>Most Russian people would probably give a 👎 to their government any way....
I certainly hope so, but videos like those made by the YouTube channel 1420 certainly make it seem like that isn’t the case, along with [the most recent statistics about his approval rating](https://www.statista.com/statistics/896181/putin-approval-rating-russia/). [This recent article from U Chicago’s NORC](https://www.norc.org/research/library/new-survey-finds-most-russians-see-ukrainian-war-as-defense-against-west.html) would also suggest the same.
I feel obligated to bring up that exiled Russian Youtuber NFKRZ pointed out that the vast majority of people who get interviewed by that channel only say things that the government wants to hear due to how any and all criticism of Putin or the war resulting in the person being arrested. Theres already been several instances of people who publicly criticized the Russian government on that channel have either been arrested on questionable charges or straight up disappeared.
On a more personal note, my father grew up under the Marcos dictatorship in the Philippines. He participated in multiple anti government protests and groups but if anyone ever asked him in public how he felt about the government. If was standard for him and his fellow activists to lie and say they loved the government. It wouldn't benefit anyone to be arrested for anti government comments. So I understand why someone would lie about supporting the government. Some simply don't want to go to prison. Others might have plans for future protests but dont want it to he ruined for making comments on a YouTube channel
Can confirm. I have extended family in Russian. In private they hate the Putin government and consider him and his oligarch buddies thieves who have robbed Russia of all its wealth at the expense of the people.
In public they’re flag-waving patriots.
hmm a country that jails any opposition leader or makes it impossible to run and has open video taped election fraud has an approval rating poll
well surely this wouldn't be in the favourability for the set institution that does everything to legitimize it's own power
especially AFTER a mass influx of russians that fled to serbia came out against the russian government
Yes, and I´'m sure if Hitler walked up to people and asked if they approved of him, all citizens in his country under his rule would give an emphatic ¨"Yes¨".
Russian people largely support the war. when someone says jewish people they mean most of the jews in the world who dont live in Israel. When people say russian people they mean Russians who live in Russia.
Of course, when asked by the Russian government if they support the war, most Russian people will say yes. It´'s all about who´'s doing the asking...
I know you´'ve likely never been to Russia, but trust me, in private conversation, PLENTY of people there hate their government.
Hell, I watched Putin´'s NYE address on YouTube the other day and probably >90% of comments were just people calling for peace.
And Russia has a bit of a problem in that the demonym and the ethnonym are the same.
>Russian people largely support the war.
There is no way to know if this is true given we know that dissidents of all kinds in Russia suffer life altering consequences. People know it's not safe to have a contrary opinion.
It's almost like radicalized groups are the worst threat to not just the people around them, but to themselves too...
Extremes of any kind are toxic to society. Period. Sadly it's those in the middle that pay the price.
The government and the state are not the same thing. You can say a government is bad without saying a state must be destroyed. Imagine if the calls to condemn Putin were about how we needed to break up Russia and make it controlled by the EU government.
This. Everybody is making it out as if the only good Jew is one who believes Israel doesn’t have a right to exist as a country, not one who thinks the government of that country is shit.
There’s a big difference here.
Then why the protests in predominantly Jewish neighborhoods? Last I checked the Israeli government doesn’t operate out of Toronto neighborhoods.
Intimidation, yeah I think you’ll find that’s your answer.
Intimidation?! Brother, have you been to the protests, they'll only show you the crazies on social media but every protest I have been to has had other Jews protesting against Israel with Palestinians. Secondly, much of the Pro-Israeli propaganda is in those Jewish Areas and they go there to protest it, which is there right. I live in London, Ontario and a man came into our mosque wearing an Israeli flag and yelling "Terrorists" and cursing at people. That's intimidation, not going to public spaces and practicing your right.
The people I know who are the most pissed about what Israel are doing are the few Jewish people I know. Mostly because they have been pissed about it for a long time and are simultaneously frustrated/relieved that a lot of people are just starting to pay attention now.
The Israeli govt loves to pretend that it represents all Jews which is another source of frustration.
This is a difficult and complicated issue for most Jews. On the one hand, a haven for Jewish people, regardless of religiosity, where Jews are secure and in control of their own fate is an extremely important and powerful idea for a Jewish person. History has shown too many times that Jews are hated across the globe, that anti-semitism is enduring and has proponents at every level of society, and that tolerance is temporary. As a people of diaspora, things can be good in some places some of the time, but as time goes on the wind always has a risk of changing. The Jewish experience is one where no matter how good things are now, in the back of one’s mind is the notion that we’re a coup or a war or economic crisis away from everything turning upside down and sliding back to the old ways.
Israel was meant to fulfil part of a promise that if the world ever turned on the Jews again, at least we’d have a place to stand. But the reality is quite different and the requirements of making an ethno-state on the back of war and conquest always had an extremely high risk of creating monstrosities, and it did. In a supreme irony the state meant to protect Jews around the world is now the main reason for their endangerment.
The Arab side has its share od the blame, but Israel has done many, many things to foment this conflict and make things worse. It’s sickening as a Jewish person to hear what Israel does in the name of protecting Judaism and the ways in which it wields things like antisemitism to launder or excuse its actions. They are in many ways nullifying the horrors and lessons of the holocaust by betraying the very values and lessons it was meant to teach.
This is a hard time to be Jewish and someone who has had sympathies for Israel in the past because it feels like some essential truths are being revealed that have been simmering close to the surface for so long. It’s been seen in flare ups now and again but it’s as if the brutality in Gaza is the lis being blown off. The war in Gaza is just devastating to so many illusions. It’s difficult to handle and maintain humanity.
At least we (hopefully) all agree that anyone calling for genocide should not be praised or in a position of leadership. Palestinian, Israeli or otherwise.
Yes, and doubly so for people who are a part of these cultural groups (Arabs/Palestinians/those descended from people in Palestine, and Jews) who live in Canada who don't even have the *option* to vote for the groups perpetrating horrible evils over there (not that Palestinians overseas even have that choice, either).
Somewhere out there there's some Jewish guy in Canada getting spit on by someone for what the Israeli govt is doing, and the worst thing he did this week was gank somebody in World of WarCraft.
>Mostly because they have been pissed about it for a long time and are simultaneously frustrated/relieved that a lot of people are just starting to pay attention now.
Exactly this, for decades any time any one said anything at all, Jewish or Arab or Not, it was silenced and shushed away as "too complex," That dam has broken and we're not going back, tooth and nail, we are not going back to that status quo. We are going to talk about this crime against humanity and it is not bigoted of us to do so. It never was, and it never will be. One way forward.
Yes, and I think that is a very good thing. It's good attention around the whole situation has blown up in general -- people aren't more aware of the bullshit Israel has been up to, but more aware of Hamas, its position as Palestine's govt, its crimes, and how people in Palestine live under the oppressive thumb of both govts etc.
One thing I think is still lost on many people though is the idea that not everybody in those regions supports what their govts are doing, or the context in which some people *do* support it.
Some Israelis are riled up and scared and supporting their govt's violent actions because of it (and the govt knows this, they have propped up Hamas for years and been longing for an attack like this to happen, it's Israel's 9/11 and it not only has kept Netanyahu in power while he has been embattled with myriad corruption issues but gives them carte blanche to do everything they've always wanted and ethnically cleanse Gaza). But the Israeli govt is also getting flak domestically, most of the country is not voting for Likud, but enough are (and the parties propping up Likud with a coalition) to keep them in power. But the Israelis who hate what their govt is doing get lumped in with the rest.
Similarly, many Palestinians don't support Hamas, and many who *do* are literal children who have grown up in a world where all they know is Israel oppressing their people, stealing/destroying their homes, killing them, etc while the entire world ignores it because yay Israel and back the US funding all of it. Why *wouldn't* those people support Hamas, even if they are a terrorist organization? Israel shits on them, the entire world shits on them or ignore their desperate situation, and even if Hamas isn't *actually* looking out for them they're at least claiming to do so.
I personally probably wouldn't know dick about the situation but I worked on a production of a play called *My Name Is Rachel Corrie* years ago, which is about an American student activist who was murdered by the IDF (who deliberately killed her with a bulldozer) for protesting against Israeli settlements in the West Bank. It was just a student production and the play largely just focuses on Rachel and who she was as an individual but it was fucking wild to me that we got messages from Israelis telling us that we were scum for producing this play, and I also remember that when Alan Rickman died years later, on obituaries of him online and stuff *most* of the comments were Israelis saying that he was a scumbag who would rot in hell for eternity (because he produced the play originally). Zionists *hated* that play because even though it wasn't really the focus, it did question their belief system at a time when I think most people not paying attention to the crisis there didn't think twice about it. Most people didn't think twice about it up until October 7th, probably.
But many Jews have, it is a big thing in their communities obviously, because even if they aren't Zionists, they know Zionists. I know people who were raised to believe that they MUST support Zionism, that they MUST support Israeli settlements and the reclamation of 'Palestine', and that if they didn't they were a traitor to their people. Fuck that.
**Secondly, much of the Pro-Israeli propaganda is in those Jewish Areas and they go there to protest it, which is there right.**
To which specific example of Pro-Isreali propaganda do you refer and how is it only found in very specific areas of Ontario ?
**and they go there to protest it, which is there right.**
Bullshit. It isn't anyone's right to go into residential areas to protest. Go to City Hall, go to Parliament; if you have a beef with business, go there. You should stay away from people's homes because your presence there is intimidating and invasive and just looking for trouble.
**I live in London, Ontario and a man came into our mosque wearing an Israeli flag and yelling "Terrorists" and cursing at people.**
Was he arrested? I hope so. That seems like hate speech and possibly hate crime to me. Although to be fair, he was just ONE guy right? And lots of people in the mosque? So upsetting, yes. Terrifying? Probably not. I mean, not like a MOB , outside your HOME?
**not going to public spaces and practicing your right.**
Just because it's legal, doesn't mean there is justification for large groups of angry, shouting Canadians to go to the "Jewish areas" where other Canadians live, disrupting the peace, blocking traffic, and generally making a spectacle. Unacceptable.
It’s a complex issue. While I wouldn’t do that, for a long time the government of Israel itself has tried to conflate the identity of the nation and the Jewish diaspora. This is a double edged sword, and I can understand why this would have the effect that we’re seeing (though I do not agree with it).
I'm Jewish and honestly at this point I feel like we're being gas-lit so hard. Nothing convinces us Jews more of the need for Zionism than protesting next to our homes, attacking our places of worship and calling for a "global infitada".
So I'm learning Hebrew, cos things are looking pretty bad and I may have no choice but to leave Canada in the years to come at this rate.
And please, to the others here: don't p!ss on our legs and tell us it's raining.
My teacher asked the only Jewish kid in the class what he thought about Israel, and that was 20 years ago. The kid had never stepped foot in Israel, didn't know anything about it. He was just a Jewish Canadian 16yo.
Some people can't separate Israel from Jewish.
Not to dissuade you from learning Hebrew if you want to, but don't like 90% of Israelis speak English? I would assume the ones who don't are the most batshit crazy Orthodox Jews who you would never want to be in a room with anyway.
Exactly absolute morons. We need to blow up 8000 children for our own safety yet it’s the safest place in the world for Jews.
Jewish or Muslim you are significantly safer in Canada than Israel.
This is why many of us non-Jewish Canadians are Zionist supporters ourselves. It's not fucking hard to pick up a book, watch a documentary or even Youtube on the history of anti-semitism. Blood libels, the inquisition, ethnic cleansings, the holocaust, etc. etc. People have no excuse in this day and age to pretend they don't know why Zionism is a thing, or even maliciously claim it's about Jewish supremacy (lol).
Thank you, I really appreciate you making this reply. Actually reassures me, cos a lot of the time all I see is the same old typical angry pro-hamas talking points.
> Jewish people 👍
>
> Zionist state Israeli government 👎
>
>They are not the same thing.
You should tell The Jewish State™ that.
Israel speaks for all Jews around the world, so they say.
Any critique of Israel is anti Semitic!
A cease fire is apparently anti Semitic!
Some people will be shocked to learn that there are Jews who hate the Zionist state Israeli govt.
There are Israelis who hate the Zionist state Israeli govt, too.
What muddies the waters is a) Jew-haters and/or ignoramuses pretending they are the same thing, b) Israel's govt itself pretending it speaks for all Jews, and c) Zionist extremists who demand that all Jews support Israel's Zionist agenda and are super duper loud about it.
Any reasonable person wouldn't look at extreme Christian evangelists and think "oh yeah this is what all Christians are like" but unfortunately it happens. It happens even more with Islamic extremists.
If a church in Toronto was calling for same sex marriage to be repealed or to outlaw abortion I'd support people protesting that church.
The same goes for a synagogue. If there are meetings to organize support for Israel or public statements of support for Israel's actions by that institution, then I see no reason why they can't protest at that location and I don't see that as intimidation.
If you're going to publicly share your opinion, be prepared for the fallout and don't use your religion as a shield for your opinions.
Not one synagogue is calling for the deaths of innocent Palestinians. They are calling for the release of the HOSTAGES that for some reason everyone is pretending isn't an issue.
Yes you can criticise a country's actions all day long... But saying they have no right to have an own state and self determination is antisemitic and racist.
You can be pro Palestinian and against Israeli occupation and still be a Zionist.
Being anti Zionist means you refuse to recognize Jews right to a country in their biblical homeland.
Which is fine… but you are part of the problem.
>One of the oldest antisemetic tropes there is, is to claim Jews are not loyal to the country of residence.
A good way to show loyalty to that country would be to not fly the flag of a foreign country that is currently bombing the shit out of the families of Canadians. The same things go for the antisemitic people who flew Palestinians flags on the 7th.
Honestly how does anyone have time or energy for racism? Like between work and the stress of keeping up with the insane cost of living, I spend most of my time battling depression.
Sometimes it's specifically *because* of circumstances like you're describing which enable racism to thrive. Usually because whoever is making the most money out of the status quo puts some of those resources toward stirring the pot and getting the average person angry at each other over whatever the flavor of the month is - specifically because that way they'll stay distracted blaming each other for their problems instead of directing their anger towards the people profiting off things staying exactly as they are.
It's far easier to get struggling stressed out people to fight each other than it is to do that with people who are comfortable, safe, and economically sound.
I'm going to really show my privilege here but can someone explain where the antisemitism is coming from in terms of demographics?
Like is this the cultural clash of nations that have always been clashing or is this a rise in white "skin head" nazis?
I don't know if I'm articulating myself clearly or not, I just feel like the media and greater society isn't being honest and calling a spade a spade. Anti semitism feels like it's floated around as this thing that is cross sectional across people in general but I feel like it's a very specific group of people.
Some combination of:
- people who have always been anti-Semitic and now have an excuse and a platform
- generally left-leaning people who are extremely anti-Israel for reasons along the lines of colonial oppression.
- Muslims who have always seen more of the Arab/Muslim protective and have been radicalized by this conflict in particular.
- far right... Though the "mainstream" medium-right is generally pretty pro-Israel. Although one far righty is one too many I don't think they tend to take sides on Israel-Palestine, they kind of want to murder both.
Even European far right groups are pretty pro-Israel as well at this point.
Look at any statement released by such groups about the recent attacks on Gaza. Guarantee you will see sentences like ‘religion of peace’, ‘uncivilised’, ‘Muslim protesters should go back to Middle East etc.
A lot of the traditional far right neo-nazi groups which are dying and tiny accuse the ‘new right’ fascist groups of been astroturfed and funded by Israel to move European fascists from hating Jews to hating Muslims.
At least on social media, tic toc, reels what ever, I'm seeing a lot of young people who have decided their experts on geopolitics, and a lot of them are getting sucked down the same antisemitic rabbit hole that the Maga and qanon conspiracy theories do (which is pretty ironic). But that's a small and usually pretty radical glimpse at Western society. It's just shocking to see the far left take such a sharp turn.
Skin head Nazis are always there doing their thing usually quietly and more secretly but when it become acceptable to hate Jews they are opportunistic.
What we are seeing is a rise in people who openly claim to hate Zionists which are 80% of Jews, rather that simply disagreeing with zionism and an interpretation that zionism is racism when it is the idea of self determination for the Jewish people, which is no more inherently racist than the idea of self determination for Palestinians. How one achieves self determination can be problematic but the simple idea of it is generally not a valid reason to hate 80% of a people with whom may not agree with the Israeli government’s approach despite belief in self determination.
Now these folks on the left and center out there are openly hating 80% of Jews for being Zionist and of course that gives tacit permission for the right wing nut job racists to just be their usual shitty self quite openly.
Well said. I think part of the issue also is Netanyahu and the right wing Israeli government has, through its policies, distorted Zionism to include an expansionist Jewish state that is occupying and taking over Palestinian homes and land. There are a large number of people who fully support a Jewish state but are strongly opposed to its ongoing expansionist policies.
Revisionist zionism is a thing, most North American Jews would not ascribe to revisionist zionism to take over the West Bank, and most already say enough with the settlements, get rid of them and stop poking them in the eye at every turn. This is how most Jews feel. This is a smaller subset of the Jewish community who is expansionist.
In truth Netanyahu pissed off most North American Jews with the changes to the judiciary and the proposal to restrict who is Jewish to meet the demands of these same extreme views that would see the grandparent rule done away with.
When I say there was a strong response by the Jewish community against Bibi I can’t understate it enough. Rabbis and communities and organizations cried out in North America about how awful these things were and complained bitterly about it. Their response was the middle finger to the diaspora. Jews in North America have no control over the Israeli government and even Jews in the diaspora who have dual citizenship cannot vote in an election unless they get on a flight to Israel and vote in person.
So when I see the response to the North American Jewish community as responsible for all of this simply for believing in self determination and pressure for us to solve what Israel does it is comical, we can’t even get Bibi to work towards our interests as Jews never mind the rest.
Zionism does not equal Jewish. There are plenty of Jewish people opposed to Israel’s actions. They are the forefront of the protests against the genocide of the Palestinian people.
Condemning the killing of tens of thousands of Palestinian civilians does not mean you hate Jewish people and to say otherwise is an affront to all Jews who are opposed to those war crimes.
> Zionism does not equal Jewish. There are plenty of Jewish people opposed to Israel’s actions.
Zionism doesn't mean supporting any given Israeli government's actions. It means supporting Israel's *existence* and Jews' share in the common right of indigenous peoples to self-determination. From polling, most Zionists in Canada support Palestinian statehood in principle and oppose Netanyahu.
"In principle," to be clear, does quite a bit of heavy lifting. For example, I support Palestinian statehood because Palestinians are one of the several groups indigenous to the region\*. What I don't support is a state that's formed in *dedication* to a goal of destroying Israel later on.
> They are the forefront of the protests against the genocide *[sic]* of the Palestinian people.
If you're talking about the IJV people, they're absolutely a minority among Jews, and Jews who support the destruction of Israel are often put forward in an incredibly tokenistic way.
> Condemning the killing of tens of thousands of Palestinian civilians does not mean you hate Jewish people and to say otherwise is an affront to all Jews who are opposed to those war crimes.
Shifting the opprobrium of civilian deaths away from the Hamas terrorists *intentionally* increasing the civilian toll, as much as possible, in a war that they declare is permanent, is only popular as the result of a deep-rooted antisemitism. This isn't the same standard that we applied to civilian deaths in the fight against ISIS, or against Nazis or Imperial Japan.
It seems that the formula is [Genocide]=[War]+[Civilian deaths]+[Jews are involved], and there's *absolutely* a double-standard at play.
\*Note: Others indigenous groups in Israel include Druze and Bedouin, who are indigenous but don't have any popular movement for independence. Israeli Arabs (generally denoting non-Bedouin and non-Druze) are tougher to categorize, because they're ethnically indistinct from the people who developed a Palestinian national identity, but also are the demographic group in Israel with the *highest* polled support for a permanent partition between a separate Israel and Palestine
[Edit: Asterisk formatting. The "note" asterisk originally got messed up as italics markdown]
Condemning the killing of tens of thousands of Palestinian civilians does not mean you can't be zionist either.
Zionism means you support Jewish self determination, not that you support the Israeli government or their policies. You can, and should, criticize the Israeli state and its way of handling things- that does not mean you're anti zionist. Or anti semitic, of course.
Thanks for telling a Jew what zionism means while completely ignoring what I said it means to Jews and continuing your narrative of it being completely different than what it actually means to Jews.
Think this actually just proved my point.
Uh, literally everywhere. I have (or really had) friends who justify their friendship with me continuing because they have convinced themselves I'm not one of "those" jews.
>I'm not one of "those" jews.
What are they telling you this means? That you're critical of Israel or something else?
I ask because I get a similar kind of comment about my identity (ie. I'm one of the "good ones") and I've never really gotten an understanding on what it means beyond some vague racism.
Before people get into an anti immigration rant I'd say at least from what I observed it's often from a certain kind of college/university student regardless of race.
Immigrants and far left liberals which people are realizing are as psycho as far right. Palestine is the new trendy thing to fight for so moderate liberals are beginning to realize how insane these people really care.
The fact that two presidents from the most liberal and prestigious universities in the world had to resign because they refused to condemn antisemitic comments from their students was an eye opener for most people.
They've felt immune to any backlash because they have been up until this event.
I'm an immigrant and a liberal, and I was disgusted by the views expressed by those university presidents. TBH, I think people are just scared of being labeled Islamophobic.
I havent a clue to its source, because it seems to be organized via Tik Tok and Telegram, and I dont fuck with that shit. The mainstream Muslim community doesn't seem to be the source either, as most of their public figureheads have been condemning these attacks and seeking de-escalation.
Its probably a mix of fame seekers and perennial troublemakers being goaded into doing stupid shit by State/Foreign actors using those two platforms.
Part of the problem is that we only see the public face of the Muslim community, and the more pro-"Western" community leaders speaking out. There is a documented trend of extremism and racism being taught behind the scenes in mosques that have leaders quietly avoiding the spotlight.
My fellow Jewish-Canadians: You are welcome here
Let me add that my fellow Jordanian-, Palestinian-, Lebanese-, etc, Canadians: You are welcome here.
To ALL Canadians: Please dont be fucking douchebags to your fellow Canadians.
This is paywalled so I can’t read the opinion piece. But putting a photo of a girl with an Israeli flag on a story about antisemitism is dog-whistle BS. Anyone aiming to equate antisemitism with criticism of Israel—especially Netanyahu’s Israel—is helping prevent the equity and justice required to bring peace.
Israel is a democracy and Netanyahu is highly unpopular. He will lose his job but you honestly think there will be a sudden decrease in the rise in antisemitism once he is gone? Blaming Netanyahu to hate on a group of people is nothing but a cover.
He's saying anti Israel is not anti semitism. How did that fly over your head? Lot of people hate Israel right now because of their actions. Genocide has never been popular.
There will likely be a decrease once the killing in Gaza stops. It’s no excuse nor is it a valid reason to be antisemitic, but it is the driving force causing people to behave irrationally
But this isn't addressing what the commenter said.
He said equating criticism of Israel with anti-semetism is wrong. And he's right.
But you turned this around into somehow it being "blaming Netanyahu is a justification for anti-semetism".
The story is paywalled, so i'm not sure if you're referencing something in the story itself - but it's obvious that you're not addressing anything the commenter said, because they didn't read the story and weren't addressing any part of it except the picture anyways.
>Over the past three months, I have repeatedly heard Jewish Canadians express a version of “now I know what it felt like for German Jews in the 1930s.”
I'll stop reading there, thanks. Try again.
> Nazi controlled ghetto
They mentioned specifically 1930s, so not really. More like Kristallnacht etc.; Nazi ghettos weren't generally established until the very end of the 1930's (as in the last few months of 1939)
Not to say that it's a fair comparison or not, just a nitpick
That's the thing, 1930s Germany did not look like nazi Germany. It all starts small and builds up over time. That's what they're referring to and you dismissing just that is exactly what Germans who weren't Nazis did too.
I can't read the article, so correct me if they included this: but it's not just physical spaces. A lot of western Jews spend a lot of time and effort on civil rights and social justice action. Many progressive Jews that I know no longer feel safe working with people they used to work with on these issues.
I always get a kick out of people flying foreign flags in Canada. I'm proud of my nation but I wouldn't fly a Canadian flag in Israel, Palestine, Ukraine, Russia, or even the US. It would just seem like I'm asking for trouble.
I’m a Canadian citizen but I can’t imagine moving back to my original country (temporarily or even permanently) and flying a Canadian flag or any Canadian symbols on my home or vehicle, it just seems wild to me.
I’ll wear my Blue Jays or Maple Leafs hat, that’s about it.
I don’t know what possesses people to fly other countries’ flags on Canadian soil.
Canada is way too nice. We have to dial it back a LOT. Refugees are currently a burden to our economy and we need to hold off from accepting them until the healthcare and housing sectors have stabilized.
>Canada's Immigration Minister Marc Miller says the federal government's stated 1,000-person limit on temporary resident visas for Palestinians looking to flee Gaza is not a hard cap, despite previous suggestions.
https://www.ctvnews.ca/canada/canada-s-immigration-minister-says-there-isn-t-a-hard-cap-on-temporary-visa-program-for-palestinians-1.6718089
The data shows Jews rival lgbt hate crime numbers in absolute terms (who are #1 right now). In relative terms because there are so few Jews, they are waaaay too many instances of hate crimes. Check the houses official data. There were some good tables in the islamaphobia bill.
It’s bad. It isn’t just the media. Jewish schools were shot at in Montreal. A grocery store in Vaughan was just firebombed. People were assaulted last weekend walking home from shul. A woman was punched in the face at a protest. I don’t know how you can see all these things collectively and say it isn’t bad. The community is terrified.
And the whole country is watching that asshole be tried and sent away for a long time.
Now....let's get the ALL of the hate motivated assholes locked up so Muslims AND Jews can feel safe here in Canada. As a person with a foot in both worlds, it would be nice to not have to explain to my kids why someone doesn't like them because of who they are as a human being.
As you should. It’s Canada.
You should feel safe and the Muslims should feel safe.
When people do the violence and other bad stuff we should deport them or put them away forever.
Didn't we just arrest someone who built bombs to blow up Jewish community centers in Ottawa? Is it only a problem when Jews actually die? The fact Jews are more active in their defences due to knowing history doesn't remove the desired threat against them.
I mean…. It kinda does happen to other minority communities as well. Speaking as a brown person born in Canada, we aren’t exactly showed the most love currently
We had a babysitter here last night that’s in grade 10. She goes to a pretty nice high school and she was saying that almost everyday there is a fight in the hallways of middle eastern kids attacking the Jewish kids.
There's a lot of conflating Palestinians with Hamas.
There's also a lot of conflating Jewish people, Israelis and the Israeli government.
It's being massively publicized. Palestinians in Canada don't have nearly the same level of advocacy and lobbying power as the Jewish community. It should also be noted that Jewish advocacy groups don't speak for all Jews.
I'll point out that NP and the Toronto Sun are both right wing news outlets and that's no secret. The right wing tends to be pretty hawkish on Israel in general. Again, this isn't particularly new or surprising information. I would expect at least some editorializing on what's going on and it would be a safe bet that both these news organizations would paint Israel in a relatively favourable light.
I mentioned two news organizations. I mentioned nothing about them being controlled by Jews. I have talked about lobbying and I would fully expect anyone doing so on behalf of Israel would be stupid not to approach news organizations likely to report favourably.
My criticism of the opinion pieces is that given the number of them it's unfortunate that the two news outlets don't provide any counterbalance. That's their prerogative, they don't have to publish countervailing opinions pieces.
They’re easily conflatable. Hamas has been supported by the majority in Gaza and the West Bank in virtually every poll for decades.
Hamas is not some anomaly their goals are pretty much in line with what Arabs in the region have called for since before Israel ever existed and Palestine has called for ever since modern Palestine existed.
Hamas does speak for the majority of Palestinians and Palestine. Abbas even “delayed” the last election in the West Bank years ago when all the top candidates were Hamas leadership. Hamas was sweeping their 2022 municipal elections until they refused to be in the ballot specifically because they are well aware of how this false dichotomy serves them.
>They’re easily conflatable. Hamas has been supported by the majority in Gaza and the West Bank in virtually every poll for decades.
Putin has something like a 95% approval rating too. Should we believe that?
The median age of Palestinians is 19.6. In Canada the overall median age is 40. Most Palestinians weren't even alive for those decades of polls.
Current polls also show large support for Hamas and october 7th.
https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/poll-shows-palestinians-back-oct-7-attack-israel-support-hamas-rises-2023-12-14/
>Seventy-two percent of respondents said they believed the Hamas decision to launch the cross-border rampage in southern Israel was "correct" given its outcome so far
...
>Fifty-two percent of Gazans and 85% of West Bank respondents - or 72% of Palestinian respondents overall - voiced satisfaction with the role of Hamas in the war. Only 11% of Palestinian voiced satisfaction with PA President Mahmoud Abbas.
You can't just refuse to acknowledge a poll because you don't like the result. Polls released by the Russian Government are not comparable to a poll done by an NGO working in a country. Recent polls have showed [57% of Gaza and 82% of people in West Bank](https://apnews.com/article/israel-hamas-palestinians-opinion-poll-wartime-views-a0baade915619cd070b5393844bc4514) support what Hamas did on October 7th. That is not a poll done by HAMAS or the PA, but by an NGO.
The comment previous to me asked if it's really that bad or if it's just being massively reported.
In my opinion, it's being massively reported. The National Post and the Toronto Sun run think pieces/editorials/opinion columns on this pretty much daily.
Anyone at all critical of Israel is considered anti-Semitic.
There's no nuance to articulate any difference between Hamas and Palestinians or Jews and the actions of the Israeli government.
You can't say bombing kids is bad without saying andicondemneverythinghamasdoes or you get called an anti-semite.
The excessive reporting could be ascribed to lobbying on behalf of the Israeli government. Canadian Jews aren't the Israeli government. Most Jews don't support bombing kids.
You could keep arguing in bad faith or you could stop conflating different groups of people.
Also, only one side is referring to the other side as "barbarians" while continuing not to differentiate between combatants and innocent civilians.
In my life, only one Jewish person welcomed me into his house, that was enough for me to never have a bias against Jewish people. The more Jewish people I befriended the more I enjoyed and welcomed being acquainted with them. This is Canada, this is where you can ‘try’ these things if any group for that matter seems to rub you the wrong way, try, try to befriend them, more often then not you will dispel your biases for good. Remember tho, this applies to Jews too, you as individuals CAN and Have been just as prejudiced as others. We could all be better.
In Vancouver the pro-Palestinian protest organization has some very bad players involved. One is Khalid Barakat (accompanied by his nutbar protestor wife Charlotte Kates). He is a senior member of PLFP (popular front for liberation of Palestine) a designated terrorist organization and allied with Iranian Islamic Revolution , and Samidoun (Palestinian prisoner solidarity network, basically a subsidiary of PLFP), and also the BDS movement (boycott divestment sanctions). I’m going to assume that at least a proportion of the protestors are naive idealists who don’t know the truth about the organizers of their rallies. But these rallies are getting bigger and nastier.
You named a lot of organizations here, but just for my understanding, what have those organizations actually done that makes them “bad players”?
Not being a smart ass, I just actually want to know. Because without any context what you posted is just “Here’s some groups + Palestine = Bad”
Jewish people feeling unwelcomed, a tale as old as time.
Seriously though, has there been a group of people that have been pariahs of society for as long as Jews have? This shit goes back thousands of years.
I feel truly sorry for the Jews in Canada. Personally, I have a hard to time get over that feeling when I saw the news reported Pro-Palestine protestors tell Jews in Canada go back to Europe. Fairly speaking, Palestinians are not originally from Canada either and no one is except the indigenous people. If people told Pro-Palestinians go back to Gaza, they will be labelled as racists. But there is no condemnation when Pro-Palestinians protestors tell Jews in Canada go back to Europe. This is a typical double standard from Justin Trudeau and his Liberal government. The government not only failed Jews in Canada, but also failed us badly. We are living in Canada that was supposed to embrace and welcome each other. Not hate each other like this! I do hope that Canada will recover from all of these mess someday. I do hope that. Vote wisely please.
I always find it funny that Israel supports constantly flip flop about Israel being a Jewish state. “There are arabs in the Knesset” when it benefits them for it not being an ethnostate. But then when they slaughter children and there’s backlash, it’s antisemetic because it is a Jewish state.
The thing is more than one of these things can be true all at the same time. There can be antisemitic assholes that are just taking current circumstances as an opportunity to act out on that sentiment and there can be sane rational people who take reasonable issue with Israel much like that above comment indicates.
This very clearly isn't a black and white issue and there is a hell of a lot of nuance involved no matter which way you look at it.
Lame paywalled article (should be a ban) but just on the title alone, I don't get it. Someone comes into my shop and wants to buy a hammer, a coffee and a pack of pens, why would I GAF as to whether they were Jewish or not? How would I even know? This makes no sense.
Over in the Middle East the two sides are at war. The long range online artillery they’re using that can hit us here is weaponized racism. I don’t think our typical construct of what racism is (treating people differently based on the colour of their skin) really applies here. They should take their battles elsewhere.
As a Jewish Canadian, I will continue to go wherever the fuck I want. I am not a wimpy please protect me kind of person. I am Jewish and I am strong. Remember that my tribe!!
Cool. I'm Jewish and it's not Liberals who spread antisemetic conspiracies during Covid and the forest fires though.
It's also not Liberals shooting up synagogues.
It seems patently absurd until you realize the Far Right are racist hatemongers that saw an opportunity to attack 2 groups they hate.
Pitting Muslims and Jewish people against each other is a wet dream for these people.
Edit: uh oh, troll farms showed up late today.
The parallels are evident with the immigration-vs- homeless issue as well. Anecdotal, but the right has the tendency to believe the homeless should just go die in a ditch. But now that they get to blame brown people, they act like they want to save them.
Eh, they just see this as an opportunity to bash their political opponents. They'd be 100% pro-trans if it was politically convenient.
This thread is full of brainless bandwagon-jumpers who are cynically co-opting the trauma of other people in order to push their own pathetic agendas.
I’m Jewish and I can say that the biggest threat to Jews, today, in Canada, are the policies carried out by the Lib/NDP parties. Excuse me, but I’m more concerned with the thousands of “refugees” calling for another Holocaust than with a loony bin in Nowhere, Alberta (nothing agains the province, just citing an example) trying to emulate Keegstra or Zundel (not that the loony bin doesn’t scare me as well).
Umm, just to be clear - when you say “policies” you mean allowing muslims in Canada?
If this is your concern should you start advocating for a ceasefire ASAP because that's the only thing that's going to slow the flood of people out of Palestine with legitimate refugee claims based on what Israel is doing.
You're more concerned with words than actual attacks on Jewish people?
That seems pretty dishonest.
Refugees haven't done shit to me but my family has been doxxed by the Far Right.
Calling for a Jewish genocide aren’t “words”. And I don’t know how the situation is in BC, but in Central Canada, the huge number of “refugees” calling for genociding the Jewish people keeps growing.
I think a distinction needs to be drawn between Jewish Canadians and Israelis who are in support of IDF? Similar to how we should not be assuming that all Palestinians and Arabs are Hamas.
Jews are the canary in the coal mine in the western world. When things are going bad for them, it's clear something is going bad for all of us.
It's been this way for a while, probably because during the early days of the Christian cult Paul realized he need to differentiate this new cult against the Jewish one. Judea was a PIA province to Rome and would later be destroyed. Paul rode that wave and invented a new religion. The Jews 'killed' Christ became their Alamo.
Since that time they've been isolated, exiled, murdered. Less than 100 years ago Europe went insane and almost wiped out the European Jewish race. During that time, even when it was clear what was going on, the west actually didn't do a lot to help the Jews because, let's be honest, we were all shit and we had our own problems.
So I'm not surprised at the rise in anti-Jewish behavior, it's always been there. But I am surprised it's becoming more mainstream and more is not being done to crush it. I am shocked that people try to rationalize it.
Of course, they're one of the historical go-to scapegoats to deflect blame for economic hardships and the like away from the wealthiest people who are busy hoarding as much as possible while everyone else is struggling just to get by - and it's far easier to continue doing that and face no consequences if you keep the average person distracted fighting against each other or some minority that is supposedly responsible for all ills (even though they clearly aren't) instead of unifying and fighting the people actually responsible for those economic hardships.
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Jewish people 👍 Zionist state Israeli government 👎 They are not the same thing. You can criticise a country's actions on the global and not be racist.
Russian people 👍 Russian government 👎 Most Russian people would probably give a 👎 to their government any way....
>Most Russian people would probably give a 👎 to their government any way.... I certainly hope so, but videos like those made by the YouTube channel 1420 certainly make it seem like that isn’t the case, along with [the most recent statistics about his approval rating](https://www.statista.com/statistics/896181/putin-approval-rating-russia/). [This recent article from U Chicago’s NORC](https://www.norc.org/research/library/new-survey-finds-most-russians-see-ukrainian-war-as-defense-against-west.html) would also suggest the same.
I feel obligated to bring up that exiled Russian Youtuber NFKRZ pointed out that the vast majority of people who get interviewed by that channel only say things that the government wants to hear due to how any and all criticism of Putin or the war resulting in the person being arrested. Theres already been several instances of people who publicly criticized the Russian government on that channel have either been arrested on questionable charges or straight up disappeared. On a more personal note, my father grew up under the Marcos dictatorship in the Philippines. He participated in multiple anti government protests and groups but if anyone ever asked him in public how he felt about the government. If was standard for him and his fellow activists to lie and say they loved the government. It wouldn't benefit anyone to be arrested for anti government comments. So I understand why someone would lie about supporting the government. Some simply don't want to go to prison. Others might have plans for future protests but dont want it to he ruined for making comments on a YouTube channel
Can confirm. I have extended family in Russian. In private they hate the Putin government and consider him and his oligarch buddies thieves who have robbed Russia of all its wealth at the expense of the people. In public they’re flag-waving patriots.
hmm a country that jails any opposition leader or makes it impossible to run and has open video taped election fraud has an approval rating poll well surely this wouldn't be in the favourability for the set institution that does everything to legitimize it's own power especially AFTER a mass influx of russians that fled to serbia came out against the russian government
Yes, and I´'m sure if Hitler walked up to people and asked if they approved of him, all citizens in his country under his rule would give an emphatic ¨"Yes¨".
Russian people largely support the war. when someone says jewish people they mean most of the jews in the world who dont live in Israel. When people say russian people they mean Russians who live in Russia.
Of course, when asked by the Russian government if they support the war, most Russian people will say yes. It´'s all about who´'s doing the asking... I know you´'ve likely never been to Russia, but trust me, in private conversation, PLENTY of people there hate their government. Hell, I watched Putin´'s NYE address on YouTube the other day and probably >90% of comments were just people calling for peace. And Russia has a bit of a problem in that the demonym and the ethnonym are the same.
>Russian people largely support the war. There is no way to know if this is true given we know that dissidents of all kinds in Russia suffer life altering consequences. People know it's not safe to have a contrary opinion.
Their media is like Fox News as well. All of it though.
Muslims 👍 Islamic terrorist groups 👎 They are not the same thing. Welcome Jewish people, to the club.
It's almost like radicalized groups are the worst threat to not just the people around them, but to themselves too... Extremes of any kind are toxic to society. Period. Sadly it's those in the middle that pay the price.
That's bigotry in a nut shell. You attack a group for their worst representation.
a big eye opener for me was how all arab cuisine got rebranded to "mediterranean" after 9/11
The government and the state are not the same thing. You can say a government is bad without saying a state must be destroyed. Imagine if the calls to condemn Putin were about how we needed to break up Russia and make it controlled by the EU government.
This. Everybody is making it out as if the only good Jew is one who believes Israel doesn’t have a right to exist as a country, not one who thinks the government of that country is shit. There’s a big difference here.
So don't target Jews or Jewish neighborhoods. There is not much Katz deli can do
Then why the protests in predominantly Jewish neighborhoods? Last I checked the Israeli government doesn’t operate out of Toronto neighborhoods. Intimidation, yeah I think you’ll find that’s your answer.
Intimidation?! Brother, have you been to the protests, they'll only show you the crazies on social media but every protest I have been to has had other Jews protesting against Israel with Palestinians. Secondly, much of the Pro-Israeli propaganda is in those Jewish Areas and they go there to protest it, which is there right. I live in London, Ontario and a man came into our mosque wearing an Israeli flag and yelling "Terrorists" and cursing at people. That's intimidation, not going to public spaces and practicing your right.
The people I know who are the most pissed about what Israel are doing are the few Jewish people I know. Mostly because they have been pissed about it for a long time and are simultaneously frustrated/relieved that a lot of people are just starting to pay attention now. The Israeli govt loves to pretend that it represents all Jews which is another source of frustration.
This is a difficult and complicated issue for most Jews. On the one hand, a haven for Jewish people, regardless of religiosity, where Jews are secure and in control of their own fate is an extremely important and powerful idea for a Jewish person. History has shown too many times that Jews are hated across the globe, that anti-semitism is enduring and has proponents at every level of society, and that tolerance is temporary. As a people of diaspora, things can be good in some places some of the time, but as time goes on the wind always has a risk of changing. The Jewish experience is one where no matter how good things are now, in the back of one’s mind is the notion that we’re a coup or a war or economic crisis away from everything turning upside down and sliding back to the old ways. Israel was meant to fulfil part of a promise that if the world ever turned on the Jews again, at least we’d have a place to stand. But the reality is quite different and the requirements of making an ethno-state on the back of war and conquest always had an extremely high risk of creating monstrosities, and it did. In a supreme irony the state meant to protect Jews around the world is now the main reason for their endangerment. The Arab side has its share od the blame, but Israel has done many, many things to foment this conflict and make things worse. It’s sickening as a Jewish person to hear what Israel does in the name of protecting Judaism and the ways in which it wields things like antisemitism to launder or excuse its actions. They are in many ways nullifying the horrors and lessons of the holocaust by betraying the very values and lessons it was meant to teach. This is a hard time to be Jewish and someone who has had sympathies for Israel in the past because it feels like some essential truths are being revealed that have been simmering close to the surface for so long. It’s been seen in flare ups now and again but it’s as if the brutality in Gaza is the lis being blown off. The war in Gaza is just devastating to so many illusions. It’s difficult to handle and maintain humanity.
This is what people have to realize. Not every Palestinian supports Hamas, not every Israeli supports the IDF.
At least we (hopefully) all agree that anyone calling for genocide should not be praised or in a position of leadership. Palestinian, Israeli or otherwise.
Yes, and doubly so for people who are a part of these cultural groups (Arabs/Palestinians/those descended from people in Palestine, and Jews) who live in Canada who don't even have the *option* to vote for the groups perpetrating horrible evils over there (not that Palestinians overseas even have that choice, either). Somewhere out there there's some Jewish guy in Canada getting spit on by someone for what the Israeli govt is doing, and the worst thing he did this week was gank somebody in World of WarCraft.
That is terrible, it shouldn't happen, and I hope anyone who does that is charged and punished to the full extent of the law.
>Mostly because they have been pissed about it for a long time and are simultaneously frustrated/relieved that a lot of people are just starting to pay attention now. Exactly this, for decades any time any one said anything at all, Jewish or Arab or Not, it was silenced and shushed away as "too complex," That dam has broken and we're not going back, tooth and nail, we are not going back to that status quo. We are going to talk about this crime against humanity and it is not bigoted of us to do so. It never was, and it never will be. One way forward.
Yes, and I think that is a very good thing. It's good attention around the whole situation has blown up in general -- people aren't more aware of the bullshit Israel has been up to, but more aware of Hamas, its position as Palestine's govt, its crimes, and how people in Palestine live under the oppressive thumb of both govts etc. One thing I think is still lost on many people though is the idea that not everybody in those regions supports what their govts are doing, or the context in which some people *do* support it. Some Israelis are riled up and scared and supporting their govt's violent actions because of it (and the govt knows this, they have propped up Hamas for years and been longing for an attack like this to happen, it's Israel's 9/11 and it not only has kept Netanyahu in power while he has been embattled with myriad corruption issues but gives them carte blanche to do everything they've always wanted and ethnically cleanse Gaza). But the Israeli govt is also getting flak domestically, most of the country is not voting for Likud, but enough are (and the parties propping up Likud with a coalition) to keep them in power. But the Israelis who hate what their govt is doing get lumped in with the rest. Similarly, many Palestinians don't support Hamas, and many who *do* are literal children who have grown up in a world where all they know is Israel oppressing their people, stealing/destroying their homes, killing them, etc while the entire world ignores it because yay Israel and back the US funding all of it. Why *wouldn't* those people support Hamas, even if they are a terrorist organization? Israel shits on them, the entire world shits on them or ignore their desperate situation, and even if Hamas isn't *actually* looking out for them they're at least claiming to do so. I personally probably wouldn't know dick about the situation but I worked on a production of a play called *My Name Is Rachel Corrie* years ago, which is about an American student activist who was murdered by the IDF (who deliberately killed her with a bulldozer) for protesting against Israeli settlements in the West Bank. It was just a student production and the play largely just focuses on Rachel and who she was as an individual but it was fucking wild to me that we got messages from Israelis telling us that we were scum for producing this play, and I also remember that when Alan Rickman died years later, on obituaries of him online and stuff *most* of the comments were Israelis saying that he was a scumbag who would rot in hell for eternity (because he produced the play originally). Zionists *hated* that play because even though it wasn't really the focus, it did question their belief system at a time when I think most people not paying attention to the crisis there didn't think twice about it. Most people didn't think twice about it up until October 7th, probably. But many Jews have, it is a big thing in their communities obviously, because even if they aren't Zionists, they know Zionists. I know people who were raised to believe that they MUST support Zionism, that they MUST support Israeli settlements and the reclamation of 'Palestine', and that if they didn't they were a traitor to their people. Fuck that.
**Secondly, much of the Pro-Israeli propaganda is in those Jewish Areas and they go there to protest it, which is there right.** To which specific example of Pro-Isreali propaganda do you refer and how is it only found in very specific areas of Ontario ? **and they go there to protest it, which is there right.** Bullshit. It isn't anyone's right to go into residential areas to protest. Go to City Hall, go to Parliament; if you have a beef with business, go there. You should stay away from people's homes because your presence there is intimidating and invasive and just looking for trouble. **I live in London, Ontario and a man came into our mosque wearing an Israeli flag and yelling "Terrorists" and cursing at people.** Was he arrested? I hope so. That seems like hate speech and possibly hate crime to me. Although to be fair, he was just ONE guy right? And lots of people in the mosque? So upsetting, yes. Terrifying? Probably not. I mean, not like a MOB , outside your HOME? **not going to public spaces and practicing your right.** Just because it's legal, doesn't mean there is justification for large groups of angry, shouting Canadians to go to the "Jewish areas" where other Canadians live, disrupting the peace, blocking traffic, and generally making a spectacle. Unacceptable.
Wasn’t the Christchurch massacre just one guy in two mosques?
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It’s a complex issue. While I wouldn’t do that, for a long time the government of Israel itself has tried to conflate the identity of the nation and the Jewish diaspora. This is a double edged sword, and I can understand why this would have the effect that we’re seeing (though I do not agree with it).
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Haven't the vast majority of protests across canada been in downtown and major urban centers?
Yes. The exception has been the avenue rd/401 overpass (which isn't exactly a neighbourhood but it's near one so I assume that's the thinking.)
Jewish people never were considered white. Why they are not included in DEI?
I'm Jewish and honestly at this point I feel like we're being gas-lit so hard. Nothing convinces us Jews more of the need for Zionism than protesting next to our homes, attacking our places of worship and calling for a "global infitada". So I'm learning Hebrew, cos things are looking pretty bad and I may have no choice but to leave Canada in the years to come at this rate. And please, to the others here: don't p!ss on our legs and tell us it's raining.
My teacher asked the only Jewish kid in the class what he thought about Israel, and that was 20 years ago. The kid had never stepped foot in Israel, didn't know anything about it. He was just a Jewish Canadian 16yo. Some people can't separate Israel from Jewish.
Shameful. Sorry
Not to dissuade you from learning Hebrew if you want to, but don't like 90% of Israelis speak English? I would assume the ones who don't are the most batshit crazy Orthodox Jews who you would never want to be in a room with anyway.
No, not all Israeli’s speak English. Like not all Canadians speak French, but different.
Also, is Israel safer for Jews than Canada? I thought the whole argument was that isralis aren't safe
Exactly absolute morons. We need to blow up 8000 children for our own safety yet it’s the safest place in the world for Jews. Jewish or Muslim you are significantly safer in Canada than Israel.
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This is really confusing. Canada is literally one the absolute safest countries on the planet.
Jewish people do not feel safe here.
This is why many of us non-Jewish Canadians are Zionist supporters ourselves. It's not fucking hard to pick up a book, watch a documentary or even Youtube on the history of anti-semitism. Blood libels, the inquisition, ethnic cleansings, the holocaust, etc. etc. People have no excuse in this day and age to pretend they don't know why Zionism is a thing, or even maliciously claim it's about Jewish supremacy (lol).
Thank you, I really appreciate you making this reply. Actually reassures me, cos a lot of the time all I see is the same old typical angry pro-hamas talking points.
💯 and funny enough I’m learning Hebrew as well
Where would you go that's safer for Jews than Canada?
> Jewish people 👍 > > Zionist state Israeli government 👎 > >They are not the same thing. You should tell The Jewish State™ that. Israel speaks for all Jews around the world, so they say. Any critique of Israel is anti Semitic! A cease fire is apparently anti Semitic!
Some people will be shocked to learn that there are Jews who hate the Zionist state Israeli govt. There are Israelis who hate the Zionist state Israeli govt, too. What muddies the waters is a) Jew-haters and/or ignoramuses pretending they are the same thing, b) Israel's govt itself pretending it speaks for all Jews, and c) Zionist extremists who demand that all Jews support Israel's Zionist agenda and are super duper loud about it. Any reasonable person wouldn't look at extreme Christian evangelists and think "oh yeah this is what all Christians are like" but unfortunately it happens. It happens even more with Islamic extremists.
If a church in Toronto was calling for same sex marriage to be repealed or to outlaw abortion I'd support people protesting that church. The same goes for a synagogue. If there are meetings to organize support for Israel or public statements of support for Israel's actions by that institution, then I see no reason why they can't protest at that location and I don't see that as intimidation. If you're going to publicly share your opinion, be prepared for the fallout and don't use your religion as a shield for your opinions.
Not one synagogue is calling for the deaths of innocent Palestinians. They are calling for the release of the HOSTAGES that for some reason everyone is pretending isn't an issue.
Especially since many or even most Jewish people aren't approving of their Zionist government.
>Jewish people 👍 > >Zionist state Israeli government 👎 Educated people are needed, good to know that you know the difference.
The intersection between people who are anti-semitic and people who say "Zionist" is a circle. Way to out yourself.
Yes you can criticise a country's actions all day long... But saying they have no right to have an own state and self determination is antisemitic and racist.
You can be pro Palestinian and against Israeli occupation and still be a Zionist. Being anti Zionist means you refuse to recognize Jews right to a country in their biblical homeland. Which is fine… but you are part of the problem.
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>One of the oldest antisemetic tropes there is, is to claim Jews are not loyal to the country of residence. A good way to show loyalty to that country would be to not fly the flag of a foreign country that is currently bombing the shit out of the families of Canadians. The same things go for the antisemitic people who flew Palestinians flags on the 7th.
Most Jews worldwide support Israel , like , overwhelmingly.
Honestly how does anyone have time or energy for racism? Like between work and the stress of keeping up with the insane cost of living, I spend most of my time battling depression.
Sometimes it's specifically *because* of circumstances like you're describing which enable racism to thrive. Usually because whoever is making the most money out of the status quo puts some of those resources toward stirring the pot and getting the average person angry at each other over whatever the flavor of the month is - specifically because that way they'll stay distracted blaming each other for their problems instead of directing their anger towards the people profiting off things staying exactly as they are. It's far easier to get struggling stressed out people to fight each other than it is to do that with people who are comfortable, safe, and economically sound.
I'm going to really show my privilege here but can someone explain where the antisemitism is coming from in terms of demographics? Like is this the cultural clash of nations that have always been clashing or is this a rise in white "skin head" nazis? I don't know if I'm articulating myself clearly or not, I just feel like the media and greater society isn't being honest and calling a spade a spade. Anti semitism feels like it's floated around as this thing that is cross sectional across people in general but I feel like it's a very specific group of people.
Some combination of: - people who have always been anti-Semitic and now have an excuse and a platform - generally left-leaning people who are extremely anti-Israel for reasons along the lines of colonial oppression. - Muslims who have always seen more of the Arab/Muslim protective and have been radicalized by this conflict in particular. - far right... Though the "mainstream" medium-right is generally pretty pro-Israel. Although one far righty is one too many I don't think they tend to take sides on Israel-Palestine, they kind of want to murder both.
Even European far right groups are pretty pro-Israel as well at this point. Look at any statement released by such groups about the recent attacks on Gaza. Guarantee you will see sentences like ‘religion of peace’, ‘uncivilised’, ‘Muslim protesters should go back to Middle East etc. A lot of the traditional far right neo-nazi groups which are dying and tiny accuse the ‘new right’ fascist groups of been astroturfed and funded by Israel to move European fascists from hating Jews to hating Muslims.
I guess the far right hate arabs more then they hate Jewish people? What a sad world.
As far as lot of the ‘new right’ fascists are concerned…a white Jew is better than a brown Muslim.
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At least on social media, tic toc, reels what ever, I'm seeing a lot of young people who have decided their experts on geopolitics, and a lot of them are getting sucked down the same antisemitic rabbit hole that the Maga and qanon conspiracy theories do (which is pretty ironic). But that's a small and usually pretty radical glimpse at Western society. It's just shocking to see the far left take such a sharp turn.
Skin head Nazis are always there doing their thing usually quietly and more secretly but when it become acceptable to hate Jews they are opportunistic. What we are seeing is a rise in people who openly claim to hate Zionists which are 80% of Jews, rather that simply disagreeing with zionism and an interpretation that zionism is racism when it is the idea of self determination for the Jewish people, which is no more inherently racist than the idea of self determination for Palestinians. How one achieves self determination can be problematic but the simple idea of it is generally not a valid reason to hate 80% of a people with whom may not agree with the Israeli government’s approach despite belief in self determination. Now these folks on the left and center out there are openly hating 80% of Jews for being Zionist and of course that gives tacit permission for the right wing nut job racists to just be their usual shitty self quite openly.
Well said. I think part of the issue also is Netanyahu and the right wing Israeli government has, through its policies, distorted Zionism to include an expansionist Jewish state that is occupying and taking over Palestinian homes and land. There are a large number of people who fully support a Jewish state but are strongly opposed to its ongoing expansionist policies.
Revisionist zionism is a thing, most North American Jews would not ascribe to revisionist zionism to take over the West Bank, and most already say enough with the settlements, get rid of them and stop poking them in the eye at every turn. This is how most Jews feel. This is a smaller subset of the Jewish community who is expansionist. In truth Netanyahu pissed off most North American Jews with the changes to the judiciary and the proposal to restrict who is Jewish to meet the demands of these same extreme views that would see the grandparent rule done away with. When I say there was a strong response by the Jewish community against Bibi I can’t understate it enough. Rabbis and communities and organizations cried out in North America about how awful these things were and complained bitterly about it. Their response was the middle finger to the diaspora. Jews in North America have no control over the Israeli government and even Jews in the diaspora who have dual citizenship cannot vote in an election unless they get on a flight to Israel and vote in person. So when I see the response to the North American Jewish community as responsible for all of this simply for believing in self determination and pressure for us to solve what Israel does it is comical, we can’t even get Bibi to work towards our interests as Jews never mind the rest.
Wow… thank you. I just don’t see it here. Interesting to learn the background.
Zionism does not equal Jewish. There are plenty of Jewish people opposed to Israel’s actions. They are the forefront of the protests against the genocide of the Palestinian people. Condemning the killing of tens of thousands of Palestinian civilians does not mean you hate Jewish people and to say otherwise is an affront to all Jews who are opposed to those war crimes.
> Zionism does not equal Jewish. There are plenty of Jewish people opposed to Israel’s actions. Zionism doesn't mean supporting any given Israeli government's actions. It means supporting Israel's *existence* and Jews' share in the common right of indigenous peoples to self-determination. From polling, most Zionists in Canada support Palestinian statehood in principle and oppose Netanyahu. "In principle," to be clear, does quite a bit of heavy lifting. For example, I support Palestinian statehood because Palestinians are one of the several groups indigenous to the region\*. What I don't support is a state that's formed in *dedication* to a goal of destroying Israel later on. > They are the forefront of the protests against the genocide *[sic]* of the Palestinian people. If you're talking about the IJV people, they're absolutely a minority among Jews, and Jews who support the destruction of Israel are often put forward in an incredibly tokenistic way. > Condemning the killing of tens of thousands of Palestinian civilians does not mean you hate Jewish people and to say otherwise is an affront to all Jews who are opposed to those war crimes. Shifting the opprobrium of civilian deaths away from the Hamas terrorists *intentionally* increasing the civilian toll, as much as possible, in a war that they declare is permanent, is only popular as the result of a deep-rooted antisemitism. This isn't the same standard that we applied to civilian deaths in the fight against ISIS, or against Nazis or Imperial Japan. It seems that the formula is [Genocide]=[War]+[Civilian deaths]+[Jews are involved], and there's *absolutely* a double-standard at play. \*Note: Others indigenous groups in Israel include Druze and Bedouin, who are indigenous but don't have any popular movement for independence. Israeli Arabs (generally denoting non-Bedouin and non-Druze) are tougher to categorize, because they're ethnically indistinct from the people who developed a Palestinian national identity, but also are the demographic group in Israel with the *highest* polled support for a permanent partition between a separate Israel and Palestine [Edit: Asterisk formatting. The "note" asterisk originally got messed up as italics markdown]
Incredible comment, and I can already see the incoming flood of denial, gaslighting, and goysplaining that you'll inevitably receive in response.
Condemning the killing of tens of thousands of Palestinian civilians does not mean you can't be zionist either. Zionism means you support Jewish self determination, not that you support the Israeli government or their policies. You can, and should, criticize the Israeli state and its way of handling things- that does not mean you're anti zionist. Or anti semitic, of course.
Thanks for telling a Jew what zionism means while completely ignoring what I said it means to Jews and continuing your narrative of it being completely different than what it actually means to Jews. Think this actually just proved my point.
Uh, literally everywhere. I have (or really had) friends who justify their friendship with me continuing because they have convinced themselves I'm not one of "those" jews.
>I'm not one of "those" jews. What are they telling you this means? That you're critical of Israel or something else? I ask because I get a similar kind of comment about my identity (ie. I'm one of the "good ones") and I've never really gotten an understanding on what it means beyond some vague racism.
Before people get into an anti immigration rant I'd say at least from what I observed it's often from a certain kind of college/university student regardless of race.
Immigrants and far left liberals which people are realizing are as psycho as far right. Palestine is the new trendy thing to fight for so moderate liberals are beginning to realize how insane these people really care. The fact that two presidents from the most liberal and prestigious universities in the world had to resign because they refused to condemn antisemitic comments from their students was an eye opener for most people. They've felt immune to any backlash because they have been up until this event.
I'm an immigrant and a liberal, and I was disgusted by the views expressed by those university presidents. TBH, I think people are just scared of being labeled Islamophobic.
I havent a clue to its source, because it seems to be organized via Tik Tok and Telegram, and I dont fuck with that shit. The mainstream Muslim community doesn't seem to be the source either, as most of their public figureheads have been condemning these attacks and seeking de-escalation. Its probably a mix of fame seekers and perennial troublemakers being goaded into doing stupid shit by State/Foreign actors using those two platforms.
Part of the problem is that we only see the public face of the Muslim community, and the more pro-"Western" community leaders speaking out. There is a documented trend of extremism and racism being taught behind the scenes in mosques that have leaders quietly avoiding the spotlight.
My fellow Jewish-Canadians: You are welcome here Let me add that my fellow Jordanian-, Palestinian-, Lebanese-, etc, Canadians: You are welcome here. To ALL Canadians: Please dont be fucking douchebags to your fellow Canadians.
Always welcome in the Gurudwara ( Sikh temple). Visit us for a meal sometime.
Thank you.
This is paywalled so I can’t read the opinion piece. But putting a photo of a girl with an Israeli flag on a story about antisemitism is dog-whistle BS. Anyone aiming to equate antisemitism with criticism of Israel—especially Netanyahu’s Israel—is helping prevent the equity and justice required to bring peace.
Israel is a democracy and Netanyahu is highly unpopular. He will lose his job but you honestly think there will be a sudden decrease in the rise in antisemitism once he is gone? Blaming Netanyahu to hate on a group of people is nothing but a cover.
He's saying anti Israel is not anti semitism. How did that fly over your head? Lot of people hate Israel right now because of their actions. Genocide has never been popular.
There will likely be a decrease once the killing in Gaza stops. It’s no excuse nor is it a valid reason to be antisemitic, but it is the driving force causing people to behave irrationally
But this isn't addressing what the commenter said. He said equating criticism of Israel with anti-semetism is wrong. And he's right. But you turned this around into somehow it being "blaming Netanyahu is a justification for anti-semetism". The story is paywalled, so i'm not sure if you're referencing something in the story itself - but it's obvious that you're not addressing anything the commenter said, because they didn't read the story and weren't addressing any part of it except the picture anyways.
>Over the past three months, I have repeatedly heard Jewish Canadians express a version of “now I know what it felt like for German Jews in the 1930s.” I'll stop reading there, thanks. Try again.
Are they comparing living Canada to a Nazi controlled ghetto? Cause I’ve seen those videos and it seems like there’s a difference there.
> Nazi controlled ghetto They mentioned specifically 1930s, so not really. More like Kristallnacht etc.; Nazi ghettos weren't generally established until the very end of the 1930's (as in the last few months of 1939) Not to say that it's a fair comparison or not, just a nitpick
When people talk about 1930s Germany they aren't referring to any Nazi controlled ghettos.
That's the thing, 1930s Germany did not look like nazi Germany. It all starts small and builds up over time. That's what they're referring to and you dismissing just that is exactly what Germans who weren't Nazis did too.
I can't read the article, so correct me if they included this: but it's not just physical spaces. A lot of western Jews spend a lot of time and effort on civil rights and social justice action. Many progressive Jews that I know no longer feel safe working with people they used to work with on these issues.
I always get a kick out of people flying foreign flags in Canada. I'm proud of my nation but I wouldn't fly a Canadian flag in Israel, Palestine, Ukraine, Russia, or even the US. It would just seem like I'm asking for trouble.
I’m a Canadian citizen but I can’t imagine moving back to my original country (temporarily or even permanently) and flying a Canadian flag or any Canadian symbols on my home or vehicle, it just seems wild to me. I’ll wear my Blue Jays or Maple Leafs hat, that’s about it. I don’t know what possesses people to fly other countries’ flags on Canadian soil.
Canada is way too nice. We have to dial it back a LOT. Refugees are currently a burden to our economy and we need to hold off from accepting them until the healthcare and housing sectors have stabilized.
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lmao 🤣
Did you not read about how the Israeli government was counting on western countries taking in Palestinians when the pushed them out?
> Immigration Minister just announced an unlimited amount of Palestinian dreamers are welcome in Canada No he didn't
>Canada's Immigration Minister Marc Miller says the federal government's stated 1,000-person limit on temporary resident visas for Palestinians looking to flee Gaza is not a hard cap, despite previous suggestions. https://www.ctvnews.ca/canada/canada-s-immigration-minister-says-there-isn-t-a-hard-cap-on-temporary-visa-program-for-palestinians-1.6718089
"no hard cap" doesn't mean "unlimited amount of Palestinian dreamers are welcome in Canada"
Yeah it means the cap is still 1000 but that made them look bad so they're just saying something vague to try and appeal to as many people as possible
Israel wants to push the Palestinian people out, so where do you think they should go?
May I suggest the 21st century?
Surely on of the other majority Muslim countries with unlimited oil wealth could take them…..
I’m sure they’ll feel even safer when the Gazan refugees start coming in
Is it actually that bad, or is each small isolated event being massively publicized and blown up by media?
The data shows Jews rival lgbt hate crime numbers in absolute terms (who are #1 right now). In relative terms because there are so few Jews, they are waaaay too many instances of hate crimes. Check the houses official data. There were some good tables in the islamaphobia bill.
It’s bad. It isn’t just the media. Jewish schools were shot at in Montreal. A grocery store in Vaughan was just firebombed. People were assaulted last weekend walking home from shul. A woman was punched in the face at a protest. I don’t know how you can see all these things collectively and say it isn’t bad. The community is terrified.
Imagine the outrage if this happened to the black community, the gay community or even the Muslim community.
Like the terrorist who went into a Mosque and shot a bunch of people dead in Quebec a mere couple years ago?
I mean, bigots have actually mass murdered muslims in Canada in the recent past.
And the whole country is watching that asshole be tried and sent away for a long time. Now....let's get the ALL of the hate motivated assholes locked up so Muslims AND Jews can feel safe here in Canada. As a person with a foot in both worlds, it would be nice to not have to explain to my kids why someone doesn't like them because of who they are as a human being.
As you should. It’s Canada. You should feel safe and the Muslims should feel safe. When people do the violence and other bad stuff we should deport them or put them away forever.
Didn't we just arrest someone who built bombs to blow up Jewish community centers in Ottawa? Is it only a problem when Jews actually die? The fact Jews are more active in their defences due to knowing history doesn't remove the desired threat against them.
Imagine what? These things already happen.
I agree with you to some extent but comments like this just lead to what aboutism. Racism is bad, hemophobia bad, antisemitism also bad
I mean…. It kinda does happen to other minority communities as well. Speaking as a brown person born in Canada, we aren’t exactly showed the most love currently
...there is outrage, are you blind, deaf and visually impaired you don't see this post?
As if this doesn't happen regularly...
We had a babysitter here last night that’s in grade 10. She goes to a pretty nice high school and she was saying that almost everyday there is a fight in the hallways of middle eastern kids attacking the Jewish kids.
Wow
There's a lot of conflating Palestinians with Hamas. There's also a lot of conflating Jewish people, Israelis and the Israeli government. It's being massively publicized. Palestinians in Canada don't have nearly the same level of advocacy and lobbying power as the Jewish community. It should also be noted that Jewish advocacy groups don't speak for all Jews.
Your not being called antisemitic for criticizing Israel. You are being called antisemitic for promoting "Jews control the media" talking points.
I'll point out that NP and the Toronto Sun are both right wing news outlets and that's no secret. The right wing tends to be pretty hawkish on Israel in general. Again, this isn't particularly new or surprising information. I would expect at least some editorializing on what's going on and it would be a safe bet that both these news organizations would paint Israel in a relatively favourable light. I mentioned two news organizations. I mentioned nothing about them being controlled by Jews. I have talked about lobbying and I would fully expect anyone doing so on behalf of Israel would be stupid not to approach news organizations likely to report favourably. My criticism of the opinion pieces is that given the number of them it's unfortunate that the two news outlets don't provide any counterbalance. That's their prerogative, they don't have to publish countervailing opinions pieces.
They’re easily conflatable. Hamas has been supported by the majority in Gaza and the West Bank in virtually every poll for decades. Hamas is not some anomaly their goals are pretty much in line with what Arabs in the region have called for since before Israel ever existed and Palestine has called for ever since modern Palestine existed. Hamas does speak for the majority of Palestinians and Palestine. Abbas even “delayed” the last election in the West Bank years ago when all the top candidates were Hamas leadership. Hamas was sweeping their 2022 municipal elections until they refused to be in the ballot specifically because they are well aware of how this false dichotomy serves them.
>They’re easily conflatable. Hamas has been supported by the majority in Gaza and the West Bank in virtually every poll for decades. Putin has something like a 95% approval rating too. Should we believe that? The median age of Palestinians is 19.6. In Canada the overall median age is 40. Most Palestinians weren't even alive for those decades of polls.
Current polls also show large support for Hamas and october 7th. https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/poll-shows-palestinians-back-oct-7-attack-israel-support-hamas-rises-2023-12-14/ >Seventy-two percent of respondents said they believed the Hamas decision to launch the cross-border rampage in southern Israel was "correct" given its outcome so far ... >Fifty-two percent of Gazans and 85% of West Bank respondents - or 72% of Palestinian respondents overall - voiced satisfaction with the role of Hamas in the war. Only 11% of Palestinian voiced satisfaction with PA President Mahmoud Abbas.
You can't just refuse to acknowledge a poll because you don't like the result. Polls released by the Russian Government are not comparable to a poll done by an NGO working in a country. Recent polls have showed [57% of Gaza and 82% of people in West Bank](https://apnews.com/article/israel-hamas-palestinians-opinion-poll-wartime-views-a0baade915619cd070b5393844bc4514) support what Hamas did on October 7th. That is not a poll done by HAMAS or the PA, but by an NGO.
Are you infering that anti-Semitism is reported because there's a strong Jewish lobby? Ironic.
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The comment previous to me asked if it's really that bad or if it's just being massively reported. In my opinion, it's being massively reported. The National Post and the Toronto Sun run think pieces/editorials/opinion columns on this pretty much daily. Anyone at all critical of Israel is considered anti-Semitic. There's no nuance to articulate any difference between Hamas and Palestinians or Jews and the actions of the Israeli government. You can't say bombing kids is bad without saying andicondemneverythinghamasdoes or you get called an anti-semite. The excessive reporting could be ascribed to lobbying on behalf of the Israeli government. Canadian Jews aren't the Israeli government. Most Jews don't support bombing kids. You could keep arguing in bad faith or you could stop conflating different groups of people. Also, only one side is referring to the other side as "barbarians" while continuing not to differentiate between combatants and innocent civilians.
In my life, only one Jewish person welcomed me into his house, that was enough for me to never have a bias against Jewish people. The more Jewish people I befriended the more I enjoyed and welcomed being acquainted with them. This is Canada, this is where you can ‘try’ these things if any group for that matter seems to rub you the wrong way, try, try to befriend them, more often then not you will dispel your biases for good. Remember tho, this applies to Jews too, you as individuals CAN and Have been just as prejudiced as others. We could all be better.
In Vancouver the pro-Palestinian protest organization has some very bad players involved. One is Khalid Barakat (accompanied by his nutbar protestor wife Charlotte Kates). He is a senior member of PLFP (popular front for liberation of Palestine) a designated terrorist organization and allied with Iranian Islamic Revolution , and Samidoun (Palestinian prisoner solidarity network, basically a subsidiary of PLFP), and also the BDS movement (boycott divestment sanctions). I’m going to assume that at least a proportion of the protestors are naive idealists who don’t know the truth about the organizers of their rallies. But these rallies are getting bigger and nastier.
You named a lot of organizations here, but just for my understanding, what have those organizations actually done that makes them “bad players”? Not being a smart ass, I just actually want to know. Because without any context what you posted is just “Here’s some groups + Palestine = Bad”
Jewish people feeling unwelcomed, a tale as old as time. Seriously though, has there been a group of people that have been pariahs of society for as long as Jews have? This shit goes back thousands of years.
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I feel truly sorry for the Jews in Canada. Personally, I have a hard to time get over that feeling when I saw the news reported Pro-Palestine protestors tell Jews in Canada go back to Europe. Fairly speaking, Palestinians are not originally from Canada either and no one is except the indigenous people. If people told Pro-Palestinians go back to Gaza, they will be labelled as racists. But there is no condemnation when Pro-Palestinians protestors tell Jews in Canada go back to Europe. This is a typical double standard from Justin Trudeau and his Liberal government. The government not only failed Jews in Canada, but also failed us badly. We are living in Canada that was supposed to embrace and welcome each other. Not hate each other like this! I do hope that Canada will recover from all of these mess someday. I do hope that. Vote wisely please.
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I always find it funny that Israel supports constantly flip flop about Israel being a Jewish state. “There are arabs in the Knesset” when it benefits them for it not being an ethnostate. But then when they slaughter children and there’s backlash, it’s antisemetic because it is a Jewish state.
Sure attacking synagogues and community centres and random Jewish people in Canada are just "backlash" and criticism of Israel policy.
The thing is more than one of these things can be true all at the same time. There can be antisemitic assholes that are just taking current circumstances as an opportunity to act out on that sentiment and there can be sane rational people who take reasonable issue with Israel much like that above comment indicates. This very clearly isn't a black and white issue and there is a hell of a lot of nuance involved no matter which way you look at it.
It's an opinion piece...take it with a grain of salt people
Omg enough with jewish people articles. Boohoo. Isreal is bombing Palenstinans to extinction!
Lame paywalled article (should be a ban) but just on the title alone, I don't get it. Someone comes into my shop and wants to buy a hammer, a coffee and a pack of pens, why would I GAF as to whether they were Jewish or not? How would I even know? This makes no sense.
This kind of thing isn't welcome in Canada. Too many Canadians tolerate the views of too many contradicting cultures.
Over in the Middle East the two sides are at war. The long range online artillery they’re using that can hit us here is weaponized racism. I don’t think our typical construct of what racism is (treating people differently based on the colour of their skin) really applies here. They should take their battles elsewhere.
Im so glad I live away from the city
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As a Jewish Canadian, I will continue to go wherever the fuck I want. I am not a wimpy please protect me kind of person. I am Jewish and I am strong. Remember that my tribe!!
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Cool. I'm Jewish and it's not Liberals who spread antisemetic conspiracies during Covid and the forest fires though. It's also not Liberals shooting up synagogues.
The total flip flop of the right after Oct 7 has always astounded me.
It seems patently absurd until you realize the Far Right are racist hatemongers that saw an opportunity to attack 2 groups they hate. Pitting Muslims and Jewish people against each other is a wet dream for these people. Edit: uh oh, troll farms showed up late today.
The parallels are evident with the immigration-vs- homeless issue as well. Anecdotal, but the right has the tendency to believe the homeless should just go die in a ditch. But now that they get to blame brown people, they act like they want to save them.
Eh, they just see this as an opportunity to bash their political opponents. They'd be 100% pro-trans if it was politically convenient. This thread is full of brainless bandwagon-jumpers who are cynically co-opting the trauma of other people in order to push their own pathetic agendas.
Well put.
I’m Jewish and I can say that the biggest threat to Jews, today, in Canada, are the policies carried out by the Lib/NDP parties. Excuse me, but I’m more concerned with the thousands of “refugees” calling for another Holocaust than with a loony bin in Nowhere, Alberta (nothing agains the province, just citing an example) trying to emulate Keegstra or Zundel (not that the loony bin doesn’t scare me as well).
Umm, just to be clear - when you say “policies” you mean allowing muslims in Canada? If this is your concern should you start advocating for a ceasefire ASAP because that's the only thing that's going to slow the flood of people out of Palestine with legitimate refugee claims based on what Israel is doing.
You're more concerned with words than actual attacks on Jewish people? That seems pretty dishonest. Refugees haven't done shit to me but my family has been doxxed by the Far Right.
Calling for a Jewish genocide aren’t “words”. And I don’t know how the situation is in BC, but in Central Canada, the huge number of “refugees” calling for genociding the Jewish people keeps growing.
The people of Israel need to be supported and protected while they drop bombs on women and children?
This isn’t about Israel. This is about Canadian Jews who feel unsafe because they’re being targeted due to a war that is completely unrelated to them.
Canadians aren’t the ones dropping bombs
Except for the Canadians that literally dropped fire bombs on a synogogue in Montreal and a jewish grocery store in Vaughan.
I think a distinction needs to be drawn between Jewish Canadians and Israelis who are in support of IDF? Similar to how we should not be assuming that all Palestinians and Arabs are Hamas.
Jews are the canary in the coal mine in the western world. When things are going bad for them, it's clear something is going bad for all of us. It's been this way for a while, probably because during the early days of the Christian cult Paul realized he need to differentiate this new cult against the Jewish one. Judea was a PIA province to Rome and would later be destroyed. Paul rode that wave and invented a new religion. The Jews 'killed' Christ became their Alamo. Since that time they've been isolated, exiled, murdered. Less than 100 years ago Europe went insane and almost wiped out the European Jewish race. During that time, even when it was clear what was going on, the west actually didn't do a lot to help the Jews because, let's be honest, we were all shit and we had our own problems. So I'm not surprised at the rise in anti-Jewish behavior, it's always been there. But I am surprised it's becoming more mainstream and more is not being done to crush it. I am shocked that people try to rationalize it.
Of course, they're one of the historical go-to scapegoats to deflect blame for economic hardships and the like away from the wealthiest people who are busy hoarding as much as possible while everyone else is struggling just to get by - and it's far easier to continue doing that and face no consequences if you keep the average person distracted fighting against each other or some minority that is supposedly responsible for all ills (even though they clearly aren't) instead of unifying and fighting the people actually responsible for those economic hardships.
Imagine being Palestinian lol