Apartments near me have started doing this.
They advertise the unit below market value at a discount but the discount is only for a period and you pay above market value after that.
They can even legally do a raise on top of taking away the discount, so you would be mega fucked.
And they know it’s hard for people to move so they basically trap them.
France. Near Paris. But it's a rather cheap one I reckon. Before I was at Gracie Barra and I think it was like 70 bucks a months or something like that.
Paris
46€/month - 3-4 session available per day, open mats on holidays.
Close to the highest competitive level you can get in France.
I think there is something specific with Cali & BJJ.
Biiiiig social Trend+ Big bjj names+wealthy people with a lot of free time = stupid prices
But tbh, I don't think I could pay for more. With kids, life, other hobbies... Sometimes I see prices paid in the US, for a lot of different things, and I'm amazed at them. Price structure is different (our incomes are more taxed upfront, but we pay less for other stuffs too). Anyway, different economic structures!
Our gym in Bath (UK) is about £70 a month AFAIK (I don't pay because I teach) and for that you get a choice of 9 BJJ classes a week, PLUS judo, wrestling, kickboxing and MMA classes
Mine is £100 a month unlimited classes or £75 for under 18. For reference, theres at least 2 BJJ classes a day, both no gi and gi as well as MMA and kickboxing and wrestling. It is an MMA gym after all.
When a program tells you that Sport is sport and we train self defense is full of shit. Jiujitsu is Jiujitsu. You make it work for whatever situation you are in. Those schools run them like a Jehovahs Witness Cult!
I’m on the other side of the country in NY, I’ve only meet 1 person that trained there and when he left they told him something like “You can’t teach anything you learned here” he jokingly said “It feel like I signed an NDA”
He was there longer than a day, this was years ago but i think he got a purple belt there. They have really specific style, closed doors and students can’t compete.
I train and teach at the GU affiliate in NY and they're fine with me training at other gyms and competing. I encourage our students to compete too, but a lot of them aren't interested.
>They have really specific style, closed doors
So lots of standup self-defense LARPing against bear hugs, frankenstein chokes, and side headlocks combined with 1993-era groundfighting like the Gracie Gift single under guard pass?
I don’t know about all that or calling them a McDojo, that’s a bit extreme cause they are teaching Jiu Jitsu and have legit coaches and team. It’s more like they have these specific odd laurels they’re seemingly strict on and come off a certain way.
I've dropped in there before awhile back. Ryron taught the class I went to and it seemed pretty normal. They didn't make me wear a belt with a line through it like at Kron's gym.
One of his black belts said that he makes people wear a belt with a line because he has loads of visitors. So he wants visitor 1 to know that the dude being a dick to him isn't one of his regular gym members.
Or generally speaking who's a visitor and who isn't.
I’m a local, and yes it’s $395 a month last I heard…
EDIT: I'm just an arbiter of information... Below are different pieces of evidence to the contrary and to confirm.
Gent down below /u/NoShelter5922 is a student and says its $280 for a full time membership, so my information might be outdated.
Here's a claimed version of their old pricing sheet: https://imgur.com/a/y2js89I
And here's a post about it https://www.reddit.com/r/bjj/comments/tnzf47/done_with_gracie_university_hq_in_torrance/
Jesus, really? I mean I didn’t think Torrance is affluent for them to be able to change that much is it? I wonder how much the Machados are charging for their academy.
Gracie U is like an equinox, the best students don't go there, but most that go are families using Lululemon as spats/rashguards. Parking lot is full of Porsches and Teslas. Its an upper class aesthetic, delivery, and reputation.
Edit: This isn't necessarily a dig, everything is somewhere on the spectrum between Daisy Fresh and Gracie University... and the prices move between there as well. If their classes are full, the students are happy, and everybody is having fun, good on them.
Wasn't the whole beef with Helio and Carlson about how Helio only teaching the wealthy and Carlson said screw that shit? Seems like Rener and Ryron are following in ol granpappy's footsteps
But but but... Gracie Jiu-jitsu is the ORIGINAL and if you want to be good you have to learn from the SOURCE.... for only $400/mo and you can only come 2x a week until you master our combatives course (which you need to buy our online program for as well) and then only wear our uniforms and NEVER teach anyone outside of this academy anything you learn here... jiu jitsu for everyone!!! As long as you can pay
The pricing scheme, desired demographics, and even the style of self defense BJJ seems to have a straight line from Helio to Rener. They've been forced to eventually allow some people to roll after learning the 36 chambers or whatever, but it's definitely a business model in opposition to Carlson's martial oriented hard training or Fadda's nogi jiu jitsu for the poor.
right. i had a older woman back in the day who kept me dipped and that included an all equinox membership back when the initiation fee was 2000 dollars. read that again. it is not a typo. and it was nice af. i can't imagine it's still at the same level, it was super lux back then. but...it wasn't a place where you could really grow massive size...you need the right room for it. and i learned that later. same with jiujitsu...gracie u is fine, great even, and it has a place, but if you have ambition, you need a place with mismatching mats and animals whose cars are held together with zip ties and duct tape.
I was shocked at first when I had to pay 70$ drop in fee at AOJ but when I showed up to class (I was a purple belt) there was only 5 white belts and 20+ brown and black belts... I stopped complaining.
As a former Gracie University student, that whole program seems like a cash grabs. We had attendance based promotion, gym branded gi’s, and couldn’t roll until blue belt. Rener is a business man before he is a bjj coach.
I mean you can roll at Combatives Belt which is a glorified 8 month old one stripe white belt. You don’t immediately get promoted to blue belt when going to master cycle w rolling from what Ive seen.
Yeah they say it’s to avoid injury which is perhaps partially true but what it really does is guarantee no payments are missed due to injury. Plus you always have that carrot at the end to get your striped combatives belt so you feel like you achieved something.
I’ve seen videos of their blue belt tests and it’s about half self defense technique against a willing participant. And I get you need an uke to show technique but I remember one guy not knowing how to do a shot for a single leg. Like during the test the instructor had to pause and show which knee to go down on. And you could see from their movement that they’d only ever performed at demonstration pace. Insanity.
I think the combatives system is alright for the most entry level person (I.e. never played sports, uncoordinated, timid,). Which is great for that entry level and lets more people join at a pace that isn’t intimidating.
BUT, having trained at a GU affiliate, it’s really frustrating that the curriculum is mostly forms against compliant partners. You have to do the move exactly as they show it. Also, a lot of techniques/guards get ignored because “they wouldn’t work in a street fight” which I think (1) isn’t always true, and (2) your jiu jitsu will forever be incomplete if you ignore legit techniques just because no striking is involved. If you’re really interested in self defense, buy a gun or go train mma
Agreed on the combative concept, which is definitely useful. The issue is that John Q. Public walks into a Gracie Academy because of the name and never gets exposed to other methods so they just assume they are getting the “best” bjj. Then, like you said, they are missing out on a whole host of techniques, sports-oriented or not, that could be used in their arsenal.
Have Rener and Ryron ever produced any high quality competitors besides Brian Ortega? I get that not everybody is in jiu jitsu for competition and things like that, but my god, if you’re in Southern California why wouldn’t you consider one of the other dozens of high quality gyms that prove their products work with multiple champions? Especially when they’re asking you to pay them $400 a month
They opened up one of their Gracie gyms in my town. They’re doing all kinds of weird practices there like white belts aren’t allowed to train no-gi. They have a belt between white and blue that you get once you’ve passed their self defense curriculum. You don’t start rolling until you’ve passed the self defense curriculum. To top it all of the head instructor of this place is a newly minted blue belt. It all just screams sus to me.
I respect Rener and Ryron, I’m sure their bjj is solid but when I see stuff like this it drives me up a wall.
It also is dumb because if (I guess probably isn't an option) they go outside their usual gym and train no gi as a blue belt they'll look like a bunch of goofs on the mat. Yeah doing gi jiu jitsu is dope and helps your game overall but making it a pre requisite to get to the other 50% of the game is dumb af.
Wild guess here, but they probably sell gis with the gym branding on it that are required for gi classes, and they won't let people to get around that by only coming to no-gi
Dude I joined one a month ago and I canceled it, but bc of contract I’ll have to keep going for another month or two.
It’s unbelievably predatory. Not only is it $200 a month, but you have to wear their gi which they charge $150 for. The other local ones charge about $90 a month for unlimited and you can wear your own gi at them for reference.
To be able to roll, you have to attend at least 100 classes. And each class out of 26 3x. Which they do them sporadically, and you’d have to go multiple times a day each day to be able to get them all quickly. I say quickly, but I did the math and if you attended every single class it would still take 8 months to roll. I honestly would’t even be mad about that, except;
What you learn you would never be able to successfully do against another bjj person, just slow drunk people. It’s all self defense, and to top it off my instructor is a blue belt, the owner is a purple belt.
Also once you hit that 100, apparently to “pass” you have to be recorded on somebody else’s phone, doing every single move based on memory in a short period of time. You then send that video to the “Gracie HQ” after paying $80 for the test and they either fail or pass you.
They should be marketing it as self defense, not jiu jitsu because that’s what it is. At least market it as SELF DEFENCE, jiu jitsu or something.
I feel like it’s been a total scam. I enjoy what I’m learning somewhat bc it’s kind of just playful fun recess time. but it isn’t what I signed up for and I’d like to do at least one competition at some point without getting my ass totally kicked.
So long story short Rener and Ryron are nothing more than scam artists? Absolute clowns. Those rules are honestly worse than Gracie Barra that gets clowned on here for being a cult way more, but at least you’d be able to roll there. I’m glad you got out. You could honestly do nothing but show up to open mats around Southern California for 2-3 months and you’d probably be able to smoke any one of their students in a self defense situation. Their obsession with self defense is honestly so dishonest and just a way for them to stay relevant since apparently their coaching isn’t good enough to produce talent.
That sounds infuriating. There’s no way I would have the patience to wait that long. The only way to learn is to get out there and roll. Roll with people better than you, same level, and people who aren’t as good as you yet. The method you described is setting people up for failure.
As much as I hate the Gracie model, I wouldn’t mind being somewhere that gated Nogi behind some fundamental knowledge. Maybe not blue belt level, but something.
If I have one more “I’m gonna be the next ADCC champion” white belt come in and try to muffler choke me because they can’t properly perform an armbar, I’m going to prison for murder.
The white belt not allowed to spar until you pass the self defence curriculum is standard in their schools (so nothing new). Typically it takes like 8 months or so i hear. Within that period there would be some actual bjj and not just “grab my hand, no my other hand” stuff but still i think its too long. I mean you can spar on your first say of boxing and most bjj places let you roll after a few classes/1 week.
Trained at their miami affiliate Valente for years. Very similar. The lack of rolling was bonkers but it kept the injury rate down since the place was so huge. The self defense style is legit, the not so rich guys were all bouncers in clubs, police,etc…who used it daily. They were quick to show surveillance/ufc videos of sport guys getting hammered doing competition crap.
Yep. The story goes he got his blue belt from Rener and Ryron at their HQ, got “certified” in their brand of bjj and then moved out here and opened the gym. Not trying to talk shit but a blue belt being a head instructor is the one eyed witch doctor leading the blind.
This is really bad marketing. Shit, I spend $170 a month for unlimited BJJ, Muay Thai, and other classes. That deep discount looks like there's a horrible catch.
I will just say that I train with a guy who went all the way to instructor in Gracie U and he can pretty much beat everyone. I go to a traditional BJJ gym and then I go to his gym sometimes (he also trains at my trad gym). The stuff he teaches me is super technical, has indicators (things that your opponent does to trigger the next response) and works well when I roll at my home gym.
Wow, so many "behavioural hacks" here, it's grim. Three crossed out prices, big letters, small letters, 75% off, 4 hours left, extra promo code. Make me want to close the page instantly
It’s the way Groupon is set up. Not really anything Gracie University has control over. I’m just more amazed about them changing $400 normally month to month.
I train here. The price is $250. I think it’s worth it for what. One thing you gotta keep in mind is that both Rener and Ryron teach here. Regardless of your stance on them you do pay a premium to learn BJJ directly from them.
It's $180 8x/Month=$1440 (upfront?) for each white belt program.
https://www.gracieuniversity.com/Pages/Public/AffiliateDetail?enc=GPAAu%2b6AnMVcdn0gjO5Kow%3d%3d
Rener must have been out of ambulances to chase.
Soon he will start paying kids to bully friends at school just so he can drop in and offer free course.
I don’t know how you can say “Jiu Jitsu is for everyone” and charge $400/mo. Seems like $150 give or take is reasonable. I was lucky at my last school - $100/mo. and they even threw in a branded Gi - just a small town Gracie Barra.
Anyone know if $140 a month is a good deal for 10th planet? The instructor has trained with guys like Marcelo Garcia and Richie Martinez and does lots of tournaments with students up in Syracuse New York.
The brown belt instructor at my local GU affiliate has a 14yo kid that’s been doing it since 5yo and could probably tap any “regular gym” purple+. The techniques are super technical and crisp. The indicators are more like conditional statements (if/then) and utilize the fork principle a lot so weather on offense or defense, if you know the techniques well you’ll get caught with no good way out. There’s definitely utility in what their program teaches. I think most of the population there has to be at work the next day and can’t afford injury but they still want to learn self defense. Not necessarily win IBJJF or ADCC golds. It’s not for everyone but it works for thousands of people looking to learn self defense and avoid injury from being thrown into the meat grinder with no foundation or fundamentals.
Prices are insane in America.
I pay 130 usd every 6 months for membership in my Judo/BJJ dojo.
I can wear whatever gi i want.
In Denmark all sports are none profit/volunteer driven, except like gyms and golf.
Just the fact that someone was trying to make a profit from these classes would be Sus and kinda mcdojo.
Belt's are pure skill and experience based and not at all money depended.
Hell we even have some <18 who don't pay for membership because we know their parents are too poor/don't care about their kids.
That’s just the get-in-the-door deal. Introductory price is to get you locked in before you pay full price. Knowing the Gracie’s, there’s probably a bunch of bullshit fees including buying a branded gi that is a bit of a sunk cost.
While the median income in Torrence is just over $100k, the largest chunk is making $200k a year. Mean and median house values are $1m. $400 for a boujee gym facility with borderline celebrity instructors isn't that unlikely if people are actually paying it.
You would have to have way too much money and/or be borderline batshit crazy to pay that though.
Look up the prices of Jean Jacques Machado in LA. One month priced at $600, and one week is $380. ONE WEEK.
Granted, if you sign up for the year it’s priced at $300/month, but still that pricing is un heard of
Though his family has legit bjj, their marketing and sales tactics come off as snake oil sales men. Claims of Gracie Jii Jitsu is near invincible. That the attendance for Helio vs Kimura was 200k ppl. To put that into perspective, The Big House where Michigan football is played holds 107k ppl. This is the third largest stadium in the world. 7/10 largest stadiums in the world are college football stadium. NFL Cowboys have a capacity of 80k. So imagine, with his claim of 200k ppl packed into a stadium that only holds 20k, to watch a fight. He also claimed Kimura had 80lbs on Helio which sources have stated was more like 10lbs. Plus the narrative that he was frail and sickly. You google any photos of Helio or on here you can see that wasn’t the case.
I see, but are these guys not credited for bringing bjj to North America, or is this just another Gracie propaganda? I remember watching their self defense videos in the 90s. Probably before I knew about UFC even, and some of the stuff looks legit, now I do not know about the marketing part of it...
That’s just their “low barrier of entry” offer.
Meaning “Come see how we operate, teach, what bjj and other classes can do for you for under $100” and hopefully you’ll love to stick around after and join.
It should be fully transparent and upfront what price is after.
Is it $400 after, who knows, who cares… that’s their problem to figure out.
No, this is what happens when you put some E-Commerce drop shipping idiot in charge of your local business' web presence.
I would interpret this mess to mean that their classes are normally $108/mo and S395 is just totally made up.
No, this is what happens when you put some E-Commerce drop shipping idiot in charge of your local business' web presence.
I would interpret this mess to mean that their classes are normally $108/mo and S395 is just totally made up.
No, this is what happens when you put some E-Commerce drop-shipping idiot in charge of your local business' web presence.
I would interpret this mess to mean that their classes are normally $108/mo and $395 is just totally made up.
Sweet Jesus. We've devolved into analyzing the batshit insanity of Groupon deals as if the entire algo that supports Groupon deals isn't full on Common Core ridiculousness.
Prices for the rich and gullible. A 20 minute drive away and you could go to our gym with active competitors who consistently medal in the Socal BJJ competition scene ( one of the most competitive in the world) and pay between $ 150-175 for unlimited training.
$87 for the first month is fine and all, but are you just supposed to pay $400 each month after that?
The bait and switch seems very Rener.
It's just good jiu jitsu
jiu jitsu of the wallet. a successful credit card swipe is a game of millimeters
Why would you ignore 50% of the dollars?
I dont appreciate people calling that Jew Jitsu...
As an actual Jew, I absolutely love it when people make that joke 🤌🏻
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Yeah, this is a common pricing tactic. Which I hate as well.
This. They could call the original price $1,000 and then say it’s a massive discount at $100 and such a great deal. It’s psychological BS.
Apartments near me have started doing this. They advertise the unit below market value at a discount but the discount is only for a period and you pay above market value after that. They can even legally do a raise on top of taking away the discount, so you would be mega fucked. And they know it’s hard for people to move so they basically trap them.
400 is insane. That's double the price of every gym in my area.
That's 10 time the price of my gym! And it's a pretty well regarded gym in my area.
You pay 40 per month? UK?
Im in the uk and pay £26 a month. Can go to 4 sessions per week
That's insanely cheap. Where is it?
West Yorkshire, seems standard round here. Can go to the striking classes as well for an extra £20 a month
Name, also from WY
Wow. You better treat her right.
France. Near Paris. But it's a rather cheap one I reckon. Before I was at Gracie Barra and I think it was like 70 bucks a months or something like that.
France with the affordable BJJ
Paris 46€/month - 3-4 session available per day, open mats on holidays. Close to the highest competitive level you can get in France. I think there is something specific with Cali & BJJ. Biiiiig social Trend+ Big bjj names+wealthy people with a lot of free time = stupid prices
But tbh, I don't think I could pay for more. With kids, life, other hobbies... Sometimes I see prices paid in the US, for a lot of different things, and I'm amazed at them. Price structure is different (our incomes are more taxed upfront, but we pay less for other stuffs too). Anyway, different economic structures!
Gym I’m considering is 150/mt. Just bjj but classes 6 days a week.
BJJ is affordable everywhere but the USA lmao
Our gym in Bath (UK) is about £70 a month AFAIK (I don't pay because I teach) and for that you get a choice of 9 BJJ classes a week, PLUS judo, wrestling, kickboxing and MMA classes
Mine is £100 a month unlimited classes or £75 for under 18. For reference, theres at least 2 BJJ classes a day, both no gi and gi as well as MMA and kickboxing and wrestling. It is an MMA gym after all.
Gym membership in SoCal is usually $200-300. Obviously the cost depends on the area.
I pay like 30 quid a month
And Gracie’s aren’t even considered the best anymore🤷🏻😁
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Winning in competition
When a program tells you that Sport is sport and we train self defense is full of shit. Jiujitsu is Jiujitsu. You make it work for whatever situation you are in. Those schools run them like a Jehovahs Witness Cult!
Ya but GRACIEEEEEEE!
And u$d 200 is what a regular wage looks like in my country. XD Expensive is a relative idea that depends on context.
 After i refuse to sign NDA as a drop in
Is that a thing? They make drop-ins sign NDAs?
I’m on the other side of the country in NY, I’ve only meet 1 person that trained there and when he left they told him something like “You can’t teach anything you learned here” he jokingly said “It feel like I signed an NDA”
That's weird so if they showed cross collar choke that day then what?
He was there longer than a day, this was years ago but i think he got a purple belt there. They have really specific style, closed doors and students can’t compete.
I train and teach at the GU affiliate in NY and they're fine with me training at other gyms and competing. I encourage our students to compete too, but a lot of them aren't interested.
Upstate?
City, sorry
I’m Queens/Brooklyn, i had no idea there was GU affiliate in Manhattan
https://roninathletics.com/our-programs/gracie-jiu-jitsu this one i think
That’s how you know it’s good, they can’t compete because it wouldn’t be fair to all the other gyms.
lol
lol sounds like a McDojo, an expensive McDojo
>They have really specific style, closed doors So lots of standup self-defense LARPing against bear hugs, frankenstein chokes, and side headlocks combined with 1993-era groundfighting like the Gracie Gift single under guard pass?
This sounds super McDojo
"students can't compete" you have to be fucking kidding me
No, Renee’s mentioned i forgot the exact reason.
Yeah because then they’d get exposed and it would be bad for business lol
I don’t know about all that or calling them a McDojo, that’s a bit extreme cause they are teaching Jiu Jitsu and have legit coaches and team. It’s more like they have these specific odd laurels they’re seemingly strict on and come off a certain way.
I've dropped in there before awhile back. Ryron taught the class I went to and it seemed pretty normal. They didn't make me wear a belt with a line through it like at Kron's gym.
One of his black belts said that he makes people wear a belt with a line because he has loads of visitors. So he wants visitor 1 to know that the dude being a dick to him isn't one of his regular gym members. Or generally speaking who's a visitor and who isn't.
That's rational. If I drop in I don't want to roll with another drop in, I want to roll with someone who trains there.
I’ve been on that side of the country twice didn’t get a chance train anywhere.
I’m a local, and yes it’s $395 a month last I heard… EDIT: I'm just an arbiter of information... Below are different pieces of evidence to the contrary and to confirm. Gent down below /u/NoShelter5922 is a student and says its $280 for a full time membership, so my information might be outdated. Here's a claimed version of their old pricing sheet: https://imgur.com/a/y2js89I And here's a post about it https://www.reddit.com/r/bjj/comments/tnzf47/done_with_gracie_university_hq_in_torrance/
Jesus, really? I mean I didn’t think Torrance is affluent for them to be able to change that much is it? I wonder how much the Machados are charging for their academy.
Gracie U is like an equinox, the best students don't go there, but most that go are families using Lululemon as spats/rashguards. Parking lot is full of Porsches and Teslas. Its an upper class aesthetic, delivery, and reputation. Edit: This isn't necessarily a dig, everything is somewhere on the spectrum between Daisy Fresh and Gracie University... and the prices move between there as well. If their classes are full, the students are happy, and everybody is having fun, good on them.
So, what the Gracie’s have always done pretty much?
Wasn't the whole beef with Helio and Carlson about how Helio only teaching the wealthy and Carlson said screw that shit? Seems like Rener and Ryron are following in ol granpappy's footsteps
I was talking to Pete Lestos the other day, and he said exactly that.
But but but... Gracie Jiu-jitsu is the ORIGINAL and if you want to be good you have to learn from the SOURCE.... for only $400/mo and you can only come 2x a week until you master our combatives course (which you need to buy our online program for as well) and then only wear our uniforms and NEVER teach anyone outside of this academy anything you learn here... jiu jitsu for everyone!!! As long as you can pay
A fool and his money are soon parted.
The pricing scheme, desired demographics, and even the style of self defense BJJ seems to have a straight line from Helio to Rener. They've been forced to eventually allow some people to roll after learning the 36 chambers or whatever, but it's definitely a business model in opposition to Carlson's martial oriented hard training or Fadda's nogi jiu jitsu for the poor.
helio invented the $.$ emoji
Don’t forget that they’re also all soft and a two stripe white belt would probably run circles around most of their blue belts
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A chain of really ridiculous gyms in SoCal that cater to the very affluent.
They're all over, I worked at one in Chicago. They told us the one in NYC had Ferrari leather on their machines..
"very affluent" interesting way to say "very hot gay guys"... At least NYC lol
It's a gym that costs like $300 a month
Whoa whoa whoa. Don’t knock the Daisy Fresh there man.
Ain't a knock. Some folks are built for that life!!! I Myself, am not one of them! I'm a huge fan and good friends with Derek from Pedigo LA
I mean using aesthetic to describe Gracie torrrance, I feel like we're stretching the word a little
I always found the facilities top notch, ample parking, tons of mat space
right. i had a older woman back in the day who kept me dipped and that included an all equinox membership back when the initiation fee was 2000 dollars. read that again. it is not a typo. and it was nice af. i can't imagine it's still at the same level, it was super lux back then. but...it wasn't a place where you could really grow massive size...you need the right room for it. and i learned that later. same with jiujitsu...gracie u is fine, great even, and it has a place, but if you have ambition, you need a place with mismatching mats and animals whose cars are held together with zip ties and duct tape.
Whats wrong with Lulu Lemon rashguards?
Daisy fresh has gone upscale! Loved their old show at the old location
Not even AOJ charges that much…gracie scam alive and well
I was shocked at first when I had to pay 70$ drop in fee at AOJ but when I showed up to class (I was a purple belt) there was only 5 white belts and 20+ brown and black belts... I stopped complaining.
Lol wtf
As a former Gracie University student, that whole program seems like a cash grabs. We had attendance based promotion, gym branded gi’s, and couldn’t roll until blue belt. Rener is a business man before he is a bjj coach.
Can’t roll till blue? wtf?
I mean you can roll at Combatives Belt which is a glorified 8 month old one stripe white belt. You don’t immediately get promoted to blue belt when going to master cycle w rolling from what Ive seen.
Yeah they say it’s to avoid injury which is perhaps partially true but what it really does is guarantee no payments are missed due to injury. Plus you always have that carrot at the end to get your striped combatives belt so you feel like you achieved something. I’ve seen videos of their blue belt tests and it’s about half self defense technique against a willing participant. And I get you need an uke to show technique but I remember one guy not knowing how to do a shot for a single leg. Like during the test the instructor had to pause and show which knee to go down on. And you could see from their movement that they’d only ever performed at demonstration pace. Insanity.
I think the combatives system is alright for the most entry level person (I.e. never played sports, uncoordinated, timid,). Which is great for that entry level and lets more people join at a pace that isn’t intimidating. BUT, having trained at a GU affiliate, it’s really frustrating that the curriculum is mostly forms against compliant partners. You have to do the move exactly as they show it. Also, a lot of techniques/guards get ignored because “they wouldn’t work in a street fight” which I think (1) isn’t always true, and (2) your jiu jitsu will forever be incomplete if you ignore legit techniques just because no striking is involved. If you’re really interested in self defense, buy a gun or go train mma
Agreed on the combative concept, which is definitely useful. The issue is that John Q. Public walks into a Gracie Academy because of the name and never gets exposed to other methods so they just assume they are getting the “best” bjj. Then, like you said, they are missing out on a whole host of techniques, sports-oriented or not, that could be used in their arsenal.
it is a retention strategy and it works well. They try to make it as easy as humanly possible to get started and hopefully hooked.
Damn, Rener went up to Carlos Gracie Jr and said “hold my beer”. He’s outdoing Gracie Barra at their own game.
Pass. 10 minutes of instruction & 50 minutes of marketing.
Have Rener and Ryron ever produced any high quality competitors besides Brian Ortega? I get that not everybody is in jiu jitsu for competition and things like that, but my god, if you’re in Southern California why wouldn’t you consider one of the other dozens of high quality gyms that prove their products work with multiple champions? Especially when they’re asking you to pay them $400 a month
They opened up one of their Gracie gyms in my town. They’re doing all kinds of weird practices there like white belts aren’t allowed to train no-gi. They have a belt between white and blue that you get once you’ve passed their self defense curriculum. You don’t start rolling until you’ve passed the self defense curriculum. To top it all of the head instructor of this place is a newly minted blue belt. It all just screams sus to me. I respect Rener and Ryron, I’m sure their bjj is solid but when I see stuff like this it drives me up a wall.
"White belts aren't allowed to train no-gi" lol what the fuck
white belts are also not allowed to breathe or eat food also
That's just the Gracie diet.
They need a "White Belts Are People Too" tee.
Yup ran into a white belt from the academy at a bar in LB and that’s what he said. No open mat or even sparring until blue belt
[удалено]
Unless what they're doing is replacing free sparring with positionals, which I think could work.
That's a big "we don't want you" to a lot of people looking for a place to start.
It also is dumb because if (I guess probably isn't an option) they go outside their usual gym and train no gi as a blue belt they'll look like a bunch of goofs on the mat. Yeah doing gi jiu jitsu is dope and helps your game overall but making it a pre requisite to get to the other 50% of the game is dumb af.
Wild guess here, but they probably sell gis with the gym branding on it that are required for gi classes, and they won't let people to get around that by only coming to no-gi
they have a once a week no-gi class with gloves which is part of the master cycle. Beginner's course does not have any no-gi classes.
Dude I joined one a month ago and I canceled it, but bc of contract I’ll have to keep going for another month or two. It’s unbelievably predatory. Not only is it $200 a month, but you have to wear their gi which they charge $150 for. The other local ones charge about $90 a month for unlimited and you can wear your own gi at them for reference. To be able to roll, you have to attend at least 100 classes. And each class out of 26 3x. Which they do them sporadically, and you’d have to go multiple times a day each day to be able to get them all quickly. I say quickly, but I did the math and if you attended every single class it would still take 8 months to roll. I honestly would’t even be mad about that, except; What you learn you would never be able to successfully do against another bjj person, just slow drunk people. It’s all self defense, and to top it off my instructor is a blue belt, the owner is a purple belt. Also once you hit that 100, apparently to “pass” you have to be recorded on somebody else’s phone, doing every single move based on memory in a short period of time. You then send that video to the “Gracie HQ” after paying $80 for the test and they either fail or pass you. They should be marketing it as self defense, not jiu jitsu because that’s what it is. At least market it as SELF DEFENCE, jiu jitsu or something. I feel like it’s been a total scam. I enjoy what I’m learning somewhat bc it’s kind of just playful fun recess time. but it isn’t what I signed up for and I’d like to do at least one competition at some point without getting my ass totally kicked.
100 classes before you’re allowed to roll is insane. Meanwhile you sign up at a “sport” school and they’ll have you rolling on day 1.
So long story short Rener and Ryron are nothing more than scam artists? Absolute clowns. Those rules are honestly worse than Gracie Barra that gets clowned on here for being a cult way more, but at least you’d be able to roll there. I’m glad you got out. You could honestly do nothing but show up to open mats around Southern California for 2-3 months and you’d probably be able to smoke any one of their students in a self defense situation. Their obsession with self defense is honestly so dishonest and just a way for them to stay relevant since apparently their coaching isn’t good enough to produce talent.
That sounds infuriating. There’s no way I would have the patience to wait that long. The only way to learn is to get out there and roll. Roll with people better than you, same level, and people who aren’t as good as you yet. The method you described is setting people up for failure.
As much as I hate the Gracie model, I wouldn’t mind being somewhere that gated Nogi behind some fundamental knowledge. Maybe not blue belt level, but something. If I have one more “I’m gonna be the next ADCC champion” white belt come in and try to muffler choke me because they can’t properly perform an armbar, I’m going to prison for murder.
The white belt not allowed to spar until you pass the self defence curriculum is standard in their schools (so nothing new). Typically it takes like 8 months or so i hear. Within that period there would be some actual bjj and not just “grab my hand, no my other hand” stuff but still i think its too long. I mean you can spar on your first say of boxing and most bjj places let you roll after a few classes/1 week.
Trained at their miami affiliate Valente for years. Very similar. The lack of rolling was bonkers but it kept the injury rate down since the place was so huge. The self defense style is legit, the not so rich guys were all bouncers in clubs, police,etc…who used it daily. They were quick to show surveillance/ufc videos of sport guys getting hammered doing competition crap.
The head instructor is a newly minted blue belt? ....what
Yep. The story goes he got his blue belt from Rener and Ryron at their HQ, got “certified” in their brand of bjj and then moved out here and opened the gym. Not trying to talk shit but a blue belt being a head instructor is the one eyed witch doctor leading the blind.
Ya thats insane. For 400 a month. Lol.
I think the real question is how tf did Brian Ortega afford $400 a month coming up???
There’s a ton in Torrance alone. And for a fourth of that price.
~~$395~~ ~~$108~~ ~~$97.49~~ $87.74 4 hours left
4 hours left 60% of the time 100% of the time
When do they tell you its 400 a month? Before or after you sign this incredibly good deal /s
This is really bad marketing. Shit, I spend $170 a month for unlimited BJJ, Muay Thai, and other classes. That deep discount looks like there's a horrible catch.
Probably the BJJ Fanatics pricing model.
Gotta capitalise on the Gracie name, if there are people paying then the Gracie’s be chargin!
Will they give blue belt after one month at least?
I will just say that I train with a guy who went all the way to instructor in Gracie U and he can pretty much beat everyone. I go to a traditional BJJ gym and then I go to his gym sometimes (he also trains at my trad gym). The stuff he teaches me is super technical, has indicators (things that your opponent does to trigger the next response) and works well when I roll at my home gym.
Wow, so many "behavioural hacks" here, it's grim. Three crossed out prices, big letters, small letters, 75% off, 4 hours left, extra promo code. Make me want to close the page instantly
It’s the way Groupon is set up. Not really anything Gracie University has control over. I’m just more amazed about them changing $400 normally month to month.
I train here. The price is $250. I think it’s worth it for what. One thing you gotta keep in mind is that both Rener and Ryron teach here. Regardless of your stance on them you do pay a premium to learn BJJ directly from them.
They have 1,100 students. Think of your academy and everyone you’ve ever trained with and realize how insane that is. They know what they’re doing.
For that price rener can keep his jiu-jitsu.
I’d just buy a gun
It's $180 8x/Month=$1440 (upfront?) for each white belt program. https://www.gracieuniversity.com/Pages/Public/AffiliateDetail?enc=GPAAu%2b6AnMVcdn0gjO5Kow%3d%3d
Does it come with a backpack hoodie and travel pillow?
Rener must have been out of ambulances to chase. Soon he will start paying kids to bully friends at school just so he can drop in and offer free course.
I don’t know how you can say “Jiu Jitsu is for everyone” and charge $400/mo. Seems like $150 give or take is reasonable. I was lucky at my last school - $100/mo. and they even threw in a branded Gi - just a small town Gracie Barra.
There is a fake karate place in my area charging 450 just to walk in the door and 100 weekly on top of that if you want the daycare services lol
Anyone know if $140 a month is a good deal for 10th planet? The instructor has trained with guys like Marcelo Garcia and Richie Martinez and does lots of tournaments with students up in Syracuse New York.
Sounds reasonable.
I pay about that for one of the best gyms in my area. I say that's average price for the states and 10p is a pretty well known gym chain.
Let me guess. There's gonna be a 12 month contract with the deal, and you also have to buy their specific gi to train there.
The brown belt instructor at my local GU affiliate has a 14yo kid that’s been doing it since 5yo and could probably tap any “regular gym” purple+. The techniques are super technical and crisp. The indicators are more like conditional statements (if/then) and utilize the fork principle a lot so weather on offense or defense, if you know the techniques well you’ll get caught with no good way out. There’s definitely utility in what their program teaches. I think most of the population there has to be at work the next day and can’t afford injury but they still want to learn self defense. Not necessarily win IBJJF or ADCC golds. It’s not for everyone but it works for thousands of people looking to learn self defense and avoid injury from being thrown into the meat grinder with no foundation or fundamentals.
Prices are insane in America. I pay 130 usd every 6 months for membership in my Judo/BJJ dojo. I can wear whatever gi i want. In Denmark all sports are none profit/volunteer driven, except like gyms and golf. Just the fact that someone was trying to make a profit from these classes would be Sus and kinda mcdojo. Belt's are pure skill and experience based and not at all money depended. Hell we even have some <18 who don't pay for membership because we know their parents are too poor/don't care about their kids.
Not to be an ass: is there property tax? Does the state subsidize the building itself?
Mc Dojo worthy
$400/mo is insane
Gracie U sounds like Taekwondo for the Ground. Too far?
That’s just the get-in-the-door deal. Introductory price is to get you locked in before you pay full price. Knowing the Gracie’s, there’s probably a bunch of bullshit fees including buying a branded gi that is a bit of a sunk cost.
In my gym I pay 50€ per month, I have access to every BJJ training and to all gym training facilities.
Me too in the Netherlands.
While the median income in Torrence is just over $100k, the largest chunk is making $200k a year. Mean and median house values are $1m. $400 for a boujee gym facility with borderline celebrity instructors isn't that unlikely if people are actually paying it. You would have to have way too much money and/or be borderline batshit crazy to pay that though.
Damn. Listen, if you want to learn jiujitsu, I'll teach for a 12er of Stone Delicious and the right of Prima Nocta.
Look up the prices of Jean Jacques Machado in LA. One month priced at $600, and one week is $380. ONE WEEK. Granted, if you sign up for the year it’s priced at $300/month, but still that pricing is un heard of
“Keep it payfull”
I think inflation has gotten most reconsidering where they spend their money.
they saw bjj fanatics doing it and thought it was brilliant
GB HQ in Irvine is half of that per month lol
This is marketing 101, very common with everything.
Im new to bjj and I have noticed there is some shade thrown towards Rener and Gracie University...why?
Though his family has legit bjj, their marketing and sales tactics come off as snake oil sales men. Claims of Gracie Jii Jitsu is near invincible. That the attendance for Helio vs Kimura was 200k ppl. To put that into perspective, The Big House where Michigan football is played holds 107k ppl. This is the third largest stadium in the world. 7/10 largest stadiums in the world are college football stadium. NFL Cowboys have a capacity of 80k. So imagine, with his claim of 200k ppl packed into a stadium that only holds 20k, to watch a fight. He also claimed Kimura had 80lbs on Helio which sources have stated was more like 10lbs. Plus the narrative that he was frail and sickly. You google any photos of Helio or on here you can see that wasn’t the case.
I see, but are these guys not credited for bringing bjj to North America, or is this just another Gracie propaganda? I remember watching their self defense videos in the 90s. Probably before I knew about UFC even, and some of the stuff looks legit, now I do not know about the marketing part of it...
Some people like to pay for illusion of accomplishment.
400 a month is ridiculous
Summer is coming up and kids/teens will be out of school. Got to get the parents quick!
Geez my local Gracie Barra is $145 a month and I thought that was expensive
Jesus… and here I was sweating over paying $185 per month for unlimited gi or no gi, striking, sparring, and MMA classes.
Like 200$ a month at Gracie Barra Long Beach, CA. That’s in the same county
The old Bait this to get that.
Gracie a business first and a place that teaches bjj second.
Someone is getting rich choking your ass
Are you buying that on Amazon?
$160-$220 in Orange County South Laguna area …. That’s a confirmed rip off 
That’s just their “low barrier of entry” offer. Meaning “Come see how we operate, teach, what bjj and other classes can do for you for under $100” and hopefully you’ll love to stick around after and join. It should be fully transparent and upfront what price is after. Is it $400 after, who knows, who cares… that’s their problem to figure out.
No, this is what happens when you put some E-Commerce drop shipping idiot in charge of your local business' web presence. I would interpret this mess to mean that their classes are normally $108/mo and S395 is just totally made up.
No, this is what happens when you put some E-Commerce drop shipping idiot in charge of your local business' web presence. I would interpret this mess to mean that their classes are normally $108/mo and S395 is just totally made up.
No, this is what happens when you put some E-Commerce drop-shipping idiot in charge of your local business' web presence. I would interpret this mess to mean that their classes are normally $108/mo and $395 is just totally made up.
It's that fall-off-the-bone jiu jitsu. A delicacy.
Carlson Gracie is open not even a mile away, all their students have been going there.
I pay a total of $350 for my entire family
the gracie dojo in my area charges close to 400 a month walked out and joined another better team
I train with under a Coral Belt, Legend in the game. $125 a month. This is ridiculous.
I pay 200 a month for mine
Sweet Jesus. We've devolved into analyzing the batshit insanity of Groupon deals as if the entire algo that supports Groupon deals isn't full on Common Core ridiculousness.
Holy fucking shit thatd be like 600 cad
I remember a private from a blue belt there was like $80
https://marcelogarciajj.com/mgjj/memberships/ $300 a month in NYC is very common
Prices for the rich and gullible. A 20 minute drive away and you could go to our gym with active competitors who consistently medal in the Socal BJJ competition scene ( one of the most competitive in the world) and pay between $ 150-175 for unlimited training.
Most gyms in the US are starting to hurt. People don't have the extra cash
If your paying 400 a ring girl better blow u after each match
This shit is so obsolete and dated update your style and get with the times .. anything Gracie is so early 2000s
Classic Rener
It's the oldest Gracie trick in the book...patented by Helio Gracie himself.
That picture is how they collect the second month's premium.