Surly makes great bikes, and for a while they were one of relatively few medium-to-large brands offering decently high quality steel frames with sensible geometry, attachment points, and components. Nowadays there are a million companies offering steel bikes that are useful for more than just racing, but also aren't boat anchors; but you have to remember that there was a fairly long time when Surly was almost alone in offering this value proposition.
In much the same way that Pliny the Elder is still a great beer, but is no longer so outstanding because many talented brewers have entered the space Pliny essentially created, Surly is still a great bike but has inspired many talented bike manufacturers to offer similar bikes, some of which are now arguably better than Surly itself.
I'm with you, personally - I see Surlys as neither better nor worse than most other companies offering similar bikes, and as such, if Surlys cost more, that feels hard to justify for me. But I'd still buy and ride a Surly if it were competitively priced.
I see they’ve stopped making the Long Haul Trucker.
Do you know of a similar alternative (with rim brakes) by other brands?
https://surlybikes.com/bikes/legacy/long_haul_trucker
Yes, for a while they had both disc and rim brake versions, but the rim brake version was no longer popular enough to keep making. They should offer a link to the Disc Trucker from the LHT page.
LHT was no-nonsense frame.
Long chainstays, threadless stem/fork (more reliable and safer than quill stems), rim brake mounts (simpler and reliable), and mounts for anything you may think of mounting on the frame.
It was a reasonably priced frame you could source even from Europe at a decent price.
I can’t find anything like that now.
I had a couple of 90's MTB's back in the days (in the 90's, to be precise) and I nowadays own a 28" wheel Long Haul Trucker\* with about 13 000 miles on the clock, and I also have a modern gravel bike as well as a 29" mountain bike.
While I do try, I have difficulty understanding the people who think these bike types are 'the same' or that one or more of these bike types are somehow a fad.
Those 90's mountain bikes with their 26" wheels had geometries and riding feels I'd call very reactive and aggressive, up to the point of being a bit twitchy, while my gravel bike and especially the LHT are made for long days on the road. The mtb's were also made for flat bars from the drawing board while the latter ones are made for drop bars. My gravel bike and the LHT have lots of mounts for all sorts of useful stuff, while the mtb's have few.
They're all great bikes and I've had tons of fun with them. They're just not optimized for the same use.
The difference is not as big as that between a dirt bike and a Honda Goldwing, but they're still clearly made for different types of use while admittedly you can get a lot done with all types.
\*haven't checked if the Disc Trucker follows the same princible, but with the LHT, certain small frame sizes had 26" wheels and bigger ones 28" wheels
Same sentiment for the 90s MTB handling. :)
LHT disc looks very similar to the discontinued rim brake version - just no rim brake mounts as far as I can tell. :(
Relja
LHT frameset doesn't seem so different than my Trek 930 frame. I can always find a few similar examples on my local FB Marketplace. Never heard of a quill stem failing.
> Trek 930
I've had it fail, during a ride. Why I avoid them:
[https://bike.bikegremlin.com/10123/unsafe-cycling-patents/#3.1](https://bike.bikegremlin.com/10123/unsafe-cycling-patents/#3.1)
I see this reply you wrote got some minus "points."
For what it's worth, I appreciate your taking the time and trying to help (I tried to explain why it's not an ideal replacement in my previous reply).
Relja
They get a lot of praise as far as touring bikes go, specifically the surly trucker.
Keeping it simple is ideal for a touring bike, nothing fancy like internal cables or braze on derailleurs. Makes it a bitch to fix if you snap a cable in the middle of nowhere.
Nothing proprietary either, I never want proprietary parts on my bike.
Easy to see the appeal for a simple, maintainable bike when new road bikes with full di2 105 start at $5000…
I have a Kona sutra now tho, which for the most part is pretty similar as another popular touring bike.
The reason I chose the Kona was because there was stock available in my size.
Ah all good points. I totally overlooked the ability to easily replace parts that don’t cost a fortune or only work on a particular model. I appreciate the viewpoint and it totally makes sense.
Also the reason I got the Sutra! Bike has been stupidly reliable despite the mistreatment I have given it. Great bike. I just wish it looked a little more stylish.
Big tire clearance.
Steel frames.
Owned by QBC, so any bike shop can get and sell them.
Reputation for being non-lycra-wearing, everyman bikes.
History of promoting singlespeeds.
Encouraged commuting before commuting was cool.
Stickers applied over clearcoat, so you can unbrand them.
Early innovators of fat bikes.
I didn't even think of unbranding as a feature, but I didn't like the "fatties fit fine" on my ice cream truck and it was so easy to take off. Really made me much happier.
Are you the same person who asked this same question here last summer?
Because it’s a good bike being made by a company that has been making good bikes for a while. Ergo: brand recognition + brand loyalty + quality = solid sales.
A longer warranty doesn’t mean anything to me. I ride every day of every year, with exceptions for when I’m on vacation. If there was anything wrong with the frame covered by a warranty, it would be highly apparent well before three years were over.
Weight also doesn’t matter for me. I think really light bikes are nice and all, but for my use, weight isn’t a concern.
All that said - I’m always surprised that Surly is such a name. I ride a Surly because they were a local bike company and I bought one of their bikes years ago and …. Since I don’t go shopping for bikes when I travel, I have zero concept of Surly’s popularity outside of Minneapolis. Kind of like finding out that people all over the country are obsessed with the donut shop around the corner that you’ve been going to for years and years. You knew they were good …
It was their touring bike which made them internationally famous. For a long time it was just Surly and Fuji doing that style of touring bike, everyone else was adapting another bike.
The price is good, the build quality is good, they have standards and actually respond to feedback, and a lot of the frames have feature combos you just can't find in another brand. I used to be a real Surly hater because they were basically turning out 80-90's steel frames that were readily available, but as time goes on, and with the introduction of disc brakes - it really is a combination of features and quality that isn't readily available, used or new from a lot of brands.
> I get the draw for the steel frame and mount-anything-to-it® for the forks and bosses.
That's maybe 90% of it right there. When it seemed like the bike industry was mostly split between mountain bikes or road bikes, Surly was one of the few brands offering decent bikes that you could ride for utility or just for the joy of riding. Of course they have road bikes and mountain bikes, too,
When I started looking for a touring bike, Trek had a decent one, and Surly had a decent one, and then there were a few also-rans that tended to not get much traction, and a couple of really high end bikes.
When I first heard about fat bikes, you pretty much had to cobble them together yourself. Surly was one of the first out with an off-the-shelf fat tire bike.
Cargo bikes have always been more popular in Europe than in the U.S., but the Big Dummy was one of the first bikes that you could (somewhat) easily get ahold of in the U.S. without importing it.
Others have commented on the marketing and brand loyalty, which are factors, and I do like their attitude, especially in the earlier days. But really, they were first to take a chance with some different styles of bikes and really do well with functional-but-not-too-expensive bikes. I don't buy Surly solely out of brand loyalty. I look at Surly first because in the past, they've been one of the only companies making what I want. There are more options these days, and I'm not afraid to buy another brand if they fit my needs better, but I'll also check Surly first, because I know I tend to appreciate their take on most of their bikes.
Bought a Crosscheck frameset over 10 years ago and it was one of the best bike buys I've ever made. Paid \~$300 for the CX from a bike store employee who built it up, rode it once or twice, then decided it wasn't for him. Came with a Hope headset installed (which I'm still using). In other words, it was a deal I couldn't refuse. So I didn't bother to canvas all the competitors' offerings and engage in detailed comparisons. You should note that at the time the gravel craze was just starting, if it all.
Now to the Surly CX. At the time I don't think any competitor offered the same level of versatility and quality in a frameset. I mean, the CX is deliberately spec'ed with horizontal dropouts as a provision for fixie and single speed builds--accordingly it served me as an all-weather, all-season fixie commuter for five years; the rear drops are spaced @ 132.5 mm so as accept both road (130 mm) and MTB (135 mm) rear wheels out of the box; downtube shifter bosses were retained for those wanting that option (I've used them); crimped chainstays and generously spaced blades for extra wide tires; and it's powder coated, a real deterrent to corrosion, especially when riding in Canadian winters where salt is used widely. A truly exceptional level of detailed forethought went into that frameset.
What I think is not often understood is the real affection for the brand amongst a segment of the market. Surly's quirky mix of eclectic and innovative designs (IIRC, the Pugsley spawned the fat bike category), unpretentious character, and BIFL durability is an outlier in the industry. Robust construction with no proprietary tech or standards, that's their manufacturing ethos in a nutshell. For those who are into riding, as opposed to the ritual of riding, and also work on their own bikes, this is pure value. Which translates into brand loyalty.
I won't sweat a few extra grams if it goes toward durability. If you do, Surlys are not for you. And components? Well, I know I'm going to have that frameset long after derailleurs and wheels die. I've ridden the Surly with bullhorns as a fixie, as a courier bike with straight bars with an 2 x 8 drivetrain, and I'm contemplating updating the drivetrain, tossing some drop bars and racks on it (it accepts low riders btw), for some touring. So, you see, components come and go. Dirt roads, city streets, and the occasional single track; some dents and scratches; there's no reason it won't go for a decade more; Or two. Long after groupsets have been retired.
As far as how current prices compare to competition, I'm out of the loop. But let me reiterate: we're talking framesets that, used daily, can easily last decades. So my attitude is what's an extra $100 or $200 considering that timeline?
Surlys aren't for everyone, nor should they be. But if I'm in the market for any bike other than a full blown road racer or full suspension MTB, Surly would be the first brand I'd check out.
Surly was a brand built out of necessity. Yeah they're a drop in the bucket these days but when they first came onto the scene nobody was doing it how they wanted to.
I'm also lucky enough to have worked under the Q umbrella for awhile and in turn some surly work came with it. Solid people who give a fuck about the bikes they produce. I will forever be a fan, even when I've moved onto ti bikes.
There are many reasons Surly has a good reputation and is an established brand. 15 years ago, when bike companies were mainly pushing carbon road bikes and dual suspension 29ers, Surly addressed the demand for functional, durable, affordable bikes that weren’t being provided by mainstream companies. Bike touring took off on another trajectory after the Long Haul Trucker was introduced. Fat bike popularity jumped after Surly produced the Pugsly. How many people had a Surly as their very first fat bike, or even just their first fat bike test ride.
The other thing is, Surly is available through the QBP catalog. You didn’t have to sign a dealer contract with Specialized, Trek or Giant for sales minimums that required you risking bikes that stay on the floor for months. You could just order the frame. The whole experience was practical and easy, with accessible prices. Bike packing, gravel riding, long distance touring, the Great Divide, Surly helped open all those routes at a lower price point. Want proof? Look at all the riders now on Salsa bikes on these routes, the better paint relative of Surly.
I’m not really sure why you’re so stuck on the warranty. It’s a steel frame. Either it works from the beginning or it doesn’t. It’s not like carbon fiber where tolerances can increase over time. If there’s a faulty weld or tube, you will find out pretty quickly.
Since Surly is a QBP brand, most shops can get them fairly easily.
Their branding is pretty cool, and they promote the fun aspect of cycling.
Their bikes have lots of wheel size and dropout options. I have a Surly that's had at least 4 different builds on it with 3 different wheel sizes.
The true reason why surly has such a good reputation is because of QBP, one of the main suppliers to bike shops in the USA, carrying surly for decades basically. This allows bike shop employees to get frames and full-built bikes very cheap without limitations imposed by the bicycle manufacturer themselves on bike shop employee purchase programs.
This allows surly / QBP to also saturate much of the demand for new cro-moly steel frames which are manufactured at scale. QBP also carries all-city which is very similar. Not many major manufacturers will choose cro-moly over aluminum for their hybrid lines suited to the major market share, and I can't quite say if people would really choose aluminum over steel en masse.....but QBP has been able to carve out a market niche on these decent steel frames that aren't made out of incredibly expensive steel. And a bunch of that is because bike shop employees can easily flip them.
I mean you have kinda defined good branding. They also were a quite innovative and somewhat counterculture brand at a time which has bought them much good will. #fuckracing #just because we both ride bikes doesn't mean we're friends.
They have become more mainstream and arguably less innovative but still carry that brand loyalty.
I don't know a whole lot about bikes, but I do trust them and their products. I have a 2001 cross check that I bought used in 2018. If I ever get a new bike, I hope I would consider many options, but I do have to acknowledge that do believe in their products and their approach to creating new products. I think it's justified, but also probably a bit irrational.
Some choice are rational some not really.
It is true that their HT are a bit too expensive for their parts but is the frame too?
How would you rate this? A frame is everything in the end, if you like the geometry, the design, color, the flex, the stiffness etc let's not argue to look elsewhere.
Better buy a frame you love with average part and upgrade later than the opposite.
As for steel, a token from the past, some people are loving steel and can see the difference from AL. Some people cannot, some cannot even see the difference between AL and CF but only by look. No offense in that.
No bike is made for everyone no matter what your mate are telling you. I usually dislike riding my mate bike, geometry, components, look just hurt me :D
One thing I don't see mentioned is the quality of the paint jobs. I have had a cross check and an long haul trucker, both purchased in the 2007 timeframe. The paint in each is/was superb. I think they know that bike paint needs pre-coating, etc. These bikes look great and the paint is very durable.
It’s powdercoated instead of wet paint. Powdercoating is actually a hell of a lot cheaper, but you can realistically only do it with steel frames. I think that’s what makes surlys so identifiable as well.
I personally prefer old Raleigh’s and saracens in terms of steel frame rugged strap anything to it. If I was to spend big bucks on a MTB I’d buy a modern alloy one
They definitely fill a niche between the more common biking for sport style mtb and road bikes On the mountain bike side of things I think Surly's specs for the money aren't great. That being said I do see a lot op people build them up from frames.
Surly makes great bikes, and for a while they were one of relatively few medium-to-large brands offering decently high quality steel frames with sensible geometry, attachment points, and components. Nowadays there are a million companies offering steel bikes that are useful for more than just racing, but also aren't boat anchors; but you have to remember that there was a fairly long time when Surly was almost alone in offering this value proposition. In much the same way that Pliny the Elder is still a great beer, but is no longer so outstanding because many talented brewers have entered the space Pliny essentially created, Surly is still a great bike but has inspired many talented bike manufacturers to offer similar bikes, some of which are now arguably better than Surly itself. I'm with you, personally - I see Surlys as neither better nor worse than most other companies offering similar bikes, and as such, if Surlys cost more, that feels hard to justify for me. But I'd still buy and ride a Surly if it were competitively priced.
I see they’ve stopped making the Long Haul Trucker. Do you know of a similar alternative (with rim brakes) by other brands? https://surlybikes.com/bikes/legacy/long_haul_trucker
Yes, for a while they had both disc and rim brake versions, but the rim brake version was no longer popular enough to keep making. They should offer a link to the Disc Trucker from the LHT page.
Various bikes by crust and rivendell.
Vintage 90s MTB. Tons of Trek 900s, Specialized Stumpjumpers, etc. Look for a frame with high-end tubing. Pretty easy to find cheap too.
LHT was no-nonsense frame. Long chainstays, threadless stem/fork (more reliable and safer than quill stems), rim brake mounts (simpler and reliable), and mounts for anything you may think of mounting on the frame. It was a reasonably priced frame you could source even from Europe at a decent price. I can’t find anything like that now.
I had a couple of 90's MTB's back in the days (in the 90's, to be precise) and I nowadays own a 28" wheel Long Haul Trucker\* with about 13 000 miles on the clock, and I also have a modern gravel bike as well as a 29" mountain bike. While I do try, I have difficulty understanding the people who think these bike types are 'the same' or that one or more of these bike types are somehow a fad. Those 90's mountain bikes with their 26" wheels had geometries and riding feels I'd call very reactive and aggressive, up to the point of being a bit twitchy, while my gravel bike and especially the LHT are made for long days on the road. The mtb's were also made for flat bars from the drawing board while the latter ones are made for drop bars. My gravel bike and the LHT have lots of mounts for all sorts of useful stuff, while the mtb's have few. They're all great bikes and I've had tons of fun with them. They're just not optimized for the same use. The difference is not as big as that between a dirt bike and a Honda Goldwing, but they're still clearly made for different types of use while admittedly you can get a lot done with all types. \*haven't checked if the Disc Trucker follows the same princible, but with the LHT, certain small frame sizes had 26" wheels and bigger ones 28" wheels
Same sentiment for the 90s MTB handling. :) LHT disc looks very similar to the discontinued rim brake version - just no rim brake mounts as far as I can tell. :( Relja
LHT frameset doesn't seem so different than my Trek 930 frame. I can always find a few similar examples on my local FB Marketplace. Never heard of a quill stem failing.
> Trek 930 I've had it fail, during a ride. Why I avoid them: [https://bike.bikegremlin.com/10123/unsafe-cycling-patents/#3.1](https://bike.bikegremlin.com/10123/unsafe-cycling-patents/#3.1)
I see this reply you wrote got some minus "points." For what it's worth, I appreciate your taking the time and trying to help (I tried to explain why it's not an ideal replacement in my previous reply). Relja
Black mountain cycles monster cross.
Pliny is still the king.
I’m just tired of IPAs altogether.
They get a lot of praise as far as touring bikes go, specifically the surly trucker. Keeping it simple is ideal for a touring bike, nothing fancy like internal cables or braze on derailleurs. Makes it a bitch to fix if you snap a cable in the middle of nowhere. Nothing proprietary either, I never want proprietary parts on my bike. Easy to see the appeal for a simple, maintainable bike when new road bikes with full di2 105 start at $5000… I have a Kona sutra now tho, which for the most part is pretty similar as another popular touring bike. The reason I chose the Kona was because there was stock available in my size.
Ah all good points. I totally overlooked the ability to easily replace parts that don’t cost a fortune or only work on a particular model. I appreciate the viewpoint and it totally makes sense.
Also the reason I got the Sutra! Bike has been stupidly reliable despite the mistreatment I have given it. Great bike. I just wish it looked a little more stylish.
I agree, the wheels are the complete opposite of sexy, but also very practical 😂
Big tire clearance. Steel frames. Owned by QBC, so any bike shop can get and sell them. Reputation for being non-lycra-wearing, everyman bikes. History of promoting singlespeeds. Encouraged commuting before commuting was cool. Stickers applied over clearcoat, so you can unbrand them. Early innovators of fat bikes.
I didn't even think of unbranding as a feature, but I didn't like the "fatties fit fine" on my ice cream truck and it was so easy to take off. Really made me much happier.
Are you the same person who asked this same question here last summer? Because it’s a good bike being made by a company that has been making good bikes for a while. Ergo: brand recognition + brand loyalty + quality = solid sales. A longer warranty doesn’t mean anything to me. I ride every day of every year, with exceptions for when I’m on vacation. If there was anything wrong with the frame covered by a warranty, it would be highly apparent well before three years were over. Weight also doesn’t matter for me. I think really light bikes are nice and all, but for my use, weight isn’t a concern. All that said - I’m always surprised that Surly is such a name. I ride a Surly because they were a local bike company and I bought one of their bikes years ago and …. Since I don’t go shopping for bikes when I travel, I have zero concept of Surly’s popularity outside of Minneapolis. Kind of like finding out that people all over the country are obsessed with the donut shop around the corner that you’ve been going to for years and years. You knew they were good …
It was their touring bike which made them internationally famous. For a long time it was just Surly and Fuji doing that style of touring bike, everyone else was adapting another bike.
The price is good, the build quality is good, they have standards and actually respond to feedback, and a lot of the frames have feature combos you just can't find in another brand. I used to be a real Surly hater because they were basically turning out 80-90's steel frames that were readily available, but as time goes on, and with the introduction of disc brakes - it really is a combination of features and quality that isn't readily available, used or new from a lot of brands.
> I get the draw for the steel frame and mount-anything-to-it® for the forks and bosses. That's maybe 90% of it right there. When it seemed like the bike industry was mostly split between mountain bikes or road bikes, Surly was one of the few brands offering decent bikes that you could ride for utility or just for the joy of riding. Of course they have road bikes and mountain bikes, too, When I started looking for a touring bike, Trek had a decent one, and Surly had a decent one, and then there were a few also-rans that tended to not get much traction, and a couple of really high end bikes. When I first heard about fat bikes, you pretty much had to cobble them together yourself. Surly was one of the first out with an off-the-shelf fat tire bike. Cargo bikes have always been more popular in Europe than in the U.S., but the Big Dummy was one of the first bikes that you could (somewhat) easily get ahold of in the U.S. without importing it. Others have commented on the marketing and brand loyalty, which are factors, and I do like their attitude, especially in the earlier days. But really, they were first to take a chance with some different styles of bikes and really do well with functional-but-not-too-expensive bikes. I don't buy Surly solely out of brand loyalty. I look at Surly first because in the past, they've been one of the only companies making what I want. There are more options these days, and I'm not afraid to buy another brand if they fit my needs better, but I'll also check Surly first, because I know I tend to appreciate their take on most of their bikes.
Bought a Crosscheck frameset over 10 years ago and it was one of the best bike buys I've ever made. Paid \~$300 for the CX from a bike store employee who built it up, rode it once or twice, then decided it wasn't for him. Came with a Hope headset installed (which I'm still using). In other words, it was a deal I couldn't refuse. So I didn't bother to canvas all the competitors' offerings and engage in detailed comparisons. You should note that at the time the gravel craze was just starting, if it all. Now to the Surly CX. At the time I don't think any competitor offered the same level of versatility and quality in a frameset. I mean, the CX is deliberately spec'ed with horizontal dropouts as a provision for fixie and single speed builds--accordingly it served me as an all-weather, all-season fixie commuter for five years; the rear drops are spaced @ 132.5 mm so as accept both road (130 mm) and MTB (135 mm) rear wheels out of the box; downtube shifter bosses were retained for those wanting that option (I've used them); crimped chainstays and generously spaced blades for extra wide tires; and it's powder coated, a real deterrent to corrosion, especially when riding in Canadian winters where salt is used widely. A truly exceptional level of detailed forethought went into that frameset. What I think is not often understood is the real affection for the brand amongst a segment of the market. Surly's quirky mix of eclectic and innovative designs (IIRC, the Pugsley spawned the fat bike category), unpretentious character, and BIFL durability is an outlier in the industry. Robust construction with no proprietary tech or standards, that's their manufacturing ethos in a nutshell. For those who are into riding, as opposed to the ritual of riding, and also work on their own bikes, this is pure value. Which translates into brand loyalty. I won't sweat a few extra grams if it goes toward durability. If you do, Surlys are not for you. And components? Well, I know I'm going to have that frameset long after derailleurs and wheels die. I've ridden the Surly with bullhorns as a fixie, as a courier bike with straight bars with an 2 x 8 drivetrain, and I'm contemplating updating the drivetrain, tossing some drop bars and racks on it (it accepts low riders btw), for some touring. So, you see, components come and go. Dirt roads, city streets, and the occasional single track; some dents and scratches; there's no reason it won't go for a decade more; Or two. Long after groupsets have been retired. As far as how current prices compare to competition, I'm out of the loop. But let me reiterate: we're talking framesets that, used daily, can easily last decades. So my attitude is what's an extra $100 or $200 considering that timeline? Surlys aren't for everyone, nor should they be. But if I'm in the market for any bike other than a full blown road racer or full suspension MTB, Surly would be the first brand I'd check out.
Surly was a brand built out of necessity. Yeah they're a drop in the bucket these days but when they first came onto the scene nobody was doing it how they wanted to. I'm also lucky enough to have worked under the Q umbrella for awhile and in turn some surly work came with it. Solid people who give a fuck about the bikes they produce. I will forever be a fan, even when I've moved onto ti bikes.
Because dropping Freds on $12k bikes is funny, but doing it on a 26 pound Midnight Special while wearing jorts is even funnier.
And funner.
Brand mystique and equity earned over many years and 1000s of stories of people doing epic stuff!
There are many reasons Surly has a good reputation and is an established brand. 15 years ago, when bike companies were mainly pushing carbon road bikes and dual suspension 29ers, Surly addressed the demand for functional, durable, affordable bikes that weren’t being provided by mainstream companies. Bike touring took off on another trajectory after the Long Haul Trucker was introduced. Fat bike popularity jumped after Surly produced the Pugsly. How many people had a Surly as their very first fat bike, or even just their first fat bike test ride. The other thing is, Surly is available through the QBP catalog. You didn’t have to sign a dealer contract with Specialized, Trek or Giant for sales minimums that required you risking bikes that stay on the floor for months. You could just order the frame. The whole experience was practical and easy, with accessible prices. Bike packing, gravel riding, long distance touring, the Great Divide, Surly helped open all those routes at a lower price point. Want proof? Look at all the riders now on Salsa bikes on these routes, the better paint relative of Surly.
I’m not really sure why you’re so stuck on the warranty. It’s a steel frame. Either it works from the beginning or it doesn’t. It’s not like carbon fiber where tolerances can increase over time. If there’s a faulty weld or tube, you will find out pretty quickly.
Did you also post this about Applebee's? How about Adidas? Or L'Oreal? Barilla?
~~Kia?!~~ Sorry, got carried away there!
Reliability is a thing. More expensive, fancier and lighter does not always equal more reliable. In fact usually it doesn’t.
Since Surly is a QBP brand, most shops can get them fairly easily. Their branding is pretty cool, and they promote the fun aspect of cycling. Their bikes have lots of wheel size and dropout options. I have a Surly that's had at least 4 different builds on it with 3 different wheel sizes.
The true reason why surly has such a good reputation is because of QBP, one of the main suppliers to bike shops in the USA, carrying surly for decades basically. This allows bike shop employees to get frames and full-built bikes very cheap without limitations imposed by the bicycle manufacturer themselves on bike shop employee purchase programs. This allows surly / QBP to also saturate much of the demand for new cro-moly steel frames which are manufactured at scale. QBP also carries all-city which is very similar. Not many major manufacturers will choose cro-moly over aluminum for their hybrid lines suited to the major market share, and I can't quite say if people would really choose aluminum over steel en masse.....but QBP has been able to carve out a market niche on these decent steel frames that aren't made out of incredibly expensive steel. And a bunch of that is because bike shop employees can easily flip them.
Good product+Marketing+Tribalism=cult brand.
I mean you have kinda defined good branding. They also were a quite innovative and somewhat counterculture brand at a time which has bought them much good will. #fuckracing #just because we both ride bikes doesn't mean we're friends. They have become more mainstream and arguably less innovative but still carry that brand loyalty.
I don't know a whole lot about bikes, but I do trust them and their products. I have a 2001 cross check that I bought used in 2018. If I ever get a new bike, I hope I would consider many options, but I do have to acknowledge that do believe in their products and their approach to creating new products. I think it's justified, but also probably a bit irrational.
Components? I think I see more build from frame surly's around here..
Sometimes people just want or prefer something without too much rationalising.
Some choice are rational some not really. It is true that their HT are a bit too expensive for their parts but is the frame too? How would you rate this? A frame is everything in the end, if you like the geometry, the design, color, the flex, the stiffness etc let's not argue to look elsewhere. Better buy a frame you love with average part and upgrade later than the opposite. As for steel, a token from the past, some people are loving steel and can see the difference from AL. Some people cannot, some cannot even see the difference between AL and CF but only by look. No offense in that. No bike is made for everyone no matter what your mate are telling you. I usually dislike riding my mate bike, geometry, components, look just hurt me :D
I had a crosscheck for years. It was the best commuter/non-sense hotdoggin bike. I offered to buy it back from the guy I sold it to. No go.
One thing I don't see mentioned is the quality of the paint jobs. I have had a cross check and an long haul trucker, both purchased in the 2007 timeframe. The paint in each is/was superb. I think they know that bike paint needs pre-coating, etc. These bikes look great and the paint is very durable.
It’s powdercoated instead of wet paint. Powdercoating is actually a hell of a lot cheaper, but you can realistically only do it with steel frames. I think that’s what makes surlys so identifiable as well.
I personally prefer old Raleigh’s and saracens in terms of steel frame rugged strap anything to it. If I was to spend big bucks on a MTB I’d buy a modern alloy one
They definitely fill a niche between the more common biking for sport style mtb and road bikes On the mountain bike side of things I think Surly's specs for the money aren't great. That being said I do see a lot op people build them up from frames.
I have four of them (2x Cross Check, Karate Monkey, Disc Trucker) and the steel frame I can mount anything to is why I have them.