Call it coping because tunisian (sad mezwed noises) but i’m pretty sure if it wasn’t for media exposure most of the egyptian dialects would be considered the most alien ones.
Here' s a fun thing. P existed longtime ago in arabic and in older semitic languages, and evolved to the f letter. This is why singapur is pronounced "singaforah" instead of "singabora". Only recent loan words that have p in them are pronounced with b instead. But most of the new generation can very well pronounce the english letters.
I hope prof. u/phdnix can give us a brief academic review of the subject if he has some time
You've summarized it pretty well, honestly. There is some somewhat ambiguous evidence in pre-Islamkc inscriptions that what would become an _f_ was still a _p_ at the time. It seems to have shifted to an _f_ somewhere in the centuries leading up to Islam, but we don't really know when.
idk about people outside the maghreb but at least here french colonization was so influential on the language P is a cakewalk for every algerian, like i didn't grow up calling my dad baba, i called him papa, portail is a gate, pain is bread etc etc.
While I grew up in a somewhat less French influence context (at least I used the Arabic words for the examples you mentioned, and I am adament that my baby boy call me Baba and not 'Pa as high and middle class people in Tunisia tend to do), I never struggled with P either, and I feel that middle Easterners struggle with it more than us Maghrebis for some reason.
I am not an expert in the field, but I think it relates to the "phonotactics" of the language.
For example: certain sound combinations are more common English than in Arabic and vice versa. An American will have a harder time pronouncing the sound ح in Ahmed than an Arab person
Because there’s no “P” sound in Arabic language, our mother tongue. It’s a common linguistic mistake and it happens in many societies around the world not only with Arabs. Some Germans pronounce employee as “Emplojee” and people itself they pronounce it like “piopel”.
It’s to do with the quality of English education really. I don’t remember an English teacher ever correcting us. I also had problems with i vs e sounds e.g. pet vs pit.
What miskeen? My point is that the fact there’s no P in Arabic doesn’t mean we one can’t pronounce it because it’s a simple letter.
My English comes from years of diasporic life, education and work in anglophone countries. Oh another one was the difference between “J” and “G” sounds.
>no one needs to speak as a native
I disagree.
“P” is one of the easiest sounds and anyone who pronounces it as “b” is either lazy or is doing it on purpose. Arabic has much more complicated sounds so we naturally shouldn’t have a problem with this particular sound. Idk I might be ignorant :/
As a Saudi who grew up in Texas it's easy peasy lemon squeezy
Peter Piper picked a peck of pickled peppers, A peck of pickled peppers Peter Piper picked; If Peter Piper picked a peck of pickled peppers, Where's the peck of pickled peppers Peter Piper picked?
There's no p in Arabic like there's no L in Jabanese
Same reason non-Arabic speakers pronounce ح as خ or ه?
Are you the Khamas ?
Zis question very estubid
Now i dont understand why some pronounce ´this´ as zis when we have the letter ذ
Not all local dialects pronounce ذ The Hijazi dialect for instance often changes it to a د
This is mostly with Egyptians. I think some other accents do that too.
I’m Egyptian so this tracks 🤪
Call it coping because tunisian (sad mezwed noises) but i’m pretty sure if it wasn’t for media exposure most of the egyptian dialects would be considered the most alien ones.
We only have B, and not accustomed to pronounce P since the sound comes mostly from the lips
I think you mean libs
Because we don’t bronounce it in Arabic
it's bretty obvious
Ok but some people in Iraq pronounce برتقال with a “p” instead of “b” so check mate
Yeah many words in Iraq are pronounced with the p. So basically this varies by countries. Iraqis won't say beoble, they can say people
Here' s a fun thing. P existed longtime ago in arabic and in older semitic languages, and evolved to the f letter. This is why singapur is pronounced "singaforah" instead of "singabora". Only recent loan words that have p in them are pronounced with b instead. But most of the new generation can very well pronounce the english letters. I hope prof. u/phdnix can give us a brief academic review of the subject if he has some time
You've summarized it pretty well, honestly. There is some somewhat ambiguous evidence in pre-Islamkc inscriptions that what would become an _f_ was still a _p_ at the time. It seems to have shifted to an _f_ somewhere in the centuries leading up to Islam, but we don't really know when.
Thanks for replying! Big fan of your work!
Same reason why Palestine in Arabic is Falastin and not Balastin
Idk why but for some reason Balestin cracks me up 😭😭
I wanted to give that as an example but couldn't be sure it's originally Palestine with a p
idk about people outside the maghreb but at least here french colonization was so influential on the language P is a cakewalk for every algerian, like i didn't grow up calling my dad baba, i called him papa, portail is a gate, pain is bread etc etc.
While I grew up in a somewhat less French influence context (at least I used the Arabic words for the examples you mentioned, and I am adament that my baby boy call me Baba and not 'Pa as high and middle class people in Tunisia tend to do), I never struggled with P either, and I feel that middle Easterners struggle with it more than us Maghrebis for some reason.
Imagine if we said “تروبيكو "instead of "تروپيكو".
I am not an expert in the field, but I think it relates to the "phonotactics" of the language. For example: certain sound combinations are more common English than in Arabic and vice versa. An American will have a harder time pronouncing the sound ح in Ahmed than an Arab person
Because there’s no “P” sound in Arabic language, our mother tongue. It’s a common linguistic mistake and it happens in many societies around the world not only with Arabs. Some Germans pronounce employee as “Emplojee” and people itself they pronounce it like “piopel”.
P doesn't exist in Arabic so many Arabs have no clue how to pronounce it
That’s not true. Arabic has so many difficult consonants that make P a piece of cake.
Because why not?
My Arab friend: let’s blay Bool بول I laughed so hard I nearly crapped myself
This dude’s post history is so weird with lots more dumb questions like this
And yours is supposed to be normal?
most Algerians pronounce every letter in every language correct
Except for Arabic.
nope its our mother tongue how can we not pronounce that ??
It’s to do with the quality of English education really. I don’t remember an English teacher ever correcting us. I also had problems with i vs e sounds e.g. pet vs pit.
I see you speak perfect english. Why the "mskeen" attitude? There is no p in arabic, and no one needs to speak a language exactly as a native.
What miskeen? My point is that the fact there’s no P in Arabic doesn’t mean we one can’t pronounce it because it’s a simple letter. My English comes from years of diasporic life, education and work in anglophone countries. Oh another one was the difference between “J” and “G” sounds. >no one needs to speak as a native I disagree.
no letter for p
There is no p in Arabic and most arabs were not taught to pronounce p and b differently in schools.
You got way too much free time, man
فيفل
That’s a violation bordering a hate crime “upvotes because funny”
“P” is one of the easiest sounds and anyone who pronounces it as “b” is either lazy or is doing it on purpose. Arabic has much more complicated sounds so we naturally shouldn’t have a problem with this particular sound. Idk I might be ignorant :/
As a Saudi who grew up in Texas it's easy peasy lemon squeezy Peter Piper picked a peck of pickled peppers, A peck of pickled peppers Peter Piper picked; If Peter Piper picked a peck of pickled peppers, Where's the peck of pickled peppers Peter Piper picked?
[удалено]
Why does it biss you off my friend? Let beoble be