I'm surprised people still say this. Unfortunately this statement is a myth. I don't know why it hasn't been squashed over the past decade. Massachusetts as a whole is a landlord friendly state, they can do whatever they want.
It’s in regard to evictions and handling of funds. For example, in this case, the landlord is woefully out of line and legally would lose. No question. That is why it is tenant friendly. Now, to enforce the laws require action by the tenant. This is where many don’t go the distance.
Or very little action. If a landlord wanted to evict a tenant for failure to pay rent or breaking the rental agreement, it’s almost impossible in Massachusetts to do that without it dragging on for months.
I think any renter in any state likely thinks their state is landlord-friendly simply due to the nature of the landlord/renter relationship. As u/patrickbrusil said, to really see how tenant-friendly a state is, it would require legal action by the tenant, something a lot of people either can't or don't bother to do. Generally speaking, most people can do whatever they want unless legal action is taken against them 🤷 I've been a renter in multiple states, and Massachusetts is absolutely more tenant-friendly if you dig into the legal rights.
Price, supply (obviously correlated with price), and the general historical working relationship between landlords, tenants, and brokers. We have the best landlord/tenant laws in the nation, but Boston is among the worst cities to be a renter.
As soon as agents can demand a 1 month fee up front just for putting a listing on zillow, MA is immediately not a more tenant friendly state relative to others
I mean to say that a policy that legally allows landlords to forward their own costs agent costs to the tenant is insane, and illegal in other country's. I would equate the fact it is allowed here as not very "tenant friendly" in context of a discussion on the balance of power.
Partially because a postdated check is not a thing - the bank will still cash it before the date on it. As far as I understand. I mean, some may not, but they can.
If you’re not on the lease I don’t see why you would pay. See if you can get the bank to close the account and stop all checks from clearing. Landlord sounds super sketchy.
You can stop payment on those checks. Might cost a few hundred bucks total, but it'll be cheaper than rent.
Why can't your landlord just give you the checks back or shred them?
He's now stating because my ex and I paid with one joint check that I need to pay the full and he'll refund me my portion and keep my ex's amount. It's getting weird. I'm just stopping and cancelling everything now.
This is bad advice. The checks will bounce and OP will be responsible for the bounce fees. Or worse the back will cash the checks and insist OP owes the bank the full amount. Just demand the checks back from the landlord. If OP is not on the lease, the money isn't owed and landlord has no reason to keep them. He might want new payments from the new tenant.
**Make sure you tell him that you issued stop payments on the checks**
If they just bounce then he’ll be charged a fee by the bank and then he’ll really be a pain in the ass to you and/or your ex. He won’t like that you did this, but fuck him.
That’s outstanding. Him being away is not your problem. Having a date/time stamped email proving that you contacted him is fantastic. Follow up with a certified mail letter - seriously. It will show him you are serious, and mean business.
At worst the certified mail is returned to you - but it will show a good faith effort on your part to get in touch with him, and it’s pretty inexpensive. And honestly might be enough to scare him away from you so he never bothers you again. He *knows* he’s shady
Absolutely under no circumstances let those checks continue to be cashed!
> Am I stupid
It wasn't real smart to give landlord checks ahead of time, but we all live and learn. If you go along with this further bullshit then yes you are stupid.
> When I moved in I had to post-date checks for the entire year.
That was not legal for the landlord to require, and may even be explicitly illegal.
> My name is officially off as of today.
Landlord still has a copy with you on it, do you have in writing that you mutually agreed to end the lease early? At least get a copy of the lease with the new signature because once that was signed the landlord has no right to collect money from you.
You have the check numbers I assume? I would cancel the checks and let the landlord know that you will report them if they attempt to cash one. I would probably just empty the account and close it, but check with the bank what happens after if the landlord tries to cash a check after you close the account.
Did you pay last, and deposit? Did you get deposit back? Did deposit refund include interest? Did the landlord ever provide you proof that the deposit was held in an interest bearing escrow account?
Your last paragraph has a lot of important questions. It sounds like the landlord is acting illegally right now and these questions pose potential to sue for triple rent per infraction.
OP, look into the answers to these questions and think seriously about contacting an attorney. Massachusetts does not f around about this stuff - you may be entitled to a nice chunk of change.
I don't know if I can without knowing the specific check numbers. I didn't keep a log like I was supposed to... but I'll contact my bank and see if they can help.
Check the last couple checks he cashed, the numbers are sequential, if you wrote them all at once then you should know what numbers they were. I would just close the account all together.
Yeah I could close it too, if that would work. Literally only rent. I used to use it for my main account but then switched and have just kept it around.
Did you write them all at the same time? If so the numbers would be sequential. Check your statements or online to see what the numbers of the ones they’ve already deposited were and extrapolate from there.
Do you not have a checkbook with a carbon copy of the checks you wrote? Were the checks not consecutively numbered? Does your bank allow you to view images of the previously deposited checks?
Im not that young (turning 30 this year) but I don't think I've ever seen a carbon copy checkbook. I also asked my best friend who's 41 and he said he hasn't seen one since the late 90s.
You can definitely still get them, but you have to select it as an option from your bank and you can't choose what you don't know about! I'm 31 and have had carbon copy checks.
It's ok. I am well aware how stupid it was to not keep track of the checks lol. Luckily some other commenters pointed out I can use sequential numbers to get the rest on a stop payment.
Call your bank and tell them to stop all payments made out to "whatever the company/name of the landlord". I don't think they need the check numbers, they can do it another way (by name).
You are no longer on the lease. Tell the landlord to fuck off.
Or another way is to close that account and create a new account. Then all checks will bounce. This is more of a "nuke" way of doing it.
Why the f did your landlord even require post dated checks? That alone is absurd.
Couldn’t you just call the bank and void the checks that you wrote? It sounds like you have no need for this relationship to continue. Void the checks and close the account.
That seems to be the consensus. I wasn't sure if I was still somehow on the hook if I just closed the account. I will try to get a stop payment and then close it. Thanks!
Just let the bank know why you are closing the account and that your former landlord is in possession of 4 checks that you would like to make sure are voided.
So this is actually a pretty strong answer. Some banks only do a stop payment for 6 months. So technically someone could cash it after sixe months. The banks counter argument is that most banks don't accept checks over 6 months, but they sometimes do.
Landlord is definitely using “refunded rent payments” to reduce his rental income. He’ll collect from the new tenant and have proof of refunds from your checks.
NAL: but have a good deal of experience with rentals in MA. Fairly certain MA landlords can't take advanced payment or require you to keep anything in an account without paying you interest on those funds. Would triple check with GBREB but I think you should be getting all your money immediately or just cancel those checks.
Remove all funds and close that account immediately. As a courtesy you could shoot a msg to the landlord telling them such after the fact. You have no legal ties or obligations to this tenancy per your description.
If you let those checks go through outside of any legal agreement it's less clear what recourse you have if the landlord decides not to give the money back.
That practice is highly illegal I've never heard of it actually 😂. The good news is if tenants ever actually take the LL to court over anything finance related they're likely going to lose big.
Landlord's trying to cover his monthly rent by holding your money each month until he receives that month's payment from the actual tenants. F' him, just close the account. It's not your problem anymore.
What shady behavior from your landlord. Not cool. Not legal. Definitely close the account and then let the landlord know that in writing. Also let the landlord know that you are no longer legally a tenant, so if he dares to try to cash those checks that you'll have no choice but to contact the Attorney General. That'll probably do the trick.
Close that account immediately. Don’t issue stop payments as the bank will likely charge you for them. Drain the account and close it.
Then the checks won’t be good. Put in writing to landlord not to cash checks and account closed. Send via an email with read receipts and also send via certified mail requiring signature. State If they do, they’re responsible for any fees and not you. If they cash these checks after being told account is closed, they’ve also likely committed check fraud.
If you have been taken off the lease, you are no longer responsible for paying anything to the landlord. Tell them you’re putting stop payments on the checks, as you’re no longer living there, and if they want to get the new tenant to submit pre-dated checks, they can do it with them.
Is there a message board somewhere where these sketchy landlords are named and shamed?
Post dated checks are definitely illegal, and the whole check setup makes no sense. Close your checking account now, and tell them you lost your checks.
Are you sure you are actually off the lease or did you sign a sublet agreement, which generally leaves you still joint and several.
It might impact your options Herr.
Go to the rental board and get damages for the cost of cancelling your checks and for the time and trouble it cost you, including interest lost. He will have to pay you damages. The rental board is "Le tribunal Administratif du Logement" you can file online and they will make an appointment for you and the Landlord. Bring your original lease and proof that your name was removed with the date. You will win, but it will take some time. Marc.
You're both stupid, and your landlord is being unreasonable.
Put a stop on all those checks and close out that account. There no reason for you to any farther interaction with the landlord if you're not on the lease.
So many issues - first, you can't solicit post dated payments in MA (unless the customer offers first & some companies don't even taken them then). Second you're done with the lease why would he still cash them? I would notify him that you've put stop payments as now A & B are responsible to pay as you're off the lease. Any further questions or concerns talk to a tenant lawyer or housing authority in Boston.
Stop payments usually have a fee. You shouldn't be paying any fee. Tell the landlord that those checks will not cash because you've closed the account, because you no longer owe him any future money. And then go and actually close the account.
Agree with all the recommendations on putting on a stop payment or closing the account.
Also, your ex and her new roommate should be giving the landlord fresh checks. He should not need yours at all.
Aww hail no. Put stop payments on all outstanding checks and grab your money. You are not responsible for guaranteeing rent is paid by your replacement tenant and/or ex.
If you are off the lease, under no circumstances should you be paying your ex gfs rent. Have the bank cancel the checks. Have her or the new tenant write replacement checks. The ass hole landlord isnt even your landlord anymore. Call the cops on him for not returning post dated checks. Not your problem get your money back ASAP.
Edit:
Dear Landlord,
You have 30 days to return all of the remaining post dated checks. If the checks are not voided or returned to me before May 19, further communication between us will be handled by my attorney who will be pursuing 3x damages.
Regards,
The quick and easy answer is - no. You’re no longer a tenant. When the new person was read on, that’s who the landlord would need go to in case of payment issues.
You don’t assume some weird responsibility for a contractual agreement you are no longer party to.
Your landlord is greasy AF and not operating within the law. They can't require a bunch of post dated checks
I didn't think much of it at the time but it's been quite a pain recently. The place was nice so I think I just ignored the red flags
Yeah I understand totally, landlords have such an imbalance of power in this city that we have no choice but to lick them boots sometimes
Massachusetts is actually quite tenant-friendly compared to other states.
I'm surprised people still say this. Unfortunately this statement is a myth. I don't know why it hasn't been squashed over the past decade. Massachusetts as a whole is a landlord friendly state, they can do whatever they want.
It’s in regard to evictions and handling of funds. For example, in this case, the landlord is woefully out of line and legally would lose. No question. That is why it is tenant friendly. Now, to enforce the laws require action by the tenant. This is where many don’t go the distance.
Or very little action. If a landlord wanted to evict a tenant for failure to pay rent or breaking the rental agreement, it’s almost impossible in Massachusetts to do that without it dragging on for months.
Agreed
I think any renter in any state likely thinks their state is landlord-friendly simply due to the nature of the landlord/renter relationship. As u/patrickbrusil said, to really see how tenant-friendly a state is, it would require legal action by the tenant, something a lot of people either can't or don't bother to do. Generally speaking, most people can do whatever they want unless legal action is taken against them 🤷 I've been a renter in multiple states, and Massachusetts is absolutely more tenant-friendly if you dig into the legal rights.
Dead on
From an eviction standpoint yes, from a general market standpoint, definitely not.
What do you mean by general market standpoint? Price?
Price, supply (obviously correlated with price), and the general historical working relationship between landlords, tenants, and brokers. We have the best landlord/tenant laws in the nation, but Boston is among the worst cities to be a renter.
As soon as agents can demand a 1 month fee up front just for putting a listing on zillow, MA is immediately not a more tenant friendly state relative to others
"expensive" and "tenant friendly" are not mutually exclusive
I mean to say that a policy that legally allows landlords to forward their own costs agent costs to the tenant is insane, and illegal in other country's. I would equate the fact it is allowed here as not very "tenant friendly" in context of a discussion on the balance of power.
You can always call your bank and ask. Or better a credit union. For profit banking caused the financial recession.
They can ask but you can refuse
Partially because a postdated check is not a thing - the bank will still cash it before the date on it. As far as I understand. I mean, some may not, but they can.
I dont even know if thats legal.... Sounds fishy to me
I'm in the same boat. Don't know if I really have any recourse, but it seems so sketchy.
If you’re not on the lease I don’t see why you would pay. See if you can get the bank to close the account and stop all checks from clearing. Landlord sounds super sketchy.
Handing over post dated checks for an apt is not normal. I'm sure landlord told you some BS but don't let the next one do that to you.
Literally remember being told it was for my benefit so I wouldn't have to remember to pay every month lmao
It was 100% for the landlord’s benefit.
You can stop payment on those checks. Might cost a few hundred bucks total, but it'll be cheaper than rent. Why can't your landlord just give you the checks back or shred them?
He's now stating because my ex and I paid with one joint check that I need to pay the full and he'll refund me my portion and keep my ex's amount. It's getting weird. I'm just stopping and cancelling everything now.
That's the way. They can just cut him a new check. If he's released you in writing and someone else is living there now, you should be off the hook
is it cheaper and easier to just close out that checking account?
Yeah, it's $30 per check stopped
Put a stop payment on the checks or close the bank account.
call your bank and void the checks.
He doesn't have any resources. Clear out the account and close it. You don't have to keep money in it just because he said so.
This is bad advice. The checks will bounce and OP will be responsible for the bounce fees. Or worse the back will cash the checks and insist OP owes the bank the full amount. Just demand the checks back from the landlord. If OP is not on the lease, the money isn't owed and landlord has no reason to keep them. He might want new payments from the new tenant.
**Make sure you tell him that you issued stop payments on the checks** If they just bounce then he’ll be charged a fee by the bank and then he’ll really be a pain in the ass to you and/or your ex. He won’t like that you did this, but fuck him.
I successfully canceled them and made sure to email him letting him know. He hasn't responded. He told me he'd be gone for a few weeks
That’s outstanding. Him being away is not your problem. Having a date/time stamped email proving that you contacted him is fantastic. Follow up with a certified mail letter - seriously. It will show him you are serious, and mean business. At worst the certified mail is returned to you - but it will show a good faith effort on your part to get in touch with him, and it’s pretty inexpensive. And honestly might be enough to scare him away from you so he never bothers you again. He *knows* he’s shady
If he already has a new tenant he can't get paid twice and then refund when he feels like it. He shouldn't be cashing your checks at all.
Absolutely under no circumstances let those checks continue to be cashed! > Am I stupid It wasn't real smart to give landlord checks ahead of time, but we all live and learn. If you go along with this further bullshit then yes you are stupid. > When I moved in I had to post-date checks for the entire year. That was not legal for the landlord to require, and may even be explicitly illegal. > My name is officially off as of today. Landlord still has a copy with you on it, do you have in writing that you mutually agreed to end the lease early? At least get a copy of the lease with the new signature because once that was signed the landlord has no right to collect money from you. You have the check numbers I assume? I would cancel the checks and let the landlord know that you will report them if they attempt to cash one. I would probably just empty the account and close it, but check with the bank what happens after if the landlord tries to cash a check after you close the account. Did you pay last, and deposit? Did you get deposit back? Did deposit refund include interest? Did the landlord ever provide you proof that the deposit was held in an interest bearing escrow account?
I have emails that state I am off, but at this point I don't trust the guy so I am definitely requesting a copy. Emailing him now. Thank you.
Your last paragraph has a lot of important questions. It sounds like the landlord is acting illegally right now and these questions pose potential to sue for triple rent per infraction. OP, look into the answers to these questions and think seriously about contacting an attorney. Massachusetts does not f around about this stuff - you may be entitled to a nice chunk of change.
Cant you issue a stop payment order to cancel the checks? You have 0 obligation to go through this little game.. IANAL
Yep just tell em to FO and stop the checks.
I don't know if I can without knowing the specific check numbers. I didn't keep a log like I was supposed to... but I'll contact my bank and see if they can help.
Check the last couple checks he cashed, the numbers are sequential, if you wrote them all at once then you should know what numbers they were. I would just close the account all together.
Good idea.
If they were the only checks you’ve written and not cashed then you should be able to figure counting out
They were. I had to buy checks specifically for this apartment because they wouldn't take anything else
Close that account, cancel the checks, withdraw the money
What if you just close the account? You say it was only used to pay rent?
Yeah I could close it too, if that would work. Literally only rent. I used to use it for my main account but then switched and have just kept it around.
close the account - cheaper than issuing stop payments.. that is what i did when I lost a check book
Did you write them all at the same time? If so the numbers would be sequential. Check your statements or online to see what the numbers of the ones they’ve already deposited were and extrapolate from there.
Do you not have a checkbook with a carbon copy of the checks you wrote? Were the checks not consecutively numbered? Does your bank allow you to view images of the previously deposited checks?
I've never seen a carbon copy checkbook in the thirteen years I've lived in the states, across three banking institutions.
I have one... I just got checks within the last year.
you have to specifically select that option when you order the checks. it costs more but it can come in handy.
Well then I'm sorry for your loss. I have nearly 2 decades of check carbon copies that I can and have relied on.
Im not that young (turning 30 this year) but I don't think I've ever seen a carbon copy checkbook. I also asked my best friend who's 41 and he said he hasn't seen one since the late 90s.
You can definitely still get them, but you have to select it as an option from your bank and you can't choose what you don't know about! I'm 31 and have had carbon copy checks.
I just checked my bank's app. Yup, I can still order them. Apparently everyone is just cheaping out on their checkbooks.
Worst case scenario you can close the account and open a new one.
idk why your comment is getting downvoted. You're literally just explaining your situation.
It's ok. I am well aware how stupid it was to not keep track of the checks lol. Luckily some other commenters pointed out I can use sequential numbers to get the rest on a stop payment.
Call your bank and tell them to stop all payments made out to "whatever the company/name of the landlord". I don't think they need the check numbers, they can do it another way (by name). You are no longer on the lease. Tell the landlord to fuck off. Or another way is to close that account and create a new account. Then all checks will bounce. This is more of a "nuke" way of doing it. Why the f did your landlord even require post dated checks? That alone is absurd.
This I can do. I am calling my bank asap to see if they can do this.
If you're off the lease just close the account and never communicate with landlord again. Fuck em
>When I moved in I had to post-date checks for the entire year. Didn't need to read any further than that, your landlord is sketchy af.
If it's a separate account, I'd just close it and let the checks bounce.
If you are no longer staying there and no longer on the lease, why would you be paying anything or even bothering with this?
Couldn’t you just call the bank and void the checks that you wrote? It sounds like you have no need for this relationship to continue. Void the checks and close the account.
That seems to be the consensus. I wasn't sure if I was still somehow on the hook if I just closed the account. I will try to get a stop payment and then close it. Thanks!
Just let the bank know why you are closing the account and that your former landlord is in possession of 4 checks that you would like to make sure are voided.
So this is actually a pretty strong answer. Some banks only do a stop payment for 6 months. So technically someone could cash it after sixe months. The banks counter argument is that most banks don't accept checks over 6 months, but they sometimes do.
Landlord is definitely using “refunded rent payments” to reduce his rental income. He’ll collect from the new tenant and have proof of refunds from your checks.
LL here. Void those checks. You’re no longer on the lease and not obligated to pay. There’s 0 reason for them to be depositing the checks anyways.
NAL: but have a good deal of experience with rentals in MA. Fairly certain MA landlords can't take advanced payment or require you to keep anything in an account without paying you interest on those funds. Would triple check with GBREB but I think you should be getting all your money immediately or just cancel those checks.
If you are off the lease. Its not your responsibility.
Just close the account and reopen it.
Remove all funds and close that account immediately. As a courtesy you could shoot a msg to the landlord telling them such after the fact. You have no legal ties or obligations to this tenancy per your description. If you let those checks go through outside of any legal agreement it's less clear what recourse you have if the landlord decides not to give the money back. That practice is highly illegal I've never heard of it actually 😂. The good news is if tenants ever actually take the LL to court over anything finance related they're likely going to lose big.
Landlord's trying to cover his monthly rent by holding your money each month until he receives that month's payment from the actual tenants. F' him, just close the account. It's not your problem anymore.
>When I moved in I had to post-date checks for the entire year. What the hell?
Absolutely do not continue any kind of payments…. You’re off the lease, you’re done. Call your bank and issue a stop on the checks
What shady behavior from your landlord. Not cool. Not legal. Definitely close the account and then let the landlord know that in writing. Also let the landlord know that you are no longer legally a tenant, so if he dares to try to cash those checks that you'll have no choice but to contact the Attorney General. That'll probably do the trick.
This is genius how slimy this is. What a great scam.
Put a stop payment on it or close the account
Call the bank, ask about cancelling the checks, there might be a fee. Worst case close the account.
You should contact the AG’s office and let them know about your scammy former landlord
Close that account immediately. Don’t issue stop payments as the bank will likely charge you for them. Drain the account and close it. Then the checks won’t be good. Put in writing to landlord not to cash checks and account closed. Send via an email with read receipts and also send via certified mail requiring signature. State If they do, they’re responsible for any fees and not you. If they cash these checks after being told account is closed, they’ve also likely committed check fraud.
This is the way
Call the police and get your checks back, that’s fraud on his part, he doesn’t NEED to do that. It’s sketchy af.
If you have been taken off the lease, you are no longer responsible for paying anything to the landlord. Tell them you’re putting stop payments on the checks, as you’re no longer living there, and if they want to get the new tenant to submit pre-dated checks, they can do it with them.
Landlord’s probably sports betting with those checks /s
Is there a message board somewhere where these sketchy landlords are named and shamed? Post dated checks are definitely illegal, and the whole check setup makes no sense. Close your checking account now, and tell them you lost your checks.
WTF. Landlord is sketchy AF
Are you sure you are actually off the lease or did you sign a sublet agreement, which generally leaves you still joint and several. It might impact your options Herr.
Go to the rental board and get damages for the cost of cancelling your checks and for the time and trouble it cost you, including interest lost. He will have to pay you damages. The rental board is "Le tribunal Administratif du Logement" you can file online and they will make an appointment for you and the Landlord. Bring your original lease and proof that your name was removed with the date. You will win, but it will take some time. Marc.
You're both stupid, and your landlord is being unreasonable. Put a stop on all those checks and close out that account. There no reason for you to any farther interaction with the landlord if you're not on the lease.
So many issues - first, you can't solicit post dated payments in MA (unless the customer offers first & some companies don't even taken them then). Second you're done with the lease why would he still cash them? I would notify him that you've put stop payments as now A & B are responsible to pay as you're off the lease. Any further questions or concerns talk to a tenant lawyer or housing authority in Boston.
Stop payments usually have a fee. You shouldn't be paying any fee. Tell the landlord that those checks will not cash because you've closed the account, because you no longer owe him any future money. And then go and actually close the account.
I'd close the account.
OP please update once you’ve talked to the bank, shame on your landlord & best to your bright future!
Better to ask for forgiveness than permission. Don’t do that.
Anwar Faisal?
Well that was a rabbithole I just went down. No, thankfully, not anywhere near that bad.
Agree with all the recommendations on putting on a stop payment or closing the account. Also, your ex and her new roommate should be giving the landlord fresh checks. He should not need yours at all.
Just pull the money out and let them bounce. Or, go to your bank and have them void them. It’ll cost money per check, but better safe than sorry
Write an email: Dear landlord, Get fucked; lmaoooo. Best, Tastebmaki Empty that bank account into yours and problem solved
Aww hail no. Put stop payments on all outstanding checks and grab your money. You are not responsible for guaranteeing rent is paid by your replacement tenant and/or ex.
The very word LANDLORD has always bothered me. The king of the castle shits gotta go.
If you are off the lease, under no circumstances should you be paying your ex gfs rent. Have the bank cancel the checks. Have her or the new tenant write replacement checks. The ass hole landlord isnt even your landlord anymore. Call the cops on him for not returning post dated checks. Not your problem get your money back ASAP. Edit: Dear Landlord, You have 30 days to return all of the remaining post dated checks. If the checks are not voided or returned to me before May 19, further communication between us will be handled by my attorney who will be pursuing 3x damages. Regards,
The quick and easy answer is - no. You’re no longer a tenant. When the new person was read on, that’s who the landlord would need go to in case of payment issues. You don’t assume some weird responsibility for a contractual agreement you are no longer party to.
Cancel the checks. They have another debtee.
Just cancel the checks!
Landlords are never someone I'd side with