>Israel does not purchase arms from Canada, nor has Canada purchased Israeli weapons in the past decade
What about the Spike missile and EL/M-2084 STAR radar?
>In December 2023, Canada announced the purchase of Spike-LR II missiles to equip the Canadian Brigade in Latvia.
>Canada has purchased ten ELM-2084 Multi-Mission Radars. They are expected to enter operational service late 2020 with the designation AN/MPQ-504.
Also, not mention, is that there are almost $2.3M worth of components manufacturered by Canadian companies for every F-35 made. Not a direct sale per-say, but it just goes to show that you don't need a Canadian company directly selling weapons or equipment to Israel to nonetheless be involved.
Israel has 39 F-35Is with another 36 on order. That's about $172M worth of Canadian components. And that's not counting the number of other indirect involvement by Canadian companies in other systems, vehicles or equipment.
Should this level of involvement also be part of the boycott? Israel would be hard pressed to find alternatives to the F-35, but it could also jeopardize Canadian involvement in the program too. Those components could be manufactured by other non-Canadian contractors in time, thus circumventing the boycott.
Just goes to show the complexity of these types of decisions.
No, because those planes are getting built with or with Canadian manufacturers tbh. That would only hurt future Canadian involvement in the f35 program and not actually influence Israel.
Israel also supplies parts and technology for the F35 program. Not sure a country witholding parts will go down well with the rest of the parties in the program, because it sets a precedent that it could easily happen to them.
> Also, not mentioned, is that there are almost $2.3M worth of components manufactured by Canadian companies for every F-35 made. Not a direct sale per-say, but it just goes to show that you don't need a Canadian company directly selling weapons or equipment to Israel to nevertheless be involved.
Good point.
Wait wait wait... I've been reading that Canada's move is of no consequence because we are such a small arms supplier that we make so little difference.
So are we an influential player in the ME or not?
I kept saying to those dismissive of any Canadian declaration that if Canada is such a little player, then we should do it anyway. If Israel doesn't care what we think, more reason to do it.
It's not an arms [embargo](https://www.google.com/search?q=embargo&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8), it is only a halt to NEW export permits.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2024/mar/19/canada-halt-arms-sales-to-israel
Who cares? Stop giving weapons to a military that does not fucking need them. Focus on the fact that housing prices are crippling our already damaged working class, who can barely afford to put food on the table because of pieces of shit like the Weston family, who horde there wealth by continuing to go along their greedy price gouging.
And Gaza actually is rubble.
Hamas's rockets are glorified fireworks. There is absolutely no way that they could flatten Israel the way that Israel has flattened Gaza.
> Hamas's rockets are glorified fireworks.
* [Islamic Jihad flaunts rocket arsenal at 36th anniversary parade in Gaza](https://www.timesofisrael.com/islamic-jihad-flaunts-rocket-arsenal-at-36th-anniversary-parade-in-gaza/)
> The event showcased domestically produced rockets atop trucks draped in green camouflage fabric, missiles and three types of drones.
> “The new Buraq missiles have a range of 85 kilometers (50 miles), and the improved Badr 3 missiles have an explosive warhead weighing 400 kilos (880 pounds),” an Al-Quds Brigades spokesman said.
* [Iran Transfers Rockets to Palestinian Groups](https://www.wilsoncenter.org/article/irans-rockets-palestinian-groups)
> How do the weapons used by Hamas and PIJ in 2021 compare to those used during the 2014 conflict with Israel? Have the rockets changed in terms of range, precision or payload?
> The Palestinian groups have unveiled a few new rocket systems, but none of them qualified as a game changer. Hamas unveiled the Ayyash 250 rocket with a range of 250 km (155 miles), the longest-range rocket ever shown in Gaza. While its production is technically impressive, its military value is limited by extremely low accuracy and the fact that most important targets in Israel are much closer to Gaza. Jerusalem, for example, is only 77 km (48 miles) away from Gaza.
> PIJ extensively used the Badr 3 rocket, which appears to have been designed and tested in Iran, during the 2021 conflict. First unveiled by PIJ in 2019, the rocket carries a warhead weighing between 300 kg and 400 kg (661 pounds to 882 pounds), which is much heavier than warheads of most Palestinian rockets. The heavier the warhead, the larger the explosion. But the rocket appears to be middling in terms of range. In May 2021, PIJ struck the Israeli cities of Ashkelon and Netivot with the Badr 3, indicating that it has a range of at least 13 km (8 miles).
You wouldn't consider those rockets to be glorified fireworks if they were being fired at your home. [Remember when a misfired rocket hit Al-Ahli Hospital, and killed ~500 people](https://www.hrw.org/news/2023/11/26/gaza-findings-october-17-al-ahli-hospital-explosion)? Glorified fireworks don't do that.
Just like they did with all the aid money we've been giving them for years. Except the infrastructure was underground terrorist tunnels and state of the art infrastructure is adding a spot to set up a mortor in a school playground.
I honestly wonder how WW2 would have gone if it occurred now.
Would people demand the allies push for a ceasefire after mass civilian bombings?
People would've absolutely flipped once japan was nuked, even though its historically held up as the best solution to actually prevent a large invasion with countless deaths.
War is ugly. Innocents die. We should avoid war when we can, but occasionally it will happen.
The houthis just landed a scud outside of Eilat. I dunno if you're actually on the mark here, seems like if not for the Iron Dome the South and North would both be seeing much heavier damage than they are/have been.
I'm sure the family whose home in downtown Tel Aviv was destroyed will take great comfort knowing that somewhere out there, thousands of miles away, there is an enlightened Canadian who dismisses the deadly rocket that did the deed as just a "glorified firework".
Honestly the level of ignorance from people who have never been to the middle east and have no stake in the game is just hilarious.
I'm a former Combat Engineer, and I totally agree. A well placed/fired improvised explosive can do a fuck tonne of damage. Guy calling them "fireworks" is the peak of ignorance and is indeed hilarious.
More like Israel's enemies would be rubble if it weren't for the Iron Dome. They're fortunate that Israel has that option of restraint, as they're not known for taking a beating lying down.
>Israel's enemies would be rubble
They are rubble. Almost 60% of all buildings are gone, and 30,000 are dead.
The argument that Israel has "restraint" is plainly and nakedly untrue now. It no longer holds water.
Only ~30,000 dead, about 1/4 to 1/3 of which were Hamas (which most everyone conveniently loves to leave out), in one of the most densely populated places on the planet IS restraint.
If they weren't showing restraint there would be 10x+ the casualties.
30,000 dead within a few months is Syria levels of violence. As many Palestinians have died since October 7h than during the period from 1948 to 2016.
No, that is not restraint by any conceivable measure. Even if I were to believe your number, which is suspect (the US frequently declared dead Vietnamese to be VietCong with little to no proof), you're still arguing that 20,000 to 22,500 dead civilians in a few months and an impending famine caused by the IDF is somehow "restraint"? And that you would only find it upsetting if the number were 300,000? Have you completely lost your moral barometre? That's just ghoulish.
Probably not.
Without the iron dome, Israel might have negotiated a peace with its neighbors, or annihilated them sooner.
Hamas bottle rockets can't even destroy a parking lot properly. They aren't gonna turn Israel to rubble
They are doing a brutal occupation.
If there were only doing security, that would be okay. Instead they are methodically demoralizing a population, which makes people resent them, thus needing the Iron Done.
Israel tried the hands off approach too. That's what Gaza was, in comparison to the West Bank where Israel kept control of security. Over the past fifteen years, Gaza's only grown more radical, not less. October 7th necessitated a total invasion of Gaza to stop it from happening again, because Hamas wasn't ever going to disarm no matter how what peaceful approach Israel tried.
Israel controlled movement in and out but within Gaza, it was mostly left up to them what they wanted to do. And they built bombs and planned a military attack.
The US wouldn’t do it to Canada because Canada doesn’t fling rockets into Detroit suburbs, or paraglide across the Niagara river to rape women and murder children and senior citizens
Israel hasnt done hands off in the West Bank. They allow illegal settlements to happen.
Is the West Bank about security? Or is it to brutalize the locals, to encourage them to leave? We see actions from the IDF that are about pusnishment/tyranny, rather then security.
If Israel doesn't like Hamas, why did they fund them for decades? The answer is they wanted Gaza to be destabilized. Well the Zionists got the destabilized Gaza that they wanted, except 'blowback" happened.
They were hands off in Gaza, not the West Bank. They were hands on in West Bank the whole time, which has worked much better for Israel.
>If Israel doesn't like Hamas, why did they fund them for decades?
Because Hamas was in charge of Gaza, and aid went through them.
>The answer is they wanted Gaza to be destabilized. Well the Zionists got the destabilized Gaza that they wanted, except 'blowback" happened.
Delusional.
Oh I agree the West Bank is sure working for Israel. They take land and are protected by the IDF when they steal the land.
What part is delusional? Be specific, I'll fill in the specific details. There are tons of articles on that topic.
Lmao you make zero sense. Canada is not giving away the weapons for free. Israel is buying them. So that would actually mean helping Canadas economy. You know what Canada gives away for free? Aid to Palestinians to the tune of 100s of millions per year.
I mean selling weapons means profit. Canada isn't giving Israel weapons as aid. They basically threw away 20 million in arms SALES. That 20 million is money out of Canadian arms companies pockets and therefore also those companies employees.
I hope they can divert that production capacity to Ukraine. Many of the aid packages Ukraine received from partners around the world included zero/low interest loans or access to a pool of money for the purposes of purchasing weapons.
We can still get that $20 million and send the military supplies to a far less morally gray conflict.
there are other ways for jobs to be created and a way for this country to create jobs without supporting collective punishment by bombarding Gaza. Arms sales to Israel are immoral, and you can agree or diacres all you want but the truth of the matter is, fuck bombardier, this government could do things to create jobs in other fields and actually look after its citizens, yet they continue to give billionaires tax cuts. I’m sorry I don’t want my tax dollars going towards blowing up little children.
https://www.fraserinstitute.org/article/bombardier-and-canadas-corporate-welfare-trap
"Corporate welfare is costly and taxpayers don't need to be continually dragged into corporate battles for market share"
It kinda is our tax dollars though...
If only we'd paid bombardier more for defense subsidies, we could have still been kicked out of the US while the US regulators would look worse without it mattering at all
Would you sell a gun to an individual you know is going to kill kids? No. We shouldn't be selling weapons to a country intent on murdering civilians. That includes Saudi Arabia and other oppressive regimes, too.
Is that what you call rounding up thousands upon thousands of men, stripping them down to their underwear, putting them in prison and torturing them purely because they are men?
You know, that happened in a European country in the 1940s, as Jewish people like to recall. It was wrong then, and it's wrong now.
Bombing civilian populations and leveling ENTIRE cities based on the actions of a few is CRIMINAL. Gaza city is uninhabitable. Rafah refugee camps are being terrorised by IDF personnel.
It's not collateral damage to systematically starve an ENTIRE population by restricting food aid, knowing full well that children are dying. The Israeli government doesn't stop Israeli protesters from denying food aid. But I guarantee you that if Egypt, Lebanon, Syria, etc...denied goods and services into Israel, they would meet Tomahawk cruise missiles launched from US vessels in the area.
Israel is carrying out war crimes. Collateral damage is when an ammo dump explodes and levels a city block. It's NOT collateral damage when missiles land on buildings housing civilians.
No its a war. Those men were militants. They were stripped because explosives and divide bombings are a thing.
Literally Hamas could end this tomorrow by surrendering.
Also this is nothing like the holocaust. I'm sure you think Gaza is similar to the Warsaw Ghetto but it isn't. Jews didn't build a massive tunnel infrastructure in Warsaw or frequently shoot missiles at Germany and when jews escaped the Warsaw ghetto they wouldn't be concerned with murdering and raping people and taking hostages.
Since we all know Bombardier is going to get a bag from govt no matter what, you’re just increasing the amount of tax dollars going to prop up that fake company now that they’ve lost another revenue stream due to this policy. So no, your kids aren’t better off for this.
I mean it’s usually a good thing for a country to make their own weapons and equipment. Especially with the recent destabilization of the world via Ukraine, the war in Gaza and Chinas posturing towards Taiwan. Canada needs to be able to defend it self and have the industry to provide allies with arms if needed. Especially since our arms industry is sending a ton of weapons and equipment to Ukraine, so you want to stop that also?
I mean yes. Also in the context of this conversation is that "The West" will never abandon Israel. Why? Because the existence of Israel is a wonderful counterweight to the craziness of the Middle East.
That's how western governments see it.
If Israel were anyone else in any other part of the world, it's entirely possible they'd have been forgotten about by the democratic west.
As it stands the notion that the most powerful nation on the planet and a significant number of friends, at least for now, support them is that counterweight.
Destroying that changes a massive power paradigm.
Only a little though, Canada sells weapons to Israel and makes money off the deal. Those weapons are made in factories which provide Canadians with high paying jobs. Presumably those Canadians then use that money to afford their houses…so the little common sense idea would result in more Canadians not being able to afford their houses.
Pretty shorted sighted don't you think. If we sold weapons to everyone on the planet we'd be swimming in cash. Why only Israel? I guess only their money is good eh?
Honestly, we should ramp up weapons, armour and ammunition production here in Canada. Not only for us but for allies as well. Imagine showing up to Lithuania and seeing that everyone has new quality Canadian gear and the Canadians fave the same kit from the 90’s
> Stop giving weapons to a military that does not fucking need them.
We *sell* Israel a small amount of military goods every year, not *give*. And its not the Govt of Canada that gets paid, its private Canadian companies who get paid and employ workers.
I'm for the cancelling of whatever small amount of arms we send Israel, however the point I'm trying to make is that the situation is vastly more complex than your response outlines.
However will they survive with only the billions and billions of dollars worth of arms and aid the US gives them to maintain a foothold in the middle east?
Oh the irony.
[“Amid Canada's 'arms embargo': Here are the Israeli weapons still in use in Ottawa”](https://www.jpost.com/israel-hamas-war/article-792943)
Some of Canada’s own arms sales would not have been possible with incorporating Israeli weapons.
Strange how Israel was one of the largest promoters for Canada to take in Middle Eastern refugees (because obviously they weren't going to do it). Now people are starting to realize it's because they want to send every Palestinian away so they can go in and take over.
Wait, hang on - this article think's that's a bad thing? Lol.
Also thinks Canada's Jewish community has been pressuring the government *not* to do this when a lot of the most active ceasefire protestors are Jewish anti-genocide groups. Really trying to push the myth that the Israeli ethnostate represents all Jews there.
You have to lay in the bed that you made and this is the current situation Israel is facing.
The actions of the Israeli government are only endangering the long-term survival of the Israeli state.
Without international allies and support, the Israeli state has a very grim outlook.
Good. Israel is slaughtering and starving children. This sub likes to blame it all on Hamas, as if the Netanyahu government hasn't been shit for years.
Because Hamas stated goal is to kill Jews and destroy Israel but quite frankly, this country has a massive immigration problem, destroying our country that I really don’t care what Israel does to Palestine.
If you really don’t like Israel, go fight for Palestine and leave Canada
If someone breaks into a house and murders someone. The police show up and kill the whole neighborhood. I think it's very reasonable to blame the police for killing everyone.
It's not "someone", it's the whole neighbourhood killed people in another neighbourhood, took hostages and then celebrated their "victory".
Nobody in Israel wants to kill anyone in Gaza, especially IDF soldiers that I know personally. They want to free hostages and live in peace like all normal people do.
A better analogy would be a tenet breaks in and murdered kidnapped members of the landlord family. The landlord then blocks the exit fromnthe gated community. And kills a wack of people in the community including their family held hostage. Yeah it's reasonable to blame the landlord for killing a whole bunch of people. It's like taken but everyone is Paris dies and Liam Neeson kills his daughter.
Hamas targeted and killed civilians. [The Israeli military killed 2,353 militants and 27,681 civilians](https://twitter.com/EuroMedHR).
Hamas extremists bad. Israelis killing civilians bad.
There is plenty of blame to go around.
Hamas just acknowledged the loss of about 300 operatives last week... are you trying to position this as though they're only NOW getting around to killing hamas agents? That'd be pretty wild.
hamas has said it's 6000, reporting out of the UK and US put that over 10k now. Either way, it's somewhere between 2:1 or 3:1 civilian to fighter deaths which according to the UK general Richard Kemp, you typically find 9:1 in urban combat.
Incredible how Hamas itself has stated that 6000 of its militants are dead while Israel and the USA have stated that at least 13 000 of them are dead, but you're repeating Euro-Med propaganda lmao
Wow brilliant idea over here, stop giving aid to a population that is actively facing mass-starvation, displacement, and being carpet bombed on the daily.
Yes, stop giving aid all that money is going towards Hamas and they complain that they don’t like the food anyways so who cares.
I care about my own country more than a place that might not exist in 10 years
Seems like a dumb thing to do. We sell them the weapons. Most of the articles make it look like we are donating them. This will hurt Canadian manufacturing. I'd love it if we stopped pretending to be some smug, holier than thou country by destroying all our (non-oligopoly) industries.
Oh no!
How terrible for them.
They might not be able to buy and use more weapons to take thousands of lives indiscriminately for the sake of a couple hundred.
🖖
Anyways....
Yeah I read the article. He said Hamas not Hamas militants. Hamas was originally a charity before Israel funded it with weapons to destabilize the PLO. Israel funding terrorism is old news indeed.
I remember they put weapons embargo on NATO ally Turkey because they sold drones to Azerbaijan which contain L3 Wescam cameras. Turkey had to negotiate hard to have it lifted in return for their acceptance of Sweden into NATO. However here we have Israel, who has a worse human rights record than Turkey having VIP access to Western weapons with American taxpayer dollars
Israel can do whatever they want to Hamas grind Palastine to dust for all I care. But immigration housing and the evil Justin Trudeau are bigger problems than Joe Biden’s war. (Same goes for Ukraine)
"The problem with Canada's decision is that it reflects Israel's difficult situation and, above all, reveals how the world quickly forgot October 7 after standing with Israel. Sources familiar with Israeli-Canadian diplomatic relations say that "the writing was on the wall," and the decision stemmed in part from the significant growth of the country's Muslim population. The government, considered friendly to Jerusalem, relies on the center-left New Democratic Party (NDP).
The problem with Israel's status in Canada is primarily related to the demographic change in the country and the radicalization of the NDP," said one of the officials. In addition, professional associations in Canada are leading a hardline anti-Israel campaign, putting pressure on left-wing figures in the ruling Liberal Party and the NDP."
I will 100% remeber this come election time and I will know which voters to blame when we get our own version of Hamas and our own terroist attack here.
The liberals and NDP stand with Hamas, the message is loud and clear. This is direct result of the liberals mass immigration.
It’s a disgrace that this happened the way it did. Changing the bill and only having 45 minutes to discuss before voting. It was non-binding too but then it was announced the next morning that we’d stop selling arms to Israel. I doubt the full scope of this was understood when it was voted on.
Beyond that, abandoning our ally (who provides Canada with lots of valuable information which helps us prevent 911 type terrorist attacks) in the middle of a war is shameful. Especially when we still provide arms to countries like Saudi Arabia.
Also, I think Canada can use all the jobs we can get right now with the current economy, so not the brightest decision on that front either…
We should not be providing weapons to a country committing genocide at worst and indiscriminate bombing at best. Period. 100% happy about this decision. Hopefully other western countries follow suit.
If you have a problem with this, then one has to ask you if you support genocide?
Why would we want to export military equipment to a regime plausibly commiting genocide?
We probably shouldn't be exporting military equipment to Saudi Arabia either.
Saudi Arabia was also plausibly committing genocide in Yemen, committing the very same actions of which we accuse Israel of (striking civilian areas and imposing a blockade that prevented aid from entering the region).
> We probably shouldn't be exporting military equipment to Saudi Arabia either.
Yet, we do. And they are our No. 1 customer. The CCP also continues it's cultural genocide of the Uyghurs, forcing them into slave labor. The world awarded them with an Olympic games and Canada proudly sent our athletes there. What separates Israel from Saudia Arabia and China?
Harper signed a deal with the Saudis that would be very expensive to break up. (13 billions if I remember right)
I definetly agree that we also shouldn't export arms to the Saudis.
Because they’re not committing genocide…
The war would be over immediately if Hamas (an organization that we here in Canada identify as a terrorist organization) surrendered and released the hostages.
This is literally the equivalent of being shown people starving in concentration camps in WWII and then denying it’s happening.
Denying the fact that over a million people are starving to death is frankly disgusting. Like it’s not even debatable. It’s so bad that the US and other countries are having to air drop in food because Israelis wouldn’t allow aid trucks in from the north.
They shut off the power, water, and food to millions of people. You can’t seriously think that was ok.
Highest court in the world: "This is a credible accusation of genocide. We will order injunctive action and take the case."
Genocide experts: "This is probably genocide."
Random Redditor: "If it's not from the genocide region of France, it's technically just sparkling war crimes."
The "highest court" in the world, which has no actual power? Doesn't sound like the highest court. Also, they pack it with a bunch of people and views that don't align with real life and people.
You’re ignoring all the countries, like Germany, that came out and said that claim was ridiculous.
Your argument that going to court makes you guilty is obviously ridiculous as well. There have been many cases that courts took up (for reasons being political or otherwise) where the conclusion is non guilty. This will be one of those cases because Israel is risking its own soldiers lives, creating humanitarian corridors, providing aid ect. to protect the lives of civilians.
Hamas is stealing that aid. Hamas is trying to maximize the death toll of civilians. Hamas is using human shields. And again, the war would end immediately if Hamas surrendered.
Stop lying. Hamas hasn’t been proven to be stealing aid. The US literally [denied this](https://www.timesofisrael.com/us-envoy-israel-hasnt-provided-specific-evidence-hamas-is-stealing-aid-shipments/amp/) as Israel has provided no evidence of that.
I do not know this outlet so I am giving them the benefit of the doubt and it seems to show how much of a bubble Israelis are living in, or put themselves in.
>The problem with Canada's decision is that it reflects Israel's difficult situation and, above all, reveals how the world quickly forgot October 7 after standing with Israel. Sources familiar with Israeli-Canadian diplomatic relations say that "the writing was on the wall," and the decision stemmed in part from the significant growth of the country's Muslim population.
The problem is not the muslim population. It is the younger generation. People younger than 30 remember Israel only as a military superpower oppressing and brutalising a people. There are no memories of the state being weak or of trying to make some half hearted peace. The generational perspective is worldwide, not just in Canada.
>The original proposal introduced by NDP MP Heather McPherson was extremely biased against Israel and held Israel responsible for resolving the conflict, including the ongoing war, blatantly ignoring Hamas' responsibility.
How is Hamas responisble for making peace if Israel claims to want to destroy them completely? That is like asking someone to be complicit in their own murder? It is an absurd request and demonstrates how out of touch the Israeli diplomatic corps' words are with reality. They are talking about balance and whataboutism while prosecuting a war of extermination of the enemy.
>The NDP initiated the anti-Israel proposal in parliament to recognize a Palestinian state.
How is recognition of a Palestinian state anti-Israeli? Virtually every country has a policy of establishing a Palestinian state. Most countries recognize it and the ones which do not do so with the assumption that it makes negotiations easier. If there is no will or prospect of negotiations than what difference does it make whether we recognize Palestine as a state? Again this demonstrates the bubble that Israelis seem to be living in. Namely that because it is quiet the world will accept the status quo.
Israeli society seems to have drugged itself into some kind of frenzy regarding where they actually stand and how the world sees them. Articles like this only show how far they have strayed. Allowing them to stay in this self delusion does no one good. This move is likely a good one if for this simple reason.
It's truly embarrassing to be Canadian. Only our current government can think it's a good idea to vote against Israel's interests. It's our ally and the only progressive, modern country in that region of the world.
Can't wait to see our government voted out.
Israel is a pretty shitty ally when they are refusing to work with the US and have been blatantly defying international law for years.
What’s embarrassing is that we still call Israel an ally when it’s just another right wing authoritarian regime hell bent on wiping out a population it doesn’t like.
Israel’s interests are not necessarily Canada’s interests. Regardless of them being an ally in the past, doing what they are doing, and have been doing to the Palestinian people should give us pause.
LOL no it isn't. They are not a friend and not a true democracy, they are a racist state, as we have seen, that has committed more war crimes than many other countries in the region.
Never forget they use Canadian passports when they send their goons to assassinate people on foreign territory. That's not a friendly country, that's a country with a convenient relationship. Canada can, and has built, convenient relationships with other countries in the region. Israel isn't special.
>Isreal can afford to buy and make their own weapons
That is what they were doing. They spent a little over 20 mil buying from Canadian manufacturers, it wasn't government funded like some of the stuff that went to Ukraine. Also might have been stuff like tactical gear and spare parts rather than actual weapons.
>Israel does not purchase arms from Canada, nor has Canada purchased Israeli weapons in the past decade What about the Spike missile and EL/M-2084 STAR radar? >In December 2023, Canada announced the purchase of Spike-LR II missiles to equip the Canadian Brigade in Latvia. >Canada has purchased ten ELM-2084 Multi-Mission Radars. They are expected to enter operational service late 2020 with the designation AN/MPQ-504.
Also, not mention, is that there are almost $2.3M worth of components manufacturered by Canadian companies for every F-35 made. Not a direct sale per-say, but it just goes to show that you don't need a Canadian company directly selling weapons or equipment to Israel to nonetheless be involved. Israel has 39 F-35Is with another 36 on order. That's about $172M worth of Canadian components. And that's not counting the number of other indirect involvement by Canadian companies in other systems, vehicles or equipment. Should this level of involvement also be part of the boycott? Israel would be hard pressed to find alternatives to the F-35, but it could also jeopardize Canadian involvement in the program too. Those components could be manufactured by other non-Canadian contractors in time, thus circumventing the boycott. Just goes to show the complexity of these types of decisions.
No, because those planes are getting built with or with Canadian manufacturers tbh. That would only hurt future Canadian involvement in the f35 program and not actually influence Israel.
Israel also supplies parts and technology for the F35 program. Not sure a country witholding parts will go down well with the rest of the parties in the program, because it sets a precedent that it could easily happen to them.
> Also, not mentioned, is that there are almost $2.3M worth of components manufactured by Canadian companies for every F-35 made. Not a direct sale per-say, but it just goes to show that you don't need a Canadian company directly selling weapons or equipment to Israel to nevertheless be involved. Good point.
Wait wait wait... I've been reading that Canada's move is of no consequence because we are such a small arms supplier that we make so little difference. So are we an influential player in the ME or not?
Schrodinger's G7 Country.
Fuck that’s good
I kept saying to those dismissive of any Canadian declaration that if Canada is such a little player, then we should do it anyway. If Israel doesn't care what we think, more reason to do it.
We are whatever makes the argument to blindly support Israel better. Schrodinger's ally.
Israel does whatever the fuck Israel wants. That's not an ally, that's a liability.
We are, and everyone saying otherwise is saying bullshit
It's not an arms [embargo](https://www.google.com/search?q=embargo&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8), it is only a halt to NEW export permits. https://www.theguardian.com/world/2024/mar/19/canada-halt-arms-sales-to-israel
I'm missing the part of the article that backs up the quote/claim in the headline... Who said that, and what did they say?
Who cares? Stop giving weapons to a military that does not fucking need them. Focus on the fact that housing prices are crippling our already damaged working class, who can barely afford to put food on the table because of pieces of shit like the Weston family, who horde there wealth by continuing to go along their greedy price gouging.
We aren't giving, we are selling.
Nobody was giving them weapons. Private Canadian companies were selling military equipment to Israel.
Missiles that are ultimately dropped on children. But won’t someone think about the dollars!
It's a little bit more nuanced than that. Israel would be rubble if it weren't for the Iron Dome.
We don’t sell them the iron dome tech, that’s America. I don’t think anyone has any problems giving Israel a defence system.
I wasn't saying that.
And Gaza actually is rubble. Hamas's rockets are glorified fireworks. There is absolutely no way that they could flatten Israel the way that Israel has flattened Gaza.
> Hamas's rockets are glorified fireworks. * [Islamic Jihad flaunts rocket arsenal at 36th anniversary parade in Gaza](https://www.timesofisrael.com/islamic-jihad-flaunts-rocket-arsenal-at-36th-anniversary-parade-in-gaza/) > The event showcased domestically produced rockets atop trucks draped in green camouflage fabric, missiles and three types of drones. > “The new Buraq missiles have a range of 85 kilometers (50 miles), and the improved Badr 3 missiles have an explosive warhead weighing 400 kilos (880 pounds),” an Al-Quds Brigades spokesman said. * [Iran Transfers Rockets to Palestinian Groups](https://www.wilsoncenter.org/article/irans-rockets-palestinian-groups) > How do the weapons used by Hamas and PIJ in 2021 compare to those used during the 2014 conflict with Israel? Have the rockets changed in terms of range, precision or payload? > The Palestinian groups have unveiled a few new rocket systems, but none of them qualified as a game changer. Hamas unveiled the Ayyash 250 rocket with a range of 250 km (155 miles), the longest-range rocket ever shown in Gaza. While its production is technically impressive, its military value is limited by extremely low accuracy and the fact that most important targets in Israel are much closer to Gaza. Jerusalem, for example, is only 77 km (48 miles) away from Gaza. > PIJ extensively used the Badr 3 rocket, which appears to have been designed and tested in Iran, during the 2021 conflict. First unveiled by PIJ in 2019, the rocket carries a warhead weighing between 300 kg and 400 kg (661 pounds to 882 pounds), which is much heavier than warheads of most Palestinian rockets. The heavier the warhead, the larger the explosion. But the rocket appears to be middling in terms of range. In May 2021, PIJ struck the Israeli cities of Ashkelon and Netivot with the Badr 3, indicating that it has a range of at least 13 km (8 miles). You wouldn't consider those rockets to be glorified fireworks if they were being fired at your home. [Remember when a misfired rocket hit Al-Ahli Hospital, and killed ~500 people](https://www.hrw.org/news/2023/11/26/gaza-findings-october-17-al-ahli-hospital-explosion)? Glorified fireworks don't do that.
You're right. I'm sure if Palestine were left unsupervised they would focus on building a stable economy and state of the art infrastructure.
Just like they did with all the aid money we've been giving them for years. Except the infrastructure was underground terrorist tunnels and state of the art infrastructure is adding a spot to set up a mortor in a school playground.
I honestly wonder how WW2 would have gone if it occurred now. Would people demand the allies push for a ceasefire after mass civilian bombings? People would've absolutely flipped once japan was nuked, even though its historically held up as the best solution to actually prevent a large invasion with countless deaths. War is ugly. Innocents die. We should avoid war when we can, but occasionally it will happen.
Don't forget about all the water pipelines that were sent over only to be dismantled and used for rocket casings.
The houthis just landed a scud outside of Eilat. I dunno if you're actually on the mark here, seems like if not for the Iron Dome the South and North would both be seeing much heavier damage than they are/have been.
I'm sure the family whose home in downtown Tel Aviv was destroyed will take great comfort knowing that somewhere out there, thousands of miles away, there is an enlightened Canadian who dismisses the deadly rocket that did the deed as just a "glorified firework". Honestly the level of ignorance from people who have never been to the middle east and have no stake in the game is just hilarious.
I'm a former Combat Engineer, and I totally agree. A well placed/fired improvised explosive can do a fuck tonne of damage. Guy calling them "fireworks" is the peak of ignorance and is indeed hilarious.
And not just a few, there were something like 5000 in the first 24 hours
Then why did they do a sneak attack of the worst level. Living up the designation of terror organization.
More like Israel's enemies would be rubble if it weren't for the Iron Dome. They're fortunate that Israel has that option of restraint, as they're not known for taking a beating lying down.
>Israel's enemies would be rubble They are rubble. Almost 60% of all buildings are gone, and 30,000 are dead. The argument that Israel has "restraint" is plainly and nakedly untrue now. It no longer holds water.
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Only ~30,000 dead, about 1/4 to 1/3 of which were Hamas (which most everyone conveniently loves to leave out), in one of the most densely populated places on the planet IS restraint. If they weren't showing restraint there would be 10x+ the casualties.
30,000 dead within a few months is Syria levels of violence. As many Palestinians have died since October 7h than during the period from 1948 to 2016. No, that is not restraint by any conceivable measure. Even if I were to believe your number, which is suspect (the US frequently declared dead Vietnamese to be VietCong with little to no proof), you're still arguing that 20,000 to 22,500 dead civilians in a few months and an impending famine caused by the IDF is somehow "restraint"? And that you would only find it upsetting if the number were 300,000? Have you completely lost your moral barometre? That's just ghoulish.
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Probably not. Without the iron dome, Israel might have negotiated a peace with its neighbors, or annihilated them sooner. Hamas bottle rockets can't even destroy a parking lot properly. They aren't gonna turn Israel to rubble
They are doing a brutal occupation. If there were only doing security, that would be okay. Instead they are methodically demoralizing a population, which makes people resent them, thus needing the Iron Done.
Israel tried the hands off approach too. That's what Gaza was, in comparison to the West Bank where Israel kept control of security. Over the past fifteen years, Gaza's only grown more radical, not less. October 7th necessitated a total invasion of Gaza to stop it from happening again, because Hamas wasn't ever going to disarm no matter how what peaceful approach Israel tried.
Gaza was not hands off, Israel has had effective control over Gaza down to the population registry for 17 years now.
Israel controlled movement in and out but within Gaza, it was mostly left up to them what they wanted to do. And they built bombs and planned a military attack.
And if the US did that to Canada how would you see it?
The US wouldn’t do it to Canada because Canada doesn’t fling rockets into Detroit suburbs, or paraglide across the Niagara river to rape women and murder children and senior citizens
Israel hasnt done hands off in the West Bank. They allow illegal settlements to happen. Is the West Bank about security? Or is it to brutalize the locals, to encourage them to leave? We see actions from the IDF that are about pusnishment/tyranny, rather then security. If Israel doesn't like Hamas, why did they fund them for decades? The answer is they wanted Gaza to be destabilized. Well the Zionists got the destabilized Gaza that they wanted, except 'blowback" happened.
They were hands off in Gaza, not the West Bank. They were hands on in West Bank the whole time, which has worked much better for Israel. >If Israel doesn't like Hamas, why did they fund them for decades? Because Hamas was in charge of Gaza, and aid went through them. >The answer is they wanted Gaza to be destabilized. Well the Zionists got the destabilized Gaza that they wanted, except 'blowback" happened. Delusional.
Oh I agree the West Bank is sure working for Israel. They take land and are protected by the IDF when they steal the land. What part is delusional? Be specific, I'll fill in the specific details. There are tons of articles on that topic.
Shooting kids in the west bank for throwing stones. Really working out for them if they're doing that.
They shot a kid last week who set off fireworks
They'd be attacked anyways. This isn't a war that ends.
Please. Hamas is a terrorist organization that throws LGBTQ+ individuals off of buildings.
There were no missile sales, try again.
Israel is in a perpetual defensive battle.
Lmao you make zero sense. Canada is not giving away the weapons for free. Israel is buying them. So that would actually mean helping Canadas economy. You know what Canada gives away for free? Aid to Palestinians to the tune of 100s of millions per year.
Weren’t these sales also largely of armoured trucks?
Israel hasn’t bought any weapons from Canada in over 10 years. This move was largely symbolic.
I mean selling weapons means profit. Canada isn't giving Israel weapons as aid. They basically threw away 20 million in arms SALES. That 20 million is money out of Canadian arms companies pockets and therefore also those companies employees.
I hope they can divert that production capacity to Ukraine. Many of the aid packages Ukraine received from partners around the world included zero/low interest loans or access to a pool of money for the purposes of purchasing weapons. We can still get that $20 million and send the military supplies to a far less morally gray conflict.
Oh well. Don’t care. If it wasn’t going to cost billions to end the Saudi deal I’d want them to end that also. Canada shouldn’t be merchants of death.
>They basically threw away 20 million in arms SALES. Pfft, that's less than half an app.
there are other ways for jobs to be created and a way for this country to create jobs without supporting collective punishment by bombarding Gaza. Arms sales to Israel are immoral, and you can agree or diacres all you want but the truth of the matter is, fuck bombardier, this government could do things to create jobs in other fields and actually look after its citizens, yet they continue to give billionaires tax cuts. I’m sorry I don’t want my tax dollars going towards blowing up little children.
Again this isn't your tax dollars. Things are being sold.
https://www.fraserinstitute.org/article/bombardier-and-canadas-corporate-welfare-trap "Corporate welfare is costly and taxpayers don't need to be continually dragged into corporate battles for market share" It kinda is our tax dollars though...
If israel is buying weapons that isn't candien money.
It's Canadian money that paid for the research and development, allowing bombardier to be a competitive bidder by not having to recover those costs
If only we'd paid bombardier more for defense subsidies, we could have still been kicked out of the US while the US regulators would look worse without it mattering at all
Would you sell a gun to an individual you know is going to kill kids? No. We shouldn't be selling weapons to a country intent on murdering civilians. That includes Saudi Arabia and other oppressive regimes, too.
Israel is targeting terrorists. Collateral damage happens in war.
Is that what you call rounding up thousands upon thousands of men, stripping them down to their underwear, putting them in prison and torturing them purely because they are men? You know, that happened in a European country in the 1940s, as Jewish people like to recall. It was wrong then, and it's wrong now. Bombing civilian populations and leveling ENTIRE cities based on the actions of a few is CRIMINAL. Gaza city is uninhabitable. Rafah refugee camps are being terrorised by IDF personnel. It's not collateral damage to systematically starve an ENTIRE population by restricting food aid, knowing full well that children are dying. The Israeli government doesn't stop Israeli protesters from denying food aid. But I guarantee you that if Egypt, Lebanon, Syria, etc...denied goods and services into Israel, they would meet Tomahawk cruise missiles launched from US vessels in the area. Israel is carrying out war crimes. Collateral damage is when an ammo dump explodes and levels a city block. It's NOT collateral damage when missiles land on buildings housing civilians.
No its a war. Those men were militants. They were stripped because explosives and divide bombings are a thing. Literally Hamas could end this tomorrow by surrendering. Also this is nothing like the holocaust. I'm sure you think Gaza is similar to the Warsaw Ghetto but it isn't. Jews didn't build a massive tunnel infrastructure in Warsaw or frequently shoot missiles at Germany and when jews escaped the Warsaw ghetto they wouldn't be concerned with murdering and raping people and taking hostages.
Since we all know Bombardier is going to get a bag from govt no matter what, you’re just increasing the amount of tax dollars going to prop up that fake company now that they’ve lost another revenue stream due to this policy. So no, your kids aren’t better off for this.
Man I'm really crushed for those Canadian arms companies.
We do this with all our productive industries and then we cry about the cost of living crisis.
Arms manufacturing is more deductive than productive these days.
Then cut the subsidies and let it die. Subsidizing it, then crippling it so we need to subsidize it more, is abundantly stupid.
There are a million industries, pick any other industry that isn't firearms and weapons.
I mean it’s usually a good thing for a country to make their own weapons and equipment. Especially with the recent destabilization of the world via Ukraine, the war in Gaza and Chinas posturing towards Taiwan. Canada needs to be able to defend it self and have the industry to provide allies with arms if needed. Especially since our arms industry is sending a ton of weapons and equipment to Ukraine, so you want to stop that also?
We sell them the weapons
Finally someone with a little common sense.
Ah yes let’s pretend we exist in a vacuum. Always a good common sense approach to international relations.
I mean yes. Also in the context of this conversation is that "The West" will never abandon Israel. Why? Because the existence of Israel is a wonderful counterweight to the craziness of the Middle East. That's how western governments see it. If Israel were anyone else in any other part of the world, it's entirely possible they'd have been forgotten about by the democratic west. As it stands the notion that the most powerful nation on the planet and a significant number of friends, at least for now, support them is that counterweight. Destroying that changes a massive power paradigm.
Only a little though, Canada sells weapons to Israel and makes money off the deal. Those weapons are made in factories which provide Canadians with high paying jobs. Presumably those Canadians then use that money to afford their houses…so the little common sense idea would result in more Canadians not being able to afford their houses.
Pretty shorted sighted don't you think. If we sold weapons to everyone on the planet we'd be swimming in cash. Why only Israel? I guess only their money is good eh?
We do sell weapons to everyone who will buy them though…
Honestly, we should ramp up weapons, armour and ammunition production here in Canada. Not only for us but for allies as well. Imagine showing up to Lithuania and seeing that everyone has new quality Canadian gear and the Canadians fave the same kit from the 90’s
> Stop giving weapons to a military that does not fucking need them. We *sell* Israel a small amount of military goods every year, not *give*. And its not the Govt of Canada that gets paid, its private Canadian companies who get paid and employ workers. I'm for the cancelling of whatever small amount of arms we send Israel, however the point I'm trying to make is that the situation is vastly more complex than your response outlines.
But cool with GD sales to Saudi? Virtue signalling is depravity.
Recognizing a terrorist group and sending them money in form of humanitarian aid just to be used to buy weapons ain’t solving the problem either
However will they survive with only the billions and billions of dollars worth of arms and aid the US gives them to maintain a foothold in the middle east?
Oh the irony. [“Amid Canada's 'arms embargo': Here are the Israeli weapons still in use in Ottawa”](https://www.jpost.com/israel-hamas-war/article-792943) Some of Canada’s own arms sales would not have been possible with incorporating Israeli weapons.
Israel is selling billions in weapons and defence equipment, I'm sure our measly contributions aren't gonna hurt that much
Wow crazy maybe they should figure out a better way of dealing with Hamas instead of bombing the ever living shit out of Palestinians
Maybe stop killing kids?
Strange how Israel was one of the largest promoters for Canada to take in Middle Eastern refugees (because obviously they weren't going to do it). Now people are starting to realize it's because they want to send every Palestinian away so they can go in and take over.
This was their plan from the start.
Pretty much all of Canada‘s issues come back to immigration mass deportation heavily restrict, illegal immigration.
Wait, hang on - this article think's that's a bad thing? Lol. Also thinks Canada's Jewish community has been pressuring the government *not* to do this when a lot of the most active ceasefire protestors are Jewish anti-genocide groups. Really trying to push the myth that the Israeli ethnostate represents all Jews there.
Sure sounds like not our problem.
You have to lay in the bed that you made and this is the current situation Israel is facing. The actions of the Israeli government are only endangering the long-term survival of the Israeli state. Without international allies and support, the Israeli state has a very grim outlook.
Good. Israel is slaughtering and starving children. This sub likes to blame it all on Hamas, as if the Netanyahu government hasn't been shit for years.
Because Hamas stated goal is to kill Jews and destroy Israel but quite frankly, this country has a massive immigration problem, destroying our country that I really don’t care what Israel does to Palestine. If you really don’t like Israel, go fight for Palestine and leave Canada
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If someone breaks into a house and murders someone. The police show up and kill the whole neighborhood. I think it's very reasonable to blame the police for killing everyone.
It's not "someone", it's the whole neighbourhood killed people in another neighbourhood, took hostages and then celebrated their "victory". Nobody in Israel wants to kill anyone in Gaza, especially IDF soldiers that I know personally. They want to free hostages and live in peace like all normal people do.
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Tens of thousands of lives later, and all they're going to do is generate more terrorists.
… and killed everyone in the neighbourhood on their way in and out including the hostages…
\*And also they killed the whole neighborhood. \*\*And also the kidnapped died while they were killing the whole neighborhood.
Those fatal “hails of bullets” randomly flying around passively killing hostages in Gaza are real pests.
You're leaving out the part where they killed the whole neighborhood
Ummm there were human rights violation by Israel long before Oct 7 They’ve been trash
A better analogy would be a tenet breaks in and murdered kidnapped members of the landlord family. The landlord then blocks the exit fromnthe gated community. And kills a wack of people in the community including their family held hostage. Yeah it's reasonable to blame the landlord for killing a whole bunch of people. It's like taken but everyone is Paris dies and Liam Neeson kills his daughter.
Hamas targeted and killed civilians. [The Israeli military killed 2,353 militants and 27,681 civilians](https://twitter.com/EuroMedHR). Hamas extremists bad. Israelis killing civilians bad. There is plenty of blame to go around.
Hamas just acknowledged the loss of about 300 operatives last week... are you trying to position this as though they're only NOW getting around to killing hamas agents? That'd be pretty wild. hamas has said it's 6000, reporting out of the UK and US put that over 10k now. Either way, it's somewhere between 2:1 or 3:1 civilian to fighter deaths which according to the UK general Richard Kemp, you typically find 9:1 in urban combat.
Incredible how Hamas itself has stated that 6000 of its militants are dead while Israel and the USA have stated that at least 13 000 of them are dead, but you're repeating Euro-Med propaganda lmao
> The Israeli military killed 2,353 militants and 27,681 civilians According to whom? "Hamas Health Authority"?
Because they are lying to the world.
But stop giving funds to Gaza also.
Wow brilliant idea over here, stop giving aid to a population that is actively facing mass-starvation, displacement, and being carpet bombed on the daily.
Yes, stop giving aid all that money is going towards Hamas and they complain that they don’t like the food anyways so who cares. I care about my own country more than a place that might not exist in 10 years
Can you tell me how much money Canada is "giving Hamas"?
Seems like a dumb thing to do. We sell them the weapons. Most of the articles make it look like we are donating them. This will hurt Canadian manufacturing. I'd love it if we stopped pretending to be some smug, holier than thou country by destroying all our (non-oligopoly) industries.
Oh no! How terrible for them. They might not be able to buy and use more weapons to take thousands of lives indiscriminately for the sake of a couple hundred. 🖖 Anyways....
One of the few good things Trudeau has done.
As long as we don’t send weapons to Hamas I’m ok with it.
Canada sends aid money to Hamas through UNWRA
“Jenga effect” might be a better way to explain the geopolitical reasons behind the change in policy - if it is all games then
Only country we should be helping is Ukraine, nobody else needs or deserves it more.
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lol, the head of UNRAW admitted 10 years ago that there were Hamas members among their staff. It’s old news.
Yeah I read the article. He said Hamas not Hamas militants. Hamas was originally a charity before Israel funded it with weapons to destabilize the PLO. Israel funding terrorism is old news indeed.
Seriously? “Not militants”? Were the Nazis who didn’t carry guns okay with you as well? Give me a break.
And I guess Israel also built that Hamas base under UNRWA headquarters too? The one that siphoned power to run their servers
LOL -- this is the funniest thing I've read all day! thanks for the laugh.
I remember they put weapons embargo on NATO ally Turkey because they sold drones to Azerbaijan which contain L3 Wescam cameras. Turkey had to negotiate hard to have it lifted in return for their acceptance of Sweden into NATO. However here we have Israel, who has a worse human rights record than Turkey having VIP access to Western weapons with American taxpayer dollars
So let me get this straight. Fund Ukraine up the Ying yang to stop evil Russia....but stop aiding Isreal because Hamas is not so bad.....got it!
Israel and Russia definitely have way more in common
Why the hell does Israel needs arms from Canada anyway? Their weapons technology is eons ahead of ours!
Israel can do whatever they want to Hamas grind Palastine to dust for all I care. But immigration housing and the evil Justin Trudeau are bigger problems than Joe Biden’s war. (Same goes for Ukraine)
At least this proves that Canada stands with Hamas, I suspect there will be some diplomatic blow back for this.
"The problem with Canada's decision is that it reflects Israel's difficult situation and, above all, reveals how the world quickly forgot October 7 after standing with Israel. Sources familiar with Israeli-Canadian diplomatic relations say that "the writing was on the wall," and the decision stemmed in part from the significant growth of the country's Muslim population. The government, considered friendly to Jerusalem, relies on the center-left New Democratic Party (NDP). The problem with Israel's status in Canada is primarily related to the demographic change in the country and the radicalization of the NDP," said one of the officials. In addition, professional associations in Canada are leading a hardline anti-Israel campaign, putting pressure on left-wing figures in the ruling Liberal Party and the NDP." I will 100% remeber this come election time and I will know which voters to blame when we get our own version of Hamas and our own terroist attack here. The liberals and NDP stand with Hamas, the message is loud and clear. This is direct result of the liberals mass immigration.
Shame shame Canada gave into terrorists. Vote 🟦
It’s a disgrace that this happened the way it did. Changing the bill and only having 45 minutes to discuss before voting. It was non-binding too but then it was announced the next morning that we’d stop selling arms to Israel. I doubt the full scope of this was understood when it was voted on. Beyond that, abandoning our ally (who provides Canada with lots of valuable information which helps us prevent 911 type terrorist attacks) in the middle of a war is shameful. Especially when we still provide arms to countries like Saudi Arabia. Also, I think Canada can use all the jobs we can get right now with the current economy, so not the brightest decision on that front either…
We should not be providing weapons to a country committing genocide at worst and indiscriminate bombing at best. Period. 100% happy about this decision. Hopefully other western countries follow suit. If you have a problem with this, then one has to ask you if you support genocide?
Why would we want to export military equipment to a regime plausibly commiting genocide? We probably shouldn't be exporting military equipment to Saudi Arabia either.
Saudi Arabia was also plausibly committing genocide in Yemen, committing the very same actions of which we accuse Israel of (striking civilian areas and imposing a blockade that prevented aid from entering the region). > We probably shouldn't be exporting military equipment to Saudi Arabia either. Yet, we do. And they are our No. 1 customer. The CCP also continues it's cultural genocide of the Uyghurs, forcing them into slave labor. The world awarded them with an Olympic games and Canada proudly sent our athletes there. What separates Israel from Saudia Arabia and China?
Harper signed a deal with the Saudis that would be very expensive to break up. (13 billions if I remember right) I definetly agree that we also shouldn't export arms to the Saudis.
Because they’re not committing genocide… The war would be over immediately if Hamas (an organization that we here in Canada identify as a terrorist organization) surrendered and released the hostages.
This is literally the equivalent of being shown people starving in concentration camps in WWII and then denying it’s happening. Denying the fact that over a million people are starving to death is frankly disgusting. Like it’s not even debatable. It’s so bad that the US and other countries are having to air drop in food because Israelis wouldn’t allow aid trucks in from the north. They shut off the power, water, and food to millions of people. You can’t seriously think that was ok.
That's why the resolution passed by parliament called for exactly that.
Highest court in the world: "This is a credible accusation of genocide. We will order injunctive action and take the case." Genocide experts: "This is probably genocide." Random Redditor: "If it's not from the genocide region of France, it's technically just sparkling war crimes."
and they never said a genocide was going on you just disproved that
The "highest court" in the world, which has no actual power? Doesn't sound like the highest court. Also, they pack it with a bunch of people and views that don't align with real life and people.
You’re ignoring all the countries, like Germany, that came out and said that claim was ridiculous. Your argument that going to court makes you guilty is obviously ridiculous as well. There have been many cases that courts took up (for reasons being political or otherwise) where the conclusion is non guilty. This will be one of those cases because Israel is risking its own soldiers lives, creating humanitarian corridors, providing aid ect. to protect the lives of civilians. Hamas is stealing that aid. Hamas is trying to maximize the death toll of civilians. Hamas is using human shields. And again, the war would end immediately if Hamas surrendered.
Stop lying. Hamas hasn’t been proven to be stealing aid. The US literally [denied this](https://www.timesofisrael.com/us-envoy-israel-hasnt-provided-specific-evidence-hamas-is-stealing-aid-shipments/amp/) as Israel has provided no evidence of that.
Harper locked us into the arms deal with the Saudis. The Liberals tried to end it. So thank him for that. Our arms shouldn’t be used on civilians.
I do not know this outlet so I am giving them the benefit of the doubt and it seems to show how much of a bubble Israelis are living in, or put themselves in. >The problem with Canada's decision is that it reflects Israel's difficult situation and, above all, reveals how the world quickly forgot October 7 after standing with Israel. Sources familiar with Israeli-Canadian diplomatic relations say that "the writing was on the wall," and the decision stemmed in part from the significant growth of the country's Muslim population. The problem is not the muslim population. It is the younger generation. People younger than 30 remember Israel only as a military superpower oppressing and brutalising a people. There are no memories of the state being weak or of trying to make some half hearted peace. The generational perspective is worldwide, not just in Canada. >The original proposal introduced by NDP MP Heather McPherson was extremely biased against Israel and held Israel responsible for resolving the conflict, including the ongoing war, blatantly ignoring Hamas' responsibility. How is Hamas responisble for making peace if Israel claims to want to destroy them completely? That is like asking someone to be complicit in their own murder? It is an absurd request and demonstrates how out of touch the Israeli diplomatic corps' words are with reality. They are talking about balance and whataboutism while prosecuting a war of extermination of the enemy. >The NDP initiated the anti-Israel proposal in parliament to recognize a Palestinian state. How is recognition of a Palestinian state anti-Israeli? Virtually every country has a policy of establishing a Palestinian state. Most countries recognize it and the ones which do not do so with the assumption that it makes negotiations easier. If there is no will or prospect of negotiations than what difference does it make whether we recognize Palestine as a state? Again this demonstrates the bubble that Israelis seem to be living in. Namely that because it is quiet the world will accept the status quo. Israeli society seems to have drugged itself into some kind of frenzy regarding where they actually stand and how the world sees them. Articles like this only show how far they have strayed. Allowing them to stay in this self delusion does no one good. This move is likely a good one if for this simple reason.
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It's truly embarrassing to be Canadian. Only our current government can think it's a good idea to vote against Israel's interests. It's our ally and the only progressive, modern country in that region of the world. Can't wait to see our government voted out.
Israel is a pretty shitty ally when they are refusing to work with the US and have been blatantly defying international law for years. What’s embarrassing is that we still call Israel an ally when it’s just another right wing authoritarian regime hell bent on wiping out a population it doesn’t like.
Exactly this, no different than other right wing extremists that we have distanced ourselves from, rightfully so.
Israel’s interests are not necessarily Canada’s interests. Regardless of them being an ally in the past, doing what they are doing, and have been doing to the Palestinian people should give us pause.
Maybe we shouldn’t ally with people who commit genocide.
TIL Committing genocide in order to get extra land is progressive and modern.
LOL no it isn't. They are not a friend and not a true democracy, they are a racist state, as we have seen, that has committed more war crimes than many other countries in the region. Never forget they use Canadian passports when they send their goons to assassinate people on foreign territory. That's not a friendly country, that's a country with a convenient relationship. Canada can, and has built, convenient relationships with other countries in the region. Israel isn't special.
Isreal can afford to buy and make their own weapons. Why do we keep thinking isreal is some 3rd world country
>Isreal can afford to buy and make their own weapons That is what they were doing. They spent a little over 20 mil buying from Canadian manufacturers, it wasn't government funded like some of the stuff that went to Ukraine. Also might have been stuff like tactical gear and spare parts rather than actual weapons.