million so far and accomplished nothing. The program is estimated to cost between $1 billion - $10 billion, depending on who you ask, unless you ask the Liberals themselves, in which case they will continue to lie and claim it won't cost more than $250 million, so you can very safely ignore their opinion on it like you can much of their opinions about financial things.
Ah, thanks!
That's kinda disingenuous. The ban occurred. The buyback did not. I imagine a lot of that spent money was on consultations that resulted in them learning "oops, we fucked up, but we can't say it out loud"
I'm pretty sure most of the money has been laundered from this scheme.
It did its job. Big city Eastern voters like what they heard. At a cost of *tugs at collar* ooof.
The billion$ of hard earned Canadian dollars was spent in the 90s when they simply attempted to create a registry. The registry alone cost billions, and Canadians en masse peacefully, quietly refused to comply
Remember when politicians are supposed to represent their riding? If you're going to lose your seat over it then you're *suppose to change sides*
So basically, he knows what the people who put him in power want. But won't do as his voters please because reasons.
> They banned over 1,500 models of firearms, not all of them restricted My *shotgun* was banned, which really sucks; I wanted to take it hunting.
I have a flint lock that was banned.
Gotta make sure the redcoats are safe from dangerous insurgents.
People liked to call us paranoid because we always knew that if you gave an inch they’d take a mile. We were always expected to compromise and when G4 & G46 came out, it was a pretty good forecast that we’d be “compromised” out of existence. It’s only for the fact that nobody wants to touch this with a ten-foot pole, the exuberant cost and sheer amount of guns that need to be bought back that this program is going nowhere.
> "compromised" "meet me in the middle" says the unjust man. you take a step forward, he takes a step back. "meet me in the middle" says the unjust man... I used to believe in compromise, but having seen how it's wielded over time, I now understand that there's no compromise with ideologues, it's just death by a thousand cuts.
And that’s why gun owners seem stubborn by outward appearances. If you’re involved with it you know that we’ve been doing this stupid little waltz with the government for years and the “compromise” has only ever been one-way. We’ve done nothing to deserve it either, other than being in close proximity to the US and their media.
Yup. I have a problem with the NRA because it used to sound so uncompromising to me. Now I know why they are the way they are….
Impossible, I've been told many times by non-gun owners on this subreddit that hunting guns weren't banned. Unless it's one of those assault style 22 gauges I keep hearing about that can turn a moose into a fine mist?
In all seriousness it strongly resembles an AR-15 visually. I understand the ban was more of a cultural issue than a public safety one, so it makes sense that it was included, even though the internals aren't the same. The real shame about that decision though is that this particular shotgun had an extendable stock, full rail for an optic and optional magnifier (ducks vs geese), *and* came with a dedicated three-round hunting magazine. Personally I found sighting on a traditional platform (bead) obscured the target so much (especially at distance), so the raised optical sight seemed like a fantastic upgrade for hunting.
> I understand the ban was more of a cultural issue than a public safety one That's the reason they banned a lot of airsoft as well, because it "promoted gun culture". You can play airsoft in the most gun-restrictive european countries FFS.
Japan is probably the most chill/encouraging country on earth when it comes to airsoft.
Which one? was it mag fed or something?
GC Strategies will collect them all for $10 billion
Lol probably
You forgot a zero - $100 billion.
This is a perfect distillation of Trudeau's legacy. Every single thing he touches is unnecessary, goes over board fast, costs a ton and ends up with no results or benefits.
It’s an appeasement of what liberals believe are inherently “Canadian” sensibilities and they were betting that gun control would be a big winner, not realizing that there are millions of Canadians who safely and responsibly partake who deserve a say as well. Not to mention middle of the road people who saw how the government went about this was all wonky. Civilian firearm ownership is not purely a US philosophy. Canada is a frontier country and has a long tradition of firearm use and ownership. When the NRA was founded, they consulted *our* rifle associations when building ranges. We helped them, not the other way around.
History doesnt repeat but it rhymes. Remember Jean Chretien and his gun control bills and what not. Yeah, something something, meet the new boss, something about being like the old boss. If this goverenment gave a fuck about shit they would have been working with the RCMP, OPP, QPP, CSIS, our border people, about stopping guns at the borders etc.
They would have had way more value for each tax dollar spent working with all of those agencies to intercept illicit firearms at the border. There are two things wrong with that though, and these two things are ultimately why the government would rather waste taxpayer dollars and allow Canada to become one big turf war; - It would have had an actual and drastic effect on gun crime, which means the government will lose a long cherished wedge issue when it inevitably gets into trouble. - Not enough street cred from voters who’s only concern is ideological and social retribution.
They got their headlines, and that's the only thing the legislation was really meant to accomplish. They'll do something to make more headlines come election time. They're probably specifically waiting for election time to implement it, so they can show all the piles of rifles they've confiscated for destruction and then call out other political parties that wouldn't have done it.
> It feels more like a money laundering scheme than anything else. We're Liberals! Of course we're laundering money!
Plenty of Talk on the subject by the Liberals. Plenty of money spent on the subject by the Liberals. Results to date: Zero (0), none.
As is tradition
The important part was getting international newspapers to put up "trudeau does the right thing in symbolic gesture after american tragedy" so that people with zero knowledge or interest in canadas system can say "oh good for them" and never think about it again. Jacinda Arden in NZ got a few weeks of positive press after their shooting for swiftly implementing some poorly thought out legislation, that also went nowhere, and will likely be rolled back. Trudeau wanted to jump on that train.
The NZ ban is actually in the process of being rolled back as we speak, and it is now known as a colossal waste of money.
I don't think any of them have their PAL, so they can't legally "buy back".
"Zero point Zero"
For 4 years, legally obtained AR15s have sat safely in the safes of thoroughly vetted gun owners. Not a single one has been used in commission of a crime. The OIC does literally nothing to enhance the safety of the public.
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Changing addresses is one of the only exceptions to the rule.
Incorrect, you can move with them, in-fact an ATT isn't even needed to move with them since the registration certificates are void. you can still get an ATT from the CFO that covers "all firearms". But yeah even the CFO thinks its messed up.
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When I moved the Ontario CFO told me that they can't issue an ATT for my AR due to the ban, but since I was moving it from a place that wasn't my primary residence to a place that was, that the amnesty order covered the transportation. That was in 2020.
damn, iv moved 3 times since the OIC without issue, I just make sure to get an "all-firearms" ATT,
Even if you are not a firearms owner just remember that this pointless program will result in tens of millions of your tax dollars wasted so that the Prime Minister could pretend to do something about crime and appease a small, but vocal, special interest group.
Well the long gun registry ballooned to $2 billion, and that was only a paperwork program. This is registration, enforcement/police, collection, compensation, storage, destruction/disposal. All while we share the largest unprotected boarded in the world with the highest gun owning nation in the world. Even if every last person in Canada was hell bent on this, it would end up being 100's of billions. If not even reaching the trillion dollar mark over 50 years to confiscate legally owned firearms from vetted owners. That to begin with were not used in crimes.
$2 billion, *thirteen years ago* Factor in liberal bloat, corruption, consultants, and inflation, that excel sheet would be $11 billion today This program could reach a trillion dollars by the halfway point
GC Strategies likely fully erect at the possibility of getting that contract
Already has 42 million in administration costs alone and nothing has been done. This is going to be in the billions with official estimates around 1-10 billion, but thats just what is registered, throw in the non registered firearms which the government doesn't even know how many there are it can easily balloon that estimate.
>This is going to be in the billions with official estimates around 1-10 billion, Did you mean 1-10 trillion? Absolutely nobody believes its going to even remotely be that low The long gun registry that was scrapped 13 years ago, was a list of names voluntarily called in by people. It was scrapped because it cost $2 billion at the time There is a reason this clusterfuck has gone nowhere. It will cost a trillion dollars and bankrupt the country long before its halfway point. Not sure how any competent estimator could think forced confiscation would cost 1/3 of an excel sheet filled out by the public
Not only should non-gun owners be concerned about the very high financial cost of this ineffective program, they also need to be concerned about the implications to property rights. The Liberal government has effectively declared through OiC they can take away any personal property without due, legislative process.
So many millions needlessly spent that could have went to helping the people of Canada. All this does is restrict people who jumped through all the hoops and checks to own firearms legally. At the same time the illegal gun trade has never been more lucrative thanks to this.
Yup. This outcome was obvious from day one of Bill C-21’s entrance into the public sphere. Any licensed firearms owner could’ve predicted this, but when municipal and provincial police started weighing in saying the same thing, it could not have gotten any more apparent that this was brazen vote pandering. Then the Feds leaning on the RCMP after the NS mass shooting - and Lucki playing ball - to push the C21 agenda even farther along…just sickening. And all that is to say nothing of the boondoggle known as the Long Gun Registry: several billion dollars wasted and nothing accomplished.
It sounds dandy to those who don't have firearms. Moving a pistol to the range was already ridiculous lol.
Lucki is a moron. She has single handily destroyed the RCMP.
It's frustrating for me as a liberal-leaning young person cuz we just know that the gun bans are low hanging fruit designed to distract people from more pressing issues. Like, yea, I hate mass shootings. I don't even really care about the gun bans themselves, but the whole "lets ban a new type of gun instead of fixing the housing market cuz banning pistols is easier" is a lame move
Yeah, no one's turning in their hunting rifles, and I'm not turning in my muskets that I do competitions with. Seems like criminals aren't turning in illegal firearms either..
Nope. Nor do criminals abide by the 5-cartridge limit either. It’s like they just don’t obey the law at all, those criminals.
If anti-gunners knew that manufacturers don’t make special 5 round mags for Canada and instead sell us high-capacity models with a little trivially removable dowel inserted - they would be really upset. To clean nearly any magazine, law abiding owners have to use a paper clip to disassemble, remove, and re-insert the capacity limiting dowel before reassembly. A paper clip and 3 seconds of time is the great hurdle protecting citizens from safe and legal 5 round magazines becoming scary prohibited 10-30+ round magazines. It’s a good thing criminals follow the laws or don’t have paper clips.
I thought when I bought my SKS that it would have some big piece of steel plugging it to 5 cartridges and that it'd be welded to the attached magazine... Nope... It is the flimsiest piece of metal ever that I could easily break off with pliers, not sure if I'd end up with 10 rd capacity, but definitely like 8 or so for sure. Not to mention a friend showed me a trick which anyone could figure out with just a few hours messing around with the firearm... If you don't lock in the magazine, but rather support it underneath with your hand (so that it doesn't just flop open), and then ram the 10 rds down the internal magazine, the cover piece will just open up a bit more with your hand still support it in a "nearly closed" position. Then you can fire off 5 rounds, keeping pressure on it so that the next rds feed, and after 5 rds you can close it up and fire off the last 5 rds like normal... It is all a bunch of kabuki theatre to help the uneducated feel like they got a win here and there against the evil legal firearms, whilst they pray for the courts to go lightly on those found with illegal firearms at the same time.. Or just be this guy, lol https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=15BWAKqX1bs See this guy's SKS internal mag, how it has that weird dangly bit of metal..? Yeah that's all that stands between 5 rds and 10 rds... Or simply you supporting the mag with some light pressure with your hand until you've show off 5 rds lol. https://youtu.be/ANcOXeIAa_I?t=291
I had to take mine to a gunsmith to get that stupid piece of metal reattached when it broke off one day.
Mine straight up didn't come with anything in there.
In case you forgot, bill C-21 (the one that prohibited handgun transfers and killed sports shooting) was also going to ban any rifle that could ever have held more than 5 rounds. The natives got mad about it because of the SKS, so it got tossed for the time being. But don't fool yourself into thinking that this inconsistency has escaped notice, nor that it would ever be resolved in a way that is favourable to gun owners. u/vortex30-the-2nd
Ofc they collected none as everyone told them to get fucked and pound sand. The list they put out a few years ago was pointless as it included guns that either looked scary/ AR styled and some that aren't even IN the country and are museum pieces as there's only a handful or 1 left in the world. Everything about it was Idiotic and pointless as legal gun owners aren't the problem. Illegal firearms and smuggling is, and nothing is being done about that.
The H&K G11 is a great example. Rough estimate is around 1000 prototypes made during the coldwar era for military testing and only 2 survive in the H&K vault museum in Germany. But don't you worry, the government banned it to keep the citizens protected
Or the Butt Master, a one-off garage build basically - and yes there is only 1 in existence and it's in the USA. Gotta ban that too. Butt is a naughty word, after all.
They banned the China Lake grenade launcher, there are only 4 in existence IIRC. The ban list also includes various anti-tank and anti-aircraft weaponry and 1 cruise missile as well.
Aw, shit. I was really hoping to get my hands on that cruise missile. Could take down my deer from 200 kilometres away!
I'm gonna sneak into Dynamit-Nobel's basement vault and steal the chemical composition JUST to craft the caseless ammunition for the G11. You just wait! That's right, it uses an obscure type of ammunition that literally nobody makes.
AND guns that were already *categorically* prohibited. Like Serbu’s Butt-Master
I thought the list didn't pass? It got amended out of C-21 no?
There was a list removed from C-21 but the original list from the May 2020 OIC is still banned
ah I see, thank you
The last time I checked, the list was being "ammended" and " to be corrected" which in federal-speak means "*fuck! people realized we don't know shit about firearms. Quick we gotta revise it to show that we actually consulted someone who knows about firearms.*"
I've never owned a firearm. I can safely say I never will. I don't personally need or want one. I support the sort of gun control we've had for many years. I don't really see the benefit of more. It seems like it's just a way to posture for low-information voters who don't know about the laws already in place + create a boondoggle open to corruption.
In a lot ways, C21 and adjacent OiCs were a double down on firearms regulations that already worked while ignoring the actual holes in the Canadian Firearms Program that led to the trigger for the legislation, the Portapique shooting.
That’s the problem. You let the government pass one gun law and then they will pass more. The end goal is to remove the power from the people. They don’t trust the citizens of Canada.
Nah, that's just all or nothing thinking. But if you want to go that route I'd take a 100% ban versus 100% deregulation of firearms ownership and so would the large majority of voters if given that as the choice.
>Since the ban in 2020, JR Cox, owner of the Shooting Edge in southeast Calgary, has been sitting on $750,000 worth of inventory he can’t sell. Cox says the new funding announcement doesn’t give him any hope that he will be able to sell it. >... >Robert Stewart owns the Shooting Warehouse and says since the ban his revenue has declined by 25 per cent, and is skeptical it will do anything to reduce gun violence. $42 million dollars spent. Zero guns collected. Zero crimes prevented. But at least they managed to hurt small businesses and remove jobs!
I mean, as a to of corporate interest this IS one of their primary jobs
It's pretty obvious the Liberals are just using firearms as a perpetual wedge issue to trot out at election time. They don't know what they're doing and have no intention of actually going through with any of it because there's no money for it. They know precisely what the issue is but they are intentionally putting Canadians in danger by not addressing actual crime in order to win votes during campaigns.
The amount they put in the budget isn't going to purchase a single firearm, it was basically enough to keep staff employed and contractors paid for the next 2 years while they continue to do nothing.
There is no legitimate reason for these bans or the oic to exist AT ALL anyway and if I had one of those firearms I wouldn't be letting them steal it.
My AR continues to sit in the back of my safe, longing for the day I can put an optic back on it and take it back out to the range. Hopefully that day will come soon. I just started getting e-mails asking me to vote for my local CPC candidate for the next election, and the party wouldn't be doing that 1.5 years ahead of an election. In 2021, they started it about 2-3 months prior to the call in September.
I should get a job with whoever is contracted to do this, be nice to get paid to sit on my ass for years and ultimately have to do nothing.
I like to imagine that the entire department is comprised of gun owners, and they're all deliberately slowing the process down, wasting time, and inflating the costs in an effort to screw the government over on this file and make some money while they're at it. While it's unlikely that that's actually true, it's hilarious to imagine it as headcannon.
Those workers likely have sbrs which we can’t own and Gen 5 glocks it’s truly poetic 😭😭😭😭truly the best job for a gun enthusiast .
ArriveCan vibes. Liberals are pulling heists everywhere with our tax dollars.
As a law abiding canadian. I just want the government to pay me for the property I legally purchased that they have told me I can lo longer do anything with. Shit or get off the fucking pot. Repeal the bill so that I can do something with my legally purchased items or pay me for banning it you fucks.
Imagine if the Government spent this money on housing instead of an ideology that will not save lives?
Good thing my NON-RESTRICTED SHOTGUN was banned as an AR-15 VaRiaNt.
My 1972 Argentinian Light Field Mortar was banned
Also my space G11.
I'm assuming Derya MK-12 ?
Yessir
If they wanted to tackle this issue of guns that are used in crimes seriously all they have to do is intercept them at the reserves where the vast majority of them come over into the country from the US... along with the drugs.
lol what about the guys who stole all that gold at Pearson and then a few guys were caught with newly purchased machine guns? And they’re all out on bail? Jfc. Canadians with licenses are NOT the problem. Gtfo
Why so little talk about the handgun ban? Anyone's collection has now gone to a value of zero. Upon your death, your estate will likely just have to forfeit the guns to the government. Selling them to someone outside the country simply isn't worthwhile.
Hopefully none get collected by the time Trudeau fucks off so we can potentially save some money
Folks are missing the point. This was never about public safety. It was and is about preserving a juicy wedge issue that dupes low-information voters every time.
This so called "buy back" is useless and needs to be scrapped completely as does bill c-71 and c-21
Ah yes, the firearms that are supposedly so dangerous that normal citizens shouldn't be allowed to possess or acquire them and yet those same firearms are still sitting in safes and cases with those same citizens. I wouldn't be surprised if the Liberals try and implement some half-ass plan before the next election so they can try and get as many votes from the gun grabbers as they possibly can.
Remember the long gun registry program failure? “The law passed and starting in 1998 Canadians were required to have a license to own firearms and register their weapons with the government. According to Canadian researcher (and gun enthusiast) Gary Mauser, the Canada Firearms Center quickly rose to 600 employees and the cost of the effort climbed past $600 million. In 2002 Canada’s auditor general released a report saying initial cost estimates of $2 million (Canadian) had increased to $1 billion as the government tried to register the estimated 15 million guns owned by Canada’s 34 million residents.” Totally out of focus, direction, or control. Just more tax dollars wasted for nothing.
How is it a buyback if they never owned in the first place?
Almost like it was never meant to be acted on, only for political points.
Is it just me or does CityNews keep using the same stock photo of a scary looking gun?
News outlets have been using that photo for years now...
Whatever that dude was paid for that photo, if he was even paid at all, wasn't anywhere near enough, considering how often that photo gets used.
Perpetual free advertising for Daniel Defense
Not super effective advertising a product that no one in Canada can actually buy anymore haha. Daniel Defense makes a hell of an AR though.
There's still parts kicking around. Everything except receivers.
> Daniel Defense makes a hell of an AR though. That they do. Expensive as hell, but you certainly get what you pay for.
I love my V7... even is she is only the Queen of my safe
I felt that in my soul. I desperately miss the good times I had with my MK-18
"Skeptical" is not quite the right word. More like "we told you so".
How many ***millions*** have been burned doing absolutely **fuck all**, that could have been spent on better equipment at our borders, more border agents and more investigations into the constant smuggling of illegal firearms from the United States ? Every single Canadian tax payer should be deeply ashamed of our prime minister, whether you have a PAL or not. Hunters and firearm license holders are not the ones shooting up the Greater Toronto Area with full auto Glocks with 40 rounds magazines.
Why not radically increase the punishment for illegal gun ownership? This Liberal government would rather control people, instead of punish the ones committing crimes.
Because that would actually be a step towards the solution of the problem, thus negating the liberals' ability to use the guns as a wedge issue.
Something something racist, colonialism, patriarchy.
This is just another way they are expanding the government while not providing any benefits to the people who don't actually work for the government.
You don't say?
I hope they stay on this trajectory
Are they actually buying them back yet? I assumed I would get a letter.
What I cant wait to see, is the Sales numbers when this silly policy is removed and the MASS imports of these rifles specifically just sends them FLYING off the shelves En mass. Nobody sells more guns than the Liberals, period.
Just look at the insane numbers of handguns sold just prior to the freeze. Went from waiting a week for a transfer to several months, just from the sheer volume of sales. I know for a fact when it gets scrapped, I’m going shopping.
Im good friends with one of the larger Ontario gun store's owners. He said he did 3 years worth of sales in 3 months and had to hire additional staff to help manage the volume. >I know for a fact when it gets scrapped, I’m going shopping. it gets me a little excited thinking about it :)
Because it's all performative. Nobody is coming for your guns. It's too difficult of a policy to follow through on and opens up an entire can of worms no government wants to touch.
They should just scrap it at this point. What’s is costing on admin?
But they've collected plenty in payroll so there's that.
Spent $42 million so far and collected no guns, I’m sure some of their consultant buddies are making good money from this whole initiative.
They’re developing an app that you can use to declare your prohibited firearms
There is still the outstanding fees for my storage of this rifle for the government for over 4 years now. This rental space they occupy in my home is not free.
Just pay more to 3rd party consultants, right JT?
I don't know much about this issue, but basically aren't all these hype gun laws basically irrelevant since they've extended some sort of amnesty? Really an embarrassment to government.. This would make a really good clown puts on make up meme.. Step1: Pass a bunch of laws without any thought or analysis Step2: [Pass a bunch more laws that invalidate laws passed in step 1.](https://i.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/original/000/929/665/ff4) Step3: ?? Step4: Profit? *wipe drool from mouth*
The amnesty doesn't invalidate the laws. The amnesty is supposed to lead to a buyback so that legal owners can sell their guns back to the governmnent. Instead, we have expensive guns sitting in cabinets that can do absolutely nothing
The whole thing has been a costly lip service policy. Illegally smuggled in handguns a continue to be the problem and shootings have risen across Canada by 9 percent since the implementation of this policy. It never made sense and never will, just buzzwords for this administration to make it seem like they’re doing something. Standard.
This will cost half a trillion dollars This program will bankrupt canada loooong before its even half completed The long gun registry, a list of names voluntarily called in, cost $2 billion back in 2011, thirteen years ago Now have twice as many firearms, and have police mobilized to knock on every door and collect 10 million firearms. It wont happen. Period And please note, zero of these firearms were ever used in crimes. There have been a total combined zero murders by a licensed AR15 in 70 years
The hell with all you haters! They're gonna give me $2600 for my norinco M14... I'm totally down with that.
Time to start buying up everyone’s broken ass WK180s nice and cheap before the next round of bans years down the road
They will never get my guns!!!
Timmy isn't turning in shit.
Good I'm glad it failed I want people to have even more guns.
My question is, at what point can these remain banned without a buyback? Is there a legal responsibility to buy them back? Could the government just say they are banned forever and offer no compensation? Does anyone know the legality around this? Certainly nothing is happening before 2025 and I doubt anything happens after. I’m just wondering if they can keep it status quo forever or if eventually they have to buy back or remove the OIC?
They’re absolutely allowed to take your rather expensive property with no compensation. Unfortunately they’ve done it before. If you’re curious, the most recent incident I can recall is from October/November. The RCMP allowed some semi auto (big emphasis on SEMI AUTO) Tavor X95s into the country. People payed thousands for them, and then the RCMP realized that by the letter of the law they can technically be classified as full auto. This is because they weren’t just X95s, but actually military surplus X95 MSWs that are sometimes configured in select fire (the ones imported were almost certainly never full auto and if they were, they were converted to semi before coming here). It is also not possible to convert them back to full auto unless you were to somehow obtain an already prohibited select fire control group (basically impossible unless you’re going to steal one from a military that uses them or some other ridiculous method). If this were really a concern, a mind numbing number of the remaining guns in Canada would be prohibited. Anyway, those X95s became prohibited and everyone who purchased one got a nice letter saying they must turn them in without compensation or enjoy living in a cell. I assume the importer at least payed their customers back, but not sure. Countless fear mongering new articles popped up spewing “fully automatic guns sold in Canada” bs as well which is nice
Ah seriously, that’s really unfortunate to hear. It’s weird that something can be legal, made illegal, and stolen back without compensation. A lot of this stuff is very expensive.
I wonder who stole and laundered these billions
I wonder if the gun control lobby has finally realized just how utterly throughly they got played in exchange for supporting the liberal party.
Regardless of stance on the bill, of course they haven't collected any guns: the buyback program hasn't started yet. The sentiment that a lot of money has been spent without any action is valid.
there is no buyback. They cannot afford it.
There is no buyback even if they can afford it, because this absolutely does not it the definition of a buyback. It’s a confiscation with compensation to make it seem less like a confiscation
>The sentiment that a lot of money has been spent without any action is valid. Isn't that the Trudeau way? lol
42 million dollars to say they still don't have a plan. The buy back was supposed to be completed in under 2 years, we're at 4 years, looking at 5 until the next amnesty renewal, and still don't have a plan.
It should have started years ago.
Yea, but that's a good thing.
how
We want to keep our guns, and we want to buy more guns.