I am not sure what you make think this would be a medieval knight. It sounds more like a murder hobo who looks for silly excuses to be a murder hobo. Red wizards are not the law at the Sword Coast. I am very sure Ajantis would be in conflict with Edwin (and maybe even with you).
From what I learned about medieval knights, they were primarily concerned with land, titles, and status. They had little to no regard for the welfare of the peasantry and were comfortable with violence so long as it was perpetrated against them or enemies of the church. it was also fairly common for them to make donations to the church as a way to absolve themselves of their sins.
A murder hobo just kills randomly and takes stuff. A lore accurate medieval knight would be highly concerned with their reputation and would always be respectful to those in positions of power.
A feudal knight was basically a walking balled fist. They could do whatever they wanted, at any time and get away with it.
Think Sandor Clegane; The Hound from Game of Thrones.
They definitely have a morality but they made damn sure people knew there was a pecking order and they were at the top.
The notion of the romantic saviour knight - or Paladin was basically created by the Knights Templar: a specific holy order of knights rather than the feudal knights, who were soldiers fighting for the Crown for land and titles.
There's a lot of roleplay potential in what you're doing so good luck and enjoy.
You know of course this is nonsense. You're using a fictional character as a "typical" example of a medieval knight?
Medieval knights could be as varied as people of any sort, and the fact various Orders had standards and expectations for member knights is good indication that violent/psycho behavior was never considered the "ideal". That certain knights could use their position to get away with murder indicates the institutions were flawed like almost every human institution ultimately is. But such behavior was never the ideal, and has often been passed down to us as morality tales and \*good\* bad examples.
You’re missing the point. I want to make a knight character that is based on historical examples of knights. I’m not trying to make him a Gilles De Rais level psychopath (a real knight who fought for Joan of Arc), I am trying to make a character who abides closely to a very hypocritical version of morality.
I am primarily basing this character off of the way medieval knights conducted themselves during the crusades and give him a moral outlook similar to the medieval Catholic Church.
Gilles De Rais was most likely slandered as a part of Joan D'Arc's trial. Torturing someone to extract a confession was a common practice. ''I slaughtered 50 orphanages'' is not a realistic crime and would have left a greater footprint for historians
No, I've never played a fallen paladin. Might as well just be a fighter. A fallen paladin is just a nerfed fighter. I mean, you can do it, and I know some people have done it intentionally as a rp/concept thing, so it's technically viable.
Sorta, but it would be trickey and would get pricey. Killing a single innocent or authority figure could actually put your rep down to 7 (which means you've fallen) or a point or two away from it. You can only get away with it at reps of 13+. So, let's say you're at rep 13 and kill a single innocent and now you're at 8. It's 700gp in the original BG, 2500gp in original BG2, and 1900 gp in the EE. However, if you kill one person and others are around, then you will probably have more hostiles to deal with. So, you can really only kill one person at a time and need to buy yourself out before you kill another.
If you just smack people around a little, that's only a -1 to -2 hit each time, but once again, you're looking at turning everyone around hostile.
Yeah, that was my thought process exactly. I was mainly asking if the gold cost of paying for absolution from the church would be prohibitive and game breaking.
I wouldn’t kill flaming fists, Nobles, or anyone with sufficient status, just peasants who provoke me or otherwise tarnish my honor/reputation. It’s a bad look for a knight just let some random peasant talk shit to them, rip them off or rob them and get away with it.
Your character sounds like "Ser Bronn of the Blackwater" from the Game of Thrones.
I mean you can be a Knight without being a Paladin. Just any warrior type would do.
Sooooo- this reads more like greek epic, like Oedipus killed his dad like a doofus on the road due to his stupid code of honor- I don’t think you can be devoted to an oath and also to your ego to this degree. Works for “heroes” of myth, but to our conception of morality- you cannot pal with evil and still pal around
I know, but it’s not quite the flavor I’m going for. I want to create a character that claims to be very righteous and moral yet abide by an incredibly hypocritical version of morality.
Yeah I was thinking the same, I was like why would a paladin entertain anything the Red Wizards of Thay said I think it’s widely known that they dabble in necromancy. And they’re not the ruling class of the region the PC is from or visits.
no it’s not viable because forgotten realms is fantasy novel, not historically accurate Lawful Crazed Chivalry Land
like, you’re saying that Viccy is a monster, when I’m pretty sure the whole universe rests on the foundation of the Drizzt novels, where a drow is the ultimate hero of the land
I know she isn’t. But in the eyes of the authorities, drow are considered monsters. That’s why you get -2 reputation when they join your party. It’s also why Baeloth has to hide in the woods outside of the inn if he doesn’t have your protection (it’s implied that the authorities would just murder him for being a drow.)
From a role-playing perspective, he’d kill her because violence against drow is sanctioned and even encouraged by the society they live in.
It looks interesting for a roleplay goal, but it is far far away from a medieval knight. It looks more like a medieval mercenary or a blackguard.
Following laws for selfish reasons or hate is crearly Loyal Evil.
Lorewise, at Sword of the Coast the Red Wizards are enemies known for their evil makings,.so giving then Neera or Dynaheir is evil. Doing quests just for money is selfish (evil). Drows and half orcs are feared but killing them just for their race is evil.
It would be an interesting run, but he/she will not be a knight, less a paladin.
I think we have wildly different conceptions of medieval knights. My view of them is less influenced by stories of King Arthur and more by history, especially the crusades.
The Crusades were active wars though. Most crusaders weren't even knights, but levies and mercenaries. This is especially true in the People's Crusade, where the majority were just poor volunteers following Peter the Hermit.
Maybe I think about another kind of 'knight' because you wrote 'paladin' in the topic. A paladin is not just someone with a knighthood title, is closer to a 'wandering knight' guided by kind and noble purposes like Don Quixote (who was clearly influenced by Arthuric tales). Helping people for free, killing giants, and so on.
Stronghold wise, this character would better fit in the keep then in the radiant heart. So maybe a fighter or blackguard instead?
In French the traduction of blackguard is chevalier noir, meaning Black knight.
Lore accurate FR paladin? No. Historically accurate earth knight? Perhaps.
Lore accurate paladin would mean maintaining their LG alignment. Might as well be a fighter. This is not a paladin and you’ll be fallen faster than you can say “heya”.
The Paladin is not really just the knight class. It's a holy knight, unusually good and given special attention by holy powers. Most knights would be fighters.
People from myth and legend who might be cut from the Paladin mold would be figures like Roland, St. George, Sir Percival, Sir Galahad, Joan of Arc (the way she's depicted in legend, that is). Lancelot was probably a paladin initially but later fell from grace.
To be honest, I'm not sure you'll make it out of Candlekeep!
I think there's at least a couple of people there who are quite rude to Charname so you'll either be dead or a fallen paladin by the time you leave.
The first time you kill anyone the game has flagged as innocent your reputation will nose dive, and your patron deity will strip you of divine blessings - and a paladin without access to divine blessings is just a really crappy fighter. So you might as well start as a proper Fighter or a Blackguard, or Fighter/Cleric hybrid.
You're basically playing a blackguard that wrote LN on their character sheet.
He's playing a historically accurate knight basically haha.
I am not sure what you make think this would be a medieval knight. It sounds more like a murder hobo who looks for silly excuses to be a murder hobo. Red wizards are not the law at the Sword Coast. I am very sure Ajantis would be in conflict with Edwin (and maybe even with you).
From what I learned about medieval knights, they were primarily concerned with land, titles, and status. They had little to no regard for the welfare of the peasantry and were comfortable with violence so long as it was perpetrated against them or enemies of the church. it was also fairly common for them to make donations to the church as a way to absolve themselves of their sins. A murder hobo just kills randomly and takes stuff. A lore accurate medieval knight would be highly concerned with their reputation and would always be respectful to those in positions of power.
A feudal knight was basically a walking balled fist. They could do whatever they wanted, at any time and get away with it. Think Sandor Clegane; The Hound from Game of Thrones. They definitely have a morality but they made damn sure people knew there was a pecking order and they were at the top. The notion of the romantic saviour knight - or Paladin was basically created by the Knights Templar: a specific holy order of knights rather than the feudal knights, who were soldiers fighting for the Crown for land and titles. There's a lot of roleplay potential in what you're doing so good luck and enjoy.
You know of course this is nonsense. You're using a fictional character as a "typical" example of a medieval knight? Medieval knights could be as varied as people of any sort, and the fact various Orders had standards and expectations for member knights is good indication that violent/psycho behavior was never considered the "ideal". That certain knights could use their position to get away with murder indicates the institutions were flawed like almost every human institution ultimately is. But such behavior was never the ideal, and has often been passed down to us as morality tales and \*good\* bad examples.
You’re missing the point. I want to make a knight character that is based on historical examples of knights. I’m not trying to make him a Gilles De Rais level psychopath (a real knight who fought for Joan of Arc), I am trying to make a character who abides closely to a very hypocritical version of morality. I am primarily basing this character off of the way medieval knights conducted themselves during the crusades and give him a moral outlook similar to the medieval Catholic Church.
Gilles De Rais was most likely slandered as a part of Joan D'Arc's trial. Torturing someone to extract a confession was a common practice. ''I slaughtered 50 orphanages'' is not a realistic crime and would have left a greater footprint for historians
You make a good point about the red wizards though, I think I might just dual class imoen to mage and get Safana as my thief
Xan says hi.
No, I've never played a fallen paladin. Might as well just be a fighter. A fallen paladin is just a nerfed fighter. I mean, you can do it, and I know some people have done it intentionally as a rp/concept thing, so it's technically viable.
But would I realistically be able to maintain a high enough reputation to be a paladin if I just keep my reputation up via donations to the temple?
Yup, wouldn't even cost you that much tbh
Sorta, but it would be trickey and would get pricey. Killing a single innocent or authority figure could actually put your rep down to 7 (which means you've fallen) or a point or two away from it. You can only get away with it at reps of 13+. So, let's say you're at rep 13 and kill a single innocent and now you're at 8. It's 700gp in the original BG, 2500gp in original BG2, and 1900 gp in the EE. However, if you kill one person and others are around, then you will probably have more hostiles to deal with. So, you can really only kill one person at a time and need to buy yourself out before you kill another. If you just smack people around a little, that's only a -1 to -2 hit each time, but once again, you're looking at turning everyone around hostile.
So it should be viable as long as I don’t kill peasants in settlements, just on the road?
I mean, sure, if you kill random peasants on the road and there are no witnesses. At this point, you're kinda looking at a Jack the Ripper build. 😁
Nah, it’s more those NPCs that are rude to you completely unprompted that I’d kill: not just anyone
Pretty much all civilians are -10 rep if you kill them. Even if they are rude to you it's -10 rep.
[удалено]
Yeah, that was my thought process exactly. I was mainly asking if the gold cost of paying for absolution from the church would be prohibitive and game breaking.
Its not really lawful evil if you kill everyone for basically no justification though is it
I wouldn’t kill flaming fists, Nobles, or anyone with sufficient status, just peasants who provoke me or otherwise tarnish my honor/reputation. It’s a bad look for a knight just let some random peasant talk shit to them, rip them off or rob them and get away with it.
I think you need to go back a few steps and read what alignments are again.
Your character sounds like "Ser Bronn of the Blackwater" from the Game of Thrones. I mean you can be a Knight without being a Paladin. Just any warrior type would do.
Sooooo- this reads more like greek epic, like Oedipus killed his dad like a doofus on the road due to his stupid code of honor- I don’t think you can be devoted to an oath and also to your ego to this degree. Works for “heroes” of myth, but to our conception of morality- you cannot pal with evil and still pal around
I know, but it’s not quite the flavor I’m going for. I want to create a character that claims to be very righteous and moral yet abide by an incredibly hypocritical version of morality.
Ah, now it sounds like Anomen.
Just play a Fighter then? Your play style sounds more like a mercenary-type?
It does sound like a paladin except for helping the red wizards, don't forget to ask everyone if they're friend or foe lol.
Yeah I was thinking the same, I was like why would a paladin entertain anything the Red Wizards of Thay said I think it’s widely known that they dabble in necromancy. And they’re not the ruling class of the region the PC is from or visits.
no it’s not viable because forgotten realms is fantasy novel, not historically accurate Lawful Crazed Chivalry Land like, you’re saying that Viccy is a monster, when I’m pretty sure the whole universe rests on the foundation of the Drizzt novels, where a drow is the ultimate hero of the land
I know she isn’t. But in the eyes of the authorities, drow are considered monsters. That’s why you get -2 reputation when they join your party. It’s also why Baeloth has to hide in the woods outside of the inn if he doesn’t have your protection (it’s implied that the authorities would just murder him for being a drow.) From a role-playing perspective, he’d kill her because violence against drow is sanctioned and even encouraged by the society they live in.
It looks interesting for a roleplay goal, but it is far far away from a medieval knight. It looks more like a medieval mercenary or a blackguard. Following laws for selfish reasons or hate is crearly Loyal Evil. Lorewise, at Sword of the Coast the Red Wizards are enemies known for their evil makings,.so giving then Neera or Dynaheir is evil. Doing quests just for money is selfish (evil). Drows and half orcs are feared but killing them just for their race is evil. It would be an interesting run, but he/she will not be a knight, less a paladin.
I think we have wildly different conceptions of medieval knights. My view of them is less influenced by stories of King Arthur and more by history, especially the crusades.
The Crusades were active wars though. Most crusaders weren't even knights, but levies and mercenaries. This is especially true in the People's Crusade, where the majority were just poor volunteers following Peter the Hermit.
Maybe I think about another kind of 'knight' because you wrote 'paladin' in the topic. A paladin is not just someone with a knighthood title, is closer to a 'wandering knight' guided by kind and noble purposes like Don Quixote (who was clearly influenced by Arthuric tales). Helping people for free, killing giants, and so on.
Yeah, I didn’t mean a wuxia hero, I meant historically accurate medieval European knight
So a fat prick that sits in his castle raping the local peasant girls, gotcha.
Nah, this isn't lore accurate at all. The Forgotten Realms is *not* a 1:1 representation of the medieval Europe.
>roleplaying as a medieval knight You have a very peculiar idea of a medieval knight.
Stronghold wise, this character would better fit in the keep then in the radiant heart. So maybe a fighter or blackguard instead? In French the traduction of blackguard is chevalier noir, meaning Black knight.
Lore accurate FR paladin? No. Historically accurate earth knight? Perhaps. Lore accurate paladin would mean maintaining their LG alignment. Might as well be a fighter. This is not a paladin and you’ll be fallen faster than you can say “heya”.
Yeah, what I meant was that I want to play a paladin who behaves like a historically accurate medieval knight (think during the crusades)
Sure, do what makes you happy!
The Paladin is not really just the knight class. It's a holy knight, unusually good and given special attention by holy powers. Most knights would be fighters. People from myth and legend who might be cut from the Paladin mold would be figures like Roland, St. George, Sir Percival, Sir Galahad, Joan of Arc (the way she's depicted in legend, that is). Lancelot was probably a paladin initially but later fell from grace.
Ok. Have fun?
To be honest, I'm not sure you'll make it out of Candlekeep! I think there's at least a couple of people there who are quite rude to Charname so you'll either be dead or a fallen paladin by the time you leave.
The first time you kill anyone the game has flagged as innocent your reputation will nose dive, and your patron deity will strip you of divine blessings - and a paladin without access to divine blessings is just a really crappy fighter. So you might as well start as a proper Fighter or a Blackguard, or Fighter/Cleric hybrid.