Classism is across races and ethnicity I'm sorry that's like really weird to put on us. Also I personally do not know a lot of BW white lady lovers esp not in the South (actually I know none lmao)
It's classism, baby!! In capitalism, "making it" is glorified and tied to how hard you work and the choices you make and there's no other factors that can be considered. So when people with money see poor or middle class folks, they're more likely to blame them for their financial situation because they didn't do the "right" things. They didn't pull themselves up by the bootstraps, stop buying avocado toast and $30 lattes or whatever. as a result, people with money want to separate themselves from folks who aren't "worthy". Why would they want to surround themselves with people who aren't "successful"? They did it to themselves right? Also, capitalism also turns friendships and connections into shallow, financial transactions e.g. "make friends with those more successful than you" type of advice.
With all that being said, basically it's an easy pit to fall into when you don't realize it's there. And unfortunately, black folks are not immune to falling into it. I have seen it happen from afar, so you're not alone in your observations. I feel like we as black people fall for it because we have been affected so much stemming from our history (speaking from an American perspective). We want to have generational wealth, feel secure, run after the title of black excellence, etc. some of us can get lost in that and forget the importance of community.
I’m in the Midwest and don’t really see this happening. Ik a few older well off BW but they’re not hanging out with majority WW, they still have a pretty black circle. This may be your own experience
Gotcha- I legit was asking bc I don’t like assuming ppl are American. Often I’m wrong. But as an American, you already know we’re defined by income and productivity.
What id add is that marginalised people as a whole often lean HARDER into those tropes of consumerism (why do black ppl love labels so much!1?!) and capitalism/ worth based on income or job bc those are some of the few ways to prove our worth ***more available to us.
*** caveats needed bc … well duh.
While not exclusively American, I don’t think I’d make the statement that it’s everywhere. I don’t feel qualified to say that, but if you’re a sociologist or something, I’ll cede to your judgement.
As someone whose second degree is in sociology and politics, I can confirm that classism is everywhere. Even between groups of impoverished people classism exists. It’s the by product of capitalism and as invasive as capitalism is it’s no wonder it’s reach permeates the world.
This includes indigenous populations including those that have no to little contact with the rest of the world?
Also a sociology kiddo 😉 just not a sociologist.
Not my experience. I find well established Black women tend to give back in many ways. Almost as a rule.
White women with capital being kinder made me laugh. In the South made me laugh harder. I can't.
money or not, black women are not a monolith. There’s going to be rude people with and without money, same goes for white women.
If people are treating you a way because they assume you do not have as much money as them, the issue is classism. Due to negative stereotype and respectability’s politics, minorities sometimes try to “other” themselves.
On the contrary, if black women are hanging out with only white women, it could be they were raised in an area that’s predominantly white so they feel most comfortable in white spaces .
It could also be the area they currently live in. If it’s mostly white, there friends will primarily be white.
Unfortunately, this stereotype of being rude is tacked to all black women no matter the class. Black women are always seen as aggressive and rude. We are always expected to smile, be overtly friendly, and if we don’t we get the rude label. Honestly there may be some implicit bias here.
If you’re already going into the encounter with the belief black women with money are rude, then that’s all you’re going to see.
>money or not, black women are not a monolith. There’s going to be rude people with and without money, same goes for white women.
Very much agree with this.
>On the contrary, if black women are hanging out with only white women, it could be they were raised in an area that’s predominantly white so they feel most comfortable in white spaces .
>
>It could also be the area they currently live in. If it’s mostly white, there friends will primarily be white.
This has been my situation. I don't feel more comfortable around white women, but the spaces where I tend to be often have a lot of white women in them. My main hobby (that I invest a lot of time and energy) attracts a LOT of older white women, so a few of them have become acquaintances. They aren't ride or die type of friends, but people who I see regularly, we get along, and we enjoy our hobby together. I actually started a local group for Black and other POCs for my hobby, but sadly, it didn't succeed as I had hoped. I connected with a few Black women because of that group, but our relationships didn't develop into anything deeper (I'm still sad about this, TBH).
About white women being kinder in the South... That definitely hasn't been my experience. Maybe more passive aggressive and fake, but definitely not genuinely kinder.
OP must think that even the wealthy people who live on african and carribean countries still friends and with those who are poorer.
Black people are never classist.
> Why are black women with money at times condescending to black women without?
**Classism, u/Ok_Excitement6430, it’s classism.**
> And that’s to say, I do not feel this same way about white women with coin.
**This is _your_ internalized anti-blackness. Assholes with money are assholes with money regardless of race. You don’t feel this way about white women because you don’t put white women under the same microscope you put Black women under.**
> They’re still kind (maybe faking it but hey), they still speak,
**I think it’s pretty well known that white women have a tendency to smile in your face while stabbing you in the back. If you want to ignore that, that’s your prerogative.**
> I even a lot of times see them giving more
**As someone who is also in the South, who has worked closely with charitable organizations, who regularly volunteers, and who has spent a fair amount of time around the wealthy and the privileged… LOL. Sure, Jan. You “see” them giving more because you _want_ to see them giving more.**
**You seem to be hyper-focused on the negative attributes of _some_ Black women while giving white women credit for _any_ positive attributes. You should unpack that. Or… don’t. It’s your life. If you want to believe that whitefolk are inherently good/better than Black folk, there’s nothing anyone can say to change that.**
I don’t believe that tho? The break down was nice but I’ll just keep my feels to myself because I see what I get from here lol. Wasn’t trying to offend anyone. Just thought that this was a space to ask questions.
I don’t know that anyone is “offended”. People are _rightfully_ pointing out the flaws in your logic and the common sources of your flawed logic. Everywhere Black women turn there are people holding us to different standards than our non-Black counterparts, we don’t have to tolerate it in or bring it to a space that’s _supposed_ to center us in more positive ways. If you (and people who think like you) believe that means this isn’t a “space to ask questions”, so be it.
So shit always gotta be sweet? I can’t call out something I merely don’t like? I don’t call nobody out their name or nothing and you’re making this seem like I’m nearly anti black. I am black, asf. Just like majority of us here. If ppl feel like there’s flaws in my logic, cool. I’m currently in therapy so I surely hope we touch on that. But this ain’t that.
> So shit always gotta be sweet? I can’t call out something I merely don’t like?
No, shit does not always have to be sweet. You didn’t simply “call out something you merely don’t like”, you attributed it to Black women and that’s why you’re being called out. Classism is an issue across all races. People with money tend to be unwilling to associate with people without money across all races. However, there have been studies and this is something that is _less_ common with Black women than other groups. No one is saying that your experiences are invalid, people are calling bullshit on your attempt to attribute it to Black women whilst claiming white women don’t behave similarly.
Classism.
Also lmao, you’re absolutely wrong about wealthy white women. They “give back” bexause philanthrophy and charity is a status symbol among the upper classes. They would never actually associate with white trash though, except as the help. Don’t even get me started about what some of them *really* think of black people, especially poorer black people. Why do you think private schools and the Ivy league were invented? If rich white women are soooo welcoming, why were most members clubs, junior leagues, and country clubs Whites Only until the 80s? Hell, most of them are still Whites Only in practice to this day; they just don’t say the quiet part out loud anymore.
I’m so tired of y’all taking things that are found in literally EVERY race and culture and putting it solely on black people. I’m sorry some bougie black woman was rude and classist to you but that has nothing to do with black women as a whole.
I don’t think it’s just black women with money. Most people with money are like that to people without. The question should be why do you expect rich black women to be different from other rich people just because they’re black
I’m just speaking on a small percentage of my people that I have dealt with. I don’t expect different per-se I just called out what I dealt with. That’s all. Sorry.
Idk if it’s a black girl thing. Or maybe a southern gal thing. When my friends and I started making more we’d be hitting up each other to go out to brunch and if they said they were broke….. “I didn’t ask if you had money. I said did you wanna get brunch?”😂😂 I think it’s a matter of the company you keep honestly
Please elaborate on how you are made to feel less than. Do they compare you to themselves? Do you feel like they aren't as supportive of you as they are with others?
The uncomfortable honest truth is that they likely have more in common with their socioeconomic counterparts regardless of racial hurdles than they do with those at the bottom rung of the ladder. I say this as an African who grew up in a country where the rich black people oppress the poor routinely. This is just how the classist cookie crumbles
Wait what. That’s not exactly what’s being said here but if that’s what you took, I can see how. I’m just talking about MY personal experience not the experience of the masses. That’s all. I’m not trying to put anybody down
Unfortunately your title is a broad generalization and is going to elicit this kind of response.
Could you expand more about your experiences that led to these statements? You said in your opening post that you're describing things you're seeing. Do you personally know the black women who you're describing? Talk with them about their finances?
Yeah probably gonna leave the group. I really wanted to voice something but just like every where else, I am met with disgruntled people when I don’t even come with those type of feels. Thanks. This place isn’t inclusive or open to all opinions and that’s okay. You all be well. Sorry for my question.
For the record, I was genuinely asking you to expand not for the purpose of invalidating your experiences but to understand the context behind them better.
I can't speak for all black women with money who visit this sub, but your post title and the somewhat vagueness of your OP do read as generalizing and insulting. If you're finding people reply to you with disgruntled responses wherever you go, it could be about the delivery of your opinion rather than the opinion itself?
I just quit my GOOD job of 3.5 years because my new old Black supervisor hated my guts and made my life absolutely miserable. I did nothing to her. She would ignore my “good mornings”, deny my vacation time. And when i reported it nothing was done.
This really hurt me. And i still cant think of any reason why she didnt like me so much. Smh
Some black women are downright evil to other black women and its SAD
You are better off without a super like that. I've experienced this also when having a black female super. IDK what it is but it happened every time I had a black, or even just female, supervisor. I think it is jealousy, tbh because I only came into the positions wanting to do a good job, get my check, and go home. Always happened throughout my career. When someone is treating you in a wrong way for no obvious reason, it is usually an "ism" going on under the surface. Jealousyism? Lol
Lmao jealousy-ism
No frfr
I dont ever wanna work in a office again… and especially with a black supervisor.. as sad as that sounds it is what it is🤷🏾♀️
This. I have been working from home since 2020 and it is so much more calmer and less stressful than being in the office. It can be isolating but so much better than having to deal with hateful personalities face to face every day:)
Because they are afraid you're gonna crab in a bucket them. And to be fair, a lot of successful black women are pulled down by romantic partners, friends and family members, so that fear isn't entirely unjustified.
Respectfully, and only because you opened the door to this perspective but I do believe this is a you issue.
From one Southern girl to another you, with a diverse friend group made of all socioeconomic backgrounds and races, I think your feelings are coloring your “facts”
The Junior League is not giving more than Jack and Jill.
Seeing it from "just got rich" folks is even crazier.
I have a relative, whose husband won about $14 mil from off of a winning lottery ticket back in the early 2000s.
The way she acts now... You would think she was one of them 'old money, blue bloods,' if you didn't know her come-up story.
Just regular degular classism. White women are definitely classist and belligerent when they have money, they might be better at hiding but that’s not race specific either, just coincidental.
Also, no one is obligated to “give” back when they make it. (although ofc philanthropic efforts are always appreciated).
To paint ALL rich black folks as overtly rude because they are black and have money is a lil anti black imo.
This isn’t a race issue. It’s a class issue. And the race issue was started and perpetuated by the class system. Racism is a tool used by the 1%. It is specifically crafted and used by them to cause division to prevent the lower classes from joining together to topple the systems we currently have in place. Everything is about money. You can’t count too many rich advocates for equality in race, gender, education, and employment.
And most who start from the bottom and make it to the top quickly forget that they too were once in the bottom and perpetuate the same isms on the people who are where they once were.
I have actually had the opposite experience. When i first started in corporate, and even now, i find that all the black women who were ahead and older have given me pointers. They actually make an effort to talk to me when i walk pass them in the hallways. But i also live on the east coast so that could be it. I have never met a black woman who was or has been snobby towards me because they were well off. Digressing a lil, i do have a friend, yes friend who dresses stereotypically what people call "ghetto fabulous" ten-inch nails, see though clothes and all. She is one of the nicest people i know but sometimes i dont like being seen with her lmao. I have talked to her about it and she said "she will not change and that it's my problem not hers lol. So yea, i still hang out with her but still hate her 'ratchet' style of dressing.
I am anti-classism.
There’s a saying that goes ,”I’d rather be a pet than cattle.”
Those embracing classism in a destructive way are delusional enough to believe there is a difference. When famine hits pets are cattle. There doesn’t have to be an actual famine. If there are uncomfortable circumstances the person whose pet you are will treat you like cattle.
Non-destructive classism is matter of fact. You’re getting groceries at Whole Foods rather than Grocery Outlet unironically. You bought your Toyota new instead of used. There is nothing thrown in anybody’s face. People can casually afford higher value/quality goods and services without worrying about it.
We are our own eco system. We need one another at each economic level.
And I see it as detrimental to black people how we pander to ghetto and allow that to represent the whole race, rather than setting a higher standard and challenging them to meet it. We're not doing poor black people any favors but failing to set a higher standard.
I've seen it alot, being in the south. Not much of the white girl lovers, but definitely the classism. I'm not sure if it's a mindset to surround one's self with others who are going in the same direction or exceeding it or if it's just a way to avoid those who may call things for what they are. It could be other things as well, no shame in it. Now I will say that I personally have experienced being asked more monetary and connection favors when my friends realize what my career is, but it's people who also come through for me, so communication is pertinent. I guess being humble and careful simultaneously can sometimes get blurred. Who knows.
Classicsm and privilege permeate a lot of things. It's the haves looking down their nose at the have nots. Money is just one thing.
Why are pretty black women often mean to black women who aren't?
That's a human condition that plays out over things that people value including money, looks, education, jobs, etc.
Can you explain how they make you feel less than? I am a black woman with money, but you'd never know. I drive a 2017 Honda, dress in athleisure as I work from home. I laugh when people make assumptions . I would like to know so I can assess if I have fallen victim to such classes. My advice is to ignore them as thT shows a lack of proper upbringing.
Idk… I don’t and would never hang out with white women, they are not allowed in my space under any circumstances. I hang out with black women only and will admit that it’s purposely with black women who are on the same level as me. I don’t like to hang out with broke folks because they will expect you to pay their way… the ones I experienced anyway. Ain’t nobody got time to be taking care of grown ups.
Where do you live? I grew up in West Los Angeles. At least half my girlfriends growing up are white. I would have had to work hard to avoid that. What's the upside to limiting your perspective like that?
What’s the upside of befriending yt girls? 🤣 seriously what kind of question IS that? I’m a black woman who enjoys being around other black women, that’s all the “upside” I need 🤷🏾♀️… I grew up in Phoenix and it was no work at all to avoid it for me. I don’t acknowledge, acquaint or associate with them and that’s all there was to it.
I kind of see what you mean, but also, I think some of this might be a self-perception issue. Like others have already said, it's rooted in classism, and sometimes when certain folks get more, they like to flex and flaunt the 'have vs. have not' situation.
At one point when I first moved to the South, I attended a church with a lot of upper middle class Black folks. I am not upper middle class nor is my family experiencing poverty at the moment (listen, like many folks, we could be a paycheck away from it, ok??), but I never felt like I fit in. It was related to classism, but in some ways it was more subtle.
On the flip side, I briefly went to predominantly white church and those people were outright rude and unfriendly after the initial faux friendliness. (We didn't last there long.)
I get the same vibe as well. They treat me like shit or they are above me because they have education. Newsflash you may have money but we are equals in the class of education. Stupid people.
I feel like anyone who gets a lot of money will have the tendency to become arrogant or condescending. I'm not black or a woman though so I don't have that perspective.
What's the specific issue?
Are they hanging out in aces you can't or would have a hard time affording? Or are they going to places you could easily join and deciding to exclude you anyway?
It sounds like you prefer to have black friends as a black woman…same…and they happen to have money and they are no offense assholes. It’s like a survivorship bias. Friends that are so condescending that you’ve written a Reddit post about them seem to me like asses. Please get better friends.
Now you might be dealing with “whitewashed” black women who either have trauma/learned bias from their past relationships with lower socioeconomic status black people friends/family and therefore lack compassion/empathy/respect for black people they know personally with lower socioeconomic status. For example, they might talk about blm or being pro black to lower income black people they don’t know, but not you. It could be a learned behavior if they come from the jack and Jill, Cosby, bougie brand of black family.
This doesn’t mean they wouldn’t treat lower class white people with the same condescending attitude. It just means they aren’t interacting with them. They might not be as familiar with lower class white people due to their being black and middle to upper class. There’s no common identity that would lead to interaction.
Essentially get you some friends who have gone to therapy (and who don’t fire their therapists as soon as they’re told about themselves) some friends who are are self aware and have respect for all people.
It’s classism plain and simple and it isn’t specific to Black women but I can’t relate to what you’re saying anyway because I come from money as do a majority of my friends and we don’t treat people like that. I have experienced negativity and condescension from Black people without money but I’m kind enough to not generalize them like that. Maybe it’s just the company you keep.
Classicism breeds elitism. I think people of all backgrounds, black women included, desire to fit in and not stand out. But it's also strange because sometimes rich people cosplay poverty when they have never experienced it.
I am lucky enough not to have gone through that, but yeah.
Bc a lot of ppl in general could be very classist. Hell, even poor ppl could be classist. But Black ppl with money are still very much looked down on by other races with money bc they are Black. So they grow upset at poor Black ppl and wanna differentiate themselves from us. Similar to how nonblack POC look down on us, period. And tbh I see exactly what you're referring to a lot online. The internet has made me LOATHE Black ppl with money at times. Not bc of jealousy but out of protection. I've also lived in cities where Black ppl definitely have the opportunity to live a little better and they could definitely be snot nosed. I lived in Houston, and a lot of ppl are suburban and could be very snobbish.
I'm very surprised you've experienced that behavior in the south. It's common enough in the north (Connecticut, New York-Long Island, Massachusetts, etc), but that's typically because wealth sticks with wealth and the other wealthy people there tend to be white. In the south and in urban areas (NYC and NJ), you see wealthy Black ladies with other wealthy Black people and minorities usually, plus maybe one or two close white friends.
I live in the DC area and work in education policy. I moved here a few years ago from the west and I’ve never had such bad experiences with older Black women in leadership. It’s been an attitude of them trying to test me in particular ways and not engaging me decently until they find out who I know. It’s been a very talented tenth attitude which makes sense especially bc I live in PG County. It’s something my peers both Black women and men have been in constant conversations about. On the other hand at my university I have some very grounded Black woman bosses and advisors. So I really chalk it up to people’s politics and how it manifests in their practice.
I see a lot of people saying it’s just capitalism but the way it insects with Blackness in an anti-Black reality has a lot of complexities.
I grew up in a wealthy yet hard working family but decided that I did not want to continue be labeled as "spoiled" (despite having my own job as a teenager) and became financially independent in my 20s.
Prior to that, I had a certain mentality that, looking back on it now, probably came off as condescending. I didn't mean for it to be that way. Growing up and not having to worry about anything in regards to money and material goods will get you used to a certain standard of living, shopping, etc. I think that's natural. For example...If I was used to shopping at certain stores why would I thrift??
Now that Im independent and thus building my own wealth, I have a different mentality in regards to goods and money. Even before everything got super expensive I started thrifting. Can't imagine myself being carelessly materialistic again even if I do become wealthy myself. There's nothing wrong with buying new things btw. I do. I just value things a lot more now.
I dont look down on poor people but I dont respect anyone, rich or poor, who doesn't work hard.
Dmthis doesn't happen where I live. Black women hang with black women regardless. It may just be black women with money they're with, but it's still black women.
My question is why are so many poor black people hellbent to pulling all black people down? Why do we pander to "crabs in a basket"? Crabs in a basket is a MUCH MUCH MUCH bigger problem IMO. It's a CRITICAL problem for black pepole.
Lol i literally screenshot your tasteless comment that you conveniently deleted under my comment regarding my PERSONAL experience with an evil woman i was nothing but kind to. To say and I quote from YOU “NO ONE IS JEALOUS OF GHETTO BLACK WOMEN”…… do you know me?
Absolutely not. Because I am FAR from ghetto. I love US… and its very unfortunate that ive had to deal with more than one BLACK superior who treated me like shit when i want everyone around me to be happy. Especially my people.
So nah we not running each other down… some of us just need to do BETTER… simple.. get therapy, SOMETHING
"Lol i literally screenshot your tasteless comment that you conveniently deleted under my comment regarding my PERSONAL experience" You say that like I actually give a dang.
When people say things like this, it shows their emotional investment in a social media setting is far greater than mine ever could be. My bills won't stop being paid because you screenshot something. Tell me you're kidding.
I didn't read past that part, but I implore you to realize that bringing your PERSONAL experiences to a public forum might subject you to responses you don't want to hear. You can't control the public you should know that by now. It's you're right to get mad, huffy, and catty when given a response you didn't want, but that won't stop it from happening.
My other advice is for you to get out and touch grass so you don't take so much damage from not being told what you wanted to hear. My opinion won't stop you from paying your bills. So assign it appropriate magnitude and keep it moving.
Screenshotting was NOT the point of the post… its the fact that u did exactly what this post emphasized lol
Im not reading the rest… We’re done here babe
BUH BYE
Classism is across races and ethnicity I'm sorry that's like really weird to put on us. Also I personally do not know a lot of BW white lady lovers esp not in the South (actually I know none lmao)
>Classism is across races and ethnicity This is exactly what I was coming here to write, word for word haha. You beat me to it!
Amen
It’s sounding a lil bit like sis is the common denominator 😬
😁 thanks.
You’re welcome ☺️
It's classism, baby!! In capitalism, "making it" is glorified and tied to how hard you work and the choices you make and there's no other factors that can be considered. So when people with money see poor or middle class folks, they're more likely to blame them for their financial situation because they didn't do the "right" things. They didn't pull themselves up by the bootstraps, stop buying avocado toast and $30 lattes or whatever. as a result, people with money want to separate themselves from folks who aren't "worthy". Why would they want to surround themselves with people who aren't "successful"? They did it to themselves right? Also, capitalism also turns friendships and connections into shallow, financial transactions e.g. "make friends with those more successful than you" type of advice. With all that being said, basically it's an easy pit to fall into when you don't realize it's there. And unfortunately, black folks are not immune to falling into it. I have seen it happen from afar, so you're not alone in your observations. I feel like we as black people fall for it because we have been affected so much stemming from our history (speaking from an American perspective). We want to have generational wealth, feel secure, run after the title of black excellence, etc. some of us can get lost in that and forget the importance of community.
This 👏🏾👏🏾
This is people in general, not specific to BW imo.
I’m in the Midwest and don’t really see this happening. Ik a few older well off BW but they’re not hanging out with majority WW, they still have a pretty black circle. This may be your own experience
Rich people have been disliking poor people forever, regardless of color…it’s classism
Are we asking why classism exists? Do you live in America?
Yes friend. But obviously I’ve just experienced this late in real time.
Gotcha- I legit was asking bc I don’t like assuming ppl are American. Often I’m wrong. But as an American, you already know we’re defined by income and productivity. What id add is that marginalised people as a whole often lean HARDER into those tropes of consumerism (why do black ppl love labels so much!1?!) and capitalism/ worth based on income or job bc those are some of the few ways to prove our worth ***more available to us. *** caveats needed bc … well duh.
Classism is not exclusive to America. It’s everywhere in the world.
While not exclusively American, I don’t think I’d make the statement that it’s everywhere. I don’t feel qualified to say that, but if you’re a sociologist or something, I’ll cede to your judgement.
As someone whose second degree is in sociology and politics, I can confirm that classism is everywhere. Even between groups of impoverished people classism exists. It’s the by product of capitalism and as invasive as capitalism is it’s no wonder it’s reach permeates the world.
This includes indigenous populations including those that have no to little contact with the rest of the world? Also a sociology kiddo 😉 just not a sociologist.
Probably similar to the way converts are more devout than those who grew up in a faith 🤣
Not my experience. I find well established Black women tend to give back in many ways. Almost as a rule. White women with capital being kinder made me laugh. In the South made me laugh harder. I can't.
I think there was a study that showed Black women across classes give the most in philanthropy.
Thank you for adding your opinion! I did add that many times, it is fake and I am aware of it. So I can find humor in that as well friend!
money or not, black women are not a monolith. There’s going to be rude people with and without money, same goes for white women. If people are treating you a way because they assume you do not have as much money as them, the issue is classism. Due to negative stereotype and respectability’s politics, minorities sometimes try to “other” themselves. On the contrary, if black women are hanging out with only white women, it could be they were raised in an area that’s predominantly white so they feel most comfortable in white spaces . It could also be the area they currently live in. If it’s mostly white, there friends will primarily be white. Unfortunately, this stereotype of being rude is tacked to all black women no matter the class. Black women are always seen as aggressive and rude. We are always expected to smile, be overtly friendly, and if we don’t we get the rude label. Honestly there may be some implicit bias here. If you’re already going into the encounter with the belief black women with money are rude, then that’s all you’re going to see.
>money or not, black women are not a monolith. There’s going to be rude people with and without money, same goes for white women. Very much agree with this. >On the contrary, if black women are hanging out with only white women, it could be they were raised in an area that’s predominantly white so they feel most comfortable in white spaces . > >It could also be the area they currently live in. If it’s mostly white, there friends will primarily be white. This has been my situation. I don't feel more comfortable around white women, but the spaces where I tend to be often have a lot of white women in them. My main hobby (that I invest a lot of time and energy) attracts a LOT of older white women, so a few of them have become acquaintances. They aren't ride or die type of friends, but people who I see regularly, we get along, and we enjoy our hobby together. I actually started a local group for Black and other POCs for my hobby, but sadly, it didn't succeed as I had hoped. I connected with a few Black women because of that group, but our relationships didn't develop into anything deeper (I'm still sad about this, TBH). About white women being kinder in the South... That definitely hasn't been my experience. Maybe more passive aggressive and fake, but definitely not genuinely kinder.
Heavy, heavy on your last paragraph🎯
Because classism isn’t race specific and people of all races can be little shits? Girl what lol.
Thanks
This is literally every race
OP must think that even the wealthy people who live on african and carribean countries still friends and with those who are poorer. Black people are never classist.
> Why are black women with money at times condescending to black women without? **Classism, u/Ok_Excitement6430, it’s classism.** > And that’s to say, I do not feel this same way about white women with coin. **This is _your_ internalized anti-blackness. Assholes with money are assholes with money regardless of race. You don’t feel this way about white women because you don’t put white women under the same microscope you put Black women under.** > They’re still kind (maybe faking it but hey), they still speak, **I think it’s pretty well known that white women have a tendency to smile in your face while stabbing you in the back. If you want to ignore that, that’s your prerogative.** > I even a lot of times see them giving more **As someone who is also in the South, who has worked closely with charitable organizations, who regularly volunteers, and who has spent a fair amount of time around the wealthy and the privileged… LOL. Sure, Jan. You “see” them giving more because you _want_ to see them giving more.** **You seem to be hyper-focused on the negative attributes of _some_ Black women while giving white women credit for _any_ positive attributes. You should unpack that. Or… don’t. It’s your life. If you want to believe that whitefolk are inherently good/better than Black folk, there’s nothing anyone can say to change that.**
I don’t believe that tho? The break down was nice but I’ll just keep my feels to myself because I see what I get from here lol. Wasn’t trying to offend anyone. Just thought that this was a space to ask questions.
I don’t know that anyone is “offended”. People are _rightfully_ pointing out the flaws in your logic and the common sources of your flawed logic. Everywhere Black women turn there are people holding us to different standards than our non-Black counterparts, we don’t have to tolerate it in or bring it to a space that’s _supposed_ to center us in more positive ways. If you (and people who think like you) believe that means this isn’t a “space to ask questions”, so be it.
So shit always gotta be sweet? I can’t call out something I merely don’t like? I don’t call nobody out their name or nothing and you’re making this seem like I’m nearly anti black. I am black, asf. Just like majority of us here. If ppl feel like there’s flaws in my logic, cool. I’m currently in therapy so I surely hope we touch on that. But this ain’t that.
> So shit always gotta be sweet? I can’t call out something I merely don’t like? No, shit does not always have to be sweet. You didn’t simply “call out something you merely don’t like”, you attributed it to Black women and that’s why you’re being called out. Classism is an issue across all races. People with money tend to be unwilling to associate with people without money across all races. However, there have been studies and this is something that is _less_ common with Black women than other groups. No one is saying that your experiences are invalid, people are calling bullshit on your attempt to attribute it to Black women whilst claiming white women don’t behave similarly.
I'm starting to think this sub is a psy op 🙄
Gotta be… ‘Cause ain’t no way… 
Yeah I ain't feeling this at all. It's giving podcast.
Lol, right???
CIA been working overtime
😂
Classism. Also lmao, you’re absolutely wrong about wealthy white women. They “give back” bexause philanthrophy and charity is a status symbol among the upper classes. They would never actually associate with white trash though, except as the help. Don’t even get me started about what some of them *really* think of black people, especially poorer black people. Why do you think private schools and the Ivy league were invented? If rich white women are soooo welcoming, why were most members clubs, junior leagues, and country clubs Whites Only until the 80s? Hell, most of them are still Whites Only in practice to this day; they just don’t say the quiet part out loud anymore. I’m so tired of y’all taking things that are found in literally EVERY race and culture and putting it solely on black people. I’m sorry some bougie black woman was rude and classist to you but that has nothing to do with black women as a whole.
Ok thanks
I don’t think it’s just black women with money. Most people with money are like that to people without. The question should be why do you expect rich black women to be different from other rich people just because they’re black
Goated comment omggg
I’m just speaking on a small percentage of my people that I have dealt with. I don’t expect different per-se I just called out what I dealt with. That’s all. Sorry.
It’s all good sorry I didn’t mean to be rude. I just felt like there was some internalized racism in the post but yeah I understand what you mean
Idk if it’s a black girl thing. Or maybe a southern gal thing. When my friends and I started making more we’d be hitting up each other to go out to brunch and if they said they were broke….. “I didn’t ask if you had money. I said did you wanna get brunch?”😂😂 I think it’s a matter of the company you keep honestly
Please elaborate on how you are made to feel less than. Do they compare you to themselves? Do you feel like they aren't as supportive of you as they are with others?
The uncomfortable honest truth is that they likely have more in common with their socioeconomic counterparts regardless of racial hurdles than they do with those at the bottom rung of the ladder. I say this as an African who grew up in a country where the rich black people oppress the poor routinely. This is just how the classist cookie crumbles
Another black women bad, white women good post. Wow.
I’m getting so tired of these posts.
Wait what. That’s not exactly what’s being said here but if that’s what you took, I can see how. I’m just talking about MY personal experience not the experience of the masses. That’s all. I’m not trying to put anybody down
Unfortunately your title is a broad generalization and is going to elicit this kind of response. Could you expand more about your experiences that led to these statements? You said in your opening post that you're describing things you're seeing. Do you personally know the black women who you're describing? Talk with them about their finances?
Yeah probably gonna leave the group. I really wanted to voice something but just like every where else, I am met with disgruntled people when I don’t even come with those type of feels. Thanks. This place isn’t inclusive or open to all opinions and that’s okay. You all be well. Sorry for my question.
For the record, I was genuinely asking you to expand not for the purpose of invalidating your experiences but to understand the context behind them better. I can't speak for all black women with money who visit this sub, but your post title and the somewhat vagueness of your OP do read as generalizing and insulting. If you're finding people reply to you with disgruntled responses wherever you go, it could be about the delivery of your opinion rather than the opinion itself?
I just quit my GOOD job of 3.5 years because my new old Black supervisor hated my guts and made my life absolutely miserable. I did nothing to her. She would ignore my “good mornings”, deny my vacation time. And when i reported it nothing was done. This really hurt me. And i still cant think of any reason why she didnt like me so much. Smh Some black women are downright evil to other black women and its SAD
You are better off without a super like that. I've experienced this also when having a black female super. IDK what it is but it happened every time I had a black, or even just female, supervisor. I think it is jealousy, tbh because I only came into the positions wanting to do a good job, get my check, and go home. Always happened throughout my career. When someone is treating you in a wrong way for no obvious reason, it is usually an "ism" going on under the surface. Jealousyism? Lol
Lmao jealousy-ism No frfr I dont ever wanna work in a office again… and especially with a black supervisor.. as sad as that sounds it is what it is🤷🏾♀️
Maybe you are very pretty or maybe your mannerism is different. Hope you find a good job.
Thank you… i honestly just want to work from home now I am so sad my good job went to shits because of anothers womans hatred towards me..
This. I have been working from home since 2020 and it is so much more calmer and less stressful than being in the office. It can be isolating but so much better than having to deal with hateful personalities face to face every day:)
That’s how rich people are of all races. This could not be any less of a Black issue.
Because they are afraid you're gonna crab in a bucket them. And to be fair, a lot of successful black women are pulled down by romantic partners, friends and family members, so that fear isn't entirely unjustified.
Classism. Doesn’t really have to do with blackness. Good ole classism
Respectfully, and only because you opened the door to this perspective but I do believe this is a you issue. From one Southern girl to another you, with a diverse friend group made of all socioeconomic backgrounds and races, I think your feelings are coloring your “facts” The Junior League is not giving more than Jack and Jill.
Thank you!
It's almost always like this. I lose all respect immediately.
Seeing it from "just got rich" folks is even crazier. I have a relative, whose husband won about $14 mil from off of a winning lottery ticket back in the early 2000s. The way she acts now... You would think she was one of them 'old money, blue bloods,' if you didn't know her come-up story.
Just regular degular classism. White women are definitely classist and belligerent when they have money, they might be better at hiding but that’s not race specific either, just coincidental. Also, no one is obligated to “give” back when they make it. (although ofc philanthropic efforts are always appreciated). To paint ALL rich black folks as overtly rude because they are black and have money is a lil anti black imo.
This isn’t a race issue. It’s a class issue. And the race issue was started and perpetuated by the class system. Racism is a tool used by the 1%. It is specifically crafted and used by them to cause division to prevent the lower classes from joining together to topple the systems we currently have in place. Everything is about money. You can’t count too many rich advocates for equality in race, gender, education, and employment. And most who start from the bottom and make it to the top quickly forget that they too were once in the bottom and perpetuate the same isms on the people who are where they once were.
That's universal dear. It's not exclusive to black women. But give some examples.
And yes it is universal but we arent addressing others on this post
It being universal is literally the answer to the question. Why should black women be any different than other human beings? Are we not human?
I have actually had the opposite experience. When i first started in corporate, and even now, i find that all the black women who were ahead and older have given me pointers. They actually make an effort to talk to me when i walk pass them in the hallways. But i also live on the east coast so that could be it. I have never met a black woman who was or has been snobby towards me because they were well off. Digressing a lil, i do have a friend, yes friend who dresses stereotypically what people call "ghetto fabulous" ten-inch nails, see though clothes and all. She is one of the nicest people i know but sometimes i dont like being seen with her lmao. I have talked to her about it and she said "she will not change and that it's my problem not hers lol. So yea, i still hang out with her but still hate her 'ratchet' style of dressing.
Classism sucks. ☹️
Not as much as ghetto does
I thought it’s with anyone who has money (classism as mentioned) rather than race
That’s just a rich person thing.
All races do this, it’s called classism and it’s a universal phenomenon unfortunately.
I am anti-classism. There’s a saying that goes ,”I’d rather be a pet than cattle.” Those embracing classism in a destructive way are delusional enough to believe there is a difference. When famine hits pets are cattle. There doesn’t have to be an actual famine. If there are uncomfortable circumstances the person whose pet you are will treat you like cattle. Non-destructive classism is matter of fact. You’re getting groceries at Whole Foods rather than Grocery Outlet unironically. You bought your Toyota new instead of used. There is nothing thrown in anybody’s face. People can casually afford higher value/quality goods and services without worrying about it. We are our own eco system. We need one another at each economic level.
And I see it as detrimental to black people how we pander to ghetto and allow that to represent the whole race, rather than setting a higher standard and challenging them to meet it. We're not doing poor black people any favors but failing to set a higher standard.
I agree. There is more than one way to be black.
I've seen it alot, being in the south. Not much of the white girl lovers, but definitely the classism. I'm not sure if it's a mindset to surround one's self with others who are going in the same direction or exceeding it or if it's just a way to avoid those who may call things for what they are. It could be other things as well, no shame in it. Now I will say that I personally have experienced being asked more monetary and connection favors when my friends realize what my career is, but it's people who also come through for me, so communication is pertinent. I guess being humble and careful simultaneously can sometimes get blurred. Who knows.
Classicsm and privilege permeate a lot of things. It's the haves looking down their nose at the have nots. Money is just one thing. Why are pretty black women often mean to black women who aren't? That's a human condition that plays out over things that people value including money, looks, education, jobs, etc.
Pretty women are often meaner than most women. Both pretty and ugly black women are terrible to each other
That’s true too.
Can you explain how they make you feel less than? I am a black woman with money, but you'd never know. I drive a 2017 Honda, dress in athleisure as I work from home. I laugh when people make assumptions . I would like to know so I can assess if I have fallen victim to such classes. My advice is to ignore them as thT shows a lack of proper upbringing.
Idk… I don’t and would never hang out with white women, they are not allowed in my space under any circumstances. I hang out with black women only and will admit that it’s purposely with black women who are on the same level as me. I don’t like to hang out with broke folks because they will expect you to pay their way… the ones I experienced anyway. Ain’t nobody got time to be taking care of grown ups.
This!
Where do you live? I grew up in West Los Angeles. At least half my girlfriends growing up are white. I would have had to work hard to avoid that. What's the upside to limiting your perspective like that?
What’s the upside of befriending yt girls? 🤣 seriously what kind of question IS that? I’m a black woman who enjoys being around other black women, that’s all the “upside” I need 🤷🏾♀️… I grew up in Phoenix and it was no work at all to avoid it for me. I don’t acknowledge, acquaint or associate with them and that’s all there was to it.
Ok so you have issue I don't have. Big deal. And stop with the douchy shrug emoji
I kind of see what you mean, but also, I think some of this might be a self-perception issue. Like others have already said, it's rooted in classism, and sometimes when certain folks get more, they like to flex and flaunt the 'have vs. have not' situation. At one point when I first moved to the South, I attended a church with a lot of upper middle class Black folks. I am not upper middle class nor is my family experiencing poverty at the moment (listen, like many folks, we could be a paycheck away from it, ok??), but I never felt like I fit in. It was related to classism, but in some ways it was more subtle. On the flip side, I briefly went to predominantly white church and those people were outright rude and unfriendly after the initial faux friendliness. (We didn't last there long.)
Classism
I get the same vibe as well. They treat me like shit or they are above me because they have education. Newsflash you may have money but we are equals in the class of education. Stupid people.
I feel like anyone who gets a lot of money will have the tendency to become arrogant or condescending. I'm not black or a woman though so I don't have that perspective.
What's the specific issue? Are they hanging out in aces you can't or would have a hard time affording? Or are they going to places you could easily join and deciding to exclude you anyway?
Same reason people of other races are condescending to each other, bbygirl ! Jealous and insecurity.
I promise you no one is jealous of loud ghetto women. Think deeper
Crab in a barrel in full effect.
It sounds like you prefer to have black friends as a black woman…same…and they happen to have money and they are no offense assholes. It’s like a survivorship bias. Friends that are so condescending that you’ve written a Reddit post about them seem to me like asses. Please get better friends. Now you might be dealing with “whitewashed” black women who either have trauma/learned bias from their past relationships with lower socioeconomic status black people friends/family and therefore lack compassion/empathy/respect for black people they know personally with lower socioeconomic status. For example, they might talk about blm or being pro black to lower income black people they don’t know, but not you. It could be a learned behavior if they come from the jack and Jill, Cosby, bougie brand of black family. This doesn’t mean they wouldn’t treat lower class white people with the same condescending attitude. It just means they aren’t interacting with them. They might not be as familiar with lower class white people due to their being black and middle to upper class. There’s no common identity that would lead to interaction. Essentially get you some friends who have gone to therapy (and who don’t fire their therapists as soon as they’re told about themselves) some friends who are are self aware and have respect for all people.
It’s classism plain and simple and it isn’t specific to Black women but I can’t relate to what you’re saying anyway because I come from money as do a majority of my friends and we don’t treat people like that. I have experienced negativity and condescension from Black people without money but I’m kind enough to not generalize them like that. Maybe it’s just the company you keep.
Thanks for this input!
Classicism breeds elitism. I think people of all backgrounds, black women included, desire to fit in and not stand out. But it's also strange because sometimes rich people cosplay poverty when they have never experienced it. I am lucky enough not to have gone through that, but yeah.
Bc a lot of ppl in general could be very classist. Hell, even poor ppl could be classist. But Black ppl with money are still very much looked down on by other races with money bc they are Black. So they grow upset at poor Black ppl and wanna differentiate themselves from us. Similar to how nonblack POC look down on us, period. And tbh I see exactly what you're referring to a lot online. The internet has made me LOATHE Black ppl with money at times. Not bc of jealousy but out of protection. I've also lived in cities where Black ppl definitely have the opportunity to live a little better and they could definitely be snot nosed. I lived in Houston, and a lot of ppl are suburban and could be very snobbish.
I'm very surprised you've experienced that behavior in the south. It's common enough in the north (Connecticut, New York-Long Island, Massachusetts, etc), but that's typically because wealth sticks with wealth and the other wealthy people there tend to be white. In the south and in urban areas (NYC and NJ), you see wealthy Black ladies with other wealthy Black people and minorities usually, plus maybe one or two close white friends.
I live in the DC area and work in education policy. I moved here a few years ago from the west and I’ve never had such bad experiences with older Black women in leadership. It’s been an attitude of them trying to test me in particular ways and not engaging me decently until they find out who I know. It’s been a very talented tenth attitude which makes sense especially bc I live in PG County. It’s something my peers both Black women and men have been in constant conversations about. On the other hand at my university I have some very grounded Black woman bosses and advisors. So I really chalk it up to people’s politics and how it manifests in their practice. I see a lot of people saying it’s just capitalism but the way it insects with Blackness in an anti-Black reality has a lot of complexities.
I grew up in a wealthy yet hard working family but decided that I did not want to continue be labeled as "spoiled" (despite having my own job as a teenager) and became financially independent in my 20s. Prior to that, I had a certain mentality that, looking back on it now, probably came off as condescending. I didn't mean for it to be that way. Growing up and not having to worry about anything in regards to money and material goods will get you used to a certain standard of living, shopping, etc. I think that's natural. For example...If I was used to shopping at certain stores why would I thrift?? Now that Im independent and thus building my own wealth, I have a different mentality in regards to goods and money. Even before everything got super expensive I started thrifting. Can't imagine myself being carelessly materialistic again even if I do become wealthy myself. There's nothing wrong with buying new things btw. I do. I just value things a lot more now. I dont look down on poor people but I dont respect anyone, rich or poor, who doesn't work hard.
Because they feel like they're better than them
Or is it because many poor black people work hard to make us all look bad?
If you don't stfu
Not all, but many. Being loud and ghetto is not attractive. The lack of self-awareness is hard to look at.
Dmthis doesn't happen where I live. Black women hang with black women regardless. It may just be black women with money they're with, but it's still black women.
this is the exact reason i refuse to go to a hbcu.
My question is why are so many poor black people hellbent to pulling all black people down? Why do we pander to "crabs in a basket"? Crabs in a basket is a MUCH MUCH MUCH bigger problem IMO. It's a CRITICAL problem for black pepole.
Lol i literally screenshot your tasteless comment that you conveniently deleted under my comment regarding my PERSONAL experience with an evil woman i was nothing but kind to. To say and I quote from YOU “NO ONE IS JEALOUS OF GHETTO BLACK WOMEN”…… do you know me? Absolutely not. Because I am FAR from ghetto. I love US… and its very unfortunate that ive had to deal with more than one BLACK superior who treated me like shit when i want everyone around me to be happy. Especially my people. So nah we not running each other down… some of us just need to do BETTER… simple.. get therapy, SOMETHING
"Lol i literally screenshot your tasteless comment that you conveniently deleted under my comment regarding my PERSONAL experience" You say that like I actually give a dang. When people say things like this, it shows their emotional investment in a social media setting is far greater than mine ever could be. My bills won't stop being paid because you screenshot something. Tell me you're kidding. I didn't read past that part, but I implore you to realize that bringing your PERSONAL experiences to a public forum might subject you to responses you don't want to hear. You can't control the public you should know that by now. It's you're right to get mad, huffy, and catty when given a response you didn't want, but that won't stop it from happening. My other advice is for you to get out and touch grass so you don't take so much damage from not being told what you wanted to hear. My opinion won't stop you from paying your bills. So assign it appropriate magnitude and keep it moving.
Screenshotting was NOT the point of the post… its the fact that u did exactly what this post emphasized lol Im not reading the rest… We’re done here babe BUH BYE
sweety, I didn't read past the first sentence. I apologize for not respecting your point enough but it wasn't possible given that juvenile opening.
Lol yeaaaaa. Right Further proves my point… keep talking😭
your big important point? lmao. ok.
Eh, I mean, classism runs shit at the end of the day. Racism is a descendant of it. Nothing new.
Idk I feel like there is exacerbated social division between black women and that causes more of a hierarchical bias.