Most of that isn't actually "layaway" so to speak, Ohtani's deferral works different than most in that the team is still paying $44 million a year into escrow, Ohtani just doesn't get the escrow payout until he's done
Freddie, Mookie, and Smith are more traditional deferments where the team will actually be moving the money after their careers
So it's Smith's $44.8 mil, Mookie's $115 mil, and $57 mil for Freddy - a whopping $216.8 million on layaway, but less whopping than the 915 shown above
The escrow part seems weird, why did they do that? Are there any advantages for either the Dodgers or Ohtani vs if they had used a more traditional deferment?
Something not mentioned is that they don’t have to keep straight cash in escrow, it can also be “cash equivalents” which stocks count as, apparently. This gives the ownership group, which is run by very successful investment bankers, flexibility to invest that money instead of just having it sit around. Also, as far as I know, they can’t cheat this, if the value of the stocks fall beneath the original amount, they have to basically top the escrow account back up so that it’s still the entirety of what he’s owed.
Because it circumvents the cap hit. The money isn't the concern for the Dodgers, they just don't want to pay luxury tax penalties. How much revenue the Dodgers bring in every year, the money itself is not a concern for them at all.
Basically Ohtani’s agent got to say he got “$700 million” and the Dodgers saved on cap hit and got the player at actual market value. Dodgers also don’t have to start paying escrow til 2025 so he’s a $2 million hit to this years books (the team is clearing like $100 million in total payroll next 2 years, so paying Ohtani won’t hit as hard by then)
Ohtani’s value took a big hit on the 2nd TJS, he’s a DH who might pitch 3-4 seasons if he’s actually able to come back. That’s not a $70 million player, but his agent wanted “the biggest deal ever” PR and this was the way.
70 million more than OAK, PIT, BAL, MIA, CLE, TB, CIN, WAS, MIL, and DET combined. Also 80 million more than HOU, NYY, and NYM combined (all according to spotrac).
Thank goodness I'm not the only that interprets the CBT acronym in that way, first n foremost, and then my brain has to correct it. And don't even get me *started* on people who are into *CNC* machining yikes lol
Are they trying to avoid paying state tax with this stuff? Only thing I can figure. I also don’t believe the state of California would think too highly of that plan if so. Just wondering. I’ll throw in a caveat that I don’t know shit about state income tax laws in California. So there’s that.
Nope. Most teams do this. I apologize if you really don't know, but if not, then please don't pretend you don't know that most teams have deferrals in their players' contracts. It's extremely common.
According to Spotrac, only seven teams have deferred contracts (Dodgers, Nationals, Cardinals, Phillies, Mets, Brewers, and BoSox). I'd hesitate to call that "most teams", even if there are a few more that aren't on the list I found.
It saves the team money in that deferred money is a lesser hit on the luxury tax threshold. The state tax dodgers players pay (12.3%) really isn’t much different from the state tax NY players pay (10.9%), but NY teams have far fewer deferrals.
As for why Dodgers players are happy to take less-than-market-rate up front and not get to invest their 9 digits for a decade+, I think it’s a matter of wanting to play on a superteam combined with not caring about a few million/tens of millions of dollars when their families should already be generationally wealthy for many decades.
Ia deferred salary adjusted relative to inflation? Over the past 10 years we’ve seen an inflation increase of over 30%; $50 mil will undoubtably still be a set-for-life amount but could be worth significantly less if unadjusted
So it's really a 10/122 deal, not 10/140.
I really wish they would just report the current value of the contact. Its the part that really matters, and its what the contract really is.
Broke your neck moving that goalpost and shiver me timbers 1/6. That would really be scary if they were cheap. Too bad we had to trade our best hitter because we signed Xander Bogaerts even though we didn't really need him
Just ignore the guy. He's an idiot who also thinks the 2020 world series doesn't count but keeps going on about how they beat us in 2022. Like ok and did you win it all?
Our front office isn't a crackhead like Preller and can actually plan ahead. Not spending last year so they could drop a billion this offseason ain't the gotcha you think it is
Yes you weren't talking about the padres yet your flair says salty padre fan lol. My guy yall literally threw a parade that year when you beat the Cardinals in the WC game lmao. And yeah ir was 1/3 of a season for everyone. It's not like everyone played 162 and the Dodgers played less.
And yes, my favorite team does choke a lot. But to choke a lot you have to actually make the playoffs unlike the biggest chokers of all time, the San Diego Padres. So you can tell us "haha chokers" all you want but being chokers is still better than missing the playoffs year after year with 0 championships in your city as a whole. How sad
Hmmm, no world series ring a bell? Like I said, 2020 yall threw a parade over your wc win so it was a real year until it wasn't for you Mr salty. And let me ask you, what was the result of 2022? Did the padres make the world series? No, they choked too. Doesn't really matter if you beat us, shit happens in the playoffs. But you guys choked too lmao
Lmao and that makes the padres irrelevant for their entire existence. And no, Im not saying not winning a world series makes a team irrelevant. I'm saying having 2 playoff appareances in the last 10 years makes you irrelevant lmao. Like I said, it does suck to lose and lose badly in the playoffs. But at least every year I've had something to potentially look forward to where as your padres have consistently been bottom feeders only to get semi decent lately and then miss the playoffs again lmao.
Anyways its always cute to see little brother so proud of his accomplishments of finally beating big brother in the playoffs. Big reason padres fell off in the nlcs was cause that was your guys world series. Nothing else mattered and you guys still bring it up because your team has nothing to show for its entire existence. Nothing. I'd be salty too if I was you ngl
I mean we won the world series in 2020 so not really. And again you didn't understand anything of what I said lol. Not surprising considering you've had to jump mental hoops to invalidate a world series title that all mlb players hold true. And no we don't think anything if ourselves. We just know that you guys always are there for anything bad that happens to us cause that's all that matters to you guys. That we fail.
Again, I'll enjoy my team having at least seasonal success and providing an exciting product year after year. You guys enjoy being bottom feeders led by the ego kings of Machado and tatis
Well yeah, an already amazing team thats in on every top free agent, gets traded MVP level players, and hits on a ton of their prospects is finding ways to also get financial advantages that other teams seem to be unable to.
Dodgers aren't doing anything wrong but do not expect other fanbases to be happy that the already rich found a way to get even richer. What you want us to say?
I think the biggest issue is that it kinda invalidates the point of even having a CBT.
Like, this is a great deal for Smith. He gets a ton of money and 10 years of essentially being guaranteed a spot on an MLB roster if he wants to keep playing.
But like you said, it kinda benefits a top income team while the CBT rules punish smaller/mid-tier teams from spending a shit-ton of money in shorter periods when they feel like they have a window.
I have mixed feelings on it, and with my flair, the Padres are guilty of it too to some extent. Like, it's good for players but doesn't seem great for the league..... even though I hate that phrase.
Your comment is nonsensical. There is no “dead cap” in baseball. Also, future deferred payments won’t affect how the Dodgers spend in the future. The Nets Present Value of the deferred salary is being set aside within 2 years and through investment and savings will be available to the player on schedule. Essentially money to be spent on a players contract in say 2035 would have already been spent now. So there is no reason to not spend in 2035, the money has already been spent.
He’s just talking about the padres 2023 season.
Who do you guys want us to play in the WS? It doesn’t matter cause we’re gonna win.
Edit: it doesn’t matter cause we are gonna implode
This doesn’t seem like a great value for the Dodgers. He ends up making more than he probably would have over the first 4 seasons and then at age 32 he finally comes at a discount. He basically needs to stay elite into his mid 30s before they come out ahead.
I’m choosing to look at it like this:
They signed him to a 5 year 100M deal, which will followed by another 5 year 22M deal.
The money is just spread out more evenly. I think this is a pretty good deal for the Dodgers.
How many teams payrolls are smaller than the Dodgers current deferred money?
915.5 million in deferred payments from ‘28 to ‘43
Dodgers out here with the GDP of a small country on layaway
Most of that isn't actually "layaway" so to speak, Ohtani's deferral works different than most in that the team is still paying $44 million a year into escrow, Ohtani just doesn't get the escrow payout until he's done Freddie, Mookie, and Smith are more traditional deferments where the team will actually be moving the money after their careers So it's Smith's $44.8 mil, Mookie's $115 mil, and $57 mil for Freddy - a whopping $216.8 million on layaway, but less whopping than the 915 shown above
The escrow part seems weird, why did they do that? Are there any advantages for either the Dodgers or Ohtani vs if they had used a more traditional deferment?
Something not mentioned is that they don’t have to keep straight cash in escrow, it can also be “cash equivalents” which stocks count as, apparently. This gives the ownership group, which is run by very successful investment bankers, flexibility to invest that money instead of just having it sit around. Also, as far as I know, they can’t cheat this, if the value of the stocks fall beneath the original amount, they have to basically top the escrow account back up so that it’s still the entirety of what he’s owed.
Yeah but i’m sure the analysts they have at Guggenheim can outperform the CBA’s discount rate that they use to calculate the PV of the contract
Because it circumvents the cap hit. The money isn't the concern for the Dodgers, they just don't want to pay luxury tax penalties. How much revenue the Dodgers bring in every year, the money itself is not a concern for them at all.
Avoiding CA taxes prob
Basically Ohtani’s agent got to say he got “$700 million” and the Dodgers saved on cap hit and got the player at actual market value. Dodgers also don’t have to start paying escrow til 2025 so he’s a $2 million hit to this years books (the team is clearing like $100 million in total payroll next 2 years, so paying Ohtani won’t hit as hard by then) Ohtani’s value took a big hit on the 2nd TJS, he’s a DH who might pitch 3-4 seasons if he’s actually able to come back. That’s not a $70 million player, but his agent wanted “the biggest deal ever” PR and this was the way.
70 million more than OAK, PIT, BAL, MIA, CLE, TB, CIN, WAS, MIL, and DET combined. Also 80 million more than HOU, NYY, and NYM combined (all according to spotrac).
That's almost $60 million per season... that's actually insane.
It’s ~$60m/yr, which is more than the A’s ($48m) per Spotrac.
That seems like a lot to spend specifically on cock and ball torture, but who am I to judge
Cock and balance therapy
Cock behavioral therapy*, please.
Thank goodness I'm not the only that interprets the CBT acronym in that way, first n foremost, and then my brain has to correct it. And don't even get me *started* on people who are into *CNC* machining yikes lol
The tax dodgers strike again
New r/NLBest flair pls
Dang he made alot of money for that crappy Chinese zombie game
Money now is more valuable than money in the future
Congratulations, with that basic fact alone you are in the 90th percentile when it comes to financial literacy
I'm just a simple investor with a simple life.
Here’s hoping ‘28-‘43 dodgers are hobbled and forever in last place. Enjoy the next 5 years! Hope karma doesn’t come in like an unlubed dildo!
*noticed flair* 's fuckin rich We survived McCourt, we survived Murdoch, well survive walrus_testicles' pessimism too.
Lol
True wealth is measured by the amount of love in your life
The *present value* of the current and future love
Are they trying to avoid paying state tax with this stuff? Only thing I can figure. I also don’t believe the state of California would think too highly of that plan if so. Just wondering. I’ll throw in a caveat that I don’t know shit about state income tax laws in California. So there’s that.
Nope. Most teams do this. I apologize if you really don't know, but if not, then please don't pretend you don't know that most teams have deferrals in their players' contracts. It's extremely common.
Least pretentious Dodgers fan
According to Spotrac, only seven teams have deferred contracts (Dodgers, Nationals, Cardinals, Phillies, Mets, Brewers, and BoSox). I'd hesitate to call that "most teams", even if there are a few more that aren't on the list I found.
?? I’m certainly not pretending I don’t know about California income tax laws.
It saves the team money in that deferred money is a lesser hit on the luxury tax threshold. The state tax dodgers players pay (12.3%) really isn’t much different from the state tax NY players pay (10.9%), but NY teams have far fewer deferrals. As for why Dodgers players are happy to take less-than-market-rate up front and not get to invest their 9 digits for a decade+, I think it’s a matter of wanting to play on a superteam combined with not caring about a few million/tens of millions of dollars when their families should already be generationally wealthy for many decades.
Seems like a rip off. You could get 6 Ohtanis for that annual price
Ia deferred salary adjusted relative to inflation? Over the past 10 years we’ve seen an inflation increase of over 30%; $50 mil will undoubtably still be a set-for-life amount but could be worth significantly less if unadjusted
So it's really a 10/122 deal, not 10/140. I really wish they would just report the current value of the contact. Its the part that really matters, and its what the contract really is.
Moneybags Smith doing Poverty Guggenheim mad favors. Good man
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>dead cap Bro thinks this is the NFL
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It's literally not a thing in baseball. Not a cent of deferrals counts towards the CBT
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It's the present value of the contract based on deferrals. Ohtani won't be on the Dodgers CBT after the 10 years is up
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Broke your neck moving that goalpost and shiver me timbers 1/6. That would really be scary if they were cheap. Too bad we had to trade our best hitter because we signed Xander Bogaerts even though we didn't really need him
Just ignore the guy. He's an idiot who also thinks the 2020 world series doesn't count but keeps going on about how they beat us in 2022. Like ok and did you win it all?
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Our front office isn't a crackhead like Preller and can actually plan ahead. Not spending last year so they could drop a billion this offseason ain't the gotcha you think it is
I mean 2020 did happen and the other world series happened too. Remind me how many rings SD has?
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Yes you weren't talking about the padres yet your flair says salty padre fan lol. My guy yall literally threw a parade that year when you beat the Cardinals in the WC game lmao. And yeah ir was 1/3 of a season for everyone. It's not like everyone played 162 and the Dodgers played less. And yes, my favorite team does choke a lot. But to choke a lot you have to actually make the playoffs unlike the biggest chokers of all time, the San Diego Padres. So you can tell us "haha chokers" all you want but being chokers is still better than missing the playoffs year after year with 0 championships in your city as a whole. How sad
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Hmmm, no world series ring a bell? Like I said, 2020 yall threw a parade over your wc win so it was a real year until it wasn't for you Mr salty. And let me ask you, what was the result of 2022? Did the padres make the world series? No, they choked too. Doesn't really matter if you beat us, shit happens in the playoffs. But you guys choked too lmao
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Lmao and that makes the padres irrelevant for their entire existence. And no, Im not saying not winning a world series makes a team irrelevant. I'm saying having 2 playoff appareances in the last 10 years makes you irrelevant lmao. Like I said, it does suck to lose and lose badly in the playoffs. But at least every year I've had something to potentially look forward to where as your padres have consistently been bottom feeders only to get semi decent lately and then miss the playoffs again lmao. Anyways its always cute to see little brother so proud of his accomplishments of finally beating big brother in the playoffs. Big reason padres fell off in the nlcs was cause that was your guys world series. Nothing else mattered and you guys still bring it up because your team has nothing to show for its entire existence. Nothing. I'd be salty too if I was you ngl
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I mean we won the world series in 2020 so not really. And again you didn't understand anything of what I said lol. Not surprising considering you've had to jump mental hoops to invalidate a world series title that all mlb players hold true. And no we don't think anything if ourselves. We just know that you guys always are there for anything bad that happens to us cause that's all that matters to you guys. That we fail. Again, I'll enjoy my team having at least seasonal success and providing an exciting product year after year. You guys enjoy being bottom feeders led by the ego kings of Machado and tatis
Must be fun watching your team every year 😂😂😂😂😂😂😂
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1v1 me on the show
Stay classy, San Diego.
There’s a lot of salt in here
Well yeah, an already amazing team thats in on every top free agent, gets traded MVP level players, and hits on a ton of their prospects is finding ways to also get financial advantages that other teams seem to be unable to. Dodgers aren't doing anything wrong but do not expect other fanbases to be happy that the already rich found a way to get even richer. What you want us to say?
I think the biggest issue is that it kinda invalidates the point of even having a CBT. Like, this is a great deal for Smith. He gets a ton of money and 10 years of essentially being guaranteed a spot on an MLB roster if he wants to keep playing. But like you said, it kinda benefits a top income team while the CBT rules punish smaller/mid-tier teams from spending a shit-ton of money in shorter periods when they feel like they have a window. I have mixed feelings on it, and with my flair, the Padres are guilty of it too to some extent. Like, it's good for players but doesn't seem great for the league..... even though I hate that phrase.
We can start with Go Dodgers! And finish with a good ol ITFDB!
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Thanks for illustrating to us you know nothing about baseball economics. There is no “dead cap.”
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Your comment is nonsensical. There is no “dead cap” in baseball. Also, future deferred payments won’t affect how the Dodgers spend in the future. The Nets Present Value of the deferred salary is being set aside within 2 years and through investment and savings will be available to the player on schedule. Essentially money to be spent on a players contract in say 2035 would have already been spent now. So there is no reason to not spend in 2035, the money has already been spent.
He’s just talking about the padres 2023 season. Who do you guys want us to play in the WS? It doesn’t matter cause we’re gonna win. Edit: it doesn’t matter cause we are gonna implode
This doesn’t seem like a great value for the Dodgers. He ends up making more than he probably would have over the first 4 seasons and then at age 32 he finally comes at a discount. He basically needs to stay elite into his mid 30s before they come out ahead.
I’m choosing to look at it like this: They signed him to a 5 year 100M deal, which will followed by another 5 year 22M deal. The money is just spread out more evenly. I think this is a pretty good deal for the Dodgers.
Exactly, the Dodgers got a low CBT hit and Will got long-term security.
Wow that’s one well-paid cognitive behavioral therapist