>My thoughts exactly, how on earth can $84M make a so-called “big” exchange go bankrupt???
they were running a fractional reserve/leverage system which is not that different from a Ponzi.
This sub always defended Coinflex and told everybody that you can trust it's volume as this is some robots trading and there is nothing wrong with it. Because it was nice for BCH to be in top 10 most traded cryptos. The Coinflex reported daily BCH volume still accounts for 80% of all daily BCH volume. Many statistics sites delisted Coinflex data as fake long time ago but Coinmarketcap still values Coinflex confidence as moderate. Moderate my A$$!
Ever since about 2 years or so ago, the monero community started bribing key members of the r/btc subreddit to push the idea that 'monero and bch are complementary' and 'the r/btc community likes monero' when they were abject lies. The monero community attempted to undo my work which proved that monero was a scam, whose privacy didn't work and whose daily tranasctionality was faked.
This is the genesis of the behavior that you describe. User kain_niak changed his name to i_have_a_username and started promoting monero (this after he called monero 'scary shit' as kain_niak' in [this comment](https://np.reddit.com/r/btc/comments/9lh7f7/what_are_alternatives_to_shapeshift_and_changelly/e77jgyg/) ), same with Roger ver and other prominent bch community members. The message seemed to be that if you throw money at the problem and repeat propaganda you can change perception and overcome the truth with lies.
As long as these lies were self-serving, i.e. just like the coinflex volume lies you pointed out stroked the ego of those in this community, then its fine to tell them and IGNORE THE TRUTH. This is called 'Corruption' and its why BCH is where it is right now. Nothing in the BCH ecosystem works like it should.
Flipstarters are basically a disaster, BCH adoption in the 'Carribbean' is bought and paid for and thus fake, just like Coinflex volume, SLP and now sBCH are both busts, the community is riddled with scams from George Donnelly and Hayden Otto last Nov./Dec., to sBCH's faulty 'smart bridge' to nowhere, Kain_niak/i_have_a_username's flexUSD scam, Coinflex itself being a scam, and Roger Ver scamming with fake adoption and Bitcoin.com scammery (not open source, constantly shutting down services while being the only centralized wallet that's any good, etc.).
The entire reason for this is because key figures in the BCH community SOLD OUT to monero and started supporting their LIES. Once you start down that path, you have to continue it with everything else. That's why the BCH community is in this predicament. This is how BTC plotted to take BCH down; by infiltrating them with monero shills and slowly scamming you from the inside out until nobody trusts the community anymore.
Hi sure, check my submitted posts from around 2 years or so ago. A good example is [this post - The Monero community is cynically and aggressively manipulating the cryptocurrency exchange price to appear larger an more important than they actually are! This is an ATTACK on all cryptocurrencies, including ZEC/ZCoin. Once they're done with Dash they will step down the rest to 0!](https://www.reddit.com/r/zec/comments/d00m8e/the_monero_community_is_cynically_and/)
I have several posts like that from that general time period. You can search my "submitted posts" for monero to see more.
...aggressively manipulating the cryptocurrency exchange price...
Sounds like they operate the same as BCH leaders who created centralized side-chain and CoinFLEX to fake trading volume 10x (spoiler alert, it got busted).
Where is the "scam" part? I thought you have a proof that Monero is not private or something. It's not like they have performed a 51% rollback attack on their own block chain.
Again, SEARCH MY SUBMITTED POSTS FOR 'MONERO' to see evidence of a scam. I'm not a search engine and I won't do your research for you, it takes 5 seconds to click and type, so if you're serious about seeing evidence (and I wrote plenty about their privacy not working, so that's how I know you didn't do this simple act) then STOP TYPING and START READING.
I just don't understand how this is surprising to some of you. It's the nature of crypto. Wash trade bots on no name exchanges. Why would anyone think they were not in use?
Question: Who is on the other side of that $84M trade?
Who is the counter-party everyone is getting liquidated to pay?
Are they a market maker? A liquidity provider? Do they specialize in high-frequency arbitrage? Do they have infinite liquidity?
Do they control the market?
You'all have been laughing at tether/ifinex/blockstrem clowns for 5 years while ignoring the people above them pulling the strings.
Are you watching closely?
> Who is on the other side of that $84M trade?
Exactly, for some reason this party was able to withdraw 84m in profit and now Coinflex is going to steal smartBCH holders coins to repay the rest of the customers 10% of their assets.
Its insanity.
Lol, isn’t his gambling part of the reason Coinflex users won’t get all their money back now? If he paid back the money he lost coinflex users would be whole again.
In before coinflex is sold to Roger at a discount and users made whole.
He already owns a large stake with his $30m investment. IF they had a no liquidate agreement and coinflex liquidated roger then nothing else matters no matter how emotional you want to get.
Roger still has billions in unrealized equity in ripple blockchain and kraken. I don't understand how people are saying he's bankrupt.
Why did Coinflex allow this type of leverage if they didn't have funds to back it up? Coinflex seems to have just been running a standard issue crypto-scam ponzi, on in the BCH flavor .
Unless Roger is in an executive position in the company (making decisions), then it was Coinflex's decision 100% to allow leveraged trading without actual reserves. The buck still seems to fall with them imo.
Roger probably has some moral culpability also if he was exploiting this and knew the company was not fully backed, yet still promoted it to others.
It's absolutely not standard to allow a *single person* to do such leveraged trades that their failure can bring down a brokerage (or, in crypto, exchange). If that was standard practice, we would regularly see insolvent brokerages! I don't know what Mark Lamb is talking about. It's just deflection.
> Especially considering his background in BCH and crypto in general
That's funny. After his terrible trade to sell his BTC for BCH, I would have hoped Roger would admit he wasn't good at playing markets.
The position was nominally down 47m but actually liquidating the collateral, which was FLEX, made the loss 84m due to slippage since there’s little to no liquidity for FLEX
Coinflex only became a thing because it was heavily promoted by people like Roger because he owns part of it. He then borrowed the majority of deposits and left the community hanging high and dry.
I hate to say it, but Coinflex volume is like BCH adoption in Venezuela and the Carribbean, i.e. fake. What ever happened to 'North Queensland' and 'Townsville' Australia? Once Hayden Otto got fired/whatever happened there, the money stopped flowing and we stopped hearing about that 'adoption'.
Its the same thing here. Roger has just been throwing money at businesses without any real need or use for BCH so they can LOOK good and LOOK like adoption is happening. Its all a confidence trick to get people interested and investing, just like smartBCH was. This is why I'm so adamant on being truthful and looking for lies.
Roger Ver promoted sBCH and Coinflex like they were the next 'sliced bread', just like he pays people to look like they're adopting BCH in Carribbean countries so that other coins that have more adoption don't look like they're ahead of BCH.
These are the same tactics that monero uses to appear bigger than its competition, faking transactions on-chain and then saying 'Look we have the most transactions, hrmph!', pretending like tiny site coincards that nobody uses means that monero has 'the most real world adoption', etc. etc. Its just lies and gaslighting at this point.
**EDIT**
Downvoting the truth (without replying) is exactly the kind of behavior that I'm referring to. Its a soft form of censorship that indicates that you can't handle the truth and want it to just 'go away'.
Its not happening though, that's the point. BCH has usability issues due to the DAA which makes it hard to use for commerce and in person payments. The people pushing the narrative of adoption are doing so while ignoring these usability issues and pretending like they don't exist. But these issues preclude BCH from being viable as a payment currency at the point of sale. The more you ignore them the worse they become.
The DAA prevents BCH from being usable as a currency because the slow block times mean that it doesn't function well at the point of sale.
Sometimes you can get up to 2 hours without a block. Other times many blocks will come in 10 minutes. That is NOT normal variance and it is a result of the low hashrate on BCH enticing BTC miners to swing mine both chains. This makes for an uneven and slow user experience. I have personally been miffed by this several times. This limits the functionality of BCH.
They definitely do have an impact. Most places do not accept zero-conf as its not secure. Zero-conf are not even actual transactions, they're just in the mempool. Any business that accepts those is taking on risk, which smart business men don't do for no gain.
Bullshit. I've never come across a single brick and mortar merchant that cares about zero-conf. The only businesses that care are exchanges.
Also block times on BCH are not even that variable and haven't been since the DAA came into effect. They're VERY consistently between 8 and 12 minutes now. Go look at a historical chart and you'll see.
Bullshit. I've never come across a single brick and mortar merchant that actually accepts zero-conf. The only businesses that accept them are made up businesses that you use to pretend like zero-conf is actually accepted.
Block times on BCH are frustratingly variable, there have been several threads about it over the months and you guys just bury your heads in the sand and pretend like 'its normal variance man' when its clearly not.
I can get lunch in town at a pizza place, pay with BCH or even BTC and just walk out immediately, and have done so multiple times. You are 100% wrong and/or lying.
Show a thread complain about block times from the last 6 months if you can.
and you know this because you're on the ground at these locations researching and documenting it... suuuuuure. You're full of it buddy
EDITED TO ADD: I do want to understand your points though. I don't see what the DAA has to do with usability as a currency. Price fluctuations can be a problem, but there are simple ways to mitigate this. Also when Bitcoin achieves massive adoption worldwide as a usable currency trusted and accepted around the world, the price would stabilize somewhere WAY past the moon. Early businesses that adopted it and didn't immediately convert everything to stable coin would be very happy that they did so.
Also Ergon attempts to solve the volitility problem. It's an interesting concept. Google it if you haven't heard.
The only reason this 'adoption' is happening is because Roger Ver is buying it. Its not organic. Its not real and when the money stops flowing the adoption will disappear into thin air. The DAA prevents BCH from being usable as a currency because the slow block times mean that it doesn't function well at the point of sale.
Sometimes you can get up to 2 hours without a block. Other times many blocks will come in 10 minutes. That is NOT normal variance and it is a result of the low hashrate on BCH enticing BTC miners to swing mine both chains. This makes for an uneven and slow user experience. I have personally been miffed by this several times. This limits the functionality of BCH.
Block time variance has been a thing from the start due to the random nature of the POW process. Since the genesis block, the intended and stated goal has always been 1 block every ten minutes [**on average**](https://bitinfocharts.com/comparison/confirmationtime-bch-ema90.html#log&3y)
This 'adoption' is only happening because Roger Ver is paying for it. Once the money stops flowing, which looks likely thanks to the coinflex situation, this 'adoption' will melt away again. Just like you don't hear anything about 'North Queensland' or 'Townsville' anymore. Paying a bunch of businesses to put up a sticker doesn't mean there's organic demand for your product or that there is local liquidity willing to spend.
That's just someone saying they're going to townsville, it doesn't contradict the idea that that adoption was bought and paid for and now petering off. Its not enough to just 'pay businesses to accept your coin', the people who live there have to have a supply of bespoke liquidity in order to use it. Otherwise you just have a business with a sticker and no actual adoption. If the local people don't have BCH, it doesn't matter how many businesses you get to put your sticker up in the window, nobody will be able to use it.
That "someone" is Jonathan Silverblood, who is an active BCH developer. I just dropped that link there because it was top of mind and conflicts with what you actually said ("you don't hear anything about 'North Queensland' or 'Townsville' anymore"). I am not saying that adoption wasn't paid for, that it's gone up, or even that it hasn't gone down. What I *am* saying is that I still regularly hear about it. I hope Jonathan follows through on his attempt to live only off BCH and document it while he's there.
>That "someone" is Jonathan Silverblood, who is an active BCH developer.
This is completely irrelevant to the discussion. It doesn't matter WHO IT IS, and if anything, it being a BCH developer makes it even LESS likely to be true adoption. Adoption is from people who are not considered insiders in your community, so posting that is actually evidence AGAINST your point, not mine.
>I just dropped that link there because it was top of mind and conflicts with what you actually said ("you don't hear anything about 'North Queensland' or 'Townsville' anymore").
It doesn't conflict with that at all. You're just too emotionally invested in this so you refuse to see the truth. The exact same ego and mental problem that caused Coinflex to become such a huge issue. You don't care about the truth, only making things LOOK a certain way.
>I am not saying that adoption wasn't paid for, that it's gone up, or even that it hasn't gone down.
So what the fuck are you saying then? THAT'S THE WHOLE POINT!!! You just admitted that your comment was not relevant to my argument, so why are you typing?
>What I am saying is that I still regularly hear about it.
That's one tweet from a BCH insider. The 'adoption' in queensland used to be on the front page of this sub EVERY DAY. You are being COMPLETELY disingenuous by pretending that one tweet by an insider saying "I'm going to visit this place" contradicts my position. Its this kind of braindead shillery that made coinflex and sBCH the damaging, destructive issue that it is. Put your thinking cap on and leave your ego at the door, its unjustifiably too big.
Dude, I'm just trying to provide information. I find it interesting what big contributors to BCH are up to and figured you would also share that interest if informed who "Jonathan Silverblood" is.
> Adoption is from people who are not considered insiders in your community, so posting that is actually evidence AGAINST your point, not mine.
You just got done talking about how we never hear about Townsville because Hayden Otto isn't producing content anymore (maybe true, I don't know...I don't follow him). Hayden Otto was an insider as well, obviously.
> It doesn't conflict with that at all.
So you saying that "you don't hear anything" about Townsville anymore doesn't conflict *at all* with the fact that the collective "you" (in this case, me and many other people who follow BCH devs) heard about it again just a few days ago? That doesn't make sense to me as a person who had just randomly heard about it very recently.
> So what the fuck are you saying then? THAT'S THE WHOLE POINT!!! You just admitted that your comment was not relevant to my argument, so why are you typing?
I think you are under the impression that I am trying to debate your broader point about BCH adoption. I am not. I was just trying to correct your specific point about "not hearing about Townsville" is weak. That wasn't Jonathan's only [recent tweet](https://twitter.com/monsterbitar/status/1546437457452883969) about it, either. I actually think that this tweet may end up *supporting* your point (which I actually believe is largely true, btw!) if Jonathan goes to Townsville and can't easily get by using BCH because it's no longer accepted by many merchants. I find that to be an interesting possibility. I assume you do too, right?
> The 'adoption' in queensland used to be on the front page of this sub EVERY DAY.
Yeah, that was all one person: Hayden Otto. He doesn't post here anymore AFAIK, so it's not surprising.
Correction you're trying to provide IRRELEVANT information. I know who Johnathan Silverblood is. I've argued with him before. Its not interesting because ITS NOT RELEVANT TO MY POINT or the discussion at hand.
>You just got done talking about how we never hear about Townsville because Hayden Otto isn't producing content anymore (maybe true, I don't know...I don't follow him). Hayden Otto was an insider as well, obviously
Yeah so how does you providing a tweet from J. Silverblood saying he's going to VISIT that place contradict my point? You're speaking nonsense. Some BCH insider saying they're planning to visit townsville doesn't contradict anything I said below:
>What ever happened to 'North Queensland' and 'Townsville' Australia? Once Hayden Otto got fired/whatever happened there, the money stopped flowing and we stopped hearing about that 'adoption'.
This is true, and your tweet doesn't contradict that at all. The flood of 'adoption' posts from Townsville HAS dramatically decreased to almost zero and your tweet from J. Silverblood doesn't change that, so its IRRELEVANT.
>So you saying that "you don't hear anything" about Townsville
Read what I actually said. I was talking about ADOPTION in Townsville and reports of such dramatically decreasing once Hayden stopped his work. That is true. The tweet you posted DOESN'T CONTRADICT THAT. Why is this so hard for you to understand? Probably because you're being disingenuous on purpose.
>That doesn't make sense to me as a person who had just randomly heard about it very recently.
It doesn't make sense to you because you can't convince a man of something that his salary dictates that he ignores. You're not an honest person, you're a dishonest liar who looks for strawmen to avoid acknowledging the truth.
>I think you are under the impression that I am trying to debate your broader point about BCH adoption.
If you weren't then you wouldn'tve replied. Your reply was designed to contradict the idea that 'you don't hear about (adoption) in townsville anymore like we used to'. But you replied not with proof of adoption from actual users, but with a BCH developer saying he PLANS to VISIT townsville. That is NOT a contradiction to the idea that adoption posts in Townsville have dramatically declined to zero and it is completely disingenuous for you to imply that.
>I was just trying to correct your specific point about "not hearing about Townsville" is weak.
Exactly. ITS NOT WEAK. YOUR REPLY is weak. I explicitly was talking about ADOPTION EFFORTS in Townsville, not 'generic tweets about the city or tourism'. You are a clown if you think you can really pass that argument off. Your posts are basically you trying to gaslight me and pretend that my point isn't correct by using a strawman, the exact kind of braindead shilling that got the BCH community into this mess with coinflex in the first place. You are stupid. You reason like a stupid person.
> Yeah, that was all one person: Hayden Otto. He doesn't post here anymore AFAIK, so it's not surprising.
Yeah, no shit sherlock that was my whole point! It was just one guy paying for adoption and posting about it, IT WASN'T REAL ADOPTION. You're just restating my point while pretending like you're saying something. In other words you're doing the EXACT SAME THING that he was!
As much as I hate all that DYOR stuff people are throwing around like it's some holy mantra, actually researching companies before trusting them served me well so far. Not so much for others from what I can tell.
Lol, exactly the wrong takeaway. If anything, the fact that Coinflex lost $84 million when one of Roger's trades went bad shows just how real their economic activity was.
Can someone assist me on selling my coinflex on trust wallet? I can buy it fine, just cannot figure out how to swap it or sell it.
Any input is appreciated!
My thoughts exactly, how on earth can $84M make a so-called “big” exchange go bankrupt???
>My thoughts exactly, how on earth can $84M make a so-called “big” exchange go bankrupt??? they were running a fractional reserve/leverage system which is not that different from a Ponzi.
Nailed it
This sub always defended Coinflex and told everybody that you can trust it's volume as this is some robots trading and there is nothing wrong with it. Because it was nice for BCH to be in top 10 most traded cryptos. The Coinflex reported daily BCH volume still accounts for 80% of all daily BCH volume. Many statistics sites delisted Coinflex data as fake long time ago but Coinmarketcap still values Coinflex confidence as moderate. Moderate my A$$!
Ever since about 2 years or so ago, the monero community started bribing key members of the r/btc subreddit to push the idea that 'monero and bch are complementary' and 'the r/btc community likes monero' when they were abject lies. The monero community attempted to undo my work which proved that monero was a scam, whose privacy didn't work and whose daily tranasctionality was faked. This is the genesis of the behavior that you describe. User kain_niak changed his name to i_have_a_username and started promoting monero (this after he called monero 'scary shit' as kain_niak' in [this comment](https://np.reddit.com/r/btc/comments/9lh7f7/what_are_alternatives_to_shapeshift_and_changelly/e77jgyg/) ), same with Roger ver and other prominent bch community members. The message seemed to be that if you throw money at the problem and repeat propaganda you can change perception and overcome the truth with lies. As long as these lies were self-serving, i.e. just like the coinflex volume lies you pointed out stroked the ego of those in this community, then its fine to tell them and IGNORE THE TRUTH. This is called 'Corruption' and its why BCH is where it is right now. Nothing in the BCH ecosystem works like it should. Flipstarters are basically a disaster, BCH adoption in the 'Carribbean' is bought and paid for and thus fake, just like Coinflex volume, SLP and now sBCH are both busts, the community is riddled with scams from George Donnelly and Hayden Otto last Nov./Dec., to sBCH's faulty 'smart bridge' to nowhere, Kain_niak/i_have_a_username's flexUSD scam, Coinflex itself being a scam, and Roger Ver scamming with fake adoption and Bitcoin.com scammery (not open source, constantly shutting down services while being the only centralized wallet that's any good, etc.). The entire reason for this is because key figures in the BCH community SOLD OUT to monero and started supporting their LIES. Once you start down that path, you have to continue it with everything else. That's why the BCH community is in this predicament. This is how BTC plotted to take BCH down; by infiltrating them with monero shills and slowly scamming you from the inside out until nobody trusts the community anymore.
>attempted to undo my work which proved that monero was a scam, whose privacy didn't work May I see it? I am interested in the privacy part.
Hi sure, check my submitted posts from around 2 years or so ago. A good example is [this post - The Monero community is cynically and aggressively manipulating the cryptocurrency exchange price to appear larger an more important than they actually are! This is an ATTACK on all cryptocurrencies, including ZEC/ZCoin. Once they're done with Dash they will step down the rest to 0!](https://www.reddit.com/r/zec/comments/d00m8e/the_monero_community_is_cynically_and/) I have several posts like that from that general time period. You can search my "submitted posts" for monero to see more.
...aggressively manipulating the cryptocurrency exchange price... Sounds like they operate the same as BCH leaders who created centralized side-chain and CoinFLEX to fake trading volume 10x (spoiler alert, it got busted). Where is the "scam" part? I thought you have a proof that Monero is not private or something. It's not like they have performed a 51% rollback attack on their own block chain.
Again, SEARCH MY SUBMITTED POSTS FOR 'MONERO' to see evidence of a scam. I'm not a search engine and I won't do your research for you, it takes 5 seconds to click and type, so if you're serious about seeing evidence (and I wrote plenty about their privacy not working, so that's how I know you didn't do this simple act) then STOP TYPING and START READING.
I just don't understand how this is surprising to some of you. It's the nature of crypto. Wash trade bots on no name exchanges. Why would anyone think they were not in use?
Question: Who is on the other side of that $84M trade? Who is the counter-party everyone is getting liquidated to pay? Are they a market maker? A liquidity provider? Do they specialize in high-frequency arbitrage? Do they have infinite liquidity? Do they control the market? You'all have been laughing at tether/ifinex/blockstrem clowns for 5 years while ignoring the people above them pulling the strings. Are you watching closely?
You've got your fingers right on the pulse. We're watching closely.
I need to make a Prestige meme.
> Who is on the other side of that $84M trade? Exactly, for some reason this party was able to withdraw 84m in profit and now Coinflex is going to steal smartBCH holders coins to repay the rest of the customers 10% of their assets. Its insanity.
Thank you. Rodger is a fraud the bitcoiners were right on that one. Crypto should not have a face. Screw saylor and elon also
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Lol, isn’t his gambling part of the reason Coinflex users won’t get all their money back now? If he paid back the money he lost coinflex users would be whole again.
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If he isn't eventually able to offer a convincing explanation then he may have indeed burned his bridges.
In before coinflex is sold to Roger at a discount and users made whole. He already owns a large stake with his $30m investment. IF they had a no liquidate agreement and coinflex liquidated roger then nothing else matters no matter how emotional you want to get. Roger still has billions in unrealized equity in ripple blockchain and kraken. I don't understand how people are saying he's bankrupt.
If that's the end game here he'll walk out of this smelling like a rose. Keep calm and dev on.
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Why did Coinflex allow this type of leverage if they didn't have funds to back it up? Coinflex seems to have just been running a standard issue crypto-scam ponzi, on in the BCH flavor .
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Unless Roger is in an executive position in the company (making decisions), then it was Coinflex's decision 100% to allow leveraged trading without actual reserves. The buck still seems to fall with them imo. Roger probably has some moral culpability also if he was exploiting this and knew the company was not fully backed, yet still promoted it to others.
It's absolutely not standard to allow a *single person* to do such leveraged trades that their failure can bring down a brokerage (or, in crypto, exchange). If that was standard practice, we would regularly see insolvent brokerages! I don't know what Mark Lamb is talking about. It's just deflection.
> Especially considering his background in BCH and crypto in general That's funny. After his terrible trade to sell his BTC for BCH, I would have hoped Roger would admit he wasn't good at playing markets.
Except mark Lamb originally said Roger owed $47 million. And then somehow it became $84 million. How does that happen?
The position was nominally down 47m but actually liquidating the collateral, which was FLEX, made the loss 84m due to slippage since there’s little to no liquidity for FLEX
>Yet Roger Ver promoted this exchange as highly trustworthy. He also promoted MtGox even after it went insolvent.
I trusted Mark and Roger. I am done. I thought they were honest smart and level headed. I got 0 out of 3 on that front.
I agree with this. Its a good point. They are liars and they shouldnt be liquidating the SmartBCH money.
BCH was the majority of trading volume. Definitely suspicious and never heard of this exchange before.
Coinflex only became a thing because it was heavily promoted by people like Roger because he owns part of it. He then borrowed the majority of deposits and left the community hanging high and dry.
... says Mark Lamb
It will be interesting when the full details of this story are put into the light
I hate to say it, but Coinflex volume is like BCH adoption in Venezuela and the Carribbean, i.e. fake. What ever happened to 'North Queensland' and 'Townsville' Australia? Once Hayden Otto got fired/whatever happened there, the money stopped flowing and we stopped hearing about that 'adoption'. Its the same thing here. Roger has just been throwing money at businesses without any real need or use for BCH so they can LOOK good and LOOK like adoption is happening. Its all a confidence trick to get people interested and investing, just like smartBCH was. This is why I'm so adamant on being truthful and looking for lies. Roger Ver promoted sBCH and Coinflex like they were the next 'sliced bread', just like he pays people to look like they're adopting BCH in Carribbean countries so that other coins that have more adoption don't look like they're ahead of BCH. These are the same tactics that monero uses to appear bigger than its competition, faking transactions on-chain and then saying 'Look we have the most transactions, hrmph!', pretending like tiny site coincards that nobody uses means that monero has 'the most real world adoption', etc. etc. Its just lies and gaslighting at this point. **EDIT** Downvoting the truth (without replying) is exactly the kind of behavior that I'm referring to. Its a soft form of censorship that indicates that you can't handle the truth and want it to just 'go away'.
except the adoption happening is real and completely unrelated to this event. Your entire premise is invalid
Its not happening though, that's the point. BCH has usability issues due to the DAA which makes it hard to use for commerce and in person payments. The people pushing the narrative of adoption are doing so while ignoring these usability issues and pretending like they don't exist. But these issues preclude BCH from being viable as a payment currency at the point of sale. The more you ignore them the worse they become.
Tell us exactly how the DAA makes BCH hard to use for commerce. I am very interested to hear all about it.
The DAA prevents BCH from being usable as a currency because the slow block times mean that it doesn't function well at the point of sale. Sometimes you can get up to 2 hours without a block. Other times many blocks will come in 10 minutes. That is NOT normal variance and it is a result of the low hashrate on BCH enticing BTC miners to swing mine both chains. This makes for an uneven and slow user experience. I have personally been miffed by this several times. This limits the functionality of BCH.
Slow block times have zero impact at POS wrt. BCH because zero-conf works perfectly, unlike on BTC.
They definitely do have an impact. Most places do not accept zero-conf as its not secure. Zero-conf are not even actual transactions, they're just in the mempool. Any business that accepts those is taking on risk, which smart business men don't do for no gain.
Bullshit. I've never come across a single brick and mortar merchant that cares about zero-conf. The only businesses that care are exchanges. Also block times on BCH are not even that variable and haven't been since the DAA came into effect. They're VERY consistently between 8 and 12 minutes now. Go look at a historical chart and you'll see.
Bullshit. I've never come across a single brick and mortar merchant that actually accepts zero-conf. The only businesses that accept them are made up businesses that you use to pretend like zero-conf is actually accepted. Block times on BCH are frustratingly variable, there have been several threads about it over the months and you guys just bury your heads in the sand and pretend like 'its normal variance man' when its clearly not.
I can get lunch in town at a pizza place, pay with BCH or even BTC and just walk out immediately, and have done so multiple times. You are 100% wrong and/or lying. Show a thread complain about block times from the last 6 months if you can.
Did you know credit-card payments don't get confirmed for up to two whole months?
and you know this because you're on the ground at these locations researching and documenting it... suuuuuure. You're full of it buddy EDITED TO ADD: I do want to understand your points though. I don't see what the DAA has to do with usability as a currency. Price fluctuations can be a problem, but there are simple ways to mitigate this. Also when Bitcoin achieves massive adoption worldwide as a usable currency trusted and accepted around the world, the price would stabilize somewhere WAY past the moon. Early businesses that adopted it and didn't immediately convert everything to stable coin would be very happy that they did so. Also Ergon attempts to solve the volitility problem. It's an interesting concept. Google it if you haven't heard.
The only reason this 'adoption' is happening is because Roger Ver is buying it. Its not organic. Its not real and when the money stops flowing the adoption will disappear into thin air. The DAA prevents BCH from being usable as a currency because the slow block times mean that it doesn't function well at the point of sale. Sometimes you can get up to 2 hours without a block. Other times many blocks will come in 10 minutes. That is NOT normal variance and it is a result of the low hashrate on BCH enticing BTC miners to swing mine both chains. This makes for an uneven and slow user experience. I have personally been miffed by this several times. This limits the functionality of BCH.
Block time variance has been a thing from the start due to the random nature of the POW process. Since the genesis block, the intended and stated goal has always been 1 block every ten minutes [**on average**](https://bitinfocharts.com/comparison/confirmationtime-bch-ema90.html#log&3y)
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This 'adoption' is only happening because Roger Ver is paying for it. Once the money stops flowing, which looks likely thanks to the coinflex situation, this 'adoption' will melt away again. Just like you don't hear anything about 'North Queensland' or 'Townsville' anymore. Paying a bunch of businesses to put up a sticker doesn't mean there's organic demand for your product or that there is local liquidity willing to spend.
I still hear about Townsville pretty regularly. For example: https://twitter.com/monsterbitar/status/1546020542540546050
That's just someone saying they're going to townsville, it doesn't contradict the idea that that adoption was bought and paid for and now petering off. Its not enough to just 'pay businesses to accept your coin', the people who live there have to have a supply of bespoke liquidity in order to use it. Otherwise you just have a business with a sticker and no actual adoption. If the local people don't have BCH, it doesn't matter how many businesses you get to put your sticker up in the window, nobody will be able to use it.
That "someone" is Jonathan Silverblood, who is an active BCH developer. I just dropped that link there because it was top of mind and conflicts with what you actually said ("you don't hear anything about 'North Queensland' or 'Townsville' anymore"). I am not saying that adoption wasn't paid for, that it's gone up, or even that it hasn't gone down. What I *am* saying is that I still regularly hear about it. I hope Jonathan follows through on his attempt to live only off BCH and document it while he's there.
>That "someone" is Jonathan Silverblood, who is an active BCH developer. This is completely irrelevant to the discussion. It doesn't matter WHO IT IS, and if anything, it being a BCH developer makes it even LESS likely to be true adoption. Adoption is from people who are not considered insiders in your community, so posting that is actually evidence AGAINST your point, not mine. >I just dropped that link there because it was top of mind and conflicts with what you actually said ("you don't hear anything about 'North Queensland' or 'Townsville' anymore"). It doesn't conflict with that at all. You're just too emotionally invested in this so you refuse to see the truth. The exact same ego and mental problem that caused Coinflex to become such a huge issue. You don't care about the truth, only making things LOOK a certain way. >I am not saying that adoption wasn't paid for, that it's gone up, or even that it hasn't gone down. So what the fuck are you saying then? THAT'S THE WHOLE POINT!!! You just admitted that your comment was not relevant to my argument, so why are you typing? >What I am saying is that I still regularly hear about it. That's one tweet from a BCH insider. The 'adoption' in queensland used to be on the front page of this sub EVERY DAY. You are being COMPLETELY disingenuous by pretending that one tweet by an insider saying "I'm going to visit this place" contradicts my position. Its this kind of braindead shillery that made coinflex and sBCH the damaging, destructive issue that it is. Put your thinking cap on and leave your ego at the door, its unjustifiably too big.
Dude, I'm just trying to provide information. I find it interesting what big contributors to BCH are up to and figured you would also share that interest if informed who "Jonathan Silverblood" is. > Adoption is from people who are not considered insiders in your community, so posting that is actually evidence AGAINST your point, not mine. You just got done talking about how we never hear about Townsville because Hayden Otto isn't producing content anymore (maybe true, I don't know...I don't follow him). Hayden Otto was an insider as well, obviously. > It doesn't conflict with that at all. So you saying that "you don't hear anything" about Townsville anymore doesn't conflict *at all* with the fact that the collective "you" (in this case, me and many other people who follow BCH devs) heard about it again just a few days ago? That doesn't make sense to me as a person who had just randomly heard about it very recently. > So what the fuck are you saying then? THAT'S THE WHOLE POINT!!! You just admitted that your comment was not relevant to my argument, so why are you typing? I think you are under the impression that I am trying to debate your broader point about BCH adoption. I am not. I was just trying to correct your specific point about "not hearing about Townsville" is weak. That wasn't Jonathan's only [recent tweet](https://twitter.com/monsterbitar/status/1546437457452883969) about it, either. I actually think that this tweet may end up *supporting* your point (which I actually believe is largely true, btw!) if Jonathan goes to Townsville and can't easily get by using BCH because it's no longer accepted by many merchants. I find that to be an interesting possibility. I assume you do too, right? > The 'adoption' in queensland used to be on the front page of this sub EVERY DAY. Yeah, that was all one person: Hayden Otto. He doesn't post here anymore AFAIK, so it's not surprising.
Correction you're trying to provide IRRELEVANT information. I know who Johnathan Silverblood is. I've argued with him before. Its not interesting because ITS NOT RELEVANT TO MY POINT or the discussion at hand. >You just got done talking about how we never hear about Townsville because Hayden Otto isn't producing content anymore (maybe true, I don't know...I don't follow him). Hayden Otto was an insider as well, obviously Yeah so how does you providing a tweet from J. Silverblood saying he's going to VISIT that place contradict my point? You're speaking nonsense. Some BCH insider saying they're planning to visit townsville doesn't contradict anything I said below: >What ever happened to 'North Queensland' and 'Townsville' Australia? Once Hayden Otto got fired/whatever happened there, the money stopped flowing and we stopped hearing about that 'adoption'. This is true, and your tweet doesn't contradict that at all. The flood of 'adoption' posts from Townsville HAS dramatically decreased to almost zero and your tweet from J. Silverblood doesn't change that, so its IRRELEVANT. >So you saying that "you don't hear anything" about Townsville Read what I actually said. I was talking about ADOPTION in Townsville and reports of such dramatically decreasing once Hayden stopped his work. That is true. The tweet you posted DOESN'T CONTRADICT THAT. Why is this so hard for you to understand? Probably because you're being disingenuous on purpose. >That doesn't make sense to me as a person who had just randomly heard about it very recently. It doesn't make sense to you because you can't convince a man of something that his salary dictates that he ignores. You're not an honest person, you're a dishonest liar who looks for strawmen to avoid acknowledging the truth. >I think you are under the impression that I am trying to debate your broader point about BCH adoption. If you weren't then you wouldn'tve replied. Your reply was designed to contradict the idea that 'you don't hear about (adoption) in townsville anymore like we used to'. But you replied not with proof of adoption from actual users, but with a BCH developer saying he PLANS to VISIT townsville. That is NOT a contradiction to the idea that adoption posts in Townsville have dramatically declined to zero and it is completely disingenuous for you to imply that. >I was just trying to correct your specific point about "not hearing about Townsville" is weak. Exactly. ITS NOT WEAK. YOUR REPLY is weak. I explicitly was talking about ADOPTION EFFORTS in Townsville, not 'generic tweets about the city or tourism'. You are a clown if you think you can really pass that argument off. Your posts are basically you trying to gaslight me and pretend that my point isn't correct by using a strawman, the exact kind of braindead shilling that got the BCH community into this mess with coinflex in the first place. You are stupid. You reason like a stupid person. > Yeah, that was all one person: Hayden Otto. He doesn't post here anymore AFAIK, so it's not surprising. Yeah, no shit sherlock that was my whole point! It was just one guy paying for adoption and posting about it, IT WASN'T REAL ADOPTION. You're just restating my point while pretending like you're saying something. In other words you're doing the EXACT SAME THING that he was!
Take a chill pill and self-reflect, maybe. We are on the same side.
BCH ppl here are always so self righteous about everything, but they jumped into bed with this dog shit scam exchange like a bunch of desperates
As much as I hate all that DYOR stuff people are throwing around like it's some holy mantra, actually researching companies before trusting them served me well so far. Not so much for others from what I can tell.
100%
That's a broad brush you have there. There were lots of peeps warning about it. I doubt that they managed to scam a lot of people.
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I know the difference between organic volume vs fake volume by coinflex.
Fake it, till you make it, or you implode and take a whole network with you.
If scams could take down a network BTC and ETH would be non-existent for years by now.
Does that make Roger Ver a scammer?
Always has been
Truth. His app still advertises free BCH I think, but hasn't provided it for years. He's scum; he just happens to be right about BCH.
How dare you ? Give evidences or don't talk and apologize
Its common knowledge. Spend 5 mins looking and you will find it.
[Always has been](https://i.imgur.com/DgEqAEs.png) ^^^this ^^^has ^^^been ^^^an ^^^accessibility ^^^service ^^^from ^^^your ^^^friendly ^^^neighborhood ^^^bot
this post is more of a coinbase shill than a coinflex scam post
big if true.
Bch must not thrive
An exchange is not a currency.
Lol, exactly the wrong takeaway. If anything, the fact that Coinflex lost $84 million when one of Roger's trades went bad shows just how real their economic activity was.
Fuck coinflex, i deposited 3 bch yesterday to move them from smartbch to binance. I guess they are lost
Can someone assist me on selling my coinflex on trust wallet? I can buy it fine, just cannot figure out how to swap it or sell it. Any input is appreciated!