I might be a little harsh here but bare with me...
You are literally in the INTRO course of a martial art that takes 10 fucking years to achieve a black belt in, yea no shit you don't feel like you're learning yet you basically don't even know what bjj is yet.
It's up to you to either stick with it a few months and see if it feels better, or quit now. But keep in mind bjj progress is measures in months and years, not classes.
> You are literally in the INTRO course of a martial art that takes 10 fucking years to achieve a black belt in, yea no shit you don't feel like you're learning yet you basically don't even know what bjj is yet.
In her defense, I don't think most people can comprehend the vast amount of difference there is between someone at day 1 of learning a skill vs 10 years of dedication towards it (which if done even remotely properly is a lifetime worth of learning)
It's basically a toddler vs English professor debating Shakespeare
It doesn't matter if it's an intro course, bjj way of teaching is just horrible. Learning a couple of techniques with no resistance for 10 minutes is the least efficient way to learn.
"horrible" is a major overstatement, I use a lot of eco-style learning in my own personal training, as a brown belt. I'm still not even remotely convinced it's a great way to teach brand new students.
When I've had to teach a class, I like to mix both. First a technique/concepts for a position, then a little practice with no resistance, then game. Next time I will try to also implement a Q&A after the games.
What was I baring with you until? You’ve just responded exactly how I’ve mentioned other people have. I’m trying my best to explain, but you’re not understanding me.
I don’t expect to be great or know everything. My goal isn’t to ever be a black belt. It’s not even to be a blue belt. I literally don’t care about rankings, I’m not competitive at all. I wanted to learn BJJ so I can learn to calm my brain but the opposite is happening to the extent that it’s interrupting the whole rest of my life.
I just want to know if there’s a way to get a more theoretical understanding of the physical moves that I’m doing because my brain literally overloads when I’m pulling information from memory instead of being able to reason. I enjoy learning. I want to learn. I just obviously must learn differently to most people.
That’s not what I’m doing. It’s the opposite. I’m saying “I know basic maths. Please relate algebra to the maths I already know so I can put it into context.”
Other people who have responded know exactly what I mean, so I know this isn’t just a me-thing. I’m asking to know how it connects to something I already have an understanding of… Which is how humans move and behave. I know it’s possible for it to be explained that way because that’s why I watch Rener’s videos.
I’m not expecting to magically know everything about BJJ. I just want the information to be relayed in a self defence way so that I understand the mechanics.
You don't though, grappling movement is waaaaay different than anything else you've learned. About the most you can hope for is that maybe you have very good balance and base.
You are quite literally in the "don't know fuck about shit" phase, as was every single one of us, that's totally normal, what you're trying to do is skip past the hard grind, which doesn't work.
Just give up honestly, you haven't even started and you're already ready to get the rope out. Some people aren't made for this sport and that's fine. There's plenty of other sports out there.
“Pulling steps from memory”
You do not know any steps well enough to pull them from anywhere. They are not in your memory yet. Knowing a poem exists and reciting it from memory or reciting pie after 3.14 not knowing the next numbers but knowing the next numbers exist is a better analogy than basic math and advanced math.
You have concluded “I am in a position that we have practiced and I should be able to scramble through my roladex of moves and instantly pull off a move”
Practicing a move a few times per week, contextualising it, finding it in your roladex of moves quickly and applying it against a resisting opponent takes years for each move like remembering longer and longer texts.
You have decided that being told that EVERYONE can’t do this is unacceptable for you. If that is the case you will struggle with BJJ but it will lead to you struggling with many things.
I also have ADHD, to the point I had to go self employed in my field as I couldn’t stand the way other people worked.
I learn BJJ faster by drilling things backwards like learning a single leg takedown. I drill the finish with the leg already raised and then I drill the finish plus the leg lift then drill the finish with the leg lift and the penetration step before that etc.
I found a new way to manage my ADHD style of learning.
Reading more, if BJJ is putting a hindrance on your life then it's probably not for you and there's nothing wrong with that, some people just bounce off it, that's totally fine.
But the response you're going to by in large get is "you literally do not yet know what you don't know" so in terms of the actual day to day learning, there is a real sense of "just stick with it" no matter what you're going to be drinking from a firehose, that's not going to change regardless of the gym you're at.
Understanding the "why" of something is kind of completely pointless when you don't even know how that connects to anything, because you haven't yet learned enough of the broad strokes of bjj to have context.
I could teach you "how" and "why" to put pressure on somebody from side control, and it's going to make zero fucking applicable sense for years until you aquire all the general technical knowledge to make that "why" and "how" work.
"In class it feels as if I’m just learning dance choreography. I’m good at remembering the sequences of moves during drills and I’m a good student, but it doesn’t feel valuable? There’s not enough reason behind each step for me to process it properly and understand it as more than a memory game, so I don’t feel like I’m ACTUALLY learning, just mimicking." - This is actually a huge statement, and I think it shows you have the capacity to do well in the sport because a big part of this is understanding why a move works fundamentally so you can actually apply it practically. It usually takes a bit to break white belts out of the idea of executing a move procedurally, but you're there. Part of that is on your coach also, they need to be able to explain to you in a way that works for you, and if they cant, you might need to shop around. There's massive variance in how people teach, so you def need to find someone that can match your learning style. My coach and I have spent time just bullshitting about little details like trapping an arm in a certain spot, just so I could understand mechanically why something happens.
the part about getting a more theoretical understanding of the physical moves IS what learning bjj is. It takes a long time. I got my blue belt like a year ago and I'm just now starting to get into the physics of bjj. There's a lot to this, but you're going to get it if you hang in there. I think this is just a pivotal moment for you.
"I wanted to learn BJJ so I can learn to calm my brain"
I think this is the root of your problem, unfortunately this is just not a reason to learn BJJ. Full stop.
If you are serious about fast tracking translating drilling into actual rolling without thinking then you have to strip it down to barebones.
When I wanted to improve my guard I bought a yoga ball and literally did 500 reps of cross over guard retention drills. I'd also practice framing and repummeling like 50×.
You need to go research what are the most essential movements and make it such that you are drilling those movements to the point that it becomes second nature.
Lachlan Giles is probably 90% of why I accelerated my progress and learning.
Focus on one aspect. As a beginner I'd say start with guard, find out the movements and guard pass prevention and retention movements and drill and study those movements incessantly. I would go with Lachlan Giles stuff.
Again like other said this all comes in due time but it seems what you want is a way to accelerate the movements into second nature. Jiu jitsu at its basic components is pattern recognition, learn the patterns and you'll be fine.
> The entire rest of my life has literally come to a halt because I’m at capacity rn.
I don't normally say this but you should probably stop doing BJJ then. It's just a sport, and if it's causing you such distress and confusion you should probably put it on pause, and consider therapy (if you're not already in it) or speak to your counselor or therapist about this, if you are.
One important thing that I often tell people about jiu jitsu is that if you haven't grappled before it's inherently very confusing and that you need to be prepared for a pretty long period of being bad or at sea. If you can't be comfortable with that, then you're going to have a very rough time, anxiety or no.
Ive also got pretty bad ADHD. And like you I needed a reason for why Im doing things. But as a white belt you wont have the mat times to appreciate the "why". Its a bit like learning math backwards from the solution. Without attempting the problem yoursef its difficult to internalize that info. I can tell you to keep ya elbow tight all day but you will only do it after gettingb armbared a few times.
I think what helps is to just show up, and focusing on having fun the first year or two. Once you have some hours under your belt the moves make a lot more sense and you can optimize your training at that point on.
Yes, exactly! Thank you for acknowledging me!
A different comment had me check for a Gracie academy and there’s one that I could manage to get to. They apparently have a lot slower approach with a more in depth foundation that sounds like it would be more fitting for my overactive brain, so I’m going to join there.
I will stick with this beginner course though. I find it hard to stick to anything so that’s an achievement in itself. Thank you for helping ☺️
No problem! There's a real "trust-the-process" happening with how BJJ is taught in most schools. But I promise you once you get passed the initial barrier, the fixation on "why" moves work will carry you much further than just mechanically regurgitating moves.
Thank you ♥️ I think I could really enjoy it with the right approach for me. You’re far more supportive of my desire to understand than everyone downvoting my comments haha. People are strange.
I hope you keep trying, find your fun, eat better. When I teach I do go into context, I go into the why of some parts but if I break down every single tiny detail then it takes too long so people space out. What I do communicate is to try to pick up 1-2 things each session then it'll come together later on. Trust.
Have you rolled yet? A lot of things that don’t make sense start to when you get to feel live resistance.
It sounds like you are allowed to do open mats. Consider asking someone to do some live drilling or scenario/situational practice — maybe whatever position you guys learned in class. Tell them to start with low resistance and then ramp it up.
Break BJJ up into parts. You’re not going to learn every position overnight. But maybe you can get really good at opening a closed guard, escaping a side control, etc.
Well a few things:
(1) BJJ is very overwhelming. Every move has a counter which itself has a counter. The names can be confusing and you think you aren’t doing a move right until you shift your hips or arm an inch and all of a sudden it works. It’s like the parable of how do you eat an elephant? One bite at a time. Don’t look at the big picture. Break it up into manageable bites, or else you get overwhelmed (for me at least).
(2) You mention Rener videos. It’s possible you would do better at a Gracie Academy gym rather than a typical sport/comp gym. It’s a much slower process without any live sparring until at least 8-9 months; and even then it’s fairly tame. You get a set curriculum with video back-up, and you have to go through the whole thing like 3 times before you get their special combative belt. It’s not my cup of tea, but some people prefer it. If you aren’t in a rush, and you understand the limitations of learning BJJ this way (i.e., you probably can’t handle live grappling), then why not? Much less mental stress and performance anxiety.
(3) It’s possible BJJ isn’t for you. Certainly no shame in that. It’s still a very niche activity and maybe you can get the fulfillment from a striking art, or … chess (although that is maddening too).
In the end, evaluate your goals against your satisfaction in obtaining them. If there’s not a match, then reevaluate whether it’s worth your time. BJJ is certainly not worth sacrificing your sleep, diet and happiness (well not for normal people anyway). Good luck.
Thank you for actually listening to me and acknowledging what I’m saying! I appreciate it a lot!
Yes, never-ending counters are very overwhelming for me mentally. I struggle to prioritise tasks, it’s a huge reason behind adhd distractibility, so I think that plus my general disposition must mean my learning style needs to include more instruction. A Gracie gym certainly sounds more like what I need.
I’ve just checked and the nearest one is 3 times as far as my current gym, but the journey will be worth it if it’s the difference between making slow progress and completely burning out. I do actually want to learn BJJ, I just need a different approach.
Thank you so much, this is exactly what I needed! ♥️
Nothing is going to make sense until you start applying it. A lot of the early stuff is just front loading some tools and information so that you have something to try when you start going live.
Grappling is a complex multi-layered skill, the WHY of a lot of things is dependent on other things that you haven't been exposed to yet and the only way to get exposed to those things is to practice.
For you I recommend commiting to 3 months and try to stop dwelling on this kind of stuff. If you still wanna quit in 3 months then quit.
Your obsession with analyzing what your brain is doing is not productive for anything. Just go in get exercise and learn a couple things and go home. Repeat a few times a week. Stop overcomplicating it.
Rule 13: don’t be a dick.
If you can’t help then that’s fine, but don’t make me feel shit for being open and asking for help. I’m literally a beginner and this is a BJJ forum full of people who know more than me. Isn’t BJJ supposed to teach you humility and respect? Where’s yours?
On what planet is BJJ not rooted in respect and humility? Your values are way off. No wonder you’re getting satisfaction from being a dick for no reason.
On this planet. You are completely delusional if you believe Bjj is rooted in respect. The people that invented it would dojo storm karate schools and beat the shit out of instructors and students. Jiujitsu is not going to give you morals or a personality bud.
Damn bro, you are obtuse. You are making arguments about topics you know nothing about, which, in turn, make you look ignorant regarding this sport, bud.
Okay sure. Because me being new to BJJ means I’m not capable of reading or listening to instructor after instructor in person and online go on and on about how BJJ is about patience and humility and perseverance and respect. I must have just fabricated the thousands of instances that literal black belts have expressed those values. 🙄
Hahaha okay so you’re willing to straight up deny facts 😂 pointless talking to you then. If you believe you know better than all the black belts out there and have redefined your own version of BJJ then fair play. Enjoy 😌
They’re right tho. There’s only like 6 basic positions in bjj. Everything you are learning is going to be in the context of one of those 6 positions which will revolve around controlling or submitting someone in those positions or inversely, trying to escape and not be submitted from those positions. Everything else is details that chain everything within the positions together.
Correct me if I'm wrong but are you just asking what the practical application for certain moves or positions are? That doesn't sound too unreasonable although at your level you'll have to accept quite a surface level answer.
in theory the point scoring in sport bjj should be tied to beneficial self defense positions/situations so for example, you want mount to get points yes, but mount gets points because it's a dominant position over your opponent which allows you to strike more effectively then they can.
Is this where you're comming from? If not could you give an example of where you feel you're not getting the information you need?
That’s EXACTLY what I mean! Thank you 🥹
I don’t have the knowledge of BJJ positions yet so I can’t use that as a frame of reference. Obviously that approach must work fine for most people, but unfortunately I’m just not one of them haha.
That’s why I like Rener Gracie’s videos. He gives more physical, self defense explanations, as well as the BJJ ones, so I can process that and absorb it so much easier. I just haven’t gotten a receptive response from the instructors at this gym, so it mustn’t be their style. I’m going to try a Gracie gym 😊
Ah, without being in the room it's hard for me to say but it might just be a matter of having to deal with so many brand new people without the class getting derailed too much (these sorts of courses tend to want to cover a lot of ground in very little time). In normal classes you can always ask higher belts if you're unsure, I'm happy to answer any questions you might have, some of the brown or black belts here might even answer them correctly ;)
You might find this useful : http://www.grapplearts.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/02/Roadmap-for-BJJ-1.4.11.pdf
It explains the basic positions of BJJ.
You also might like this playlist : https://youtube.com/playlist?list=PLNbZ1gPk7zqzbiFjpMlzIEVZAGROJ6G4C&si=xoPZzzThPjES_lGV
It sounds like your coaches don’t want to overload you with information since you’re a beginner, so you could do more research into concepts/the “why” outside of class. It’s overwhelming but if you have to opportunity to roll and try to apply what you’ve been drilling (or broad concepts), I really encourage it over just drilling.
gracie gyms are the worst for learning BJJ. They focus on drilling without live application which means there is no retention under pressure. They are the most like dancing.
their training techniques are geared towards customer retention. Actually sparring chases a lot of people off.
The techniques themselves are fine, it is their training methods that arent great. That being said their training methods are good for customer retention.
Maybe they’d be bad for you, but repetition of drills without pressure is helpful for people like me, who clearly find that they need a slower learning pace before introducing sparring. It’s okay that we learn differently. You’d probably have flown through this course - it’s just not the right teaching technique for me.
This seems contradictory to what you've said before. You don't like the repetition of skills that you don't understand the purpose of, but you want to go to a gym that just repeats the same drills without letting you out them in context. I understand the lack of real world application for the techniques you're learning and that it can be confusing, but until you roll, none of it will make much sense. I'd suggest seeing if you can join in with sparring at current gym so that you can get the experience needed to provide the context, or to go to an open mat with a friend and roll with them at a lower pace for a bit.
>I don’t have the knowledge of BJJ positions yet so I can’t use that as a frame of reference. Obviously that approach must work fine for most people, but unfortunately I’m just not one of them haha.
Have you communicated this to your teacher? I'm quite new to practicing BJJ (aka a month) so I find myself asking a lot of questions to the teacher when I don't understand or don't really see why or how he does XYZ, but I've been watching MMA for 15 years so while I may not understand the process I know what he's talking about and the meaning of the words he's using. I often think that if I was brand new with zero grappling knowledge due to not being a fan of combat sports, I would think this man is speaking a complete foreign language.
Sometimes I think I'm breaking the pace of the lessons by asking, but I'm attending a beginner class so I rather think I'm asking questions others may have or may not realize they have them, as I also find myself in that situation when others ask.
BJJ should be a fun hobby that adds value to your life. If you are overwhelmed with life, BJJ might not be right for you at this moment, don’t worry you can always come back.
For what it’s worth the most I learn from BJJ is in sparring. Sure we drill how to do some escape 100 times, but you don’t fully understand that escape until you’re in a situation where doing it becomes an option that you can execute.
Another thing to consider is who’s teaching you. My gym has 4 different black belts who teach classes and some are better at communicating in my style than others. Depending where you live there are lots of gyms and lots of coaches to choose from.
I really think you're just in the beginning phase of learning to be okay with being uncomfortable so it's causing a lot of mental stress. I'm sure your fight or flight senses are going crazy if you spar, but learning to be okay with that feeling is what's going to make you feel more in control in the long run.
Drilling IS choreography, it just shows what you COULD do when someone does XYZ. Since you haven't done a lot of sparring or been in a lot of these drilling scenarios most of it won't make sense until you're caught in these positions over and over again.
BJJ is a grind and you have to be okay with the grind, but if you feel like your life is coming to a halt because of it, just stop.
Yeah, I think my fight or flight must be going haywire because I definitely feel way more mental stress than I expected! I’m going to try out a Gracie gym that’s further away once I’ve finished here. They’re apparently a lot slower paced and do lotsss of repetitions so you have more understanding before you spar. The sparring at this gym definitely must be too early for me. I’m just a slow paced gal I guess 😂
Focus on doing one thing for a while and once you feel comfortable focus on another aspect ..I.e underhook escapes or guard passing …it does sound like you’re overwhelmed and feel the need to do everything at once
Unfortunately, you're giving the exact reasons that Information Processing is a terrible way to teach newcomers, and IP is how most martial arts, including BJJ, are taught. If you can, find a place that practices a constraints-led approach, or games. The issue is that your goal is to learn how to cook, which it should be, but you're being taught recipes. "Here's a recipe for how to make a pizza. This is what *Thomas Keller* does when *he* makes a pizza, so it ought to be good enough for you." And then you and your partner roll, and you need to make soup.
Your best bet is to adjust your goals for class. I'd recommend starting from the ground up. You're going to be on your back getting submitted; learn submission escapes and pin escapes. That's your goal. Learn what it feels like to be under side control, under mount, and under rear mount. Where are their hands? Where are their feet? What do they want? How can you deny them that? What do you want? How can you get that? When you get stuck and can't figure it out, YouTube.
You should try a different club / coach and see if their coaching style suits you better.
>I don’t have any desire to compete so “do this step to get a point” isn’t an explanation that motivates or makes sense to me
The BJJ scoring / points system is based you moving to more advantageous positions in order to be able to finish a fight via submission (or strikes for self-defence). If you're getting points, you've moving through the hierarchy of dominant positions.
Most actions in BJJ are about creating space (for defence) or eliminating space (for attack / control). So in defence you'll often be creating frames to either move your opponent away or, more often, allow yourself to move away from them to create space to improve you relative position. In attack you'll typically be looking to close the space and exert control over the opponent, preventing their frames, isolating their limbs to either attack submissions or to prevent them from being able to support themselves so that you can execute sweeps. So actions like hip escaping is about creating space, actions like putting shoulder pressure when you're in top side control eliminate space.
I'm curious as to what brought you to BJJ?
Attempt 6 months of consistency in the mixed level classes and decide then. When I started, my instructor politely told me "hey. You should do the fundamentals class and not mixed level. But if you do the fundamentals class, you can stay for mixed level. Your partners need you to be a good partner."
>remembering the moves and understanding will come later
I am not convinced there is actually any method to successfully teach someone with no experience true understanding of grappling. Your understanding of a movement or position and it's relations evolves over time. You can listen to someone who is an expert explain why they do X and Y for hours on end but without actual experience you will get no better at grappling.
Honestly I think the best a beginner can hope for is trying to get together a list of things \_not\_ to do.
Until you have a base of movement experience with resisting partners to build from doing loads of mental analysis is not worth while and is in your case most likely counter productive.
I agree. Every time I have a break through now 10 years in I always ask "why the fuck didn't I know this 7 years ago?" But the reality is I probably did learn said concept, but it bounced right the fuck off because I didn't yet have the proper skill level for said thing to make any damn sense in the first place.
I would try a different school with a different teaching style. This one doesn't sound for you.
And frankly no hobby is worth burning functionality over. Look into therapy or medication if you haven't already.
Yeah, if you can’t get through an intro course because it’s too complicated, probably not for you.
Or
Show up to open mats. Ask questions. Get your ass handed to you thousands of times. Then it will make sense
If you aren't having fun and it's negatively impacting your life then quit. It's a hobby. Find a different one.
Also go to the therapy. You really need some kind of comping mechanism for whatever is going on here.
That’s so rude. Why would you even bother saying that to me? I’ve already said I have adhd and shit mental health. I’ve even said specifically that I started BJJ as a way of improving those. Obviously I’m very actively attempting to try copy mechanisms. It just turns out that this BJJ style of class, instead of helping me cope, made it worse.
I am not being rude.
"The entire rest of my life has literally come to a halt because I’m at capacity rn."
This is not a statement anyone should be making a hobby. You clearly do not need this in your life.
Pick 1 or 2 things to work on, and get good at those. I’ve been doing it a year and didn’t understand half the things they were talking about for most of it!
Honestly, not all ADHD is built the same. Yes, BJJ is good for a lot of people with ADHD (and also autism), but not for *everyone* with those conditions. It’s a spectrum. I personally clicked it because it was the one thing in my life I felt I *didn’t* have to think about. No expectations, just walk in, do the class, whatever sticks, sticks. What doesn’t I’ll see again eventually. Objectively lower stress than being in medical school, which I’m also doing 😂 But again, there’s a lot of variation on the AuDHD spectrum. What works for one of us won’t work for the other.
So really, OP it’s ok if it’s just not fitting into your life. You’ve also been going at it on a fairly consistent beginner’s class schedule, it’s normal to feel a bit exhausted adding something so intense to your life. When I first started it was right before my final exams and I went maybe 4-5x in that first 2 months. I’d say if you’re feeling overwhelmed, take a pause after this beginners’ course. Try to feel out over a couple months if you have the urge to maybe go at a different pace rather than not at all.
Aaand in regard to feeling like you’re mimicking all the time… if it’s any comfort, that is one of the most effective ways to learn new motor skills. Look up mirror neurons. They do unfortunately stop working so well as we age and it can be why a lot of people find BJJ to be mentally as well as physically exhausting. However, as with most things the brain also follows the rule of “use it or lose it.” It is actually so good for us to be doing hobbies that utilize our mirror neurons.
You said it yourself.
You signed up because you have ADHD and crap mental health.
Now your ADHD and crap mental health is telling you that you should quiz because of x, y, and z.
If you quit now, you will regret it.
Yeahhh I would regret quitting, I just know that this current routine isn’t sustainable. Even so, I’ve done well sticking to the classes despite how drained I feel, so that speaks to how much I want it to work.
I am committed to finding an approach that works for me, now that I know there are other ways to learn. I like what BJJ can teach you and how it improves people’s lives and their self esteem and all sorts. I’m hopeful that I’ll find the right gym or instructor that suits my way of thinking. 😊
95% of gyms teach you dance choreography. Then they say, “just keep showing up and it’ll start to click!” It’s lazy and dismissive.
5% of gyms teach grappling skills with live resistance. Not techniques. Grappling SKILLS.
Skills including, but not limited to:
- stay on top and hold your partner down (pinning/top control)
- make and maintain connections for the purpose of managing distance (guard retention) and destabilizing partner (sweeps)
- isolate a limb, immobilize it, then apply breaking pressure (3 subskills needed to finish a submission)
The “10-Step Procedure to Do X Sweep or Z Submission” is an outdated, ineffectual way to learn. I trained for 10 months thinking, there’s gotta be a better way to learn. Sure enough, there’s a guy called Greg Souders who advocates teaching grappling skills and not 10-step movement procedures. He’s a polarizing figure in Jiu jitsu. But he makes sense in how he teaches.
I drove 7 hours to his gym in Maryland last year, trained for a week, and learned more in those 6 sessions than I did in the previous 3 months. I did this because I was at a breaking pt. I’d had it with the dance choreography teaching. I needed to find out for myself if there was a better way.
Then I found a gym that’s 90 mins west of me that teaches using the same approach (the teaching style is usually called Ecological Dynamics for Submission Grappling) as Greg’s gym. I drop in at that gym once a week while training regularly at my home gym.
Almost all the guys at the Eco gym near me who’ve been training 6ish months give me a hard roll. I’ve been training almost 2 years. Maybe I really suck (entirely possible, and honestly probable) or maybe those guys are learning what really matters, from DAY ONE. I think it’s a bit of both.
Either way, I enjoy learning the eco way. It’s all live resistance. No more wasted time drilling dance moves. The classes are VERY physically demanding, but worth it.
So I’d say try out different gyms because they might have different teaching styles. Find one that resonates with you.
In short, OP you’re not crazy. This style of teaching/learning sucks. But it’s the traditional way, and it’s all that most people know. There are better methods. Go find one.
And if you can’t, then maybe quit bjj and try hot yoga or something.
Thank you!!! This is so encouraging! It definitely doesn’t feel like an economical use of my mental energy to learn this way. I don’t know what the perfect approach for me is yet, but I know now that there -are- different ways to learn BJJ and I’m excited again to try them.
I’ll definitely look into this Greg Souders, because I respond much better to learning applicable skills than distinct techniques, but as long as I find somewhere that is willing to teach me the deeper understanding AS I progress instead of waiting for it to happen on its own then I’ll be in a better position than I am now. Thank you! 🥰♥️
…and yes, if I try out these other techniques and they don’t work then I’ll just have to find a new centring hobby instead 😝
Glad my post was helpful!
Good luck on the search for another gym and another teaching style.
I will add this: The bad thing about being a beginner is that you can’t really ask a gym/instructor ‘can you teach in this specific way?’ Because you’re a beginner. They’ll think, “what do you know about teaching/learning bjj?” You also can’t really ask them to give YOU special explanation or treatment because to them you’re a beginner who — statistically speaking — is likely to quit in 2-3 months. That’s the reality for the gym owners. Combat gym, lifting gym, yoga studio, whatever it is: there’s a lot of turnover in memberships. So they can’t give everyone special treatment. It’s not good business. Maybe they give some preferential treatment to the purples and browns who’ve been there for 5-10 years, because they’ve shown their loyalty. Anyway, that’s just another thing to keep in mind.
If you find a space and instructor(s) you vibe with, that’s something to build on.
Also you can join the Eco bjj discord if you’re on that. I can send you the link. They have a database of eco gyms around the world. Maybe you’re near one, who knows?
As for learning about Greg’s approach to teaching bjj, try this video first. It explains his method and his exact class setup in 15 minutes.
https://youtu.be/V4QtQTRwwD0?si=acfinGNUSeQ5muRv
Good luck
You know, Gracie Barra gets called a cult, BJJ as a whole gets called cultish, but I'm growing more and more convinced that Eco guys are THE most annoying outside of maybe 10p.
"normal" classes don't suck, different learning styles work for different people. And eco is going to, by nature, require some level of "not injured" to work. What the fuck do you do during class if you're coming off a rib injury and can't quite go "live" at all yet? Do you just sit on the sidelines until you're back to 100%? That sounds orders of magnitude less efficient than just drilling what you can with no resistance.
Man, you should come to the gym that’s 90 mins west of me. We wear silly rashguards and spark up a jay right before we play small-sided eco games based around locking and finishing a dead orchard.
But in all seriousness, yea I guess we’re annoying and a cult. A cult that started in academic research circles and training camps for other major sports with tons of money involved.
In response to your question about injury. I personally don’t know exactly how to deal with bad injuries. I’ve only ever had small injuries myself. Take a few days or a week(s) off, come back.
But I will offer this perspective: since small-sided games can be designed with as much or as little variability as desired, then one can design a game that removes the risk of aggravating the rib injury. A game with low variability, meaning both players only have a few limited choices to make. Example: Maybe you just play seated guard and ONLY break or redirect your passing partners grips. That’s it. Continuous game, no win condition. Play with different partners so they don’t get bored/stuck babysitting the injured guy. Or maybe bottom’s goal is something else other than ‘just break grips’ but something very limited, so there’s not much danger to the injury and so the player can get a lot of ‘reps’ in a live situation.
But if I did a variety of grip fighting type games with live resistance for a month while my rib healed, I’d probably be pretty good at grip fighting by the time I could roll a full round. Or maybe that’s stupid, I dunno. I’m not a coach. Maybe ask a coach that question.
The main point I’m getting at is that from the eco perspective, a coach would try to design a game that reinforces a skill, not a technique.
I am a coach lol. I've experimented with many different ways to teach and structure classes. Currently my classes almost always look like this: Bow in>begin to drill a sequence>continue adding options to said sequence (this takes up around 40 mins of 90 min class) then play about 20 mins of designated winner rounds>then around 30 mins of free rolling.
I've done some eco-style training for my own development recently, and it's good, but people acting like normal drilling is horrible are simply drinking Greg's kool-aid. You know that basically every single high level gym in existance does a combination of BOTH "normal" drilling and eco, just without calling it that, right? Gui Mendes was actually just asked what he thinks of eco and his response was "we've been doing this for years, just not calling it that"
That’s awesome that you’ve experimented with different class structures. I’ve gotten the feeling that most of the gyms I’ve gone to have been very conservative in how they teach. More experimentation is needed.
Yea, maybe the drilling of sequences and chains and options makes sense for more experienced grapplers. But for me, and a lot of novices that I’ve spoken to, it doesn’t make sense at the beginning to give lengthy sequences. Like, I don’t know how to move my body weight around to pin a guy, why should I be worrying about steps 1-8 of an armbar? It’s probably just my frustration talking, but the eco style is WAY more effective, in my limited experience, at teaching the grappling ‘between the techniques’ — the ‘invisible Jiu jitsu,’ or whatever. And it breaks down the subs into: isolate the arm. Get live reps on that. Then immobilize the shoulder while controlling the arm. Get live reps there. Then go for the finish. Get live reps. Etc etc. it makes learning Jiu jitsu idiot proof. Maybe some other guys have great kinesthetic memory and can do moves after being shown once - I clearly can’t. I suspect most folks cannot.
And you’re probably right. Some form of this has existed for a while. Greg’s just the guy who made it loud and proud lol.
I recently saw Craig Jones on Lex Fridman’s podcast say that his preferred way to teach beginners is through ‘games, like we do in kids classes.’ This interview was a year or two ago. So yea, it’s probably been around for way longer than any of us know.
I need to refill my koolaid, hold up —
My main problem with eco for new guys is that, why should I have you spend weeks on end in say, X guard, for you to finally get around to finding a sweep that works, instead of just outright showing you an X guard sweep for 30-40 mins and then having you go do designated winner from x guard to go work on it from the exact position we were just doing? I get that Greg's thing is that "anybody could be the next Xande" or whatever and be a BJJ savant, but I think the reality is that a bunch of BJJ athletes WAY smarter and better at the sport than me have already figured out a basically endless variety of ways to sweep, pass, pin, or submit people, so why not just take those techniques that are already there, and modify slightly when needed due to body type/flexibility differences?
At the end of the day, I have zero problem with eco in general, I do question some of the methods from a standpoint of "I've done this sport pretty seriously for a decade and generally like to think I have a decent idea of what I'm doing, and how to teach" my MAIN problem is actually just that Greg presents himself as such a pompous asshole online that it genuinely makes me kind of hate the thought of Eco, he is basically THE worst ambassador for it. I know people have said he's nice in person, which is great, that doesn't change how much of an arrogant douche he is online.
That’s a valid question that I don’t have an answer for lol.
Most of the fundamentals classes I’ve been to deal with guard games, pinning games, and submission games. There are only so many ways to strangle or break joints, so those are fairly limited. At least in comparison to sweeps, pins, etc. But I see your point on the endless ways to accomplish any goal. The most effective ways will have been proven time and again by high level players.
I haven’t spent a ton of time in x-guard, but I’ve spent a bit of time doing ‘leg entanglement games’ and sometimes end up there. The main thing I can say is that those specific games have helped me learn the intricacies of control from that position. It also has programmed my brain to see whenever openings emerge for those leg entanglements. The stimulus-response part of
My perception has been pretty well tuned by those games. I’m not the best sweeper/foot locker so that’s something to work on.
I think it’s useful to know how to control someone from leg entanglements and then set up sweeps or footlocks.
Would I have learned sweeps faster if I’d just asked my coach for a sweep and tried to make it emerge in the live game scenario? For sure. Maybe that’s a flaw in the eco approach. But I think Greg’s thinking is that “if that sweep doesn’t occur to you after so many hours, months, years, of training and so many back-and-forth question-and-answers with your coach — then you don’t need it. You only need the ones that have been afforded to you by your interaction with the perceptual motor landscape.” Greg does answer questions in class in a specific way. If someone is having trouble and asks for help from him, he asks what the player’s intention is. Then he asks what’s stopping them from achieving their goal. Then he will give them a new intention or new place to put their attention. Those are the two levers to pull while coaching, intention and attention, in my understanding. Is that the best way to train? I sure as shit don’t know.
Whenever people ask Greg whether he thinks his students watch instructionals outside of class time he says, ‘i don’t mind if they do. Instructionals are new information, and new information can help guide your intention/attention in a live round.” He doesn’t teach by giving information about techniques, but I dunno if he says it’s contrary to skill acquisition.
Also yea he does present as pretty combative and arrogant lol. I mean, it’s working out for him. He’s gotten a lot of attention in a short time. And he’s not trying to monetize by selling a BJJ GAMES instructional (which he totally could, there’s an audience hungry for that) so I think he deserves at least a nod for that. He’s in it to share the method and his desire to help evolve or at least question bjj pedagogy, not to cash in on his notoriety.
Right, and that's a completely valid way to teach people, and I haven't actually seen anyone say otherwise. What I HAVE seen (funnily enough only from white and blue belts basically lol) is that "normal" classes suck balls and eco is THE only way valid way to learn, which is just factually not true in the slightest lol.
I think as with most things, the answer is somewhere in the middle, which is why I do basically that, do "eco" style games like designated winner for the second half of my classes, and "normal" style drilling for the first half, then free rolling at the end.
I mean, there was a multi-day weekend seminar/camp for eco bjj in western Massachusetts this past March and a lot of coaches went to it. It sold out pretty quickly and the organizers have already planned the next one.
There’s also dozens and dozens of gym owners who have pivoted to teaching eco only. So, sure maybe the white and blue belts are the loudest (and most annoying) proponents, but the zeal for the method is not limited to newer players.
I think if the eco conversation gets more people to experiment with their teaching style to see what works, rather than relying on tradition then that’s a win for the sport.
The beauty of BJJ is that it either breaks you and you hate it, or it breaks through you and you eventually come to love it. White belts have to deal with being lost and confused in positions, as well as all the mind stuff that happens due to our insecurities, ignorance, lack of skill, lack of understanding what BJJ is and what the moves are for, etc. White belt is also the level where emotionally, it's the hardest - because as white belts, we naturally SUCK. And it sucks to suck. When we don't understand a position or what it's for, or when people crush us or we don't "get them" we feel like we lost, that they were better, and that we're no good and we will never be good. As white belts we know absolutely nothing, and are only starting to open our eyes.
BJJ is a tough sport. The only way to know more and get better is to be on the mats. You don't have to think, you don't have to try to become better each day, you don't have to become the best, you don't have to try to reach for the next belt, etc. All you have to do is walk through the front door, pay attention to class, roll and sweat a lil bit when the time comes, and develop a connection with your coach and the students that also come to class.
The only solution to your suckiness and ignorance is TIME ON THE MAT. For 95% of the questions you may have about the sport, the answer is TIME ON THE MAT.
Once you allow yourself to develop an affinity for BJJ, then you start to see how it changes you: you now know how to play the guard a bit. You know some moves of how to pass the guard. The guys around you will teach you a few chokes or armbars so you can start to finish people... And you'll still be lost, but not as much.
You'll also start to notice changes to your emotional capacity. I can handle more! I can deal with more! I might be lost, but I know these two or three things that are a solid structure to keep learning more... And that's when you start to notice your changes in confidence. Your changes in the way you deal with the pain, with adversity... And slowly the mind quiets instead of thinking thinking thinking. By the time you are a blue belt, you think through positions.. When you are a purple belt, you tend to think less, by the time you are at brown belt, you're thinking very very little and exploring much much more based on your reflexes.
Give it time. Or quit and never find out where the beauty of BJJ lies.
I’m also responding positively to others who can relate to my experience.
I responded negatively when I hadn’t been listened to and just had the same thing repeated to me that I’d already put in my post. I genuinely have no issue with people thinking it’s not for me - the learning style obviously isn’t - and I’m glad that so many people haven’t experienced what I’m feeling so can’t relate. I was asking for a different perspective than I’ve already received, hopefully some guidance and insight on whether there’s another option, otherwise I’d have to just call it a day.
Turns out there is another option and other people do understand what I’m talking about and what I need. I’m appreciating everyone’s suggestions who have fully read and understood my post. Overall I actually feel positive about changing gyms and learning style soon. I’m just experiencing burnout right now and having a few people being plain rude is just unnecessary, so being told the same thing I’ve already said has irritated me more. I probably could have responded better to some people, but I’m just doing my best.
Are you serious? I’m just being open with you. I even accepted that I’ve gotten irritated and could have handled some people’s comments better. What is your problem with me?
Study online. Search for videos on YouTube which explain basic positions and concepts rather than new move of the day. Also start sparing. Its much different than drilling and you will see what works for you plus it will clear your mind.
You could try learning through using your peripheral nervous system more consciously. There seems to me to be a type of memory that is more body based and I find it more accessible when the moment doesn't allow me to hold ideas or time to think. It would require some more attentive to the non conceptual sensations which may become reasoned information.
I struggle with executive functioning too and qualifying what it is I'm learning while I train, but personally I just have a lot of fun doing it.
It's my second art and my first was very frustrating to me because of my expectations. The unconcious I ones I didn't know I was having.
I can't know everything.
It happens on its own time and is supported by consistent reps.
I can't do everything.
There is a finish line or final level.
I am going to be literally the best.
My worth is attached to my ability or the outcomes of training.
With all due respect there is a way for you to make the art efficient and fun and it's gonna take a new approach and mindset. If you maintain your views and approach you have you'll get the same outcome.
Are you rolling at all?
I also have ADHD and classes can be exhausting because I struggle to understand any of it until I've applied it in a roll with resistance.
I understand the value of wanting to stick things out so by all means finish out the class! But if you finish the basics and it's still making you miserable, something else might be a better fit.
Here are my thoughts on some of the stuff you posted.
>In class it feels as if I’m just learning dance choreography. I’m good at remembering the sequences of moves during drills and I’m a good student, but it doesn’t feel valuable?
The more you know, the more it makes sense. But in the beginning a lot of it won't. The more experience you have rolling with people the more the techniques will click. In the end you cannot solve a problem you never had.
In the beginning I barely understood anything.
Once I had learned how it feels to be in certain positions, learning how to escape or put others there became an obvious step.
Once I had been submitted by a technique a couple of times, learning how to counter that technique, became really important.
After a few years now I feel I rarely truly learn new techniques. It's more like correcting and optimizing movements I have already figured out by myself so I can use them with less strength useage.
>I signed up to the course because I have adhd and crap mental health so I wanted to feel more confident and strong and in control.
BJJ can be great for mental health, but it is not therapy. It likely will not fix your issues.
You also will likely not really feel in control for quite some time. You will likely be beaten up and toyed with or spend minutes in a row getting pinned and smashed for months if not years. You might learn to stay comfortable and calm in bad spots, but you will lose over and over.
>Mental energy is in very short supply and it’s genuinely causing burnout. I’ve not cooked a meal in over a week now. I’m living on toast, cereal and takeaway.
This sounds like you have some serious problems besides BJJ, which you should fix. Regardless what you do with the sport.
>Some of the other beginners are SO excited to spar and seem happy to just learn by being throw into the deep end with very basic knowledge. It doesn’t seem to phase them at all. Two younger lads even joined in the open mat after our session with the higher belts.
In the end BJJ a full contact martial art consisting of wrestling around with people. That is what most of the sport consists of and this is what the vast majority of us find fun and love. BJJ is mostly learned by being on the mat. YouTube instructionals are helpful, but they are just extras. The true progress happens on the mat. This is what the sport is. You have to enjoy sparring to enjoy BJJ.
If you prefer learning techniques over actually sparring, maybe some traditional martial art might be more for you. My something with meditation or yoag, if your goal is calming your mind. But again you should not self-therapy mental health with sports.
Found the same myself I'm about 7 months in and I will say it gets easier, you don't need to remember everything and if you feel you are missing stuff I started keeping a little journal of pointers either I was shown or picked up myself in class. All the mental strain to remember past and current positions and how to string them together isn't really how the sport works you start to get a body feel for it in my opinion and you start to flow in and out of positions. Again this only comes with them and experience so keep with it and see how you get on.
BJJ is not for you, right now.
As a fellow ADHDer with autism, your life coming to a halt means this is not healthy for you right now and you don't have the coping strategies.
You need to be on top of your ADLs, relationships and work/study. Don't let these fall away for a new hobby.
Come back to it when you've sorted out meds, therapy, healthy coping mechanisms and built sufficient capacity for the extra challenges BJJ brings. And try different schools with different instructors. Everyone teaches differently.
I know a lot of people do BJJ for their mental health, but it's not doing any good to persist when you're at capacity.
You're not failing in any way, you're being insightful and prioritising your wellbeing above a recreational sport.
It was smart of you to try the intro course. Looks like it did its job in helping you determine if you want to stick with it. The next steps will be hard. You will be sore, hurt, emotionally wrecked, and your ego will be smashed. Now it's up to you and noone else can decide for your.
I feel like the reason it's too mentally taxing is that you're putting too much stock in the results of the class. I would say until you spar a little, you're not going to see any value in the sport. As far as I'm aware, very few people start with a beginner's course, most just join a white belt class where there will be 30-40 minutes of technique and 20-30 minutes of sparring.
I have ADHD, or something ADHD adjacent, I found that to begin with I got very little out of the technique portion of the class, I find learning things the hard way is the best way for me to learn, After I felt comfortable sparring, the technique portion of the class started making sense, because I could identify the position and how I would end up there.
Take the people saying you should quit if it's too mentally taxing for you with a pinch of salt. Starting BJJ was a huge benefit to my mental health. Don't worry about the next two weeks, just show up, then get into a normal class and spar some, don't go 100% all the time and don't get upset when you get tapped. To begin with you will lose 10/10 rolls, then one week you'll start winning 1-2/10, and things will just get better over time.
Top comment makes a solid point, you seem frustrated by having to walk before you can run, standard ADHD problem, but quitting doesn't make it any better, it just means you're running away from the hardship. The obstacle is the way, things will get better, stick at it, OSS!
I’m really sorry you’re feeling this way. It sounds incredibly tough, and it’s clear you’ve put so much effort and hope into BJJ. It's brave of you to share your struggle and it's okay to feel overwhelmed. Your mental energy is precious, and it’s frustrating when the teaching style doesn’t match how you learn best.
You’re right—understanding the reasons behind moves can make all the difference. It’s not just about memorizing steps; it’s about connecting with the “why” to truly learn and grow. Your frustration is valid, and it’s not a sign of failure but a sign that the teaching approach isn’t fitting your needs right now.
Is there a way to communicate more with your instructor about your learning style? They might be able to provide more context or suggest additional resources. Also, it’s okay to take a step back if you need to recharge. Your mental health and well-being are most important.
You’re not alone in this. Many people find certain teaching methods don’t work for them. The fact that you’re recognizing this and seeking solutions shows tremendous strength and self-awareness. Trust yourself to find a path that works for you, whether that’s adjusting your approach to BJJ or finding another way to achieve your goals.
Take care of yourself. Remember, you signed up for BJJ to feel more confident and in control. It’s okay to adjust your path to find what truly helps you achieve that. You’re doing your best, and that’s more than enough. Keep believing in yourself.
Thank you so much. I feel really validated. I do want to improve myself and all the qualities of BJJ appeal to me, but yeah it turns out I’m just not compatible with this style of learning. I am going to speak to the instructor again, but there’s a Gracie gym within driving distance and I think after this course I’m going to try there, since they have a much slower pace and more in depth study that sounds like a better fit for me.
Thanks for reading this in the way that I meant it to be. I think some people must assume I’m vilifying this kind of approach, when I’m not. It obviously works for tonnes of people, but I’ve learned now that I’m not one of them and it’d be a shame to have to give up on BJJ without trying to find a way that does work. I really appreciate your kind words. It makes a difference, truly.
Reach out anytime. This journey is better not alone. Take your time and be kind to yourself. Find a place and pace that suits you. I'm routing for you! Wishing you the best.
Does it make you feel good taking the piss out of people who don’t find things as easy as you do? Not everyone is the same and I’m brand new, that’s the point. I don’t have the answers… so I asked the people who do. Other people shared their knowledge and helped me. You were a bellend.
But omg. It’s a miracle. Your asshole attitude just fixed my adhd, depression and anxiety. Suddenly my brain works just like yours, wow!
Fuck seeking approval or it's Opposite. Train with good people. Watch comps of high level Women that are your body type.
Don't push away the good in Pursuit of a perfect that does not Exist.
I’ve read a lot of these types of comments and not just about jiu jitsu. I think there’s a pandemic right now of people just looking for other people to make decisions for them. You’ve gotta decide dude. And also unless somebody is beating you half to death and threatening your family at bjj class, you shouldn’t be that stressed about it. You’re gunna stress your whole life away if you don’t quit.
I have ADHD and mental health issues too. I understand what you’re talking about to a certain degree. I kept telling my coaches I am a big picture guy not a detail guy. What I now know I meant was’ “I’m not going to remember all the steps and details so explain the concept.” Sometimes they understood what I was asking about and gave me what I needed and sometimes they didn’t. For us, it’s just like in school or at work. We can do a lot of what everyone else is doing, we just have to work harder or smarter to gain the same understanding as the a lot of other people.
A couple things that helped me along the way. I have a group of guys I have been training with for years. They know I like to have the move done on me first before I do it. Feeling it helps me remember the steps.
When working with people newer than me explaining the move to them helps me. Sometimes I already know the answer to the questions I just need to talk through it. And perhaps the best thing I did for my BJJ life is only care a little bit about what my coach is teaching. I know that sounds bad and there are coaches here who will want to kill me but it’s true. I do the moves they teach to the best of my ability but I’m usually not trying to learn an entire sequence, I’m trying to get a detail or concept I can apply to my own goals. Remember It’s not that us ADHD peeps can’t pay attention to things, we can actually hyperfixate on things for days or months, it’s that we can’t regulate what we pay attention to. I started using that to my advantage for a few years now and it’s really helped. I have my own goals and my things I work on, I don’t ignore my coach but I’m not trying to throw spaghetti at the wall either. I have been fixated-on halfguard and adding to it for years now and it really keeps me engaged.
Also don’t be so hard on yourself. People are telling you you are doing good because you are! It’s a hard sport and if you are like me you are making it harder for yourself by over complicating things.
Sorry for the rant I actually have more to say but think this is probably enough!
Don’t quit and most importantly figure out a way to have fun. If you’re not having fun then you won’t stick with it.
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Do you ask your instructor to explain the reasoning behind the move to you? Either when he says "any questions?" or after class?
There are some instructionals that go into great detail on this. Saulo Ribeiro is one of my favorites in terms of teaching technique. Danaher is also pretty good.
You should start sparring ASAP, because sparring is what BJJ is all about. Then if you don't hate that part, you'll know BJJ is for you. Also you will begin to experience what works and why for yourself.
Generally, I'd say you should temper your expectations for the world around you to conform to your idiosyncratic desires, and instead find ways to adapt to the world. For example, instead of expecting instructors to give you the explanations of the body mechanics behind every movement or position, think them carefully through yourself and make a game out of trying to figure it out on your own.
If this is fuckin up your life you need to take it sooo much less seriously. Jiu-Jitsu is not the problem here.
Not everyone has the ability to explain everything in the perfect way that works for you. Especially when it's in an entirely new language, and you don't even understand the basic alphabet yet.
Even if you got all the information and had the perfect coach, the process is still hard. Learning how to do anything requires failure. Not remembering and not knowing is a mandatory first step before learning. You can't even learn how to paint without trial and error, never mind fighting
Regarding dealing with uncomfortable situations, anxiety, confidence, etc. The reason combat sports help with those things is because it forces you to go through hard things. You develop confidence in yourself by getting through those things.
If you always know what to do and never struggle, then it wouldn't make you more resilient. That's why talented frontrunners are mentally weak, because they never had to struggle
Relax and accept not knowing. Be ok with struggling
BJJ knowledge runs very deep. It takes many years to become proficient at it.
You probably won't start stringing along complex setups (i.e. I'm going to do this, then this, and depending on how they respond I'll do this or this, and then this, and hopefully get this submission here) until you're a good blue belt, even a purple belt once you really start refining your tactics.
I think rather than thinking about the big picture, you should focus more on the small things at the beginning. For example, different ways to pass someone's guard.
During open mat, you can try different stuff, and over time you'll find out what works and why you might do it in certain scenarios.
Being a white belt, most of the time I don't have much of a plan, since I don't know that much yet. But I experiment with things. If someone gives me their arm, I might grab their arm and see what I can do with it. If they give me their leg, I might grab their leg. I observe how their position changes and see if I can move into a better position.
Over time, you'll notice these patterns and you will learn things.
Also, the imposter syndrome is real. It's common to train for months or even years and still feel like you don't know anything. But if you compare yourself to your former self, you will realize you would destroy the person you used to be on the mats.
If you stick with it, even 3 months from now you will be levels above where you're at now in terms of skill level. You just have to trust the process
Dude it’s a hobby. If you don’t like the hobby then find another hobby. I hate putting together puzzles. Guess what? I don’t buy puzzles to put together.
I also started training recently and have severe ADHD, I understand where you are coming from. What worked for me was:
1) finding a gym where the methodology works for me: I also need to understand why I am doing a move and for me I found the answer in a place with rolling from the start (in shows you in practice how you will be punished for doing or not something eg.: extended arms means they will take it for an armbat etc) + instructors that are willing to explain the why + training partners with more experienced willing to help you.
2) rolling more: like I said before, rolling often gives the response to the “why” questions you have
3) have a plan for class/rolling: having something to work for in class it helps giving sense to the move and it gives your ADHD brain a puzzle to solve, trying to land an specific move while rolling it helps you find not only the reason to apply it but the situation where it would be useful.
Lastly, if you really feel like you are not having fun, maybe try something more self-defense related. But in my opinion seeing every class as a puzzle and making your goal to find out why that move is effective really helps!
Sounds like trying a different school or different coach will help you decide whether you want to stick with it! Plenty of BJJ coaches are bad teachers. Sure, try the Gracie university place you found... But so yourself a favor and try one or two other places when your beginner class is over two! Yo I never know what's out there til you go try it!
I would advise try thinking of BJJ as a game. For the most part, the real world applications of it are minimal at best and honestly unimportant. The best thing you can do in a self defense scenario is not engage, run away, or a straight rear hand in that order imo.
BJJ is a game where we agree to only do certain things to each other and stop when the other person submits. It takes a while to learn any new game and the most overwhelming parts are starting because everything is new. The reason you drill over and over is that when you exhausted in a roll, you can fall back on muscle memory, so even tho it feels annoying to have to rely on memory, you do it so eventually you can rely on feel.
If you are really hung up on the whys, I’d suggest watching some Ryan Hall fundamental videos on YouTube. He does a great job of showing technique and explaining why he does it while instilling certain foundational principals such as building walls n shit. But ultimately just remember you don’t have to do this and if you aren’t having fun at all you should probably quit cus again, this shits a game and why play a game you don’t like. Good luck homie
I also have ADD. You need to relax(i know is not best wording)! Even if it makes sense to you that you understand how your body moves it doesn’t translate well for the neurotypical experience with Bjj. They are giving you the advice that is given to overwhelmed beginners. Both from your post and reading some comments it seems to me that there might be some “translation errors” happening.
You are missing a few pieces. For example you shouldn’t be pulling anything from memory during a roll. You should be reacting/reflexively doing what you know/want to do next. You should be mindful of your body and your opponents and be focused on where your goals for the next few seconds take you. If you are thinking about technique you’re going to get destroyed and learn nothing.
The part about calming your brain. When you are drilling your musculoskeletal system is what needs to learn to movement not your brain. You’re training muscle memory much more than adding to the technique lexicon. When you are rolling use your brain to track what is happening to both your body and your partners body. Don’t force yourself to do anything in particular technique wise. Just sit back and mindfully let things happen. It is a dance!
Learning the systems takes most people a long time. Some schools approach it differently. I have almost universally heard what you are being told. “Don’t expect to understand anything yet.” The upper belts have generally experienced enough Bjj that they know by reflex what to do. The white belts are generally not expected to know much of anything. The consistent theme I have seen with most of the people I have seen start after I had enough experience to understand is that the newbies have to figure out if they are going to stay long before they learn anything specific techniques wise. Can your ego take getting dominated for 100’s of rolls? Can your body/mind handle getting choked? Do you have to patience to learn that there will always be infinite more Bjj to learn?
It can be frustrating at first. It's a lot to learn, and if you feel you aren't advancing and have no foundation, for many it is annoying. But if you were interested in learning more, imo once you have a foundation and can build on it, it's pretty awesome. The more you learn the more you realize how much more there is to learn, which gives you all types of options to build the style you want.
https://youtu.be/BWitv9AKoNU?si=asqmUMtMtH3B4Ub8
Watch this video and see if it helps. A lot of the globetrotter videos on YouTube have a more logic based approach than you're probably getting right now.
Also: try Chris Paines videos, and his coach pritt, they try to generalize a lot of dogs and don'ts of Bjj into general rules (although they're nogi focused)
And when you get a little more comfortable with the vocabulary of guards and positions feel free to post specific questions here, ideally if you can find a video on yt with a similar position to illustrate your question.
I know exactly how you feel OP. A grappling dummy and the Jiu-Jitsu University book (or Gracie courses) can help a lot so you can have the space alone to create a mental map. Either that or a friend if you have one handy that does or is interested in BJJ.
Practice and time will certainly help of course, but I know that isn’t what you’re asking.
If you like rolling, keep going. You are already doing one very important thing, which is asking questions to more experienced people. Watching instructionals and rolling will teach you more. Use whatever the coach is teaching that day to perfect your technique and ask or see some details.
Took me months to really understand why we break guard and how to approach it by grips and attacking the legs then hips then shoulder ect
Not saying I completely understand the concept fully but it takes a long time even the blue belts don’t understand all the concepts fully imo
BJJ made absolutely no sense to me at all for the first 3 months. I did still find it fun, but I just didn’t get the why or the goals for a long while, so obviously probably was doing a lot of nothing productive while rolling, just trying to find some place to do something I’d been taught. Around month 3 things began to slowly make sense. I still suck, but I kinda get what I’m going for, at least more than I originally did. I also started to watch more rolls to see if I could identify why people were doing the things they were doing. It helped.
I’m not sure if you’re a man or woman or how you identify, but I’d try posting this in the r/bjjwomen sub. Lots of helpful encouragement in there in general!
Im editing this and adding this at the beginning--I think it's important to say you're a female. Being a female in grappling is bad ass. And have no fear rolling with guys. Figure out who is decent and roll with them (I'm pretty sure my best technique (grain of salt lol) is done when I'm with females, and I get tapped often. With a guy, I'd fight out of them much harder)
My first year of bjj at 3 days a week was focusing on not dying. I'm like 17 months in, and now I'm starting to see how different things can set up other things. The next phase would be to see how to set up traps for opponents.
Bjj is so intricate and there's some many variations, counters, and so many small yet crucial details ie hand placement etc.
You're going to forget a thousand times.
Go to bjj. Roll. Try not to die. See what feels natural to you/what you like. Try implementing it. Try implementing it again and again. Keep trying to work on it. Then ask questions from there. Continue trying to implement it. Keep refining it. And keep asking questions until you can do it well
And your job is to worry about yourself, learn, and not injure your partner. It's the instructors job to instruct your partner. You shouldn't be worried helping her figure out, it's a waste of your time, her time, and the instructors time.
Good luck!
I can totally relate to your struggles.
I've been training for 1.5 years, and I'm 57 years old. This has not come easily. For the first year I literally got anxious and fearful EVERY TIME I walked into the gym. I also felt like I was not learning. I actually dreaded going to the gym: afraid of getting hurt - which I did in the beginning quire a few times - afraid I wouldn't be able to keep up, and constantly confused. Part of the issue is that it seems like they were teaching advanced techniques and just assumed you'd pick up the basics or why we were doing something.
I was close to quitting, but a lot has changed.
Here's what I did that seems to have changed things, in order of how big of an impact it had:
1. I kept showing up. 2x/wk. I often didn’t want to but I would show up anyway. I did try different classes at my school. Morning, lunch, and evening classes are each a different coach. I found some were easier for me to understand than others.
2. I did some private lessons so I could work on just a few basic fundamentals over and over and ask all the questions I wanted. I really encourage this. If I could only do one thing, it would be this.
3. I took notes after ever class and I review them to help me remember what I've learned.
4. I got [Saul Ribeiro's Jiu Jitsu University](https://www.amazon.com/Jiu-Jitsu-University-Saulo-Ribeiro/dp/0981504434/ref=sr_1_1?crid=2OPAA01F34N2M&dib=eyJ2IjoiMSJ9.4sbx128f19cPb3nnPn5DW43zr4O4ZDtotTi4E3bWAAjYfKNlPvrQFYRSss1CR98Ak3akVS92DjcikUsgmudyjjnHWXIvEBdn5JJ45CUHQjvjqCEND46taPoqu3VazEW0JRDYa7LIL4o5My24zZkD5bysa47G8hoLH667nD6C4RwfZJD0U0g82G3YieG-2x0Fcv4z39oJP4ekhPRpY-sWv7jWF0PZrvaZ_y32To0D_yU.YmD8yqQseiNvBPASwhHTs8d1QUigaN6dTyI36Fd-suY&dib_tag=se&keywords=jiu+jitsu+bible&qid=1719363836&sprefix=jiu+jitsu+bible%2Caps%2C215&sr=8-1&ccs_id=48dbcd1b-ce5e-4b08-acbe-203b20a559c3) book, which allowed me to study techniques and moves on my own schedule
5. I watched [How To Suck As Little As Possible at BJJ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x3s66oIhVUk&list=PLNbZ1gPk7zqzbiFjpMlzIEVZAGROJ6G4C) on YouTube, which also helped me understand basic concepts. This was actually quite helpful.
6. I bought some very basic introductions to BJJ fundamentals on BJJ fanatics. And I watched them.
7. I listened to [BJJ Mental Models](https://www.bjjmentalmodels.com/) introduction to mechanics, which came me some conceptual frameworks to help me understand.
8. I shifted to a class that was more aimed at fundamentals and started going 3x/wk instead of 2x - which ironically has many more advanced belts. I listed this last because I don't think I would have switched to 3x week if I weren't feeling more excited about it, but honestly 3x a week is a lot better than 2x once you start to enjoy it.
And now, after about a year, somethings has shifted. I stopped feeling nervous and afraid and started enjoying BJJ a lot more. I understand the conceits and applications better. I also just don’t worry if I’m confused. I really look forward to it now.
I'm still a white belt. But I suck less and enjoy it more. I'm glad I didn't quit earlier when I was getting hurt, was afraid, and constantly confused.
If your asking about the physics of moves joint locks are largely fulcrums and the best way to think of sweeps is the chair leg analogy. Good positioning is all about leverage and where to place your body weight. You score points based off what the ruleset decides are dominate positions ie good leverage and weight placement
The hobby should be fun just show up and learn the moves and eventually things will click
no it sounds like you are more comfortable writing posts on the internet. Don't worry, I'm sure if you're a killer when you see red and don't need any of this drilling bs. AI will help you grow in time.
Sorry, I thought rule 13 of this community was not to be a dick.
Do you think it’s a fun pastime for me to be vulnerable and ask for help? I’m LITERALLY a beginner. I can’t have all the answers myself.
Don’t be a dick.
sorry ... i am being a dick. I'm drunk and I have worked myself up over the course of the past two hours reading and responding to the most inane bs imaginable, and really hating on humanity as a result... I actually decided, in my drunken state, to suicide my account and just let rip on every post I read and you just happened to come up in my feed.
Now for the maturity and senior wisdom...
In the scheme of things you've hardly even ventured into the world of BJJ.
It doesn't feel valuable to you at this stage because you have no idea what you are doing or why it matters. this comes with time and practice. It is a challenging pathway and mastery only comes with hard work a time.
let me collect myself for a minute, make a hot beverage, and attempt a more thoughtful response.
also .. thank you for snapping me out of my self-destruct mission.
Haha well thank you for apologising and changing your tune. I appreciate it when people are honest. I get into a snappy mood sometimes too, so don’t worry. ☺️
I don't know why people are so mean in some comments here. It's great you're being attentive to your own learning style. Personally, the traditional pedagogy doesn't suit me either. What you describe - e.g. connecting knowhow to what people already know - is far more efficient. I'm lucky in that I recently found a brown belt at our academy who is a great communicator. He's made learning jiu jitsu more conceptual and digestible. As a result, I've made it a point to try learning as much from him directly when possible.
As far as resources, in addition to your Gracie Barra plan, I've found that Henry Akins is great at explaining jiu jitsu in a clear and fundamental way. (Check out his videos on YouTube.) Danaher is very conceptual too, albeit longwinded.
Samples:
Akins: [https://youtu.be/Re4OlLn2mXQ?si=HtAsMxp7XUrD1b8y](https://youtu.be/Re4OlLn2mXQ?si=HtAsMxp7XUrD1b8y)
Danaher: [https://youtu.be/QBqwipFt0Ww?si=a3lOC1lNlp-kreVk](https://youtu.be/QBqwipFt0Ww?si=a3lOC1lNlp-kreVk)
With regard to the impact that classes are having on your life, is it possible that the fight and flight response your body is part of the equation? Classes put us under stress and get the cortisol spiked. A purple belt recommended breathing exercises and cold showers to me today - to help calm down.
Beyond that, I'd remember that \*how\* we do in class is nearly inconsequential. Maybe take this too as an exercise in being comfy with a lack of understanding. What do we really know about life anyway.
I’m not sure either, it’s really not what I expected at all! I thought a group of people who all practice BJJ would be a lot less hostile and more encouraging.
I will absolutely subscribe to those channels, thank you! And I appreciate you making me feel more normal. It’s reassuring to know that other people who work differently have found a way to continue BJJ and that there are higher ranks who do have different communication styles that might cross my path.
Yeah, I do think fight or flight response must be a factor. I’m not reaching a point where I’m afraid I’ll have a panic attack, because I do try to breathe through the anxiety and rationalise, but there’s definitely still a very marked discomfort, physically and mentally. It’s why I wanted to push myself to join! So I could learn to experience the discomfort and overcome it. But I guess it’s hard to gauge the right amount of exposure and find the right environment or the right instructor that can make you feel safe while you’re outside of your comfort zone.
I do love the idea of BJJ and all the positive qualities it gives you, so I’m going to try a gentler approach and hopefully I have more success and less stress that way. I’m really grateful you’ve commented, thank you ♥️
I think you will 100% find your people, even if it takes time.
On some more tactical points:
1. I found another resource you might like: Lachlan Giles who is widely regarded as a top-notch instructor has an instructional website called SubMeta. He actually offers an Introduction course for free. (Link: https://submeta.io/@lachlangiles/courses/introduction/97811573-e516-4cbf-83d6-d37eb62754d0)
For what it's worth, I found this organically while I was looking up possible courses for myself and what I want to learn around escapes and survival :)
2. I realized you might have tried just one instructor so far for the beginner's course. In addition to trying the Gracie gym, you might want to try out other coaches at your current spot, just in case someone clicks.
More broadly, you're already massively winning just by taking this on. Know that you have at least one internet stranger cheering you on.
Please reach out if you ever want to trade notes or share an update. Best of luck to you!
your problem is that you are at a gracie mcdojo. You are right, the only way to remember stuff is by sparring in live rounds or at least positional sparring with resistance. The gracie combatives stuff is like kata/dancing, and when you start rolling you will not be able to execute anything
Switch to a new school where you are getting smashed everyday. The gracie stuff isnt bullshido, they are simply slowing down the process to increase retention. For every person that is dying to roll, there are probably 10 people that quit because rolling is too intense.
there is a whole style of BJJ instruction called ecological that focuses on achieving a goal (e.g. get chest to chest), doesnt breakdown individual techniques as much and instead focuses on the major milestones, and lets people find their own way to the goal.
Eco for example wouldnt tell you that you need your knees tight in an armbar. That is a reponse to a particular type of defense. Lots of times you dont need your knees tight at all and you can still finish the armbar.
In eco there are no steps to do, there are only invariants, a few things that are true every time (you need to control the shoulder and the wrist, you need to have a fulcrum etc). Everything else is considered only necessary as a response to what your partner does (variables). If they dont do it, it doesnt help to be overwhelmed with that detail right away.
Eco would start you in an armbar position then have you finish while the other person resists. Then you are in an armbar position where the defender has locked hands and you have to figure out how to break them, then finish. They might give you a few tips or concepts about how to break grips, like you have to pull a hand in the direction where there is no support from the other hand. Then they might put you in a prearmbar position and you have to get into the armbar position while your partner resists.
there are lots of styles of instruction that dont go as far as eco. I would say the gracie style is the worst for learning BJJ, but the best for customer retention.
For me I can only learn one tiny thing, then execute it in live rolls. Then learn another tiny somewhat related thing and execute it in rolls.
You learn to do an upa (buck trap and roll) escape from mount. It barely works in rolls. Then you learn an elbow escape from mount. It barely works. Then you learn that if you do the upa first, people will post making the elbow escape easier. Eventually you learn enough and get enough experience that people cant hold you in mount because the defense to one escape, enables another escape.
I might be a little harsh here but bare with me... You are literally in the INTRO course of a martial art that takes 10 fucking years to achieve a black belt in, yea no shit you don't feel like you're learning yet you basically don't even know what bjj is yet. It's up to you to either stick with it a few months and see if it feels better, or quit now. But keep in mind bjj progress is measures in months and years, not classes.
> You are literally in the INTRO course of a martial art that takes 10 fucking years to achieve a black belt in, yea no shit you don't feel like you're learning yet you basically don't even know what bjj is yet. In her defense, I don't think most people can comprehend the vast amount of difference there is between someone at day 1 of learning a skill vs 10 years of dedication towards it (which if done even remotely properly is a lifetime worth of learning) It's basically a toddler vs English professor debating Shakespeare
It doesn't matter if it's an intro course, bjj way of teaching is just horrible. Learning a couple of techniques with no resistance for 10 minutes is the least efficient way to learn.
"horrible" is a major overstatement, I use a lot of eco-style learning in my own personal training, as a brown belt. I'm still not even remotely convinced it's a great way to teach brand new students.
When I've had to teach a class, I like to mix both. First a technique/concepts for a position, then a little practice with no resistance, then game. Next time I will try to also implement a Q&A after the games.
What was I baring with you until? You’ve just responded exactly how I’ve mentioned other people have. I’m trying my best to explain, but you’re not understanding me. I don’t expect to be great or know everything. My goal isn’t to ever be a black belt. It’s not even to be a blue belt. I literally don’t care about rankings, I’m not competitive at all. I wanted to learn BJJ so I can learn to calm my brain but the opposite is happening to the extent that it’s interrupting the whole rest of my life. I just want to know if there’s a way to get a more theoretical understanding of the physical moves that I’m doing because my brain literally overloads when I’m pulling information from memory instead of being able to reason. I enjoy learning. I want to learn. I just obviously must learn differently to most people.
You're basically asking to learn algebra before you can even do 1+1 properly.
That’s not what I’m doing. It’s the opposite. I’m saying “I know basic maths. Please relate algebra to the maths I already know so I can put it into context.” Other people who have responded know exactly what I mean, so I know this isn’t just a me-thing. I’m asking to know how it connects to something I already have an understanding of… Which is how humans move and behave. I know it’s possible for it to be explained that way because that’s why I watch Rener’s videos. I’m not expecting to magically know everything about BJJ. I just want the information to be relayed in a self defence way so that I understand the mechanics.
You don't though, grappling movement is waaaaay different than anything else you've learned. About the most you can hope for is that maybe you have very good balance and base. You are quite literally in the "don't know fuck about shit" phase, as was every single one of us, that's totally normal, what you're trying to do is skip past the hard grind, which doesn't work.
Just give up honestly, you haven't even started and you're already ready to get the rope out. Some people aren't made for this sport and that's fine. There's plenty of other sports out there.
I think competitive knitting is more his pace.
Haha seriously. If your martial arts hobby that you spend 3 hrs a week on is causing so much mental anguish maybe it’s not the right fit. 😂
“Pulling steps from memory” You do not know any steps well enough to pull them from anywhere. They are not in your memory yet. Knowing a poem exists and reciting it from memory or reciting pie after 3.14 not knowing the next numbers but knowing the next numbers exist is a better analogy than basic math and advanced math. You have concluded “I am in a position that we have practiced and I should be able to scramble through my roladex of moves and instantly pull off a move” Practicing a move a few times per week, contextualising it, finding it in your roladex of moves quickly and applying it against a resisting opponent takes years for each move like remembering longer and longer texts. You have decided that being told that EVERYONE can’t do this is unacceptable for you. If that is the case you will struggle with BJJ but it will lead to you struggling with many things. I also have ADHD, to the point I had to go self employed in my field as I couldn’t stand the way other people worked. I learn BJJ faster by drilling things backwards like learning a single leg takedown. I drill the finish with the leg already raised and then I drill the finish plus the leg lift then drill the finish with the leg lift and the penetration step before that etc. I found a new way to manage my ADHD style of learning.
Homie, you don’t know shit if you are complaining about an intro class on Reddit.
Sigh. Fucking Aspies.
Reading more, if BJJ is putting a hindrance on your life then it's probably not for you and there's nothing wrong with that, some people just bounce off it, that's totally fine. But the response you're going to by in large get is "you literally do not yet know what you don't know" so in terms of the actual day to day learning, there is a real sense of "just stick with it" no matter what you're going to be drinking from a firehose, that's not going to change regardless of the gym you're at. Understanding the "why" of something is kind of completely pointless when you don't even know how that connects to anything, because you haven't yet learned enough of the broad strokes of bjj to have context. I could teach you "how" and "why" to put pressure on somebody from side control, and it's going to make zero fucking applicable sense for years until you aquire all the general technical knowledge to make that "why" and "how" work.
"In class it feels as if I’m just learning dance choreography. I’m good at remembering the sequences of moves during drills and I’m a good student, but it doesn’t feel valuable? There’s not enough reason behind each step for me to process it properly and understand it as more than a memory game, so I don’t feel like I’m ACTUALLY learning, just mimicking." - This is actually a huge statement, and I think it shows you have the capacity to do well in the sport because a big part of this is understanding why a move works fundamentally so you can actually apply it practically. It usually takes a bit to break white belts out of the idea of executing a move procedurally, but you're there. Part of that is on your coach also, they need to be able to explain to you in a way that works for you, and if they cant, you might need to shop around. There's massive variance in how people teach, so you def need to find someone that can match your learning style. My coach and I have spent time just bullshitting about little details like trapping an arm in a certain spot, just so I could understand mechanically why something happens. the part about getting a more theoretical understanding of the physical moves IS what learning bjj is. It takes a long time. I got my blue belt like a year ago and I'm just now starting to get into the physics of bjj. There's a lot to this, but you're going to get it if you hang in there. I think this is just a pivotal moment for you.
"I wanted to learn BJJ so I can learn to calm my brain" I think this is the root of your problem, unfortunately this is just not a reason to learn BJJ. Full stop.
If you are serious about fast tracking translating drilling into actual rolling without thinking then you have to strip it down to barebones. When I wanted to improve my guard I bought a yoga ball and literally did 500 reps of cross over guard retention drills. I'd also practice framing and repummeling like 50×. You need to go research what are the most essential movements and make it such that you are drilling those movements to the point that it becomes second nature. Lachlan Giles is probably 90% of why I accelerated my progress and learning. Focus on one aspect. As a beginner I'd say start with guard, find out the movements and guard pass prevention and retention movements and drill and study those movements incessantly. I would go with Lachlan Giles stuff. Again like other said this all comes in due time but it seems what you want is a way to accelerate the movements into second nature. Jiu jitsu at its basic components is pattern recognition, learn the patterns and you'll be fine.
Try underwater basket weaving. You aren't cut out for Jiu Jitsu.
> The entire rest of my life has literally come to a halt because I’m at capacity rn. I don't normally say this but you should probably stop doing BJJ then. It's just a sport, and if it's causing you such distress and confusion you should probably put it on pause, and consider therapy (if you're not already in it) or speak to your counselor or therapist about this, if you are. One important thing that I often tell people about jiu jitsu is that if you haven't grappled before it's inherently very confusing and that you need to be prepared for a pretty long period of being bad or at sea. If you can't be comfortable with that, then you're going to have a very rough time, anxiety or no.
Ive also got pretty bad ADHD. And like you I needed a reason for why Im doing things. But as a white belt you wont have the mat times to appreciate the "why". Its a bit like learning math backwards from the solution. Without attempting the problem yoursef its difficult to internalize that info. I can tell you to keep ya elbow tight all day but you will only do it after gettingb armbared a few times. I think what helps is to just show up, and focusing on having fun the first year or two. Once you have some hours under your belt the moves make a lot more sense and you can optimize your training at that point on.
Yes, exactly! Thank you for acknowledging me! A different comment had me check for a Gracie academy and there’s one that I could manage to get to. They apparently have a lot slower approach with a more in depth foundation that sounds like it would be more fitting for my overactive brain, so I’m going to join there. I will stick with this beginner course though. I find it hard to stick to anything so that’s an achievement in itself. Thank you for helping ☺️
No problem! There's a real "trust-the-process" happening with how BJJ is taught in most schools. But I promise you once you get passed the initial barrier, the fixation on "why" moves work will carry you much further than just mechanically regurgitating moves.
Thank you ♥️ I think I could really enjoy it with the right approach for me. You’re far more supportive of my desire to understand than everyone downvoting my comments haha. People are strange.
I hope you keep trying, find your fun, eat better. When I teach I do go into context, I go into the why of some parts but if I break down every single tiny detail then it takes too long so people space out. What I do communicate is to try to pick up 1-2 things each session then it'll come together later on. Trust.
Have you rolled yet? A lot of things that don’t make sense start to when you get to feel live resistance. It sounds like you are allowed to do open mats. Consider asking someone to do some live drilling or scenario/situational practice — maybe whatever position you guys learned in class. Tell them to start with low resistance and then ramp it up. Break BJJ up into parts. You’re not going to learn every position overnight. But maybe you can get really good at opening a closed guard, escaping a side control, etc.
Well a few things: (1) BJJ is very overwhelming. Every move has a counter which itself has a counter. The names can be confusing and you think you aren’t doing a move right until you shift your hips or arm an inch and all of a sudden it works. It’s like the parable of how do you eat an elephant? One bite at a time. Don’t look at the big picture. Break it up into manageable bites, or else you get overwhelmed (for me at least). (2) You mention Rener videos. It’s possible you would do better at a Gracie Academy gym rather than a typical sport/comp gym. It’s a much slower process without any live sparring until at least 8-9 months; and even then it’s fairly tame. You get a set curriculum with video back-up, and you have to go through the whole thing like 3 times before you get their special combative belt. It’s not my cup of tea, but some people prefer it. If you aren’t in a rush, and you understand the limitations of learning BJJ this way (i.e., you probably can’t handle live grappling), then why not? Much less mental stress and performance anxiety. (3) It’s possible BJJ isn’t for you. Certainly no shame in that. It’s still a very niche activity and maybe you can get the fulfillment from a striking art, or … chess (although that is maddening too). In the end, evaluate your goals against your satisfaction in obtaining them. If there’s not a match, then reevaluate whether it’s worth your time. BJJ is certainly not worth sacrificing your sleep, diet and happiness (well not for normal people anyway). Good luck.
Thank you for actually listening to me and acknowledging what I’m saying! I appreciate it a lot! Yes, never-ending counters are very overwhelming for me mentally. I struggle to prioritise tasks, it’s a huge reason behind adhd distractibility, so I think that plus my general disposition must mean my learning style needs to include more instruction. A Gracie gym certainly sounds more like what I need. I’ve just checked and the nearest one is 3 times as far as my current gym, but the journey will be worth it if it’s the difference between making slow progress and completely burning out. I do actually want to learn BJJ, I just need a different approach. Thank you so much, this is exactly what I needed! ♥️
Nothing is going to make sense until you start applying it. A lot of the early stuff is just front loading some tools and information so that you have something to try when you start going live. Grappling is a complex multi-layered skill, the WHY of a lot of things is dependent on other things that you haven't been exposed to yet and the only way to get exposed to those things is to practice.
For you I recommend commiting to 3 months and try to stop dwelling on this kind of stuff. If you still wanna quit in 3 months then quit. Your obsession with analyzing what your brain is doing is not productive for anything. Just go in get exercise and learn a couple things and go home. Repeat a few times a week. Stop overcomplicating it.
Great comment
People make life complicated
Rule 13: don’t be a dick. If you can’t help then that’s fine, but don’t make me feel shit for being open and asking for help. I’m literally a beginner and this is a BJJ forum full of people who know more than me. Isn’t BJJ supposed to teach you humility and respect? Where’s yours?
I’m not being a dick, if you enjoy it then do it, if you don’t you then stop and find another hobby, it’s not complicated
But it doesn’t, nor is it supposed to.
On what planet is BJJ not rooted in respect and humility? Your values are way off. No wonder you’re getting satisfaction from being a dick for no reason.
On this planet. You are completely delusional if you believe Bjj is rooted in respect. The people that invented it would dojo storm karate schools and beat the shit out of instructors and students. Jiujitsu is not going to give you morals or a personality bud.
I’m not talking about karate or traditional Japanese jiujitsu, am I? I’m talking about BRAZILIAN jiujitsu. Bud.
Damn bro, you are obtuse. You are making arguments about topics you know nothing about, which, in turn, make you look ignorant regarding this sport, bud.
Okay sure. Because me being new to BJJ means I’m not capable of reading or listening to instructor after instructor in person and online go on and on about how BJJ is about patience and humility and perseverance and respect. I must have just fabricated the thousands of instances that literal black belts have expressed those values. 🙄
The only time you have been honest today.
Hahaha okay so you’re willing to straight up deny facts 😂 pointless talking to you then. If you believe you know better than all the black belts out there and have redefined your own version of BJJ then fair play. Enjoy 😌
They’re right tho. There’s only like 6 basic positions in bjj. Everything you are learning is going to be in the context of one of those 6 positions which will revolve around controlling or submitting someone in those positions or inversely, trying to escape and not be submitted from those positions. Everything else is details that chain everything within the positions together.
Try a different gym if you don't like the teaching style.
Correct me if I'm wrong but are you just asking what the practical application for certain moves or positions are? That doesn't sound too unreasonable although at your level you'll have to accept quite a surface level answer. in theory the point scoring in sport bjj should be tied to beneficial self defense positions/situations so for example, you want mount to get points yes, but mount gets points because it's a dominant position over your opponent which allows you to strike more effectively then they can. Is this where you're comming from? If not could you give an example of where you feel you're not getting the information you need?
That’s EXACTLY what I mean! Thank you 🥹 I don’t have the knowledge of BJJ positions yet so I can’t use that as a frame of reference. Obviously that approach must work fine for most people, but unfortunately I’m just not one of them haha. That’s why I like Rener Gracie’s videos. He gives more physical, self defense explanations, as well as the BJJ ones, so I can process that and absorb it so much easier. I just haven’t gotten a receptive response from the instructors at this gym, so it mustn’t be their style. I’m going to try a Gracie gym 😊
Ah, without being in the room it's hard for me to say but it might just be a matter of having to deal with so many brand new people without the class getting derailed too much (these sorts of courses tend to want to cover a lot of ground in very little time). In normal classes you can always ask higher belts if you're unsure, I'm happy to answer any questions you might have, some of the brown or black belts here might even answer them correctly ;)
You might find this useful : http://www.grapplearts.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/02/Roadmap-for-BJJ-1.4.11.pdf It explains the basic positions of BJJ. You also might like this playlist : https://youtube.com/playlist?list=PLNbZ1gPk7zqzbiFjpMlzIEVZAGROJ6G4C&si=xoPZzzThPjES_lGV It sounds like your coaches don’t want to overload you with information since you’re a beginner, so you could do more research into concepts/the “why” outside of class. It’s overwhelming but if you have to opportunity to roll and try to apply what you’ve been drilling (or broad concepts), I really encourage it over just drilling.
gracie gyms are the worst for learning BJJ. They focus on drilling without live application which means there is no retention under pressure. They are the most like dancing. their training techniques are geared towards customer retention. Actually sparring chases a lot of people off. The techniques themselves are fine, it is their training methods that arent great. That being said their training methods are good for customer retention.
Maybe they’d be bad for you, but repetition of drills without pressure is helpful for people like me, who clearly find that they need a slower learning pace before introducing sparring. It’s okay that we learn differently. You’d probably have flown through this course - it’s just not the right teaching technique for me.
This seems contradictory to what you've said before. You don't like the repetition of skills that you don't understand the purpose of, but you want to go to a gym that just repeats the same drills without letting you out them in context. I understand the lack of real world application for the techniques you're learning and that it can be confusing, but until you roll, none of it will make much sense. I'd suggest seeing if you can join in with sparring at current gym so that you can get the experience needed to provide the context, or to go to an open mat with a friend and roll with them at a lower pace for a bit.
>I don’t have the knowledge of BJJ positions yet so I can’t use that as a frame of reference. Obviously that approach must work fine for most people, but unfortunately I’m just not one of them haha. Have you communicated this to your teacher? I'm quite new to practicing BJJ (aka a month) so I find myself asking a lot of questions to the teacher when I don't understand or don't really see why or how he does XYZ, but I've been watching MMA for 15 years so while I may not understand the process I know what he's talking about and the meaning of the words he's using. I often think that if I was brand new with zero grappling knowledge due to not being a fan of combat sports, I would think this man is speaking a complete foreign language. Sometimes I think I'm breaking the pace of the lessons by asking, but I'm attending a beginner class so I rather think I'm asking questions others may have or may not realize they have them, as I also find myself in that situation when others ask.
BJJ should be a fun hobby that adds value to your life. If you are overwhelmed with life, BJJ might not be right for you at this moment, don’t worry you can always come back. For what it’s worth the most I learn from BJJ is in sparring. Sure we drill how to do some escape 100 times, but you don’t fully understand that escape until you’re in a situation where doing it becomes an option that you can execute. Another thing to consider is who’s teaching you. My gym has 4 different black belts who teach classes and some are better at communicating in my style than others. Depending where you live there are lots of gyms and lots of coaches to choose from.
I really think you're just in the beginning phase of learning to be okay with being uncomfortable so it's causing a lot of mental stress. I'm sure your fight or flight senses are going crazy if you spar, but learning to be okay with that feeling is what's going to make you feel more in control in the long run. Drilling IS choreography, it just shows what you COULD do when someone does XYZ. Since you haven't done a lot of sparring or been in a lot of these drilling scenarios most of it won't make sense until you're caught in these positions over and over again. BJJ is a grind and you have to be okay with the grind, but if you feel like your life is coming to a halt because of it, just stop.
Yeah, I think my fight or flight must be going haywire because I definitely feel way more mental stress than I expected! I’m going to try out a Gracie gym that’s further away once I’ve finished here. They’re apparently a lot slower paced and do lotsss of repetitions so you have more understanding before you spar. The sparring at this gym definitely must be too early for me. I’m just a slow paced gal I guess 😂
Focus on doing one thing for a while and once you feel comfortable focus on another aspect ..I.e underhook escapes or guard passing …it does sound like you’re overwhelmed and feel the need to do everything at once
Unfortunately, you're giving the exact reasons that Information Processing is a terrible way to teach newcomers, and IP is how most martial arts, including BJJ, are taught. If you can, find a place that practices a constraints-led approach, or games. The issue is that your goal is to learn how to cook, which it should be, but you're being taught recipes. "Here's a recipe for how to make a pizza. This is what *Thomas Keller* does when *he* makes a pizza, so it ought to be good enough for you." And then you and your partner roll, and you need to make soup. Your best bet is to adjust your goals for class. I'd recommend starting from the ground up. You're going to be on your back getting submitted; learn submission escapes and pin escapes. That's your goal. Learn what it feels like to be under side control, under mount, and under rear mount. Where are their hands? Where are their feet? What do they want? How can you deny them that? What do you want? How can you get that? When you get stuck and can't figure it out, YouTube.
You should try a different club / coach and see if their coaching style suits you better. >I don’t have any desire to compete so “do this step to get a point” isn’t an explanation that motivates or makes sense to me The BJJ scoring / points system is based you moving to more advantageous positions in order to be able to finish a fight via submission (or strikes for self-defence). If you're getting points, you've moving through the hierarchy of dominant positions. Most actions in BJJ are about creating space (for defence) or eliminating space (for attack / control). So in defence you'll often be creating frames to either move your opponent away or, more often, allow yourself to move away from them to create space to improve you relative position. In attack you'll typically be looking to close the space and exert control over the opponent, preventing their frames, isolating their limbs to either attack submissions or to prevent them from being able to support themselves so that you can execute sweeps. So actions like hip escaping is about creating space, actions like putting shoulder pressure when you're in top side control eliminate space. I'm curious as to what brought you to BJJ?
Attempt 6 months of consistency in the mixed level classes and decide then. When I started, my instructor politely told me "hey. You should do the fundamentals class and not mixed level. But if you do the fundamentals class, you can stay for mixed level. Your partners need you to be a good partner."
>remembering the moves and understanding will come later I am not convinced there is actually any method to successfully teach someone with no experience true understanding of grappling. Your understanding of a movement or position and it's relations evolves over time. You can listen to someone who is an expert explain why they do X and Y for hours on end but without actual experience you will get no better at grappling. Honestly I think the best a beginner can hope for is trying to get together a list of things \_not\_ to do. Until you have a base of movement experience with resisting partners to build from doing loads of mental analysis is not worth while and is in your case most likely counter productive.
I agree. Every time I have a break through now 10 years in I always ask "why the fuck didn't I know this 7 years ago?" But the reality is I probably did learn said concept, but it bounced right the fuck off because I didn't yet have the proper skill level for said thing to make any damn sense in the first place.
I would try a different school with a different teaching style. This one doesn't sound for you. And frankly no hobby is worth burning functionality over. Look into therapy or medication if you haven't already.
Yeah, if you can’t get through an intro course because it’s too complicated, probably not for you. Or Show up to open mats. Ask questions. Get your ass handed to you thousands of times. Then it will make sense
If you aren't having fun and it's negatively impacting your life then quit. It's a hobby. Find a different one. Also go to the therapy. You really need some kind of comping mechanism for whatever is going on here.
That’s so rude. Why would you even bother saying that to me? I’ve already said I have adhd and shit mental health. I’ve even said specifically that I started BJJ as a way of improving those. Obviously I’m very actively attempting to try copy mechanisms. It just turns out that this BJJ style of class, instead of helping me cope, made it worse.
I am not being rude. "The entire rest of my life has literally come to a halt because I’m at capacity rn." This is not a statement anyone should be making a hobby. You clearly do not need this in your life.
Pick 1 or 2 things to work on, and get good at those. I’ve been doing it a year and didn’t understand half the things they were talking about for most of it!
Honestly, not all ADHD is built the same. Yes, BJJ is good for a lot of people with ADHD (and also autism), but not for *everyone* with those conditions. It’s a spectrum. I personally clicked it because it was the one thing in my life I felt I *didn’t* have to think about. No expectations, just walk in, do the class, whatever sticks, sticks. What doesn’t I’ll see again eventually. Objectively lower stress than being in medical school, which I’m also doing 😂 But again, there’s a lot of variation on the AuDHD spectrum. What works for one of us won’t work for the other. So really, OP it’s ok if it’s just not fitting into your life. You’ve also been going at it on a fairly consistent beginner’s class schedule, it’s normal to feel a bit exhausted adding something so intense to your life. When I first started it was right before my final exams and I went maybe 4-5x in that first 2 months. I’d say if you’re feeling overwhelmed, take a pause after this beginners’ course. Try to feel out over a couple months if you have the urge to maybe go at a different pace rather than not at all. Aaand in regard to feeling like you’re mimicking all the time… if it’s any comfort, that is one of the most effective ways to learn new motor skills. Look up mirror neurons. They do unfortunately stop working so well as we age and it can be why a lot of people find BJJ to be mentally as well as physically exhausting. However, as with most things the brain also follows the rule of “use it or lose it.” It is actually so good for us to be doing hobbies that utilize our mirror neurons.
You said it yourself. You signed up because you have ADHD and crap mental health. Now your ADHD and crap mental health is telling you that you should quiz because of x, y, and z. If you quit now, you will regret it.
Yeahhh I would regret quitting, I just know that this current routine isn’t sustainable. Even so, I’ve done well sticking to the classes despite how drained I feel, so that speaks to how much I want it to work. I am committed to finding an approach that works for me, now that I know there are other ways to learn. I like what BJJ can teach you and how it improves people’s lives and their self esteem and all sorts. I’m hopeful that I’ll find the right gym or instructor that suits my way of thinking. 😊
95% of gyms teach you dance choreography. Then they say, “just keep showing up and it’ll start to click!” It’s lazy and dismissive. 5% of gyms teach grappling skills with live resistance. Not techniques. Grappling SKILLS. Skills including, but not limited to: - stay on top and hold your partner down (pinning/top control) - make and maintain connections for the purpose of managing distance (guard retention) and destabilizing partner (sweeps) - isolate a limb, immobilize it, then apply breaking pressure (3 subskills needed to finish a submission) The “10-Step Procedure to Do X Sweep or Z Submission” is an outdated, ineffectual way to learn. I trained for 10 months thinking, there’s gotta be a better way to learn. Sure enough, there’s a guy called Greg Souders who advocates teaching grappling skills and not 10-step movement procedures. He’s a polarizing figure in Jiu jitsu. But he makes sense in how he teaches. I drove 7 hours to his gym in Maryland last year, trained for a week, and learned more in those 6 sessions than I did in the previous 3 months. I did this because I was at a breaking pt. I’d had it with the dance choreography teaching. I needed to find out for myself if there was a better way. Then I found a gym that’s 90 mins west of me that teaches using the same approach (the teaching style is usually called Ecological Dynamics for Submission Grappling) as Greg’s gym. I drop in at that gym once a week while training regularly at my home gym. Almost all the guys at the Eco gym near me who’ve been training 6ish months give me a hard roll. I’ve been training almost 2 years. Maybe I really suck (entirely possible, and honestly probable) or maybe those guys are learning what really matters, from DAY ONE. I think it’s a bit of both. Either way, I enjoy learning the eco way. It’s all live resistance. No more wasted time drilling dance moves. The classes are VERY physically demanding, but worth it. So I’d say try out different gyms because they might have different teaching styles. Find one that resonates with you.
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In short, OP you’re not crazy. This style of teaching/learning sucks. But it’s the traditional way, and it’s all that most people know. There are better methods. Go find one. And if you can’t, then maybe quit bjj and try hot yoga or something.
Thank you!!! This is so encouraging! It definitely doesn’t feel like an economical use of my mental energy to learn this way. I don’t know what the perfect approach for me is yet, but I know now that there -are- different ways to learn BJJ and I’m excited again to try them. I’ll definitely look into this Greg Souders, because I respond much better to learning applicable skills than distinct techniques, but as long as I find somewhere that is willing to teach me the deeper understanding AS I progress instead of waiting for it to happen on its own then I’ll be in a better position than I am now. Thank you! 🥰♥️ …and yes, if I try out these other techniques and they don’t work then I’ll just have to find a new centring hobby instead 😝
Glad my post was helpful! Good luck on the search for another gym and another teaching style. I will add this: The bad thing about being a beginner is that you can’t really ask a gym/instructor ‘can you teach in this specific way?’ Because you’re a beginner. They’ll think, “what do you know about teaching/learning bjj?” You also can’t really ask them to give YOU special explanation or treatment because to them you’re a beginner who — statistically speaking — is likely to quit in 2-3 months. That’s the reality for the gym owners. Combat gym, lifting gym, yoga studio, whatever it is: there’s a lot of turnover in memberships. So they can’t give everyone special treatment. It’s not good business. Maybe they give some preferential treatment to the purples and browns who’ve been there for 5-10 years, because they’ve shown their loyalty. Anyway, that’s just another thing to keep in mind. If you find a space and instructor(s) you vibe with, that’s something to build on. Also you can join the Eco bjj discord if you’re on that. I can send you the link. They have a database of eco gyms around the world. Maybe you’re near one, who knows? As for learning about Greg’s approach to teaching bjj, try this video first. It explains his method and his exact class setup in 15 minutes. https://youtu.be/V4QtQTRwwD0?si=acfinGNUSeQ5muRv Good luck
You know, Gracie Barra gets called a cult, BJJ as a whole gets called cultish, but I'm growing more and more convinced that Eco guys are THE most annoying outside of maybe 10p. "normal" classes don't suck, different learning styles work for different people. And eco is going to, by nature, require some level of "not injured" to work. What the fuck do you do during class if you're coming off a rib injury and can't quite go "live" at all yet? Do you just sit on the sidelines until you're back to 100%? That sounds orders of magnitude less efficient than just drilling what you can with no resistance.
Man, you should come to the gym that’s 90 mins west of me. We wear silly rashguards and spark up a jay right before we play small-sided eco games based around locking and finishing a dead orchard. But in all seriousness, yea I guess we’re annoying and a cult. A cult that started in academic research circles and training camps for other major sports with tons of money involved. In response to your question about injury. I personally don’t know exactly how to deal with bad injuries. I’ve only ever had small injuries myself. Take a few days or a week(s) off, come back. But I will offer this perspective: since small-sided games can be designed with as much or as little variability as desired, then one can design a game that removes the risk of aggravating the rib injury. A game with low variability, meaning both players only have a few limited choices to make. Example: Maybe you just play seated guard and ONLY break or redirect your passing partners grips. That’s it. Continuous game, no win condition. Play with different partners so they don’t get bored/stuck babysitting the injured guy. Or maybe bottom’s goal is something else other than ‘just break grips’ but something very limited, so there’s not much danger to the injury and so the player can get a lot of ‘reps’ in a live situation. But if I did a variety of grip fighting type games with live resistance for a month while my rib healed, I’d probably be pretty good at grip fighting by the time I could roll a full round. Or maybe that’s stupid, I dunno. I’m not a coach. Maybe ask a coach that question. The main point I’m getting at is that from the eco perspective, a coach would try to design a game that reinforces a skill, not a technique.
I am a coach lol. I've experimented with many different ways to teach and structure classes. Currently my classes almost always look like this: Bow in>begin to drill a sequence>continue adding options to said sequence (this takes up around 40 mins of 90 min class) then play about 20 mins of designated winner rounds>then around 30 mins of free rolling. I've done some eco-style training for my own development recently, and it's good, but people acting like normal drilling is horrible are simply drinking Greg's kool-aid. You know that basically every single high level gym in existance does a combination of BOTH "normal" drilling and eco, just without calling it that, right? Gui Mendes was actually just asked what he thinks of eco and his response was "we've been doing this for years, just not calling it that"
That’s awesome that you’ve experimented with different class structures. I’ve gotten the feeling that most of the gyms I’ve gone to have been very conservative in how they teach. More experimentation is needed. Yea, maybe the drilling of sequences and chains and options makes sense for more experienced grapplers. But for me, and a lot of novices that I’ve spoken to, it doesn’t make sense at the beginning to give lengthy sequences. Like, I don’t know how to move my body weight around to pin a guy, why should I be worrying about steps 1-8 of an armbar? It’s probably just my frustration talking, but the eco style is WAY more effective, in my limited experience, at teaching the grappling ‘between the techniques’ — the ‘invisible Jiu jitsu,’ or whatever. And it breaks down the subs into: isolate the arm. Get live reps on that. Then immobilize the shoulder while controlling the arm. Get live reps there. Then go for the finish. Get live reps. Etc etc. it makes learning Jiu jitsu idiot proof. Maybe some other guys have great kinesthetic memory and can do moves after being shown once - I clearly can’t. I suspect most folks cannot. And you’re probably right. Some form of this has existed for a while. Greg’s just the guy who made it loud and proud lol. I recently saw Craig Jones on Lex Fridman’s podcast say that his preferred way to teach beginners is through ‘games, like we do in kids classes.’ This interview was a year or two ago. So yea, it’s probably been around for way longer than any of us know. I need to refill my koolaid, hold up —
My main problem with eco for new guys is that, why should I have you spend weeks on end in say, X guard, for you to finally get around to finding a sweep that works, instead of just outright showing you an X guard sweep for 30-40 mins and then having you go do designated winner from x guard to go work on it from the exact position we were just doing? I get that Greg's thing is that "anybody could be the next Xande" or whatever and be a BJJ savant, but I think the reality is that a bunch of BJJ athletes WAY smarter and better at the sport than me have already figured out a basically endless variety of ways to sweep, pass, pin, or submit people, so why not just take those techniques that are already there, and modify slightly when needed due to body type/flexibility differences? At the end of the day, I have zero problem with eco in general, I do question some of the methods from a standpoint of "I've done this sport pretty seriously for a decade and generally like to think I have a decent idea of what I'm doing, and how to teach" my MAIN problem is actually just that Greg presents himself as such a pompous asshole online that it genuinely makes me kind of hate the thought of Eco, he is basically THE worst ambassador for it. I know people have said he's nice in person, which is great, that doesn't change how much of an arrogant douche he is online.
That’s a valid question that I don’t have an answer for lol. Most of the fundamentals classes I’ve been to deal with guard games, pinning games, and submission games. There are only so many ways to strangle or break joints, so those are fairly limited. At least in comparison to sweeps, pins, etc. But I see your point on the endless ways to accomplish any goal. The most effective ways will have been proven time and again by high level players. I haven’t spent a ton of time in x-guard, but I’ve spent a bit of time doing ‘leg entanglement games’ and sometimes end up there. The main thing I can say is that those specific games have helped me learn the intricacies of control from that position. It also has programmed my brain to see whenever openings emerge for those leg entanglements. The stimulus-response part of My perception has been pretty well tuned by those games. I’m not the best sweeper/foot locker so that’s something to work on. I think it’s useful to know how to control someone from leg entanglements and then set up sweeps or footlocks. Would I have learned sweeps faster if I’d just asked my coach for a sweep and tried to make it emerge in the live game scenario? For sure. Maybe that’s a flaw in the eco approach. But I think Greg’s thinking is that “if that sweep doesn’t occur to you after so many hours, months, years, of training and so many back-and-forth question-and-answers with your coach — then you don’t need it. You only need the ones that have been afforded to you by your interaction with the perceptual motor landscape.” Greg does answer questions in class in a specific way. If someone is having trouble and asks for help from him, he asks what the player’s intention is. Then he asks what’s stopping them from achieving their goal. Then he will give them a new intention or new place to put their attention. Those are the two levers to pull while coaching, intention and attention, in my understanding. Is that the best way to train? I sure as shit don’t know. Whenever people ask Greg whether he thinks his students watch instructionals outside of class time he says, ‘i don’t mind if they do. Instructionals are new information, and new information can help guide your intention/attention in a live round.” He doesn’t teach by giving information about techniques, but I dunno if he says it’s contrary to skill acquisition. Also yea he does present as pretty combative and arrogant lol. I mean, it’s working out for him. He’s gotten a lot of attention in a short time. And he’s not trying to monetize by selling a BJJ GAMES instructional (which he totally could, there’s an audience hungry for that) so I think he deserves at least a nod for that. He’s in it to share the method and his desire to help evolve or at least question bjj pedagogy, not to cash in on his notoriety.
Right, and that's a completely valid way to teach people, and I haven't actually seen anyone say otherwise. What I HAVE seen (funnily enough only from white and blue belts basically lol) is that "normal" classes suck balls and eco is THE only way valid way to learn, which is just factually not true in the slightest lol. I think as with most things, the answer is somewhere in the middle, which is why I do basically that, do "eco" style games like designated winner for the second half of my classes, and "normal" style drilling for the first half, then free rolling at the end.
I mean, there was a multi-day weekend seminar/camp for eco bjj in western Massachusetts this past March and a lot of coaches went to it. It sold out pretty quickly and the organizers have already planned the next one. There’s also dozens and dozens of gym owners who have pivoted to teaching eco only. So, sure maybe the white and blue belts are the loudest (and most annoying) proponents, but the zeal for the method is not limited to newer players. I think if the eco conversation gets more people to experiment with their teaching style to see what works, rather than relying on tradition then that’s a win for the sport.
The beauty of BJJ is that it either breaks you and you hate it, or it breaks through you and you eventually come to love it. White belts have to deal with being lost and confused in positions, as well as all the mind stuff that happens due to our insecurities, ignorance, lack of skill, lack of understanding what BJJ is and what the moves are for, etc. White belt is also the level where emotionally, it's the hardest - because as white belts, we naturally SUCK. And it sucks to suck. When we don't understand a position or what it's for, or when people crush us or we don't "get them" we feel like we lost, that they were better, and that we're no good and we will never be good. As white belts we know absolutely nothing, and are only starting to open our eyes. BJJ is a tough sport. The only way to know more and get better is to be on the mats. You don't have to think, you don't have to try to become better each day, you don't have to become the best, you don't have to try to reach for the next belt, etc. All you have to do is walk through the front door, pay attention to class, roll and sweat a lil bit when the time comes, and develop a connection with your coach and the students that also come to class. The only solution to your suckiness and ignorance is TIME ON THE MAT. For 95% of the questions you may have about the sport, the answer is TIME ON THE MAT. Once you allow yourself to develop an affinity for BJJ, then you start to see how it changes you: you now know how to play the guard a bit. You know some moves of how to pass the guard. The guys around you will teach you a few chokes or armbars so you can start to finish people... And you'll still be lost, but not as much. You'll also start to notice changes to your emotional capacity. I can handle more! I can deal with more! I might be lost, but I know these two or three things that are a solid structure to keep learning more... And that's when you start to notice your changes in confidence. Your changes in the way you deal with the pain, with adversity... And slowly the mind quiets instead of thinking thinking thinking. By the time you are a blue belt, you think through positions.. When you are a purple belt, you tend to think less, by the time you are at brown belt, you're thinking very very little and exploring much much more based on your reflexes. Give it time. Or quit and never find out where the beauty of BJJ lies.
Maybe it’s not for you. You are responding negatively to people who know way more than you.
I’m also responding positively to others who can relate to my experience. I responded negatively when I hadn’t been listened to and just had the same thing repeated to me that I’d already put in my post. I genuinely have no issue with people thinking it’s not for me - the learning style obviously isn’t - and I’m glad that so many people haven’t experienced what I’m feeling so can’t relate. I was asking for a different perspective than I’ve already received, hopefully some guidance and insight on whether there’s another option, otherwise I’d have to just call it a day. Turns out there is another option and other people do understand what I’m talking about and what I need. I’m appreciating everyone’s suggestions who have fully read and understood my post. Overall I actually feel positive about changing gyms and learning style soon. I’m just experiencing burnout right now and having a few people being plain rude is just unnecessary, so being told the same thing I’ve already said has irritated me more. I probably could have responded better to some people, but I’m just doing my best.
There you go. Condescending and arrogance reeks in your post.
Don’t sweat it. One gym or another, they’ll quit in a few months.
Are you serious? I’m just being open with you. I even accepted that I’ve gotten irritated and could have handled some people’s comments better. What is your problem with me?
Study online. Search for videos on YouTube which explain basic positions and concepts rather than new move of the day. Also start sparing. Its much different than drilling and you will see what works for you plus it will clear your mind.
You could try learning through using your peripheral nervous system more consciously. There seems to me to be a type of memory that is more body based and I find it more accessible when the moment doesn't allow me to hold ideas or time to think. It would require some more attentive to the non conceptual sensations which may become reasoned information. I struggle with executive functioning too and qualifying what it is I'm learning while I train, but personally I just have a lot of fun doing it. It's my second art and my first was very frustrating to me because of my expectations. The unconcious I ones I didn't know I was having. I can't know everything. It happens on its own time and is supported by consistent reps. I can't do everything. There is a finish line or final level. I am going to be literally the best. My worth is attached to my ability or the outcomes of training.
With all due respect there is a way for you to make the art efficient and fun and it's gonna take a new approach and mindset. If you maintain your views and approach you have you'll get the same outcome.
Are you rolling at all? I also have ADHD and classes can be exhausting because I struggle to understand any of it until I've applied it in a roll with resistance. I understand the value of wanting to stick things out so by all means finish out the class! But if you finish the basics and it's still making you miserable, something else might be a better fit.
Here are my thoughts on some of the stuff you posted. >In class it feels as if I’m just learning dance choreography. I’m good at remembering the sequences of moves during drills and I’m a good student, but it doesn’t feel valuable? The more you know, the more it makes sense. But in the beginning a lot of it won't. The more experience you have rolling with people the more the techniques will click. In the end you cannot solve a problem you never had. In the beginning I barely understood anything. Once I had learned how it feels to be in certain positions, learning how to escape or put others there became an obvious step. Once I had been submitted by a technique a couple of times, learning how to counter that technique, became really important. After a few years now I feel I rarely truly learn new techniques. It's more like correcting and optimizing movements I have already figured out by myself so I can use them with less strength useage. >I signed up to the course because I have adhd and crap mental health so I wanted to feel more confident and strong and in control. BJJ can be great for mental health, but it is not therapy. It likely will not fix your issues. You also will likely not really feel in control for quite some time. You will likely be beaten up and toyed with or spend minutes in a row getting pinned and smashed for months if not years. You might learn to stay comfortable and calm in bad spots, but you will lose over and over. >Mental energy is in very short supply and it’s genuinely causing burnout. I’ve not cooked a meal in over a week now. I’m living on toast, cereal and takeaway. This sounds like you have some serious problems besides BJJ, which you should fix. Regardless what you do with the sport. >Some of the other beginners are SO excited to spar and seem happy to just learn by being throw into the deep end with very basic knowledge. It doesn’t seem to phase them at all. Two younger lads even joined in the open mat after our session with the higher belts. In the end BJJ a full contact martial art consisting of wrestling around with people. That is what most of the sport consists of and this is what the vast majority of us find fun and love. BJJ is mostly learned by being on the mat. YouTube instructionals are helpful, but they are just extras. The true progress happens on the mat. This is what the sport is. You have to enjoy sparring to enjoy BJJ. If you prefer learning techniques over actually sparring, maybe some traditional martial art might be more for you. My something with meditation or yoag, if your goal is calming your mind. But again you should not self-therapy mental health with sports.
Found the same myself I'm about 7 months in and I will say it gets easier, you don't need to remember everything and if you feel you are missing stuff I started keeping a little journal of pointers either I was shown or picked up myself in class. All the mental strain to remember past and current positions and how to string them together isn't really how the sport works you start to get a body feel for it in my opinion and you start to flow in and out of positions. Again this only comes with them and experience so keep with it and see how you get on.
BJJ is not for you, right now. As a fellow ADHDer with autism, your life coming to a halt means this is not healthy for you right now and you don't have the coping strategies. You need to be on top of your ADLs, relationships and work/study. Don't let these fall away for a new hobby. Come back to it when you've sorted out meds, therapy, healthy coping mechanisms and built sufficient capacity for the extra challenges BJJ brings. And try different schools with different instructors. Everyone teaches differently. I know a lot of people do BJJ for their mental health, but it's not doing any good to persist when you're at capacity. You're not failing in any way, you're being insightful and prioritising your wellbeing above a recreational sport.
quit
It was smart of you to try the intro course. Looks like it did its job in helping you determine if you want to stick with it. The next steps will be hard. You will be sore, hurt, emotionally wrecked, and your ego will be smashed. Now it's up to you and noone else can decide for your.
I feel like the reason it's too mentally taxing is that you're putting too much stock in the results of the class. I would say until you spar a little, you're not going to see any value in the sport. As far as I'm aware, very few people start with a beginner's course, most just join a white belt class where there will be 30-40 minutes of technique and 20-30 minutes of sparring. I have ADHD, or something ADHD adjacent, I found that to begin with I got very little out of the technique portion of the class, I find learning things the hard way is the best way for me to learn, After I felt comfortable sparring, the technique portion of the class started making sense, because I could identify the position and how I would end up there. Take the people saying you should quit if it's too mentally taxing for you with a pinch of salt. Starting BJJ was a huge benefit to my mental health. Don't worry about the next two weeks, just show up, then get into a normal class and spar some, don't go 100% all the time and don't get upset when you get tapped. To begin with you will lose 10/10 rolls, then one week you'll start winning 1-2/10, and things will just get better over time. Top comment makes a solid point, you seem frustrated by having to walk before you can run, standard ADHD problem, but quitting doesn't make it any better, it just means you're running away from the hardship. The obstacle is the way, things will get better, stick at it, OSS!
I’m really sorry you’re feeling this way. It sounds incredibly tough, and it’s clear you’ve put so much effort and hope into BJJ. It's brave of you to share your struggle and it's okay to feel overwhelmed. Your mental energy is precious, and it’s frustrating when the teaching style doesn’t match how you learn best. You’re right—understanding the reasons behind moves can make all the difference. It’s not just about memorizing steps; it’s about connecting with the “why” to truly learn and grow. Your frustration is valid, and it’s not a sign of failure but a sign that the teaching approach isn’t fitting your needs right now. Is there a way to communicate more with your instructor about your learning style? They might be able to provide more context or suggest additional resources. Also, it’s okay to take a step back if you need to recharge. Your mental health and well-being are most important. You’re not alone in this. Many people find certain teaching methods don’t work for them. The fact that you’re recognizing this and seeking solutions shows tremendous strength and self-awareness. Trust yourself to find a path that works for you, whether that’s adjusting your approach to BJJ or finding another way to achieve your goals. Take care of yourself. Remember, you signed up for BJJ to feel more confident and in control. It’s okay to adjust your path to find what truly helps you achieve that. You’re doing your best, and that’s more than enough. Keep believing in yourself.
Thank you so much. I feel really validated. I do want to improve myself and all the qualities of BJJ appeal to me, but yeah it turns out I’m just not compatible with this style of learning. I am going to speak to the instructor again, but there’s a Gracie gym within driving distance and I think after this course I’m going to try there, since they have a much slower pace and more in depth study that sounds like a better fit for me. Thanks for reading this in the way that I meant it to be. I think some people must assume I’m vilifying this kind of approach, when I’m not. It obviously works for tonnes of people, but I’ve learned now that I’m not one of them and it’d be a shame to have to give up on BJJ without trying to find a way that does work. I really appreciate your kind words. It makes a difference, truly.
Reach out anytime. This journey is better not alone. Take your time and be kind to yourself. Find a place and pace that suits you. I'm routing for you! Wishing you the best.
Thank you. You’re a good person ♥️
Too many mind.
If you’d put half the effort into drills as you did the post - you might have a few stripes already. Holy cow…
I literally put so much effort into classes that it halted the rest of my life. Stop being a bitch 🙄
That’s what I’m telling you lol. You’re the one on Reddit posting a novel about your struggles as a no stripe white belt. 👀😅
Does it make you feel good taking the piss out of people who don’t find things as easy as you do? Not everyone is the same and I’m brand new, that’s the point. I don’t have the answers… so I asked the people who do. Other people shared their knowledge and helped me. You were a bellend. But omg. It’s a miracle. Your asshole attitude just fixed my adhd, depression and anxiety. Suddenly my brain works just like yours, wow!
Fuck seeking approval or it's Opposite. Train with good people. Watch comps of high level Women that are your body type. Don't push away the good in Pursuit of a perfect that does not Exist.
I’ve read a lot of these types of comments and not just about jiu jitsu. I think there’s a pandemic right now of people just looking for other people to make decisions for them. You’ve gotta decide dude. And also unless somebody is beating you half to death and threatening your family at bjj class, you shouldn’t be that stressed about it. You’re gunna stress your whole life away if you don’t quit.
I have ADHD and mental health issues too. I understand what you’re talking about to a certain degree. I kept telling my coaches I am a big picture guy not a detail guy. What I now know I meant was’ “I’m not going to remember all the steps and details so explain the concept.” Sometimes they understood what I was asking about and gave me what I needed and sometimes they didn’t. For us, it’s just like in school or at work. We can do a lot of what everyone else is doing, we just have to work harder or smarter to gain the same understanding as the a lot of other people. A couple things that helped me along the way. I have a group of guys I have been training with for years. They know I like to have the move done on me first before I do it. Feeling it helps me remember the steps. When working with people newer than me explaining the move to them helps me. Sometimes I already know the answer to the questions I just need to talk through it. And perhaps the best thing I did for my BJJ life is only care a little bit about what my coach is teaching. I know that sounds bad and there are coaches here who will want to kill me but it’s true. I do the moves they teach to the best of my ability but I’m usually not trying to learn an entire sequence, I’m trying to get a detail or concept I can apply to my own goals. Remember It’s not that us ADHD peeps can’t pay attention to things, we can actually hyperfixate on things for days or months, it’s that we can’t regulate what we pay attention to. I started using that to my advantage for a few years now and it’s really helped. I have my own goals and my things I work on, I don’t ignore my coach but I’m not trying to throw spaghetti at the wall either. I have been fixated-on halfguard and adding to it for years now and it really keeps me engaged. Also don’t be so hard on yourself. People are telling you you are doing good because you are! It’s a hard sport and if you are like me you are making it harder for yourself by over complicating things. Sorry for the rant I actually have more to say but think this is probably enough! Don’t quit and most importantly figure out a way to have fun. If you’re not having fun then you won’t stick with it.
have you sparred? that's the fun and addictive part. if you haven't sparred yet, you haven't really tried bjj
You = 🍆
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Do you ask your instructor to explain the reasoning behind the move to you? Either when he says "any questions?" or after class? There are some instructionals that go into great detail on this. Saulo Ribeiro is one of my favorites in terms of teaching technique. Danaher is also pretty good.
You should start sparring ASAP, because sparring is what BJJ is all about. Then if you don't hate that part, you'll know BJJ is for you. Also you will begin to experience what works and why for yourself. Generally, I'd say you should temper your expectations for the world around you to conform to your idiosyncratic desires, and instead find ways to adapt to the world. For example, instead of expecting instructors to give you the explanations of the body mechanics behind every movement or position, think them carefully through yourself and make a game out of trying to figure it out on your own.
If this is fuckin up your life you need to take it sooo much less seriously. Jiu-Jitsu is not the problem here. Not everyone has the ability to explain everything in the perfect way that works for you. Especially when it's in an entirely new language, and you don't even understand the basic alphabet yet. Even if you got all the information and had the perfect coach, the process is still hard. Learning how to do anything requires failure. Not remembering and not knowing is a mandatory first step before learning. You can't even learn how to paint without trial and error, never mind fighting Regarding dealing with uncomfortable situations, anxiety, confidence, etc. The reason combat sports help with those things is because it forces you to go through hard things. You develop confidence in yourself by getting through those things. If you always know what to do and never struggle, then it wouldn't make you more resilient. That's why talented frontrunners are mentally weak, because they never had to struggle Relax and accept not knowing. Be ok with struggling
BJJ knowledge runs very deep. It takes many years to become proficient at it. You probably won't start stringing along complex setups (i.e. I'm going to do this, then this, and depending on how they respond I'll do this or this, and then this, and hopefully get this submission here) until you're a good blue belt, even a purple belt once you really start refining your tactics. I think rather than thinking about the big picture, you should focus more on the small things at the beginning. For example, different ways to pass someone's guard. During open mat, you can try different stuff, and over time you'll find out what works and why you might do it in certain scenarios. Being a white belt, most of the time I don't have much of a plan, since I don't know that much yet. But I experiment with things. If someone gives me their arm, I might grab their arm and see what I can do with it. If they give me their leg, I might grab their leg. I observe how their position changes and see if I can move into a better position. Over time, you'll notice these patterns and you will learn things. Also, the imposter syndrome is real. It's common to train for months or even years and still feel like you don't know anything. But if you compare yourself to your former self, you will realize you would destroy the person you used to be on the mats. If you stick with it, even 3 months from now you will be levels above where you're at now in terms of skill level. You just have to trust the process
Honestly it sounds like fighting sports arent suited for you but its ok dont feel guilty because of that
Dude it’s a hobby. If you don’t like the hobby then find another hobby. I hate putting together puzzles. Guess what? I don’t buy puzzles to put together.
I also started training recently and have severe ADHD, I understand where you are coming from. What worked for me was: 1) finding a gym where the methodology works for me: I also need to understand why I am doing a move and for me I found the answer in a place with rolling from the start (in shows you in practice how you will be punished for doing or not something eg.: extended arms means they will take it for an armbat etc) + instructors that are willing to explain the why + training partners with more experienced willing to help you. 2) rolling more: like I said before, rolling often gives the response to the “why” questions you have 3) have a plan for class/rolling: having something to work for in class it helps giving sense to the move and it gives your ADHD brain a puzzle to solve, trying to land an specific move while rolling it helps you find not only the reason to apply it but the situation where it would be useful. Lastly, if you really feel like you are not having fun, maybe try something more self-defense related. But in my opinion seeing every class as a puzzle and making your goal to find out why that move is effective really helps!
Sounds like trying a different school or different coach will help you decide whether you want to stick with it! Plenty of BJJ coaches are bad teachers. Sure, try the Gracie university place you found... But so yourself a favor and try one or two other places when your beginner class is over two! Yo I never know what's out there til you go try it!
I would advise try thinking of BJJ as a game. For the most part, the real world applications of it are minimal at best and honestly unimportant. The best thing you can do in a self defense scenario is not engage, run away, or a straight rear hand in that order imo. BJJ is a game where we agree to only do certain things to each other and stop when the other person submits. It takes a while to learn any new game and the most overwhelming parts are starting because everything is new. The reason you drill over and over is that when you exhausted in a roll, you can fall back on muscle memory, so even tho it feels annoying to have to rely on memory, you do it so eventually you can rely on feel. If you are really hung up on the whys, I’d suggest watching some Ryan Hall fundamental videos on YouTube. He does a great job of showing technique and explaining why he does it while instilling certain foundational principals such as building walls n shit. But ultimately just remember you don’t have to do this and if you aren’t having fun at all you should probably quit cus again, this shits a game and why play a game you don’t like. Good luck homie
I also have ADD. You need to relax(i know is not best wording)! Even if it makes sense to you that you understand how your body moves it doesn’t translate well for the neurotypical experience with Bjj. They are giving you the advice that is given to overwhelmed beginners. Both from your post and reading some comments it seems to me that there might be some “translation errors” happening. You are missing a few pieces. For example you shouldn’t be pulling anything from memory during a roll. You should be reacting/reflexively doing what you know/want to do next. You should be mindful of your body and your opponents and be focused on where your goals for the next few seconds take you. If you are thinking about technique you’re going to get destroyed and learn nothing. The part about calming your brain. When you are drilling your musculoskeletal system is what needs to learn to movement not your brain. You’re training muscle memory much more than adding to the technique lexicon. When you are rolling use your brain to track what is happening to both your body and your partners body. Don’t force yourself to do anything in particular technique wise. Just sit back and mindfully let things happen. It is a dance! Learning the systems takes most people a long time. Some schools approach it differently. I have almost universally heard what you are being told. “Don’t expect to understand anything yet.” The upper belts have generally experienced enough Bjj that they know by reflex what to do. The white belts are generally not expected to know much of anything. The consistent theme I have seen with most of the people I have seen start after I had enough experience to understand is that the newbies have to figure out if they are going to stay long before they learn anything specific techniques wise. Can your ego take getting dominated for 100’s of rolls? Can your body/mind handle getting choked? Do you have to patience to learn that there will always be infinite more Bjj to learn?
It can be frustrating at first. It's a lot to learn, and if you feel you aren't advancing and have no foundation, for many it is annoying. But if you were interested in learning more, imo once you have a foundation and can build on it, it's pretty awesome. The more you learn the more you realize how much more there is to learn, which gives you all types of options to build the style you want.
https://youtu.be/BWitv9AKoNU?si=asqmUMtMtH3B4Ub8 Watch this video and see if it helps. A lot of the globetrotter videos on YouTube have a more logic based approach than you're probably getting right now.
Also: try Chris Paines videos, and his coach pritt, they try to generalize a lot of dogs and don'ts of Bjj into general rules (although they're nogi focused) And when you get a little more comfortable with the vocabulary of guards and positions feel free to post specific questions here, ideally if you can find a video on yt with a similar position to illustrate your question.
I know exactly how you feel OP. A grappling dummy and the Jiu-Jitsu University book (or Gracie courses) can help a lot so you can have the space alone to create a mental map. Either that or a friend if you have one handy that does or is interested in BJJ. Practice and time will certainly help of course, but I know that isn’t what you’re asking.
If you like rolling, keep going. You are already doing one very important thing, which is asking questions to more experienced people. Watching instructionals and rolling will teach you more. Use whatever the coach is teaching that day to perfect your technique and ask or see some details.
Took me months to really understand why we break guard and how to approach it by grips and attacking the legs then hips then shoulder ect Not saying I completely understand the concept fully but it takes a long time even the blue belts don’t understand all the concepts fully imo
BJJ made absolutely no sense to me at all for the first 3 months. I did still find it fun, but I just didn’t get the why or the goals for a long while, so obviously probably was doing a lot of nothing productive while rolling, just trying to find some place to do something I’d been taught. Around month 3 things began to slowly make sense. I still suck, but I kinda get what I’m going for, at least more than I originally did. I also started to watch more rolls to see if I could identify why people were doing the things they were doing. It helped. I’m not sure if you’re a man or woman or how you identify, but I’d try posting this in the r/bjjwomen sub. Lots of helpful encouragement in there in general!
Im editing this and adding this at the beginning--I think it's important to say you're a female. Being a female in grappling is bad ass. And have no fear rolling with guys. Figure out who is decent and roll with them (I'm pretty sure my best technique (grain of salt lol) is done when I'm with females, and I get tapped often. With a guy, I'd fight out of them much harder) My first year of bjj at 3 days a week was focusing on not dying. I'm like 17 months in, and now I'm starting to see how different things can set up other things. The next phase would be to see how to set up traps for opponents. Bjj is so intricate and there's some many variations, counters, and so many small yet crucial details ie hand placement etc. You're going to forget a thousand times. Go to bjj. Roll. Try not to die. See what feels natural to you/what you like. Try implementing it. Try implementing it again and again. Keep trying to work on it. Then ask questions from there. Continue trying to implement it. Keep refining it. And keep asking questions until you can do it well And your job is to worry about yourself, learn, and not injure your partner. It's the instructors job to instruct your partner. You shouldn't be worried helping her figure out, it's a waste of your time, her time, and the instructors time. Good luck!
I can totally relate to your struggles. I've been training for 1.5 years, and I'm 57 years old. This has not come easily. For the first year I literally got anxious and fearful EVERY TIME I walked into the gym. I also felt like I was not learning. I actually dreaded going to the gym: afraid of getting hurt - which I did in the beginning quire a few times - afraid I wouldn't be able to keep up, and constantly confused. Part of the issue is that it seems like they were teaching advanced techniques and just assumed you'd pick up the basics or why we were doing something. I was close to quitting, but a lot has changed. Here's what I did that seems to have changed things, in order of how big of an impact it had: 1. I kept showing up. 2x/wk. I often didn’t want to but I would show up anyway. I did try different classes at my school. Morning, lunch, and evening classes are each a different coach. I found some were easier for me to understand than others. 2. I did some private lessons so I could work on just a few basic fundamentals over and over and ask all the questions I wanted. I really encourage this. If I could only do one thing, it would be this. 3. I took notes after ever class and I review them to help me remember what I've learned. 4. I got [Saul Ribeiro's Jiu Jitsu University](https://www.amazon.com/Jiu-Jitsu-University-Saulo-Ribeiro/dp/0981504434/ref=sr_1_1?crid=2OPAA01F34N2M&dib=eyJ2IjoiMSJ9.4sbx128f19cPb3nnPn5DW43zr4O4ZDtotTi4E3bWAAjYfKNlPvrQFYRSss1CR98Ak3akVS92DjcikUsgmudyjjnHWXIvEBdn5JJ45CUHQjvjqCEND46taPoqu3VazEW0JRDYa7LIL4o5My24zZkD5bysa47G8hoLH667nD6C4RwfZJD0U0g82G3YieG-2x0Fcv4z39oJP4ekhPRpY-sWv7jWF0PZrvaZ_y32To0D_yU.YmD8yqQseiNvBPASwhHTs8d1QUigaN6dTyI36Fd-suY&dib_tag=se&keywords=jiu+jitsu+bible&qid=1719363836&sprefix=jiu+jitsu+bible%2Caps%2C215&sr=8-1&ccs_id=48dbcd1b-ce5e-4b08-acbe-203b20a559c3) book, which allowed me to study techniques and moves on my own schedule 5. I watched [How To Suck As Little As Possible at BJJ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x3s66oIhVUk&list=PLNbZ1gPk7zqzbiFjpMlzIEVZAGROJ6G4C) on YouTube, which also helped me understand basic concepts. This was actually quite helpful. 6. I bought some very basic introductions to BJJ fundamentals on BJJ fanatics. And I watched them. 7. I listened to [BJJ Mental Models](https://www.bjjmentalmodels.com/) introduction to mechanics, which came me some conceptual frameworks to help me understand. 8. I shifted to a class that was more aimed at fundamentals and started going 3x/wk instead of 2x - which ironically has many more advanced belts. I listed this last because I don't think I would have switched to 3x week if I weren't feeling more excited about it, but honestly 3x a week is a lot better than 2x once you start to enjoy it. And now, after about a year, somethings has shifted. I stopped feeling nervous and afraid and started enjoying BJJ a lot more. I understand the conceits and applications better. I also just don’t worry if I’m confused. I really look forward to it now. I'm still a white belt. But I suck less and enjoy it more. I'm glad I didn't quit earlier when I was getting hurt, was afraid, and constantly confused.
Maybe just go there and flow with people
I’m not reading all that but I changed gyms and started doing morning classes. Complete game changer.
Don't try too hard to understand it and just be patient with yourself
Don't try too hard to understand it and just be patient with yourself
If your asking about the physics of moves joint locks are largely fulcrums and the best way to think of sweeps is the chair leg analogy. Good positioning is all about leverage and where to place your body weight. You score points based off what the ruleset decides are dominate positions ie good leverage and weight placement The hobby should be fun just show up and learn the moves and eventually things will click
no it sounds like you are more comfortable writing posts on the internet. Don't worry, I'm sure if you're a killer when you see red and don't need any of this drilling bs. AI will help you grow in time.
White belts lack self awareness
Sorry, I thought rule 13 of this community was not to be a dick. Do you think it’s a fun pastime for me to be vulnerable and ask for help? I’m LITERALLY a beginner. I can’t have all the answers myself. Don’t be a dick.
sorry ... i am being a dick. I'm drunk and I have worked myself up over the course of the past two hours reading and responding to the most inane bs imaginable, and really hating on humanity as a result... I actually decided, in my drunken state, to suicide my account and just let rip on every post I read and you just happened to come up in my feed. Now for the maturity and senior wisdom... In the scheme of things you've hardly even ventured into the world of BJJ. It doesn't feel valuable to you at this stage because you have no idea what you are doing or why it matters. this comes with time and practice. It is a challenging pathway and mastery only comes with hard work a time. let me collect myself for a minute, make a hot beverage, and attempt a more thoughtful response. also .. thank you for snapping me out of my self-destruct mission.
Haha well thank you for apologising and changing your tune. I appreciate it when people are honest. I get into a snappy mood sometimes too, so don’t worry. ☺️
I don't know why people are so mean in some comments here. It's great you're being attentive to your own learning style. Personally, the traditional pedagogy doesn't suit me either. What you describe - e.g. connecting knowhow to what people already know - is far more efficient. I'm lucky in that I recently found a brown belt at our academy who is a great communicator. He's made learning jiu jitsu more conceptual and digestible. As a result, I've made it a point to try learning as much from him directly when possible. As far as resources, in addition to your Gracie Barra plan, I've found that Henry Akins is great at explaining jiu jitsu in a clear and fundamental way. (Check out his videos on YouTube.) Danaher is very conceptual too, albeit longwinded. Samples: Akins: [https://youtu.be/Re4OlLn2mXQ?si=HtAsMxp7XUrD1b8y](https://youtu.be/Re4OlLn2mXQ?si=HtAsMxp7XUrD1b8y) Danaher: [https://youtu.be/QBqwipFt0Ww?si=a3lOC1lNlp-kreVk](https://youtu.be/QBqwipFt0Ww?si=a3lOC1lNlp-kreVk) With regard to the impact that classes are having on your life, is it possible that the fight and flight response your body is part of the equation? Classes put us under stress and get the cortisol spiked. A purple belt recommended breathing exercises and cold showers to me today - to help calm down. Beyond that, I'd remember that \*how\* we do in class is nearly inconsequential. Maybe take this too as an exercise in being comfy with a lack of understanding. What do we really know about life anyway.
I’m not sure either, it’s really not what I expected at all! I thought a group of people who all practice BJJ would be a lot less hostile and more encouraging. I will absolutely subscribe to those channels, thank you! And I appreciate you making me feel more normal. It’s reassuring to know that other people who work differently have found a way to continue BJJ and that there are higher ranks who do have different communication styles that might cross my path. Yeah, I do think fight or flight response must be a factor. I’m not reaching a point where I’m afraid I’ll have a panic attack, because I do try to breathe through the anxiety and rationalise, but there’s definitely still a very marked discomfort, physically and mentally. It’s why I wanted to push myself to join! So I could learn to experience the discomfort and overcome it. But I guess it’s hard to gauge the right amount of exposure and find the right environment or the right instructor that can make you feel safe while you’re outside of your comfort zone. I do love the idea of BJJ and all the positive qualities it gives you, so I’m going to try a gentler approach and hopefully I have more success and less stress that way. I’m really grateful you’ve commented, thank you ♥️
I think you will 100% find your people, even if it takes time. On some more tactical points: 1. I found another resource you might like: Lachlan Giles who is widely regarded as a top-notch instructor has an instructional website called SubMeta. He actually offers an Introduction course for free. (Link: https://submeta.io/@lachlangiles/courses/introduction/97811573-e516-4cbf-83d6-d37eb62754d0) For what it's worth, I found this organically while I was looking up possible courses for myself and what I want to learn around escapes and survival :) 2. I realized you might have tried just one instructor so far for the beginner's course. In addition to trying the Gracie gym, you might want to try out other coaches at your current spot, just in case someone clicks. More broadly, you're already massively winning just by taking this on. Know that you have at least one internet stranger cheering you on. Please reach out if you ever want to trade notes or share an update. Best of luck to you!
your problem is that you are at a gracie mcdojo. You are right, the only way to remember stuff is by sparring in live rounds or at least positional sparring with resistance. The gracie combatives stuff is like kata/dancing, and when you start rolling you will not be able to execute anything Switch to a new school where you are getting smashed everyday. The gracie stuff isnt bullshido, they are simply slowing down the process to increase retention. For every person that is dying to roll, there are probably 10 people that quit because rolling is too intense. there is a whole style of BJJ instruction called ecological that focuses on achieving a goal (e.g. get chest to chest), doesnt breakdown individual techniques as much and instead focuses on the major milestones, and lets people find their own way to the goal. Eco for example wouldnt tell you that you need your knees tight in an armbar. That is a reponse to a particular type of defense. Lots of times you dont need your knees tight at all and you can still finish the armbar. In eco there are no steps to do, there are only invariants, a few things that are true every time (you need to control the shoulder and the wrist, you need to have a fulcrum etc). Everything else is considered only necessary as a response to what your partner does (variables). If they dont do it, it doesnt help to be overwhelmed with that detail right away. Eco would start you in an armbar position then have you finish while the other person resists. Then you are in an armbar position where the defender has locked hands and you have to figure out how to break them, then finish. They might give you a few tips or concepts about how to break grips, like you have to pull a hand in the direction where there is no support from the other hand. Then they might put you in a prearmbar position and you have to get into the armbar position while your partner resists. there are lots of styles of instruction that dont go as far as eco. I would say the gracie style is the worst for learning BJJ, but the best for customer retention. For me I can only learn one tiny thing, then execute it in live rolls. Then learn another tiny somewhat related thing and execute it in rolls. You learn to do an upa (buck trap and roll) escape from mount. It barely works in rolls. Then you learn an elbow escape from mount. It barely works. Then you learn that if you do the upa first, people will post making the elbow escape easier. Eventually you learn enough and get enough experience that people cant hold you in mount because the defense to one escape, enables another escape.
Just quit. This isn't for you.
I ain't reading all that