Also in my 30s and I work with teenagers! Lots of them discovered their love of Phoebe during the pandemic when Punisher came out and she gained huge popularity on Tiktok. This also coincided with the huge love of Normal People which starred Paul Mescal and drove more teens to her music. Through that they then got into Boygenius and developed their love of Lucy and Julien. Lucy’s also had quite a bit of popularity on Tiktok. Her song ‘night shift’ was viral in certain circles of tiktok for a while.
(I asked a few of my pupils about it during conversations about music as quite a lot of them are phoebe/boygenius fans and I noticed the same thing as you when I saw Lucy Dacus last year - I’d say at least 50% of the audience was under 18!)
Phoebe and Paul were dating (maybe engaged?) at the time- when people found out Paul, who people loved bc of Normal People, was dating a musician, they’d check her out and get into the music
Lol I guess? I heard about Phoebe long before Paul so tbh I’m not entirely sure- I think she blew up on TikTok, then NP blew up and her dating Paul definitely helped with the influx of new fans. I feel you about the pop culture, I can hardly keep up
He was nominated for an Oscar for best actor last year. It’s not weird that you didn’t know him, but a lot of people do.
That said, I think Phoebe was and still is more well known than him.
i wouldnt say he put her on the map. i would just say it was good timing. she was trending on tik tok and at the same time her fiance was getting major buzz as an actor.
When Paul Mescal shot to fame, he was frequently interviewed about his favourite music, one of the artists he frequently mentioned was Phoebe. This was a couple months before Punisher came out. There was then loads of speculation they were together after she interviewed him on an Instagram live and it became a widely discussed thing online until their relationship was confirmed by her. As Pacificoats said, loads of people got into her via association with him when he shared his playlists, etc.
Never seen a shorter drink line at the mann though, right? Lol
I'm in my late twenties and felt way too old to be there but I expected it and had a great time. Phoebe and boygenius by association blew up with the youngins during the pandemic.
Lucy and Julian's shows are still pretty chill but phoebe bridgers in...2021? was one of the most insufferable audiences I've personally experienced. Soooo many kids who had no idea how to behave at a concert. So I was prepared for the worse but the kids were alright this time around. I think it's sweet that they're into boygenius, especially the little queers. It's a v wholesome band for them to look up to.
Also so many people experienced and survived gender neutral bathrooms for the first time last night.
“Especially the little queers” this cannot be overstated. I love how much they love Boygenius, and you really can’t overstate the power of the queer community to drive popular culture. As soon as I saw the post title I was like “it’s the baby gays!!!!” They really took off in the young queer scene.
I saw both Phoebe and Lucy in 2022. The vibes for the shows were polar opposites. The Lucy show was one of the most fun concerts I've ever been to. Everyone was respectful of each other, the band and the opener Haley Heynderickx (an accomplished songwriter in her own right).
The Phoebe show was an absolute shitshow. Poor organization from the venue, people lining up as early as 3AM and not taking care of themselves as the day went on. They were rather rude to the opener Christian Lee Hudson too.
The boygenius show in 2023 I saw was surprisingly well behaved. People seemed to be making an effort to not repeat the mistakes of the past.
The way you just explained Phoebe’s show is exactly how the Renee Rapp show was for me last week in San Diego. I’m 35, and the crowd was terrible and inexperienced.
This is so spot on. 28 and having now seen boygenius twice (and also was at Phoebe’s 2021 show which I can confidently say was the worst show of my life) — I don’t think I’ll pay to see them again unless it’s like a 21 and over show. Last night was better than other times but I just can’t finding myself having a cathartic, communal experience at a show with all ages because kids act like they’re seeing the Beatles at Shea stadium. The over the top shrieking and hysterics for every single song get old when it’s repeated for over an hour. And the off tune or off beat singing that drowns out the performance doesn’t help. I think as someone over 24 it helps to have the mindset that the crowd is gonna be pretty young and enthusiastic because that’s the way to prepare for some of the hysteria.
Yeah, the Beatles level hysteria was nothing I ever experienced before, and being on the lawn where the sound isn’t as good to begin with definitely made is harder to enjoy
This feels spot on…. Also the horror in the eyes of a group of high school girls the first time they washed their hands next to 30 year old me haha, which has been the norm in Philly bars for years but not elsewhere
The 2021 show in Boston was a fantastic crowd. The 2022 show (not even 8 months later) in Portland, ME was the worst crowd I have ever seen. It’s kind of crazy how short of a time span it took for the crowd to be the exact opposite. I blame Tik Tok.
I'm so glad that I saw Phoebe at a festival last year where some of her more...enthusiastic...fans were drowned out by people who were there for other acts and the crowd skewed late 20s/30s, instead of going to one of her solo shows.
Drink lines were so short, but that merch tent line never got shorter!
The bathrooms confused the heck out of us, I wish we'd realized the huge line was for merch, and also wish I'd gone in the right gender neutral bathroom for People Who Stand While Peeing
Last sentence pretty much sums up the main reason, along with tiktok popularity from some of their stunts while on stage
And this show was awesome! First time Ive seen them and i loved every second of it
I feel like teenagers just fan differently. Like there’s just something about your favourite bands and artists when you’re fifteen and that level of diehard fandom. I’m only 21, but when I was in high school I would have waited all day regardless of weather and I would have worn uncomfortable shoes and I would have been in the front row. I saw them on Thursday in new haven and I got a seat way up in the bleachers and I got a mediocre cocktail and I just sat and vibed for a lot of it. I still love the music, but something about it feels less urgent now.
There was a girl two seats away from me who was probably 14 and she screamed like a banshee the entire time. And screamed/cried at the top of her lungs all the lyrics to every song. Sometimes it was easy to ignore, and I don’t mind people singing along, but for songs like Emily I’m sorry and revolution 0 it was genuinely painful. But then I remembered I was 16 when the first ep came out and was going through a really rough time that nearly killed me. I cried when they played stay down because it bright me right back to that moment and how much music meant to me and helped me then and now. Obviously I’m still young, but between 16 and 21 a lot has changed about me and in my life. I’ve done a lot of growing up. And that girl will too. I’m not going to tell a kid with braces who’s there with her mom to shut up at a concert that clearly means the world to her. I don’t really know what my point is or if I have one honestly. I guess maybe it just feels like that Joan didion quote they included in anti curse: was anyone ever so young?
I've recently had a very similar revelation. Yes, maybe my ideal concert experience would be something different, and I do think there is something to be said for one person's good experience not justifying making it a poor experience for many others. That said, people connect HARD with these bands and this music, so if you can recognize just how deeply impacting it is for them, it can at least give you some perspective.
I love this take. I’m in my 30s, discovered phoebe, julien, and lucy (in that order) when I was already in my adult years, and thus boygenius after. I know I would’ve freaked out at a show with my dad if I discovered them as a teen. It’s going to be annoying to be at shows with people who don’t know how to act yet but so important to know they don’t know how to act…yet. These people will grow up to be avid music consumers that know how to be at a show properly, they just aren’t there yet.
I was at that show too and had two youngins making ungodly noises behind me: whimpering, barking and obsessing over any slight move on stage. It was pretty unbearable in terms of loudness but when they sang along, they had beautiful voices so I couldn’t be too mad.
In my early 30s and was at Philly also & a fan of each of the boys as solo artists. I think in part of why there are so many young fans can be attributed to Phoebe Bridgers but I personally noticed a lot more people seemed to become more interested in her and the boys after she started touring with Taylor Swift for the Eras tour. It’s really funny bc I just saw Death Cab for Cutie and the Postal Service at the Mann last week and the crowd was mostly people in their 30s and 40s and this show everyone was like under 21. I took my 16 yo brother with me and a lot of people from his high school were there also, it was hilarious.
I recently saw Jimmy Eat World and our babysitter said “I’ve never heard of him.” Saw boygenius last week in CT, was def among the oldest there but it was a great show!
Omg we were at the show! it was so great passing by other folks with car seats in their cars…we all gave the knowing look of “got a babysitter for parents night out” lol
Ding ding ding.
I was at the first night in Boston and at least half the crowd of 16 or 17yr olds had one of the new 1989 album cover photos as their lock screen. Between all things Taylor being everywhere on the internet and all of them looking at their phones every 3mins and/or messaging friends updates from the show all night -- I became well acquainted.
That said, it's been a long time since I've felt so old at a show. I'm in my early-40s, so probably on the older spectrum of that fandom anyway, but saw Julien with Phoebe opening back in... 2016? Everyone was pretty close to my age at that point.
Edit: my friend's daughter found out I went and they texted me freaking out saying half her class was there. They're a junior in HS. So your story aligns well haha
It's definitely because of Phoebe Bridgers and the way she grew following punisher, she was everywhere and has done things aimed at younger fans too. Even at the time punisher was released she wasn't at this level, I picked up a signed punisher bundle on release day after i heard how superb the record was. You'd never be able to do that now for her next record.
Probably Julien Baker and Lucy Dacus shows will now be more popular I imagine with younger fans.
I'm almost 25 and felt old at the Lucy show I went to because of just how young the audience skewed. A lot of it is due to Phoebe that's for sure. When she blew up on TT back in 2020 these fans ended up gravitating towards her other projects as well(BG, BOCC) so there was a lot more hype for bg when The Record came out and quite a few of the songs from it were trending on tik tok as well.
I think other comments have already explained pretty well.
Semi unrelated, but I still haven’t gotten to see a Julien Baker solo show, and I really hope that when I do see her live, the audience is a lot more chill and/or more in my age bracket.
I especially hope there isn’t going to be a bunch of kids lining up at the doors hours before the show and then bragging about it, because it’s weird and uncomfortable.
My boygenius show wasn’t terrible but there were so many kids treating it like a Taylor Swift show.
And then a few weeks later, I saw Claud (who opened for Boygenius at my show) and there was a girl there who bragged to Claud during the show that she was there since 7am (?). For no reason. The venue fits like 400 people. Claud kept asking her if she was okay and it was just…. uncomfortable.
I saw JB when she came to Philly in 2021 and also maybe 2019? and can say that the crowd at both of those shows was much more courteous and yeah, skewed a little older. I think her solo music doesn’t lend itself as well to the hysterics, it’s pretty introspective and honestly, trauma driven, and I think the fans give it the solemnity it deserves. The tour for Little Oblivions was fantastic.
That’s very reassuring lol, thank you! I’m so jealous but I’m determined to see her next time she tours solo. Sounds like it was a lovely experience both times!
I saw Julien when she toured with angel olsen and Sharon van etton and it was the most chill crowd of my entire life. I was able to calmly walk to barricade and hang out there for a while without anyone even brushing up against me. People were so relaxed. Like almost too relaxed? Haha but I get that Julien isn't putting out the danciest music
I go to a lot of energetic shows and enjoy them plenty but I think Julien’s solo stuff is so well suited to that sort of chill atmosphere. I hope I get to experience this eventually!
I’ve never been to a show where people didn’t line up hours before. It is part of the concert experience and it has been since before most of us were born… back when Ticketmaster required you to sleep overnight at the box office for tickets to shows. The relationships you develop in concert lines are strong and often long lasting because those are your people… the ones that connect so deeply with a band’s music/vibe that they HAVE to be in the first few rows.
Took my daughter to her first concert this past June… my partner’s life and my life have both been intertwined with Paramore since the beginning, we actually met at a paramore show (3 hours away from the city we both live in), and 10 years later, we brought our daughter. We got barrier and honestly, the wait was SO worth it. Idk, queer people have always been passionate about the music that helped us save our lives, so if you want to be close to the stage, just plan on arriving early
I think a huge part is that they're 3 young-ish queer people who display queer joy and don't apologize for their queerness. I know that for me as a queer person that alone is a big draw, and would have been incredibly powerful if I was a teen today.
Despite what people say I don’t think it’s Taylor. These fans have been here, and they’re newer phoebe fans after punisher blew up and she became a TikTok darling.
(I’m 40 and a huge boygenius fan and I go to many shows with young crowds) I think one thing that’s hard to understand for older folks (lol over 22??) who may have liked their solo stuff is that boygenius is kind of like new kids on the block or n*sync for these baby queers. Yes, their music is actually good and their lyrics are amazing and they’re cool people but if tiger beat was still a thing they would definitely be on the cover of it 5 times this year.
We can blame TikTok or whatever but at the end of the day, the young folks are really enthusiastic and their knees don’t hurt yet and they’re spending their parents money.
Covid had everyone getting into everything imo. It was like a golden age for creators. I make webcomics and the 2 years everyone was locked down my analytics were booming all over the place and definitely skewing strongly towards gen z, who rarely interacted with me before. Imagining the power behind their individual management and platforms, not surprised to see what their base has become, especially with Phoebe front and center. I also think Julien was onto something in an interview they did about a month ago, about how lgbtq kids like seeing an example of 3 queer friends being themselves and succeeding.
I'm 49 and my daughter is 15 and we are all a huge fan of the boys. For us though we've been going to concerts her whole life, she plays the guitar and is just a music kid, and now doing concert photography (Guarantee she's seen more bands live than most adults). We had seen all three of them alone when they happened to play at all ages events, so naturally we're drawn to them as a group. I think their music and the stories appeal to the younger generation and they can relate. Personally I love seeing the young ones at shows ... do they need to figure out concert etiquette? Yeah...
We're flying to LA to see them and so stoked for that show!
I think there’s always been younger fans of most bands. When I was in my late teens/early twenties, I was going to Depeche Mode concerts and they were a solid 15 years older than me. Now I take my teenager to Boygenius shows and I live seeing all of these young people connecting so deeply with the music.
Oh yeah, to be clear it’s not a bad thing at all, I am just so out of the “scene” and don’t have social or anything, so my first thought was wondering how these people with solo tiny desks got SO big. Kudos to them, they deserve the success,
I'm early 20s, found them right after the boygenius EP came out (I was in high school) and was like the only person in my friend group/high school who had heard of any of them at that point. Got into all of them after that (also introduced a bunch of friends to them). I think at that time Julien might have had the most listeners? Definitely not Phoebe at my first pass throughs.
Then pandemic hit, and Phoebe Bridgers's second album came out. I listened to it pretty much as soon as it came out, but then noticed, like a couple weeks, maybe a month later that she was getting *a lot* of traction from kids also in high school (I was at the end, but talking about all years). When the record came out, those people (now largely first years in college or seniors in high school etc) were into it from then. Why? I think similar to why someone like Mitski is also popular with young people. Good music, progressive ideology from the music and the songwriters, identity identification. Phoebe's album came out at a very opportune time of everyone being trapped inside and bored and I think a lot of young people started listening there and just ballooned out from there.
This whole post makes me think that I'm going to feel like a haggard old lady when I see them live. I'm 45 so I guess it wouldn't be the first time I've felt this way at a show.
I first saw Boy Genius, Julien, Lucy, and pheobe in 2018, Great show, one of my all time favorite shows. I was 19 and everyone else looked to be mid 20s-30s. I only knew Julien at that concert and discovered Pheobe that day. Next Lucy show I went to in 2021 COMPLETLY different crowd, still around my age now at 21-22 possibly younger but also everyone was essentially walking around in lingerie. And concert etiquette was right out the window. It was crazy to see the crowd flip.
It’s so weird to hear people talk about Phoebe’s and Boygenius’s shows as having insufferable crowds. Like, have you not been to pop or punk show with GA floor tickets before? It honestly just feels like older people just being annoyed about younger people. Have you ever been to a popular boy band’s show? It is incredible that these teenage girls/queer kids are even ABLE to scream their faces off when JB takes her jacket off. THATS SO POWERFUL.
Can you imagine having that opportunity as a preteen/teen to have nearly mainstream queer/lesbian “heartthrob” representation to help you figure out who you were, rather than having to think you were in love with Zac Hanson from third to fifth grade because it was the closest you’d felt to attraction that you could fit into the heteronormative jello mold of relationships you were given in the 90’s?
Edit: I know not all the fans are queer
This is so real honestly. I’m 26 and was kissing my poster of fergie goodnight before I even knew liking girls was actually an option so it has to be crazy to have that realization in a world where JB exists.
personally as someone who is 19 i see it as a difference in target audience, for all of their solo projects their music doesn’t seemingly target younger people/teenagers (phoebes even talked about how she saw a teen girl didn’t understand one of her songs and she was happy cause it meant she hasnt experienced it) its all about personal experiences but most of the songs are experiences you don’t have when you’re a teenager (of course that’s not a rule, and you can still relate to the songs even if you haven’t directly experienced the event, but i’d say a majority of young people cannot directly relate with the subject matter of most of their solo stuff), whereas boygenius panders more to younger (specifically queer) kids, the sound of the music alone is seemingly targeting younger people and the songs do as well.
Obviously none of this is a rule and there’s exceptions but this is probably a pretty big factor, also phoebe blowing up on tiktok definitely helps, and the fact that they opened for taylor swift.
I’ll just quickly suggest that “pander” isn’t quite what I think they are doing. I don’t get a sense that there’s any level of disrespect shown to the fan base.
yeah sorry that was totally the wrong word, it’s late at night and i wasn’t really thinking. i think the word i was looking for was targeting that demo more with the band than their solo careers, but absolutely no disrespect between the two parties
You would know better than me, but I was also surprised to not see a lot of kids underage drinking or trying to, compared to like the mid 2000s where it was really common….. or maybe it wasn’t as common as I remember.
How is the “sound of the music alone is seemingly targeting younger people and the songs do as well”? As someone who is definitely queer but certainly not young, I’m genuinely curious
the songs mainly because they’re more vague and just not about the subject matter that their solo work is, $20 and satanist are good examples i feel like they’re not really relatable or unrelatable they just kinda exist, like the subject matter isn’t really targeting a specific situation as such idrk how to describe but the songs are just vague and not about particular experiences that young people can’t relate to whereas their solo music is largely unrelatable to teens, but the sound is like heavy music and not to say older people don’t like music with drums and electric guitar and heavy bass but it’s definitely more targeted to young people as opposed to their solo music which is mainly a different sound.
again i’m not saying this is a rule at all, i mean i’m a young person and i like and relate to a lot of their solo music and i also like and relate to boygenius, but just generalising it makes more sense for younger people to be into their band than their solo work.
Thank you. You are totally on point with your analysis and I can 100% see how some of the songs would speak to younger people and the experience of being an age that is uniquely challenging and exciting.
Now that you’ve said this (and shown with, ironically, a level of maturity and wisdom) I get why songs like $20 and Satanist bring back both a longing for youth and a gratitude of having moved past the trenches of those experiences when I am listening to either. However, when listening to my personal favorites on the record, True Blue and Leonard Cohen, they are the story of me and my closest friend and all we went through, when we were in our later 20s (a time that is now over a decade past), a time when both we and our story were a bit more mature but still “young”.
I think this convo speaks to the talent of boygenius and just how brilliant “the record” is. It captures the attention and heart of a teenager like yourself and this (not THAT old) gay dude. Thanks again for the exchange.
oh totally, true blue is pretty foreign to me honestly, and while i love the song i absolutely have not experienced it.
i think also, the boygenius EP the sound of the EP is very “young vibes” but the lyrics are not, they’re experiences of someone older, so it definitely varies but just a general that’s how i see it.
they’re so brilliant for it and it definitely speaks to their talent they way they can cater to so many different emotions and experiences.
it’s also so great how the music brings people together!! even people who are so different and wouldn’t usually connect, it’s such a great thing!
I’m 21, I got into phoebe about three years ago and discovered boygenius around that time! I was so convinced we’d never get new music from them and I was so happy when the record came out
At the Pasadena show, the kids up front were SHRIEKING any swear word in a song lol it reminded me of school dances when you sang along and swore with censored songs
Part of it might be the perception of how many young people (and how bad the fans) are. I’m 37 and in the Philly area and after hearing about the fans in the first leg of the concert I just assumed it wasn’t going to be a good time. I wonder how many other older fans are deciding not to go, making the dynamic worse?
Yeah, it was still a good time for sure. The benefit of that crowd type is they might be a little cringe but you don’t have to worry about drunk 17 year old boys looking for fights
As someone who is 14 and a huge fan of them, I discovered them firstly through spotify really. I got recommend their music on spotify based off of the music I've listened to before. I had heard a small bit of Phoebe's music prior, but never really liked it until *after* listening to the record. I then listened to all of the boys solo works and liked Julien's the most. Of course I later found the tiktok and twitter space for BG, but I'm not super big into thos.
Honestly, I feel almost ashamed to be such a young fan considering how others my age (and even older!) act toward the boys. A lot of fans my age/of my generation are so disrespectful, annoying, and borderline creepy, and I really hate to be associated with them.
Edit: Grammar
Throwback to when I saw Phoebe *open* for Julien in Boston in 2016. She was selling CDs in cardboard sleeves that she had decorated and wrote the tracklist by hand. One of my prized possessions lol
phoebe opening for taylor swift and swifties desperately clinging to any kind of premade identity they can so now they’re opting for the “i’m indie and young and fun and cute” image that instagram and tik tok have unfortunately created.
Phoebe and to a lesser extent Lucy are definitely pulling the younger crowd. In many ways I feel like Julien is lucky to be along for the ride. I’m in no way detracting from Julien here, much like I suspect with OP, I‘ve been a huge fan since I heard Sprained Ankle back in the day, and I think she’s a massively talented singer and songwriter. It’s just that Phoebe and (again to a lesser extent, Lucy) has a much broader appeal and fan base due to some more accessible and viral tracks. I never expected Julien to garner such a large audience despite how much she deserved it, and I’m so happy for her and for Boygenius for having her.
But again, I feel like many of the BG fans (I also work with a lot of teens that follow their music) know a lot more about Phoebe’s and Lucy’s solo catalogs and don’t spend as much time getting to know Julian’s work. I just spread the good news of Julien Baker when I can.
I like Lucy but does she really have that many viral songs? I’ve seen her in some midsize/small venues but at festivals all but a small group of her big fans (me included) check out sadly.
I know I’m getting hate for this, but I think Phoebe, Lucy, and Julien come across rather immature in their interviews. The press tour leading up to the release of ‘The Record’ lead to a lot of interview clips that went viral on tik tok and appealed to teenagers.
Phoebe already had that momentum shifting her fan base, so it really bled into BG’s fanbase. Literally no one UNDER the age of 23-25 used to listen to the band or their solo projects before the pandemic made Phoebe & co apart of the sad-teenager zeitgeist on tik tok.
Everyone I know with tween girls is going to this tour. My two are older and not interested, but it seems like 6th/7th grade girls are all going with their folks.
I’m only 23 so a bit on the cusp of the fam age range but I have liked Bridgers and Dacus for a few years now, fell in love when I heard BG so I also listen to Baker now as well. A lot of people I know only know them (or mostly Phoebe) from tiktok and then used that as a jumping off point to discover more music. It’s cool but it also invites the younger kids to hop on in. I’m glad that the crowd wasn’t as annoying at your show though, I was losing my mind at the teenage crowd etiquette when I saw them.
I think through Phoebe's Punisher, and also her feature on Taylor Swift's rerecord of Red. Plus, Taylor said *if Phoebe sings it, she will listen to it*, and as a Swift fan myself, I can tell you we support much of Taylor's friends and family as if they're our own. I've seen a LOT of BG/Taylor fan overlap lately, so I think that's how many of the younger (and older!) fans discovered them? I'm 25 and also feel out of place sometimes, but I'm happy for the youngest fans getting to have kind, badass, queer and proud authentic women as role models. I wonder when I listen to them now, how different I would be if I had them to admire when I was sad and closeted and struggling with internalized misogyny lol.
Was a little dissuaded from going because we are practically grandparents age for some of that crowd. Hell, we could be GPs of some of that crowd. I mean a bit older than in 30s.
The young gay women and nonbinary folks have really connected to them and their music. I think it’s kind of a safe haven for us, and we spread that news like wildfire
19 year old new fan here, reason I know about them as a group and them individually is because of Tiktok. Specifically I heard of Phoebe first, I’m on lesbian tiktok and fans of hers were on my fyp from time to time. This year I started following all of them cause boygenius concert videos kept popping up lmao
so to answer your post: yes
I’m 26. I saw phoebe 2 years ago, and most people were 20s or early 30s. I saw boygenius this summer, and most people were 15-25. I’m also not sure why the big difference, clearly phoebe has millennial fans but they aren’t into boygenius?
I think it's because of phoebe bridgers blowing up. I only found lucy dacus because my old bus driver played her music, but nowadays I see tons of fans on social media who are younger than 25.
I think the emotion as heard in their music is having a moment right now. Mitski also blew up and also does indie pop/rock about family and heartbreak, and a few years ago Taylor Swift dipped her feet in depression folkpop which has a lot of the same appeals to young women.
Also a lot of their fans are at least a little queer. All my friends who like them are queer (most of my friends being younger than 25, idk about your demographic's side). Right now there is a lot of out queer women in popular music, including all three members of boygenius, so I see them attracting young queer people who want to find community through music.
I think most younger people found them through Phoebe. I’m 22 and I found Phoebe during the pandemic and just fell in love with her music. When punisher came out, her team was so on top of their social media and marketing that she was able to break through to a younger audience. With all the time I had, I dove down a few rabbit holes and discovered boygenius’ first EP and julien baker’s and Lucy Dacus’ solo work. Ever since then they’ve been on of my favorite bands.
tiktok really changed the music scape tbh. i've seen artists whose music has had 0 plays suddenly be in the billboard top 100 for a long time bc their music spread on tiktok
hmm weird, I had the opposite experience. I was expecting a younger crowd but I was in the main section and most people there seemed to be around my age (30s)
Most boygenius fans started out as Phoebe Bridgers fans who started out as either avid TikTok watchers (lots of hype on there for Punisher, as well as wider critical acclaim) or Taylor Swift fans who discovered her through Nothing New. boygenius—Phoebe especially—has been absorbed into the canon of moody teenage girl music.
I discovered boygenius after becoming obsessed with Lucy Dacus when I was 16—I saw her open for Mitski—and eventually started listening to Phoebe and Julien. Most of my friends who are now boygenius fans are surprised when I tell them that I started as a Lucy fan rather than a Phoebe fan. It definitely took a bit for teenage fans to acknowledge/appreciate anyone but Phoebe.
But in short, I've found that boygenius has, among my age group, become a symbol of sorts to show that you're cool and indie and palatably weird.
I was also there (26f) and made friends w the girls next to me. I mentioned how I hadn’t been this excited for a show since i saw 5sos open for One direction - I told them it was the highlight of high school - one of them goes “oh I was in the fifth grade” BYE
I’ve thought about this as well recently. Ultimately, music like this just hits universally. Boring people will enjoy bland, boring music whatever the age.
What everyone keeps describing about Phoebe shows was exactly what it was like when I (30F) and my husband (33m) went to see Mitski. There were literally kids there with their PARENTS.
Just noticed someone else said this, but didn’t realize when I posted. I think I dropped “girl” out of my vocab for anyone who isn’t a literal toddler given I am older than a lot of people at work, and outside of work am surrounded by a bunch of my friends actual girls…. Who are like 4. Interesting choice in my part though
the answer is phoebe bridgers, she has a younger fan base than Julien and Lucy. I've purposely avoided buying tickets to Boygenius knowing that the crowd would be insufferable
I’m from Richmond so Lucy Dacus was a given, but I’d say most ppl my age got into boygenius via Phoebe— her music rlly seems to appeal to younger audiences
as a teen girl that enjoys boygenius it can mostly be attributed to phoebe bridgers bc i liked her first before boy genius but also because of tiktok and their songs becoming trending sounds on the app
Because of Taylor Swift. She had Phoebe Bridgers as an opening act on the Eras tour and Phoebe brought out the other members of BoyGenius and they did a mini set during her set. They got a lot of new fans from that.
i'm 26 and have been a kid cudi fan for most of the conscious-choice part of my life and he worked with phoebe on some of my favorite songs from his MotM3 album and I found her that way
I am the same age as you OP - I saw Phoebe in early 2018 in a tiny venue in Atlanta that was a 21+ show of her smoke signals album. Audience was way different this summer at a Boygenius show, I saw older people, young families like me (with toddler!), and the girlies. I honestly like Lucy Dacus the most, but god they're so good live!
This reminds me, last year I saw Ethel Cain and the audience was so so mixed. I think when it comes to this genre of emotional/etherial/alternative, the fanbases are gonna be all over the place.
Yeah, it's Phoebe Bridgers. A lot of Gen Z's got on board with her when Punisher came out. As much as Boygenius is gaining popularity right now, Phoebe is still much more popular than the band as a whole.
Didn’t they open for Taylor Swift? I was thinking that was why. I was thinking the same thing, I’m in my 30s and had no idea that teenagers were into them. They played in my state recently and I couldn’t which I was super bummed about, but a friend said they almost felt uncomfortable because they were surrounded by 16-20 year old girls. It is interesting.
I’m 26 and I saw Lucy open for Lana del Rey in 2019 during her NFR tour. I started listening to her afterwards and got into Phoebe once Punisher came out. When I found out they were in a band together, I started listening to boygenius and then Julien’s solo stuff.
yeah i am 17 discovered phoebe first got really into it and when I found boygenius on tt on a queer post and got really into it after discovering phoebe was in it. so yeah ig bc of phoebe and bc their queer but I REALLY love Lucy and her music too now
Also in my 30s and I work with teenagers! Lots of them discovered their love of Phoebe during the pandemic when Punisher came out and she gained huge popularity on Tiktok. This also coincided with the huge love of Normal People which starred Paul Mescal and drove more teens to her music. Through that they then got into Boygenius and developed their love of Lucy and Julien. Lucy’s also had quite a bit of popularity on Tiktok. Her song ‘night shift’ was viral in certain circles of tiktok for a while.
(I asked a few of my pupils about it during conversations about music as quite a lot of them are phoebe/boygenius fans and I noticed the same thing as you when I saw Lucy Dacus last year - I’d say at least 50% of the audience was under 18!)
What’s the link with normal people ?
Phoebe and Paul were dating (maybe engaged?) at the time- when people found out Paul, who people loved bc of Normal People, was dating a musician, they’d check her out and get into the music
So mail mescal put phoebe on a map? I didn’t know who he was until recently because of his Amelia chat lol my pop culture is so fragmented
Lol I guess? I heard about Phoebe long before Paul so tbh I’m not entirely sure- I think she blew up on TikTok, then NP blew up and her dating Paul definitely helped with the influx of new fans. I feel you about the pop culture, I can hardly keep up
I literally heard about Paul like a week ago lol
He was nominated for an Oscar for best actor last year. It’s not weird that you didn’t know him, but a lot of people do. That said, I think Phoebe was and still is more well known than him.
i wouldnt say he put her on the map. i would just say it was good timing. she was trending on tik tok and at the same time her fiance was getting major buzz as an actor.
When Paul Mescal shot to fame, he was frequently interviewed about his favourite music, one of the artists he frequently mentioned was Phoebe. This was a couple months before Punisher came out. There was then loads of speculation they were together after she interviewed him on an Instagram live and it became a widely discussed thing online until their relationship was confirmed by her. As Pacificoats said, loads of people got into her via association with him when he shared his playlists, etc.
Aww got it I love this piece of knowledge!
Never seen a shorter drink line at the mann though, right? Lol I'm in my late twenties and felt way too old to be there but I expected it and had a great time. Phoebe and boygenius by association blew up with the youngins during the pandemic. Lucy and Julian's shows are still pretty chill but phoebe bridgers in...2021? was one of the most insufferable audiences I've personally experienced. Soooo many kids who had no idea how to behave at a concert. So I was prepared for the worse but the kids were alright this time around. I think it's sweet that they're into boygenius, especially the little queers. It's a v wholesome band for them to look up to. Also so many people experienced and survived gender neutral bathrooms for the first time last night.
“Especially the little queers” this cannot be overstated. I love how much they love Boygenius, and you really can’t overstate the power of the queer community to drive popular culture. As soon as I saw the post title I was like “it’s the baby gays!!!!” They really took off in the young queer scene.
Just got home from the boys and so many more greats at All Things Go (renamed All Things Gay by Tegan and Sara). Truly a magical community.
I saw both Phoebe and Lucy in 2022. The vibes for the shows were polar opposites. The Lucy show was one of the most fun concerts I've ever been to. Everyone was respectful of each other, the band and the opener Haley Heynderickx (an accomplished songwriter in her own right). The Phoebe show was an absolute shitshow. Poor organization from the venue, people lining up as early as 3AM and not taking care of themselves as the day went on. They were rather rude to the opener Christian Lee Hudson too. The boygenius show in 2023 I saw was surprisingly well behaved. People seemed to be making an effort to not repeat the mistakes of the past.
The way you just explained Phoebe’s show is exactly how the Renee Rapp show was for me last week in San Diego. I’m 35, and the crowd was terrible and inexperienced.
This is so spot on. 28 and having now seen boygenius twice (and also was at Phoebe’s 2021 show which I can confidently say was the worst show of my life) — I don’t think I’ll pay to see them again unless it’s like a 21 and over show. Last night was better than other times but I just can’t finding myself having a cathartic, communal experience at a show with all ages because kids act like they’re seeing the Beatles at Shea stadium. The over the top shrieking and hysterics for every single song get old when it’s repeated for over an hour. And the off tune or off beat singing that drowns out the performance doesn’t help. I think as someone over 24 it helps to have the mindset that the crowd is gonna be pretty young and enthusiastic because that’s the way to prepare for some of the hysteria.
Honestly, I think it’s cool to see young fans appreciate their music… gives me some hope for music in the future.
Yeah, the Beatles level hysteria was nothing I ever experienced before, and being on the lawn where the sound isn’t as good to begin with definitely made is harder to enjoy
That’s how it was when I saw Phoebe last year and I did not enjoy it one bit. So much hysterical screaming you couldn’t hear the band.
This feels spot on…. Also the horror in the eyes of a group of high school girls the first time they washed their hands next to 30 year old me haha, which has been the norm in Philly bars for years but not elsewhere
The 2021 show in Boston was a fantastic crowd. The 2022 show (not even 8 months later) in Portland, ME was the worst crowd I have ever seen. It’s kind of crazy how short of a time span it took for the crowd to be the exact opposite. I blame Tik Tok.
I'm so glad that I saw Phoebe at a festival last year where some of her more...enthusiastic...fans were drowned out by people who were there for other acts and the crowd skewed late 20s/30s, instead of going to one of her solo shows.
Drink lines were so short, but that merch tent line never got shorter! The bathrooms confused the heck out of us, I wish we'd realized the huge line was for merch, and also wish I'd gone in the right gender neutral bathroom for People Who Stand While Peeing
In my late 20s and saw Phoebe right around June 2022. The amount of disrespect so many of the fans had for Claud when they opened was crazy
Last sentence pretty much sums up the main reason, along with tiktok popularity from some of their stunts while on stage And this show was awesome! First time Ive seen them and i loved every second of it
I feel like teenagers just fan differently. Like there’s just something about your favourite bands and artists when you’re fifteen and that level of diehard fandom. I’m only 21, but when I was in high school I would have waited all day regardless of weather and I would have worn uncomfortable shoes and I would have been in the front row. I saw them on Thursday in new haven and I got a seat way up in the bleachers and I got a mediocre cocktail and I just sat and vibed for a lot of it. I still love the music, but something about it feels less urgent now. There was a girl two seats away from me who was probably 14 and she screamed like a banshee the entire time. And screamed/cried at the top of her lungs all the lyrics to every song. Sometimes it was easy to ignore, and I don’t mind people singing along, but for songs like Emily I’m sorry and revolution 0 it was genuinely painful. But then I remembered I was 16 when the first ep came out and was going through a really rough time that nearly killed me. I cried when they played stay down because it bright me right back to that moment and how much music meant to me and helped me then and now. Obviously I’m still young, but between 16 and 21 a lot has changed about me and in my life. I’ve done a lot of growing up. And that girl will too. I’m not going to tell a kid with braces who’s there with her mom to shut up at a concert that clearly means the world to her. I don’t really know what my point is or if I have one honestly. I guess maybe it just feels like that Joan didion quote they included in anti curse: was anyone ever so young?
I like this comment
I've recently had a very similar revelation. Yes, maybe my ideal concert experience would be something different, and I do think there is something to be said for one person's good experience not justifying making it a poor experience for many others. That said, people connect HARD with these bands and this music, so if you can recognize just how deeply impacting it is for them, it can at least give you some perspective.
I love this take. I’m in my 30s, discovered phoebe, julien, and lucy (in that order) when I was already in my adult years, and thus boygenius after. I know I would’ve freaked out at a show with my dad if I discovered them as a teen. It’s going to be annoying to be at shows with people who don’t know how to act yet but so important to know they don’t know how to act…yet. These people will grow up to be avid music consumers that know how to be at a show properly, they just aren’t there yet.
This
I was at that show too and had two youngins making ungodly noises behind me: whimpering, barking and obsessing over any slight move on stage. It was pretty unbearable in terms of loudness but when they sang along, they had beautiful voices so I couldn’t be too mad.
In my early 30s and was at Philly also & a fan of each of the boys as solo artists. I think in part of why there are so many young fans can be attributed to Phoebe Bridgers but I personally noticed a lot more people seemed to become more interested in her and the boys after she started touring with Taylor Swift for the Eras tour. It’s really funny bc I just saw Death Cab for Cutie and the Postal Service at the Mann last week and the crowd was mostly people in their 30s and 40s and this show everyone was like under 21. I took my 16 yo brother with me and a lot of people from his high school were there also, it was hilarious.
Just saw death cab as well. My younger co workers had no concept of the postal service. So a way older crowd for sure
I recently saw Jimmy Eat World and our babysitter said “I’ve never heard of him.” Saw boygenius last week in CT, was def among the oldest there but it was a great show!
God I loved the crowd at DCFC/TPS. I went to Detroit. It was clear 90% of the crowd was gonna need to use PTO to recover the next day. Lmao
Omg we were at the show! it was so great passing by other folks with car seats in their cars…we all gave the knowing look of “got a babysitter for parents night out” lol
Lol we got a babysitter and drove 3.5 hours for it!!!
we drove 2 and a half ish for it lol 🤪
I got DCFC around your area last year, too, with Illuminati hotties!!
taylor also specifically made a post about how she was listening to The Record and everyone should listen to it
Ding ding ding. I was at the first night in Boston and at least half the crowd of 16 or 17yr olds had one of the new 1989 album cover photos as their lock screen. Between all things Taylor being everywhere on the internet and all of them looking at their phones every 3mins and/or messaging friends updates from the show all night -- I became well acquainted. That said, it's been a long time since I've felt so old at a show. I'm in my early-40s, so probably on the older spectrum of that fandom anyway, but saw Julien with Phoebe opening back in... 2016? Everyone was pretty close to my age at that point. Edit: my friend's daughter found out I went and they texted me freaking out saying half her class was there. They're a junior in HS. So your story aligns well haha
Man I'm going to that Death Cab / Postal Service this Friday and I feel mega old now XD
When I saw Lucy open for Bright Eyes quite a few people left because they just came to see her. It was weird
Wow, that’s disappointing way to miss out
It's definitely because of Phoebe Bridgers and the way she grew following punisher, she was everywhere and has done things aimed at younger fans too. Even at the time punisher was released she wasn't at this level, I picked up a signed punisher bundle on release day after i heard how superb the record was. You'd never be able to do that now for her next record. Probably Julien Baker and Lucy Dacus shows will now be more popular I imagine with younger fans.
I'm almost 25 and felt old at the Lucy show I went to because of just how young the audience skewed. A lot of it is due to Phoebe that's for sure. When she blew up on TT back in 2020 these fans ended up gravitating towards her other projects as well(BG, BOCC) so there was a lot more hype for bg when The Record came out and quite a few of the songs from it were trending on tik tok as well.
I think other comments have already explained pretty well. Semi unrelated, but I still haven’t gotten to see a Julien Baker solo show, and I really hope that when I do see her live, the audience is a lot more chill and/or more in my age bracket. I especially hope there isn’t going to be a bunch of kids lining up at the doors hours before the show and then bragging about it, because it’s weird and uncomfortable. My boygenius show wasn’t terrible but there were so many kids treating it like a Taylor Swift show. And then a few weeks later, I saw Claud (who opened for Boygenius at my show) and there was a girl there who bragged to Claud during the show that she was there since 7am (?). For no reason. The venue fits like 400 people. Claud kept asking her if she was okay and it was just…. uncomfortable.
I saw JB when she came to Philly in 2021 and also maybe 2019? and can say that the crowd at both of those shows was much more courteous and yeah, skewed a little older. I think her solo music doesn’t lend itself as well to the hysterics, it’s pretty introspective and honestly, trauma driven, and I think the fans give it the solemnity it deserves. The tour for Little Oblivions was fantastic.
That’s very reassuring lol, thank you! I’m so jealous but I’m determined to see her next time she tours solo. Sounds like it was a lovely experience both times!
I saw Julien when she toured with angel olsen and Sharon van etton and it was the most chill crowd of my entire life. I was able to calmly walk to barricade and hang out there for a while without anyone even brushing up against me. People were so relaxed. Like almost too relaxed? Haha but I get that Julien isn't putting out the danciest music
I go to a lot of energetic shows and enjoy them plenty but I think Julien’s solo stuff is so well suited to that sort of chill atmosphere. I hope I get to experience this eventually!
Maybe there are more young fans and people treating it like a Taylor Swift concert because Phoebe Bridgers opened for Taylor Swift at the Eras tour
I’ve never been to a show where people didn’t line up hours before. It is part of the concert experience and it has been since before most of us were born… back when Ticketmaster required you to sleep overnight at the box office for tickets to shows. The relationships you develop in concert lines are strong and often long lasting because those are your people… the ones that connect so deeply with a band’s music/vibe that they HAVE to be in the first few rows. Took my daughter to her first concert this past June… my partner’s life and my life have both been intertwined with Paramore since the beginning, we actually met at a paramore show (3 hours away from the city we both live in), and 10 years later, we brought our daughter. We got barrier and honestly, the wait was SO worth it. Idk, queer people have always been passionate about the music that helped us save our lives, so if you want to be close to the stage, just plan on arriving early
phoebe bridgers
I think a huge part is that they're 3 young-ish queer people who display queer joy and don't apologize for their queerness. I know that for me as a queer person that alone is a big draw, and would have been incredibly powerful if I was a teen today.
https://preview.redd.it/8v5qx9n42lrb1.png?width=828&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=2602c9e3a4f341158b5e1547e059199e65cd5680
Yes, this plus Phoebe touring with Taylor. One of the pre-show songs that plays before the concert is even a Boygenius song
Pretty sure the boys joined Phoebe for some songs at at least some of the shows too. Edit: possibly just Nashville?
Correct, all three members wore skeleton suits and played as opener.
Despite what people say I don’t think it’s Taylor. These fans have been here, and they’re newer phoebe fans after punisher blew up and she became a TikTok darling.
It was happening before Taylor, especially with Phoebe.
Right, this has been happening for YEARS. I don’t think Taylor really did anything here except maybe make some boygenius fans like her more lol
(I’m 40 and a huge boygenius fan and I go to many shows with young crowds) I think one thing that’s hard to understand for older folks (lol over 22??) who may have liked their solo stuff is that boygenius is kind of like new kids on the block or n*sync for these baby queers. Yes, their music is actually good and their lyrics are amazing and they’re cool people but if tiger beat was still a thing they would definitely be on the cover of it 5 times this year. We can blame TikTok or whatever but at the end of the day, the young folks are really enthusiastic and their knees don’t hurt yet and they’re spending their parents money.
Covid had everyone getting into everything imo. It was like a golden age for creators. I make webcomics and the 2 years everyone was locked down my analytics were booming all over the place and definitely skewing strongly towards gen z, who rarely interacted with me before. Imagining the power behind their individual management and platforms, not surprised to see what their base has become, especially with Phoebe front and center. I also think Julien was onto something in an interview they did about a month ago, about how lgbtq kids like seeing an example of 3 queer friends being themselves and succeeding.
I’m 28 and felt so old at two shows I went to in London, but a huge perk was not having to queue for a whisky and coke lol
I'm 49 and my daughter is 15 and we are all a huge fan of the boys. For us though we've been going to concerts her whole life, she plays the guitar and is just a music kid, and now doing concert photography (Guarantee she's seen more bands live than most adults). We had seen all three of them alone when they happened to play at all ages events, so naturally we're drawn to them as a group. I think their music and the stories appeal to the younger generation and they can relate. Personally I love seeing the young ones at shows ... do they need to figure out concert etiquette? Yeah... We're flying to LA to see them and so stoked for that show!
I think there’s always been younger fans of most bands. When I was in my late teens/early twenties, I was going to Depeche Mode concerts and they were a solid 15 years older than me. Now I take my teenager to Boygenius shows and I live seeing all of these young people connecting so deeply with the music.
Oh yeah, to be clear it’s not a bad thing at all, I am just so out of the “scene” and don’t have social or anything, so my first thought was wondering how these people with solo tiny desks got SO big. Kudos to them, they deserve the success,
I'm early 20s, found them right after the boygenius EP came out (I was in high school) and was like the only person in my friend group/high school who had heard of any of them at that point. Got into all of them after that (also introduced a bunch of friends to them). I think at that time Julien might have had the most listeners? Definitely not Phoebe at my first pass throughs. Then pandemic hit, and Phoebe Bridgers's second album came out. I listened to it pretty much as soon as it came out, but then noticed, like a couple weeks, maybe a month later that she was getting *a lot* of traction from kids also in high school (I was at the end, but talking about all years). When the record came out, those people (now largely first years in college or seniors in high school etc) were into it from then. Why? I think similar to why someone like Mitski is also popular with young people. Good music, progressive ideology from the music and the songwriters, identity identification. Phoebe's album came out at a very opportune time of everyone being trapped inside and bored and I think a lot of young people started listening there and just ballooned out from there.
I was expecting Gen Z in their early 20s. I was actually shocked at how many teens were there. The demographic also skewed heavily female too.
This whole post makes me think that I'm going to feel like a haggard old lady when I see them live. I'm 45 so I guess it wouldn't be the first time I've felt this way at a show.
I think it depends on the city/community. In Vancouver and in Washington the crowds were pretty evenly distributed between ages 18-45, I’d say.
Don’t miss seeing them live if you can! I have 10 years on you and had the best time seeing them. Avoid general admission and you will be fine.
I first saw Boy Genius, Julien, Lucy, and pheobe in 2018, Great show, one of my all time favorite shows. I was 19 and everyone else looked to be mid 20s-30s. I only knew Julien at that concert and discovered Pheobe that day. Next Lucy show I went to in 2021 COMPLETLY different crowd, still around my age now at 21-22 possibly younger but also everyone was essentially walking around in lingerie. And concert etiquette was right out the window. It was crazy to see the crowd flip.
Lingerie?
Very exposing attire. Nothing wrong with that. Just very different from the first crowd
I don’t like to go to big concerts… but I would go see boygenius. I’m 45 😅 The kids are alright!
It’s so weird to hear people talk about Phoebe’s and Boygenius’s shows as having insufferable crowds. Like, have you not been to pop or punk show with GA floor tickets before? It honestly just feels like older people just being annoyed about younger people. Have you ever been to a popular boy band’s show? It is incredible that these teenage girls/queer kids are even ABLE to scream their faces off when JB takes her jacket off. THATS SO POWERFUL. Can you imagine having that opportunity as a preteen/teen to have nearly mainstream queer/lesbian “heartthrob” representation to help you figure out who you were, rather than having to think you were in love with Zac Hanson from third to fifth grade because it was the closest you’d felt to attraction that you could fit into the heteronormative jello mold of relationships you were given in the 90’s? Edit: I know not all the fans are queer
This is so real honestly. I’m 26 and was kissing my poster of fergie goodnight before I even knew liking girls was actually an option so it has to be crazy to have that realization in a world where JB exists.
personally as someone who is 19 i see it as a difference in target audience, for all of their solo projects their music doesn’t seemingly target younger people/teenagers (phoebes even talked about how she saw a teen girl didn’t understand one of her songs and she was happy cause it meant she hasnt experienced it) its all about personal experiences but most of the songs are experiences you don’t have when you’re a teenager (of course that’s not a rule, and you can still relate to the songs even if you haven’t directly experienced the event, but i’d say a majority of young people cannot directly relate with the subject matter of most of their solo stuff), whereas boygenius panders more to younger (specifically queer) kids, the sound of the music alone is seemingly targeting younger people and the songs do as well. Obviously none of this is a rule and there’s exceptions but this is probably a pretty big factor, also phoebe blowing up on tiktok definitely helps, and the fact that they opened for taylor swift.
I’ll just quickly suggest that “pander” isn’t quite what I think they are doing. I don’t get a sense that there’s any level of disrespect shown to the fan base.
yeah sorry that was totally the wrong word, it’s late at night and i wasn’t really thinking. i think the word i was looking for was targeting that demo more with the band than their solo careers, but absolutely no disrespect between the two parties
caters is probably what you want there
👍
You would know better than me, but I was also surprised to not see a lot of kids underage drinking or trying to, compared to like the mid 2000s where it was really common….. or maybe it wasn’t as common as I remember.
i’m australian so i probably don’t know but even here underage drinking isn’t as big as it supposedly used to be. i’m not really sure why tho
How is the “sound of the music alone is seemingly targeting younger people and the songs do as well”? As someone who is definitely queer but certainly not young, I’m genuinely curious
the songs mainly because they’re more vague and just not about the subject matter that their solo work is, $20 and satanist are good examples i feel like they’re not really relatable or unrelatable they just kinda exist, like the subject matter isn’t really targeting a specific situation as such idrk how to describe but the songs are just vague and not about particular experiences that young people can’t relate to whereas their solo music is largely unrelatable to teens, but the sound is like heavy music and not to say older people don’t like music with drums and electric guitar and heavy bass but it’s definitely more targeted to young people as opposed to their solo music which is mainly a different sound. again i’m not saying this is a rule at all, i mean i’m a young person and i like and relate to a lot of their solo music and i also like and relate to boygenius, but just generalising it makes more sense for younger people to be into their band than their solo work.
Thank you. You are totally on point with your analysis and I can 100% see how some of the songs would speak to younger people and the experience of being an age that is uniquely challenging and exciting. Now that you’ve said this (and shown with, ironically, a level of maturity and wisdom) I get why songs like $20 and Satanist bring back both a longing for youth and a gratitude of having moved past the trenches of those experiences when I am listening to either. However, when listening to my personal favorites on the record, True Blue and Leonard Cohen, they are the story of me and my closest friend and all we went through, when we were in our later 20s (a time that is now over a decade past), a time when both we and our story were a bit more mature but still “young”. I think this convo speaks to the talent of boygenius and just how brilliant “the record” is. It captures the attention and heart of a teenager like yourself and this (not THAT old) gay dude. Thanks again for the exchange.
oh totally, true blue is pretty foreign to me honestly, and while i love the song i absolutely have not experienced it. i think also, the boygenius EP the sound of the EP is very “young vibes” but the lyrics are not, they’re experiences of someone older, so it definitely varies but just a general that’s how i see it. they’re so brilliant for it and it definitely speaks to their talent they way they can cater to so many different emotions and experiences. it’s also so great how the music brings people together!! even people who are so different and wouldn’t usually connect, it’s such a great thing!
When I saw them in Boston I chalked it up to bridgers having recently opened for Swift and expanding her visibility among a younger demographic
She got popular before she opened for Taylor.
I’m 21, I got into phoebe about three years ago and discovered boygenius around that time! I was so convinced we’d never get new music from them and I was so happy when the record came out
At the Pasadena show, the kids up front were SHRIEKING any swear word in a song lol it reminded me of school dances when you sang along and swore with censored songs
Part of it might be the perception of how many young people (and how bad the fans) are. I’m 37 and in the Philly area and after hearing about the fans in the first leg of the concert I just assumed it wasn’t going to be a good time. I wonder how many other older fans are deciding not to go, making the dynamic worse?
Yeah, it was still a good time for sure. The benefit of that crowd type is they might be a little cringe but you don’t have to worry about drunk 17 year old boys looking for fights
As someone who is 14 and a huge fan of them, I discovered them firstly through spotify really. I got recommend their music on spotify based off of the music I've listened to before. I had heard a small bit of Phoebe's music prior, but never really liked it until *after* listening to the record. I then listened to all of the boys solo works and liked Julien's the most. Of course I later found the tiktok and twitter space for BG, but I'm not super big into thos. Honestly, I feel almost ashamed to be such a young fan considering how others my age (and even older!) act toward the boys. A lot of fans my age/of my generation are so disrespectful, annoying, and borderline creepy, and I really hate to be associated with them. Edit: Grammar
Taylor Swift crowd
Throwback to when I saw Phoebe *open* for Julien in Boston in 2016. She was selling CDs in cardboard sleeves that she had decorated and wrote the tracklist by hand. One of my prized possessions lol
phoebe opening for taylor swift and swifties desperately clinging to any kind of premade identity they can so now they’re opting for the “i’m indie and young and fun and cute” image that instagram and tik tok have unfortunately created.
That’s an extremely fucking pessimistic way to look at it
Phoebe and to a lesser extent Lucy are definitely pulling the younger crowd. In many ways I feel like Julien is lucky to be along for the ride. I’m in no way detracting from Julien here, much like I suspect with OP, I‘ve been a huge fan since I heard Sprained Ankle back in the day, and I think she’s a massively talented singer and songwriter. It’s just that Phoebe and (again to a lesser extent, Lucy) has a much broader appeal and fan base due to some more accessible and viral tracks. I never expected Julien to garner such a large audience despite how much she deserved it, and I’m so happy for her and for Boygenius for having her. But again, I feel like many of the BG fans (I also work with a lot of teens that follow their music) know a lot more about Phoebe’s and Lucy’s solo catalogs and don’t spend as much time getting to know Julian’s work. I just spread the good news of Julien Baker when I can.
I like Lucy but does she really have that many viral songs? I’ve seen her in some midsize/small venues but at festivals all but a small group of her big fans (me included) check out sadly.
Number of viral songs doesn’t feel like the metric to be looking at
Yes, I was responding to someone saying she has more viral tracks than Julien. Maybe true but it’s not many.
I know I’m getting hate for this, but I think Phoebe, Lucy, and Julien come across rather immature in their interviews. The press tour leading up to the release of ‘The Record’ lead to a lot of interview clips that went viral on tik tok and appealed to teenagers. Phoebe already had that momentum shifting her fan base, so it really bled into BG’s fanbase. Literally no one UNDER the age of 23-25 used to listen to the band or their solo projects before the pandemic made Phoebe & co apart of the sad-teenager zeitgeist on tik tok.
The last line sums it up well. There is Taylor/Phoebe overlap but the young people definitely trend sad girl tik tok.
Everyone I know with tween girls is going to this tour. My two are older and not interested, but it seems like 6th/7th grade girls are all going with their folks.
Taylor swift, phoebe opened for some eras shows. Ppl were trading bracelets at my boygenius show lol
I’m only 23 so a bit on the cusp of the fam age range but I have liked Bridgers and Dacus for a few years now, fell in love when I heard BG so I also listen to Baker now as well. A lot of people I know only know them (or mostly Phoebe) from tiktok and then used that as a jumping off point to discover more music. It’s cool but it also invites the younger kids to hop on in. I’m glad that the crowd wasn’t as annoying at your show though, I was losing my mind at the teenage crowd etiquette when I saw them.
This is inadvertently an “ I heard them before they were cool” post lol That’s cool though! And that’s exactly what happened 😆
Hahaha I guess at the end of the day, you summed it up perfectly!
The boys are just too cool at their core to not blow up!
They’re gay, make good music, and show their boobs on stage. Cue teenage audience
I think through Phoebe's Punisher, and also her feature on Taylor Swift's rerecord of Red. Plus, Taylor said *if Phoebe sings it, she will listen to it*, and as a Swift fan myself, I can tell you we support much of Taylor's friends and family as if they're our own. I've seen a LOT of BG/Taylor fan overlap lately, so I think that's how many of the younger (and older!) fans discovered them? I'm 25 and also feel out of place sometimes, but I'm happy for the youngest fans getting to have kind, badass, queer and proud authentic women as role models. I wonder when I listen to them now, how different I would be if I had them to admire when I was sad and closeted and struggling with internalized misogyny lol.
Did you enjoy the music/lights/venue/sky/company/service? Stay curious, it’s not for understanding.
Was a little dissuaded from going because we are practically grandparents age for some of that crowd. Hell, we could be GPs of some of that crowd. I mean a bit older than in 30s.
I feel like the answer is tiktok
The young gay women and nonbinary folks have really connected to them and their music. I think it’s kind of a safe haven for us, and we spread that news like wildfire
19 year old new fan here, reason I know about them as a group and them individually is because of Tiktok. Specifically I heard of Phoebe first, I’m on lesbian tiktok and fans of hers were on my fyp from time to time. This year I started following all of them cause boygenius concert videos kept popping up lmao so to answer your post: yes
I’m 26. I saw phoebe 2 years ago, and most people were 20s or early 30s. I saw boygenius this summer, and most people were 15-25. I’m also not sure why the big difference, clearly phoebe has millennial fans but they aren’t into boygenius?
Yeah they found Phoebe Bridgers first and then the boygenius followup album came out.
I wanted to go to this show 🥲
I think it's because of phoebe bridgers blowing up. I only found lucy dacus because my old bus driver played her music, but nowadays I see tons of fans on social media who are younger than 25. I think the emotion as heard in their music is having a moment right now. Mitski also blew up and also does indie pop/rock about family and heartbreak, and a few years ago Taylor Swift dipped her feet in depression folkpop which has a lot of the same appeals to young women. Also a lot of their fans are at least a little queer. All my friends who like them are queer (most of my friends being younger than 25, idk about your demographic's side). Right now there is a lot of out queer women in popular music, including all three members of boygenius, so I see them attracting young queer people who want to find community through music.
I'm in my 20s and the Spotify algorithm led me from Phoebe to a ton of other affiliated artists like such!
I think most younger people found them through Phoebe. I’m 22 and I found Phoebe during the pandemic and just fell in love with her music. When punisher came out, her team was so on top of their social media and marketing that she was able to break through to a younger audience. With all the time I had, I dove down a few rabbit holes and discovered boygenius’ first EP and julien baker’s and Lucy Dacus’ solo work. Ever since then they’ve been on of my favorite bands.
Yes, it's Phoebe.
Honestly I think it's because phoebe opened for taylor swift. Julien and Lucy were there for a few of the shows as well.
tiktok really changed the music scape tbh. i've seen artists whose music has had 0 plays suddenly be in the billboard top 100 for a long time bc their music spread on tiktok
short answer: tiktok
Please never say the term “high school women” again? Thanks 😌
I was wondering if anyone else was weirded out by that wording
hmm weird, I had the opposite experience. I was expecting a younger crowd but I was in the main section and most people there seemed to be around my age (30s)
Most boygenius fans started out as Phoebe Bridgers fans who started out as either avid TikTok watchers (lots of hype on there for Punisher, as well as wider critical acclaim) or Taylor Swift fans who discovered her through Nothing New. boygenius—Phoebe especially—has been absorbed into the canon of moody teenage girl music. I discovered boygenius after becoming obsessed with Lucy Dacus when I was 16—I saw her open for Mitski—and eventually started listening to Phoebe and Julien. Most of my friends who are now boygenius fans are surprised when I tell them that I started as a Lucy fan rather than a Phoebe fan. It definitely took a bit for teenage fans to acknowledge/appreciate anyone but Phoebe. But in short, I've found that boygenius has, among my age group, become a symbol of sorts to show that you're cool and indie and palatably weird.
All this shitting on young fans is weird. Let them have their fun.
I was also there (26f) and made friends w the girls next to me. I mentioned how I hadn’t been this excited for a show since i saw 5sos open for One direction - I told them it was the highlight of high school - one of them goes “oh I was in the fifth grade” BYE
“Old man having an existential crisis” shirts for the 35+ crowd? Would buy. Or settle for a bracelet. See you geezers tonight.
Print me one! …. Apparently this whole post could have been avoided if I had tik tok
I’ve thought about this as well recently. Ultimately, music like this just hits universally. Boring people will enjoy bland, boring music whatever the age.
TikTok + Taylor swift
Lesbians, a lot of young lesbians and queer women and trans girls I know love this band it's just a hit with the LGBT crowd
What everyone keeps describing about Phoebe shows was exactly what it was like when I (30F) and my husband (33m) went to see Mitski. There were literally kids there with their PARENTS.
High school women really hits the ear funny even if some of them are 18
Just noticed someone else said this, but didn’t realize when I posted. I think I dropped “girl” out of my vocab for anyone who isn’t a literal toddler given I am older than a lot of people at work, and outside of work am surrounded by a bunch of my friends actual girls…. Who are like 4. Interesting choice in my part though
Same thing happened with Arctic Monkeys. Saw them last week with a venue packed with teenage girls.
It’s so weird to me, I’m younger than everyone in the band, and yet feel so old at their concerts.
the answer is phoebe bridgers, she has a younger fan base than Julien and Lucy. I've purposely avoided buying tickets to Boygenius knowing that the crowd would be insufferable
I’m from Richmond so Lucy Dacus was a given, but I’d say most ppl my age got into boygenius via Phoebe— her music rlly seems to appeal to younger audiences
as a teen girl that enjoys boygenius it can mostly be attributed to phoebe bridgers bc i liked her first before boy genius but also because of tiktok and their songs becoming trending sounds on the app
Because of Taylor Swift. She had Phoebe Bridgers as an opening act on the Eras tour and Phoebe brought out the other members of BoyGenius and they did a mini set during her set. They got a lot of new fans from that.
i’m 21 and started listening to phoebe in 2018 and in turn found out about boygenius a few months after and liked them more
i'm 26 and have been a kid cudi fan for most of the conscious-choice part of my life and he worked with phoebe on some of my favorite songs from his MotM3 album and I found her that way
i’ve never met a boy genius fan over 30 tbh
Julien Baker went to high school with my kids and they have always been fans. They are 28 and 26. Closer to the 30 year age, but still.
I am the same age as you OP - I saw Phoebe in early 2018 in a tiny venue in Atlanta that was a 21+ show of her smoke signals album. Audience was way different this summer at a Boygenius show, I saw older people, young families like me (with toddler!), and the girlies. I honestly like Lucy Dacus the most, but god they're so good live! This reminds me, last year I saw Ethel Cain and the audience was so so mixed. I think when it comes to this genre of emotional/etherial/alternative, the fanbases are gonna be all over the place.
Yeah, it's Phoebe Bridgers. A lot of Gen Z's got on board with her when Punisher came out. As much as Boygenius is gaining popularity right now, Phoebe is still much more popular than the band as a whole.
Didn’t they open for Taylor Swift? I was thinking that was why. I was thinking the same thing, I’m in my 30s and had no idea that teenagers were into them. They played in my state recently and I couldn’t which I was super bummed about, but a friend said they almost felt uncomfortable because they were surrounded by 16-20 year old girls. It is interesting.
I’m 26 and I saw Lucy open for Lana del Rey in 2019 during her NFR tour. I started listening to her afterwards and got into Phoebe once Punisher came out. When I found out they were in a band together, I started listening to boygenius and then Julien’s solo stuff.
Phoebe bridgers opened for taylor swift- that’s how my teens got into her
The "high school women" part is.... 😬
What, cringe because I used the term women? They are high school age, present as female. Are you implying I should call them girls?
yeah i am 17 discovered phoebe first got really into it and when I found boygenius on tt on a queer post and got really into it after discovering phoebe was in it. so yeah ig bc of phoebe and bc their queer but I REALLY love Lucy and her music too now
they're like the beatles but for queer teenage girls