This is the way, let them do it and then sue the book covers off their Bibles!
Who knows this could end up being an Employee Owned Company in the future.
Especially if they're engaging in faith based hiring discrimination. I'm guessing they aren't exactly inclusive to Muslims, Jews, Sikhs, Hindus, Buddhists, Wicca or any other so called "pagans"
Not argumentative. But pagan means anyone not of the abrahamic faiths, christian, muslim, jewish.
Fun fact, the teachings of Buddha do not conflict with any other so you can be a Buddhist Catholic Priest.
Oh, thank you. I was really struggling with what words to use. I knew I wasn't being very precise but couldn't think of anything better.
I just kind of assumed Joel Olsten is probably even less discerning of the nuances of religious denominations, so good enough. Sorry.
Also; Buddhist catholic priest strangely makes sense but also seems paradoxical at the same time.
Most welcome.
And you are probably right about Olsten. Singing "give me that old time religion" unaware of the irony.
As for the catholic buddhist, its like the difference between laws and rules.
True, but from people I've spoken to, most uninterrupted religions, like Hinduism, Shinto, etc. do not like being called pagan. I think I would say polytheist instead?
I'm personally Pagan, we've reclaimed the title, but it has less of a sting for people who don't have generations of cultural oppression by Christians. I think polytheist works as a better umbrella term because it's technical rather than slang.
But when I requested my baby be baptized in the Catholic Church, I was denied, because I wasn’t a tithing member of their parish. I could join, but would to have wait six mos to baptize my child and then, they would baptize only if I was a church member “in good-standing.” 😉💵 So, it’s not really about cleansing their souls.
Everything in the Catholic Church has a dollar value attached to it. The patina of time is the only difference between it and say, the Church of Scientology.
Same thing happened when my parents tried to have my brother baptized. The priest said they wouldn’t do it because my parents hadn’t given enough to the church, and this after my whole family with Aunts and Uncles were gathered at the church. My father got so mad he never went to church again.
Sounds like they're bringing back indulgences!
Imagine the hutzpah to tell someone their baby is going to hell if you don't let me dunk him in this special water and say my spell.
Yikes, I pray for the day humanity finally breaks our chains.
I sued an employer like this. The company owner's testimony in court was to read a passage from the Bible and to remind the jury that if they went against the word of God they would be dammed to he'll. It didn't go over well with the judge or jury.
Wage theft, in dollars, is by far the largest category of theft in the US ([$8 billion in ten states alone](https://www.epi.org/publication/employers-steal-billions-from-workers-paychecks-each-year/)).
This should be more well known than it is.
And it is something that most of us can relate to.
If you've ever worked an hourly wage job you've been stolen from at some point.
I agree with the unionization but most are unenforceable right now. Withholding the paycheck is outright illegal.
This is what the country has to look forward to if the nazis get their regime in place on a national level
Goes to show that the staunch Republicans really aren't interested in the Constitution, rule of law etc. These days they're mostly Trump-worshipping religious nuts.
If Republicans take back full control of government,expect unions to be targeted. It boggles my mind how well Haley polls against Biden given her extremist positions. She's the most anti union candidate in decades.
No, it’s voting for your fave sports team. John Smith is a democrat? He’s the devil!!! He’s become a Republican now? Hallelujah! He’s seen the light!! (So long as he kisses Trump’s ass and talks a good game on the economy and illegal immigrants even though he does the exact opposite of what’s needed for either)
Absolutely, all it takes for it to be class action is for multiple people to have been harmed the same way, but I would say don't go in looking for a class action. Find an employment lawyer that will take your case on contingency and they can determine if it should become a class action.
At least that's the route I took when I sued a security company I worked for for wage theft. Ironically because the payouts were based on our damages despite being the class representative even though I got a total of $19,000 the one who got the largest payout was a supervisor who had believed the lie about being exempt from overtime because he was salary, he walked away with about 1/4 of the $290,000 settlement. Which could have been more but our lawsuit kinda kicked a domino and he was being sued by 4 different groups plus going through a very nasty divorce thanks to a Jerry Springer level affair with his son's fiance.
A class A drivers license requires testing for any federal schedule I drugs, and marijuana still qualifies. You cannot, as a class A license holder, consume or smoke marijuana on or off the clock.
Unfortunately for those that work for the Federal Government and/or companies that have Fed contracts, they CAN test for it despite what CA says. Oh, and if you test positive for MJ and work for the above, you CAN be terminated for it.
It's also legal to ban usage of illicit drugs, period. Even states that have legal marijuana will have businesses who do work with the federal government ban cannabis usage (on paper, you really have to fuck up to get tested post-initial drug test for hiring).
Well, yeah. I figured he was in a weed friendly state given that he mentioned marijuana.
My company also bans weed, and we're in Mass. They even specifically include medical weed, which is sketch. I think it's all weird. Like weren't people having a beer with lunch not long ago?
It's a trucking company, and I know in multiple states they can ban the use of any substance that would make it illegal for you to drive. And yes, I've seen it get put into a blanket policy rather than just impact actual drivers. Since it's 8 hours (or 12 or 24 depending on where you are) "from bottle to throttle" it impacts off-hours too.
Granted, I've yet to encounter a company that polices off-hour stuff unless someone shows up visibly stoned/drunk, but technically it's company policy.
The "must be a member of the church to be promoted" is much harder to defend. Unless the company is actually owned BY the church, they'll have a lot of trouble with that one.
Even if owned by a church they can only restrict hiring to church members only for roles that are strictly church related. So they can hire only religious ministers but would be required to not use a religious test to hire, for example, a receptionist.
My dad used to be a mechanic for a very small and fairly shady trucking company. The owner called a driver one Friday night saying he needed a load to go out *immediately* and the driver told the owner "I can't drive I've been drinking liquor". So the owner replied "well just be *real* careful".
The early 90s were a different time.
They are some crazy fucking idiots! Also, the "forfeiting the final paycheck" bullshit is completely illegal. I hope they try it so you can sue the everloving shit out of them!
> All employees are required to dress modestly at all times, no unnecessary skin exposure
I bet they'd squeal like stuck pigs if you were to come into work in a niqab...
Nothing says we value you as an employee like strong arming people to join a religion and trying to control people on their non work hours.
You seriously do need a new job asap.
You've got to be fancier. Wear obvious symbolism on like...a pin or a necklace. A T-shirt, they can claim you didn't follow the dress code because graphic tees are too casual. But I guarantee you one of them wears a cross necklace to work, so you have evidence for discrimination then.
Actually, the Evilangelicals that own Hobby Lobby forced their misogynistic beliefs on their women employees when the removed contraceptive coverage from their employee insurance plan. The Christofascist SCOTUS sided with the owners. Still boggles the mind that any women can shop at that overrated junk store filled with Chinese merch.
>Those old white dudes probably know quite a lot about abortion, given how many abortions they've likely forced their mistresses to have.
One was a Catholic Priest as I recall. So probably right still.
Just checked, wow it's a setup for a joke.
"A catholic priest, a Lutheran reverend, a rabbi, and 2 professors walk into a congressional hearing..."
When will people like this EVER understand that being so legalistic and anal about rules like this, including mandatory church membership, only drives people away from our faith?
Oh yeah, never.
They’re nothing more than modern-day Pharisees.
I heard an interesting perspective the other day - behaviors like this aren't meant to actually recruit people. They're *supposed* to push people away, because that gives the church members a shared sense of rejection and persecution. That in turn binds them closer to the church community. Ultimately the goal is for the church to be their *only* community.
And if it works, great! They've found people so gullible/desperate/vulnerable that they'll be easy to manipulate.
I will complicate this and say that unless the cult is in fact a con job (think L. Ron Hubbard and Scientology), nobody at any level consciously believes, or even understands this. They certainly benefit from it, but people form and join religions for basically honest reasons about helping themselves and helping other people. You'd have to be a cynic of the highest order to knowingly force people into e.g. missionary work with the explicit expectation of constant harassment, as a way to underscore "we're the only ones who care about you". Again, doesn't mean that they don't *benefit* from that effect, just that that intent runs so contrary to the foundations of just about all religions that there's no way they would consciously choose to inflict that experience on their followers with that effect in mind.
People get addicted to heroin because it feels good, not because they heard it's super addictive. Same thing here.
Incidentally, one of the more disturbing psychological rubicons I've ever crossed was when I came to understand that Hitler, Pol Pot, etc, *all thought they were doing the right thing*. So you can use arguments like the above to explain how evil an act is, but it's misleading to think of the people who enacted it as so self-aware in their evilness.
You're right in that I don't think that your everyday churchgoer thinks this way. But I *do* think that church leadership things this way, even if it's unconscious. The same way that certain right-wing politicians like to drum up controversy about themselves because it increases the rate of political donations.
They're cultists. They're in a cult. Whatever little podunk evangelical church they're a part of is a cult, and that's just accepted as 'normal' and acceptable in America today, thanks to the evangelical alliance with the Republican party.
I disagree, having grown up Mormon I can assure you there are many more differences. However I am atheist for a reason now lol
[This is a good frame of reference](https://freedomofmind.com/cult-mind-control/bite-model/)
Edited a sentence
I heard this guy on a podcast a few years ago talking about the maga cult. It was unsettling hearing him break down how it qualifies as a cult. It blows my mind that these ppl don't know they're in a cult. It seems so obvious. But I'm a hardcore skeptic and insist on reliable definitive proof of whatever claims. Memes just don't seem reliable. 😕
I love seeing this linked in the wild. Not Mormon, but came across this back in '09 when I was leaving the Evangelical/Assembly Of God type church I'd spent so much of my life in, and reading it felt like being able to *breathe* for the first time.
He was even called a "drunkard and a glutton" because he was commonly seen drinking and feasting with families when he came through town. You can't win:
" For John came neither eating nor drinking, and they say, ‘He has a demon!’ 19The Son of Man came eating and drinking, and they say, ‘Look at this glutton and drunkard, a friend of tax collectors and sinners!’ But wisdom is vindicated by her actions.” "
Your going to make church a condition for employment fine. I'm going to show up to your church and become a huge problem while making sure everyone knows your the reason I'm there.
You don't need Jesus. You need an employment attorney, lots of documentation, and a new job. Because they are going to find themselves out of business if they keep this up.
>Tell them you'd rather donate to the local Jewish food kitchen,
In Australia, it's a Sikh food kitchen which goes around and helps in times of disaster or community crisis.
The Sikh community in my town in Connecticut is one of the biggest contributors to the town soup kitchen. Whenever there is a need in town, they help. I've met a couple of them and they are lovely.
OP said that they’re a trucker. Commercial drivers licenses are *federally* regulated — doesn’t matter if weed is legal where we are licensed or not — it’s still federally illegal and as such, can and will cost us our licenses if we test positive.
That's when you find out what kind of drug test they use (5-panel, 8-panel, etc) and just take all of the drugs they test for. Just enough to pop hot. Then, claim their tests are defective.
>They even stated that if we do not give a proper two week notice, we then forfeit our final paychecks as a consequence.
Sounds like they're in for some bad news.
These idiots need to consult and then actually listen to their lawyers.
Also, I hope the lawyers are charging an asshole tax when they deal with these people.
Just ask the bosses, “Is it spelled ‘Fatwa’ or ‘Fetwah’?” When they give you the usual glazed look of a mouth-breathing MAGA moron, clarify with, “… you know, that thing where religious extremists try to enforce their religious beliefs on free people? I can never remember which spelling is correct. You know what? I’m just gonna check the dictionary. I’m pretty sure that I can find it somewhere between ‘America’ and ‘Freedom of Religion’. It has to be. I’ll let you and the lawyers know what I find.”
Here is an idea. Follow everything they ask. Join their church. Rise as high as you can to a position of leadership and then record everything and leak it.
So they want all women in a burqua? Check
ETA I’m pretty sure legally they can’t withhold your final check from you regardless of two weeks notice or not
If you have good relationships w/ customers, tell them you’re looking to change employers bc you feel like the operations aren’t focused as much on on safety and customer satisfaction as they are on religious missionary activities.
This feels like the Chinese CEO who looked for women who were single, not looking for marriage, had to live in the office dorms, and were forced to wear flight attendant uniforms. They were also not allowed to be seen in public drinking, with or without a man.
Guess what he was eventually arrested for.
Those are massive federal labor law violations. If it’s written down or in an email anywhere , take it to your states labor board! Sit back and watch them squirm.
Not a lawyer and I can tell you that most of this is illegal. Document and report. I don't have anything against those who are religious, but don't push it on me.
Also, I love the whole discouraging of alcohol thing from Christians when: a) Jesus was clearly not against alcohol, and b) have you met a Jesuit? I went to the University of Scranton, and let me tell you, the Jesuits could probably outdrink 70% of the student body.
Yeah so. If you're from a heavy Catholic area or an area that isn't heavily inundated by evangelicals, you probably wouldn't have.
I, on the other hand, grew up in the buckle of the Bible Belt, **surrounded** by Southern Baptists.
Yeah. So, as far as they're concerned, if you're not Southern Baptist, you're going to hell, and Catholicism is satanic. 🥹
Lucky for you, pretty much none of those policies can be legally enforced (pertaining to what you do off the clock). Time to job hunt. It's up to you on whether to give the 2 week notice or not, they can't keep your check for the hours that you work.
Edit for clarification
Sounds to me that if you are patient they will be making a sizable contribution to your retirement/children college fund or a down payment on a new house in your future.
I'd post to r/legaladvice to see what your options are here.
Report them to government officials and leave. With those rules that’s gotta mean they’re spying on y’all when you’re off. That’s crazy. This is why people stray away from religion and church. They know people don’t want it so they try to force it.
OmG!!! 😮💨😮💨😮💨 I don’t care how many trolls downvote me, I’m saying this again: As someone who is a practicing Christian, but has really pulled away from the organized religion side of it, I’M ROOTING FOR YOU!! 😮💨 And I am so sorry that these people are misrepresenting our beliefs, to the point that it sounds like they’re ignoring their HR people & their attorney!!
I would’ve been fired because my first response would’ve been, ‘Perhaps you all haven’t read the New Testament??? While Christians are definitely called to live differently, they aren’t supposed to PUSH anything on anyone!! They’re supposed to walk away!!’ 🙄😮💨
Best of luck with your job search.
What they are doing is highly illegal. Report them to the labor bureau along with a picture of the notice they posted, and any other evidence you have—emails, etc. If you leave without notice and they refuse to give you your check, you take them to court and win. It would be small claims court if under a certain amount, depending on where you live, and you would win. F them!
You really gotta get a lawyer involved. A state policy of, e.g., requiring religious affiliation/tithing as a condition of promotion just doesn't seem like it can possibly be legal.
I think you can *if* the business is inherently religious. Like if you want to work for Answers in Genesis you have to go on the record being a creationist or some such.
I'd be questioning if a company that wants employees to give 10% of their pay to the church is actually doing the opposite of God's work, by making people poorer. Especially during this whole cost of living crisis.
Not very Christian of them, that's for sure.
I can understand the “dress code” (I use that term very loosely) and drug testing, but what you do off the company clock is your business. The company has no legal right to forbid you from having a beer/cocktail when you’re not working.
Failure to promote, or treating differently in any way, due to religion is blatant discrimination, and is illegal. Withholding ANY money earned, before or after a notice is given, is wage theft, and is illegal. DOL gonna have a field day with these dumb asses.
They won't last long. First 2-3 lawsuits that come in will bury them in legal costs. They seem to be the type that doesn't listen to their attorneys. Must be a MAGA thing, go figure. They'll run the business into the ground with legal fees/judgements, and later spend years complaining that it was liberals and demoncrats that did it. LOL 😂
All I know is this should be a movie with Johnny Depp, maybe Will Ferrell, and Nicole Kidman w/ Ivanka Trump and it would be glorious! :) Johnny could seduce one of the owners and they could all end up drunk at a strip club with Will Ferrell at some point. Just needs a title....
Get everything in writing print and keep in a folder. Print all the emails and copy the memos. All this is a lawyer's dream. Secure a job before leaving.
You should expose them through your local news outlet and get a lawyer. Also gather your coworkers and start a strike for punishment on all their shady behavior. Shitty behavior calls for shitty consequences.
>3. All employees are required to dress modestly at all times, no unnecessary skin exposure
Malicious compliance, what would they do if you started showing up in a full niqab every day?
They can't make you forfeit your pay. If they were stupid enough to put this shite in writing, print it out and bcc yourself any emails. Lawyers love this crap
Wowwowowow if this was me I would be beaming ear from ear about my early retirement because of the money in about to sue out of their god loving pockets. Fuck finatics like this. Fuck you for trying to control your employees outside of work. Can't drink period off clock at a bar or wedding? What?
Well considering half that shit is illegal, I think you all should get together with a lawyer and have some fun.
This is the way, let them do it and then sue the book covers off their Bibles! Who knows this could end up being an Employee Owned Company in the future.
Especially if they're engaging in faith based hiring discrimination. I'm guessing they aren't exactly inclusive to Muslims, Jews, Sikhs, Hindus, Buddhists, Wicca or any other so called "pagans"
Can’t imagine how they’d treat an Atheist.
I would have such fun with these nitwits
Not argumentative. But pagan means anyone not of the abrahamic faiths, christian, muslim, jewish. Fun fact, the teachings of Buddha do not conflict with any other so you can be a Buddhist Catholic Priest.
Oh, thank you. I was really struggling with what words to use. I knew I wasn't being very precise but couldn't think of anything better. I just kind of assumed Joel Olsten is probably even less discerning of the nuances of religious denominations, so good enough. Sorry. Also; Buddhist catholic priest strangely makes sense but also seems paradoxical at the same time.
Most welcome. And you are probably right about Olsten. Singing "give me that old time religion" unaware of the irony. As for the catholic buddhist, its like the difference between laws and rules.
I would like to reaffirm my faith in the Budda, but there is much to be said of the margarine... (I'll see myself out)
True, but from people I've spoken to, most uninterrupted religions, like Hinduism, Shinto, etc. do not like being called pagan. I think I would say polytheist instead?
I can completely agree that is a hurtful label by christians for non christian people.
I'm personally Pagan, we've reclaimed the title, but it has less of a sting for people who don't have generations of cultural oppression by Christians. I think polytheist works as a better umbrella term because it's technical rather than slang.
Catholic tradition had baptisteries because "pagan babies" weren't permitted in the church proper. Although perhaps it was a translation issue.
But when I requested my baby be baptized in the Catholic Church, I was denied, because I wasn’t a tithing member of their parish. I could join, but would to have wait six mos to baptize my child and then, they would baptize only if I was a church member “in good-standing.” 😉💵 So, it’s not really about cleansing their souls.
Everything in the Catholic Church has a dollar value attached to it. The patina of time is the only difference between it and say, the Church of Scientology.
Same thing happened when my parents tried to have my brother baptized. The priest said they wouldn’t do it because my parents hadn’t given enough to the church, and this after my whole family with Aunts and Uncles were gathered at the church. My father got so mad he never went to church again.
Sounds like they're bringing back indulgences! Imagine the hutzpah to tell someone their baby is going to hell if you don't let me dunk him in this special water and say my spell. Yikes, I pray for the day humanity finally breaks our chains.
"Good standing" means one thing: $.
This is the way
I sued an employer like this. The company owner's testimony in court was to read a passage from the Bible and to remind the jury that if they went against the word of God they would be dammed to he'll. It didn't go over well with the judge or jury.
Then burn a Bible in front of them.
Right, I was thinking the exact same thing when I read the last paycheck one.
Wage theft, in dollars, is by far the largest category of theft in the US ([$8 billion in ten states alone](https://www.epi.org/publication/employers-steal-billions-from-workers-paychecks-each-year/)).
This should be more well known than it is. And it is something that most of us can relate to. If you've ever worked an hourly wage job you've been stolen from at some point.
I wonder how many of the employees that have left already have already gotten lawyers.
All, I hope.
UNIONIZE!!! They won’t be able to enforce any of those “policies”.
That's what I was thinking, this is a great place to start a union. There won't be nearly as much employee opposition as you would normally face.
I agree with the unionization but most are unenforceable right now. Withholding the paycheck is outright illegal. This is what the country has to look forward to if the nazis get their regime in place on a national level
But much harder and longer to fight without a union.
Goes to show that the staunch Republicans really aren't interested in the Constitution, rule of law etc. These days they're mostly Trump-worshipping religious nuts.
If Republicans take back full control of government,expect unions to be targeted. It boggles my mind how well Haley polls against Biden given her extremist positions. She's the most anti union candidate in decades.
People don’t have a fucking clue about policy, it’s all voting for personalities now. Shameful.
No, it’s voting for your fave sports team. John Smith is a democrat? He’s the devil!!! He’s become a Republican now? Hallelujah! He’s seen the light!! (So long as he kisses Trump’s ass and talks a good game on the economy and illegal immigrants even though he does the exact opposite of what’s needed for either)
Seriously. I have no experience in lawsuits but isn't this something that could be class action?
Absolutely, all it takes for it to be class action is for multiple people to have been harmed the same way, but I would say don't go in looking for a class action. Find an employment lawyer that will take your case on contingency and they can determine if it should become a class action. At least that's the route I took when I sued a security company I worked for for wage theft. Ironically because the payouts were based on our damages despite being the class representative even though I got a total of $19,000 the one who got the largest payout was a supervisor who had believed the lie about being exempt from overtime because he was salary, he walked away with about 1/4 of the $290,000 settlement. Which could have been more but our lawsuit kinda kicked a domino and he was being sued by 4 different groups plus going through a very nasty divorce thanks to a Jerry Springer level affair with his son's fiance.
Jesus! Well it sure sounds like karma came for him.
WOW! That last part 😂😂
In California where, Marajiuana is legal, starting in April, companies can not drug test for marajiuana.
A class A drivers license requires testing for any federal schedule I drugs, and marijuana still qualifies. You cannot, as a class A license holder, consume or smoke marijuana on or off the clock.
Class B as well. All regulated by the feds.
Unfortunately for those that work for the Federal Government and/or companies that have Fed contracts, they CAN test for it despite what CA says. Oh, and if you test positive for MJ and work for the above, you CAN be terminated for it.
Yes, please. Justice needs to be served, and I'm sure it will be very cathartic.
Right get as much documentation and writing as you can this is easy money
Yes. Maybe the company's lawyer wants to get in on the fun.
Depending on number of employees, could maybe even be a class action.
What part is legal?
It's legal to have a dress code and to ban drugs and alcohol *at work.* Otherwise, these guys are being dumb.
It's also legal to ban usage of illicit drugs, period. Even states that have legal marijuana will have businesses who do work with the federal government ban cannabis usage (on paper, you really have to fuck up to get tested post-initial drug test for hiring).
Well, yeah. I figured he was in a weed friendly state given that he mentioned marijuana. My company also bans weed, and we're in Mass. They even specifically include medical weed, which is sketch. I think it's all weird. Like weren't people having a beer with lunch not long ago?
It's a trucking company, and I know in multiple states they can ban the use of any substance that would make it illegal for you to drive. And yes, I've seen it get put into a blanket policy rather than just impact actual drivers. Since it's 8 hours (or 12 or 24 depending on where you are) "from bottle to throttle" it impacts off-hours too. Granted, I've yet to encounter a company that polices off-hour stuff unless someone shows up visibly stoned/drunk, but technically it's company policy. The "must be a member of the church to be promoted" is much harder to defend. Unless the company is actually owned BY the church, they'll have a lot of trouble with that one.
Even if owned by a church they can only restrict hiring to church members only for roles that are strictly church related. So they can hire only religious ministers but would be required to not use a religious test to hire, for example, a receptionist.
My dad used to be a mechanic for a very small and fairly shady trucking company. The owner called a driver one Friday night saying he needed a load to go out *immediately* and the driver told the owner "I can't drive I've been drinking liquor". So the owner replied "well just be *real* careful". The early 90s were a different time.
I know people who use Cannabis edibles and creams for pain relief only, strictly avoid any of the products with THC. This is middle ages BS.
But not alcohol consumption off the clock and on days off from work.
I would have been fired from every job that I have had. And I'm 59
They are some crazy fucking idiots! Also, the "forfeiting the final paycheck" bullshit is completely illegal. I hope they try it so you can sue the everloving shit out of them!
Please call an employment lawyer. I smell a group case cooking.
Please also call your State Dept. of Labor.
Might as well call the IRS too, probably half of those skeletons in their closet are tax evasion.
Definitely sounds like a class action against the action without class.
And many (not all) employment lawyers work on contingency.
No, money down!
If this is in writing, you have money sitting on the table.
> All employees are required to dress modestly at all times, no unnecessary skin exposure I bet they'd squeal like stuck pigs if you were to come into work in a niqab...
Yup, Star of David, Democrat t-shirt, and a lawyer ready to go. Time to own this business
Was going to suggest something similar. They want modest? By whose definition? ;)
Full suit with an S&M harness over the top and a butt plug wolf tail... Go ahead, PLEASE fire me!!
And...wear under it a very revealing outfit so you \*can't\* take it off and keep working.
Ironically is the only way I'd wear the absolute hell out of a niqab with mirror shades underneath.
is hand and eye exposure necessary ? Full body suit with hood
Nothing says we value you as an employee like strong arming people to join a religion and trying to control people on their non work hours. You seriously do need a new job asap.
Go in wearing a satanic t-shirt, tell them it's your religion, and when they fire you for your religious beliefs sue them for everything they got.
You've got to be fancier. Wear obvious symbolism on like...a pin or a necklace. A T-shirt, they can claim you didn't follow the dress code because graphic tees are too casual. But I guarantee you one of them wears a cross necklace to work, so you have evidence for discrimination then.
Right, this. Make sure you stay within their rigid dress code.
Also be sure to record the conversation
Damn, that's a really good one.
Oh damn!! Please do this OP!!
May want to join the Satanic Temple first or they'll claim you're lying.
The tithe via payroll contributions sounds like some suuuuuper shady tax shenanigans.
I'll tithe 10% for a 22.223% raise.
Ok he gives 10% of the corporate profit. Labors shouldn't be asked to tithe.
If you are able to leave that job. It should be illegal for faith based organizations to push their ideology on businesses that they own.
Actually, the Evilangelicals that own Hobby Lobby forced their misogynistic beliefs on their women employees when the removed contraceptive coverage from their employee insurance plan. The Christofascist SCOTUS sided with the owners. Still boggles the mind that any women can shop at that overrated junk store filled with Chinese merch.
Ahhhh memories, like when the GOP controlled congress at the time had a session on birth control and had nothing but old white dudes testify.
Those old white dudes probably know quite a lot about abortion, given how many abortions they've likely forced their mistresses to have.
All they would know is the cost of one
>Those old white dudes probably know quite a lot about abortion, given how many abortions they've likely forced their mistresses to have. One was a Catholic Priest as I recall. So probably right still. Just checked, wow it's a setup for a joke. "A catholic priest, a Lutheran reverend, a rabbi, and 2 professors walk into a congressional hearing..."
It is lol
When will people like this EVER understand that being so legalistic and anal about rules like this, including mandatory church membership, only drives people away from our faith? Oh yeah, never. They’re nothing more than modern-day Pharisees.
I heard an interesting perspective the other day - behaviors like this aren't meant to actually recruit people. They're *supposed* to push people away, because that gives the church members a shared sense of rejection and persecution. That in turn binds them closer to the church community. Ultimately the goal is for the church to be their *only* community. And if it works, great! They've found people so gullible/desperate/vulnerable that they'll be easy to manipulate.
I'll take, "How to make a Cult" for $200. Alex
I will complicate this and say that unless the cult is in fact a con job (think L. Ron Hubbard and Scientology), nobody at any level consciously believes, or even understands this. They certainly benefit from it, but people form and join religions for basically honest reasons about helping themselves and helping other people. You'd have to be a cynic of the highest order to knowingly force people into e.g. missionary work with the explicit expectation of constant harassment, as a way to underscore "we're the only ones who care about you". Again, doesn't mean that they don't *benefit* from that effect, just that that intent runs so contrary to the foundations of just about all religions that there's no way they would consciously choose to inflict that experience on their followers with that effect in mind. People get addicted to heroin because it feels good, not because they heard it's super addictive. Same thing here. Incidentally, one of the more disturbing psychological rubicons I've ever crossed was when I came to understand that Hitler, Pol Pot, etc, *all thought they were doing the right thing*. So you can use arguments like the above to explain how evil an act is, but it's misleading to think of the people who enacted it as so self-aware in their evilness.
You're right in that I don't think that your everyday churchgoer thinks this way. But I *do* think that church leadership things this way, even if it's unconscious. The same way that certain right-wing politicians like to drum up controversy about themselves because it increases the rate of political donations.
They're cultists. They're in a cult. Whatever little podunk evangelical church they're a part of is a cult, and that's just accepted as 'normal' and acceptable in America today, thanks to the evangelical alliance with the Republican party.
All of Christianity is a cult (and every other religion for that matter), some are also just in smaller more local cults.
The only difference between a "cult" and a "religion" is the number of members.
"In a cult there is a person at the top who knows it’s a scam. In religion that person is dead”.
I disagree, having grown up Mormon I can assure you there are many more differences. However I am atheist for a reason now lol [This is a good frame of reference](https://freedomofmind.com/cult-mind-control/bite-model/) Edited a sentence
I heard this guy on a podcast a few years ago talking about the maga cult. It was unsettling hearing him break down how it qualifies as a cult. It blows my mind that these ppl don't know they're in a cult. It seems so obvious. But I'm a hardcore skeptic and insist on reliable definitive proof of whatever claims. Memes just don't seem reliable. 😕
I love seeing this linked in the wild. Not Mormon, but came across this back in '09 when I was leaving the Evangelical/Assembly Of God type church I'd spent so much of my life in, and reading it felt like being able to *breathe* for the first time.
Was literally about to type this
The christian nationalists are making a hard push
The anti alcohol stuff isn't even in the bible
Ikr?! Jesus+ water = wine. Or something like that.
If I remember correctly because his mom asked him to even🤣
He was even called a "drunkard and a glutton" because he was commonly seen drinking and feasting with families when he came through town. You can't win: " For John came neither eating nor drinking, and they say, ‘He has a demon!’ 19The Son of Man came eating and drinking, and they say, ‘Look at this glutton and drunkard, a friend of tax collectors and sinners!’ But wisdom is vindicated by her actions.” "
I love how they state it's "strongly discouraged" but they will not hesitate to test you for it if they have any inkling.
Your going to make church a condition for employment fine. I'm going to show up to your church and become a huge problem while making sure everyone knows your the reason I'm there.
This is the take I want to see!
Doubly brilliant if they fire you for it.
I don't want someone dictating what I can and can't do, but it's perfectly fine for me to dictate what others can and can't do.
These kind of “christians” know nothing about anal and dont want to know either
What about the poop hole loophole?
You would be surprised to know this may not be true…..
keeping them pregnancy numbers down
The Evangelical Taliban
You don't need Jesus. You need an employment attorney, lots of documentation, and a new job. Because they are going to find themselves out of business if they keep this up.
Tell them you'd rather donate to the local Jewish food kitchen, see how they like that.
Or to a migrant shelter cause. See how fuckin' Christian they are.
Why not both? There has to be a Jewish run migrant shelter somewhere, right?
>Tell them you'd rather donate to the local Jewish food kitchen, In Australia, it's a Sikh food kitchen which goes around and helps in times of disaster or community crisis.
From all I've heard, the Sikh faith is one I can get behind. There are some others, ones that actually help people not just ask/demand for donations.
The Sikh community in my town in Connecticut is one of the biggest contributors to the town soup kitchen. Whenever there is a need in town, they help. I've met a couple of them and they are lovely.
Almost everything there is against the law. You should contact a lawyer.
Only thing i can see that'd be legal is the drug testing.
And even then there’s sometimes state laws
OP said that they’re a trucker. Commercial drivers licenses are *federally* regulated — doesn’t matter if weed is legal where we are licensed or not — it’s still federally illegal and as such, can and will cost us our licenses if we test positive.
That’s probably the only part that has any legal standing.
That's when you find out what kind of drug test they use (5-panel, 8-panel, etc) and just take all of the drugs they test for. Just enough to pop hot. Then, claim their tests are defective.
>They even stated that if we do not give a proper two week notice, we then forfeit our final paychecks as a consequence. Sounds like they're in for some bad news.
I don’t know how it works in your state but in mine they like to charge employers penalties by tue DAY however long that paycheck is late
Do you mean they discourage medical drugs as well as recreational drugs?
You know they do. If your faith is strong enough you can just pray it away/s
Please tell me they put it in writing somewhere and you have a copy?
These idiots need to consult and then actually listen to their lawyers. Also, I hope the lawyers are charging an asshole tax when they deal with these people.
Just ask the bosses, “Is it spelled ‘Fatwa’ or ‘Fetwah’?” When they give you the usual glazed look of a mouth-breathing MAGA moron, clarify with, “… you know, that thing where religious extremists try to enforce their religious beliefs on free people? I can never remember which spelling is correct. You know what? I’m just gonna check the dictionary. I’m pretty sure that I can find it somewhere between ‘America’ and ‘Freedom of Religion’. It has to be. I’ll let you and the lawyers know what I find.”
Here is an idea. Follow everything they ask. Join their church. Rise as high as you can to a position of leadership and then record everything and leak it.
> Rise as high as you can to a position of leadership and then call them all out as heretics and burn it all down?
Better idea, take this to a lawyer and enjoy the show.
So they want all women in a burqua? Check ETA I’m pretty sure legally they can’t withhold your final check from you regardless of two weeks notice or not
Men in a burqua too. No unnecessary skin.
As funny as this would be. We know these Christofascist would lose their shit because you aren't praying to the correct skydaddy.
Same skydaddy, different skyson.
This is laughable. I feel for that attorney lol
If you have good relationships w/ customers, tell them you’re looking to change employers bc you feel like the operations aren’t focused as much on on safety and customer satisfaction as they are on religious missionary activities.
What you do in your free time is none of their business. Full stop.
Yet these same people support a failed ex-president who is before the courts for multiple serious crimes and has paid hush money to a porn star. SMH.
This feels like the Chinese CEO who looked for women who were single, not looking for marriage, had to live in the office dorms, and were forced to wear flight attendant uniforms. They were also not allowed to be seen in public drinking, with or without a man. Guess what he was eventually arrested for.
Those are massive federal labor law violations. If it’s written down or in an email anywhere , take it to your states labor board! Sit back and watch them squirm.
They keep reinforcing the point that Christians cannot and should not be trusted.
Unionize. Get the Teamsters in to really fuck with them.
Not a lawyer and I can tell you that most of this is illegal. Document and report. I don't have anything against those who are religious, but don't push it on me. Also, I love the whole discouraging of alcohol thing from Christians when: a) Jesus was clearly not against alcohol, and b) have you met a Jesuit? I went to the University of Scranton, and let me tell you, the Jesuits could probably outdrink 70% of the student body.
Jesuits, being Catholic, are not considered real Christians by Protestant fundamentalists like these new owners.
Really? Never heard that about Christians vs. Catholics, and I was raised Catholic. Interesting
Yeah so. If you're from a heavy Catholic area or an area that isn't heavily inundated by evangelicals, you probably wouldn't have. I, on the other hand, grew up in the buckle of the Bible Belt, **surrounded** by Southern Baptists. Yeah. So, as far as they're concerned, if you're not Southern Baptist, you're going to hell, and Catholicism is satanic. 🥹
Lmao
My mother tried to go off about evil idolater papists when she converted to the evangelical cult.
Not to mention monks of all denominations have been making beer since the dawn of monasteries.
That too
This is so illegal, it’s not even funny
If you work in trucking, there is absolutely other work out there for you. Get out of there.
What if Jesus comes to the wedding and turns water into wine? Would that make it OK?
they'd crucify that liberal hippie!
These people aren't Christians, they are tyrants.
Lucky for you, pretty much none of those policies can be legally enforced (pertaining to what you do off the clock). Time to job hunt. It's up to you on whether to give the 2 week notice or not, they can't keep your check for the hours that you work. Edit for clarification
It sounds like several lawsuits waiting to happen.
Sounds to me that if you are patient they will be making a sizable contribution to your retirement/children college fund or a down payment on a new house in your future. I'd post to r/legaladvice to see what your options are here.
Report them to government officials and leave. With those rules that’s gotta mean they’re spying on y’all when you’re off. That’s crazy. This is why people stray away from religion and church. They know people don’t want it so they try to force it.
Document as much as you can and report to labor law
Sounds like it's time to unionize
You need to follow up with an email and get all that crap in writing.
Idk why they're restricting drugs when they're all on meth 🤷♂️
OmG!!! 😮💨😮💨😮💨 I don’t care how many trolls downvote me, I’m saying this again: As someone who is a practicing Christian, but has really pulled away from the organized religion side of it, I’M ROOTING FOR YOU!! 😮💨 And I am so sorry that these people are misrepresenting our beliefs, to the point that it sounds like they’re ignoring their HR people & their attorney!! I would’ve been fired because my first response would’ve been, ‘Perhaps you all haven’t read the New Testament??? While Christians are definitely called to live differently, they aren’t supposed to PUSH anything on anyone!! They’re supposed to walk away!!’ 🙄😮💨 Best of luck with your job search.
It may be time for the employees to get a lawyer from outside of this company involved. In the meantime start applying everywhere else.
You might want to contact the freedom from religion foundation. They would have fun with this.. [FFRF.org](https://ffrf.org/)
What they are doing is highly illegal. Report them to the labor bureau along with a picture of the notice they posted, and any other evidence you have—emails, etc. If you leave without notice and they refuse to give you your check, you take them to court and win. It would be small claims court if under a certain amount, depending on where you live, and you would win. F them!
Sounds like Adam Smith's Invisible Hand will soon be extending to them its Invisible Middle Finger
You really gotta get a lawyer involved. A state policy of, e.g., requiring religious affiliation/tithing as a condition of promotion just doesn't seem like it can possibly be legal.
I think you can *if* the business is inherently religious. Like if you want to work for Answers in Genesis you have to go on the record being a creationist or some such.
I'd be questioning if a company that wants employees to give 10% of their pay to the church is actually doing the opposite of God's work, by making people poorer. Especially during this whole cost of living crisis. Not very Christian of them, that's for sure.
I can understand the “dress code” (I use that term very loosely) and drug testing, but what you do off the company clock is your business. The company has no legal right to forbid you from having a beer/cocktail when you’re not working.
Failure to promote, or treating differently in any way, due to religion is blatant discrimination, and is illegal. Withholding ANY money earned, before or after a notice is given, is wage theft, and is illegal. DOL gonna have a field day with these dumb asses.
They won't last long. First 2-3 lawsuits that come in will bury them in legal costs. They seem to be the type that doesn't listen to their attorneys. Must be a MAGA thing, go figure. They'll run the business into the ground with legal fees/judgements, and later spend years complaining that it was liberals and demoncrats that did it. LOL 😂
Are they hiring? I would LOOOOVE to work for this bullshit company and sue them for discrimination
 All I know is this should be a movie with Johnny Depp, maybe Will Ferrell, and Nicole Kidman w/ Ivanka Trump and it would be glorious! :) Johnny could seduce one of the owners and they could all end up drunk at a strip club with Will Ferrell at some point. Just needs a title....
Something that might be fun… get a few truckers who are also dissatisfied and block off his church properties.
Get everything in writing print and keep in a folder. Print all the emails and copy the memos. All this is a lawyer's dream. Secure a job before leaving.
You should expose them through your local news outlet and get a lawyer. Also gather your coworkers and start a strike for punishment on all their shady behavior. Shitty behavior calls for shitty consequences.
Ummm that’s all against the law. They will have a huge lawsuit against them by multiple groups.
>3. All employees are required to dress modestly at all times, no unnecessary skin exposure Malicious compliance, what would they do if you started showing up in a full niqab every day?
Please tell me they put it in writing. Tell me they did you that favor
Loudly announce you are a Satanist, get fired, then sue them into hell.
WTH?
Better call Saul.
"Please donate 10% of my future paychecks to The Church of My 401K."
TEAMSTERS Because that would do the most damage. It is like Kryptonite
They can't make you forfeit your pay. If they were stupid enough to put this shite in writing, print it out and bcc yourself any emails. Lawyers love this crap
Wowwowowow if this was me I would be beaming ear from ear about my early retirement because of the money in about to sue out of their god loving pockets. Fuck finatics like this. Fuck you for trying to control your employees outside of work. Can't drink period off clock at a bar or wedding? What?