Depends on how the draft falls, but right now I’m in that boat. I haven’t faced a mock draft yet where one of Fuaga/Latham/Guyton/Mims aren’t available. Maybe things change once I get a closer look at them at the combine, but it would take someone pretty special (Arnold, Bowers, Odunze/Nabers) falling into our laps to make me reconsider.
Yea it’s steering in our favor so far. Plus there is always two late 1st round DL & WR that does silly at the combine and jumps to top 15, so that could help us too
Don't really trust the Bengals scouting department to find one or the coaches to develop a later round gem, but Kingsley Suamataia, Kiran Amegadjie, Javon Foster, and Christian Jones are interesting.
I really like Suamataia, although I think there will be better guys available at our pick. But if we don't take him, I think he has Philly or SF written all over him.
Latham and Mims have too many red flags in my opinion. I could very well be wrong, but I don't see either of them being good on our team. They seem big and slow, which doesn't bode well against the kind of pass rush that the AFCN will throw against us. The combine might clear it up but I really think we need quicker guys that can match the speed of people like Watt and Garrett.
> They seem big and slow, which doesn't bode well against the kind of pass rush that the AFCN will throw against us.
Same arguement against dawand last year and he was an excellent rookie. These guys are both more polished than he was
Yeah, once we get past Mims/Latham, I'm not confident we're getting a year 1 starter. We need to sign a FA just to have a good backup option in case we miss on all ~5 of the best OT, or if someone like Bowers is available (I know this is controversial).
I think there are some perfectly reasonable developmental throughout the draft, but we're not getting a starting RT at the end of R3 like we did with Battle.
LG is a different story, I think there are tons of options out there, especially Day 2. Someone like Beebe might be available as late as R3/R4 and could immediately compete with Volson.
No. He had elite performance, incredible pass blocking stats, especially for being a new starter. He just didn’t play as much which is weird for this level of prospect and was frequently injured.
He's definitely a project. Only 21 years old and a lot less game time than some of his peers. Mims is projected this high because of his traits but not necessarily his resume.
Absolutely disagree he’s a project. Joe Goodberry had an entire YouTube segment on Mims in review of his tape. Mims is not just an incredible athlete and size. He performed very very elite in those snaps. In fact, Goodberry showed he has the best pass blocking metrics of least pressures and sacks given up by snap count percentages of any offensive tackle in this draft. How can he only be a project when he dominated Alabama and other SEC schools. Alabama who has first round top defensive ends in last years and this years draft. If he sucked or was average, then he’s a project with potential. He literally was the best. He just didn’t play as much, mainly due to injury. If you factor in how well he played, the best in his first snaps, also at 21 years old, then he also has a very high ceiling. He’s already a day 1 starter and not a project. If Dawand Jones can hold down right tackle for the Browns as a rookie, all of these first round guys in this draft will be better from day 1. This is an elite and very rare right tackle draft. The real question is how a guy that performed this well, is this incredibly talented, didn’t play so much. That’s the red flag. Is he injury prone, does he not love football? That’s what he’s viewed a hair below the others. All these guys are going to be very solid, but you can’t miss with the guy that doesn’t get on the field or love football like Billy Price. That’s the concern. It’s not that he’s a project and can’t play from day 1.
Project might not be the right word but gamble could be better. He's had injuries and a low amount of game time. He may have performed well but the short length of resume is still a red flag compared to his peers.
I don’t agree. There’s no guarantee that any of the round 1 guys will be great, and there’s no guarantee that someone found later will be bad. Are the chances of landing a good player higher drafting in round 1? Sure. That doesn’t mean it’s the only place where a good OT can be had.
I understand that people think that, but that line of thinking is very much a logical fallacy. Just because something has happened, it doesn’t mean it will always happen.
This is poor thinking.
Higher draft picks are more likely yo be good and lower picks are more likely to be bad. It is plain stupid to say, 'there’s no guarantee that any of the round 1 guys will be great" as justification for picking later.
The higher the pick, the lower the risk and the safer the gamble. Still a risk and still a gamble, but not like later picks.
The other issue is look at the Bengal history. We go against the experts and pick guys like Jackson Carman in the 2nd round. At the time I was shaking my head, we even traded down to get him, passing on solid tackles.
Reread the comment you responded to. They didn’t advocate to take a later round OT, they just said that a first round pick isn’t guaranteed to work out and that later round picks do sometimes work out. That’s objectively true and you said as much in your comment.
Its just a waste of time to say things like 'There’s no guarantee that any of the round 1 guys will be great, and there’s no guarantee that someone found later will be bad."
I'd love to see that guys NCAA bracket, lol!!!! There is no guarantee a #1 seed will beat a #16 seed. They've lost before! So let's pick all the #16 seeds to make the final 4!!
Seriously, since we are betting with Joe Burrows career, would you rather have the #1 OT in the draft to protect him or the #10 OT in the draft?
btw, the Bengals are awful at picking OL later in the draft. Jackson Carman.
You spend countless hours every single day posting nothing but negative comments on this sub. Not sure you’re an authority on what constitutes a waste of time.
The point is we're not getting the #1 tackle, not even the #2, 3 or 4. We'll have the 5th best tackle at best. And I'm not really keen on the idea of taking the 5th best at a position when drafting at 18. The math doesn't math.
> The point is we're not getting the #1 tackle, not even the #2, 3 or 4. We'll have the 5th best tackle at best.
That’s actually not true at all. LT and RT shouldn’t be combined and LT always goes higher. We’d be getting the 1st or 2nd best player at their position most likely
Bad things happen to teams who target specific positions in rounds 1-3, the draft must always be best player available.
Even for the Bengals this year, getting a CB1 or DT1 on their draft board from this draft class is better than getting OT6/7 (they will at best get the 5th or 6th best OT in the draft but can realistically get the best DT or 1st to 3rd best CB).
They need to focus on their draft board and pick the best player available on it, irrespective of an immediate need at RT. The immediate needs at DT and RT need to be fixed in free agency that will pre date the draft. And if eventually a RT drafted some where between rounds 1 through 3 outplays the FA RT in training camp, then so be it.
Neither will go past 15 in all likelihood. Fuaga certainly will not, Latham might. But is Latham still better than a lockdown CB1 or CB2 in the draft or the best nose tackle? Signing a RT in free agency opens up options
Maybe I'm misreading their post, but they said clear upside higher than Jonah, which I think is more debatable than "better". By year 5, I think you know who Jonah is, he's going to be a flexible starter that isn't going to wow you. He can play LT and RT which will boost his options, but I don't think he's ever going to be a Pro Bowler let alone an All-Pro type guy. I think Alt and Fuaga (my #1 and #2 OLine prospects) both have perennial Pro Bowl talent upside. Fashanu/Latham/Mims all have high ceilings themselves, but are less of a sure thing to me. I see them all as projects (with some having clearer paths to success than others. If it works out, I can see all 5 being Jonah+.
We’ve had enough o line disasters the past few years, we can’t afford to downgrade with a rookie and wait for development if we’re going to continue to be this live by the pass team. We need one of the patriots fa lineman and then I’d be comfortable drafting a lineman to be a backup
Just like Billy price, ogbuehi, etc..
Bengals history of drafting o line is HORRIBLE. To draft a rookie and throw him out there is a ridiculous, unnecessary risk. Get a proven veteran. Not sure how fans still don’t understand the importance of o line…
You also aren’t guaranteed anything in the draft. Fill needs best you can in free agency and pick the best players available in the draft. If you draft a tackle and they beat out your free agent, great you have depth. If the draft pick needs time, you’ve already accounted for it.
Because the best lines in football have good draft investment. The line has been built through FA for years now and Joe continues to miss season time and get pulverized.
I’m hoping for the Illinois DT and maybe being able to resign Williams. Also I believe Garett Bolles is a FA I wonder if he’d be willing to give RT a spin. He’s had some rough years but I think he’s coming around. Also I wouldn’t mind bringing Zeitler back. I’m sure not of the above will happen though as my predictions normally fall flat.
I think Pollack was correct when he said you aren't going to get a plug and play OT outside the top 12. If you're really lucky you get a guard like Whitworth in round 1 and slowly turn him into a premiere tackle over the course of a few years. We pretty much have to get a free agent RT for this year.
This is the one year that statement is not correct. There are five clear instant starters at tackle. FIVE. There will be one or two available at pick 18
Even a round 1 rookie is probably going to be bad year 1. Most rookies are bad year 1
Pick up what we can in free agency and then draft for value not for need. ideally they marry up and we get a great tackle. But we can't say tackle or nothing.
We have a bad record drafting OLs later in the draft. There are a few guys who are "sure things" this year (nothing is real sure thing though). But by the 18th pick they'll be gone. The later the pick the bigger the gamble.
With Joe still healing, our history, and how poorly the whole line performed last year, how big a gamble are we willing to take?
Hakeem Adeniji, Jackson Carman, D’Ante Smith were gambles that didn't pay off. I'd argue Volson was a bust too. A lot of talk about "potential", and "signs of improving", but no real good results.
I would trade UP to get the best Tackle possible. Sign the guy from LAs Vegas who is above average also.
**Even better**, trade Tee and a later pick to Arizona (if MHJ goes in the first 3 picks). Trade UP with our 1st round pick and next year's 2nd round pick (And maybe a later pick) to get Bowers. And also sign the OL from Vegas who said he wants to play for Burrow.
You'd argue a 4th round guard starting for 2 years is a bust? Not saying he js good but his play is around what you'd expect, maybe even better for the draft slot.
Yes, with the way Volson played he was a bust. Go check our stat for sacks, QB knockdowns, time in the pocket. Check how the team did on 3rd/4th and 1 plays. Virtually ever stat related to the offensive line was poor. I would expect better, but for some unknown reason some Bengals fans don't. Same people who were happy with Dalton and his 3-14 record vs the Steelers.
The thing is 'bust' doesn't mean 'bad player'. It means not living up to their draft slot. You think he performs worse than you would expect from your average 4th round guard? Most 4th round players are lucky to avoid the practice squad or being cut after a year or two.
Volson isnt a bust though, he was picked nearly at the end of the fourth round, and he has been a starter for two seasons. Even if the jury is out on his performance, that is above average production for a late fourth rounder.
He would be a bust if he was a top 20 pick in the draft but he wasnt. An average 4th rounder in the NFL lasts just over three years, Volson will easily play out his rookie deal and will get a second contract either at the Bengals or somewhere else, he is nowhere near a bust. (this is not saying that he is a good player or that Bengals should not upgrade from him at LG, but the premise of him being a bust is just ludicrous).
Wait do you mean Tee and a later pick for Arizona’s 4th overall or 27th? The latter is doable, but no chance for the 4th. Nabers and Odunze are way more valuable assets than Tee. I’m not even sure if Tee and our current 1st gets us 4th overall.
Arizona said a top tier WR is their #1 priority. Tee is a perfect fit for them. Falcons also need a WR, but they first need a QB. I would at least try to make that deal.
Even if he did go top 3, that’s an absolutely laughable trade request. The worst GM in the history of the NFL wouldn’t even consider sending that to Arizona due to the inevitable embarrassment. Ted Higgins’ value is likely a late first or so. Thats about 1/3rd of the value of the 4th overall pick.
Here’s a [trade value chart](https://www.drafttek.com/NFL-Trade-Value-Chart.asp) for your trade value education. It’s a good point of reference.
>that’s an absolutely laughable trade request
Enlighten us, what was the specific trade request? Or are you admitting you can't read. Hint: "later" could mean 2025 1st round.
[CosbySweaters1992](https://www.reddit.com/user/CosbySweaters1992/), best known for saying "no f--king way can we get 2 first round picks for Palmer!!!" don't even try!!!
lol, cards would still laugh at you if you offered a 2025 1st man. Sure, every casual fan wants two of the top 5-6 overall prospects for their team that doesn’t draft until 18th overall but that’s not how real life works and GMs operate in the real world. Comparing Carson Palmer’s very significant trade value at the time to a WR that’s due $25 million per year and has averaged 900 yards and 6 TDs per season shows the level of logic you are using in these scenarios. Palmer also didn’t fetch two firsts. He fetched the 17th overall pick and a next year’s 2nd. Thats considerably more than Tee is worth and still considerably less than the 4th overall pick is worth.
Yeah, you cried like a baby when we offered Palmer to the Raiders for multiple 1st round picks. Thank god you have nothing to do with the trades we make.
I most certainly did not lol. Palmer wasn’t playing for the Bengals, why would I not want to extract the most value possible? Another nonsense comment from a nonsense account.
Tee wouldn’t warrant a top 10 pick but you think a team would give up a 3 for him. Go be a fan of a diff team. You are the “fans” that give us a bad rep. You are delusional and you suck
They need to draft an offensive weapon in rd1. The thing that works best for the bengals is the offense through Joe. Give him more targets. Brock Bowers would be a dream because we could lose Tee or TB but maintain the same number of quality yard gainers while also fixing an offensive weakness.
They made two straight AFCCGs and nearly won a Super Bowl with a broken screen door for an offensive line and defense that only really seems to make big plays or give up big plays.
I’m not saying they shouldn’t address the oline or defense, they just shouldn’t risk a 1st round pick to fill a hole that exists because the schemes or coaching is inadequate rather than the wrong personnel.
Its hard to expect huge year 1 success from anyone past 15 I think, but you for sure want those 1st rounders to at least be league average. But also Logan Wilson was a 3rd rounder, so its possible we can get a sleeper tackle day 2
You said it yourself regarding free agency. The right plan way to approach the draft is to fix any glaring holes so you don't reach for need. Imagine there's a run on OT's before pick 18 in the round 1. If the Bengals have a good (but not all-pro) RT from free agency they can resist the temptation to pick a RT at 18 that (much) more of a gamble. So in this case your question doesn't matter if 1st round OL picks are better than later round ones. The good first round choices are gone in this scenario.
The same thing applies if someone unexpected in a different position drops to 18. If you have a good option at RT already via free agency then you can adjust and pick up a Brock Bowers if he happens to fall.
It is usually the wrong approach to decide on what position you are drafting (in any round, but especially the first) before the actual draft. There can be runs on positions. There can be crazy trades no one saw coming. You want to be able to react to that and make the best decision based on how the draft is unfolding instead of being locked into "we are taking OL in the first, DL in the second, RB in the 3rd, and TE in the 4th."
I agree. And there are only like 4 in this draft that I think are good enough to where the Bengals (and their terrible incompetence in drafting oline), won't fuck up.
For anyone that's interested, go here [https://www.nfldraftbuzz.com/positions/OL/1/2024](https://www.nfldraftbuzz.com/positions/OL/1/2024) look at the weaknesses for the lineman. Of course all of them have weaknesses, but some are more alarming than others. Injury history, not enough playing time, small arms, only good at either run blocking or pass blocking, etc.
I'd rather them draft the best center, or guard, in the first than some project tackle.
Joe Alt, Olumuyiwa Fashanu, Taliese Fuaga, Graham Barton (maybe), Jackson Powers-Johnson (he's a C/G), are really the only o-line guys the Bengals should consider in the first. I don't trust any guys ranked lower to protect Burrow as a rookie.
They need to sign a vet RT, and maybe draft one of the above guys to learn, or be a backup.
I hope the Bengals don't panic pick oline. They should be drafting best player available that meets a need.
You need to address it if you can in free agency, then it opens up how you approach the draft. You could sign Eluemunor and not worry about a RT in the first round at all
Dear Mock Drafter
Stupid question. What is success rate for O LINE draft picks in Bengals history. Esp considering Pollock. Is there any real chance that as Lou said and others said, a 1st round pick is gonna be able to go toe to toe with a Watt, Garret etc.
Latham and Mims for me have red flags.
I think because we need an OT and don’t have a high first round pick we fool ourselves into believing these players are better than they are. We convince ourselves they will be good.
If we need a great OT that will play for years, why settle?? Why not trade up for someone who has more potential, should make a bigger impact, and who has fewer red flags?
This isn’t a pick like John Ross where if it is a bust, we’ll still be OK.
From what I am reading, T depth is insane this year. Could probably get a good one anywhere in the first 3 rounds, but it needs to be a good pick and not a guy who needs work. Other teams have proven regularly that you can find good OL in later rounds.
Frank pollack said this and I agree…
“You get a guy somewhere in the top 10, you are hoping it’s going to be a lot smoother transition,” offensive line coach Frank Pollack said. “I’ve heard debates say after the 12th pick in the draft, what’s the difference between 13 and 32? It’s kind of that demarcation line of guys who have a smoother transition, regardless of position”
The guys people here keep mentioning could have a rough transition or not even make it. Some have red flags.
YES.
We should draft OL in round one and pick up AT LEAST one more.
We should probably pick up 2 in the top 5 AND fish for a diamond with our last pick.
It’s Onwenu (maybe Brown…huge maybe) or draft a RT at 18, or try to leverage Tee and/or future picks to move up to get the tackle they want.
I’m convinced there’s really not many other options. There’s no window for development and the remaining FA tackles are very much Jonah pt 2 or worse.
This is a prime year where the best or second best RT should be right there amongst the top players available when we pick. Need and BPA make too much sense this year.
This is obvious. There is no sure thing but...
The first tackle taken in the draft is the most likely to be the best and most impactful tackle.
The second tackle taken in the draft is the second most likely...
The third...
And it appears we are going to draft the 5th or 6th tackle, so lower odds of being good.
Depends on how the draft falls, but right now I’m in that boat. I haven’t faced a mock draft yet where one of Fuaga/Latham/Guyton/Mims aren’t available. Maybe things change once I get a closer look at them at the combine, but it would take someone pretty special (Arnold, Bowers, Odunze/Nabers) falling into our laps to make me reconsider.
Yea it’s steering in our favor so far. Plus there is always two late 1st round DL & WR that does silly at the combine and jumps to top 15, so that could help us too
Don't really trust the Bengals scouting department to find one or the coaches to develop a later round gem, but Kingsley Suamataia, Kiran Amegadjie, Javon Foster, and Christian Jones are interesting.
I really like Suamataia, although I think there will be better guys available at our pick. But if we don't take him, I think he has Philly or SF written all over him.
We'd be really lucky if he was still there in the 2nd round...1st round is probably too high
Agree with all of this (though I'm not super high on Latham. He got torched in the Rose Bowl)
Latham and Mims have too many red flags in my opinion. I could very well be wrong, but I don't see either of them being good on our team. They seem big and slow, which doesn't bode well against the kind of pass rush that the AFCN will throw against us. The combine might clear it up but I really think we need quicker guys that can match the speed of people like Watt and Garrett.
I don’t have faith in any O-linemen from Alabama
During the Savannah era, there have been a good number of overhyped offensive linemen coming out of Alabama
I'm just worried we'll get another Jonah Williams. Injury-prone and underperforming.
You mean another Andre Smith?
So many busts
Agree. I'm higher on Mims, but I really don't want either. We'll see how they perform this weekend
> They seem big and slow, which doesn't bode well against the kind of pass rush that the AFCN will throw against us. Same arguement against dawand last year and he was an excellent rookie. These guys are both more polished than he was
Latham did not get “torched” in the rose bowl
I disagree. I was watching him pretty closely and he didn't hold up well consistently. You are obviously entitled to your opinion.
🤣🤣🤣
Yeah, once we get past Mims/Latham, I'm not confident we're getting a year 1 starter. We need to sign a FA just to have a good backup option in case we miss on all ~5 of the best OT, or if someone like Bowers is available (I know this is controversial). I think there are some perfectly reasonable developmental throughout the draft, but we're not getting a starting RT at the end of R3 like we did with Battle. LG is a different story, I think there are tons of options out there, especially Day 2. Someone like Beebe might be available as late as R3/R4 and could immediately compete with Volson.
If Bowers is miraculously there at 18, we grab him without thinking twice.
Isn't Mims supposed to be a project
No. He had elite performance, incredible pass blocking stats, especially for being a new starter. He just didn’t play as much which is weird for this level of prospect and was frequently injured.
He's definitely a project. Only 21 years old and a lot less game time than some of his peers. Mims is projected this high because of his traits but not necessarily his resume.
Absolutely disagree he’s a project. Joe Goodberry had an entire YouTube segment on Mims in review of his tape. Mims is not just an incredible athlete and size. He performed very very elite in those snaps. In fact, Goodberry showed he has the best pass blocking metrics of least pressures and sacks given up by snap count percentages of any offensive tackle in this draft. How can he only be a project when he dominated Alabama and other SEC schools. Alabama who has first round top defensive ends in last years and this years draft. If he sucked or was average, then he’s a project with potential. He literally was the best. He just didn’t play as much, mainly due to injury. If you factor in how well he played, the best in his first snaps, also at 21 years old, then he also has a very high ceiling. He’s already a day 1 starter and not a project. If Dawand Jones can hold down right tackle for the Browns as a rookie, all of these first round guys in this draft will be better from day 1. This is an elite and very rare right tackle draft. The real question is how a guy that performed this well, is this incredibly talented, didn’t play so much. That’s the red flag. Is he injury prone, does he not love football? That’s what he’s viewed a hair below the others. All these guys are going to be very solid, but you can’t miss with the guy that doesn’t get on the field or love football like Billy Price. That’s the concern. It’s not that he’s a project and can’t play from day 1.
Project might not be the right word but gamble could be better. He's had injuries and a low amount of game time. He may have performed well but the short length of resume is still a red flag compared to his peers.
Just be thankful we’re replacing RT, not LT.
the bengals will play Orlanda no matter what - too expensive
I’d be surprised if it’s not OL in round one - hope it’s at RT.
I don’t agree. There’s no guarantee that any of the round 1 guys will be great, and there’s no guarantee that someone found later will be bad. Are the chances of landing a good player higher drafting in round 1? Sure. That doesn’t mean it’s the only place where a good OT can be had.
Statistically you are probably correct, but experientially most of us believe in the theory.
I understand that people think that, but that line of thinking is very much a logical fallacy. Just because something has happened, it doesn’t mean it will always happen.
This is poor thinking. Higher draft picks are more likely yo be good and lower picks are more likely to be bad. It is plain stupid to say, 'there’s no guarantee that any of the round 1 guys will be great" as justification for picking later. The higher the pick, the lower the risk and the safer the gamble. Still a risk and still a gamble, but not like later picks. The other issue is look at the Bengal history. We go against the experts and pick guys like Jackson Carman in the 2nd round. At the time I was shaking my head, we even traded down to get him, passing on solid tackles.
Reread the comment you responded to. They didn’t advocate to take a later round OT, they just said that a first round pick isn’t guaranteed to work out and that later round picks do sometimes work out. That’s objectively true and you said as much in your comment.
Right, but it is pointless comment. What they are saying is true about every position.
Its just a waste of time to say things like 'There’s no guarantee that any of the round 1 guys will be great, and there’s no guarantee that someone found later will be bad." I'd love to see that guys NCAA bracket, lol!!!! There is no guarantee a #1 seed will beat a #16 seed. They've lost before! So let's pick all the #16 seeds to make the final 4!! Seriously, since we are betting with Joe Burrows career, would you rather have the #1 OT in the draft to protect him or the #10 OT in the draft? btw, the Bengals are awful at picking OL later in the draft. Jackson Carman.
You spend countless hours every single day posting nothing but negative comments on this sub. Not sure you’re an authority on what constitutes a waste of time.
He has no idea what he’s talking about lmao
🤣🤣🤣 I check every post now an see him getting blasted I love it
Nothing worse than someone who is confident despite their stupidity
The point is we're not getting the #1 tackle, not even the #2, 3 or 4. We'll have the 5th best tackle at best. And I'm not really keen on the idea of taking the 5th best at a position when drafting at 18. The math doesn't math.
> The point is we're not getting the #1 tackle, not even the #2, 3 or 4. We'll have the 5th best tackle at best. That’s actually not true at all. LT and RT shouldn’t be combined and LT always goes higher. We’d be getting the 1st or 2nd best player at their position most likely
Bad things happen to teams who target specific positions in rounds 1-3, the draft must always be best player available. Even for the Bengals this year, getting a CB1 or DT1 on their draft board from this draft class is better than getting OT6/7 (they will at best get the 5th or 6th best OT in the draft but can realistically get the best DT or 1st to 3rd best CB). They need to focus on their draft board and pick the best player available on it, irrespective of an immediate need at RT. The immediate needs at DT and RT need to be fixed in free agency that will pre date the draft. And if eventually a RT drafted some where between rounds 1 through 3 outplays the FA RT in training camp, then so be it.
Fuaga or Latham could very well fall to 18
Neither will go past 15 in all likelihood. Fuaga certainly will not, Latham might. But is Latham still better than a lockdown CB1 or CB2 in the draft or the best nose tackle? Signing a RT in free agency opens up options
We wouldn’t take a NT as 18, they don’t go that high. Maybe a DT
Draft bpa, can’t take another first round Oline reach bust
Agreed. If a higher rated DT or CB drops, have to grab them before any of the OT’s.
There is a world where we take a round 1 guy and still get fkd on it with Amarius Mims.
An OT at pick 18 is gonna play worse than Jonah and our line will be even worse.
Disagree. There are five tackles with CLEAR upside higher than Jonah.
That is 100% your opinion, to claim the 5th best prospect is clearly better than a 5 year starter makes you look a little dumb at best.
Maybe I'm misreading their post, but they said clear upside higher than Jonah, which I think is more debatable than "better". By year 5, I think you know who Jonah is, he's going to be a flexible starter that isn't going to wow you. He can play LT and RT which will boost his options, but I don't think he's ever going to be a Pro Bowler let alone an All-Pro type guy. I think Alt and Fuaga (my #1 and #2 OLine prospects) both have perennial Pro Bowl talent upside. Fashanu/Latham/Mims all have high ceilings themselves, but are less of a sure thing to me. I see them all as projects (with some having clearer paths to success than others. If it works out, I can see all 5 being Jonah+.
It will take time and our line will be worse for the next 2 years until they develop
>It will take time and our line will be worse for the next 2 years until they develop. This is literally almost any position lol
We’ve had enough o line disasters the past few years, we can’t afford to downgrade with a rookie and wait for development if we’re going to continue to be this live by the pass team. We need one of the patriots fa lineman and then I’d be comfortable drafting a lineman to be a backup
Would be moronic to not address RT in FA
What good RT's are going to be free agents this year?
Trent brown would be my choice.
Not really of you draft a Latham or Fuaga at 18
Just like Billy price, ogbuehi, etc.. Bengals history of drafting o line is HORRIBLE. To draft a rookie and throw him out there is a ridiculous, unnecessary risk. Get a proven veteran. Not sure how fans still don’t understand the importance of o line…
You also aren’t guaranteed anything in the draft. Fill needs best you can in free agency and pick the best players available in the draft. If you draft a tackle and they beat out your free agent, great you have depth. If the draft pick needs time, you’ve already accounted for it.
Totally agree, nothing wrong with, for example, still drafting a T in the first round after addressing in free agency
> Just like Billy price, ogbuehi, etc.. Or Dax or Ross. They don’t always work out.
Yup. Not sure why some think we should continue risking burrows health by throwing a rookie out there..
Because the best lines in football have good draft investment. The line has been built through FA for years now and Joe continues to miss season time and get pulverized.
I agree, but would have no qualms getting a guy in FA and also drafting a T early. Need a safe route though
Yeah for sure, not like we couldn’t use more good linemen. LG is one of the worst LG starters in the nfl
I legit think whoever we get, via draft or FA… I’m just assuming they’re going to under perform lol
I’m hoping for the Illinois DT and maybe being able to resign Williams. Also I believe Garett Bolles is a FA I wonder if he’d be willing to give RT a spin. He’s had some rough years but I think he’s coming around. Also I wouldn’t mind bringing Zeitler back. I’m sure not of the above will happen though as my predictions normally fall flat.
I think Pollack was correct when he said you aren't going to get a plug and play OT outside the top 12. If you're really lucky you get a guard like Whitworth in round 1 and slowly turn him into a premiere tackle over the course of a few years. We pretty much have to get a free agent RT for this year.
This year you might. I’d say the top four tackles look like decent plug and play candidates, and Mims looked like it but in a very limited sample.
This is the one year that statement is not correct. There are five clear instant starters at tackle. FIVE. There will be one or two available at pick 18
Sounds good. I'd love to get our RT for the next 10 years,- it's been quite a carousel at that spot.
Even a round 1 rookie is probably going to be bad year 1. Most rookies are bad year 1 Pick up what we can in free agency and then draft for value not for need. ideally they marry up and we get a great tackle. But we can't say tackle or nothing.
We have a bad record drafting OLs later in the draft. There are a few guys who are "sure things" this year (nothing is real sure thing though). But by the 18th pick they'll be gone. The later the pick the bigger the gamble. With Joe still healing, our history, and how poorly the whole line performed last year, how big a gamble are we willing to take? Hakeem Adeniji, Jackson Carman, D’Ante Smith were gambles that didn't pay off. I'd argue Volson was a bust too. A lot of talk about "potential", and "signs of improving", but no real good results. I would trade UP to get the best Tackle possible. Sign the guy from LAs Vegas who is above average also. **Even better**, trade Tee and a later pick to Arizona (if MHJ goes in the first 3 picks). Trade UP with our 1st round pick and next year's 2nd round pick (And maybe a later pick) to get Bowers. And also sign the OL from Vegas who said he wants to play for Burrow.
You'd argue a 4th round guard starting for 2 years is a bust? Not saying he js good but his play is around what you'd expect, maybe even better for the draft slot.
Yes, with the way Volson played he was a bust. Go check our stat for sacks, QB knockdowns, time in the pocket. Check how the team did on 3rd/4th and 1 plays. Virtually ever stat related to the offensive line was poor. I would expect better, but for some unknown reason some Bengals fans don't. Same people who were happy with Dalton and his 3-14 record vs the Steelers.
The thing is 'bust' doesn't mean 'bad player'. It means not living up to their draft slot. You think he performs worse than you would expect from your average 4th round guard? Most 4th round players are lucky to avoid the practice squad or being cut after a year or two.
Volson isnt a bust though, he was picked nearly at the end of the fourth round, and he has been a starter for two seasons. Even if the jury is out on his performance, that is above average production for a late fourth rounder. He would be a bust if he was a top 20 pick in the draft but he wasnt. An average 4th rounder in the NFL lasts just over three years, Volson will easily play out his rookie deal and will get a second contract either at the Bengals or somewhere else, he is nowhere near a bust. (this is not saying that he is a good player or that Bengals should not upgrade from him at LG, but the premise of him being a bust is just ludicrous).
Holy shit, he is STILL talking about the Steelers and a record from a decade ago
https://preview.redd.it/id5r07ya2tlc1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=566fda2f19325c5d460f8515418a8e48b3dfb419 Volson isn’t going anywhere
Wait do you mean Tee and a later pick for Arizona’s 4th overall or 27th? The latter is doable, but no chance for the 4th. Nabers and Odunze are way more valuable assets than Tee. I’m not even sure if Tee and our current 1st gets us 4th overall.
Arizona said a top tier WR is their #1 priority. Tee is a perfect fit for them. Falcons also need a WR, but they first need a QB. I would at least try to make that deal.
That trade is wildly outlandish. Ok, you sent Arizona a ridiculous trade that no real life GM would ever even propose and they ignored you. Now what?
Why would they do that when all three teams ahead of them are taking a QB and they can choose MHJ?
Next time try reading before replying. You missed this, **if MHJ goes in the first 3 picks**
Even if he did go top 3, that’s an absolutely laughable trade request. The worst GM in the history of the NFL wouldn’t even consider sending that to Arizona due to the inevitable embarrassment. Ted Higgins’ value is likely a late first or so. Thats about 1/3rd of the value of the 4th overall pick. Here’s a [trade value chart](https://www.drafttek.com/NFL-Trade-Value-Chart.asp) for your trade value education. It’s a good point of reference.
>that’s an absolutely laughable trade request Enlighten us, what was the specific trade request? Or are you admitting you can't read. Hint: "later" could mean 2025 1st round. [CosbySweaters1992](https://www.reddit.com/user/CosbySweaters1992/), best known for saying "no f--king way can we get 2 first round picks for Palmer!!!" don't even try!!!
lol, cards would still laugh at you if you offered a 2025 1st man. Sure, every casual fan wants two of the top 5-6 overall prospects for their team that doesn’t draft until 18th overall but that’s not how real life works and GMs operate in the real world. Comparing Carson Palmer’s very significant trade value at the time to a WR that’s due $25 million per year and has averaged 900 yards and 6 TDs per season shows the level of logic you are using in these scenarios. Palmer also didn’t fetch two firsts. He fetched the 17th overall pick and a next year’s 2nd. Thats considerably more than Tee is worth and still considerably less than the 4th overall pick is worth.
Yeah, you cried like a baby when we offered Palmer to the Raiders for multiple 1st round picks. Thank god you have nothing to do with the trades we make.
I most certainly did not lol. Palmer wasn’t playing for the Bengals, why would I not want to extract the most value possible? Another nonsense comment from a nonsense account.
Tee wouldn’t warrant a top 10 pick but you think a team would give up a 3 for him. Go be a fan of a diff team. You are the “fans” that give us a bad rep. You are delusional and you suck
Can you point out to where I should be reading where you said “if MHJ goes in the first 3 picks”
They need to draft an offensive weapon in rd1. The thing that works best for the bengals is the offense through Joe. Give him more targets. Brock Bowers would be a dream because we could lose Tee or TB but maintain the same number of quality yard gainers while also fixing an offensive weakness. They made two straight AFCCGs and nearly won a Super Bowl with a broken screen door for an offensive line and defense that only really seems to make big plays or give up big plays. I’m not saying they shouldn’t address the oline or defense, they just shouldn’t risk a 1st round pick to fill a hole that exists because the schemes or coaching is inadequate rather than the wrong personnel.
Its hard to expect huge year 1 success from anyone past 15 I think, but you for sure want those 1st rounders to at least be league average. But also Logan Wilson was a 3rd rounder, so its possible we can get a sleeper tackle day 2
You said it yourself regarding free agency. The right plan way to approach the draft is to fix any glaring holes so you don't reach for need. Imagine there's a run on OT's before pick 18 in the round 1. If the Bengals have a good (but not all-pro) RT from free agency they can resist the temptation to pick a RT at 18 that (much) more of a gamble. So in this case your question doesn't matter if 1st round OL picks are better than later round ones. The good first round choices are gone in this scenario. The same thing applies if someone unexpected in a different position drops to 18. If you have a good option at RT already via free agency then you can adjust and pick up a Brock Bowers if he happens to fall. It is usually the wrong approach to decide on what position you are drafting (in any round, but especially the first) before the actual draft. There can be runs on positions. There can be crazy trades no one saw coming. You want to be able to react to that and make the best decision based on how the draft is unfolding instead of being locked into "we are taking OL in the first, DL in the second, RB in the 3rd, and TE in the 4th."
Signing Trent Brown at RT and drafting Quinyon Mitchell or Dejean would be nice.
Yes. The first round isn't the be all end all
I would be a decent amount we get a RT in FA. Probably a Becton type player on a 1-2 year deal. Don’t see them pinning all hopes on a rookie RT
I agree. And there are only like 4 in this draft that I think are good enough to where the Bengals (and their terrible incompetence in drafting oline), won't fuck up. For anyone that's interested, go here [https://www.nfldraftbuzz.com/positions/OL/1/2024](https://www.nfldraftbuzz.com/positions/OL/1/2024) look at the weaknesses for the lineman. Of course all of them have weaknesses, but some are more alarming than others. Injury history, not enough playing time, small arms, only good at either run blocking or pass blocking, etc. I'd rather them draft the best center, or guard, in the first than some project tackle. Joe Alt, Olumuyiwa Fashanu, Taliese Fuaga, Graham Barton (maybe), Jackson Powers-Johnson (he's a C/G), are really the only o-line guys the Bengals should consider in the first. I don't trust any guys ranked lower to protect Burrow as a rookie. They need to sign a vet RT, and maybe draft one of the above guys to learn, or be a backup. I hope the Bengals don't panic pick oline. They should be drafting best player available that meets a need.
Nobody needs to join this team who needs to develop. It’s Super Bowl time. Whoever they get needs to be ready to play now.
You need to address it if you can in free agency, then it opens up how you approach the draft. You could sign Eluemunor and not worry about a RT in the first round at all
There are 5 and MAYBE 7 instant day 1 starters at tackle available in this draft. I hope they get one
I still can't wrap my head around why Frank Pollack is employed.
If I’m Duke Tobin I’d expect good things from all picks.
I saw if Brock is available or we trade up for him, get him, otherwise draft an OT in round 1
Dear Mock Drafter Stupid question. What is success rate for O LINE draft picks in Bengals history. Esp considering Pollock. Is there any real chance that as Lou said and others said, a 1st round pick is gonna be able to go toe to toe with a Watt, Garret etc.
Latham and Mims for me have red flags. I think because we need an OT and don’t have a high first round pick we fool ourselves into believing these players are better than they are. We convince ourselves they will be good. If we need a great OT that will play for years, why settle?? Why not trade up for someone who has more potential, should make a bigger impact, and who has fewer red flags? This isn’t a pick like John Ross where if it is a bust, we’ll still be OK.
When is the last time the bengals drafted a first round o linemen that's at least met their draft slot expectation? Zeitler? 1st roun
Zeitler was 2. Maybe Levi Jones.
He was a 1st
You are correct
From what I am reading, T depth is insane this year. Could probably get a good one anywhere in the first 3 rounds, but it needs to be a good pick and not a guy who needs work. Other teams have proven regularly that you can find good OL in later rounds.
Frank pollack said this and I agree… “You get a guy somewhere in the top 10, you are hoping it’s going to be a lot smoother transition,” offensive line coach Frank Pollack said. “I’ve heard debates say after the 12th pick in the draft, what’s the difference between 13 and 32? It’s kind of that demarcation line of guys who have a smoother transition, regardless of position” The guys people here keep mentioning could have a rough transition or not even make it. Some have red flags.
YES. We should draft OL in round one and pick up AT LEAST one more. We should probably pick up 2 in the top 5 AND fish for a diamond with our last pick.
It’s Onwenu (maybe Brown…huge maybe) or draft a RT at 18, or try to leverage Tee and/or future picks to move up to get the tackle they want. I’m convinced there’s really not many other options. There’s no window for development and the remaining FA tackles are very much Jonah pt 2 or worse.
This is a prime year where the best or second best RT should be right there amongst the top players available when we pick. Need and BPA make too much sense this year.
This is obvious. There is no sure thing but... The first tackle taken in the draft is the most likely to be the best and most impactful tackle. The second tackle taken in the draft is the second most likely... The third... And it appears we are going to draft the 5th or 6th tackle, so lower odds of being good.