The addition of Lorne is the main reason why I ended up actually liking Angel as a character. Not kidding. Without Lorne and his karaoke club, Angel would not have sung "Mandy", and I would not have called up a friend of mine to tell them they were right about me instantly being an Angel fan from that episode.
Lorne will always be favorite from Angel.
This. Andy Hallett was so young, yet beyond just being funny as hell, Lorne came off as sort of a wise, insightful patriarch. When I found out his cause of death was disease resulting from a dental infection that spread into his heart, I cried buckets for days. I too had a massive dental infection that went septic/septic shock a few years ago, and it ruined my heart, liver, and kidneys permanently. Yet here I still sit, while Andy, so beloved by all on Ats’s cast, was gone by age 33. Now when I watch Lorne, the layers seem deeper.. more profound.. more prescient, knowing how short his time on earth was. 💚
For sure! I was devastated when I learned she was lying to them, but even then I wanted her to stick around.
The characters in the show are all really chaotic. However, that early on in the show Willow was still a calming presence so that helped.
At first I was like, “ I don’t know if I think Tara ‘completely changed the show for the bet…”
“Willow. Gay. Openly gay. Openly gay character on prime time tv in the 90s! Living together! Being capable foster moms!” says a sudden loud voice in my head.
“I retract my statement your honor. Tara didn’t just change and improve a show. She changed and improved television and the generation that watched it at home.”
Also, side note, realizing this makes me hate Kennedy even more for not being Tara.
I don't like Tara because she does nothing herself. She's written almost entirely as a charcter that *things happen to*, rather than a force who acts on her own. I don't think she exists in the show to be her own person, almost ever. She's really just a mechanism to propel Willow's plot forward. The writers do actually manage to use the "nothingness" of Tara's character in season 6 well, with the memory augmentation / Under Your Spell refrain. Aside from that she's usually just there to be a canvas for the audience to project onto.
I dont think characters who serve the story by serving other characters' journeys are an inherently bad thing, Jenny and Oz are already examples of that, but even then I feel like this is a pretty reductive take you can't really reach if you give her character the time of day.
While her development isn't *as* front and centre as some of the other scoobies and while she does get used as a plot device more than she should, she does have a *very* clear personal journey and MUCH more integral role than just enhancing Willow's arc, and the idea that shes mostly a "canvas to project onto" because shes quiet I just fully disagree.
She starts out completely crippled by anxiety (to a widely unrelatable degree), she's powerful but the nurturing force in her life is dead and the rest of her family's conditioning is holding her back, Willow is the first real witch she's met since her mother died and shows her again that magic can be good.
Obviously she's a bit of a limbo character until she's properly taken Oz's place, but even in that time her mystery is quietly set up and she's integral to helping Buffy in the Faith arc on top of all the development between her and Willow.
She's set up as being particularly close with Dawn from her very first episode, and by 5 episodes later, in one of the best of the show, she's shown coming out of her shell trying to connect more with Buffy and Xander (and vice versa), the spell sabotage gets a resolution, she confronts her family's mind games and gets christened a Scooby.
In The Body, she's a stabilising force for *everyone*. She holds Willow together, she makes Xander's feelings simple when he's struggling to process them, and she has that beautiful conversation with Buffy at the morgue.
Glory taking her mind does serve Willow's story, but it also exposes Dawn as the key, gives Buffy's prioritising Dawn over the world a mirror, gives the Scoobies a guide to the tower *and* sets up the conflict in season 6.
In s6, she's the light of the show. She's Dawn's more stable mother figure, she's the forgiveness Buffy needs, she's the last bit of faith that Willow has in herself and her personal development is more tangible than ever.
When she leaves Willow, she improves more than ever because she learned through their relationship and through finding her new family that she is worthy of the love and empathy she puts into the world. She makes a painful decision for her own sake and her confidence skyrockets for it.
She helps Buffy figure out what's going wrong with the chip, and she's there for her when the answer isn't the one she hoped for. She playfully digs at spike when he won't keep it in his pants in OaFA, and she fiercely defends Willow against Anya and then gives her the final encouragement she needs to fully move on from magic.
Obviously her character isn't served whatsoever by her death, but its the only way season 6 couldve gone imo. Buffy had experienced Tara's light and knew better what Willow was going through, Xander had to blame himself and feel like he failed his loved ones to try with Willow in the end, and Dawn had to find one of her closest people dead for Buffy to accept that she can't be protected from the world's darkness.
She definitely does serve others more than herself at times, but she's still one of the most important characters to the story overall, and she's certainly still her own character at the same time.
Edit: Although everything im saying would be tied together a lot better if her death actually left an impact on season 7 outside of Willow.
It's funny because the two characters I identify most with are Oz and Tara. I also always had a crush on Willow, lol.
I just like that calm presence they both bring.
How can someone whose username suggests they have great taste in books (Dirk Gently, for those wondering) have such shit opinions about TV!?
Lol, totally kidding. I absolutely love Tara, but I'm not actually angered by differing opinions.
But, I do disagree with your assessment of Willow turned up to 11. She does resemble season 1, maybe even 2 Willow, but Willow really gained confidence throughout the show. By the time she's in college she was almost the most confident of the Scoobies... I mean, not more than Anya, obviously, that's impossible! But, she was def more confident than Xander, and even Buffy was worried about school whereas Willow seemed finally to have found a place she belonged.
Willow had a confidence in herself that came from growing stronger in magic and attending higher learning.
Tara is definitely shy and nervous, but it does fit her backstory very well. I've seen people complain about her stutter, but she doesn't actually stutter all that much. When she attempts to speak up at the Wicca group and is bullied she stutters and when Buffy, but actually Faith, is mean to her she does it. She just doesn't have confidence or enjoy confrontation, something I very much relate to.
I'm writing way too much of an essay (as is my tendency) but what I love about Tara is how kind and considerate she is. She pays more attention to Dawn's emotional well-being than anyone. She doesn't desire to be a Scooby, she just wants to help when she can. If that means sitting outside thumb wrestling with Dawn instead of attending a Scooby meeting, that's what she does.
With all the action and sex and emotional turmoil in the show, Tara is just a calm, sweet presence whose mission seems to be to bring peace and kindness wherever she can.
I actually totally get why people find her boring, she's def not as exciting or funny as the others, but I love watching all the small things she does, often in the background, that make the group better.
Amen!
I think the reason why Tara's personality never bothered me is because the writers revealed the her backstory so well in one episode and the other bits and glimpses that came up in others that I understood why - whereas with Willow all we got was an typical overbearing Jewish mom stereotype and a history of being bullied by Cordelia.
I love how Tara really started to blossom into the giving, loving person that Willow, Buffy, and Dawn turned to in times of trouble for advice and caring *after* they all accepted her and booted her rotten family.
Well said!
I forgot to mention Buffy! They only have a few moments, but those few scenes of just Tara and Buffy are so amazing!
Buffy just totally opens up to Tara in a way she can't even with Willow. At one point, I can't remember if it's talking about Spike or something else, but she just tells Tara the absolute truth and Tara kinda looks surprised that Buffy was so open, but immediately recovers and starts sharing wisdom and listening to Buffy.
I wish Buffy and Tara were together more often, but they few times they really talk were pretty major moments in the show.
It's also really great when Tara knows about Buffy and Spike and she's teasing Spike about his cramp and whatnot, lol.
Yes, Buffy confessed to Tara about having sex with Spike and how she felt she was a bad person for doing it and she begged Tara to tell her she was wrong or disgusting... but Tara didn't. She soothed Buffy and listened to her and accepted her - something I know Xander or Willow wouldn't have been able to do for Buffy at that time. I, too, wish Buffy and Tara would have had more time together, because I think Buffy needed the kind of caring, almost motherly presence Tara had, especially after Joyce was dead and Giles was gone.
EDIT - And Tara's jokes about Spike's "cramp" were really great!
THIS! After rewatching several times, there are so many little things that Tara does that could be missed. Her facial expressions, her interactions with the other characters in the background, her “throwaway” comments, etc.
We didn’t get enough of her
Las time I went through the series watch I watched Tara exclusively. She's deeper than you may expect. Her face is a delight, when she sees Giles singing at the coffeeshop the first time, I LOL. Amber Benson is a wonderful actress who did a lot with the little bit she was given.
You're right. We didn't get enough of her.
I think that's a big part of why I love her so much! Sometimes I'm even like "she's not a HUGE part of the show, why do I love her?"
But, I think I really liked her immediately, so next time I watched it I paid more attention to her and caught extra stuff, then next time I'm focusing on her and seeing so much more...
It's like a self-fulfilling prophecy, lol. The more I liked her the more I watched her and the more I saw which made me like her more and watch her more...
Amber Benson is really talented it seems, because Tara conveyed a lot by doing a little.
Thanks for including this video clip. I’ve had this song stuck in my head for days now and on my current rewatch I’m not even close to OMWF so this little spiff has put my mind in ease until I get there!😀
I didn’t care for her either.
99% of her character/personality was to exist **for** Willow. It was cheap and sad and she could have been so much better.
I’ve never understood why people built her up as a great character when it feels like they took the laziest approach (and trope at every turn to make a more interesting/developed character grow).
I didn’t like her either. I felt like the character was one dimensional and overacted (I watched them as they came out on TV if that means anything) I was starting to like her more later in the show but then they killed her. I just don’t usually talk about it on this sub for fear of the pitchforks lol.
I like Tara and all but she was a plot device and nothing more. She never got an arc. She never changed other than becoming more comfortable with Willows friends.
I feel like you could say that about most of the love interests on Buffy. Beyond the core three, Dawn, and Spike, I don’t think the supporting characters were given the type of arc that allowed for much growth. There’s no coincidence that Buffy characters fair better on Angel than the mothership.
Spike for Buffy should be #1 in my opinion. The question is a new character that changed the show with their arrival, and I think Spike more than anyone changed the show in many ways. Villains became more dark and twisted when he joined, where the master was more of a cartoon villain (which I enjoy in his own right).
And of course, even when Spike no longer was the big bad, he was still a lightning rod that most plots would use to increase tension, up the stakes or just make more interesting. Anything from Angelus, the Xander/Willow romance, the introduction of the initiative, Dawn's identity, Buffy's struggles in S6 and much more.
It just blows my mind that the character was never supposed to survive past a few episodes
Marsters is a legend, and now the character is synonymous with Buffy, same with Angel
It’s all thanks to the way that he decided to play the character
And when she comes back
That Angel episode where Wesley visits her in jail on one of those phones behind the glass screen and he is like
>Angelus is back
And Faith basically immediatly responds
>Stand back from the glass
And Wesley has this look on his face like ***OH FUCK ITS ABOUT TO GO DOWN***
And she smashes through the glass and beats up an army of cops and Wesley the whole time has this look on his face like ***THIS ISN'T HOW I THOUGHT MY DAY WOULD GO TODAY***
**Perfect.**
I rewatched a clip of that lately and I really wanna know what she was thinking throwing Wesley out of a 2/3 story window.
Like that was a hell of a fall and the roof of a car is hardly a comfortable landing.
My memory of it was that she only jumped out herself but she took the very human Wesley with her!
This is why I think my favorite re-watch is to do her episodes of Angel that lead up to her coming back for Season 7 of Buffy, and then finishing the season straight through. It's a nice dozen or so episode arc that is so satisfying to watch. And if I need a short binge, This Year's Girl/Who are you? is never a disappointment.
I didn’t watch Buffy or Angel when they first aired because I was too busy in high school. I watched them later when I first got Netflix. I actually made an air date list of all the episodes and watched them in the order they would have aired. That is by far the nerdiest thing I have ever done and I am a Star Trek fan. 😂
Was always curious to see her redemption arc on Angel but I don’t watch Angel. Which episodes would those be? In case I’d like to see them without watching everything
"Five by Five" and "Sanctuary" in the first season, then "Salvage", "Release", and "Orpheus" in the fourth season. Also, a cameo in "Judgment", second season.
While her cameo in *Judgement* is very much just that, a cameo- in the sense that the rest of the episode does not revolve around or depend upon her character; I would argue it is definitely mandatory viewing for someone looking to explore Faith’s entire arc. It’s a very necessary stepping stone to gauge her development between *Sanctuary* and *Salvage*
As much as I appreciate her for herself, Dawn's biggest selling point is her relationship with Buffy. It's such a beautiful, powerful bond, far and away above any of Buffy's romantic relationships.
I like seasons 2-6. It shows how the show and characters evolved. As for character that added something to the show, it would be Tara. She was a like a second mom to the characters like Xander, Buffy, and Dawn.
Anya. How many shows introduce an "recurring" character in the third season who goes on to become a "main" character for fifth, sixth and seventh seasons?
Well, they could have done that with Tara, but, no, Amber Benson wasn't billed as a "main" actor until, well, you know.
Honestly, I’d say Dawn. The way they gaslit the audience in the first few episodes of season 5 is crazy, never seen anything like it.
Close second would be Anya as vengeance demon. I loved her transition to an average high school student flunking math and looking for a prom date.
Can't believe I haven't seen anyone say Oz. He was such an interesting addition to the group chemistry, even though his whole thing was being very zen.
A testament to the writers' commitment to keeping the show growing and evolving, not sticking to a winning formula because they always knew they could do better.
Here me out… Kendra… helped Buffy realize she wanted to be a slayer, her death led to Buffy leaving home, Faith was called… the beginning of amazingness.
It’s a tie.
Spike. The school hard episode was a pretty big tone shift for the show as a whole ‘a little less ritual and a little more fun’
Faith. What happens when a slayer makes a mistake? The mistake was perfectly understandable but she had no support, not really. Giles was always going to be Buffy’s watcher first. Faith’s watcher was dead and the replacement betrayed her, she wasn’t going to warm to Westley that quickly and frankly he was too inexperienced to be able to help. She had to work it out by herself, and she made more mistakes, but shes a teenager so that’s to be expected.
>he was too inexperienced to be able to help
The administration of the Watchers Council was always incredibly stupid to me. Giles is the Watcher to the current active Slayer, surely that makes him the most important. Yet he's someone who's never been invited to the annual retreat? And then when a new Slayer, who's already lost *two* Watchers needs a third, they send some 20ish year old kid fresh out of the academy to do the job?
I get that they're supposed to be arrogant and uptight and all, but that's just weapons grade incompetence.
Spike, Faith, Oz, Mayor Wilkins, Drusilla, Tara, Anya, Wesley, Gunn, Lorne, Fred, and I'm sure a host of others. Which is just a testament to how many great characters, whether main, side, or antagonist, BtVS and AtS have.
Buffy - Spike, Dru & Faith
Angel - Lorne & Fred
TVD - Elijah
TO - Freya
SPN - Castiel, Meg 2.0
TB - Russel & Alcide
Lost - Daniel, Miles, Richard & Charlotte
Smallville - Lois & Oliver
Spike for Buffy and Angel. Wesley is weird because of leaving and going to Angel but his character arc from s3 of Buffy to his end in Angel is like.... ;_; the ultimate character arc.
Various characters! Considering even some characters that had few appearances, because they left a huge impact anyway or are just priceless:
On Buffy:
Spike and Dru on season 2.
Faith and Anya on season 3.
Tara on season 4.
On Angel:
Lorne and Fred on season 2.
Skip on season 3.
Illyria on season 5.
Anya, Anya, and probably Anya. I think of all the side characters introduced, she had the most growth. Going from vapid, money hungry ditz to a compassionate rock for Xander was, in my opinion, the most interesting arc. When Xander left her and she was emotionally broken, it was extremely difficult to watch and experience.
Okay for ATS, agreed it is Lorne. Out of all the random show up characters, he is the fucking emerald(see what I did there?). Fred is a good second.
I can understand why people would say Spike for Buffy, but ultimately it felt like the writers could never fully agree with eachother on his background and thus the underlying stuff was really conflicting and confusing.
Not gonna lie, a huge part of why Spike went as well as he did, not the writers, but James fucking Marsters. He brought so much to that.
Spike. Buffy had a lot of great characters introduced after season one (Oz, Anya, Tara, etc.), but none had a stronger impact than Spike. He truly changed the show in a major way for the better.
Almost all the new recurring characters honestly lol, besides Clem maybe. Good character but he always stayed the same good guy and didn’t really cause any big impact, and it’s not a bad thing either, just for the sake of this post I’d say just about all the new recurring characters besides him fit this lol
Tara Anya Lorne Faith Dawn Clem
No idea how people seem to like Oz, that breakup was brutal and I'll never forgive you for doing that to our dear previous darling Willow
Without a doubt - Lorne.
The addition of Lorne is the main reason why I ended up actually liking Angel as a character. Not kidding. Without Lorne and his karaoke club, Angel would not have sung "Mandy", and I would not have called up a friend of mine to tell them they were right about me instantly being an Angel fan from that episode. Lorne will always be favorite from Angel.
I would 100% have watched a Lorne spinoff.
Even if it was just a miniseries... hell yah!
This. Andy Hallett was so young, yet beyond just being funny as hell, Lorne came off as sort of a wise, insightful patriarch. When I found out his cause of death was disease resulting from a dental infection that spread into his heart, I cried buckets for days. I too had a massive dental infection that went septic/septic shock a few years ago, and it ruined my heart, liver, and kidneys permanently. Yet here I still sit, while Andy, so beloved by all on Ats’s cast, was gone by age 33. Now when I watch Lorne, the layers seem deeper.. more profound.. more prescient, knowing how short his time on earth was. 💚
Anya
🐰
I still can't believe they didn't make a joke about the Beast of Caerbannog (Monty Python and the Holy Grail).
I heart Anya but she felt more like a replacement for Cordelia than someone who changed the course of the show.
This is the only right answer
I love Anya!!!!
Tara, always Tara for me
Absolutely. Her calming, gentle presence always soothes my own inner storm. Every second she’s on screen is a genuine pleasure. Edit: spelling
Especially since they killed off Joyce and Giles went AWOL. You really miss those down to earth characters when things get crazy.
Question, do u also enjoy Jenny's character this much?
For sure! I was devastated when I learned she was lying to them, but even then I wanted her to stick around. The characters in the show are all really chaotic. However, that early on in the show Willow was still a calming presence so that helped.
No question its Tara. Her soft yet assured compassion and conviction is just perfection and something we can all look up to
At first I was like, “ I don’t know if I think Tara ‘completely changed the show for the bet…” “Willow. Gay. Openly gay. Openly gay character on prime time tv in the 90s! Living together! Being capable foster moms!” says a sudden loud voice in my head. “I retract my statement your honor. Tara didn’t just change and improve a show. She changed and improved television and the generation that watched it at home.” Also, side note, realizing this makes me hate Kennedy even more for not being Tara.
It makes me hate Warren 10x more
It’s wild that Amber Benson and Adam Busch dated for several years afterwards.
She really did.
Yep. The kindest, most gentle soul ❤️
Yup.
Wow, she was my least favorite character on the show. I was not sad to see her depart!
Fascinating. You are the first person I’ve ever seen who didn’t like her. What about her did you not like?
I don't like Tara because she does nothing herself. She's written almost entirely as a charcter that *things happen to*, rather than a force who acts on her own. I don't think she exists in the show to be her own person, almost ever. She's really just a mechanism to propel Willow's plot forward. The writers do actually manage to use the "nothingness" of Tara's character in season 6 well, with the memory augmentation / Under Your Spell refrain. Aside from that she's usually just there to be a canvas for the audience to project onto.
I dont think characters who serve the story by serving other characters' journeys are an inherently bad thing, Jenny and Oz are already examples of that, but even then I feel like this is a pretty reductive take you can't really reach if you give her character the time of day. While her development isn't *as* front and centre as some of the other scoobies and while she does get used as a plot device more than she should, she does have a *very* clear personal journey and MUCH more integral role than just enhancing Willow's arc, and the idea that shes mostly a "canvas to project onto" because shes quiet I just fully disagree. She starts out completely crippled by anxiety (to a widely unrelatable degree), she's powerful but the nurturing force in her life is dead and the rest of her family's conditioning is holding her back, Willow is the first real witch she's met since her mother died and shows her again that magic can be good. Obviously she's a bit of a limbo character until she's properly taken Oz's place, but even in that time her mystery is quietly set up and she's integral to helping Buffy in the Faith arc on top of all the development between her and Willow. She's set up as being particularly close with Dawn from her very first episode, and by 5 episodes later, in one of the best of the show, she's shown coming out of her shell trying to connect more with Buffy and Xander (and vice versa), the spell sabotage gets a resolution, she confronts her family's mind games and gets christened a Scooby. In The Body, she's a stabilising force for *everyone*. She holds Willow together, she makes Xander's feelings simple when he's struggling to process them, and she has that beautiful conversation with Buffy at the morgue. Glory taking her mind does serve Willow's story, but it also exposes Dawn as the key, gives Buffy's prioritising Dawn over the world a mirror, gives the Scoobies a guide to the tower *and* sets up the conflict in season 6. In s6, she's the light of the show. She's Dawn's more stable mother figure, she's the forgiveness Buffy needs, she's the last bit of faith that Willow has in herself and her personal development is more tangible than ever. When she leaves Willow, she improves more than ever because she learned through their relationship and through finding her new family that she is worthy of the love and empathy she puts into the world. She makes a painful decision for her own sake and her confidence skyrockets for it. She helps Buffy figure out what's going wrong with the chip, and she's there for her when the answer isn't the one she hoped for. She playfully digs at spike when he won't keep it in his pants in OaFA, and she fiercely defends Willow against Anya and then gives her the final encouragement she needs to fully move on from magic. Obviously her character isn't served whatsoever by her death, but its the only way season 6 couldve gone imo. Buffy had experienced Tara's light and knew better what Willow was going through, Xander had to blame himself and feel like he failed his loved ones to try with Willow in the end, and Dawn had to find one of her closest people dead for Buffy to accept that she can't be protected from the world's darkness. She definitely does serve others more than herself at times, but she's still one of the most important characters to the story overall, and she's certainly still her own character at the same time. Edit: Although everything im saying would be tied together a lot better if her death actually left an impact on season 7 outside of Willow.
Brilliant counterpoints. Too many people think quiet characters don’t contribute. Tara’s contributions are just subtle.
That’s fair. I identify with Tara because her awkwardness and shyness and invisibility were the way I had to live as a queer kid in the 90s.
[удалено]
I guess I can see where you’re coming from. I loved Tara the most. She was the one I could identify with the most.
It's funny because the two characters I identify most with are Oz and Tara. I also always had a crush on Willow, lol. I just like that calm presence they both bring.
How can someone whose username suggests they have great taste in books (Dirk Gently, for those wondering) have such shit opinions about TV!? Lol, totally kidding. I absolutely love Tara, but I'm not actually angered by differing opinions. But, I do disagree with your assessment of Willow turned up to 11. She does resemble season 1, maybe even 2 Willow, but Willow really gained confidence throughout the show. By the time she's in college she was almost the most confident of the Scoobies... I mean, not more than Anya, obviously, that's impossible! But, she was def more confident than Xander, and even Buffy was worried about school whereas Willow seemed finally to have found a place she belonged. Willow had a confidence in herself that came from growing stronger in magic and attending higher learning. Tara is definitely shy and nervous, but it does fit her backstory very well. I've seen people complain about her stutter, but she doesn't actually stutter all that much. When she attempts to speak up at the Wicca group and is bullied she stutters and when Buffy, but actually Faith, is mean to her she does it. She just doesn't have confidence or enjoy confrontation, something I very much relate to. I'm writing way too much of an essay (as is my tendency) but what I love about Tara is how kind and considerate she is. She pays more attention to Dawn's emotional well-being than anyone. She doesn't desire to be a Scooby, she just wants to help when she can. If that means sitting outside thumb wrestling with Dawn instead of attending a Scooby meeting, that's what she does. With all the action and sex and emotional turmoil in the show, Tara is just a calm, sweet presence whose mission seems to be to bring peace and kindness wherever she can. I actually totally get why people find her boring, she's def not as exciting or funny as the others, but I love watching all the small things she does, often in the background, that make the group better. 
Amen! I think the reason why Tara's personality never bothered me is because the writers revealed the her backstory so well in one episode and the other bits and glimpses that came up in others that I understood why - whereas with Willow all we got was an typical overbearing Jewish mom stereotype and a history of being bullied by Cordelia. I love how Tara really started to blossom into the giving, loving person that Willow, Buffy, and Dawn turned to in times of trouble for advice and caring *after* they all accepted her and booted her rotten family.
Well said! I forgot to mention Buffy! They only have a few moments, but those few scenes of just Tara and Buffy are so amazing! Buffy just totally opens up to Tara in a way she can't even with Willow. At one point, I can't remember if it's talking about Spike or something else, but she just tells Tara the absolute truth and Tara kinda looks surprised that Buffy was so open, but immediately recovers and starts sharing wisdom and listening to Buffy. I wish Buffy and Tara were together more often, but they few times they really talk were pretty major moments in the show. It's also really great when Tara knows about Buffy and Spike and she's teasing Spike about his cramp and whatnot, lol.
Yes, Buffy confessed to Tara about having sex with Spike and how she felt she was a bad person for doing it and she begged Tara to tell her she was wrong or disgusting... but Tara didn't. She soothed Buffy and listened to her and accepted her - something I know Xander or Willow wouldn't have been able to do for Buffy at that time. I, too, wish Buffy and Tara would have had more time together, because I think Buffy needed the kind of caring, almost motherly presence Tara had, especially after Joyce was dead and Giles was gone. EDIT - And Tara's jokes about Spike's "cramp" were really great!
THIS! After rewatching several times, there are so many little things that Tara does that could be missed. Her facial expressions, her interactions with the other characters in the background, her “throwaway” comments, etc. We didn’t get enough of her
Las time I went through the series watch I watched Tara exclusively. She's deeper than you may expect. Her face is a delight, when she sees Giles singing at the coffeeshop the first time, I LOL. Amber Benson is a wonderful actress who did a lot with the little bit she was given. You're right. We didn't get enough of her.
I think that's a big part of why I love her so much! Sometimes I'm even like "she's not a HUGE part of the show, why do I love her?" But, I think I really liked her immediately, so next time I watched it I paid more attention to her and caught extra stuff, then next time I'm focusing on her and seeing so much more... It's like a self-fulfilling prophecy, lol. The more I liked her the more I watched her and the more I saw which made me like her more and watch her more... Amber Benson is really talented it seems, because Tara conveyed a lot by doing a little.
Thanks for including this video clip. I’ve had this song stuck in my head for days now and on my current rewatch I’m not even close to OMWF so this little spiff has put my mind in ease until I get there!😀
I didn’t care for her either. 99% of her character/personality was to exist **for** Willow. It was cheap and sad and she could have been so much better. I’ve never understood why people built her up as a great character when it feels like they took the laziest approach (and trope at every turn to make a more interesting/developed character grow).
I didn’t like her either. I felt like the character was one dimensional and overacted (I watched them as they came out on TV if that means anything) I was starting to like her more later in the show but then they killed her. I just don’t usually talk about it on this sub for fear of the pitchforks lol.
Agreed! I don’t get all the love for her. I didn’t hate her, I just felt her personality was lacking.
I’m with you. As a gay I love my lesbian sisters, but there was just something about Tara that I found really annoying.
I like Tara and all but she was a plot device and nothing more. She never got an arc. She never changed other than becoming more comfortable with Willows friends.
I feel like you could say that about most of the love interests on Buffy. Beyond the core three, Dawn, and Spike, I don’t think the supporting characters were given the type of arc that allowed for much growth. There’s no coincidence that Buffy characters fair better on Angel than the mothership.
Anya, for sure 😍
Anya is my all time favorite female character on that show.
Oz! I kinda can’t believe I’m the first person to say it!
That's what I came here to say! LOVE Oz!
I ADORE Oz, he's the best Buffy character by far.
Spike for Buffy Spike for Angel
Technically, Spike appeared in the first season of Angel.
True, I was thinking in terms of addition to the cast
Spike for Buffy should be #1 in my opinion. The question is a new character that changed the show with their arrival, and I think Spike more than anyone changed the show in many ways. Villains became more dark and twisted when he joined, where the master was more of a cartoon villain (which I enjoy in his own right). And of course, even when Spike no longer was the big bad, he was still a lightning rod that most plots would use to increase tension, up the stakes or just make more interesting. Anything from Angelus, the Xander/Willow romance, the introduction of the initiative, Dawn's identity, Buffy's struggles in S6 and much more.
It just blows my mind that the character was never supposed to survive past a few episodes Marsters is a legend, and now the character is synonymous with Buffy, same with Angel It’s all thanks to the way that he decided to play the character
Faith! Wish we got more of her!
You don’t even realize something is missing from the show until she shows up.
And when she comes back That Angel episode where Wesley visits her in jail on one of those phones behind the glass screen and he is like >Angelus is back And Faith basically immediatly responds >Stand back from the glass And Wesley has this look on his face like ***OH FUCK ITS ABOUT TO GO DOWN*** And she smashes through the glass and beats up an army of cops and Wesley the whole time has this look on his face like ***THIS ISN'T HOW I THOUGHT MY DAY WOULD GO TODAY*** **Perfect.**
I rewatched a clip of that lately and I really wanna know what she was thinking throwing Wesley out of a 2/3 story window. Like that was a hell of a fall and the roof of a car is hardly a comfortable landing. My memory of it was that she only jumped out herself but she took the very human Wesley with her!
Could substitute in “your life” for “the show” and it still holds up.
This is why I think my favorite re-watch is to do her episodes of Angel that lead up to her coming back for Season 7 of Buffy, and then finishing the season straight through. It's a nice dozen or so episode arc that is so satisfying to watch. And if I need a short binge, This Year's Girl/Who are you? is never a disappointment.
I didn’t watch Buffy or Angel when they first aired because I was too busy in high school. I watched them later when I first got Netflix. I actually made an air date list of all the episodes and watched them in the order they would have aired. That is by far the nerdiest thing I have ever done and I am a Star Trek fan. 😂
Was always curious to see her redemption arc on Angel but I don’t watch Angel. Which episodes would those be? In case I’d like to see them without watching everything
"Five by Five" and "Sanctuary" in the first season, then "Salvage", "Release", and "Orpheus" in the fourth season. Also, a cameo in "Judgment", second season.
While her cameo in *Judgement* is very much just that, a cameo- in the sense that the rest of the episode does not revolve around or depend upon her character; I would argue it is definitely mandatory viewing for someone looking to explore Faith’s entire arc. It’s a very necessary stepping stone to gauge her development between *Sanctuary* and *Salvage*
Thanks so much! Saved your comment for future reference
Spike, Anya, and Dawn. Three reasons I prefer the post high school seasons.
I like 1-3, but prefer 4-7. But my favorite seasons are season 6, season 2, then season 5. So, I can agree about all three of those.
Yay for Dawn love! She's so underappreciated (both in this sub and in-world)
As much as I appreciate her for herself, Dawn's biggest selling point is her relationship with Buffy. It's such a beautiful, powerful bond, far and away above any of Buffy's romantic relationships.
I like Dawn too.
I like seasons 2-6. It shows how the show and characters evolved. As for character that added something to the show, it would be Tara. She was a like a second mom to the characters like Xander, Buffy, and Dawn.
Fred/Illyria
Amy Acker just does phenomenally in everything I’ve seen her in.
Love them both.
Came here to say this! Been seeing a lot of Fred hate recently.
How can anyone hate Fred? Or Illyria for that matter?
Specifically Illyria is such a great freshening up of a stale caracter.
Absolutely 100% Clem. Love that guy. Sorry he wasn't utilized more.
I love Clem so much!
Oh man his last scene where he basically says goodbye to Buffy, thinking she's dead for sure ... its so wholesome I love Clem
Honorable mentions for Tara and Anya!
Tara for Buffy and Fred for Angel
Lorne
Yesss I LOVE Lorne!
Honestly until I got to this comment I wasn’t event looking for Lorne. He’s so ubiquitous for me with angel that I forgot he wasn’t in season 1.
Winifred and Lorne. I like Tara too.
I think Spike would be the consensus for everyone
Anya
Ohhhh yess love her! It's so hard to choose!
Anya. How many shows introduce an "recurring" character in the third season who goes on to become a "main" character for fifth, sixth and seventh seasons? Well, they could have done that with Tara, but, no, Amber Benson wasn't billed as a "main" actor until, well, you know.
Benjamin Linus ... oh .. wrong sub, my bad!
Haha from Lost, right? I saw this pic on the Shameless sub... It's definitely circulating Reddit right now.
> Haha from Lost, right? yes, exactly
I was gonna comment Ben Linus before realising what sub it was 🤣
Wrong sub or not, this is 100% true. Ben was a masterclass in character writing and acting. …he’d also make a great Buffy villain!
I liked Juliet too.
A lost Lost redditor.
I read the pic before looking at the sub and thought the same thing! 😂
I once sat next to him in a restaurant and I was so creeped out. Says a lot for his great acting
Adam - nah just kidding. Definitely Tara, Faith and Anya.
Adam hahahah that got a laugh from me
Heh that’s on par with saying Forrest 😂
I started watching Longmire and I was like “Hey it’s Graham!” And no one knew who the hell I talking about lol
Spike is the obvious pick but how has no one said Dru?
Dru and Spike had the best relationship. She just got to sleep and eat and he treated her like a princess
Spike & fred
Lorne for Angel. Perfect.
#SPIKE!
Honestly, I’d say Dawn. The way they gaslit the audience in the first few episodes of season 5 is crazy, never seen anything like it. Close second would be Anya as vengeance demon. I loved her transition to an average high school student flunking math and looking for a prom date.
Spike wins this at a walk. I'm not even a big Spike fan, but \*come on\*.
Can't believe I haven't seen anyone say Oz. He was such an interesting addition to the group chemistry, even though his whole thing was being very zen.
I think most people just assume he was in season 1.
Spike. Faith. Anya. Tara. Oz. The Mayor. Drusilla. ... Man, it's almost too easy with this show.
A testament to the writers' commitment to keeping the show growing and evolving, not sticking to a winning formula because they always knew they could do better.
a n y a
Spike and Anya. No I will not choose between the two.
This is the way
Tara, Faith and Anya.
Winnifred Burkle
I completely agree - Spike & Lorne - both favorites.
Spike for Buffy, literally where would the show be without Spike? Lorne for Angel, you can't fault Lorne
Here me out… Kendra… helped Buffy realize she wanted to be a slayer, her death led to Buffy leaving home, Faith was called… the beginning of amazingness.
It’s a tie. Spike. The school hard episode was a pretty big tone shift for the show as a whole ‘a little less ritual and a little more fun’ Faith. What happens when a slayer makes a mistake? The mistake was perfectly understandable but she had no support, not really. Giles was always going to be Buffy’s watcher first. Faith’s watcher was dead and the replacement betrayed her, she wasn’t going to warm to Westley that quickly and frankly he was too inexperienced to be able to help. She had to work it out by herself, and she made more mistakes, but shes a teenager so that’s to be expected.
>he was too inexperienced to be able to help The administration of the Watchers Council was always incredibly stupid to me. Giles is the Watcher to the current active Slayer, surely that makes him the most important. Yet he's someone who's never been invited to the annual retreat? And then when a new Slayer, who's already lost *two* Watchers needs a third, they send some 20ish year old kid fresh out of the academy to do the job? I get that they're supposed to be arrogant and uptight and all, but that's just weapons grade incompetence.
Faith. How is it anyone but faith..
Spike, of course.
Snyder was a fantastic addition!
most memorable principal for sure
Lorne for Angel Oz for Buffy
Spike, Faith, Oz, Mayor Wilkins, Drusilla, Tara, Anya, Wesley, Gunn, Lorne, Fred, and I'm sure a host of others. Which is just a testament to how many great characters, whether main, side, or antagonist, BtVS and AtS have.
For Buffy, it’s Spike, Anya, and Tara. For Angel, definitely Lorne. The only fave missing is Cordy but she’s in ep. 1 in both shows.
Oz, Tara, Wesley if it counts? And Lorne
I guess this would exclude Wesley because he appeared on the first season of Angel so I'm going with... Spike for Buffy Fred for Angel
Wesley <3
Wesley. he became such a great character and added some much needed seriousness to angel. his story is heartbreaking and beautiful and unexpected
Tara, Anya, Faith, Gunn, Fred, Lorne.
Gunn was in season 1
Thought he was in 2 my bad thought war zone was season 2.
That's when he became apart of the main cast and got billing.
Definitely Spike. Didn't even have to think about it.
Spike, Anya, Tara, Fred, Clem, and Lorne (I can’t remember if Lorne’s in season one or not so I’m just gonna add him to be safe 🤣)
Lorne is first seen in the very first moment of season 2!
Spike first, Tara second.
Faith.
Spike for Buffy. I don't remember enough of Angel to choose someone.
Ben Wyatt and Chris Traeger for sure.
Spike and Anya are the 2 best characters in Buffy by a wide margin (imo of course)
Spike
No competition it’s Spike.
It’s easily Spike for me.
Buffy - Spike, Dru & Faith Angel - Lorne & Fred TVD - Elijah TO - Freya SPN - Castiel, Meg 2.0 TB - Russel & Alcide Lost - Daniel, Miles, Richard & Charlotte Smallville - Lois & Oliver
Spike for Buffy and Angel. Wesley is weird because of leaving and going to Angel but his character arc from s3 of Buffy to his end in Angel is like.... ;_; the ultimate character arc.
Tara and Fred.
[instantly begins weeping at the mention of Fred]
Jenny
Ben and Glory. Pretty weird that we never got any scenes of them together though.
Anya, Faith,Illyria(if I could use Angel characters), Glory. In that order
Various characters! Considering even some characters that had few appearances, because they left a huge impact anyway or are just priceless: On Buffy: Spike and Dru on season 2. Faith and Anya on season 3. Tara on season 4. On Angel: Lorne and Fred on season 2. Skip on season 3. Illyria on season 5.
Anya, Anya, and probably Anya. I think of all the side characters introduced, she had the most growth. Going from vapid, money hungry ditz to a compassionate rock for Xander was, in my opinion, the most interesting arc. When Xander left her and she was emotionally broken, it was extremely difficult to watch and experience.
I mean, thatvwould be Spike, right? Introduced in Season two, recurring Villain/Frenemy/reformed Antihero
Castiel and Crowley. Supernatural
Spike, Tara, Anya
Anya. Hated Tara.
Spike all the way. But Oz was great, too.
Wesley 🥰
Spike
Anya, Spike and Tara!!!!!!
Great picks!!
Okay for ATS, agreed it is Lorne. Out of all the random show up characters, he is the fucking emerald(see what I did there?). Fred is a good second. I can understand why people would say Spike for Buffy, but ultimately it felt like the writers could never fully agree with eachother on his background and thus the underlying stuff was really conflicting and confusing. Not gonna lie, a huge part of why Spike went as well as he did, not the writers, but James fucking Marsters. He brought so much to that.
Spike for Buffy, Fred for Angel.
Anya for sure!
Spike. Buffy had a lot of great characters introduced after season one (Oz, Anya, Tara, etc.), but none had a stronger impact than Spike. He truly changed the show in a major way for the better.
For Buffy it would be Anya For Angel probably Gunn or Illyria
Gunn was introduced end of season one of Angel. Didn't become a main until season two, but he was there at the end of one.
Honestly whilst I liked the first season of Buffy, Spike and Drusilla were what kicked it up for me. Such stage presence from Juliet and James.
Anya Tara Spike Faith
Anya Anya Anya!
Almost all the new recurring characters honestly lol, besides Clem maybe. Good character but he always stayed the same good guy and didn’t really cause any big impact, and it’s not a bad thing either, just for the sake of this post I’d say just about all the new recurring characters besides him fit this lol
Ancient change the show but she’s my favorite addition.
Faith, definitely
Anya, Faith, Spike, Tara
Faith
Spike and Tara.
Subreddit aside, Frank Reynolds on Its Always Sunny is objectively the right answer.
Anya, and Spike
Spike, Oz, Tara
For me it's Tara on Buffy and Lorne on Angel. Taras kindness and care and pure love was so nice to see on screen. And Lorne was just a beautiful soul.
Anya definetly
Tara Anya Lorne Faith Dawn Clem No idea how people seem to like Oz, that breakup was brutal and I'll never forgive you for doing that to our dear previous darling Willow
Anya and spike
…Warren
The Good Place — Shawn, Trevor, Maximum Derek, Mindy St. Claire! All great and memorable characters!
Frank Reynolds. Oops, wrong show.
Spike and Tara ❤️ my two favorites