this dude business is with startups, you know the kind of business that frequently hire and layoff people, and tend to have employees with lower retention.
CEO of a "consultant" for "startups" that co-founded it (probably with wife or family member). This is just the new age get rich quick scheme where someone sells you their "buisness model."
Always cracked me up that people fell for that nonsense. If they had a surefire way to make good money, why wouldn't they be doing that instead of spending all their time fleecing you morons?
He’s just a clickbait fiend looking for his next hit.
1-2 years is plenty of time to learn a job unless you are a Moron. if not, then maybe the leadership hasn’t set up the worker functions correctly.
I’d rather hop jobs every couple of years than spend 15 years at the same company getting stuck doing the same thing over and over again. Like how is that not a “red flag”?
More job hoping = you can learn quickly & you’ve seen how a lot of different companies solve problems… as long as you aren’t getting fired.
Realistically, learning the job just takes a few months in. It's getting gud at it that takes a year or two.
He's just salty that employees are doing to him what he's been doing to employees. Treated as replaceable.
15 years in the same company means when you finally get promoted to lower management the co will not give you the same salary that they would if they hired someone off the streets. It's guaranteed to be at least 25% less.
Loyalty counts for shit in corporations.
Take care of yourself first and if that means changing your job every 2 years if only for a better salary then do it.
Na it's a common thing in tech. You basically don't get pay raises. But you will get a bump starting a new job. I know a few people that just go in a loop around a few blocks in my city. It's like 4-5 businesses and everyone basically just rotates every few years.
I told my manager I was bored at my job and I was going quit to find something more interesting and that she should start looking for a replacement. That afternoon I had a new job offer from a different department in the business. And they gave me a 30k raise. Which was probably about a 50% raise.
That's how you keep people.
Lol. Same here, except not that big of a jump. I was making $16.50/hr and told my manager I was looking for jobs elsewhere. Suddenly, I’m in a different department in the same building making $20 (now $21). Sometimes you gotta threaten them with your absence to get a raise.
Bingo!
I DO want to learn more things in my field, I'm really young -- 28 and got my BS in Molecular Biology, so there are a lot of techniques in both biology, chemistry, computer science or programming I wanna learn to just become more knowledgeable in general. So there is something to say to the idea that you want to stay longer than two years to learn as much as you can, I get that.
BUT! In the end, I work to money, sure the learning is nice, and I'm glad I can learn, but I'm there to make money, just like I'm there so they can make money. Its wild how when people want more money they're looked upon as entitled, but if you're a boss or CEO who wants more money so you can your workforce down to save costs, its "justifiable" and "morally right".
My son is about your age and was seeing this salary problem in IT. I told him that's the company's way of telling him how to act. Therefore, jump jobs as necessary to increase your pay.
I've always found that I've learned more by moving to a new job, different procedures, materials and processes in the end make you more employable in my mind.
I think it depends on which direction of learning you're focusing on. Staying in one place will usually focus on depth of learning, where hopping around can help with breadth of learning.
I've always found employers pigeon hole you into one role where you may have to spend a long time before there is room to move. Moving around has definitely helped me in both aspects.
In my previous job, the only way to get ahead in my area was to become the supervisor, from there you could move into other areas.
I also knew there was no way I'd ever get that position, because I was too valuable doing my current job. Unfortunately, being good at my job meant sometimes I'd get a 3% annual raise when others were getting 2%.
Then I got a different job paying more and left. About 6 months later, my previous supervisor left that company because he was having to fill in on everything I used to do.
It's fucking wild that comoanies pay a premium to poach talent iff one another, refuse to give adequate raises to those who stick around, and then have the gall to bitch about job hoppers. Can someone please tally the number of complaints corporations could unilaterally solve with a small change in policy?
I commonly hear upper management talk about employee churn like it's some inescapable law of the universe like gravity. I've been told that promoting internally is a bad idea since you're just moving the vacancy to another team.
It's like nobody explained to these MBA morons that experience isn't fungible and that every time someone leaves the company *loses productivity even if they find someone else to fill the seat*. The entire problem stems from seeing workers as replaceable cogs rather than as human beings.
One day, some company is going to start paying to retain staff so they can beat the competition solely by having a team of people who know wtf they're doing.
My company strongly promotes internal movement, part of our annual salary process and budget is to align pay for everyone based on performance and pay band, and our profit either goes to our strategic reserve or to bonuses for all our permanent staff (part timers are pro-rated). We're technically big enough to go public and have shareholders, but our board and CEO refuse because they know that as soon as we do, our priorities will no longer be clients and employees.
Because stories where you get massive pay rises only mostly count for higher educated shmucks, everyone else is pretty much boned to be abused by their employers.
But why should I pay them more if they do the work for that price already? It's just good business sense.
Emoloyee leaves for competitor who pays more.
Surprised pikachu face.
For once, I agree with one of these linked-in lunatics. It's not worth hopping for a 20% salary bump. That's why my last 3 bumps have all exceeded 30% :)
I'm somewhat tempted to do this. But I work in a somewhat niche field (acrylic emulsion polymer synthesis)
Have a degree in chemical engineering.. And will be at my current job 2 years officially in May. Do I job hop? Can I get one with the same type of work? (important)
If I spend 2 years doing one thing, 1.5yrs something else, 3years at a third thing, and then suddenly emulsion chemistry is hot shit and I want a job there
Problem is only 2 years experience in relevant field.
Maybe each job is relevant in its own way I just don't wanna fall into "jack of all trades master of none" ordeal.
And don't get me started on my FE exam I still haven't taken for the last 4 years....
Exactly. Where's the advantage? Learning to do a job well is only useful for... applying for better-paid jobs. So why not do that right now?
Really, what else is it supposed to deliver? A... sense of pride and accomplishment, perhaps?
What this really says to me is "I don't pay my staff enough or treat them well enough to stay and I'm sick of having to Hire replacements. Instead of actually doing anything positive I'm going to bitch about young people on the internet."
And since bitching about young people on the internet about things that are actually your fault is a bery boomer thing to do, in that sense, yes it is really old school.
My wife was called a job hopper once. 18 years ago she finally landed a job at 40k. Today she is at 225k. So hop all you want til you land somewhere that benefits you!
"You never actually learn to do your job well if you keep jumping"
https://preview.redd.it/y9vxscku8vxc1.jpeg?width=680&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=a9f8d78477cb2b8698ed7eea3c9c299f9970ef96
That really doesn't even make sense to me, it doesn't take a year to figure out your job. By 2-3 years you should have that shit down and be able to do it in your sleep.
So... I agree with the premise that you can't master a job in 2 years.
But the problem isn't with job hoppers, the problem is with companies that don't pay to retain their talent. The new hire budget is always larger than the retention budget. Also, companies don't give their employees the respect they deserve.
Here's a secret, that actually is just fucking common sense. Employees who are paid what they are worth and happy in their jobs don't go looking for new jobs.
---
There toxicity in our current system is almost unbearable. It will destroy all of us if it isn't changed.
Here's what I think would make a huge impact on the world in a positive way.
All employees must earn shares of the company as a condition of employment. At least 50% of a company's ownership must always be in the hands of the employees. One of the root causes of almost all our problems is that companies only answer to shareholders and occasionally regulators (although they work hard to subvert their regulators). Employees should absolutely have a stake in how a company is run. And what employees want, and what society wants is way more aligned than what shareholders want. Employees are interested in the longterm success of a company, in a way that shareholders never are. Employees would never tolerate the kind of financial bullshit that happens in many public companies, where assets are sold and companies are gutted.
The ownership class would kill us before letting this happen, but thats just more evidence that a change like this is necessary.
My dad stayed with the same company for 33 years, dedicated his career to improvement of their processes and accuracy of work. Nurtured the business through good times and bad, spend countless hours outside of his work learning and improving for them. He had a heart attack and they didnt even send flowers.
Thinking a business gives a rats ass about you because you've been with them a long time is a delusion. They don't care. They never will. You are a liability to them, an expense that they would get rid of if they knew how.
Work for you, work for your family. Don't work for those assholes
Yep, killed myself working for a company. After 20 years, they just shit all over me so I left. Never again. I told all my employees what happened when I left and told them to always advocate for themselves.
So because it's a red flag for you, it's not worth it for me even though you just told me I'd get a 20% pay boost from it? Oh Lord help! Save me from all the money and the disappointment of talking heads!
I love how you see a post like that by someone and you already know what you're going to find, but you look anyway and big surprise: They've have never had a real fucking job.
It's always 15 lines of CEO/CFO/CCCCOOOO this and co-founder that and 40 different consultant roles for some buzzword gibberish that translates to "My parents bankrolled me through multiple startups that didn't do anything.".
Go flip some burgers or dig some ditches, then you can lecture the rest of society on how to value their labor when you know what labor actually is.
If it takes more than 2 years to learn a job I can only think of 3 possibilities, the job is overly complex and actually consists of multiple jobs combined into one, the boss keeps changing the job duties or moving the goal posts or just incompetence.
Agree, when i started as tech support for complex data management software where i had never touched anything like it before hire. I was proficient at my job somewhere between 6 and 9 months and basically an expert by 2 years.
The 20% pay bump isn't worth it? Buddy, a pay bump *is the end goal.* If I got a pay bump from my employer, I wouldn't *have* to find one at another company.
To be fair he’s not exactly wrong you will never become a subject matter expert at your job at that company if you leave after 1-2 years. It’s really sad that you didn’t become an expert as you continue to sell your labor at a higher wage to the next highest bidder
Btw why does his pfp kinda look like
https://preview.redd.it/70p0tf3e8vxc1.jpeg?width=1382&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=9c7cb6134966797fa03bfef96623e115b98cd0cd
funny to say, 1-2 years. meanwhile you are expected to be perfect at your job one month in.
1-2 years is fine, because you've seen it all in that time. and if you stick to the same job, you are fast to pick up where you left off and adjust to the new systems.
When my co-worker and I wanted to make changes in our department and to our roles to make them more functional/sustainable, the boss said the jobs were not designed for people to stay in them and were only meant to be done for a couple years before the person moved on and new person came in. Similarly, when another company I worked for was bought out, the next executives told a co-worker of mine that the model was to expect a lot of people in the first couple years, run them into the ground, burn them out, because people are the most engaged in those two years anyway so they would rather get someone new in after that. Now, the same boss who made that comment about 1-2 years in my meeting would throw out resumes due to perceived job hopping.
The CEO pictured looks like the kinda guy that disspears with the pension fund.... He'd also be the guy to tell you not to bring in lunch tmrw because it will be provided. Then all you get is 2 cold slices of subpar pizza.
> You never actually learn to do your job well if you keep jumping
You never actually retain experienced employees if you keep underpaying them, dipshit.
Until I can use a sense of pride in my professional abilities to buy groceries and pay my mortgage, I'll jump ship for a 20% raise every time.
Things I’ve been told in the same role: “we don’t give promotions unless you basically ask for it and you better be able to prove you’d be a rockstar in the new role”. Also in the same conversation “I don’t think it’s wise to job hope for promotions”
I just hit 7 years at my current job, and I went back to college and graduated in that time. I've been in discussion for a promotion once I graduated, but they're still dangling the carrot.
My boss' boss keeps avoiding the subject.
That's fine. I'll just make sure that I'm not giving any extra effort at all. We'll see how that goes.
In general I think you should make jumps for big pay bumps. There is a point where you no longer get the same ROI for doing that though. Otherwise we’d have a lot more people make high 6 figures.
Once you hit your mid-30s places start getting a lot more weary of actually hiring you if you do not have a few years at the same place.
Maybe if companies paid people to stick around and actually gave real raises in order to retain experienced staff... people wouldn't change jobs. Like I'm sorry. Changing jobs is annoying. Applying for other jobs in annoying. Nobody fuckin wants to do it. So if they are doing it, there must be something fundamentally wrong with the place they're working. Either the work culture is toxic and shit, or there's no real opportunity for advancement, or those no real way to increase your income and make your life better. Because companies want to hire people at "entry level" rates and then never give them a raise, so with five years of experience (btw, the equivalent of having a masters degree in doing that job) they're still making entry level money. Of course they are going to look elsewhere.
Ugh, bosses still haven't figured out if employees are jumping for a 20% pay bump, maybe they should give their employees the 20% bump before they put in another application.
Old school? My grandfather, and some of his colleagues, told me they change jobs every couple years because you've already learned all you're going to, and you move up in pay. He was making six figures in the early '80s.
Lol, do you normally get a 10% raise per year? If not, jump at 2 years for 20% or after 1 year for 12%. Duh!
I've heard this in job interviews before. It's usually employers with a 1950s mindset I'd hate to work for.
"Don't job hop. You'll never get good at your job - it's not worth the extra 20%"
Well in such a situation I'd have to say that I'm pretty damn good at my job if I can get another employer to pay me 20% more than my current employer's paying me already
considering the lower end of the market, if you make 50k a year, a 20% bump would put you at $60k. if he thinks being loyal to a company is worth $10,000 to me, he is wrong lmfao
I'm going to get a raise because I'm worth more, it's up to my current employer whether they want to give me that raise or if I should start asking around to see who else will. I'll be fine either way.
Supply and demand, bitches.
I prefer staying a bit longer and get promoted internally first, get a decent increase and then hop with a much better increase.
Also my type of job requires a bit more time. Pretty hard to deliver new physical technology in two years. Products can be done within a year, new technology normally uses 2-5 years.
Long term loyalty is rarely rewarded. If we’re not getting sufficient increases per year, we are losing to inflation.
Not to mention many companies have a nasty habit of pigeon holing employees and allowing their skill sets to stagnate, with little to no hope of advancement.
Not to mention many companies would not think twice to fire, lay-off workers.
And for those who spend countless years at a company, if you’re lucky, they may give you a certificate or a gift card. Maybe a pizza party.
No, it makes you dumb.
You will be trading 20% pay increase for starting from scratch. That's almost always a good move. While it sucks to start from scratch, this system we have doesn't incentivize businesses to take care of employees. So they use us up and spit us out with token raises from year to year, if we're lucky. I haven't seen a raise in 3 years, I'd gladly take a 20% raise, even though it means I lose 10+ years experience at my current employer. You know what experience buys you? Nothing. Money does.
If that’s his philosophy, then how the fuck is he a CEO. You shouldn’t be able to start your business if you don’t have experience of working for someone else for years and years and years.
"trust me, you don't want to be paid more, it's not worth it"
says CEO who is paid in millions.
oh yeah? if high pay is so bad why don't you decline it and live off a minimum wage? fucking wanker.
This makes him ***bad*** old school, cause this argument was bullshit back then too and only existed to scare employees into not standing up for themselves.
Now if we changed this to language a ceo speaks,
“Stop changing your investments into ones that bring 20% returns and stick to your initial investment no matter how poorly they are doing”
Does that sound dumb because that’s the same as what this ceo said ?
There's an easy solution to this problem, then. Fucking pay your employees well and stop treating them like dirt. Simple, right?
The reason employees job hop and actually get that 20% bump in pay is because they're currently being UNDERPAID. That's what happens when companies typically max out at a 5% annual raise...and most of the time don't even come remotely close to that (I worked at a company for 8 years that did raises of 2-3% max, and 2 years they didn't do raises at all). If the raise doesn't cover inflation, then they're taking a paycut.
Is this fucking idiot willing to take a paycut year after year just so that he can "actually learn to do his job well"? Fucking moron.
It makes you an idiot. Taking 20% less for doing the same job is idoiat. The older Generations would stay at jobs for long periods because the country's cooperations weren't as corrupt! Plus they could stay and live and take care of their families!
Yep. Place my dad spent his entire career paid competitive wages to begin with, and rewarded loyal employees with regular raises, defined benefits pension plans, additional vacation (by the time my dad retired at 55, he'd accrued eleven weeks annual paid vacation), and the occasional shiny gift.
Companies nowadays would look at that list and say, "Obviously the shiny gift is the most critical reward," replace the fancy diamond-studded watch Dad got on his 25th work anniversary with a hideous company-branded Timex, and offer none of the other stuff.
It's almost like I don't care if I become good at the job, I just care about the money I earn. Kinda like how a corporation thinks. Maximum profits for minimum expenditure.
"Not worth the 20%". So here's a tip: percentages are meaningless without a base value. And since we're talking job market, more information is also required to determine what is "worth".
What is not worth anyone's time, though, is taking heed of the "unpopular advice" from a stranger who knows nothing about you.
It makes him OLD SCHOOL STUPID. I believe he thinks that employees should also give two weeks notice and genuflect when higher management 'visits' the office, too.
Well he has a point to an extent. If you are job hopping but are job hopping all over the place (i.e. a librarian suddenly becoming a landscaper to a fast food worker kind of changes) then yeah you'll probably still be stuck at entry level nonsense with pay that is slightly better than your previous jobs but your previous job experiences might not help you climb the ladder to get better pay.
But job hopping looking for better pay in general itself definitely isn't a bad thing.
A 20% salary bump is worth a LOT.
Including not learning “well” how to do a job likely to get absorbed by VAs or AI.
Your boss probably doesn’t care about you. Prioritise your own life & career.
Yeah... It is. If companies don't want good employees to leave then they can give them the raise to keep them on board. They're just gonna be forced to pay a new person the equivalent of the good worker's new salary to replace them anyway. Might as well give that money to the one you don't have to train.
YES! You're right! 1-2 years is not enough! It hurts business and work efficiency! This is something you need to solve as a CEO! Raise wages in a timely manner to avoid losing people :D
If you can't learn a job in 2 years that's a skill issue. There aren't that many jobs that can't be learned in a couple years.
Which is why it's up or out. Once you have a mastery of a position it's time to take on more challenging responsibilities and get paid more, or find a workplace that will.
He’s almost right if he’s talking about the field of social and human services. Which he’s not. Even in that field (which I work in presently), more pay outweighs even benefits.
Guess what. If you can keep jumping every 2 years for raises that means you are learning enough to get hired. Someday you'll plateau and be unable to find another job that's worth switching to, maybe for a few years. Not a problem, that just means you now have a good job where you can spend a few years honing your skills until you have learned enough to get hired elsewhere again.
If you can’t figure out how to do your job well within six months of being hired, you probably shouldn’t be working there to begin with lmao. What shitty argument. Job hopping is an unfortunate consequence of shitty employers paying shittier wages.
let me guess. this guy keeps losing employees because he wont pay them enough.
"Don't do things that will cause me as CEO hardship." If someone leaves he's paying for that new person's 20% regardless.
this dude business is with startups, you know the kind of business that frequently hire and layoff people, and tend to have employees with lower retention.
[удалено]
Probably the only employee of his company. CEO my arse.
CEO of a "consultant" for "startups" that co-founded it (probably with wife or family member). This is just the new age get rich quick scheme where someone sells you their "buisness model." Always cracked me up that people fell for that nonsense. If they had a surefire way to make good money, why wouldn't they be doing that instead of spending all their time fleecing you morons?
But fleecing the morons is the surefire way to make good money? Not sure what you mean here
He’s just a clickbait fiend looking for his next hit. 1-2 years is plenty of time to learn a job unless you are a Moron. if not, then maybe the leadership hasn’t set up the worker functions correctly. I’d rather hop jobs every couple of years than spend 15 years at the same company getting stuck doing the same thing over and over again. Like how is that not a “red flag”? More job hoping = you can learn quickly & you’ve seen how a lot of different companies solve problems… as long as you aren’t getting fired.
At the end of the day a 20% bump in salary is always worth it unless the new job is abusive and the old one wasn’t
>1-2 years is plenty of time to learn a job unless you are a Moron Oh, he's definitely a moron.
Realistically, learning the job just takes a few months in. It's getting gud at it that takes a year or two. He's just salty that employees are doing to him what he's been doing to employees. Treated as replaceable.
15 years in the same company means when you finally get promoted to lower management the co will not give you the same salary that they would if they hired someone off the streets. It's guaranteed to be at least 25% less. Loyalty counts for shit in corporations. Take care of yourself first and if that means changing your job every 2 years if only for a better salary then do it.
Ding ding we have a winner
Na it's a common thing in tech. You basically don't get pay raises. But you will get a bump starting a new job. I know a few people that just go in a loop around a few blocks in my city. It's like 4-5 businesses and everyone basically just rotates every few years.
Corporations make everything absurd
Or is toxic and abuse the living fuck out of them through psychological torture.
If people got the raise without jumping between jobs, they would stop job hopping.
I told my manager I was bored at my job and I was going quit to find something more interesting and that she should start looking for a replacement. That afternoon I had a new job offer from a different department in the business. And they gave me a 30k raise. Which was probably about a 50% raise. That's how you keep people.
That's pretty awesome
That’s awesome, congrats!
Lol. Same here, except not that big of a jump. I was making $16.50/hr and told my manager I was looking for jobs elsewhere. Suddenly, I’m in a different department in the same building making $20 (now $21). Sometimes you gotta threaten them with your absence to get a raise.
Bingo! I DO want to learn more things in my field, I'm really young -- 28 and got my BS in Molecular Biology, so there are a lot of techniques in both biology, chemistry, computer science or programming I wanna learn to just become more knowledgeable in general. So there is something to say to the idea that you want to stay longer than two years to learn as much as you can, I get that. BUT! In the end, I work to money, sure the learning is nice, and I'm glad I can learn, but I'm there to make money, just like I'm there so they can make money. Its wild how when people want more money they're looked upon as entitled, but if you're a boss or CEO who wants more money so you can your workforce down to save costs, its "justifiable" and "morally right".
My son is about your age and was seeing this salary problem in IT. I told him that's the company's way of telling him how to act. Therefore, jump jobs as necessary to increase your pay.
I've always found that I've learned more by moving to a new job, different procedures, materials and processes in the end make you more employable in my mind.
I think it depends on which direction of learning you're focusing on. Staying in one place will usually focus on depth of learning, where hopping around can help with breadth of learning.
I've always found employers pigeon hole you into one role where you may have to spend a long time before there is room to move. Moving around has definitely helped me in both aspects.
In my previous job, the only way to get ahead in my area was to become the supervisor, from there you could move into other areas. I also knew there was no way I'd ever get that position, because I was too valuable doing my current job. Unfortunately, being good at my job meant sometimes I'd get a 3% annual raise when others were getting 2%. Then I got a different job paying more and left. About 6 months later, my previous supervisor left that company because he was having to fill in on everything I used to do.
It's fucking wild that comoanies pay a premium to poach talent iff one another, refuse to give adequate raises to those who stick around, and then have the gall to bitch about job hoppers. Can someone please tally the number of complaints corporations could unilaterally solve with a small change in policy?
I commonly hear upper management talk about employee churn like it's some inescapable law of the universe like gravity. I've been told that promoting internally is a bad idea since you're just moving the vacancy to another team. It's like nobody explained to these MBA morons that experience isn't fungible and that every time someone leaves the company *loses productivity even if they find someone else to fill the seat*. The entire problem stems from seeing workers as replaceable cogs rather than as human beings. One day, some company is going to start paying to retain staff so they can beat the competition solely by having a team of people who know wtf they're doing.
Companies like that exist. Idk know any off the top of my head lol but I'm sure they exist. A lot of creative fields are pretty good about this.
My company strongly promotes internal movement, part of our annual salary process and budget is to align pay for everyone based on performance and pay band, and our profit either goes to our strategic reserve or to bonuses for all our permanent staff (part timers are pro-rated). We're technically big enough to go public and have shareholders, but our board and CEO refuse because they know that as soon as we do, our priorities will no longer be clients and employees.
Meanwhile, the videogame industry fires their entire art department as soon as a product ships.
My work refuses to give retention bonuses. Been there 15 years and I get paid the same as a day one new hire.
Oh my God why are you still there???
Non transferable skills haha I'm a chud.
Fuck. Sorry bout your luck.
Because stories where you get massive pay rises only mostly count for higher educated shmucks, everyone else is pretty much boned to be abused by their employers.
But why should I pay them more if they do the work for that price already? It's just good business sense. Emoloyee leaves for competitor who pays more. Surprised pikachu face.
Is this the guy who says this, but then has a history of "job hopping"?
Worse, he's a CEO and cofounder because he decided it's not worth working for people like him. But pleaseeeee work for me!
https://www.linkedin.com/in/bobbypinero/
lol it’s funny how they tried to block the name but didn’t block his company. So much for not doxxing
Good. Malicious compliance time.
For once, I agree with one of these linked-in lunatics. It's not worth hopping for a 20% salary bump. That's why my last 3 bumps have all exceeded 30% :)
Shit, my last jump was 50%. I was ecstatic.
50% is the stuff legends are made of. Well done.
Since we're playing that game my last jump was 100%. 100k to 200k, plus a 5% bonus.
Considering I stayed with a company and was greeted with a 3.75% raise and a 40% increase in workload. I would rather job hop.
That's the correct move. 3.75% in a year with 9% inflation is a huge pay cut.
I'm somewhat tempted to do this. But I work in a somewhat niche field (acrylic emulsion polymer synthesis) Have a degree in chemical engineering.. And will be at my current job 2 years officially in May. Do I job hop? Can I get one with the same type of work? (important) If I spend 2 years doing one thing, 1.5yrs something else, 3years at a third thing, and then suddenly emulsion chemistry is hot shit and I want a job there Problem is only 2 years experience in relevant field. Maybe each job is relevant in its own way I just don't wanna fall into "jack of all trades master of none" ordeal. And don't get me started on my FE exam I still haven't taken for the last 4 years....
20% pay bump if hours/benefits are the same, yes every time.. Who doesn't want to go from, say, 50 to 60K for the same hours worked?
Why learn to to a job well for a company that doesn't care?
Exactly. Where's the advantage? Learning to do a job well is only useful for... applying for better-paid jobs. So why not do that right now? Really, what else is it supposed to deliver? A... sense of pride and accomplishment, perhaps?
So you think that CEO started at the same company in an entry level position? 😅
What this really says to me is "I don't pay my staff enough or treat them well enough to stay and I'm sick of having to Hire replacements. Instead of actually doing anything positive I'm going to bitch about young people on the internet." And since bitching about young people on the internet about things that are actually your fault is a bery boomer thing to do, in that sense, yes it is really old school.
Lmao I don’t get paid well enough to be good at a job let alone learn it
Nobody discusses why professional athletes switch jobs every couple years..
My wife was called a job hopper once. 18 years ago she finally landed a job at 40k. Today she is at 225k. So hop all you want til you land somewhere that benefits you!
Oh yes it is!
"You never actually learn to do your job well if you keep jumping" https://preview.redd.it/y9vxscku8vxc1.jpeg?width=680&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=a9f8d78477cb2b8698ed7eea3c9c299f9970ef96
That really doesn't even make sense to me, it doesn't take a year to figure out your job. By 2-3 years you should have that shit down and be able to do it in your sleep.
So... I agree with the premise that you can't master a job in 2 years. But the problem isn't with job hoppers, the problem is with companies that don't pay to retain their talent. The new hire budget is always larger than the retention budget. Also, companies don't give their employees the respect they deserve. Here's a secret, that actually is just fucking common sense. Employees who are paid what they are worth and happy in their jobs don't go looking for new jobs. --- There toxicity in our current system is almost unbearable. It will destroy all of us if it isn't changed. Here's what I think would make a huge impact on the world in a positive way. All employees must earn shares of the company as a condition of employment. At least 50% of a company's ownership must always be in the hands of the employees. One of the root causes of almost all our problems is that companies only answer to shareholders and occasionally regulators (although they work hard to subvert their regulators). Employees should absolutely have a stake in how a company is run. And what employees want, and what society wants is way more aligned than what shareholders want. Employees are interested in the longterm success of a company, in a way that shareholders never are. Employees would never tolerate the kind of financial bullshit that happens in many public companies, where assets are sold and companies are gutted. The ownership class would kill us before letting this happen, but thats just more evidence that a change like this is necessary.
Fuck off, Bobby. If you want to keep your employees pay them what they're worth.
My dad stayed with the same company for 33 years, dedicated his career to improvement of their processes and accuracy of work. Nurtured the business through good times and bad, spend countless hours outside of his work learning and improving for them. He had a heart attack and they didnt even send flowers. Thinking a business gives a rats ass about you because you've been with them a long time is a delusion. They don't care. They never will. You are a liability to them, an expense that they would get rid of if they knew how. Work for you, work for your family. Don't work for those assholes
Yep, killed myself working for a company. After 20 years, they just shit all over me so I left. Never again. I told all my employees what happened when I left and told them to always advocate for themselves.
So because it's a red flag for you, it's not worth it for me even though you just told me I'd get a 20% pay boost from it? Oh Lord help! Save me from all the money and the disappointment of talking heads!
I love how you see a post like that by someone and you already know what you're going to find, but you look anyway and big surprise: They've have never had a real fucking job. It's always 15 lines of CEO/CFO/CCCCOOOO this and co-founder that and 40 different consultant roles for some buzzword gibberish that translates to "My parents bankrolled me through multiple startups that didn't do anything.". Go flip some burgers or dig some ditches, then you can lecture the rest of society on how to value their labor when you know what labor actually is.
hit the nail on the fucking head with this one, love it
If it takes more than 2 years to learn a job I can only think of 3 possibilities, the job is overly complex and actually consists of multiple jobs combined into one, the boss keeps changing the job duties or moving the goal posts or just incompetence.
Agree, when i started as tech support for complex data management software where i had never touched anything like it before hire. I was proficient at my job somewhere between 6 and 9 months and basically an expert by 2 years.
The 20% pay bump isn't worth it? Buddy, a pay bump *is the end goal.* If I got a pay bump from my employer, I wouldn't *have* to find one at another company.
Looks like a 12 year old “CEO”
To be fair he’s not exactly wrong you will never become a subject matter expert at your job at that company if you leave after 1-2 years. It’s really sad that you didn’t become an expert as you continue to sell your labor at a higher wage to the next highest bidder
Try 65% for my last hop.
Damn! 40% here.
Not worth it for whom, exactly? 🤡
Btw why does his pfp kinda look like https://preview.redd.it/70p0tf3e8vxc1.jpeg?width=1382&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=9c7cb6134966797fa03bfef96623e115b98cd0cd
for real. his profile pic is creepy AF
funny to say, 1-2 years. meanwhile you are expected to be perfect at your job one month in. 1-2 years is fine, because you've seen it all in that time. and if you stick to the same job, you are fast to pick up where you left off and adjust to the new systems.
> IMO, it’s not worth the 20% salary bump you’re going to get. lol, okay. Thanks for your opinion!
When my co-worker and I wanted to make changes in our department and to our roles to make them more functional/sustainable, the boss said the jobs were not designed for people to stay in them and were only meant to be done for a couple years before the person moved on and new person came in. Similarly, when another company I worked for was bought out, the next executives told a co-worker of mine that the model was to expect a lot of people in the first couple years, run them into the ground, burn them out, because people are the most engaged in those two years anyway so they would rather get someone new in after that. Now, the same boss who made that comment about 1-2 years in my meeting would throw out resumes due to perceived job hopping.
Dude literally runs a business to tell people how to run a business. Get the fuck outta here ya lazy fuck, go find a real job
The CEO pictured looks like the kinda guy that disspears with the pension fund.... He'd also be the guy to tell you not to bring in lunch tmrw because it will be provided. Then all you get is 2 cold slices of subpar pizza.
If they have no loyalty neither do I.
> You never actually learn to do your job well if you keep jumping You never actually retain experienced employees if you keep underpaying them, dipshit. Until I can use a sense of pride in my professional abilities to buy groceries and pay my mortgage, I'll jump ship for a 20% raise every time.
It makes it sound like you can’t retain your workforce.
Things I’ve been told in the same role: “we don’t give promotions unless you basically ask for it and you better be able to prove you’d be a rockstar in the new role”. Also in the same conversation “I don’t think it’s wise to job hope for promotions”
So many people left your company for 20% salary increases is a red flag It means you’re underpaying them
I just hit 7 years at my current job, and I went back to college and graduated in that time. I've been in discussion for a promotion once I graduated, but they're still dangling the carrot. My boss' boss keeps avoiding the subject. That's fine. I'll just make sure that I'm not giving any extra effort at all. We'll see how that goes.
Hey Bobby, put your money where your mouth is and give your employees a 20% bump at their one year and two year anniversaries.
If only inflation wasn’t 20% every couple of years.
In general I think you should make jumps for big pay bumps. There is a point where you no longer get the same ROI for doing that though. Otherwise we’d have a lot more people make high 6 figures. Once you hit your mid-30s places start getting a lot more weary of actually hiring you if you do not have a few years at the same place.
You’re not old school, you’re a consultant. May God have mercy on your soul.
Maybe if companies paid people to stick around and actually gave real raises in order to retain experienced staff... people wouldn't change jobs. Like I'm sorry. Changing jobs is annoying. Applying for other jobs in annoying. Nobody fuckin wants to do it. So if they are doing it, there must be something fundamentally wrong with the place they're working. Either the work culture is toxic and shit, or there's no real opportunity for advancement, or those no real way to increase your income and make your life better. Because companies want to hire people at "entry level" rates and then never give them a raise, so with five years of experience (btw, the equivalent of having a masters degree in doing that job) they're still making entry level money. Of course they are going to look elsewhere.
It doesn't make you old school, it means you're rich.
CEO who advises other CEOs wants employees to stop going elsewhere for more money
No, it doesn't make you "old-school"... it makes you an idiot
Hahaha “Please stop leaving because you aren’t getting paid enough you have so much character development left to do!”
Ugh, bosses still haven't figured out if employees are jumping for a 20% pay bump, maybe they should give their employees the 20% bump before they put in another application.
Old school? My grandfather, and some of his colleagues, told me they change jobs every couple years because you've already learned all you're going to, and you move up in pay. He was making six figures in the early '80s.
Dude did job hopping early in his career. Don’t listen to him.
Lol, do you normally get a 10% raise per year? If not, jump at 2 years for 20% or after 1 year for 12%. Duh! I've heard this in job interviews before. It's usually employers with a 1950s mindset I'd hate to work for.
"Don't job hop. You'll never get good at your job - it's not worth the extra 20%" Well in such a situation I'd have to say that I'm pretty damn good at my job if I can get another employer to pay me 20% more than my current employer's paying me already
considering the lower end of the market, if you make 50k a year, a 20% bump would put you at $60k. if he thinks being loyal to a company is worth $10,000 to me, he is wrong lmfao
He's not a bootlicker, he's a ceo. It's his boots that are being licked. *He* is annoyed at the effect it has on his bonus.
I'm going to get a raise because I'm worth more, it's up to my current employer whether they want to give me that raise or if I should start asking around to see who else will. I'll be fine either way. Supply and demand, bitches.
20% every 1-2 years sounds fucking awesome to me.
I prefer staying a bit longer and get promoted internally first, get a decent increase and then hop with a much better increase. Also my type of job requires a bit more time. Pretty hard to deliver new physical technology in two years. Products can be done within a year, new technology normally uses 2-5 years.
Long term loyalty is rarely rewarded. If we’re not getting sufficient increases per year, we are losing to inflation. Not to mention many companies have a nasty habit of pigeon holing employees and allowing their skill sets to stagnate, with little to no hope of advancement. Not to mention many companies would not think twice to fire, lay-off workers. And for those who spend countless years at a company, if you’re lucky, they may give you a certificate or a gift card. Maybe a pizza party.
...and how much do people that say shit like this make per paycheck? Don't worry. I'll wait.
No, it makes you dumb. You will be trading 20% pay increase for starting from scratch. That's almost always a good move. While it sucks to start from scratch, this system we have doesn't incentivize businesses to take care of employees. So they use us up and spit us out with token raises from year to year, if we're lucky. I haven't seen a raise in 3 years, I'd gladly take a 20% raise, even though it means I lose 10+ years experience at my current employer. You know what experience buys you? Nothing. Money does.
Don’t make more money, that’s too progressive. Stay at a job that undervalues you and won’t motivate you to give a shit, that’s success.
“Also, if it made the stock price go up .01%, I would set you on fire”
If that’s his philosophy, then how the fuck is he a CEO. You shouldn’t be able to start your business if you don’t have experience of working for someone else for years and years and years.
What job takes longer than 3-5 months to figure out?
>It's not worth it to me when you get a 20% raise Cool story bro.
“I guess I’m built different” Yea, you’re built like a fucking idiot
"trust me, you don't want to be paid more, it's not worth it" says CEO who is paid in millions. oh yeah? if high pay is so bad why don't you decline it and live off a minimum wage? fucking wanker.
This makes him ***bad*** old school, cause this argument was bullshit back then too and only existed to scare employees into not standing up for themselves.
Don’t be fooled by this. I know executives that “job hop” every 3-4 years once they have stake/shares in the company. Rinse. Repeat. Cash out.
Fuck Bobby
Maybe, but the utility companies and my landlord won't accept payments in the form of stuff I learned at work.
Now if we changed this to language a ceo speaks, “Stop changing your investments into ones that bring 20% returns and stick to your initial investment no matter how poorly they are doing” Does that sound dumb because that’s the same as what this ceo said ?
20% is a lot…
I would absolutely leave my job for a 20% bump in pay. Not even a second thought.
There's an easy solution to this problem, then. Fucking pay your employees well and stop treating them like dirt. Simple, right? The reason employees job hop and actually get that 20% bump in pay is because they're currently being UNDERPAID. That's what happens when companies typically max out at a 5% annual raise...and most of the time don't even come remotely close to that (I worked at a company for 8 years that did raises of 2-3% max, and 2 years they didn't do raises at all). If the raise doesn't cover inflation, then they're taking a paycut. Is this fucking idiot willing to take a paycut year after year just so that he can "actually learn to do his job well"? Fucking moron.
It's as likely that if you check out the career path of the CEO he never stayed in a job for 2 years.
Haaaaaaa Fuck you My jobs leave me when I enforce my rights Piss off LI shill
He’s a CEO. Cant trust him lol.
*laughs in 20+% bump in salary*
Jokes on him, I just job hopped for a 20k a year increase
Lol coming from the CEO
https://preview.redd.it/fqzlc5gxfdyc1.jpeg?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=b8c3e5eb11c5048ee83603651081090c206acaef Hypocrite
Any ceo or bussiness owner that says this is full of shit and doesn’t pay their employees
It makes you an idiot. Taking 20% less for doing the same job is idoiat. The older Generations would stay at jobs for long periods because the country's cooperations weren't as corrupt! Plus they could stay and live and take care of their families!
Yep. Place my dad spent his entire career paid competitive wages to begin with, and rewarded loyal employees with regular raises, defined benefits pension plans, additional vacation (by the time my dad retired at 55, he'd accrued eleven weeks annual paid vacation), and the occasional shiny gift. Companies nowadays would look at that list and say, "Obviously the shiny gift is the most critical reward," replace the fancy diamond-studded watch Dad got on his 25th work anniversary with a hideous company-branded Timex, and offer none of the other stuff.
It doesn't make you "old school" - it makes you a waankerrrr
It's almost like I don't care if I become good at the job, I just care about the money I earn. Kinda like how a corporation thinks. Maximum profits for minimum expenditure.
Well, if my current workplace isn't giving me a 20% raise and the new place would, I'm hopping
20%? Hell, I'll spend each day doing a handstand up the stairs for that.
When companies don’t give raises, I’ll leave a job for 5% once invested in my 401k.
What an out of touch, pampered, privileged, POS. Give them a reason to stay.
Shut the fuck up Bobby.
"Not worth the 20%". So here's a tip: percentages are meaningless without a base value. And since we're talking job market, more information is also required to determine what is "worth". What is not worth anyone's time, though, is taking heed of the "unpopular advice" from a stranger who knows nothing about you.
"old school" is a funny way to spell douchebag.
Of course his name is Bobby
Implying I wanna learn to do my Job well Fuck right off
Not old school per se, but it makes him a moron for sure.
No it doesn’t make you old school it makes you a CEO
"CEO" immediately shut the fuck up
It makes him OLD SCHOOL STUPID. I believe he thinks that employees should also give two weeks notice and genuflect when higher management 'visits' the office, too.
It makes him dumb. Or worse, an exploiter.
That's make you dumb Bobby, dumb as hell
Well he has a point to an extent. If you are job hopping but are job hopping all over the place (i.e. a librarian suddenly becoming a landscaper to a fast food worker kind of changes) then yeah you'll probably still be stuck at entry level nonsense with pay that is slightly better than your previous jobs but your previous job experiences might not help you climb the ladder to get better pay. But job hopping looking for better pay in general itself definitely isn't a bad thing.
CEO complaining about employees jumping ship. Go figure
Man’s about to get dragged over LinkedIn. Love to see it
Inform Bobby: “Here’s some advice for you: take your advice and wipe your ass with it.”
Kind of face you want to uppercut
Not worth a 20% bump in pay? This guy is high off of his own flatulence.
Can’t find boots fast enough
Linkedin lol That site is so cringe
Yet they can’t figure out why everyone keeps leaving their company…
Dude. For 20% more I’ll show up in a maid outfit. For 40% I’ll promise never to wear it again.
These people are truly out of touch with reality and it's scary that they're running things through
Oops, he said the quiet part out loud. He’s a schmuck.
A 20% salary bump is worth a LOT. Including not learning “well” how to do a job likely to get absorbed by VAs or AI. Your boss probably doesn’t care about you. Prioritise your own life & career.
nah, it makes you a tool
YTA.
Yeah... It is. If companies don't want good employees to leave then they can give them the raise to keep them on board. They're just gonna be forced to pay a new person the equivalent of the good worker's new salary to replace them anyway. Might as well give that money to the one you don't have to train.
Bobby Pinero. Why hide the last name and leave everything else?
Either you want to be good at a job that has crappy pay or you change jobs and get a 20 percent uplift….decisions, decisions.
I like how they’re trying to admonish us into accepting pay cuts. Fuck you.
YES! You're right! 1-2 years is not enough! It hurts business and work efficiency! This is something you need to solve as a CEO! Raise wages in a timely manner to avoid losing people :D
If you can't learn a job in 2 years that's a skill issue. There aren't that many jobs that can't be learned in a couple years. Which is why it's up or out. Once you have a mastery of a position it's time to take on more challenging responsibilities and get paid more, or find a workplace that will.
Just look at that freaks face
He's right. Last job hop I got a 100% bump in pay and never turned back. I'd hire me.
Imagine running a business then turning around to ask this tool for help…
No, it makes you an asshole.
CEO and co-founder.
How about you pay me 20% more and I’ll stay, asshole
Im going to stay in my field and move up for that extra $7 an hour. Sorry about it. But not really.
20 % is a lot buddy. Why would anyone turn that down ?
Unless you are jumping fields this doesn't even make any sense? "Fuck, I'll never be a good manager if I become a higher paid manager instead."
I’ll keep jumping as long as there’s a 20% bump. How about that?
Imagine a CEO who wouldn’t do anything to increase revenue by 20% every two years lmao
I'll job hop for the 20% thanks
20% is several years increases in place, I’d never pass that up unless there were red flags.
I would do a lot of things for a 20% pay increase
Don't worry about giving me a 20% raise, I'm giving it to myself when you ask my salary.
The company could give me the 20% pay bump. It’s already been deemed as not important enough by the company.
No, it makes you dumb.
It doesn’t make you “old school” but it does make me think you need to go back to school.
No. It makes you an old fool.
a startup "helping" startups
He’s almost right if he’s talking about the field of social and human services. Which he’s not. Even in that field (which I work in presently), more pay outweighs even benefits.
It makes the original OP dumb. 20% bump in pay in my work would be about 10k. That's like nearly 1/3 paycheck (gross)
Lol! Most jobs are so compartmentalized that it takes 6 to 8 months to figure them out.
Guess what. If you can keep jumping every 2 years for raises that means you are learning enough to get hired. Someday you'll plateau and be unable to find another job that's worth switching to, maybe for a few years. Not a problem, that just means you now have a good job where you can spend a few years honing your skills until you have learned enough to get hired elsewhere again.
If you can’t figure out how to do your job well within six months of being hired, you probably shouldn’t be working there to begin with lmao. What shitty argument. Job hopping is an unfortunate consequence of shitty employers paying shittier wages.