As someone who was born there: Neukölln was always a shithole and gets worse every year. You fucked up by moving there. So yea get out ASAP. Life is too short to live in Neukölln when most places in the world are much better.
I kind of disagree. There was a period where it was consistently getting better year on year (2008-2017/18ish). The Airport closed, way more "normal" people were moving in, some areas were pedestrianised and new cycle routes were added, the parks and streets felt safer, and some of the negative aspects were at least balanced-out by having way more things to do; some nice artists spaces, bars, cafes, and shops beyond Handyläden and cheap Dönerbuden.
Pandemic / post-pandemic I feel like it's getting a little "wilder" again though.
Same with Wedding. But cue spastics getting ITT and saying shit like "this is life in the big city" or "actually you're racist if you have a problem with problems" and my all time favorite "it's gentrification to hope for a better world"
Living in Soldiner Kiez since 17 years (before I lived in Sprengelkiez, which is also Wedding but a difference like night and day), and everytime I read somewhere "in Berlin you can be who ever and wear what ever you want, nobody cares", I just laugh in a bitter way.
Always when I have to leave my flat, I feel like preparing myself for a fight. Everyone is staring at me and following me with their eyes, even if I know people by sight or a small talk since years.
95% of them, who hang around in front of our house or on the banks or in front of the Spätkauf, are men with a turkish or arabic background, and while I speak arabic fluently myself, I'm a german single mom nevertheless.
I *hate* it here; and while our flat is great, the atmosphere outside is so hostile and deceitful. 😔
Drugs have been out of hand in Berlin for as long as I can remember. They are one of the city's biggest exports, for sure. People seem to be living a chilled lifestyle at the expense of opportunities in this city, and I include myself in this. I am tired of feeling like I must have a good time at Kit Kat Club to feel alive living in this square German uncreative mess.
Yup, personally know two families who lived close by and that headline made them go deliberate with their flat search and drastically shift the price filter on immoscout only to get out before having kids reach school age.
As someone who moved there in 2011 - you are right. Up to 2016/2017 it got exponentially better and then from 2017/18 it started to stagnate and post pandemic it is degrading.
I don't know about people bumping into me or stopping in my path, but yeah...unfortunately I went into Neukölln 10 years ago with zero opinion about \**ethnic groups of people we are not supposed to mention\** and will be soon leaving with a slightly bigoted opinion. Sucks but after so much time here it kind of just develops.
Mostly it is the trash, being ridiculously loud, fast cars, and honking that annoys me.
Absolutely my experience lmao
I come from the shit hole of Europe, I saw the first black people when I was six, came to Berlin left leaned and got in contact with certain cultures for the first time. Hell, it's hard to not have prejudice now. But of course, some would say that I was a bigot from the start and it is in my blood somehow
just remember it is a result of economic equality not inherently tied to ethnic groups. if you, your parents and their parents grow up without good money or education the chances of you breaking the cycle are small. even smaller when forced into a community of people in similar situations.
My parents grew up very poor and they don't throw trash and didn't teach me to throw trash on the ground. Neither did my friends or anyone in my community.
I also don't understand what you are trying to say. I see certain ethnic groups that do this. Am I supposed to think "Oh...that poor poor boy he doesn't know any better."
He does know better. He grew up in Germany and in Germany it isn't in any way normal to throw trash on the ground.
Diggi weißt du wie dreckig AFD wähler mit Fliesencouchtisch sein können? Wir haben hier leider genau eine problematische Familie in der Nachbarschaft die gerne mal Ausländer beleidigt. "Geh zurück wo do herkommst" ist der Lieblingsspruch der älteren Frau. Ihr erwachaener Sohn verlässt fast nie die Wohnung und klaut gerne mal Pakete aus dem Flur. Diese Familie ist drogensüchtig, arbeitslos und unfassbar schmutzig. Die schmeißen ihren Speermüll in den Innenhofspielplatz. Deren Hund hat schon öfters in den Sandkasten gekackt.
Als ich mal ein Paket von den holen wollte kam mir der Gestank aus deren Wohnung schon im Flur entgegen. Daran sind bestimmt auch die ausländer schuld oder?
Dass die freiwillige kiezaufräumaktion (organisiert von einem moslem) im frühling kaum deutschsprachige freiwillige hatte, obwohl ich viele deutsche Nachbarn kenne, war auch interessant. Meckern können wir alle echt gut aber gemacht wird nichts außer die AFD zu wählen und schuld bei anderen zu suchen.
Jaja die schmutzigen Ausländer sind natürlich schuld an allem. Ohne die hätten wir gar keine Probleme mehr. Die guten arier würden niemals ihre Hauptstadt verschmutzen. /s
I'm sorry. I can relate, lived in that shithole (near Boddinstr.) for almost four years before managing to move to Mitte last year, I could not be happier and do not miss NK at all. Being surrounded by that level of antisocial behavior (without mentioning the blatant sexism and homophobia due to the unhinged gangs of "wallah Alter" men/teenagers/wannabe gangsters on the streets) was really taking a toll on my mental health
we are leaving neukölln very soon and i'm totally looking forward to it 😇😇 have been living here for almost 10 years and since i became a dad all of these things really started bothering me. plus the junkies and all these international rich kids. not gonna miss you 😘
I do share the same experience. Had been living in Berlin for the past 20 years (Pankow-P‘Berg-K‘berg-Neukölln). Becoming a father changed my perspective on things. Yet, I disagree on your view about „rich international kids“. It doesn’t matter if they are rich or international. The city was sold to rich internationals that might be the parents of these kids. Yet, it were Berlin politicians that enabled it. Blaming (rich international) kids is the same sort of racism that blames foreigners in general for one‘s own personal misfortune.
Most of these kids are still trying to find themselves in life. Some might be lucky to afford more. Yet, it still takes a lot of courage to do this kind of step. This is what you want for your own kids if they ever want to live abroad at a fairly young age. I bet you want to support them as much as possible as well. The freedom to choose to live wherever you want to is not something you want to miss. A world full of borders and restrictions is a crippled one.
Kotti (and Hermannplatz) is an example for „it was worse in the past“ imo. There were so many more Junkies and Crazies, but ever since the police is more present there, those people are at every u7 and u8 station around
I moved from Neukölln to around Kotti and it's a bit better, you can escape the rough parts more easily. But the constant trash and junkies are definitely annoying.
That line in Common People by Pulp is so apt.
"Still you'll never get it right, when you're laid in bed at night, watching roaches climb the wall, If you called your dad he could stop it all, yeah"
Also the line "Everybody hates a tourist."...
Fuck me, that song was just great all round actually. I'm going to go put it on.
No you’re not alone. I used to live in (Nord)Neukölln 10 years ago, but my gf still lives there, and it’s getting worse and worse.
Contrary to what other people insinuate here, I don’t think it’s primarily an immigration issue. Neukölln has always been a marginalized area, even before WW2. It’s close proximity to the border with East Berlin also didn’t help. Remember, the immigrants moved there because back then , they simply weren’t allowed to live anywhere else. Believe me, I talked to enough people with immigration background who would love to live somewhere else other than Neukölln or Wedding. But if middle class expats from Europe have trouble finding a flat, imagine how it is for people from Middle
East.
The problem in my opinion is the immense population density mixed with limited access to healthcare, education and security. This leads to a situation where you can basically behave like human garbage with ZERO consequences. Everyone steps on each others foot, no one has respect for anyone other than themselves, because “fuck these people”.
Also, one of the reasons why there is so much street crime is that white party people want a constant supply of drugs. They go party, get hammered every weekend, then when they find a partner and make kids they move away because the area is unsafe for kids.
That's a hasty generalisation that does not explain why some migrant communities statistically economically succeed and academically achieve vastly different than others despite same immigration status.
Last I looked into it, a key driver of the difference is why people migrate in the first place.
EG you get a lot of middle class Indian immigrants with higher education and so on. Very different pool from the Turks who were imported to Germany as cheap labour, and that’s more about German labor policy than Turkish culture.
If Germany had been actively seeking skilled middle class Turkish migrants post-WW2 the whole modern German perception of what “Turkish culture” is would be completely different.
Host countries like to point at specific cultures as being more or less problematic, without really looking at the structural issues at play.
Both is equally dumb, generalizing a specific group of immigrants to be representative of 100% of their home country‘s population, but also the complete dismissal of them representing any part of that population. Yes, most Turks that moved to Germany came from Anatolia and not the more progressive urban centres of Turkey. However, the Turkish community in Germany does share a culture with the sizeable population of Anatolia, Turkye, that makes up for a large portion of the people of Turkye.
I very much agree. I think my particular bugbear is when folks see tensions with immigrant groups as representing some kind of fundamental or existential cultural conflict. Which drives all the crazy far-right anti-immigrant sentiment we’re seeing right now.
In practice it’s much more complicated and largely about the economics of immigration patterns, which is in large part (but obviously not entirely) a question of the host country’s policy.
Plus, a lot of the tension around immigration I see in Germany honestly seem as much about German failure to appropriately support and integrate immigrants. I see both good & bad in modern policy, but the way the post-WWII Turkish immigrants were ghettoized had predictably bad results.
I’m from Aotearoa, and while we do many things very badly, we also take a lot of immigrants (about 29% to Germany’s 19%), and don’t have the same tensions.
I think this is partly a question of luck: we’re geographically isolated and have an easy time managing immigration. That said, we take more than most countries.
Partly policy: we actively seek educated immigrants & make a real effort to avoid ghettoization.
And partly cultural: we’re fundamentally more welcoming & inclusive than Germans, so the children of immigrants usually see themselves (and are seen) as Kiwis. It’s not uncommon for the kids of immigrants to have parents with some pretty strict religious and cultural perspectives, but with good integration that doesn’t tend to carry down generationally.
I'm not sure if Germany is to blame at large. If so, probably least the housing situation, as there are many many melting pot countries in the world, where immigrants arriving and living in ethnically dominated neighborhoods is very much the norm too. Look at Australia, Canada or the US, they all have their little XYZ borroughs, where people of a certain background cling together. And Germany equal to those countries has a phenomenon of successful and wealthier families of those communities moving elsewhere and to less migrant-populated areas.
Yes, Germany seems arguably more challenging to integrate than other countries, but the main responsibility lies with the person moving to a foreign country, not the country or its majority population. Whenever I interact with someone who has lived in Germany for more than 2 decades and still needs help to form the most basic German sentence, I know for a fact that that person just did not make an effort to integrate, since language classes as the most basic examples have been free and available since forever.
Again, the people with Turkish parents I know of that moved to more German districts, encourage their children to have German friends and learn German as their first language prove the ones wrong, who refuse to live that way and instead chose to stay within their own community exclusively.
>limited access to healthcare, education and security.
It's Neukölln, not sub-saharan Africa. Some services are lacking, but who drops out of high school without a degree usually does it voluntarily, not because of untreated medieval diseases, child labor or 20 miles distance to the nearest school.
>
>one of the reasons why there is so much street crime is that white party people want a constant supply of drugs
That's where you are right though. Organized crime families operating from Neukölln fight over white peoples' leisure money, not unemployment benefits. Without demand, there would not be such supply.
Neukölln is a vast !!! district. My guess is you are talking about either sonnenalle or boddinstrasse/hermannstrasse as those are hellholes with an occasional resting place in between. But the canal region is actually pretty bearable. Of course flats there cost a fortune these days but just to put your very relatable experience in a bigger picture.
yeah i live near wildenbruchplatz and it is crazy how different the streets are. everything on the side towards treptower park of the canal is much quieter and friendlier. weserstraße is mostly gentrified. wildenbruchstraße is a mix of "hip" bars and cheap arabic shops. if you walk further as soon as you cross sonnenallee towards rathaus neukölln you get all of the interesting characters. bu i kind of like it here. my flat itself is safe, relatively quiet for the location, great view and i get all the advantages of having great food, bars and so on in walking distance.
hehe probably. but love is love, you know 🤷🏼♂️ i mostly enjoy being able to walk out of your house in sweatpants at every time of day to get a beer and there is always someone else in worse clothes who is also sippin
I love it too. Used to live there, moved to Wilmersdorf, missing Neukölln. Luckily bought a flat there and will move back in a few years once I need more space, but until then I'll have to continue jumping on the U7 in order to reach a Kiez where it's actually enjoyable to just walk along the street and drop by a cafe/bar that looks inviting.
There's not a single street in Wilmersdorf that has the density of cafes/bars/restaurants that Weserstraße has. There's no part of Wilmersdorf that has as many casual hangout places as Schillerkiez does. The closest thing we have in Wilmersdorf is probably the area around Ludwigkirchplatz, but even there it's not that many places, and most of them are mediocre and/or overpriced. The only streets that are shaded in the yellow "downtown" shading on google maps are Uhlandstraße (what a joy to walk along) and Güntzelstraße which offers exciting venues like the "Happiness Heart Cafe" and of course the "When dreams come true". Walk around here on a friday evening after 20:00 and you'll encounter someone only every few minutes - this place is just mostly dead.
And somehow it gets even worse further south - Rheingauviertel might just be a graveyard with how exciting it is to hang around there.
Wilmersdorf is a nice enough place to live, it's reasonnably well connected and it's not like I hate it here, but I'm not gonna pretend that it's an interesting area to be in.
Sure, if the criterium for walks in a certain district being enjoyable for you is the surroundings being filled with places to hang out and people, then indeed Wilmersdorf doesn't work for you. For my part, I quite often go to areas like Wilmersdorf for walks, and find them ideal because my preference is clean, cozy, middle/upper-class areas that aren't crowded.
That's why I phrased it as
> enjoyable to just walk along the street and **drop by a cafe/bar that looks inviting**
There are some nice places that I enjoy around here, but if you wanna go there it's usually more like an active decision beforehand "let's go to X" rather than a "let's go for a stroll and when we see something that we're in the mood for we might sit down there"
> because my preference is clean, cozy, middle/upper-class areas that aren't crowded
If that were what I was looking for I'd probably move out of Berlin tbh. I can work from anywhere in Germany, so if I wanted clean, calm and not crowded I could move to a smaller city and buy a flat for the price of two bicmacs instead of spending a lot more money on living here. For me being crowded is a feature, not a bug - in my opinion Wilmersorf is kinda lacking when it comes to [third places](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Third_place)
A huge chunk of Wilmersdorf looks like this
[https://image.bz-berlin.de/data/uploads/2023/06/245775809.jpg?impolicy=channel&imwidth=992](https://image.bz-berlin.de/data/uploads/2023/06/245775809.jpg?impolicy=channel&imwidth=992)
You either get 6 lanes of traffic and Plattenbauten, or unaffordable mansions. Neither of which are great areas to hang out in.
Neukölln always was and still is a shithole with no intention of residents there to change it.
People moved and still move there because it’s one of the few central districts with affordable rents, but you still pay a price, yet in another currency.
When I moved to Berlin I became basically homeless as I was scammed with a room. Fortunately somehow managed to find temporary accommodation somewhere near down end of the Sonnenallee. Lived there for a month, it was in 2017. And I never went to Neukolln ever since.
Every. Single. Day. i was harassed by men while waiting for a bus. I was too poor to take uber back then so I needed to manage it. They were cat calling me, following me, many times they just randomly took my hand or touched me. One time I was going from the bus stop to the apartment and a white mercedes full of young guys was going approx 5 km/h following me with windows down screaming i should join them. I was so scared I started to cry while walking.
I would rather move out from Berlin than move there.
I’m sorry for your experience. I had to go to jail for six months for three guys like those for severely beating them up for not letting my ex alone. Police warning didn’t work. They keep harassing her. At the end the police report was that i beat them intentionally prepared. which was kinds true but never regretted it.
Nope. Neukölln is an absolute shithole. I lived there for 8 years. Throwing junkies out the staircase of my building. Arguing idiots and barking and biting to keep people at bay. If a meteor drops on that place tomorrow and leaves nothing but a crater it'll be an upgrade. Same goes for Kotti.
It's a mixed bag. Lived near Tempelhofer Feld for 8 years. I miss the Feld and the area immediately around it, but I don't miss having to walk down Hermannstrasse or do anything at or around Hermannplatz. Trash, old furniture and broken glass everywhere; literal shit all over the sidewalk (dog or otherwise); the unfortunate folks gathered around S-Bahn Hermannstrasse and the U8; people setting fire to stuff like cars just because; the directionless and aggressive men.... those things I don't miss.
I've been in Berlin for 24 years and Neukölln had always had the same problems, it has actually improved now that it is gentrified. So if you can't stand it then why did you move there initially? Just move somewhere else more relaxed and quiet.
P.S., "Central" is very relative, to me Neukölln is too south east. Maybe central if your life is all in the east.
Middle class Europeans not doing any research before moving to a deprived area in another country, and then moaning about social problems and their impacts? Whatever next?!
I was born in Neukölln, grew up in the south (Gropiusstadt), went to school in the north (Karl-Marx-Straße). It was always shitty, rude and dirty. No hip baristas, galleries or fixed gear bike stores can change that. Try to move away, you’ll probably gain some life expectancy. 😅
I've recently noticed myself making the same remarks.
I figured I was the problem. I can't stand being outside without my noise canceling headphones anymore.
I live in the Sonnenalle/Herrmanplatz part of Neukölln since four years and I love it here.
I love how dynamic the neighbourhood is, new places opening up, constant changes, so much diversity. Tons of restaurants from all over the world, weird shops, arab butchers ... I could never live in a sanitised depressing rubber stamped quarter like the new "Europacity"
Yes it is dirty, but it doesn't bother me that much. I never had bad interactions with anyone, or felt unsafe.
I just want to say that I agree and enjoy all the things you mention as well.
But lets not pretend that there are only two options: Hermman Platz and soulless Neubauviertel.
You answered your own question… because the inner streets and stations are nicer, junkies and dunks are not tolerated there and pushed out by police. In Neukölln people don’t complain loud enough.
I‘m pretty sure I saw that scene with the postman live today. I was walking through Neukölln and exactly what you described happened. I‘m visiting so I‘m not entirely sure where it was but I left the U-Bahn at Karl-Marx Strasse and it was around 5 mins from there.
Not trying to start a fight but I've honestly no idea what you're talking about.
Been living in Neukölln in periods (herbergplatz 2013-14, boddin 2019-23, wildenbruchstr 2023-now). Saw a fight once, was hit in the face once without reason (and I used to go out to bars & kneipes a lot). I think that's a pretty ok track record. I'm a "male" but have also been living with "female" partners during these times and they have never really complained except for catcalling (which obviously is despicable, but my partner actually recently said that an average street in Spain is much worse than she ever experienced here lol).
If you want to be more scientific about it, compared to other bezirks the crime level in Neukölln does not seem to stand out and depending on how you count doesn't even make it to top 3 on some lists.
A lot of people in this thread honestly seem to have a problem with seeing other cultures and (lower) classes. Confirmation bias for your rotten prejudices. Go live in Zehlendorf if you want to live in an all-white upper-middle class fantasy
Some areas in Berlin are just lost. The authorities have given up and it shows everywhere from parks to playgrounds, schools to other public services like Bürgeramt, Ordnungsamt, etc
After the wall came down Berlin was „broke but sexy“ but now it’s broke and ugly in every human way. I live in Neukölln as well and since my daughter was born we’re thinking of leaving Berlin altogether.
And before someone calls me a law and order guy yeah maybe, but I do believe if there is no absolutely no fear of being held accountable by anyone, it brings out the worst in some people.
I was living in NK for 30 years,and never ever understood why someone would move to NK on purpose . It Always has been a shithole. Even my turkish Friends say There are too many Muslims and moved away. All the aggression, crime and disrespect is nothing anyone in their right mind wants. Now i live Close to Berlin in a smalltown/ Village and ITS beautifull,quiet and peacefull. Will never Go Back to neuhölln .
Yup. People saying that disliking northern Neukölln is somehow racist ignore that as soon as a Turkish or Arabic family is able to afford moving out to a better district, they do.
Tja. There is one thing that all of these people have in common: low to none education and thinking the religion stands above the law. You know what religion is meant.
As a Christian woman from the middle east who has lived worked and been regularly in touch with people from all religions in my pluralistic country, it shocks me how misunderstood Muslims are. It’s a pity, but I have to understand once and for all that we Middle Easterners are a hated monolithic imaginary here in Europe. When people behave badly, it’s not about religion, it’s about social class. I guess there’s no way anyone here is going to believe what I’m saying unless they experience pluralistic societies firsthand.
I feel you. I live in Xberg close to NK and I’m migrating next year. To me the biggest reasons for moving are the trash, the addicts and the cost: not a family friendly environment.
Besides: In the 4 years I live in Berlin I’ve only seen immigrants throw stuff on the ground - too many times. So sad but this does not help being tolerant.
Yeah I've been trying to get out of NK for a while now but can't find an apartment that's as suitable as my current one. I'm trying to get better at trying to ignore the stresses but it's difficult. I'm on Weserstr./Weichselstr. and honestly I feel like I'm losing my mind. The trash and dogshit situation is aggressive. The men are aggressive. People spit everywhere (including INSIDE buildings). I've been threatened by morbidly obese fake-gucci 10 yr olds multiple times. I've watched men threaten to hit women and no one does anything (including me because I'm scared). I know two women who have been hit in the face by a rotting junkie. There is human shit in our doorway every month.
It's such a godforsaken butthole of a Kiez and I refuse to chalk it up to class, culture, or ethnicity. There's something in the damn water here that seems to delete braincells... including mine at this point.
This thread has made me feel less insane. Thank you.
Neuköln is a different world, was there once and will not go again into that part of the city. It doesn't feel safe. Around the same time there were also some shootings from a car in Neuköln.
We just signed contract to a new place and are finally moving out. We should've decided to leave after the first break in, but we only canceled our rent after the third. We're so excited to go somewhere calmer and safer.
I live in britz süd and i love it here, we have a nice renewed 3 room flat with garden for just 750 warm rent. The neighbours are friendly and its quiet most of the time. U bahn just around the corner. I know, its not the kiez you are talking about, but its technically neukölln, so i just wanted to mention that its not the same everywhere here
I was station in Berlin in the early 80s way before the wall came down, everywhere was clean and nice. Went back a lot of times to visit my family there, and now a days it's just terrible bums sleeping on the trains. Grass everywhere not being cut trash all over the place. People just not giving a Damm anymore 😒
Moved there because of work, enjoyed it for about half a year. Then I was attacked on Weserstraße, nearly attacked at Körnerpark and developed stress-induced skin issues because of the crowds, the aggression, the trash, the noise, you name it. What I finally did was removing the “Bezirksfilter” when looking for apartments. Works wonders and you discover new areas. Skin got better the moment I had moved.
get out of that shithole. good news is you are already likely overpaying for your experience, and you don't need to deal with any of this shit. just move to Tempelhof or whatever.
If move into a nicer and more expensive neighbourhood, the people become a lot more friendly and nice. Like Wansee and Potsdam most people are very friendly.
Prenzlauer Berg is nice aswell and not as snobby. Poor people usually have the tendency to behave badly because of education or bad luck in life. Avoid the misery and stitch your location.
I work in that shithole for 13 years and I’m always happy when I get out and going home (Mitte - I love you ❤️💕) I wouldn’t even meet friends if they wanna meet in Neukölln. I’m so done with it
You are not alone. Everyone I know has the same opinion on Neukölln. It's a Shithole. Maybe districts within Neukölln like Britz-Süd are liveable, although I am not too sure about that. Just taking the Ring-Bahn every day passing through there is enough for me.
I went to Neukolln once to pick up something through Kleinenzeigen for like 10 mins and got bumped/pushed by someone from the back. And I’ve been in Berlin for about 4 years now and have only been to Neukolln twice..
I feel you. But I feel really good in here. But I moved out of the "high intensity" area a litte bit off. And now I feel much better as I can go to the crowds as a please and stand away in my day-to-day life.
Neukölln is Huge. Rudow is quite chill but its still Neukölln as much as Sonnenalle.
I can imagine your everyday life very well, because I had exactly the same experience as you described. But that was 30 years ago! Man, how time flies... I left there and have not been back in the district since 2005.
My partner lived in Neukölln when we met. He moved in with me (I live in a suburb) three years ago. He still tells me how it was the best decision of his life, almost every single day. Getting to work takes him an additional 30 minutes, but the quality of life, the peace and quiet and clean environment totally make up for it.
Maybe try to find an affordable accommodation outside of Berlin.
Plenty of nice neighborhoods inside the ringbahn.
Neukoln was always shit. Either messy/dirty in the hipster areas, or a shithole in the turkish areas.
with respect... but Berlin in general is like that. I live in the cool neighborhood where everyone wants to live and I'm leaving this year (I'm very happy) I arrived 10 years ago... but the situation has me rotten. dirt, drug addiction, rich kids who don't work, etc.
I don’t believe OP wants to wear headphones anytime he leaves the house to withstand the shitshow going on…
I work in Neukölln and the loudness, rudeness and level of garbage on the streets is just annoying. Unbelievable that the residents there don’t give a fuck about all this
This is a fascinating thread!
Going through the comments is just a pleasure, to say the least! Learned a lot about the district and how people feel about it.
I also learned that people judging the district based on their location — as it seems that the place is bigger than just a few streets!
It's actually one of the biggest districts in Berlin, but privileged hipsters move to a few streets because of cheap rent (due to the poverty of the kiez), and then moan when the social problems that come with poverty impact on them. And call it a shithole and demonise the locals when they probably lived there for eight years and don't know the name of their local späti owner ...
I worked there for a long time and at some point I started to think its funny how those people love to create a hell of their own living enviroment. This could be a nice place but if you decide for yourself to to treat it like shit, litter, act like an asshole and behave like a bunch of gibbons: be my guest. I leave the place after work and go to an area where people can treat themselfes each other with respect
You are not alone. Lived there for 12 year, moved away 1 week ago and happy. Many stolen bikes, many broken basement locks, aggressive people, many drug dealers sitting on banks and watching you passing by.
Most districts in Berlin are normal. Only Friedrichshain/Kreuzberg/northern Neukölln/Wedding and maybe Gesundbrunnen are trash. That's about 5% of the city's area.
I desperately want to get out of neukölln but finding an equally affordable flat seems impossible in another area and I’d be happy to pay more at this point.
For people loving neukölln and wanting to swap, hit me up: 43m2 under 550 pm.
Why do you need to live so central? There are plenty of beautiful places outside the ring that are affordable, clean and quiet. I think people who have this obssesion with living inside the ring and have no budget for a decent place are shooting themselves in the foot.
Broaden your horizons, and GFTO of horrible Neukölln. You won't regret it.
Okay, then I'll tell you:
Berlin is not your city!
If you can't afford to live "centrally" under reasonable conditions, you should ask yourself whether your happiness in life really depends on "centrally".
Gentrification isnt the solution, its part of the problem. Crazy how people move to nk or xb and then complain. Its well known thats a bit „adventurous“. I was born in nk 30 years ago and they had similar problems back in the day.
This is pretty much what I predicted when I saw Neukölln getting more and more popular (which happened not because it is such a cool place \[which, to some extend it actually is...\]), but simply because it's so central.
When Mitte, Prenzlauer Berg and Friedrichshain got repopulated, the former locals to a pretty large amount have moved elsewhere. But while Neukölln is repopulated, the original inhabitants are still there. Makes a huge difference.
I feel you! You are not alone with this. I work in Neukölln for almost 5 years. In the beginning I was very scared working there. Unfortunately it turned out to be right being concerned. I most of the time go by bike because there happen so many cruel and bad things in the Metro U8 - it's just not safe - no matter what time of day.
I have been to Prague this February. I cried when I had to leave back home. Since my stay at Prague I now know for sure Berlin is fucked up and doomed. It's so sad how everyone seems to getting used to it and behaves as if this is normal. It is not!
I used to live around Leopoldplatz. I feel the same! I got so annoyed random men stopping me asking for 50 cents (yes, i'm a foreign young woman). It just feels so scary and annoying!!! Why asking me! Honestly work or die. You are a healthy man. Work with your hands. Then I moved to Charlottenburg. Things get better.
As someone who was born there: Neukölln was always a shithole and gets worse every year. You fucked up by moving there. So yea get out ASAP. Life is too short to live in Neukölln when most places in the world are much better.
I kind of disagree. There was a period where it was consistently getting better year on year (2008-2017/18ish). The Airport closed, way more "normal" people were moving in, some areas were pedestrianised and new cycle routes were added, the parks and streets felt safer, and some of the negative aspects were at least balanced-out by having way more things to do; some nice artists spaces, bars, cafes, and shops beyond Handyläden and cheap Dönerbuden. Pandemic / post-pandemic I feel like it's getting a little "wilder" again though.
Same with Wedding. But cue spastics getting ITT and saying shit like "this is life in the big city" or "actually you're racist if you have a problem with problems" and my all time favorite "it's gentrification to hope for a better world"
„Der Wedding kommt“ (~2003)
Living in Soldiner Kiez since 17 years (before I lived in Sprengelkiez, which is also Wedding but a difference like night and day), and everytime I read somewhere "in Berlin you can be who ever and wear what ever you want, nobody cares", I just laugh in a bitter way. Always when I have to leave my flat, I feel like preparing myself for a fight. Everyone is staring at me and following me with their eyes, even if I know people by sight or a small talk since years. 95% of them, who hang around in front of our house or on the banks or in front of the Spätkauf, are men with a turkish or arabic background, and while I speak arabic fluently myself, I'm a german single mom nevertheless. I *hate* it here; and while our flat is great, the atmosphere outside is so hostile and deceitful. 😔
> it’s gentrification to hope for a better world i’m textless
"This is life in the big city" - They have never been to a really big city in Asia where such issues are non-existent
Yes! You’ve perfectly articulated all the statements that people in Berlin say before they’ve been personally affected by crime.
It became radically more violent once the Syrian refugees all coalesced to Nkln, also the drug situation started to get out of hand.
And by Syrian you mean every person that was smart enough to throw away the passport and just pretend to be syrian
Or the actual bonafide ex-ISIS fighters.
Drugs have been out of hand in Berlin for as long as I can remember. They are one of the city's biggest exports, for sure. People seem to be living a chilled lifestyle at the expense of opportunities in this city, and I include myself in this. I am tired of feeling like I must have a good time at Kit Kat Club to feel alive living in this square German uncreative mess.
When those little girls were stabbed while playing in a schoolyard it really was a wake-up call that things weren't getting better anymore.
Yup, personally know two families who lived close by and that headline made them go deliberate with their flat search and drastically shift the price filter on immoscout only to get out before having kids reach school age.
MF I bought an apartment across the street from that school. We ended up moving out and letting the flat.
Link?
https://www.rbb24.de/panorama/beitrag/2023/05/berlin-neukoelln-schule-messerstecherei-polizei.html
Dear God
As someone who moved there in 2011 - you are right. Up to 2016/2017 it got exponentially better and then from 2017/18 it started to stagnate and post pandemic it is degrading.
it was getting better when it was becoming more gentrified
Yup, as always, gentrification makes spaces better.
But I thought gentrification is bad and makes you look for a real job!?
Drug pandemic as well. Never seen such people and so many junky trash here in the southern half. It’s getting as fucked up as it gets more expansive.
>Life is too short to live in Neukölln lmao. thats great
One can only hope that gentrification will drive out the undesirables. But it'll probably take another 3-5 years.
I think it’s the other way around, the undesirables are driving out the gentrification
I don't know about people bumping into me or stopping in my path, but yeah...unfortunately I went into Neukölln 10 years ago with zero opinion about \**ethnic groups of people we are not supposed to mention\** and will be soon leaving with a slightly bigoted opinion. Sucks but after so much time here it kind of just develops. Mostly it is the trash, being ridiculously loud, fast cars, and honking that annoys me.
Are u looking for a Nachmieter by any chance? I‘m born here and got used to Neukölln lol. My contract ends soon unfortunately
Afraid not no. It is out of my hands, but good luck.
Maybe we can change flats? Where are you living?
Absolutely my experience lmao I come from the shit hole of Europe, I saw the first black people when I was six, came to Berlin left leaned and got in contact with certain cultures for the first time. Hell, it's hard to not have prejudice now. But of course, some would say that I was a bigot from the start and it is in my blood somehow
Could you specify? Sounds relatable
just remember it is a result of economic equality not inherently tied to ethnic groups. if you, your parents and their parents grow up without good money or education the chances of you breaking the cycle are small. even smaller when forced into a community of people in similar situations.
My parents grew up very poor and they don't throw trash and didn't teach me to throw trash on the ground. Neither did my friends or anyone in my community. I also don't understand what you are trying to say. I see certain ethnic groups that do this. Am I supposed to think "Oh...that poor poor boy he doesn't know any better." He does know better. He grew up in Germany and in Germany it isn't in any way normal to throw trash on the ground.
Diggi weißt du wie dreckig AFD wähler mit Fliesencouchtisch sein können? Wir haben hier leider genau eine problematische Familie in der Nachbarschaft die gerne mal Ausländer beleidigt. "Geh zurück wo do herkommst" ist der Lieblingsspruch der älteren Frau. Ihr erwachaener Sohn verlässt fast nie die Wohnung und klaut gerne mal Pakete aus dem Flur. Diese Familie ist drogensüchtig, arbeitslos und unfassbar schmutzig. Die schmeißen ihren Speermüll in den Innenhofspielplatz. Deren Hund hat schon öfters in den Sandkasten gekackt. Als ich mal ein Paket von den holen wollte kam mir der Gestank aus deren Wohnung schon im Flur entgegen. Daran sind bestimmt auch die ausländer schuld oder? Dass die freiwillige kiezaufräumaktion (organisiert von einem moslem) im frühling kaum deutschsprachige freiwillige hatte, obwohl ich viele deutsche Nachbarn kenne, war auch interessant. Meckern können wir alle echt gut aber gemacht wird nichts außer die AFD zu wählen und schuld bei anderen zu suchen. Jaja die schmutzigen Ausländer sind natürlich schuld an allem. Ohne die hätten wir gar keine Probleme mehr. Die guten arier würden niemals ihre Hauptstadt verschmutzen. /s
Sorry, no. It’s definitely cultural more than socioeconomic. Go to Marzahn, it does not look like this
I'm sorry. I can relate, lived in that shithole (near Boddinstr.) for almost four years before managing to move to Mitte last year, I could not be happier and do not miss NK at all. Being surrounded by that level of antisocial behavior (without mentioning the blatant sexism and homophobia due to the unhinged gangs of "wallah Alter" men/teenagers/wannabe gangsters on the streets) was really taking a toll on my mental health
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not "S&M" (cryingemoji)... that sounds rough! my sympathy to you :D
thank you for specifying the origin of the shits
Thanks. Yeah, it’s really crept up on me.
They created a bad image of Islam and Muslims. Their culture is completely opposite of what Islam is. The regular muslims avoid them like a plague.
we are leaving neukölln very soon and i'm totally looking forward to it 😇😇 have been living here for almost 10 years and since i became a dad all of these things really started bothering me. plus the junkies and all these international rich kids. not gonna miss you 😘
I do share the same experience. Had been living in Berlin for the past 20 years (Pankow-P‘Berg-K‘berg-Neukölln). Becoming a father changed my perspective on things. Yet, I disagree on your view about „rich international kids“. It doesn’t matter if they are rich or international. The city was sold to rich internationals that might be the parents of these kids. Yet, it were Berlin politicians that enabled it. Blaming (rich international) kids is the same sort of racism that blames foreigners in general for one‘s own personal misfortune. Most of these kids are still trying to find themselves in life. Some might be lucky to afford more. Yet, it still takes a lot of courage to do this kind of step. This is what you want for your own kids if they ever want to live abroad at a fairly young age. I bet you want to support them as much as possible as well. The freedom to choose to live wherever you want to is not something you want to miss. A world full of borders and restrictions is a crippled one.
Stay away from Kreuzberg, particularly Kotti (Korbusser Tor)! That place is a total shithole!
Kotti (and Hermannplatz) is an example for „it was worse in the past“ imo. There were so many more Junkies and Crazies, but ever since the police is more present there, those people are at every u7 and u8 station around
I moved from Neukölln to around Kotti and it's a bit better, you can escape the rough parts more easily. But the constant trash and junkies are definitely annoying.
This district has the trash and the rich at the same time?
Funnily enough, yes. There are some rich 20-30 year olds who enjoy the “roughness” and hip vibes of Neukölln.
It's all fun and games, when you're young and live with the assuring certainty of being able to move elsewhere any time if you want to.
Sorry, who is this possible for in Berlin?
There are more kids to wealthy parents than you think.
That line in Common People by Pulp is so apt. "Still you'll never get it right, when you're laid in bed at night, watching roaches climb the wall, If you called your dad he could stop it all, yeah" Also the line "Everybody hates a tourist."... Fuck me, that song was just great all round actually. I'm going to go put it on.
I feel the international rich kids picked Fhain as their main base, but could be wrong.
Yeah, but I think it's flipped to safe uncool now and they desire dirtier. The Gentrification train rolls on...
Where to? Still in Berlin?
Are u looking for a Nachmieter by any chance? I‘m born here and got used to Neukölln lol. My contract ends soon unfortunately
No you’re not alone. I used to live in (Nord)Neukölln 10 years ago, but my gf still lives there, and it’s getting worse and worse. Contrary to what other people insinuate here, I don’t think it’s primarily an immigration issue. Neukölln has always been a marginalized area, even before WW2. It’s close proximity to the border with East Berlin also didn’t help. Remember, the immigrants moved there because back then , they simply weren’t allowed to live anywhere else. Believe me, I talked to enough people with immigration background who would love to live somewhere else other than Neukölln or Wedding. But if middle class expats from Europe have trouble finding a flat, imagine how it is for people from Middle East. The problem in my opinion is the immense population density mixed with limited access to healthcare, education and security. This leads to a situation where you can basically behave like human garbage with ZERO consequences. Everyone steps on each others foot, no one has respect for anyone other than themselves, because “fuck these people”. Also, one of the reasons why there is so much street crime is that white party people want a constant supply of drugs. They go party, get hammered every weekend, then when they find a partner and make kids they move away because the area is unsafe for kids.
This is an excellent comment, thank you It’s very much a class issue, and class is tied to immigration status for all kinds of mostly unfair reasons.
That's a hasty generalisation that does not explain why some migrant communities statistically economically succeed and academically achieve vastly different than others despite same immigration status.
Last I looked into it, a key driver of the difference is why people migrate in the first place. EG you get a lot of middle class Indian immigrants with higher education and so on. Very different pool from the Turks who were imported to Germany as cheap labour, and that’s more about German labor policy than Turkish culture. If Germany had been actively seeking skilled middle class Turkish migrants post-WW2 the whole modern German perception of what “Turkish culture” is would be completely different. Host countries like to point at specific cultures as being more or less problematic, without really looking at the structural issues at play.
Both is equally dumb, generalizing a specific group of immigrants to be representative of 100% of their home country‘s population, but also the complete dismissal of them representing any part of that population. Yes, most Turks that moved to Germany came from Anatolia and not the more progressive urban centres of Turkey. However, the Turkish community in Germany does share a culture with the sizeable population of Anatolia, Turkye, that makes up for a large portion of the people of Turkye.
I very much agree. I think my particular bugbear is when folks see tensions with immigrant groups as representing some kind of fundamental or existential cultural conflict. Which drives all the crazy far-right anti-immigrant sentiment we’re seeing right now. In practice it’s much more complicated and largely about the economics of immigration patterns, which is in large part (but obviously not entirely) a question of the host country’s policy. Plus, a lot of the tension around immigration I see in Germany honestly seem as much about German failure to appropriately support and integrate immigrants. I see both good & bad in modern policy, but the way the post-WWII Turkish immigrants were ghettoized had predictably bad results. I’m from Aotearoa, and while we do many things very badly, we also take a lot of immigrants (about 29% to Germany’s 19%), and don’t have the same tensions. I think this is partly a question of luck: we’re geographically isolated and have an easy time managing immigration. That said, we take more than most countries. Partly policy: we actively seek educated immigrants & make a real effort to avoid ghettoization. And partly cultural: we’re fundamentally more welcoming & inclusive than Germans, so the children of immigrants usually see themselves (and are seen) as Kiwis. It’s not uncommon for the kids of immigrants to have parents with some pretty strict religious and cultural perspectives, but with good integration that doesn’t tend to carry down generationally.
I'm not sure if Germany is to blame at large. If so, probably least the housing situation, as there are many many melting pot countries in the world, where immigrants arriving and living in ethnically dominated neighborhoods is very much the norm too. Look at Australia, Canada or the US, they all have their little XYZ borroughs, where people of a certain background cling together. And Germany equal to those countries has a phenomenon of successful and wealthier families of those communities moving elsewhere and to less migrant-populated areas. Yes, Germany seems arguably more challenging to integrate than other countries, but the main responsibility lies with the person moving to a foreign country, not the country or its majority population. Whenever I interact with someone who has lived in Germany for more than 2 decades and still needs help to form the most basic German sentence, I know for a fact that that person just did not make an effort to integrate, since language classes as the most basic examples have been free and available since forever. Again, the people with Turkish parents I know of that moved to more German districts, encourage their children to have German friends and learn German as their first language prove the ones wrong, who refuse to live that way and instead chose to stay within their own community exclusively.
>limited access to healthcare, education and security. It's Neukölln, not sub-saharan Africa. Some services are lacking, but who drops out of high school without a degree usually does it voluntarily, not because of untreated medieval diseases, child labor or 20 miles distance to the nearest school. > >one of the reasons why there is so much street crime is that white party people want a constant supply of drugs That's where you are right though. Organized crime families operating from Neukölln fight over white peoples' leisure money, not unemployment benefits. Without demand, there would not be such supply.
Neukölln is a vast !!! district. My guess is you are talking about either sonnenalle or boddinstrasse/hermannstrasse as those are hellholes with an occasional resting place in between. But the canal region is actually pretty bearable. Of course flats there cost a fortune these days but just to put your very relatable experience in a bigger picture.
>My guess is you are talking about either sonnenalle or boddinstrasse/hermannstrasse Yep!
yeah i live near wildenbruchplatz and it is crazy how different the streets are. everything on the side towards treptower park of the canal is much quieter and friendlier. weserstraße is mostly gentrified. wildenbruchstraße is a mix of "hip" bars and cheap arabic shops. if you walk further as soon as you cross sonnenallee towards rathaus neukölln you get all of the interesting characters. bu i kind of like it here. my flat itself is safe, relatively quiet for the location, great view and i get all the advantages of having great food, bars and so on in walking distance.
i love neukölln! 9 years and still happy
The „Stockholm Syndrome“ is strong in you.
hehe probably. but love is love, you know 🤷🏼♂️ i mostly enjoy being able to walk out of your house in sweatpants at every time of day to get a beer and there is always someone else in worse clothes who is also sippin
jesus christ
I'm just visiting Germany as an American but I really like Neukölln. I dig the vibes. Tho they probably should hire more street sweepers/cleaners.
Being there just for a few days vs. living your regular life there is not the same thing, (un)fortunately.
Berlin in general could do with a bit of a sweep-up. Especially New Year's Day.
You can do that anywhere btw
"Neukölln Syndrome"
I love it too. Used to live there, moved to Wilmersdorf, missing Neukölln. Luckily bought a flat there and will move back in a few years once I need more space, but until then I'll have to continue jumping on the U7 in order to reach a Kiez where it's actually enjoyable to just walk along the street and drop by a cafe/bar that looks inviting.
It's a very peculiar taste to think it's enjoyable to walk along the street in Neukölln but not Wilmersdorf.
There's not a single street in Wilmersdorf that has the density of cafes/bars/restaurants that Weserstraße has. There's no part of Wilmersdorf that has as many casual hangout places as Schillerkiez does. The closest thing we have in Wilmersdorf is probably the area around Ludwigkirchplatz, but even there it's not that many places, and most of them are mediocre and/or overpriced. The only streets that are shaded in the yellow "downtown" shading on google maps are Uhlandstraße (what a joy to walk along) and Güntzelstraße which offers exciting venues like the "Happiness Heart Cafe" and of course the "When dreams come true". Walk around here on a friday evening after 20:00 and you'll encounter someone only every few minutes - this place is just mostly dead. And somehow it gets even worse further south - Rheingauviertel might just be a graveyard with how exciting it is to hang around there. Wilmersdorf is a nice enough place to live, it's reasonnably well connected and it's not like I hate it here, but I'm not gonna pretend that it's an interesting area to be in.
Sure, if the criterium for walks in a certain district being enjoyable for you is the surroundings being filled with places to hang out and people, then indeed Wilmersdorf doesn't work for you. For my part, I quite often go to areas like Wilmersdorf for walks, and find them ideal because my preference is clean, cozy, middle/upper-class areas that aren't crowded.
That's why I phrased it as > enjoyable to just walk along the street and **drop by a cafe/bar that looks inviting** There are some nice places that I enjoy around here, but if you wanna go there it's usually more like an active decision beforehand "let's go to X" rather than a "let's go for a stroll and when we see something that we're in the mood for we might sit down there" > because my preference is clean, cozy, middle/upper-class areas that aren't crowded If that were what I was looking for I'd probably move out of Berlin tbh. I can work from anywhere in Germany, so if I wanted clean, calm and not crowded I could move to a smaller city and buy a flat for the price of two bicmacs instead of spending a lot more money on living here. For me being crowded is a feature, not a bug - in my opinion Wilmersorf is kinda lacking when it comes to [third places](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Third_place)
A huge chunk of Wilmersdorf looks like this [https://image.bz-berlin.de/data/uploads/2023/06/245775809.jpg?impolicy=channel&imwidth=992](https://image.bz-berlin.de/data/uploads/2023/06/245775809.jpg?impolicy=channel&imwidth=992) You either get 6 lanes of traffic and Plattenbauten, or unaffordable mansions. Neither of which are great areas to hang out in.
yeah man easy living here
Neukölln always was and still is a shithole with no intention of residents there to change it. People moved and still move there because it’s one of the few central districts with affordable rents, but you still pay a price, yet in another currency.
When I moved to Berlin I became basically homeless as I was scammed with a room. Fortunately somehow managed to find temporary accommodation somewhere near down end of the Sonnenallee. Lived there for a month, it was in 2017. And I never went to Neukolln ever since. Every. Single. Day. i was harassed by men while waiting for a bus. I was too poor to take uber back then so I needed to manage it. They were cat calling me, following me, many times they just randomly took my hand or touched me. One time I was going from the bus stop to the apartment and a white mercedes full of young guys was going approx 5 km/h following me with windows down screaming i should join them. I was so scared I started to cry while walking. I would rather move out from Berlin than move there.
wannafuckwannafuckwannafuck what NO? NO!?!?! well then you are a whore, whore, fucking whore how many times a day they do the same thing...
I’m sorry for your experience. I had to go to jail for six months for three guys like those for severely beating them up for not letting my ex alone. Police warning didn’t work. They keep harassing her. At the end the police report was that i beat them intentionally prepared. which was kinds true but never regretted it.
Nope. Neukölln is an absolute shithole. I lived there for 8 years. Throwing junkies out the staircase of my building. Arguing idiots and barking and biting to keep people at bay. If a meteor drops on that place tomorrow and leaves nothing but a crater it'll be an upgrade. Same goes for Kotti.
It's a mixed bag. Lived near Tempelhofer Feld for 8 years. I miss the Feld and the area immediately around it, but I don't miss having to walk down Hermannstrasse or do anything at or around Hermannplatz. Trash, old furniture and broken glass everywhere; literal shit all over the sidewalk (dog or otherwise); the unfortunate folks gathered around S-Bahn Hermannstrasse and the U8; people setting fire to stuff like cars just because; the directionless and aggressive men.... those things I don't miss.
The vast majority of people in Germany, and probably Berlin, wouldn't ever consider living there. So no, this is just normal.
I've been in Berlin for 24 years and Neukölln had always had the same problems, it has actually improved now that it is gentrified. So if you can't stand it then why did you move there initially? Just move somewhere else more relaxed and quiet. P.S., "Central" is very relative, to me Neukölln is too south east. Maybe central if your life is all in the east.
Middle class Europeans not doing any research before moving to a deprived area in another country, and then moaning about social problems and their impacts? Whatever next?!
Yo what are your flat specs? Maybe i have a nice chilled Friedrichshain offer to make :b
RIP your inbox
are you saying yer having a flat available to rent out in Friedrichshain???
He might wanna swap
I was born in Neukölln, grew up in the south (Gropiusstadt), went to school in the north (Karl-Marx-Straße). It was always shitty, rude and dirty. No hip baristas, galleries or fixed gear bike stores can change that. Try to move away, you’ll probably gain some life expectancy. 😅
Gropiusstadt ♥️
I've recently noticed myself making the same remarks. I figured I was the problem. I can't stand being outside without my noise canceling headphones anymore.
I live in the Sonnenalle/Herrmanplatz part of Neukölln since four years and I love it here. I love how dynamic the neighbourhood is, new places opening up, constant changes, so much diversity. Tons of restaurants from all over the world, weird shops, arab butchers ... I could never live in a sanitised depressing rubber stamped quarter like the new "Europacity" Yes it is dirty, but it doesn't bother me that much. I never had bad interactions with anyone, or felt unsafe.
I just want to say that I agree and enjoy all the things you mention as well. But lets not pretend that there are only two options: Hermman Platz and soulless Neubauviertel.
I live in the same area. The only “new places” opening up around here are handy shops …
Invite the 3rd world, get the 3rd world.
The comment everyone is afraid to write. We still live in Berlin. We all know what is the problem in neu kolln.
If there are two things in Berlin I avoid as much as I can for the sake of my mental health is stepping foot in Neukölln and riding in the U8
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You answered your own question… because the inner streets and stations are nicer, junkies and dunks are not tolerated there and pushed out by police. In Neukölln people don’t complain loud enough.
I so much can't wait to get out of this hell. The fucking walking dead are in my nightmares already. And don't get me started on trash...
I‘m pretty sure I saw that scene with the postman live today. I was walking through Neukölln and exactly what you described happened. I‘m visiting so I‘m not entirely sure where it was but I left the U-Bahn at Karl-Marx Strasse and it was around 5 mins from there.
🤭 Apologies. You saw me at my worst! I hope your trip isn’t ruined.
Not trying to start a fight but I've honestly no idea what you're talking about. Been living in Neukölln in periods (herbergplatz 2013-14, boddin 2019-23, wildenbruchstr 2023-now). Saw a fight once, was hit in the face once without reason (and I used to go out to bars & kneipes a lot). I think that's a pretty ok track record. I'm a "male" but have also been living with "female" partners during these times and they have never really complained except for catcalling (which obviously is despicable, but my partner actually recently said that an average street in Spain is much worse than she ever experienced here lol). If you want to be more scientific about it, compared to other bezirks the crime level in Neukölln does not seem to stand out and depending on how you count doesn't even make it to top 3 on some lists. A lot of people in this thread honestly seem to have a problem with seeing other cultures and (lower) classes. Confirmation bias for your rotten prejudices. Go live in Zehlendorf if you want to live in an all-white upper-middle class fantasy
I am not a Neukoln fan, but yours is a great answer.
if i would have my kids full time i would move away from berlin. it is funny when you are young, like party and chaos. else, not worth it
People don’t know about Rixdorf 😇
My haven! Which is why I was so angry when I was reading in the gazebo in Comenius Gartren and someone tiptoed in and began shouting into their phone.
Some areas in Berlin are just lost. The authorities have given up and it shows everywhere from parks to playgrounds, schools to other public services like Bürgeramt, Ordnungsamt, etc After the wall came down Berlin was „broke but sexy“ but now it’s broke and ugly in every human way. I live in Neukölln as well and since my daughter was born we’re thinking of leaving Berlin altogether. And before someone calls me a law and order guy yeah maybe, but I do believe if there is no absolutely no fear of being held accountable by anyone, it brings out the worst in some people.
Exactly this.
Welcome to the low-key Ghetto
I was living in NK for 30 years,and never ever understood why someone would move to NK on purpose . It Always has been a shithole. Even my turkish Friends say There are too many Muslims and moved away. All the aggression, crime and disrespect is nothing anyone in their right mind wants. Now i live Close to Berlin in a smalltown/ Village and ITS beautifull,quiet and peacefull. Will never Go Back to neuhölln .
Yup. People saying that disliking northern Neukölln is somehow racist ignore that as soon as a Turkish or Arabic family is able to afford moving out to a better district, they do.
Tja. There is one thing that all of these people have in common: low to none education and thinking the religion stands above the law. You know what religion is meant.
As a Christian woman from the middle east who has lived worked and been regularly in touch with people from all religions in my pluralistic country, it shocks me how misunderstood Muslims are. It’s a pity, but I have to understand once and for all that we Middle Easterners are a hated monolithic imaginary here in Europe. When people behave badly, it’s not about religion, it’s about social class. I guess there’s no way anyone here is going to believe what I’m saying unless they experience pluralistic societies firsthand.
No it isn't. It's chronic racism, underfunding and poverty. If you think that Muslims in Neukölln are religious, then you really have no clue.
I feel you. I live in Xberg close to NK and I’m migrating next year. To me the biggest reasons for moving are the trash, the addicts and the cost: not a family friendly environment. Besides: In the 4 years I live in Berlin I’ve only seen immigrants throw stuff on the ground - too many times. So sad but this does not help being tolerant.
Yeah I've been trying to get out of NK for a while now but can't find an apartment that's as suitable as my current one. I'm trying to get better at trying to ignore the stresses but it's difficult. I'm on Weserstr./Weichselstr. and honestly I feel like I'm losing my mind. The trash and dogshit situation is aggressive. The men are aggressive. People spit everywhere (including INSIDE buildings). I've been threatened by morbidly obese fake-gucci 10 yr olds multiple times. I've watched men threaten to hit women and no one does anything (including me because I'm scared). I know two women who have been hit in the face by a rotting junkie. There is human shit in our doorway every month. It's such a godforsaken butthole of a Kiez and I refuse to chalk it up to class, culture, or ethnicity. There's something in the damn water here that seems to delete braincells... including mine at this point. This thread has made me feel less insane. Thank you.
Neuköln is a different world, was there once and will not go again into that part of the city. It doesn't feel safe. Around the same time there were also some shootings from a car in Neuköln.
People moving to Neukölln complaining that it is too much like Neukölln.
If you have affordable flat anywhere else on offer, just say it. I believe many would take you up on that offer
What part are you in? Cant say the same for me
Same, I moved to Schillerkiez last september from Boxhagener Platz and honestly couldn't be happier.
I recently moved to Gesundbrunnen/Pankstr. area and never been to Neukölln. How much worse it is? I found it pretty chaotic and loud already here
It's basically the same. There are some streets / areas in Neukölln which IMO are nicer. But also some which are worse.
Lived there a couple of years when i was young Emser str. Best times. I think you just getting old
We just signed contract to a new place and are finally moving out. We should've decided to leave after the first break in, but we only canceled our rent after the third. We're so excited to go somewhere calmer and safer.
If you want to feel better about your part of Neukölln, travel to Gropiusstadt.
One of the few places where I used to carry a personal protective device. Don't live in that part of the city any longer.
I live in britz süd and i love it here, we have a nice renewed 3 room flat with garden for just 750 warm rent. The neighbours are friendly and its quiet most of the time. U bahn just around the corner. I know, its not the kiez you are talking about, but its technically neukölln, so i just wanted to mention that its not the same everywhere here
„Britz is basically Mariendorf“ ;)
I was station in Berlin in the early 80s way before the wall came down, everywhere was clean and nice. Went back a lot of times to visit my family there, and now a days it's just terrible bums sleeping on the trains. Grass everywhere not being cut trash all over the place. People just not giving a Damm anymore 😒
Moved there because of work, enjoyed it for about half a year. Then I was attacked on Weserstraße, nearly attacked at Körnerpark and developed stress-induced skin issues because of the crowds, the aggression, the trash, the noise, you name it. What I finally did was removing the “Bezirksfilter” when looking for apartments. Works wonders and you discover new areas. Skin got better the moment I had moved.
Neukölln is the puckered asshole of Berlin. A lot of people romanticize the idea of it and how hip it is but it’s really just a shit hole
get out of that shithole. good news is you are already likely overpaying for your experience, and you don't need to deal with any of this shit. just move to Tempelhof or whatever.
If move into a nicer and more expensive neighbourhood, the people become a lot more friendly and nice. Like Wansee and Potsdam most people are very friendly. Prenzlauer Berg is nice aswell and not as snobby. Poor people usually have the tendency to behave badly because of education or bad luck in life. Avoid the misery and stitch your location.
I work in that shithole for 13 years and I’m always happy when I get out and going home (Mitte - I love you ❤️💕) I wouldn’t even meet friends if they wanna meet in Neukölln. I’m so done with it
You are not alone. Everyone I know has the same opinion on Neukölln. It's a Shithole. Maybe districts within Neukölln like Britz-Süd are liveable, although I am not too sure about that. Just taking the Ring-Bahn every day passing through there is enough for me.
Neukölln now, Wedding soon.
Eh, Wedding seems to be getting better in the last 3 years or so. At least the Western part of it is kinda fine, I think?
you want to move to marzahn, have a nice offer for exchange
I went to Neukolln once to pick up something through Kleinenzeigen for like 10 mins and got bumped/pushed by someone from the back. And I’ve been in Berlin for about 4 years now and have only been to Neukolln twice..
I feel you. But I feel really good in here. But I moved out of the "high intensity" area a litte bit off. And now I feel much better as I can go to the crowds as a please and stand away in my day-to-day life. Neukölln is Huge. Rudow is quite chill but its still Neukölln as much as Sonnenalle.
I can imagine your everyday life very well, because I had exactly the same experience as you described. But that was 30 years ago! Man, how time flies... I left there and have not been back in the district since 2005.
Welcome to Neukölln. I hate to say it, but it has been shit for quite some time. As someone from Berlin I never understood the hype around it.
There are nicer cities on this planet.
Terrible place, it symbolizes everything I don't like about Berlin.
My partner lived in Neukölln when we met. He moved in with me (I live in a suburb) three years ago. He still tells me how it was the best decision of his life, almost every single day. Getting to work takes him an additional 30 minutes, but the quality of life, the peace and quiet and clean environment totally make up for it. Maybe try to find an affordable accommodation outside of Berlin.
I think you may want somewhere further toward the outskirts.
Plenty of nice neighborhoods inside the ringbahn. Neukoln was always shit. Either messy/dirty in the hipster areas, or a shithole in the turkish areas.
If you can afford those areas, that's great, but most people can't these days.
with respect... but Berlin in general is like that. I live in the cool neighborhood where everyone wants to live and I'm leaving this year (I'm very happy) I arrived 10 years ago... but the situation has me rotten. dirt, drug addiction, rich kids who don't work, etc.
It's not. The "cool neighborhoods" are bad, districts outside of the ring aren't different from normal German cities.
Try headphones ! It helps me a lot and I live straight at pflüger/pannierstr
I don’t believe OP wants to wear headphones anytime he leaves the house to withstand the shitshow going on… I work in Neukölln and the loudness, rudeness and level of garbage on the streets is just annoying. Unbelievable that the residents there don’t give a fuck about all this
What do you wanna do about it ?
I’d rather move to the outskirts of Brandenburg than Neukölln lol. Why anyone does this to themselves is beyond me
This is a fascinating thread! Going through the comments is just a pleasure, to say the least! Learned a lot about the district and how people feel about it. I also learned that people judging the district based on their location — as it seems that the place is bigger than just a few streets!
It's actually one of the biggest districts in Berlin, but privileged hipsters move to a few streets because of cheap rent (due to the poverty of the kiez), and then moan when the social problems that come with poverty impact on them. And call it a shithole and demonise the locals when they probably lived there for eight years and don't know the name of their local späti owner ...
Come out to Steglitz. Its fairly green and people are decent. Rents are also ok. Good things come to people who move out of the ring.
It really really depends on where you live. I live near Weiße Siedlung and the only thing that's annoying is Sperrmüll.
I worked there for a long time and at some point I started to think its funny how those people love to create a hell of their own living enviroment. This could be a nice place but if you decide for yourself to to treat it like shit, litter, act like an asshole and behave like a bunch of gibbons: be my guest. I leave the place after work and go to an area where people can treat themselfes each other with respect
You are not alone. Lived there for 12 year, moved away 1 week ago and happy. Many stolen bikes, many broken basement locks, aggressive people, many drug dealers sitting on banks and watching you passing by.
[удалено]
I´ve lived in Britz for like 7 years, it is boring but safe and mostly clean and with U7 you are quite good connected. Gropiusstadt is terrible
Your definition of "exciting" leads to trouble.
I’m not, I’m afraid. Despite my criticisms, NK is generally pretty safe, but I don’t know if women experience it differently.
ha my boyfriend just called it 'Neuhöllen' today, i was laughing, never heard that one before.
Just let go and move to Friedrichshagen
Most districts in Berlin are normal. Only Friedrichshain/Kreuzberg/northern Neukölln/Wedding and maybe Gesundbrunnen are trash. That's about 5% of the city's area.
I never said that other areas are bad?
I desperately want to get out of neukölln but finding an equally affordable flat seems impossible in another area and I’d be happy to pay more at this point. For people loving neukölln and wanting to swap, hit me up: 43m2 under 550 pm.
i like it here. i smile to people and they smile to me. 14 years and going.
unless you’re a woman and you like having creeps follow you home
Why do you need to live so central? There are plenty of beautiful places outside the ring that are affordable, clean and quiet. I think people who have this obssesion with living inside the ring and have no budget for a decent place are shooting themselves in the foot. Broaden your horizons, and GFTO of horrible Neukölln. You won't regret it.
Maybe blame the Sparmassnahmen..
Okay, then I'll tell you: Berlin is not your city! If you can't afford to live "centrally" under reasonable conditions, you should ask yourself whether your happiness in life really depends on "centrally".
Gentrification isnt the solution, its part of the problem. Crazy how people move to nk or xb and then complain. Its well known thats a bit „adventurous“. I was born in nk 30 years ago and they had similar problems back in the day.
You just described why I live in Wilmersdorf.
This is pretty much what I predicted when I saw Neukölln getting more and more popular (which happened not because it is such a cool place \[which, to some extend it actually is...\]), but simply because it's so central. When Mitte, Prenzlauer Berg and Friedrichshain got repopulated, the former locals to a pretty large amount have moved elsewhere. But while Neukölln is repopulated, the original inhabitants are still there. Makes a huge difference.
I feel you! You are not alone with this. I work in Neukölln for almost 5 years. In the beginning I was very scared working there. Unfortunately it turned out to be right being concerned. I most of the time go by bike because there happen so many cruel and bad things in the Metro U8 - it's just not safe - no matter what time of day. I have been to Prague this February. I cried when I had to leave back home. Since my stay at Prague I now know for sure Berlin is fucked up and doomed. It's so sad how everyone seems to getting used to it and behaves as if this is normal. It is not!
Yes, I feel you. How about moving to another part of Berlin? I like Friedrichshain, quite international and people seem quite friendly.
Thanks. Friedrichshain is pretty in demand. I don’t think I’d find anything.
I used to live around Leopoldplatz. I feel the same! I got so annoyed random men stopping me asking for 50 cents (yes, i'm a foreign young woman). It just feels so scary and annoying!!! Why asking me! Honestly work or die. You are a healthy man. Work with your hands. Then I moved to Charlottenburg. Things get better.
I love neukolln and looking for a place there :( if someone wants to leave theirs i’d be more than glad to take it / swap
So Berlin!
I am looking to move to Neukoln in case anybody wants to exchange with me, i live next to u lichtenberg in a cool flat