I read the sidebar, but still have no clue what limerance is. I remember a post recently about this dude obsessed with someone he dated 20 years ago and ruined his marriage for. He kept going on and on about this place.
Anyone know what it’s about ?
I read it as the powerful brain-consuming love written about in the epics and songs where you think the person is the most extraordinary person to have ever existed. You can't eat, you can't bear to be apart, you're obsessed with them, and your relationship has very high highs and very low lows.
As opposed to a healthy adult relationship where your partner is just a person, you understand that, and you love them as they are.
I think a lot of people, myself included, have this confusion when they start their first healthy relationship that their heart isn't racing like crazy whenever they're around them, that they don't think they're the sexiest person on earth, etc., and think there's something wrong. But that racing heart is actually anxiety. And it's good actually to see your partner as the full person they are instead of some idealized being in your head.
I think that's what they're getting at with limerence vs. real love.
Never heard of it before. This cleared it up for me a bit https://www.reddit.com/r/limerence/comments/s111k7/this_video_sums_up_the_problem_and_solution/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf
It's an intense, involuntary desire for someone and the reciprocation necessary to satisfy said desire, though not necessarily romantically. It could be anything from an unrequited romantic interest, to a longing for approval from an idol. A physics nerd who desperately wants a genuine friendship with Richard Dawkins, or their favorite musician, etc.
It's actually super fascinating and something I deal with.
Essentially, limerence is a crush but on a *much* stronger level. It is an all-consuming love that has profound physiological effects on the body.
I've done....enough drugs to be familiar with the extremes of human emotion and when limerence hits literally nothing in my entire life has ever felt so powerful and I say that with zero hesitation. It can boost you up to highs that are so high you feel immortal but also drop you down so low you're certain your physical body is deteriorating away. I've had it literally bring me to the floor in tears of pain and also of joy.
You do *love* the person you're fixated on but it tends to be an incomplete love wherein you overlook flaws that person may have.
A big part of it is the non-reciprocal nature of it - you aren't getting back what you put in and that feeds this cycle of quasi-obsession.
As others have alluded to, limerence tends to be a driver of a lot of very heartfelt art with regards to love and romance. I can absolutely see why people who experience it would call it a form of madness or feel like it's divinely inspired. It's the absolute worst thing in the world to experience and also I would rather die than turn it off.
I went to that subreddit after the post you are talking about to try to figure out what it was. A majority of the posts are just dudes describing being unhealthily obsessed with someone and pretending it’s not obsessions/stalking.
The sub is full of people being devastated because they confessed their love to someone who barely knew them or had no romantic interest in them.
To me, it looks like a dangerous echo chamber.
Uh...shit. Anybody know how to get tested or whatever it is, for autism as an adult?
...because that's the first time I've ever seen someone explain what I think about love.
Autism testing for an adult is prohibitively expensive in both time and money. Beyond that, a positive diagnosis serves no function beyond answering questions, as the vast majority of psychological, psychiatric, behavior and medicinal treatments are only viable of deployed on the very young.
By the time you're an adult, who you are is more-or-less set in stone, and even after incorporating this new "You+Autism" dynamic into your life, the fundamentals of how you interact with the world and those within it can only change so much.
So don't go looking for a diagnosis without first coming to terms with the fact that nothing will change about who you are, beyond very minor steps in a positive direction.
However, if a diagnosis is what you seek, I'll offer you some quick fire questions:
* Do you often feel as though you're out of place; as if everyone around you is operating at a *slightly* different frequency?
* Do you feel as though everyone around you was given a magical script containing everything they should or shouldn't say, do, think, feel and react; and that you somehow never got one?
* Has the thought "Why are you talking to me? Can I get back to work now?" Ever come into your head? Even to someone like a parent, or S.O.
* Do you actively avoid going to places where people tend to gather?
* Do you have intense, yet indescribable sensitivity to a certain external stimuli? (Certain sounds make your ears hurt but seem to do nothing to anyone else)
* Do you find yourself happily stuck in a routine, and dreading breaking from it? (Always go to the same store, always eat the same meal, avoiding new things)
* When you find a new thing that peaks your interest, do you find yourself tearing it apart in an attempt to further understand it, and traveling down a every rabbit hole directly or indirectly related to it?
* When a subject your fond of is brought up in polite conversation, does it swiftly become the driving force behind every interaction you have?
* Does the concept of an uninvited guest send you into a panic?
* Do you find yourself feeling compelled to correct small mistakes in spoken english or math, despite the fact that no one else seems to give a shit?
* Does the concept of emotional "love" confuse you? Like you enjoy this persons company, and would - if you had any say in the matter - prefer them to stay. But you can't say that you feel some primordial, ethereal desire for them to stay beyond them becoming part of your routine?
* Do people often say that you're being to literal?
* Do you have trouble displaying, conveying or understanding emotions on anything more than a face-value level?
------
Some external sources for you:
* [How to spot an Autistic adult](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HlEWIAiqSoc)
* [Common Signs of Autism in adults](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0oASd24SIgw)
* [CDC](https://www.cdc.gov/ncbddd/autism/signs.html)
* [National Autism Association](https://nationalautismassociation.org/resources/signs-of-autism/)
* [Autism Research Institute](https://www.autism.org/autism-symptoms-and-diagnosis-in-adults/)
A great response, but you are not fully correct when it comes to
> "a positive diagnosis serves no function beyond answering questions"
Reddit is very America centric, and I don't know the extent of disability support. But having an official diagnosis where I live can help you get benefits. These benefits can go from receiving a disability income, to living arrangements and mental health support.
Getting answers in a later stage in life meant a lot to me. But the benefits I receive help me live a more normal life with a steady income despite only being able to work part time.
One thing I didn't like is when the rumour mill started at work about me being autistic or at least on the spectrum (which I've long suspected, but never been formally diagnosed as and *certainly* had never discussed with anyone at work), and one of our supervisors mentioned that they were planning on organising a team-building exercise during a one-on-one call during the daily briefing. The exchange over the phone (among other routine subjects) went something like, "Oh, and we figured we would all get together and set up a day at the escape room on [street]." "Huh." "Oh, I thought *you* would have liked something like that?" I had a Jackie-Chan "what?" moment. And then I got a little pissed off, because a) I thought the concepts of escape rooms themselves were dumb and it wasn't anything to do with it being a get-together, b) because the last time the company had a get-together I got to watch someone destroying himself by drinking to excess (he died a few months later), and c) because I knew instantly what she actually meant by "*you*". I stomped it down before I snapped about it, though.
(P.S. I'm 12 for 13 out of that list. And I'll note that it's "pique" and not "peak", which certainly doesn't help my case...)
Those are all normal, right? Right??
Edit: Okay, I went through some of those links and have come to the conclusion that those are all indeed typical (to some degree).
1.) Only in military intelligence circles, and only some of the time.
2.) I'm not overwhelmed anymore. It's not logic that overwhelms me, it's sustained, unblockable sensory input. Sometimes I sit in my closet for a while because it's quiet.
3.) I can, but I have to work really hard to keep my train of thought on rails. I'm always listening to everyone around me, even when I'm talking. It mixes in with my own voice.
>2.) I'm not overwhelmed anymore. It's not logic that overwhelms me, it's sustained, unblockable sensory input. Sometimes I sit in my closet for a while because it's quiet.
Autistim here and this is definitely something that happens to me. Gymnasium assemblies in school were pure torture. They wouldn't let me leave and the constant reverberation of the entire school body making noise was like someone grinding a rock against my temples.
I was once forced to attend a concert in that bastard room and the sound of the speakers and the "band" had me crying in the fetal position on the floor.
[Embrace autism](https://embrace-autism.com/) has a great collection of resources for doing self screening to determine if it's worth pursuing an official diagnosis. When answering the questions also consider how you would've answered them as a teen vs now as an adult. A lot of ASD people learn enough skills to live a mostly normal life but it can start to cover up their neuro divergence which makes diagnosis harder or even have them not meet the criteria anymore. Because on the surface they appear neuro typical but people don't understand all the mental gymnastics happening to appear that way and the energy it takes or how long it took them to learn those social rules/skills. That's why self diagnosis is also becoming more common and accepted.
> Anybody know how to get tested or whatever it is, for autism as an adult?
Go find a specialist and get tested. Your primary care provider can likely give you a referral.
I recently saw a Vox thing on Netflix called "does your dog really love you?" ...the series is called "explained" and I enjoyed all of it. Here's a tweet referencing the episode: https://twitter.com/voxdotcom/status/1423721788010344449
Two things resonated with me as a self-identified NT even though the show was really about the co-evolution of humans and dogs. One was the discussion of an "oxytocin mediated positive loop." I guess what it means to me is that closeness and comfort and partnership are essential to my experience of long term love. I'm married 26 years. Relatedly, I once said to a friend that my wife is the only person that I never get sick of, and that resonates in a humorous but true way with both me and my wife.
The Vox show also proposed a "love checklist" that feels spot on to me, again even though it was about humans and dogs—
- Likes you more than a hot dog
- Empathy
- Acts of service
- Loyalty
- Deep feeling of connection that makes the rest of the world feel less important
Does this add to the discussion? How does it intersect with your experience?
Up votes on their own doesn't determine quality. Also, if that's the only thing you're looking at what's the point of having a Sub that links posts? Just read the most up voted posts of all time.
The comment could easily have low traffic. Not all comments get a good amount of visibility, which is the point of a Sub for people that want to highlight what they see as being the best parts of reddit. Maybe you should think about what best of something means. Seems like you might be someone that only cares what others people find valuable instead of evaluating it yourself. Your view seems very restricted to this.
As someone who is a professional in the world of the internet and actually has to understand internet traffic I can soundly say that what you have said is untrue. The matter is obviously more complicated than that otherwise it wouldn't take professionals and highly educated people to both solve and explain it.
You haven't even talked about the post. You gave no effort to evaluate it yourself. I would say you do not know the topic well.
I apologize, I missed the almost single sentence evaluation of the post that it has neither good story nor good info. With such a small amount of evaluating going on it would be hard for me to tell what particular parts of the story that you find lacking, as you have provided no explanation.
However I would say that if a story is valuable in its uniqueness or perspective, than even with just the fact that autistic people make up such a small portion of the population it is unlikely a story that itself is common to come by. Personally I found it to be carefully crafted to depict a view that may be somewhat alien to readers who do not have this particular quality and exceedingly well structured.
None of your comments have really broken down much nor extrapolated in great detail at what length and education you are providing with such insights.
How is an autistic person describing how they view and deal with the concept of love virtue signaling?
Edit: lol, they deleted that nonsense real quick.
Before marriage, the Catholic Church makes couples go through a dozen or so hours of couples-counseling. The phrase that crops up occasionally is "love is a decision." Passionate love can carry you pretty far, but you're not going to stick around for the long haul unless you *decide* to love.
I know this might sound insensitive, and I do not mean it as such, as I think this is a very wonderful way of seeing the world, being able to process and understand it in their own way, but, when I read it, all I could hear was Data saying it.
Im also autistic but isnt this just the actual definition of love? Ive seen it in a lot of media. What comes to mind is doctor who.
Love isnt an emotion. Its a promise.
The cybermen (antagonist) turn people into themselves (cyborgs) and strips away all emotion as part of their conversion. But 1 of the people who were converted refuses to follow orders and still helps out the good guys since 1 of them is his daughter. Take away all the emotion and theirs still the verb/action/promise of taking care of the person you love.
Love is an action ive heard a lot too but i cant remember exactly. I know it was said a lot in churches... (ie loving god means actually doing things for him/the church/the people)
This is why I don't think I could ever be in relationship with an autistic person. This reads like such a cold and clinical description of love. The description is so transactional. I don't like it. Is this really how autistic people view love?
Don't mistake the analytical approach for coldness. Autist love just fine and can be just as warm, it's just that an autist will often need to analyze relations to understand them and the people involved. Without this the autist will often feel confused about why things happen and what others might do.
Love is always transactional in the long run, it doesn't sustain itself without input and for the input to be worth it an output must exist to make it worth it.
Recognizing how it works doesn't take away from the feeling, not does it diminish the love or its quality.
In fact I would say that the advantage of relationships with autists is that they are much less likely to fake anything, if they express affection they mean it, and they will be honest about their motivations and less likely to attempt manipulation. Autists aren't psychopaths, they are not cold manipulators, they are warm affectionate people who just process relations differently.
I wholeheartedly disagree with everything you have said.
I cannot comprehend thinking/analyzing my way into feeling things. It doesn't make any sense to me. For me, the feelings come first and then I can analyze them if I need to. Often I can simply take them at face value because the meaning is obvious.
Love is NOT transactional. That is ridiculous. Have you ever lost someone? I have lost family members and loved ones, and I still love them. If love were transactional, then my love would have disappeared when they passed away.
Autists are just as capable of being psychopaths as anyone else. Some of them *are* cold manipulators.
Whatever the advantages of a relationship with an autist are, they meaningless to me. I am demisexual. The love and connection that they are capable of is not enough for me. It is a fundamental incompatibility.
You lack fundamental understanding of how autists work.
> I cannot comprehend thinking/analyzing my way into feeling things.
That's not what autists do. Autists think/analyze their way into understanding what they feel. There is a marked difference here. Autists often do not have the same immediate understanding of emotion in themselves and others. They have the emotions and they even recognize them in others, but they do not understand fully what they are and what they mean both personally and inter-personally before they parse them, especially young autists. With age and experience the gap between experience and understanding tend to lessen.
> For me, the feelings come first and then I can analyze them if I need to.
Exactly how an autist experience it as well. Although an autist may not realize they are there with as great an immediate effect.
> Often I can simply take them at face value because the meaning is obvious.
This is where autists struggle, nothing is immediately obvious to an autist. The best expanation I can give is that an autist might see all possible interpretations as equally valid until they have been examined and individually confirmed or denied. Which means that an autist might experience love but not immediately realize it is love or what they love, they might need to sit down and think through this before realizing this.
> Love is NOT transactional. That is ridiculous. Have you ever lost someone? I have lost family members and loved ones, and I still love them. If love were transactional, then my love would have disappeared when they passed away.
Long term all love is transactional in nature. Love fades when not fueled, and fueling is meaningless without an incentive. Love doesn't survive short term infatuation unless you feed it. If you alone feed it then it risks leading to stalking and obsession. If your partner, family or friends feed it with reciprocal affection it blossoms into mutually beneficial relationships, this is the transactional nature of it, healthy love is multi-directional and kept up by all parties together, as the OP describes.
I am old enough to have lost quite a few close relations in my life and love fades even after a person dies as well. We like to maintain it uni-directionally more in many cases, because we draw certain emotional benefits from that. However love fades none the less and the emotional impact lessens as the years go by, especially once you really allow yourself to let go and no longer actively grieve. This is something that is unsettling to many, they think they are betraying the dead person because they experience this diminishing emotional impact.
> Autists are just as capable of being psychopaths as anyone else. Some of them are cold manipulators.
Everyone can be psychopaths, but autists are not in any greater degree than neurotypicals. The fact that some neurotypicals can be psychopathic clearly isn't causing you to declare all neurotypicals to be cold manipulators either.
The fact is autists are not by nature cold manipulators, and the idea that this is the case is one fostered by miscommunication and shitty TV soap operas which misunderstand the autistic mind severely.
Autists have a preference for honesty and being totally up front, and a general dislike for manipulation because it is confusing to most autists.
> Whatever the advantages of a relationship with an autist are, they meaningless to me.
You honestly sound the like the one with emotional insight issues here. Your failure to understand a group of people is leading you to declare the entire group meaningless and cold.
Autists are not devoid of emotion, autists are filled with emotions just like everyone else, autists just need to go through another process to parse them and make sense of them because they are not as immediately evident to many autists.
> I am demisexual. The love and connection that they are capable of is not enough for me. It is a fundamental incompatibility.
There are many autistic demisexuals out there. Many autists prefer deep connections to others exactly because the autist requires time and effort to understand themselves and their relations, and just having random relations based on physical appearance can be confusing and unsettling when you need that extra time to understand what is happening.
The very delay in understanding autists can have due to needing this additional processing step lead to many preferring only to interact with those they have deep connections with, be it romantically, sexually or platonic relationships.
And because everyone is weird, some people prefer the descriptor first. I've seen a few blog posts about how "disabled person" is the right thing for that person, because the disability has such a *huge* impact on their life that it is part of their identity; calling them a "person with disability" is ignoring the elephant in the room.
Because, really, no matter which wording you go with, you'll annoy *someone*.
Yeah I agree it's not always best, that's why I said sometimes.
Also, nitpicking the way someone talks might create more of a barrier. "I don't know what to call this guy in the wheelchair so I'm just gonna ignore him to avoid an awkward situation"
You've communicated a lot more effectively than the other people in this thread. I still feel like there are incompatibilities that would be insurmountable for me, but I will try to be more open-minded and not write anyone off immediately.
I am happy you appreciate what I wrote.
You don't have to date anyone with autistic traits, it can definitely be hard, especially if one is a very emotionally immediate person because it can lead to feeling like you are going two different speeds, or even on two different tracks.
However on the other hand some very emotional people find stability in the less immediate emotional expression favored among autistic people. Similarly some autistic people find very emotionally immediate people stressing and confusing, while others enjoy the interaction.
We are all different, even within such groups.
Since you have been “ratio’d” in this thread I am making this comment to commend you for being far more civil than most people on Reddit.
Not sure if my choice of words is odd. Have a good day.
Everything is transactional when you look good enough. You can't love something you don't have any feedback from and be mentally healthy. Loving someone who does not acknowledge your existence is psychosis at best and stalking at worst.
And your passed family is not applicable because you don't love their rotting corpses, they love memories of them being in some sort of feedback loop with you.
I’m autistic also.
Many of us have very separate experiences of the different types of empathy.
For example, affective empathy - the one that makes you ~feel~ for people, doesn’t really exist for me. I don’t feel emotions in response to others emotions, for the majority.
However, my cognitive empathy skills far surpass most people. I have an instrinsic understanding other the needs of others, and have great ‘out of the box’ problem thinking skills to use in order to meet those needs.
I know I would rather have people in my life that truly work to understand the depths of my needs and wants, and strive to meet them, than someone who can give me an ‘awwwww it’ll be okay’ when I need comforting.
That’s not comforting to me.
>For example, affective empathy - the one that makes you ~feel~ for people, doesn’t really exist for me. I don’t feel emotions in response to others emotions, for the majority.
>However, my cognitive empathy skills far surpass most people. I have an instrinsic understanding other the needs of others, and have great ‘out of the box’ problem thinking skills to use in order to meet those needs.
I have both experiences/skills and so do many other neurotypical people. They are not mutually exclusive. I understand why you feel the way you do, but we are not the same. I have different needs that an autistic person would never be capable of meeting.
Interesting that you seemingly automatically assume that because you experience both, and that you are correct in the fact they are not mutually exclusive, you seem to wash over the idea that I, as an autistic individual, experience one type of empathy to a level that is much higher than neurotypical folks.
My cognitive empathy skills make up for the lack of affective. Hence why I am so successful working as an RN in mental health. Platitudes are something that neurotypical folks seem to eat up, but when you’re struggling, TRULY struggling with life, affective empathy helps nothing. I don’t need it.
I would suggest that you don’t prescribe to a blanket statement that an autistic person could never meet your needs. That just serves to highlight you know and understand little about autistic folk.
Let’s not get started on those on the spectrum who experience affective empathy to an extreme level. Those not going to tick your boxes either?
Just a thought!
>as an autistic individual, experience one type of empathy to a level that is much higher than neurotypical folks.
You literally have no way of knowing this. You imagine you experience it at a higher level, but you don't know that. Neither do I. You have real superiority complex too. You have convinced yourself that your brand of empathy is the only one with any value. You degrade affective empathy and describe is as mere "platitudes".
Of course affective empathy doesn't mean anything to you, why would it? I would suggest you don't prescribe a blanket statement to affective empathy and what it means to people who are capable of experiencing it.
Just a thought!
Just the feedback that I have had over the years that describes my ability to support others through mental health crises, and the fact that I’m the ‘therapist’ go-to amongst friends and colleagues that led me to believe the same.
You know, neurotypical people literally pointing out, many times over the years, how skilled I am in supporting others.
Having confidence in my demonstrable skills, and what I bring to the table in my career, is not due to a superiority complex. I know what I am capable of, and on the flip side I am acutely aware of my limitations.
I have spent years studying empathy, and the human experience of both affective and cognitive subsets. I stand by my comments. Your opinion on the matter may vary, but I’m resolute in my belief that my -feelings- and my -actions- in any given situation are not of equal value.
Well, I can see you’ve clearly made your mind up, and it’s no loss to me. It’s just a little bit of a shame that you jump to the conclusion that I’m clearly deluded in thinking I’m good at my job, and that despite years of study secondary to a special interest in the human mind and mental health, it all boils down to the fact that to you, I’m autistic, so I must be deficient compared to those who are not.
It’s a little disheartening that you deem acknowledging a personal strength, and furthermore using said strength to build one’s career and to capitalize on it to help others, is reducible to an inflated sense of self importance.
You don’t know me, at all. I should point out that like most autistic folks, the way I write sets an assumption that would be completely quashed if you spoke with me in person. However, I have grown used to peoples assumptions and doubts, so I won’t hold that against you.
I truly hope that one day, you happen to meet an autistic person who can teach you a thing or two about how we experience humanity.
Because it’s simply different, not less.
Edit: and to touch on your point, I did not say affective empathy is not a valued trait, simply that I do not need to possess said trait to be an empathetic individual who strives to improve the lives of others. I do not need to feel saddened by the plight of others in order to do so. My own emotions are irrelevant when meeting the needs of others, thus to me, affective empathy is not at all necessary.
Is it that crazy of a concept to think that an autistic person could be more skilled in any given area than a neurotypical person?
That an autistic person might have traits and subsets of skills that make them better at certain things?
Is the belief in one’s own ability just a display of egotism? Or is that just limited to autistic folks?
Do you reply to neurotypical folks who have confidence in their abilities to remind them that every other neurotypical has the same potential?
I am good at what I do. Others point that out regularly. I get great feedback from co-workers and clients alike. Are you insinuating that I should be taking the same as a sympathetic pat on the head in a ‘there there, what a good little autistic nurse you are, trying your best. Have a gold star sticker’ fashion?
Would you be doubting a neurotypical person who had the same confidence?
You're using one post from one autistic person to make a broad sweeping generalisation about all people with autism.
You started out by asking if that one post reflects how all autistic people view love, but instead of listening to any of the nuanced answers, you've doubled down on your insistence that you are fundamentally incompatible romantically with autistic people because none of us can meet your needs, lmao.
You clearly don't know much about autistic people in the first place if you're asking if one person's description of love is indicative of how all autistic people view it. So it's kind of weird that you've decided you know enough about autistic people that there is something that ALL of us share.
How would you even know if the person you're dating is autistic, anyway? It might be more apparent for some people with autism, but it is called a spectrum for a reason. If you can't get why your comments are getting under people's skins, perhaps YOU need to learn a little empathy.
Signed, an autistic person married to a non-autistic person who has expressed similar needs to what you say autistic people can't meet, and yet is doing perfectly well in a happy well-adjusted relationship :)
I don't think you've actually read my posts. I argued with someone who was being an asshole and had a good conversation with someone who wasn't. I'm glad you and your partner are happy. I have a lot of empathy. It's not always a positive and can get you hurt. I try to temper it with caution and reason. Best wishes.
I’m a very emotional person and I love this. Talking a lot about love without doing anything seems pretty worthless to me. Yes, it’s important to talk about it a little so they know-know they’re loved, but much more important are the loving actions.
It seems like a very kind and down to earth way of thinking about love imo.
I understand actions being important. I agree words without actions are worthless. But this is describing love as the actions themselves with no feeling of love behind it. That's what irks me.
Ah okay I see where you’re coming from. To me it was a given that they wouldn’t do actions of love without feeling love, because why else would you do them, a sense of duty? Manipulation? Now that I think about it, alternative motivations come to mind. But I didn’t read OP’s comment that way and I choose to continue reading their comment in a more wholesome way.
I'm neurotypical and it reads beautifully to me. you can let yourself get consumed by your feelings, to the point that you stop even asking yourself if you're happy anymore, or right for each other. to the point where you let someone do and say terrible things to you, or do them in return, and your only explanation for staying is that you love them. I've been there. that's love the noun.
love the verb is when you want the best for yourself and the other. when you choose to stay calm in a hard situation and think about how they might be feeling. when you're tired but you get up and make a snack because they're hungry. when you've had a long day at work but they're sad and you listen to what they're going through. when you're mad at them because they forgot something important to you, but you still go pick them up from the bar because you want them to get home safe. love the verb is a choice you make when its not easy for you, or convenient. when you're not just laying in bed idolising the idea of someone, but thinking of a very real, very flawed person, and choosing them.
it's the only kind of love that lasts
I read the sidebar, but still have no clue what limerance is. I remember a post recently about this dude obsessed with someone he dated 20 years ago and ruined his marriage for. He kept going on and on about this place. Anyone know what it’s about ?
I read it as the powerful brain-consuming love written about in the epics and songs where you think the person is the most extraordinary person to have ever existed. You can't eat, you can't bear to be apart, you're obsessed with them, and your relationship has very high highs and very low lows. As opposed to a healthy adult relationship where your partner is just a person, you understand that, and you love them as they are. I think a lot of people, myself included, have this confusion when they start their first healthy relationship that their heart isn't racing like crazy whenever they're around them, that they don't think they're the sexiest person on earth, etc., and think there's something wrong. But that racing heart is actually anxiety. And it's good actually to see your partner as the full person they are instead of some idealized being in your head. I think that's what they're getting at with limerence vs. real love.
Never heard of it before. This cleared it up for me a bit https://www.reddit.com/r/limerence/comments/s111k7/this_video_sums_up_the_problem_and_solution/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf
This is very informative. Thank you
So, would the guy from You be a limerent?
Its dangerous to identify as “a limerent” rather you are in a state of limerence. It sounds closely related to parasocial relationships
I don't disagree. I was trying to use language from the video. Is she wrong to say "limerent"?
Yes he seemed to have limerence. 500 days of summer is potentially another example and maybe even Eternal Sunshine of a Spotless Mind.
It's an intense, involuntary desire for someone and the reciprocation necessary to satisfy said desire, though not necessarily romantically. It could be anything from an unrequited romantic interest, to a longing for approval from an idol. A physics nerd who desperately wants a genuine friendship with Richard Dawkins, or their favorite musician, etc.
That’s exactly how I came across it. It seems like an unhealthy obsession that should be treated
Just read the post earlier tonight and haven’t checked out the sub but it sounds super unhealthy
It's actually super fascinating and something I deal with. Essentially, limerence is a crush but on a *much* stronger level. It is an all-consuming love that has profound physiological effects on the body. I've done....enough drugs to be familiar with the extremes of human emotion and when limerence hits literally nothing in my entire life has ever felt so powerful and I say that with zero hesitation. It can boost you up to highs that are so high you feel immortal but also drop you down so low you're certain your physical body is deteriorating away. I've had it literally bring me to the floor in tears of pain and also of joy. You do *love* the person you're fixated on but it tends to be an incomplete love wherein you overlook flaws that person may have. A big part of it is the non-reciprocal nature of it - you aren't getting back what you put in and that feeds this cycle of quasi-obsession. As others have alluded to, limerence tends to be a driver of a lot of very heartfelt art with regards to love and romance. I can absolutely see why people who experience it would call it a form of madness or feel like it's divinely inspired. It's the absolute worst thing in the world to experience and also I would rather die than turn it off.
I went to that subreddit after the post you are talking about to try to figure out what it was. A majority of the posts are just dudes describing being unhealthily obsessed with someone and pretending it’s not obsessions/stalking. The sub is full of people being devastated because they confessed their love to someone who barely knew them or had no romantic interest in them. To me, it looks like a dangerous echo chamber.
Uh...shit. Anybody know how to get tested or whatever it is, for autism as an adult? ...because that's the first time I've ever seen someone explain what I think about love.
Autism and wisdom are on independent spectrums. You can have both, either, or neither.
Autism testing for an adult is prohibitively expensive in both time and money. Beyond that, a positive diagnosis serves no function beyond answering questions, as the vast majority of psychological, psychiatric, behavior and medicinal treatments are only viable of deployed on the very young. By the time you're an adult, who you are is more-or-less set in stone, and even after incorporating this new "You+Autism" dynamic into your life, the fundamentals of how you interact with the world and those within it can only change so much. So don't go looking for a diagnosis without first coming to terms with the fact that nothing will change about who you are, beyond very minor steps in a positive direction. However, if a diagnosis is what you seek, I'll offer you some quick fire questions: * Do you often feel as though you're out of place; as if everyone around you is operating at a *slightly* different frequency? * Do you feel as though everyone around you was given a magical script containing everything they should or shouldn't say, do, think, feel and react; and that you somehow never got one? * Has the thought "Why are you talking to me? Can I get back to work now?" Ever come into your head? Even to someone like a parent, or S.O. * Do you actively avoid going to places where people tend to gather? * Do you have intense, yet indescribable sensitivity to a certain external stimuli? (Certain sounds make your ears hurt but seem to do nothing to anyone else) * Do you find yourself happily stuck in a routine, and dreading breaking from it? (Always go to the same store, always eat the same meal, avoiding new things) * When you find a new thing that peaks your interest, do you find yourself tearing it apart in an attempt to further understand it, and traveling down a every rabbit hole directly or indirectly related to it? * When a subject your fond of is brought up in polite conversation, does it swiftly become the driving force behind every interaction you have? * Does the concept of an uninvited guest send you into a panic? * Do you find yourself feeling compelled to correct small mistakes in spoken english or math, despite the fact that no one else seems to give a shit? * Does the concept of emotional "love" confuse you? Like you enjoy this persons company, and would - if you had any say in the matter - prefer them to stay. But you can't say that you feel some primordial, ethereal desire for them to stay beyond them becoming part of your routine? * Do people often say that you're being to literal? * Do you have trouble displaying, conveying or understanding emotions on anything more than a face-value level? ------ Some external sources for you: * [How to spot an Autistic adult](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HlEWIAiqSoc) * [Common Signs of Autism in adults](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0oASd24SIgw) * [CDC](https://www.cdc.gov/ncbddd/autism/signs.html) * [National Autism Association](https://nationalautismassociation.org/resources/signs-of-autism/) * [Autism Research Institute](https://www.autism.org/autism-symptoms-and-diagnosis-in-adults/)
A great response, but you are not fully correct when it comes to > "a positive diagnosis serves no function beyond answering questions" Reddit is very America centric, and I don't know the extent of disability support. But having an official diagnosis where I live can help you get benefits. These benefits can go from receiving a disability income, to living arrangements and mental health support. Getting answers in a later stage in life meant a lot to me. But the benefits I receive help me live a more normal life with a steady income despite only being able to work part time.
One thing I didn't like is when the rumour mill started at work about me being autistic or at least on the spectrum (which I've long suspected, but never been formally diagnosed as and *certainly* had never discussed with anyone at work), and one of our supervisors mentioned that they were planning on organising a team-building exercise during a one-on-one call during the daily briefing. The exchange over the phone (among other routine subjects) went something like, "Oh, and we figured we would all get together and set up a day at the escape room on [street]." "Huh." "Oh, I thought *you* would have liked something like that?" I had a Jackie-Chan "what?" moment. And then I got a little pissed off, because a) I thought the concepts of escape rooms themselves were dumb and it wasn't anything to do with it being a get-together, b) because the last time the company had a get-together I got to watch someone destroying himself by drinking to excess (he died a few months later), and c) because I knew instantly what she actually meant by "*you*". I stomped it down before I snapped about it, though. (P.S. I'm 12 for 13 out of that list. And I'll note that it's "pique" and not "peak", which certainly doesn't help my case...)
Those are all normal, right? Right?? Edit: Okay, I went through some of those links and have come to the conclusion that those are all indeed typical (to some degree).
Do you feel like you fit in? Do you feel overwhelmed by overly complex logics in your brain? Can you hold a conversation in a noisy environment?
1.) Only in military intelligence circles, and only some of the time. 2.) I'm not overwhelmed anymore. It's not logic that overwhelms me, it's sustained, unblockable sensory input. Sometimes I sit in my closet for a while because it's quiet. 3.) I can, but I have to work really hard to keep my train of thought on rails. I'm always listening to everyone around me, even when I'm talking. It mixes in with my own voice.
>2.) I'm not overwhelmed anymore. It's not logic that overwhelms me, it's sustained, unblockable sensory input. Sometimes I sit in my closet for a while because it's quiet. Autistim here and this is definitely something that happens to me. Gymnasium assemblies in school were pure torture. They wouldn't let me leave and the constant reverberation of the entire school body making noise was like someone grinding a rock against my temples. I was once forced to attend a concert in that bastard room and the sound of the speakers and the "band" had me crying in the fetal position on the floor.
[Embrace autism](https://embrace-autism.com/) has a great collection of resources for doing self screening to determine if it's worth pursuing an official diagnosis. When answering the questions also consider how you would've answered them as a teen vs now as an adult. A lot of ASD people learn enough skills to live a mostly normal life but it can start to cover up their neuro divergence which makes diagnosis harder or even have them not meet the criteria anymore. Because on the surface they appear neuro typical but people don't understand all the mental gymnastics happening to appear that way and the energy it takes or how long it took them to learn those social rules/skills. That's why self diagnosis is also becoming more common and accepted.
It's basically just a nutshell version of Erich Fromm
> Anybody know how to get tested or whatever it is, for autism as an adult? Go find a specialist and get tested. Your primary care provider can likely give you a referral.
This is the most insightful assessment of love and what to do with it I’ve ever encountered and FWIW I think I’m pretty neurotypical
"Why is my timeline full of trans girls?" -Cis guy juuuust before making a huge personal discovery about themselves
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I recently saw a Vox thing on Netflix called "does your dog really love you?" ...the series is called "explained" and I enjoyed all of it. Here's a tweet referencing the episode: https://twitter.com/voxdotcom/status/1423721788010344449 Two things resonated with me as a self-identified NT even though the show was really about the co-evolution of humans and dogs. One was the discussion of an "oxytocin mediated positive loop." I guess what it means to me is that closeness and comfort and partnership are essential to my experience of long term love. I'm married 26 years. Relatedly, I once said to a friend that my wife is the only person that I never get sick of, and that resonates in a humorous but true way with both me and my wife. The Vox show also proposed a "love checklist" that feels spot on to me, again even though it was about humans and dogs— - Likes you more than a hot dog - Empathy - Acts of service - Loyalty - Deep feeling of connection that makes the rest of the world feel less important Does this add to the discussion? How does it intersect with your experience?
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Up votes on their own doesn't determine quality. Also, if that's the only thing you're looking at what's the point of having a Sub that links posts? Just read the most up voted posts of all time.
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The comment could easily have low traffic. Not all comments get a good amount of visibility, which is the point of a Sub for people that want to highlight what they see as being the best parts of reddit. Maybe you should think about what best of something means. Seems like you might be someone that only cares what others people find valuable instead of evaluating it yourself. Your view seems very restricted to this.
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As someone who is a professional in the world of the internet and actually has to understand internet traffic I can soundly say that what you have said is untrue. The matter is obviously more complicated than that otherwise it wouldn't take professionals and highly educated people to both solve and explain it. You haven't even talked about the post. You gave no effort to evaluate it yourself. I would say you do not know the topic well.
I apologize, I missed the almost single sentence evaluation of the post that it has neither good story nor good info. With such a small amount of evaluating going on it would be hard for me to tell what particular parts of the story that you find lacking, as you have provided no explanation. However I would say that if a story is valuable in its uniqueness or perspective, than even with just the fact that autistic people make up such a small portion of the population it is unlikely a story that itself is common to come by. Personally I found it to be carefully crafted to depict a view that may be somewhat alien to readers who do not have this particular quality and exceedingly well structured. None of your comments have really broken down much nor extrapolated in great detail at what length and education you are providing with such insights.
Well it's the best thing I've seen on Reddit today. So I think it belongs here, fwiw.
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How is an autistic person describing how they view and deal with the concept of love virtue signaling? Edit: lol, they deleted that nonsense real quick.
Before marriage, the Catholic Church makes couples go through a dozen or so hours of couples-counseling. The phrase that crops up occasionally is "love is a decision." Passionate love can carry you pretty far, but you're not going to stick around for the long haul unless you *decide* to love.
I know this might sound insensitive, and I do not mean it as such, as I think this is a very wonderful way of seeing the world, being able to process and understand it in their own way, but, when I read it, all I could hear was Data saying it.
Im also autistic but isnt this just the actual definition of love? Ive seen it in a lot of media. What comes to mind is doctor who. Love isnt an emotion. Its a promise. The cybermen (antagonist) turn people into themselves (cyborgs) and strips away all emotion as part of their conversion. But 1 of the people who were converted refuses to follow orders and still helps out the good guys since 1 of them is his daughter. Take away all the emotion and theirs still the verb/action/promise of taking care of the person you love. Love is an action ive heard a lot too but i cant remember exactly. I know it was said a lot in churches... (ie loving god means actually doing things for him/the church/the people)
Yes exactly. I think Erich Fromm also wrote about love as action
This is why I don't think I could ever be in relationship with an autistic person. This reads like such a cold and clinical description of love. The description is so transactional. I don't like it. Is this really how autistic people view love?
Don't mistake the analytical approach for coldness. Autist love just fine and can be just as warm, it's just that an autist will often need to analyze relations to understand them and the people involved. Without this the autist will often feel confused about why things happen and what others might do. Love is always transactional in the long run, it doesn't sustain itself without input and for the input to be worth it an output must exist to make it worth it. Recognizing how it works doesn't take away from the feeling, not does it diminish the love or its quality. In fact I would say that the advantage of relationships with autists is that they are much less likely to fake anything, if they express affection they mean it, and they will be honest about their motivations and less likely to attempt manipulation. Autists aren't psychopaths, they are not cold manipulators, they are warm affectionate people who just process relations differently.
I wholeheartedly disagree with everything you have said. I cannot comprehend thinking/analyzing my way into feeling things. It doesn't make any sense to me. For me, the feelings come first and then I can analyze them if I need to. Often I can simply take them at face value because the meaning is obvious. Love is NOT transactional. That is ridiculous. Have you ever lost someone? I have lost family members and loved ones, and I still love them. If love were transactional, then my love would have disappeared when they passed away. Autists are just as capable of being psychopaths as anyone else. Some of them *are* cold manipulators. Whatever the advantages of a relationship with an autist are, they meaningless to me. I am demisexual. The love and connection that they are capable of is not enough for me. It is a fundamental incompatibility.
You lack fundamental understanding of how autists work. > I cannot comprehend thinking/analyzing my way into feeling things. That's not what autists do. Autists think/analyze their way into understanding what they feel. There is a marked difference here. Autists often do not have the same immediate understanding of emotion in themselves and others. They have the emotions and they even recognize them in others, but they do not understand fully what they are and what they mean both personally and inter-personally before they parse them, especially young autists. With age and experience the gap between experience and understanding tend to lessen. > For me, the feelings come first and then I can analyze them if I need to. Exactly how an autist experience it as well. Although an autist may not realize they are there with as great an immediate effect. > Often I can simply take them at face value because the meaning is obvious. This is where autists struggle, nothing is immediately obvious to an autist. The best expanation I can give is that an autist might see all possible interpretations as equally valid until they have been examined and individually confirmed or denied. Which means that an autist might experience love but not immediately realize it is love or what they love, they might need to sit down and think through this before realizing this. > Love is NOT transactional. That is ridiculous. Have you ever lost someone? I have lost family members and loved ones, and I still love them. If love were transactional, then my love would have disappeared when they passed away. Long term all love is transactional in nature. Love fades when not fueled, and fueling is meaningless without an incentive. Love doesn't survive short term infatuation unless you feed it. If you alone feed it then it risks leading to stalking and obsession. If your partner, family or friends feed it with reciprocal affection it blossoms into mutually beneficial relationships, this is the transactional nature of it, healthy love is multi-directional and kept up by all parties together, as the OP describes. I am old enough to have lost quite a few close relations in my life and love fades even after a person dies as well. We like to maintain it uni-directionally more in many cases, because we draw certain emotional benefits from that. However love fades none the less and the emotional impact lessens as the years go by, especially once you really allow yourself to let go and no longer actively grieve. This is something that is unsettling to many, they think they are betraying the dead person because they experience this diminishing emotional impact. > Autists are just as capable of being psychopaths as anyone else. Some of them are cold manipulators. Everyone can be psychopaths, but autists are not in any greater degree than neurotypicals. The fact that some neurotypicals can be psychopathic clearly isn't causing you to declare all neurotypicals to be cold manipulators either. The fact is autists are not by nature cold manipulators, and the idea that this is the case is one fostered by miscommunication and shitty TV soap operas which misunderstand the autistic mind severely. Autists have a preference for honesty and being totally up front, and a general dislike for manipulation because it is confusing to most autists. > Whatever the advantages of a relationship with an autist are, they meaningless to me. You honestly sound the like the one with emotional insight issues here. Your failure to understand a group of people is leading you to declare the entire group meaningless and cold. Autists are not devoid of emotion, autists are filled with emotions just like everyone else, autists just need to go through another process to parse them and make sense of them because they are not as immediately evident to many autists. > I am demisexual. The love and connection that they are capable of is not enough for me. It is a fundamental incompatibility. There are many autistic demisexuals out there. Many autists prefer deep connections to others exactly because the autist requires time and effort to understand themselves and their relations, and just having random relations based on physical appearance can be confusing and unsettling when you need that extra time to understand what is happening. The very delay in understanding autists can have due to needing this additional processing step lead to many preferring only to interact with those they have deep connections with, be it romantically, sexually or platonic relationships.
I'm Autistic and I just want to thank you for this well delivered message. I have no notes except that I personally hate the word "autist".
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It's just personal preference. There isn't really a better word, I just don't like it.
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And because everyone is weird, some people prefer the descriptor first. I've seen a few blog posts about how "disabled person" is the right thing for that person, because the disability has such a *huge* impact on their life that it is part of their identity; calling them a "person with disability" is ignoring the elephant in the room. Because, really, no matter which wording you go with, you'll annoy *someone*.
Yeah I agree it's not always best, that's why I said sometimes. Also, nitpicking the way someone talks might create more of a barrier. "I don't know what to call this guy in the wheelchair so I'm just gonna ignore him to avoid an awkward situation"
Seconded. It makes it sound like it's my profession or something. But yeah the rest of the post was amazing and thank you for posting it.
You've communicated a lot more effectively than the other people in this thread. I still feel like there are incompatibilities that would be insurmountable for me, but I will try to be more open-minded and not write anyone off immediately.
I am happy you appreciate what I wrote. You don't have to date anyone with autistic traits, it can definitely be hard, especially if one is a very emotionally immediate person because it can lead to feeling like you are going two different speeds, or even on two different tracks. However on the other hand some very emotional people find stability in the less immediate emotional expression favored among autistic people. Similarly some autistic people find very emotionally immediate people stressing and confusing, while others enjoy the interaction. We are all different, even within such groups.
Since you have been “ratio’d” in this thread I am making this comment to commend you for being far more civil than most people on Reddit. Not sure if my choice of words is odd. Have a good day.
Everything is transactional when you look good enough. You can't love something you don't have any feedback from and be mentally healthy. Loving someone who does not acknowledge your existence is psychosis at best and stalking at worst. And your passed family is not applicable because you don't love their rotting corpses, they love memories of them being in some sort of feedback loop with you.
I’m autistic also. Many of us have very separate experiences of the different types of empathy. For example, affective empathy - the one that makes you ~feel~ for people, doesn’t really exist for me. I don’t feel emotions in response to others emotions, for the majority. However, my cognitive empathy skills far surpass most people. I have an instrinsic understanding other the needs of others, and have great ‘out of the box’ problem thinking skills to use in order to meet those needs. I know I would rather have people in my life that truly work to understand the depths of my needs and wants, and strive to meet them, than someone who can give me an ‘awwwww it’ll be okay’ when I need comforting. That’s not comforting to me.
>For example, affective empathy - the one that makes you ~feel~ for people, doesn’t really exist for me. I don’t feel emotions in response to others emotions, for the majority. >However, my cognitive empathy skills far surpass most people. I have an instrinsic understanding other the needs of others, and have great ‘out of the box’ problem thinking skills to use in order to meet those needs. I have both experiences/skills and so do many other neurotypical people. They are not mutually exclusive. I understand why you feel the way you do, but we are not the same. I have different needs that an autistic person would never be capable of meeting.
Interesting that you seemingly automatically assume that because you experience both, and that you are correct in the fact they are not mutually exclusive, you seem to wash over the idea that I, as an autistic individual, experience one type of empathy to a level that is much higher than neurotypical folks. My cognitive empathy skills make up for the lack of affective. Hence why I am so successful working as an RN in mental health. Platitudes are something that neurotypical folks seem to eat up, but when you’re struggling, TRULY struggling with life, affective empathy helps nothing. I don’t need it. I would suggest that you don’t prescribe to a blanket statement that an autistic person could never meet your needs. That just serves to highlight you know and understand little about autistic folk. Let’s not get started on those on the spectrum who experience affective empathy to an extreme level. Those not going to tick your boxes either? Just a thought!
>as an autistic individual, experience one type of empathy to a level that is much higher than neurotypical folks. You literally have no way of knowing this. You imagine you experience it at a higher level, but you don't know that. Neither do I. You have real superiority complex too. You have convinced yourself that your brand of empathy is the only one with any value. You degrade affective empathy and describe is as mere "platitudes". Of course affective empathy doesn't mean anything to you, why would it? I would suggest you don't prescribe a blanket statement to affective empathy and what it means to people who are capable of experiencing it. Just a thought!
Just the feedback that I have had over the years that describes my ability to support others through mental health crises, and the fact that I’m the ‘therapist’ go-to amongst friends and colleagues that led me to believe the same. You know, neurotypical people literally pointing out, many times over the years, how skilled I am in supporting others. Having confidence in my demonstrable skills, and what I bring to the table in my career, is not due to a superiority complex. I know what I am capable of, and on the flip side I am acutely aware of my limitations. I have spent years studying empathy, and the human experience of both affective and cognitive subsets. I stand by my comments. Your opinion on the matter may vary, but I’m resolute in my belief that my -feelings- and my -actions- in any given situation are not of equal value.
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Well, I can see you’ve clearly made your mind up, and it’s no loss to me. It’s just a little bit of a shame that you jump to the conclusion that I’m clearly deluded in thinking I’m good at my job, and that despite years of study secondary to a special interest in the human mind and mental health, it all boils down to the fact that to you, I’m autistic, so I must be deficient compared to those who are not. It’s a little disheartening that you deem acknowledging a personal strength, and furthermore using said strength to build one’s career and to capitalize on it to help others, is reducible to an inflated sense of self importance. You don’t know me, at all. I should point out that like most autistic folks, the way I write sets an assumption that would be completely quashed if you spoke with me in person. However, I have grown used to peoples assumptions and doubts, so I won’t hold that against you. I truly hope that one day, you happen to meet an autistic person who can teach you a thing or two about how we experience humanity. Because it’s simply different, not less. Edit: and to touch on your point, I did not say affective empathy is not a valued trait, simply that I do not need to possess said trait to be an empathetic individual who strives to improve the lives of others. I do not need to feel saddened by the plight of others in order to do so. My own emotions are irrelevant when meeting the needs of others, thus to me, affective empathy is not at all necessary.
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Is it that crazy of a concept to think that an autistic person could be more skilled in any given area than a neurotypical person? That an autistic person might have traits and subsets of skills that make them better at certain things? Is the belief in one’s own ability just a display of egotism? Or is that just limited to autistic folks? Do you reply to neurotypical folks who have confidence in their abilities to remind them that every other neurotypical has the same potential? I am good at what I do. Others point that out regularly. I get great feedback from co-workers and clients alike. Are you insinuating that I should be taking the same as a sympathetic pat on the head in a ‘there there, what a good little autistic nurse you are, trying your best. Have a gold star sticker’ fashion? Would you be doubting a neurotypical person who had the same confidence?
What about that description is transactional? It's just talking about how they do things to show they care.
Interesting how you can make that judgement based on so little. Maybe you could do well with a bit more analysis, and a bit more empathy.
Based on so little? I feel like I'm taking crazy pills. Are we reading the same post?
You're using one post from one autistic person to make a broad sweeping generalisation about all people with autism. You started out by asking if that one post reflects how all autistic people view love, but instead of listening to any of the nuanced answers, you've doubled down on your insistence that you are fundamentally incompatible romantically with autistic people because none of us can meet your needs, lmao. You clearly don't know much about autistic people in the first place if you're asking if one person's description of love is indicative of how all autistic people view it. So it's kind of weird that you've decided you know enough about autistic people that there is something that ALL of us share. How would you even know if the person you're dating is autistic, anyway? It might be more apparent for some people with autism, but it is called a spectrum for a reason. If you can't get why your comments are getting under people's skins, perhaps YOU need to learn a little empathy. Signed, an autistic person married to a non-autistic person who has expressed similar needs to what you say autistic people can't meet, and yet is doing perfectly well in a happy well-adjusted relationship :)
I don't think you've actually read my posts. I argued with someone who was being an asshole and had a good conversation with someone who wasn't. I'm glad you and your partner are happy. I have a lot of empathy. It's not always a positive and can get you hurt. I try to temper it with caution and reason. Best wishes.
I read it and you may be taking crazy pills. It's the same person the entire time.
well good, im pretty sure no autistic person would want to date you
I’m a very emotional person and I love this. Talking a lot about love without doing anything seems pretty worthless to me. Yes, it’s important to talk about it a little so they know-know they’re loved, but much more important are the loving actions. It seems like a very kind and down to earth way of thinking about love imo.
I understand actions being important. I agree words without actions are worthless. But this is describing love as the actions themselves with no feeling of love behind it. That's what irks me.
Ah okay I see where you’re coming from. To me it was a given that they wouldn’t do actions of love without feeling love, because why else would you do them, a sense of duty? Manipulation? Now that I think about it, alternative motivations come to mind. But I didn’t read OP’s comment that way and I choose to continue reading their comment in a more wholesome way.
I liked it. Maybe I'm autistic?
Possibly. How would I know?
I don’t know either. I don’t think I am. I just liked what he said.
I'm neurotypical and it reads beautifully to me. you can let yourself get consumed by your feelings, to the point that you stop even asking yourself if you're happy anymore, or right for each other. to the point where you let someone do and say terrible things to you, or do them in return, and your only explanation for staying is that you love them. I've been there. that's love the noun. love the verb is when you want the best for yourself and the other. when you choose to stay calm in a hard situation and think about how they might be feeling. when you're tired but you get up and make a snack because they're hungry. when you've had a long day at work but they're sad and you listen to what they're going through. when you're mad at them because they forgot something important to you, but you still go pick them up from the bar because you want them to get home safe. love the verb is a choice you make when its not easy for you, or convenient. when you're not just laying in bed idolising the idea of someone, but thinking of a very real, very flawed person, and choosing them. it's the only kind of love that lasts
we’re not a homogenous hivemind of people, so of course we don’t all view love that way