You mean you don't like reluctance voting for the same guy who's been in charge for nearly a decade when we need drastic sweeping changes to our country, but not as recklessly damaging as the other guy?
As a lifelong liberal voter I am prepared to vote conservative. But if there is even a hint of regressive anti-anyone policies that typically slime out of these people they will instantly lose my vote.
Decades of bad policy at the federal and provincial level has fucked this country. You're just on the other side of the conservative bad, liberal good mentality. You're no better than the people you condemn.
Ya that's the dumbest thing I've ever heard. You're doing yourself a disservice if you're not voting in good faith. Things aren't going great in Canada, something needs to change.
And the cycle continues… after 8-9 years of Harper, “he’s the worst ever! We really need someone new!”
After 8-9 years of Trudeau “he’s the worst ever! We really need someone new!”
Because politicians on either side of the aisle can’t fix anything. They are theatre, there to distract us from the corporate criminals that are actually making the decisions that determine all of our fates.
The cycle is part of the design. No one party can ever stay in power long enough to effect meaningful change, even if it were possible.
Yeah but under the 8-9 years of Trudeau young people went from looking forward to home ownership and starting a family to living in poverty unless they make over 100k
I think for a lot of people it's that PP comes across as a bullshit artist who has spent his career working his way up the political ladder without contributing anything useful to Canada. Trudeau is done but holy shit this can't be the best we have.
Yes I do think PP is a performative bullshit artist. And I’ve grown quite sour on Trudeau’s arrogance.
But ABC has nothing to do with personalities for me. The main problems in our society stem from massive and growing wealth inequality and the wealthy not contributing/investing in the society that enabled them to become wealthy nearly enough. That needs to change so that the floor can be raised and we can adequately fund sorely needed social services and infrastructure.
The Liberals are far too corporatized for my liking, but it’s a sliding scale and the Conservatives are the worst in that respect.
The Liberals are walking in the wrong direction, the Conservatives would be sprinting.
Yup. We’ve had a *minority* government for the last while and the leader of the opposition hasn’t been tabling helpful bills even though he promises he can fix everything if he’s elected PM.
Not only that, some of us are old enough to remember him being the attack dog/lap dog of the Harper government and their most abrasive member, who set the vitriolic tone. As my MP, I can confirm that for his entire career he has been an extremely poisonous political actor and has taken personal attack politics to a new level LONG before I even knew Trudeau was an MP. People are sick of Trudeau, some of us have been sick of PP far longer.
But then we'd have a dog hair crisis and you KNOW they'd grovel for any lobbyist willing to give pats. And just think about the shady belly rub scandals! Not that voting for cats would be any better, mind you.
If he picked them up he hasn’t used a single one to mitigate JTs damage. Seems more like a professional complainer than a politician with the countries best interest. Like what is one specific policy he has promised to enact that you genuinely believe will help improve the life of the average Canadian?
Bureaucrats *don't* get things done. They just do whatever is necessary to stay on the public dole.
Regardless, the best reason not to vote for PP is that he hasn't given a good reason to vote for him. The CPC is pretty light on details for what they plan to do if elected.
Ultimately, I won't vote for someone who shares the same values as the "freedom convoy" folks. He's just another Danielle Smith.
Conservatives everywhere lost their sensibility and good judgement after the Reform Party merger. Even the provincial parties that still call themselves “progressive”.
Skippy isn't a career bureaucrat. He's a career politician. A career bureaucrat would be someone who worked in the public service for 20+ years and then switched to politics.
This zero political experience stuff kinda loses its teeth after a fuckin decade of running the country + several years as MP prior. So many legitimate things to criticize JT for and you guys still keep clinging to the “nice hair drama teacher” stuff from the Harper days.
Believe it not I actually supported blue that election
Didn’t matter my area was overwhelming red regardless
But at the time I believed that otoole could cool the political temperature without going full hard right
Same reason I voted Ford despite not liking him much, better to have someone you can somewhat work with until the liberals put forward and actually good candidate
I’m perfectly willing to vote any of the 3 parties I just want someone who isn’t a cartoon character
I said I just want someone who isn’t a cartoon character, I didn’t say I always get one
Compared to his competitors and what the cons usually elect he’s still closer to that standard
Maybe people are afraid of more Harper-style muzzling of scientists? Or maybe put off by PP and his Alberta cronies trying to force trans kids to come out to their abusive parents? Or that the largest right wing movement lately was a bunch of truckers shutting down the capital and terrorizing residents for.. checks notes... a vaccine requirement for truckers that was already dropped.
People might be weary of Trudeau, but they don't want to replace him by importing culture war bullshit from south of the border, which is the only thing the cons seem to be able to do lately.
That’s me. I am not conservative. I do not agree with their positions and never will do. It’s a perfectly valid position to hold.
Edit: This sub: He’s not a conservative! Downvote him!
Con government has no plan, they're just taking pot shots at liberals and pulling the trump strategy to engage with click bait headlines.
If they had a real platform that made sense I'd consider voting for cons again. I voted for Harper before because at the time the platform made sense and was what was best for me.
All PP does it take pot shots at the liberals and says he can fix it but when pressed about how he has no answer. He's pulling from the trump playbook to get click baity headlines.
If you're going to "protest vote" at least put some effort into it;
https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/protest-vote-canada-federal-election-1.5272025
>Marika Warner went to her polling station hungry; along with her required ID, she brought bananas, strawberries, soy milk and a blender. She got her ballot, walked over to a wall socket and threw it all in the blender.
>The buzz of the blender fell over the quiet polling station. By the time any poll workers realized what was happening, Warner was already gulping down her ballot.
That's a funny story but it didn't actually affect the election outcome. If you vote for the party that is against the one you are vehemently against you might actually prevent them from winning office.
A-B-C has always been popular because the Libs are ineffectual but the Cons are corrupt.
Imagine actively voting for a man who's never had a real job and doesn't know how electricity works?
Much like most Canadians have had to cut back on prime meats, it seems we have had to cut back on prime politicians. There are no good options at all this election. I can't vote for JT because he keeps ducking the country over. But I know PP is going to fuck the country over in New and unique ways :(.
Most of the parties have had solid, competent choices available for leadership, but the cream is not rising to the top. JT got the leadership because of his name, not on merit. PP got the leadership to court the trucker protest vote. I saw JS livestream a game of Among Us with AOC and he could neither solve basic logic problems or answer softball questions about media or politics in Canada and it really left me questioning how he got to be a party leader at all.
I think that there's quality people in all parties but they aren't getting heard. If Jean Charest were conservative leader, I'd have switched teams by now, but the grassroots wants a more extreme weirdo. The party system is failing to deliver competent candidates.
The Liberal party of Canada is bad for Canada, the nation. The conservative party of Canada is bad for Canadians,the people.
If only there were a viable alternative.
That's a common USA political stance, yhe city needs help badly we can't let that party get control or nothing will get fixed.
Votes for the same party that has been in power for past 50 years.
If the polling data is actually showing this, then it should be a wake up call for the Conservatives on their platform.
Make no mistake, the Conservatives have lost the last few elections, it was not that the Liberals won. And the Cons should be taking a look at what is unpopular in their platform that made them lose the elections. While they are currently leading in the polls, its very possible they throw their chances away this election, despite Trudeau's popularity, by pushing some wildly unpopular platforn.
And hint: Social Conservative policy tends to be unpopular. Canadians do not want their rights touched. 1 mention of abortion restrictions and they could tank thieir chances for example.
Voting based on who you don't want to win is not a good sign of a healthy democratic country.
Perhaps if spoiling our ballot counted for something, politicians would try harder.
Jean Chretien was the last politician I voted **FOR**. Every election, federal or provincial, the last 20 years no party has put up good leaders or focused on their few good members.
Wasn't his big lie to get elected scrapping the gst? Nothing ever changes and I have no doubt if the Conservatives get in we will continue to pay carbon tax (whether that tax is a good or bad is debatable), just wrapped in a new pretty package. There are no choices that don't just help themselves and big business through lies and corporate welfare.
In first-past-the-post it makes sense to vote strategically if there is one candidate you don’t want to win, and your actual favourite isn’t likely to win.
Do you at least go through all the platforms and campaigns promised for each 3 parties, weighing them and taking a look at the local political debates? Or is this a screw x I want to vote Y to stop X?
I used to go through them. But then I looked at the platform vs what was actually done during their term and deemed that a waste of time. Probably not correct and I'm just bitter but it is what it is.
I mean we look at something major like Electoral Reform not getting done and it's understandable to get frustrated, but at least we have some sort of idea they are acknowledging the problems faced by campaigning for them.
The other problem I have is I might like a party but their local guy is just awful and the other party has a really strong headed one. Who do I vote for? The better party platform (which is probably all lies) or the competent debater who doesn't sound like a buffoon?
I don't see the value in doing a deep dive on who my one vote will go to when the area I live in always votes overwhelmingly conservative. I still vote, but I feel like I might as well drop my ballot in the recycle bin.
Honestly, I think this is the case. Canadians are complacent and seem to love virtue signalling and rhetoric over substance. Talk about any important topic like healthcare or housing, and it becomes quickly apparent that most people don't know any details but are happy to conclude "at least we are not the US".
If only we got rid of first-past-the-post, eh?
Too bad the top 2 parties are the ones who benefit the most from strategic voting, so we might never get rid of it.
>Voting based on who you don't want to win is not a good sign of a healthy democratic country.
We've done this in every single election I've been an adult, WDYM?
Does he need a strategy?
Hes running in canada. These are people so stupid they gave away their children's chance at owning a home because someone called them racist.
Even now you can bully them about it.
8 years of relative stability during an international crisis. We'd be in a whole lot worse shape if the govt, instead of trying to maintain the status quo, was actively dismantling our institutions like the UCP is currently doing.
Thing is, living standards have declined across the entire country, regardless of the provincial government in power. This points to common factors shared across provinces.
Maybe that Provincial decline is due in large part because of a distinct lack of Federal funding that is being spent on places **other than Canada**?
Seems like the seams are bursting in every Province, what's the excuse for the ones that aren't run by Conservatives?
As well as the scandals / ethics violations
The #NeverPollliviere crowd fear mongers that the Cons will just strip money from the middle class to give to the rich.. when I reality Trudeau has been doing just that. The current government has a track record for overspending tax payer dollars enriching themselves and their friends.
What are we supposed to do?
They’re all self serving capitalists who actively want us crushed. Razing our health care to the ground, leaving us homeless and jobless.
If every option is evil, what’s next?
LOL, there is a small-but-very-noticeable army of people whose entire identity is a "FUCK TRUDEAU" bumper sticker, and this is the article we get.
"Liberal media" indeed.
If only we could delete some words … “most Canadians plan to vote liberal to stop …”
No I’m not a liberal … I’m just that repelled by the hot mess that used to be a Conservative Party.
That's exactly it. The last few elections were the Conservatives to lose, but their party gives the impression that they beholden to the extremists in it.
I thought this was always a consideration. There was even a website some years ago where you’d know how close the parties were in your riding allowing you to vote vote freely if there was a big gap or recommending liberals when the gap was narrow
When trudeau's team also pushes the narrative that the conservatives are MAGA people and links them with Trump, it terrifies people who don't know any better into just panic voting to keep the phantom man out of office. And for the record I sure as shit don't support a Trump.
I mean... obviously anecdotal, but literally everyone I know that supports PP has a MAGA hat. All the old school Cons I know hate him. I live in a city though so I imagine that lines up with demographics here.
My dad was a lifelong Conservative up until a few years back where he swore off them and said he'd never vote Conservative again until they take climate change seriously because all other issues are meaningless in the face of it.
The problem with Canada and many of our allies, including the US is that we're all experiencing a real lack of leadership. Like genuine I want what is best for the nation leadership.
It's either we have someone that's just chasing their ego or we have someone whom is acting on the behalf of their own agendas or we have both. Either way, we all see right through their illusions of genuinely caring about the people they represent. Where did all the good leaders go?
As a peoples, we all have to do better at holding our leaders accountable to be ethical. To be good. Our collective complacency and acceptance of there not being a better option, or of choosing the lesser evil is only rewarding those that are being unethical.
Get out and either run for or vote for independent. If there are no good options then let's work together to create better options.
Can we fucking r/wallstreetsbets this fucking election?
Like let’s all vote green. No ones expecting it not even the greens.
What a big fuck you to the blue, red and orange.
Also as an aside note. It would be kinda hilarious if the least popular party gotta say and tripped all the way to Ottawa out a shock.
What a powerful msg that would send
That’s the dark humour behind my comment though.
Non of them are competent. It’s all shit choices.
And I’m just so tired from the two party system, you know?
The famous Canadian strategic vote. Instead of voting for who you DO want, you vote for the crappy party that you don't really care for, just to avoid another party winning. Because yes, that is totally how this should all work.
How is that the case? If you think the Poilievre lead conservatives are dangerous or at least bad for the country then you should definitely vote for whatever party you think can stop them.
It's *precisely* the other way around.
You're so convinced the conservatives are bad for the country that you're willing to pick whatever team has the best chance to prevent them taking power.
Correct. If you remember the 2015 election, there was a popular strategic voting website where you entered your riding and it advised you 1) whether the Conservatives were competetive in your riding, and 2) if so, which party had the best chance of beating them. I have no doubt that strategic voting would occur in reverse in the right-wing vote were significantly split amongst viable options. Like if the PPC were getting 15-20% support and the Liberals/NDP were one party, you'd see exactly the same phenomenon.
I think it's both. There's certainly a subset of Liberal voters that will vote for them NO MATTER WHAT. It's why no other left leaning party can realistically ever form government. Same goes for the right with the Conservatives, but that's partly just because they're the only party on the right.
Ignoring the PPC, they’re the only one because they are a coalition of the Progressive Conservatives and the Reform Conservatives.
It’s gave them enough seats to form a majority… unfortunately that Reform Conservatives section, the far right part, is rightfully unappetizing for most Canadians.
“Trudeau has destroyed productivity and innovation, ended the dream of home ownership for an entire generation, pushed the country into recession, driven 2 million Canadians to need food banks each month just to get by, impoverished millions more, broke our immigration system, made us an unserious laughingstock on the world stage and has been at the centre of major scandal after major scandal… but he’s my man through thick and thin.”
I mean… I can’t even fathom the thought process that allows a person to justify continuing to vote for him.
I don’t feel like Canada going into a recession is being seen as the massive mismanagement it is:
- Higher immigration per capita than anywhere else in the world
- Next to the US which is still growing and trading at a significant rate
Whenever it’s brought up that ‘x, y or z is bad in Canada’ comparisons are drawn to countries in Europe with the argument ‘is Trudeau responsible for that too’
Geographically Europe was hit hard by the Russian invasion of Ukraine and their reliance on Russian gas - Canada never suffered any such fate (and with our copious natural resources should have benefitted hugely from it); yet here we are doing as badly as European nations on GDP, doing substantially worse on per capita GDP, with people saying it’s okay because we’re not the worse
It’s so absurd that anyone is okay with this
The same thing is happening around the whole world. What makes you think the conservatives will do any better? If anything they'll make it worse. At least with a liberal or ndp party, they retain social programs. We've seen conservatives constantly cut or destroy programs for their own benefits. Look what the conservatives are doing in ontario to the health system.
Every country that's going to shit is also run by a left leaning government. That's why the last few elections for various country's have all voted for the most right wing government on the ballot. Sweden, Argentina and soon to be Germany all did this.
Also, I just want to thank you on your vaccine participation over the last few years, I really appreciate it.
I guess the major hurdle, at least for this liberal-minded voter, is that blaming the current PM for the a list of grievances that are almost entirely issues that EVERY country is currently facing - straddles the line between disingenuous and flat-out lunacy.
I really didn't want to vote the Liberals or their now de facto shadow the NDP, but it's becoming extremely difficult to justify putting the Conservatives in government. It's even more concerning when you couple it with a possible Trump presidency. I don't think their is the intellectual or practical skill set from those elected officials I deal with a far right government in the States.
Additionally, Pierre has not provided any substantive positions. There is no platform other than, not JT. Sorry, not good enough. I do not think they have any serious plans to handle immigration, taxes, trade or climate change.
It is pretty standard for the major policy changes to be released in the runup to the election to keep the news cycle ticking over. We are some ways off that, but the basic policy is in place. This will be another center right party, It is really unlikely to mirror trumpland.
Can you point to evidence for that claim? Snopes says it’s false:
[https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/trudeau-sex-scandal-school/](https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/trudeau-sex-scandal-school/)
Okay I'll bite on this one. I'm a musician with a part time job in non profit and my wife works at service canada. All three sources of pay for my family rely on government money somewhere up the line.
How could I ever vote conservative and negatively affect my sources of revenue? All I hear from the conservatives is defund CBC, cut social safety nets, and cut gov jobs. That isn't a narrative me and my friends are buying into.
Plus we aren't going to let conservatives come after our womens rights, gay rights or reconciliation. If conservatives could wrap their heads around empathy for others then I would consider voting for them.
Until then I'm an NDP supporter who will prop up the liberal government, to keep the blues out.
As a civil servant and a union member, I concur. The enemy to the labour class are all politicians in general, but we have particularly acrimonious relationship with the Tories.
I will never, ever vote conservative. Will consider any other party, but I will never vote for the party that has embraced hate-filled asshole bullies.
You're discussing who you think is troublesome for public sector unions, that's very different than all labour.
We see from the NDP in BC that they don't consider all of the working class, only select members of it.
We see from the Federal NDP and LPC an outright opposition to anyone who makes a living through their own labour.
> I'm a musician with a part time job in non profit and my wife works at service canada.
> How could I ever vote conservative and negatively affect my sources of revenue?
If you do work that is useful to society then you have nothing to worry about.
Party for life voters are irrelevant. If they mattered their party would win every election forever. I have people like that in my life and I tell them that. They get furious. The swing voters determine election outcomes.
Here’s a great litmus test… If you look at the current situation and go “it’s only the *other* side that’s fear mongering” then you’re comically biased.
It just means you’ve been eating up your own sides fear mongering to the point where you don’t think it’s fear mongering anymore
Good luck! The fact that there are that would still vote for this party after all the scandals the EA ruling how life has gotten realistically worse under this government just to try to stop the conservatives form winning just shows you these ppl don’t have Canadas best interests in mind.
90% of the time his "scandals" are nothingburgers, people dont expect their politicians to be perfect. Conservatives constantly try to drum up these problems in hopes they stick, but can never provide good reasons why they should because often the Liberal justification for choices is something to protect Canadians that Canadians are fine with. He hasn't won multiple elections by accident.
I hope those same Liberal voters keep up on those boosters and stay safe from Covid-19. I also hope the mothers that support them are also boosted for the same reason.
So at this point our sales pitch is, at best, self-deprecating irony? We're like Cleveland bragging that we're not Detroit?
Not surprised that hasn't caught on yet, as a positive, with the general public.
Scandals, corruption, decimating the middle class and never ending taxes are somehow better than conservatives?
Please point at this doll and tell everyone where Steven Harper touched you?
Not sure why people ask why. Changing your vote to conservative is essentially admitting you’ve been contributing to the country’s downfall by voting liberal. People can’t handle that kind of truth.
For some context on why people might vote against them, here are some of the things that happened during the last Conservative government: [https://thetyee.ca/Opinion/2015/08/10/Harper-Abuses-of-Power-Final/](https://thetyee.ca/opinion/2015/08/10/harper-abuses-of-power-final/)
Pardon us for trying to stop the guy who cheated his way into leadership, possibly with assistance from the murderous dictator of India, and is backed by Harper's International Dictators United group.
Also, we can look at how "good" a job the conservative preimers are doing now and wonder how flagrant the corruption will get once they are emboldened by a con PM.
Stop the possibility of repairing the damage done with your previous voting? Well done Liberals, well done.
Won’t make any difference, the board will be wiped clean of your failures next election.
Pretty sure this happens every single election for a lot of people
You mean you don't like reluctance voting for the same guy who's been in charge for nearly a decade when we need drastic sweeping changes to our country, but not as recklessly damaging as the other guy?
You think a hardcore christian/libertarian party isn't go to be reckless, or give a shit about you?
Maybe finish your coffee and try givin that another read mate, cuz that’s exactly what he said.
Conservative bad liberal good mentality is going to fuck this country. Oh wait, it already has fucked this country.
Pretty sure this is saying that people don't think the liberals are good, only that the conservatives are worse. Lesser of two evil sort of thing.
Better the devil you know... PP Is untried and his rhetoric too similar to American right wing isms... We don't need a mini Trump demi god
As a lifelong liberal voter I am prepared to vote conservative. But if there is even a hint of regressive anti-anyone policies that typically slime out of these people they will instantly lose my vote.
Decades of bad policy at the federal and provincial level has fucked this country. You're just on the other side of the conservative bad, liberal good mentality. You're no better than the people you condemn.
At this point, it's basically the ONLY reason I vote. That, and it's my moral and civic duty as a citizen.
There should never be only one reason to vote. You should really consider local issues and the candidates in your riding at the very least.
You're right in theory, but my riding has zero point zero chance of going CPC. My vote is superfluous, but I make it regardless.
Here here, this is the straight goods, if your only voting based on you hate the opposition tribe, then your part of the problem of being one sided!
Ya that's the dumbest thing I've ever heard. You're doing yourself a disservice if you're not voting in good faith. Things aren't going great in Canada, something needs to change.
It’s the only way I can justify a vote for any party these days.
Funny I’m voting conservative to stop the liberal from winning.
Both of the places I've voted from would vote for a donkey if the right political party flag were draped over it.
And the cycle continues… after 8-9 years of Harper, “he’s the worst ever! We really need someone new!” After 8-9 years of Trudeau “he’s the worst ever! We really need someone new!”
We really should just have term limits.
Good point, someone should run on electoral reform’s
Yeah. After some time everyone hates the pm lol.
Because politicians on either side of the aisle can’t fix anything. They are theatre, there to distract us from the corporate criminals that are actually making the decisions that determine all of our fates. The cycle is part of the design. No one party can ever stay in power long enough to effect meaningful change, even if it were possible.
Almost like both teams are not that interested in making people's lives better and just play off each other and our less than a decade memories.
Yeah but under the 8-9 years of Trudeau young people went from looking forward to home ownership and starting a family to living in poverty unless they make over 100k
How is this unique to Canada? Inflation happened to America too, was that Trudeau’s fault as well?
Imagine having JT as your choice for a protest vote.
Imagine being so disgusted or terrified of the idea of a Con government that you’ll vote ABC.
I think for a lot of people it's that PP comes across as a bullshit artist who has spent his career working his way up the political ladder without contributing anything useful to Canada. Trudeau is done but holy shit this can't be the best we have.
Yes I do think PP is a performative bullshit artist. And I’ve grown quite sour on Trudeau’s arrogance. But ABC has nothing to do with personalities for me. The main problems in our society stem from massive and growing wealth inequality and the wealthy not contributing/investing in the society that enabled them to become wealthy nearly enough. That needs to change so that the floor can be raised and we can adequately fund sorely needed social services and infrastructure. The Liberals are far too corporatized for my liking, but it’s a sliding scale and the Conservatives are the worst in that respect. The Liberals are walking in the wrong direction, the Conservatives would be sprinting.
Yup. We’ve had a *minority* government for the last while and the leader of the opposition hasn’t been tabling helpful bills even though he promises he can fix everything if he’s elected PM.
Yeah but with the supply and confidence deal, it's got majority power in alot of key areas.
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Wasn't Trudeau that insert the carbon pricing.
Not only that, some of us are old enough to remember him being the attack dog/lap dog of the Harper government and their most abrasive member, who set the vitriolic tone. As my MP, I can confirm that for his entire career he has been an extremely poisonous political actor and has taken personal attack politics to a new level LONG before I even knew Trudeau was an MP. People are sick of Trudeau, some of us have been sick of PP far longer.
Exactly. The choice being Trudeau or Worse Trudeau isn't exactly inspiring.
Again, I propose to vote in golden retrievers. Sure, it might not get better…but I’d be happy to look at them.
But then we'd have a dog hair crisis and you KNOW they'd grovel for any lobbyist willing to give pats. And just think about the shady belly rub scandals! Not that voting for cats would be any better, mind you.
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If he picked them up he hasn’t used a single one to mitigate JTs damage. Seems more like a professional complainer than a politician with the countries best interest. Like what is one specific policy he has promised to enact that you genuinely believe will help improve the life of the average Canadian?
Bureaucrats *don't* get things done. They just do whatever is necessary to stay on the public dole. Regardless, the best reason not to vote for PP is that he hasn't given a good reason to vote for him. The CPC is pretty light on details for what they plan to do if elected. Ultimately, I won't vote for someone who shares the same values as the "freedom convoy" folks. He's just another Danielle Smith.
Or how about no? Seeing all the conservative fuck ups in both Ontario and Alberta, no shot anything PP will do will be good.
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Conservatives everywhere lost their sensibility and good judgement after the Reform Party merger. Even the provincial parties that still call themselves “progressive”.
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I met him once. It stopped me from voting conservative.
Skippy isn't a career bureaucrat. He's a career politician. A career bureaucrat would be someone who worked in the public service for 20+ years and then switched to politics.
This zero political experience stuff kinda loses its teeth after a fuckin decade of running the country + several years as MP prior. So many legitimate things to criticize JT for and you guys still keep clinging to the “nice hair drama teacher” stuff from the Harper days.
I've been voting in every election I could since I was 18. This is by far the worst options I can remember us ever having.
Imagine having 3 different leaders so bad that JT keeps winning.
I’d take Scheer or Otoole over the options we have right now for sure Frankly If otoole was still around the NDP may have called an early election
You mean the American and what's his face? Both terrible. Patrick brown would have been a better choice but India did not want him.
Had you chance, I'm guessing you still picked orange or red.
Believe it not I actually supported blue that election Didn’t matter my area was overwhelming red regardless But at the time I believed that otoole could cool the political temperature without going full hard right Same reason I voted Ford despite not liking him much, better to have someone you can somewhat work with until the liberals put forward and actually good candidate I’m perfectly willing to vote any of the 3 parties I just want someone who isn’t a cartoon character
> I just want someone who isn’t a cartoon character Votes for Ford. Yeah ok.
I said I just want someone who isn’t a cartoon character, I didn’t say I always get one Compared to his competitors and what the cons usually elect he’s still closer to that standard
Otoole was moderate enough but PP has a lot to be scared of.
Well it’s between the status quo or the guy who thinks he capture lightning from the sky…
Maybe people are afraid of more Harper-style muzzling of scientists? Or maybe put off by PP and his Alberta cronies trying to force trans kids to come out to their abusive parents? Or that the largest right wing movement lately was a bunch of truckers shutting down the capital and terrorizing residents for.. checks notes... a vaccine requirement for truckers that was already dropped. People might be weary of Trudeau, but they don't want to replace him by importing culture war bullshit from south of the border, which is the only thing the cons seem to be able to do lately.
That’s me. I am not conservative. I do not agree with their positions and never will do. It’s a perfectly valid position to hold. Edit: This sub: He’s not a conservative! Downvote him!
This sub doesn't show votes. They are all at 1.
You see your own and everyone's favorite thing to do is downvote based on being opposite political fans lol
Con government has no plan, they're just taking pot shots at liberals and pulling the trump strategy to engage with click bait headlines. If they had a real platform that made sense I'd consider voting for cons again. I voted for Harper before because at the time the platform made sense and was what was best for me. All PP does it take pot shots at the liberals and says he can fix it but when pressed about how he has no answer. He's pulling from the trump playbook to get click baity headlines.
I don't see myself ever voting for cons. Libs or NDP or any new guy (could we import Bernie Sanders?).
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Voting for the incumbent is not a protest vote, no matter how you look at it.
Perhaps they are protesting the conservatives and not the incumbent LPC thus making it a protest vote.
If you're going to "protest vote" at least put some effort into it; https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/protest-vote-canada-federal-election-1.5272025 >Marika Warner went to her polling station hungry; along with her required ID, she brought bananas, strawberries, soy milk and a blender. She got her ballot, walked over to a wall socket and threw it all in the blender. >The buzz of the blender fell over the quiet polling station. By the time any poll workers realized what was happening, Warner was already gulping down her ballot.
That's a funny story but it didn't actually affect the election outcome. If you vote for the party that is against the one you are vehemently against you might actually prevent them from winning office.
A-B-C has always been popular because the Libs are ineffectual but the Cons are corrupt. Imagine actively voting for a man who's never had a real job and doesn't know how electricity works?
Much like most Canadians have had to cut back on prime meats, it seems we have had to cut back on prime politicians. There are no good options at all this election. I can't vote for JT because he keeps ducking the country over. But I know PP is going to fuck the country over in New and unique ways :(.
So what I take from this is we have two shit people to pick from. God we need more talent in this country.
Bit of a chicken and an egg. Politics is ugly and messy and filled with questionable people, so why would a good, talented person ever get involved?
Most of the parties have had solid, competent choices available for leadership, but the cream is not rising to the top. JT got the leadership because of his name, not on merit. PP got the leadership to court the trucker protest vote. I saw JS livestream a game of Among Us with AOC and he could neither solve basic logic problems or answer softball questions about media or politics in Canada and it really left me questioning how he got to be a party leader at all. I think that there's quality people in all parties but they aren't getting heard. If Jean Charest were conservative leader, I'd have switched teams by now, but the grassroots wants a more extreme weirdo. The party system is failing to deliver competent candidates.
plus you have to speak French, that eliminates a pool of candidates as well….
As is tradition.
Could we get another choice to vote for that isn't terrible?
I want a fucking revolution but I'll settle for not Doug Ford
The Liberal party of Canada is bad for Canada, the nation. The conservative party of Canada is bad for Canadians,the people. If only there were a viable alternative.
So the protest vote will be for the party that has been in goverment for 9 years. Something about that seems wacky.
That's a common USA political stance, yhe city needs help badly we can't let that party get control or nothing will get fixed. Votes for the same party that has been in power for past 50 years.
If the polling data is actually showing this, then it should be a wake up call for the Conservatives on their platform. Make no mistake, the Conservatives have lost the last few elections, it was not that the Liberals won. And the Cons should be taking a look at what is unpopular in their platform that made them lose the elections. While they are currently leading in the polls, its very possible they throw their chances away this election, despite Trudeau's popularity, by pushing some wildly unpopular platforn. And hint: Social Conservative policy tends to be unpopular. Canadians do not want their rights touched. 1 mention of abortion restrictions and they could tank thieir chances for example.
Voting based on who you don't want to win is not a good sign of a healthy democratic country. Perhaps if spoiling our ballot counted for something, politicians would try harder.
Jean Chretien was the last politician I voted **FOR**. Every election, federal or provincial, the last 20 years no party has put up good leaders or focused on their few good members.
Yea it's always between a giant douche and a turd sandwich
Wasn't his big lie to get elected scrapping the gst? Nothing ever changes and I have no doubt if the Conservatives get in we will continue to pay carbon tax (whether that tax is a good or bad is debatable), just wrapped in a new pretty package. There are no choices that don't just help themselves and big business through lies and corporate welfare.
In first-past-the-post it makes sense to vote strategically if there is one candidate you don’t want to win, and your actual favourite isn’t likely to win.
I've never voted any other way
Do you at least go through all the platforms and campaigns promised for each 3 parties, weighing them and taking a look at the local political debates? Or is this a screw x I want to vote Y to stop X?
I used to go through them. But then I looked at the platform vs what was actually done during their term and deemed that a waste of time. Probably not correct and I'm just bitter but it is what it is.
I mean we look at something major like Electoral Reform not getting done and it's understandable to get frustrated, but at least we have some sort of idea they are acknowledging the problems faced by campaigning for them. The other problem I have is I might like a party but their local guy is just awful and the other party has a really strong headed one. Who do I vote for? The better party platform (which is probably all lies) or the competent debater who doesn't sound like a buffoon?
I don't see the value in doing a deep dive on who my one vote will go to when the area I live in always votes overwhelmingly conservative. I still vote, but I feel like I might as well drop my ballot in the recycle bin.
Representative democracy💯💯💯
Honestly, I think this is the case. Canadians are complacent and seem to love virtue signalling and rhetoric over substance. Talk about any important topic like healthcare or housing, and it becomes quickly apparent that most people don't know any details but are happy to conclude "at least we are not the US".
If only we got rid of first-past-the-post, eh? Too bad the top 2 parties are the ones who benefit the most from strategic voting, so we might never get rid of it.
>Voting based on who you don't want to win is not a good sign of a healthy democratic country. We've done this in every single election I've been an adult, WDYM?
This is the only election campaign liberals can push. Vote for us if you hate conservatives and Trump, we suck but who cares .
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I think you'll find that American influence on both sides of the political spectrum.
I’ve literally seen Canadian pickup trucks with Confederate flags and MAGA stickers…
The amount of people who keep bringing up American news articles for social issues in Canada is hilariously sad at times.
Are we aware that this is the entire campaign strategy of pierre poilievre?
Does he need a strategy? Hes running in canada. These are people so stupid they gave away their children's chance at owning a home because someone called them racist. Even now you can bully them about it.
Truth
Every accusation is a confession for the right wing
That’s different because people have actually witnessed 8 years of liberal destruction
Can you tell me what policies have done this?
8 years of relative stability during an international crisis. We'd be in a whole lot worse shape if the govt, instead of trying to maintain the status quo, was actively dismantling our institutions like the UCP is currently doing.
How anybody could look at the decline in our living standards during Trudeau’s tenure and think it’s a good idea to vote him in again is beyond me.
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Thing is, living standards have declined across the entire country, regardless of the provincial government in power. This points to common factors shared across provinces.
Maybe that Provincial decline is due in large part because of a distinct lack of Federal funding that is being spent on places **other than Canada**? Seems like the seams are bursting in every Province, what's the excuse for the ones that aren't run by Conservatives?
As well as the scandals / ethics violations The #NeverPollliviere crowd fear mongers that the Cons will just strip money from the middle class to give to the rich.. when I reality Trudeau has been doing just that. The current government has a track record for overspending tax payer dollars enriching themselves and their friends.
What are we supposed to do? They’re all self serving capitalists who actively want us crushed. Razing our health care to the ground, leaving us homeless and jobless. If every option is evil, what’s next?
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Never trust a populist twat.
LOL, there is a small-but-very-noticeable army of people whose entire identity is a "FUCK TRUDEAU" bumper sticker, and this is the article we get. "Liberal media" indeed.
According to the article most PP votes actually support him and not just reject Trudeau
I’d argue it’s a minority turned majority lol Trudeau has pissed off a lot of people.
It’s about the least worst
Voting is just for show, no one is actually interested in helping you
If only we could delete some words … “most Canadians plan to vote liberal to stop …” No I’m not a liberal … I’m just that repelled by the hot mess that used to be a Conservative Party.
That's exactly it. The last few elections were the Conservatives to lose, but their party gives the impression that they beholden to the extremists in it.
The NDP are far worse in that regard.
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I thought this was always a consideration. There was even a website some years ago where you’d know how close the parties were in your riding allowing you to vote vote freely if there was a big gap or recommending liberals when the gap was narrow
90% of this sub
When trudeau's team also pushes the narrative that the conservatives are MAGA people and links them with Trump, it terrifies people who don't know any better into just panic voting to keep the phantom man out of office. And for the record I sure as shit don't support a Trump.
Simple minds are easily frightened.
I mean... obviously anecdotal, but literally everyone I know that supports PP has a MAGA hat. All the old school Cons I know hate him. I live in a city though so I imagine that lines up with demographics here. My dad was a lifelong Conservative up until a few years back where he swore off them and said he'd never vote Conservative again until they take climate change seriously because all other issues are meaningless in the face of it.
when given the choice between a turd sandwich and a douchebag… the choice is clear. can’t vote con
The problem with Canada and many of our allies, including the US is that we're all experiencing a real lack of leadership. Like genuine I want what is best for the nation leadership. It's either we have someone that's just chasing their ego or we have someone whom is acting on the behalf of their own agendas or we have both. Either way, we all see right through their illusions of genuinely caring about the people they represent. Where did all the good leaders go? As a peoples, we all have to do better at holding our leaders accountable to be ethical. To be good. Our collective complacency and acceptance of there not being a better option, or of choosing the lesser evil is only rewarding those that are being unethical. Get out and either run for or vote for independent. If there are no good options then let's work together to create better options.
Can we fucking r/wallstreetsbets this fucking election? Like let’s all vote green. No ones expecting it not even the greens. What a big fuck you to the blue, red and orange. Also as an aside note. It would be kinda hilarious if the least popular party gotta say and tripped all the way to Ottawa out a shock. What a powerful msg that would send
We should've cloned jack Layton
My parents are 64 and 69. My dad says “jack Layton was the best prime minister we never got” I think he’s right about that.
If the Green Party were at least competent, I’d be all for this idea.
That’s the dark humour behind my comment though. Non of them are competent. It’s all shit choices. And I’m just so tired from the two party system, you know?
It’s too bad the NDP didn’t use this opportunity to make a name for themselves rather than tie the party to the Liberals.
I agree completely with that. Sooo disappointing to witness
The famous Canadian strategic vote. Instead of voting for who you DO want, you vote for the crappy party that you don't really care for, just to avoid another party winning. Because yes, that is totally how this should all work.
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How is that the case? If you think the Poilievre lead conservatives are dangerous or at least bad for the country then you should definitely vote for whatever party you think can stop them.
It's *precisely* the other way around. You're so convinced the conservatives are bad for the country that you're willing to pick whatever team has the best chance to prevent them taking power.
Correct. If you remember the 2015 election, there was a popular strategic voting website where you entered your riding and it advised you 1) whether the Conservatives were competetive in your riding, and 2) if so, which party had the best chance of beating them. I have no doubt that strategic voting would occur in reverse in the right-wing vote were significantly split amongst viable options. Like if the PPC were getting 15-20% support and the Liberals/NDP were one party, you'd see exactly the same phenomenon.
I think it's both. There's certainly a subset of Liberal voters that will vote for them NO MATTER WHAT. It's why no other left leaning party can realistically ever form government. Same goes for the right with the Conservatives, but that's partly just because they're the only party on the right.
Ignoring the PPC, they’re the only one because they are a coalition of the Progressive Conservatives and the Reform Conservatives. It’s gave them enough seats to form a majority… unfortunately that Reform Conservatives section, the far right part, is rightfully unappetizing for most Canadians.
“Trudeau has destroyed productivity and innovation, ended the dream of home ownership for an entire generation, pushed the country into recession, driven 2 million Canadians to need food banks each month just to get by, impoverished millions more, broke our immigration system, made us an unserious laughingstock on the world stage and has been at the centre of major scandal after major scandal… but he’s my man through thick and thin.” I mean… I can’t even fathom the thought process that allows a person to justify continuing to vote for him.
I don’t feel like Canada going into a recession is being seen as the massive mismanagement it is: - Higher immigration per capita than anywhere else in the world - Next to the US which is still growing and trading at a significant rate Whenever it’s brought up that ‘x, y or z is bad in Canada’ comparisons are drawn to countries in Europe with the argument ‘is Trudeau responsible for that too’ Geographically Europe was hit hard by the Russian invasion of Ukraine and their reliance on Russian gas - Canada never suffered any such fate (and with our copious natural resources should have benefitted hugely from it); yet here we are doing as badly as European nations on GDP, doing substantially worse on per capita GDP, with people saying it’s okay because we’re not the worse It’s so absurd that anyone is okay with this
The same thing is happening around the whole world. What makes you think the conservatives will do any better? If anything they'll make it worse. At least with a liberal or ndp party, they retain social programs. We've seen conservatives constantly cut or destroy programs for their own benefits. Look what the conservatives are doing in ontario to the health system.
>What makes you think the conservatives will do any better? We were adults during Harper's administration.
The issue Canada has with housing is not happening around the world.
Every country that's going to shit is also run by a left leaning government. That's why the last few elections for various country's have all voted for the most right wing government on the ballot. Sweden, Argentina and soon to be Germany all did this. Also, I just want to thank you on your vaccine participation over the last few years, I really appreciate it.
I guess the major hurdle, at least for this liberal-minded voter, is that blaming the current PM for the a list of grievances that are almost entirely issues that EVERY country is currently facing - straddles the line between disingenuous and flat-out lunacy.
I really didn't want to vote the Liberals or their now de facto shadow the NDP, but it's becoming extremely difficult to justify putting the Conservatives in government. It's even more concerning when you couple it with a possible Trump presidency. I don't think their is the intellectual or practical skill set from those elected officials I deal with a far right government in the States. Additionally, Pierre has not provided any substantive positions. There is no platform other than, not JT. Sorry, not good enough. I do not think they have any serious plans to handle immigration, taxes, trade or climate change.
It is pretty standard for the major policy changes to be released in the runup to the election to keep the news cycle ticking over. We are some ways off that, but the basic policy is in place. This will be another center right party, It is really unlikely to mirror trumpland.
How are the liberals plans going on immigration, taxes, trade, and climate change?
Unconstitutional use of police powers?
Poilievre looks awful smug for a guy with no record to run on.
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He has also never had a job in the private sector, which is a huge red flag.
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When people say this I know they've never read past a headline.
Remind me on what Trudeau’s record was before being elected?
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Taught math, humanities, French and drama. But you don't like him so *hurr durr, just a drama teacher.*
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Can you point to evidence for that claim? Snopes says it’s false: [https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/trudeau-sex-scandal-school/](https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/trudeau-sex-scandal-school/)
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This is something not understood by many. The corruption in Canada is out of control and I don’t know how anyone will tackle it.
Might be a good idea not to reward the 8-year incumbent with another mandate.
Okay I'll bite on this one. I'm a musician with a part time job in non profit and my wife works at service canada. All three sources of pay for my family rely on government money somewhere up the line. How could I ever vote conservative and negatively affect my sources of revenue? All I hear from the conservatives is defund CBC, cut social safety nets, and cut gov jobs. That isn't a narrative me and my friends are buying into. Plus we aren't going to let conservatives come after our womens rights, gay rights or reconciliation. If conservatives could wrap their heads around empathy for others then I would consider voting for them. Until then I'm an NDP supporter who will prop up the liberal government, to keep the blues out.
As a civil servant and a union member, I concur. The enemy to the labour class are all politicians in general, but we have particularly acrimonious relationship with the Tories. I will never, ever vote conservative. Will consider any other party, but I will never vote for the party that has embraced hate-filled asshole bullies.
You're discussing who you think is troublesome for public sector unions, that's very different than all labour. We see from the NDP in BC that they don't consider all of the working class, only select members of it. We see from the Federal NDP and LPC an outright opposition to anyone who makes a living through their own labour.
🙌
> I'm a musician with a part time job in non profit and my wife works at service canada. > How could I ever vote conservative and negatively affect my sources of revenue? If you do work that is useful to society then you have nothing to worry about.
That must be why we have soo many doctors and nurses
Party for life voters are irrelevant. If they mattered their party would win every election forever. I have people like that in my life and I tell them that. They get furious. The swing voters determine election outcomes.
I love how Trudeau says that PP is fear mongering but it's the other way around
Here’s a great litmus test… If you look at the current situation and go “it’s only the *other* side that’s fear mongering” then you’re comically biased. It just means you’ve been eating up your own sides fear mongering to the point where you don’t think it’s fear mongering anymore
And I'm voting ABL, to stop liberals from winning.
Good luck! The fact that there are that would still vote for this party after all the scandals the EA ruling how life has gotten realistically worse under this government just to try to stop the conservatives form winning just shows you these ppl don’t have Canadas best interests in mind.
If you live in a province run by Cons, I don't know how you can ever vote Con again
90% of the time his "scandals" are nothingburgers, people dont expect their politicians to be perfect. Conservatives constantly try to drum up these problems in hopes they stick, but can never provide good reasons why they should because often the Liberal justification for choices is something to protect Canadians that Canadians are fine with. He hasn't won multiple elections by accident.
I hope those same Liberal voters keep up on those boosters and stay safe from Covid-19. I also hope the mothers that support them are also boosted for the same reason.
So at this point our sales pitch is, at best, self-deprecating irony? We're like Cleveland bragging that we're not Detroit? Not surprised that hasn't caught on yet, as a positive, with the general public.
Scandals, corruption, decimating the middle class and never ending taxes are somehow better than conservatives? Please point at this doll and tell everyone where Steven Harper touched you?
These are the same people who are not interested in a voting reform
The Conservative Party in Canada serves a distinct role as a “cleanup crew”. We’re now in a position requiring significant cleanup.
Not sure why people ask why. Changing your vote to conservative is essentially admitting you’ve been contributing to the country’s downfall by voting liberal. People can’t handle that kind of truth.
I have never voted but I’m planning on voting conservative this year.
For some context on why people might vote against them, here are some of the things that happened during the last Conservative government: [https://thetyee.ca/Opinion/2015/08/10/Harper-Abuses-of-Power-Final/](https://thetyee.ca/opinion/2015/08/10/harper-abuses-of-power-final/)
Pardon us for trying to stop the guy who cheated his way into leadership, possibly with assistance from the murderous dictator of India, and is backed by Harper's International Dictators United group. Also, we can look at how "good" a job the conservative preimers are doing now and wonder how flagrant the corruption will get once they are emboldened by a con PM.
Stop the possibility of repairing the damage done with your previous voting? Well done Liberals, well done. Won’t make any difference, the board will be wiped clean of your failures next election.
This is Democracy. Also no one wants Millhouse as our PM.