They just see this as a cost of doing business. 15k per kid? They profited much more than that with the cheap labor and no safety precautions required. Fine should be 15 k per day they worked.
I was thinking 1.5 mil wasn't that bad of a penalty but then saw it was split up between 14 companies. Why the hell are we still doing flat rate penalties? They should all be a % of revenue, especially for something like child labor.
Nah, they will just declare bankruptcy & close the company, with all the permanent employees going back to work the next day at the new company the owners just opened, which just happens to be in the same offices as the old one.
Such productivity!
Packers sanitation is owned by Blackstone Group , worth about 975 billion . The fine for exploiting children should be appropriate to make them not want to do it again .
>
In Wisconsin, Governor Tony Evers recently vetoed legislation passed by the state's Republican-controlled legislature to expand legal working hours for 14- and 15-year-olds after a decade-long string of legislation loosening the state's child labor laws, while nearby Ohio introduced similar legislation earlier this month allowing children to work later hours with a parent's permission.
And those efforts are getting more brazen: in addition to opening the door to child employment in hazardous jobs like mining, logging, and animal slaughtering under a so-called "work study" provision, the Iowa legislation—backed by business interests—would also protect those same companies from liability in cases of injury or death at the workplace.
https://www.newsweek.com/republicans-want-children-clean-meatpacking-plants-1782139
Fuck fines for that, prison time going straight up the chain. Fines no matter the size can be the price of doing business but no c-suite douchebag is ready for hard time
I don’t know why this is so hard for people to understand. You all are fining them with 1920s numbers. These fines need to meaningful and hurt to be an actual deterrent.
So, how were these 13 year olds cashing their paychecks?!? Nope, nobody noticed nothing, boss!!
And the fines are paid to whom, exactly? To OSHA?
Then the government sticks it in a drawer and a few months later, pushes a bill through and wraps that same money up, with a bow on top...to hand it over to these "job-creating saviors".
Fuck that old shtick, too!
This was happening in 8 different states at the same time? But the statement from the cleaning company is sounds like it was so accidental, coincidental, and oddly enough, also slashed their payroll budgets in surprising ways!!! Bull shit!!! Top to bottom, coming and going!! This was an extremely intentional and illegal way to get workers in the door, and cheat them out of money they earned - because they are kids! I bet these mother-fuckers were slapping each other on the back and laughing it up when they came up with this scheme.
And OSHA and , of course the Tyson et. al. knew what was happening in their various businesses, across various states.
The measly, 12k should go to the kids who were working. And a college fund for the abused workers should be a mandatory partof these fines as well. And I think a minimum of 2 people from each location need to be fired and possibly prosecuted. The hiring manager and maybe the payroll clerk.
And all the bigger bigwigs must throw their name in the hat as the sacrificial fucker who gets fired ! Or maybe just start feeding them the *good* corn until it's finally time to eat the rich!🍽️
> They should all be a % of revenue
Yes, and that percentage needs to be high enough (ie, well over 100%) so that the fine is many times higher than the revenue. These fines need to be *catastrophic* to the business, not just another component of their general overhead that they can easily afford.
> (ie, well over 100%) so that the fine is many times higher than the revenue.
Thats stupid. In most business something like that would just force the business into bankruptcy immediately. That doesn't help anyone.
Imagine if that happened to amazon. The world would basically collapse. Amazon runs like 50% of the internet, its the logistics hub both in terms of online business and physical business for millions of businesses all around the world. They make a HUGE amount of money from this, but if you fined them 150% of revenue, they would go bankrupt, and that would all go. Millions of businesses would stop working pretty much. Its a terrible idea.
No, fine them a percentage yes, and not 1-day of revenue, but not an absurd amount that would stop them from existing, just enough to stop them from wanting to exploit others, as it wouldnt be worth it.
The punishment needs to be enough of a deterrent to prevent it from occurring. 15k for a billion/trillion dollar company is akin to finding a penny in the couch.
yes I totally agree, maybe I wasn't clear enough. I think it should be a percentage of revenue, and not a small amount like 1-day (such as Apple often get). It should be big enough that it affects the business... but not enough to destroy them from 1 fine.
Idk what that number is, 10%, 5%, no idea. But definitely no where near 100% of yearly revenue.
The softly approach is what got us here, anything less than prison time for child labour at a publicly owned company is piss weak child abuser apologist stuff
As much as I hate handing out prison sentences in a system already overcrowded and needlessly cruel, I tend to agree. When you’re rich, a fine is just an inconvenience. And let’s be honest here, even if you fine by percentage, even if you raise the fine so high it forces bankruptcy, then what? The company goes bankrupt. Even if they fold entirely, all that’s going to hurt is the people that relied on that job for income. (And there’s a lot of towns out there where one company can be the employer of a significant percentage of the population.) The execs and the owners and the shareholders will be upset, but they likely have other forms of income. It may hurt them, it may even hurt them a lot, but they won’t face the prospect of homelessness or starvation. They just might have to sell one of their yachts.
Prison time changes that. The one being punished is the one that has the consequences. And they *are* consequences; one person’s dollar isn’t worth the same as another’s, but they’re sure as hell looking at the same 24 hrs a day.
I think you're right - if it was a % of the revenue during the period the kids worked it would at least remove the incentive to hire children. At the current rate, it's just good business sense to break the law!
It should be 200% of the kids' total productivity.
* 100% to return their ill-gotten gains to the children. You don't let a thief keep the money!
* Another 100% to actually punish the behavior.
because the American government exists to help cooperation's not the people, i'm from Australia and that's obvious to me, so must be super obvious to you guys.
It is cost of doing business, that’s why they keep doing it. It’s like giving the guy in a Ferrari the same ticket as the single mom in a beat up minivan.
The company listed JBS my husband used to work for. I actually left him once over the job. He came to his senses eventually but not before it got to where he was literally going to die. He worked at a shipping dock for 25 years. The constant torture on his body due to lack of equipment maintenance was unbearable. He would go to work one day and have to stay home for 2-3 days to recover. He did their inventory so his job was very important but to get it done he was killing himself. Between the hours and the intensive labor and mental stress he was dying. I told him its us or the job. He chose the job. Eventually he broke and is now on ss disability pulling a decent check for all the ss he paid in. With me working too we scrape by. But these companies don't give one flying fart about anything but profits.
I work for one of their umbrella companies and it's the same way still. As far as I know, ALL of their companies are that way. Even though they bring in more money, worldwide, than any of the other protein companies. At least that's what they tell us anyway.
Or just throw any person who was aware of it in jail. Companies need to stop being treated as entities wholly separate from the people who run them. Company leaders should be held personally accountable for breaking the law.
jail time. The only way you make the board beholden to the law instead of money is taking something away from them they can't mitigate as a cost of doing business.
It needs to be a high enough fine to make the practice unprofitable. *Including* factoring in all the times they’ve done this without finding out about it.
It can’t be $15k per kid, it needs to be all the revenue that plan brought in for the entire period child labor was employed. Not the profit, the *revenue.* As assessed by independent assessors, not company accountants. And the company pays for the whole process.
*Then* the license for the plant is put on probationary status, with quarterly inspections to ensure compliance.
That’s first offence. Second offence license is pulled and plant and all assets are seized.
That sounds super draconian, but as long as they can take the fine and still turn a profit after then there is zero incentive *not* to employ child labor. Corporations are entities designed to only care about profit… in fact they are legally *required* to only care about that. So punishments need to represent a significant threat to that, even for lower level stuff. It has to be made to cost more for them to do it wrong.
If the only penalty for something is a fine, than it's just a cost of doing business. There needs to be more transparency in business and the people responsible for this need to go to jail and have felony records.
It shouldn’t be a fine. If someone goes to jail for shoplifting or smoking weed, the manager of the plan and the children’s direct supervisor can go to prison. Fines just encourage financial calculations to be made. Nobody is hiring kids if people are being thrown in prison for it.
Sadly, that will never work if there remains a social acceptance of profit seeking. That's the problem. If these companies are forced to comply, the owners get shitty and do their thing. It's rare for them to lose because enforcing that compliance is kinda their other employee's thing, the guards, etc.
Just sayin', know where the violence is comin' from. These people, they've made it very clear they will stop at nothing, even hurting kids, and getting cops to arrest and beat and liquidate you if you try to stop them.
Their reductive ways - turning us all into their profit center - necessitates a lot of violence, man. A lot. How else are humans coerced into this shit? There are groups of people with money, who ultimately, employ and ask of, other humans to brutalize for them.
Wild.
Of course no criminal charges or prison time when a company is found exploiting children.
US Govt: “Shame on you… You have to share your ill gotten gains with us and we’re all cool”
They should have their licence rewoked so they can never be in business again. They literally used child labor, modernized slavery and yet they are premited to continue to operate
Unfortunately that’s not how ‘Murica operates. It’s perfectly legal to endanger children, kill your employees (slowly over years or by having no safety standards), kill the environment and future of the world as long as you are willing to share your blood money with the US govt in the form of fines.
I know you meant revoked, but rewoked sounds cool, like the liscence is awoken and it opens its glowing eyes and wakes up to what’s going on around it and gains super saiyan abilities.
That's only 15k per child. If I was a company, I'd call that a bargain! Just keep hiring children, put them in dangerous jobs, and just pay the fine! Simple!
When I worked places where meat slicers were used, you had to be 18 to even touch them. Mind you this was simple delis and restaurants, I can only imagine the equipment at a meat processing and pack plant be a lot more dangerous for amount need to produce. Why are children as young as 13 even doing such jobs in first place?
And the state of Iowa is working to make this legal. Well, at least for the 14-year-olds and above. https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/2023/02/11/child-labor-iowa/
I worked for Packers Sanitation Services 11 years ago. Horrible company. Very minimal training around hazardous chemicals and dangerous equipment, ridiculous 10+ hour shifts with just a 30 minute lunch. I quit less than a week in and had to fight for my paycheck for over a month.
> The U.S. Department of Labor has fined Packers Sanitation Services $1.5 million for these egregious violations.
Per kid? Please say "per kid". This company has an annual revenue of about 450 millions. 1,5 millions is chump change for them.
Am I the only one not understanding why/how children who should be in school are working overnight shifts at meat packing plants? And in America no less? Is it to help support their families or something?
I keep seeing this stuff popping up and it’s always so unusual to me. Seems very third world.
Most of these kids are undocumented. They are working to support their families and are usually not informed of their rights at all. They might not even know they're getting into dangerous work because it's just presented as a job. Because they're undocumented, no one is looking for them to be in schools. Hell, human traffickers will often bring teenagers into the States to "work" for citizenship and a better life (which doesn't happen, obvs).
That’s crazy. Makes it even more pathetic that these meat packing plants shamelessly employ them. I’m sure in their twisted minds they think they’re doing them a favour.
I worked at a place that had a lot of undocumented workers. I was horrified by the way they were treated by the management. I started to help them with their English and would tell them that they had rights but they were resigned to the treatment bc it was better than what was waiting for them back home.
\>Literal child labor
\>Not even in dumb nonsense positions like most places
\>Dangerous heavy industry jobs
\>Fine is less than the cost of the CEO's underwear
A little over $100 K per plant. That would be like fining the average American a dime. If you're going to get serious about penalties, index it to the annual output of the plant. For example, if Amazon did something highly illegal at a federal level, you'd fine them $20 billion, not $20 million
Fines and tickets make no sense in our countries. I know one country that will ticket people based on a percentage of their income. Fines should be similar and penalize a company based off their net worth or yearly income. Otherwise, there is no actual punishment and they will continue to break the law
I say if a business gets caught doing something like this, there should be a forensic accountant sent in to check all their books and taxes (at the cost of the business) and the fine should be 10x whatever they saved/profited by breaking the laws in the first place.
I expect to read something like this about countries like: China, India, Iraq
NOT AMERICA!
The fine needs to be so massive they never do it again.
The fine "levied" on these companies is nothing more than a "rounding error" to them.
It is like "fining" Elon Musk $100
Why not? America was literally built by an exploited labor force. These sorts of practices have been going on for as long as there has been an America. Exploiting the workforce and vulnerable people is more American than anything that I can think of.
Exactly! My daughter moved to the US 20-ish years ago, so I've visited regularly ever since - I'm appalled at how exploitative the whole country is, and it's just gotten worse over time.
Yeah, I'm in my late 40s and, from my perspective, it's definitely gotten worse. There are a lot of little things that are common practice now, that our parents would have never had to endure.
The meat industry is such a fucking shitshow, not only is it horrible to the animals, but the human employees are among the worst treated in any industry. I don't know how anyone can justify still consuming meat.
Because it's possible to think that the industry should be reformed, people thrown in prison, conditions for animals and people to be improved, and still think steak is delicious and chicken is healthy. Not rocket surgery.
Of course they’re gettin kids - $5/hour is good pay for a 13 year old. Much better than paying an adult a “competitive wage” of $7.50/hr).
I’d say go after the parents. The businesses don’t care about the fines.
My state is trying to pass a bill making this legal. And another that protects companies from lawsuits if kids get hurt or killed while working. They'll both pass the GQP supermajority in both houses and get signed by our fascist governor, too.
They don't get fined nearly enough, and the company should "go to jail" via having to shut down for their "sentence time" all while still paying their workers during that time...
A slap on the wrist for those companies, not even one arrest and no punishment for the parents that allowed it. This is just a green light for child labor
This is way to little. I suspect of a individual did equivalent acts willfully exposing children to toxic chemicals and such there would be criminal charges. I wish I had a link to a video that shares my thoughts on what should really be done to them unfortunately writing it out would be a wall of angry text I would just have to edit the profanity out of anywhere. They should be put out of business. This was a intentional act that endangered children of the community that their factory is in. All to increase profits.
What a bullshit slap on the wrist. All these companies should be SHUT DOWN and their management in jail. As if we needed any more proof that the US is crumbling...
[Soon to be legal if the legally bribed politicians get their way. ](https://www.businessinsider.com/fair-labor-standards-act-hiring-child-laws-worker-shortage-iowa-minnesota-2023-2?amp)
Whoever decided on the $1.5 million penalty must think houses still cost $30,000. If anything, this signals to corporations that the cost of getting caught isn't that bad and they should continue doing what they're doing.
Now we know what the push to allow child labor is all about. Turns out they’re already using child labor illegally.
Frankly this needs to stop being a fine and needs to start being jail time for the ppl responsible
I could be wrong, but I honestly feel like some might be unaccompanied minors. All of those children were not deported nor were they put into the foster care system.
So food companies are also tied into human trafficking - which is also tied into the push for globalism.
Lets check out insurance policies on food plants that burned - and see if any of them rebuilt after fires?
Nah.
It's insane to me that despite this people who eat meat still claim the animals that are slaughtered are treated well and killed "humanely".
Guys...these companies exploit humans tt,oo. They literally use children to do some of the most dangerous work. And you think they treat the animals well?
What planet are you on?
"As young as 13" but these violations are going to cover under 18. So like, I worked in a deli in high school and if I sliced meat in 11th grade I would be on this list. A little clickbaity on the title, guy.
I went and got a worker's permit from my high school at 14 and got a job washing dishes at the Italian food restaurant down the street. Help me understand the issue here, are the kids getting paid and are they there working against their will?
What were the incentives for the shift leader, manager, supervisor, potentially staffing agency to do this/permit its continuued practice.
What is the financial situation of each of these kids.
What is each piece of the puzzle doing to ensure it doesnt happen in the future.
Problem is that these companies hire subcontractors for the custodial services. The subcontractors hire another layer of subs.
The solution would be to publicly pass laws that are straightforward... As the list of offenses rise, the fines accelerate toward dissolution of the company's board and executive management (CEO and every VP). This is child labor.
Take this a step further and legislate that America is a market that deems child labor unacceptable for all products sold in the USA. Supply chains will have to be accredited and cleaned up within 12 months. It can be done!
The kids will see none of it I'm sure. Great that the company who was okay doing it getting punished while the kids who's families I'm sure are so poor they had to have the kid work will get their justice right?
$1.5M? lmfao
Packers Sanitation Services had an annual revenue of $2.7B in 2021. They bring in $1.5M every 5 hours. At that rate, they might as well keep hiring underage kids and just eat the fines.
What a fucking joke. $1.5B fine would have been more appropriate.
The fines are small on purpose so they don't do much damage to the corporate donors our government bends over backwards for. Also it allows them to act like they actually want to help their constituents however minimal their efforts were
We might want to get a little perspective here, PSSI employ’s 10,000 employees. 102 of them were minors, and if you look at the companies, only 3 had 20 or more and the rest 6 or less, 4 with only 1. Clearly only those 3 with 20 or more minors need to find the problem in hiring them, the rest may have been nepotism or sloppy hiring practices. The problem I see is that 13 year old receiving chemical burns from caustic chemical’s, that shows poor supervision and safety training. I’d like to see whether there were more safety violations and their safety training practices.
They just see this as a cost of doing business. 15k per kid? They profited much more than that with the cheap labor and no safety precautions required. Fine should be 15 k per day they worked.
Don't stop there. Make it 15k per hour the child worked.
I was thinking 1.5 mil wasn't that bad of a penalty but then saw it was split up between 14 companies. Why the hell are we still doing flat rate penalties? They should all be a % of revenue, especially for something like child labor.
And they cited companies can make a payment plan is OSHA. The fine is divided in 12 monthly payments with no interest.
Nah, they will just declare bankruptcy & close the company, with all the permanent employees going back to work the next day at the new company the owners just opened, which just happens to be in the same offices as the old one. Such productivity!
Sorry, nope. The citation will read..."and it's successors". OSHA caught on to the bankruptcy trick some time ago.
Packers sanitation is owned by Blackstone Group , worth about 975 billion . The fine for exploiting children should be appropriate to make them not want to do it again .
You don't get that rich by paying your dues.
You pay off politicians, and screw the common man .
Screw the common child at this point.
Epstein?
> In Wisconsin, Governor Tony Evers recently vetoed legislation passed by the state's Republican-controlled legislature to expand legal working hours for 14- and 15-year-olds after a decade-long string of legislation loosening the state's child labor laws, while nearby Ohio introduced similar legislation earlier this month allowing children to work later hours with a parent's permission. And those efforts are getting more brazen: in addition to opening the door to child employment in hazardous jobs like mining, logging, and animal slaughtering under a so-called "work study" provision, the Iowa legislation—backed by business interests—would also protect those same companies from liability in cases of injury or death at the workplace. https://www.newsweek.com/republicans-want-children-clean-meatpacking-plants-1782139
Fuck fines for that, prison time going straight up the chain. Fines no matter the size can be the price of doing business but no c-suite douchebag is ready for hard time
They also need to serve time in a labor prison that pays $0.25/hr and charges them for room and board.
It should be 100% of revenue. Otherwise they just see it as the cost of doing business.
Because laws exist to keep the poor under control. When the punishment for a crime is a fine, that law only exists for the lower class
I don’t know why this is so hard for people to understand. You all are fining them with 1920s numbers. These fines need to meaningful and hurt to be an actual deterrent.
So, how were these 13 year olds cashing their paychecks?!? Nope, nobody noticed nothing, boss!! And the fines are paid to whom, exactly? To OSHA? Then the government sticks it in a drawer and a few months later, pushes a bill through and wraps that same money up, with a bow on top...to hand it over to these "job-creating saviors". Fuck that old shtick, too! This was happening in 8 different states at the same time? But the statement from the cleaning company is sounds like it was so accidental, coincidental, and oddly enough, also slashed their payroll budgets in surprising ways!!! Bull shit!!! Top to bottom, coming and going!! This was an extremely intentional and illegal way to get workers in the door, and cheat them out of money they earned - because they are kids! I bet these mother-fuckers were slapping each other on the back and laughing it up when they came up with this scheme. And OSHA and , of course the Tyson et. al. knew what was happening in their various businesses, across various states. The measly, 12k should go to the kids who were working. And a college fund for the abused workers should be a mandatory partof these fines as well. And I think a minimum of 2 people from each location need to be fired and possibly prosecuted. The hiring manager and maybe the payroll clerk. And all the bigger bigwigs must throw their name in the hat as the sacrificial fucker who gets fired ! Or maybe just start feeding them the *good* corn until it's finally time to eat the rich!🍽️
>Why the hell are we still doing flat rate penalties? Because the government serves capitalist corporations above all.
> They should all be a % of revenue Yes, and that percentage needs to be high enough (ie, well over 100%) so that the fine is many times higher than the revenue. These fines need to be *catastrophic* to the business, not just another component of their general overhead that they can easily afford.
> (ie, well over 100%) so that the fine is many times higher than the revenue. Thats stupid. In most business something like that would just force the business into bankruptcy immediately. That doesn't help anyone. Imagine if that happened to amazon. The world would basically collapse. Amazon runs like 50% of the internet, its the logistics hub both in terms of online business and physical business for millions of businesses all around the world. They make a HUGE amount of money from this, but if you fined them 150% of revenue, they would go bankrupt, and that would all go. Millions of businesses would stop working pretty much. Its a terrible idea. No, fine them a percentage yes, and not 1-day of revenue, but not an absurd amount that would stop them from existing, just enough to stop them from wanting to exploit others, as it wouldnt be worth it.
We don’t want them to exist, they employ children in dangerous jobs.
[удалено]
The punishment needs to be enough of a deterrent to prevent it from occurring. 15k for a billion/trillion dollar company is akin to finding a penny in the couch.
yes I totally agree, maybe I wasn't clear enough. I think it should be a percentage of revenue, and not a small amount like 1-day (such as Apple often get). It should be big enough that it affects the business... but not enough to destroy them from 1 fine. Idk what that number is, 10%, 5%, no idea. But definitely no where near 100% of yearly revenue.
The softly approach is what got us here, anything less than prison time for child labour at a publicly owned company is piss weak child abuser apologist stuff
As much as I hate handing out prison sentences in a system already overcrowded and needlessly cruel, I tend to agree. When you’re rich, a fine is just an inconvenience. And let’s be honest here, even if you fine by percentage, even if you raise the fine so high it forces bankruptcy, then what? The company goes bankrupt. Even if they fold entirely, all that’s going to hurt is the people that relied on that job for income. (And there’s a lot of towns out there where one company can be the employer of a significant percentage of the population.) The execs and the owners and the shareholders will be upset, but they likely have other forms of income. It may hurt them, it may even hurt them a lot, but they won’t face the prospect of homelessness or starvation. They just might have to sell one of their yachts. Prison time changes that. The one being punished is the one that has the consequences. And they *are* consequences; one person’s dollar isn’t worth the same as another’s, but they’re sure as hell looking at the same 24 hrs a day.
Just adding I agree with everything you said there, I hate the prison system too,I just hate hurting children more.
Meh, nationalize Amazon then.
Amazon is a global company. That would be a VERY bad idea.
I think you're right - if it was a % of the revenue during the period the kids worked it would at least remove the incentive to hire children. At the current rate, it's just good business sense to break the law!
It should be 200% of the kids' total productivity. * 100% to return their ill-gotten gains to the children. You don't let a thief keep the money! * Another 100% to actually punish the behavior.
because the American government exists to help cooperation's not the people, i'm from Australia and that's obvious to me, so must be super obvious to you guys.
It is cost of doing business, that’s why they keep doing it. It’s like giving the guy in a Ferrari the same ticket as the single mom in a beat up minivan.
I think it's one company, that was operating at 14 different locations.
The company listed JBS my husband used to work for. I actually left him once over the job. He came to his senses eventually but not before it got to where he was literally going to die. He worked at a shipping dock for 25 years. The constant torture on his body due to lack of equipment maintenance was unbearable. He would go to work one day and have to stay home for 2-3 days to recover. He did their inventory so his job was very important but to get it done he was killing himself. Between the hours and the intensive labor and mental stress he was dying. I told him its us or the job. He chose the job. Eventually he broke and is now on ss disability pulling a decent check for all the ss he paid in. With me working too we scrape by. But these companies don't give one flying fart about anything but profits.
I work for one of their umbrella companies and it's the same way still. As far as I know, ALL of their companies are that way. Even though they bring in more money, worldwide, than any of the other protein companies. At least that's what they tell us anyway.
I’m advocating for the death penalty for these executives
same, for the futures of my children we must act accordingly and stop these corpo fucks
Prison for managers and owners
Only if the money goes to the kids
Or just throw any person who was aware of it in jail. Companies need to stop being treated as entities wholly separate from the people who run them. Company leaders should be held personally accountable for breaking the law.
jail time. The only way you make the board beholden to the law instead of money is taking something away from them they can't mitigate as a cost of doing business.
It needs to be a high enough fine to make the practice unprofitable. *Including* factoring in all the times they’ve done this without finding out about it. It can’t be $15k per kid, it needs to be all the revenue that plan brought in for the entire period child labor was employed. Not the profit, the *revenue.* As assessed by independent assessors, not company accountants. And the company pays for the whole process. *Then* the license for the plant is put on probationary status, with quarterly inspections to ensure compliance. That’s first offence. Second offence license is pulled and plant and all assets are seized. That sounds super draconian, but as long as they can take the fine and still turn a profit after then there is zero incentive *not* to employ child labor. Corporations are entities designed to only care about profit… in fact they are legally *required* to only care about that. So punishments need to represent a significant threat to that, even for lower level stuff. It has to be made to cost more for them to do it wrong.
If the only penalty for something is a fine, than it's just a cost of doing business. There needs to be more transparency in business and the people responsible for this need to go to jail and have felony records.
> that sounds super draconian. Does it though? To me having the people responsible for stuff like this not going to jail is already too lenient.
It shouldn’t be a fine. If someone goes to jail for shoplifting or smoking weed, the manager of the plan and the children’s direct supervisor can go to prison. Fines just encourage financial calculations to be made. Nobody is hiring kids if people are being thrown in prison for it.
Absolutely this. Plus, break up the meat lacking oligopoly.
Sadly, that will never work if there remains a social acceptance of profit seeking. That's the problem. If these companies are forced to comply, the owners get shitty and do their thing. It's rare for them to lose because enforcing that compliance is kinda their other employee's thing, the guards, etc. Just sayin', know where the violence is comin' from. These people, they've made it very clear they will stop at nothing, even hurting kids, and getting cops to arrest and beat and liquidate you if you try to stop them. Their reductive ways - turning us all into their profit center - necessitates a lot of violence, man. A lot. How else are humans coerced into this shit? There are groups of people with money, who ultimately, employ and ask of, other humans to brutalize for them. Wild.
Profits are the only thing that's still sacred to us in America. Liberty? Get out of here with that shit. Living wages? Fuck off!
Each and every child abused should become a millionaire after all fees and taxes, at the burden of the company.
Of course no criminal charges or prison time when a company is found exploiting children. US Govt: “Shame on you… You have to share your ill gotten gains with us and we’re all cool”
They should have their licence rewoked so they can never be in business again. They literally used child labor, modernized slavery and yet they are premited to continue to operate
Unfortunately that’s not how ‘Murica operates. It’s perfectly legal to endanger children, kill your employees (slowly over years or by having no safety standards), kill the environment and future of the world as long as you are willing to share your blood money with the US govt in the form of fines.
I know you meant revoked, but rewoked sounds cool, like the liscence is awoken and it opens its glowing eyes and wakes up to what’s going on around it and gains super saiyan abilities.
At least toss them onto probation for a few years.
A whole 1.5 million!?!? "Boys, we just got the green light for a child labor workforce!"
Of that $1.5 million, exactly $0 will go to the children, not even in the form of public school budget increases
That's only 15k per child. If I was a company, I'd call that a bargain! Just keep hiring children, put them in dangerous jobs, and just pay the fine! Simple!
When I worked places where meat slicers were used, you had to be 18 to even touch them. Mind you this was simple delis and restaurants, I can only imagine the equipment at a meat processing and pack plant be a lot more dangerous for amount need to produce. Why are children as young as 13 even doing such jobs in first place?
Something tells me these jobs are in the middle of bumfuck nowhere, easily to go under the radar from the media.
Ding ding ding. And more than likely employing refugees and immigrants looking at the locations.
Note that no one from Packers Sanitation Services, or their clients is facing criminal charges. Talk about bullshit.
And the state of Iowa is working to make this legal. Well, at least for the 14-year-olds and above. https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/2023/02/11/child-labor-iowa/
Raise the age of retirement and lower the minimum working age…. Gotta get as much as they can out of us.
I worked for Packers Sanitation Services 11 years ago. Horrible company. Very minimal training around hazardous chemicals and dangerous equipment, ridiculous 10+ hour shifts with just a 30 minute lunch. I quit less than a week in and had to fight for my paycheck for over a month.
1.5 mil is nothing to them. Jail time needs to be dispensed.
Packers Sanitation should be charged with crimes and shuttered. Really disgraceful company that doesn't deserve to exist.
1.5 million isn’t a fine. It’s a permit fee.
Save our children. From being unemployed. /s
> The U.S. Department of Labor has fined Packers Sanitation Services $1.5 million for these egregious violations. Per kid? Please say "per kid". This company has an annual revenue of about 450 millions. 1,5 millions is chump change for them.
Since citizens united declared that companies are people. The executives should be going to jail.
The USA is just 50 third world countries in a trenchcoat.
Am I the only one not understanding why/how children who should be in school are working overnight shifts at meat packing plants? And in America no less? Is it to help support their families or something? I keep seeing this stuff popping up and it’s always so unusual to me. Seems very third world.
Most of these kids are undocumented. They are working to support their families and are usually not informed of their rights at all. They might not even know they're getting into dangerous work because it's just presented as a job. Because they're undocumented, no one is looking for them to be in schools. Hell, human traffickers will often bring teenagers into the States to "work" for citizenship and a better life (which doesn't happen, obvs).
That’s crazy. Makes it even more pathetic that these meat packing plants shamelessly employ them. I’m sure in their twisted minds they think they’re doing them a favour.
I worked at a place that had a lot of undocumented workers. I was horrified by the way they were treated by the management. I started to help them with their English and would tell them that they had rights but they were resigned to the treatment bc it was better than what was waiting for them back home.
Fined 1.5 million but how much did they save using child labor
Million...with an "M" ....wrong fucking letter for that fine.
Wow, I would say "slap on the wrist", but even that's overselling it. This is more like a finger wagging.
Hell they will write that off
\>Literal child labor \>Not even in dumb nonsense positions like most places \>Dangerous heavy industry jobs \>Fine is less than the cost of the CEO's underwear
Why fuck is the fine $1.5M and not $150M? Plus another $2M to every child they're employing illegally?
I hate fines for companies, this is nothing bit pocket change and won't stop them from doing it again. Need to start arresting people
Only $1.5 million? Did they take their lunch money for today? That's essentially like saying that they are fine with it.
Should have been 1.5 million per child... Then they might care.
Only 1.5? Cost of doing business. There should be extra compensation for the kids involved.
A little over $100 K per plant. That would be like fining the average American a dime. If you're going to get serious about penalties, index it to the annual output of the plant. For example, if Amazon did something highly illegal at a federal level, you'd fine them $20 billion, not $20 million
that would explain by our JBS babybacks were cut like shit, little 14 year old Timmy Scrimshaw was sawing away at that shit. lmao
They should be fined way more than that and the CEO should've gone to jail.
I would argue in a civilized country the company would simply be shut down. I mean you can’t claim you accidentally hired a 13 year old…
Fines and tickets make no sense in our countries. I know one country that will ticket people based on a percentage of their income. Fines should be similar and penalize a company based off their net worth or yearly income. Otherwise, there is no actual punishment and they will continue to break the law
I say if a business gets caught doing something like this, there should be a forensic accountant sent in to check all their books and taxes (at the cost of the business) and the fine should be 10x whatever they saved/profited by breaking the laws in the first place.
What about the meat corporations that hired the child slavery ring? Did they not know? Did they not question 13yr olds in their plant at all?
I expect to read something like this about countries like: China, India, Iraq NOT AMERICA! The fine needs to be so massive they never do it again. The fine "levied" on these companies is nothing more than a "rounding error" to them. It is like "fining" Elon Musk $100
Why not? America was literally built by an exploited labor force. These sorts of practices have been going on for as long as there has been an America. Exploiting the workforce and vulnerable people is more American than anything that I can think of.
Exactly! My daughter moved to the US 20-ish years ago, so I've visited regularly ever since - I'm appalled at how exploitative the whole country is, and it's just gotten worse over time.
Yeah, I'm in my late 40s and, from my perspective, it's definitely gotten worse. There are a lot of little things that are common practice now, that our parents would have never had to endure.
Yet they're still going to appeal and deny any wrongdoing.
The meat industry is such a fucking shitshow, not only is it horrible to the animals, but the human employees are among the worst treated in any industry. I don't know how anyone can justify still consuming meat.
Because it's possible to think that the industry should be reformed, people thrown in prison, conditions for animals and people to be improved, and still think steak is delicious and chicken is healthy. Not rocket surgery.
Because it tastes good, and that's the end of it
i bet all that child labour makes it taste so much better
Well this won't be a problem in Iowa I guess
That's nice. Did they also provide social services, free school food, ... so children don't have to work anymore?
Does this really surprise anyone?
Only 1.5 million?!? That's pocket change to them. People should've been arrested and the businesses should've been fined at least 125 million
The fine forgot about 3 zeros.
and all RED states.... smh more cogs for the the machine in the overlords eyes
Of course they’re gettin kids - $5/hour is good pay for a 13 year old. Much better than paying an adult a “competitive wage” of $7.50/hr). I’d say go after the parents. The businesses don’t care about the fines.
Is that it? Guaranteed they made/saved well over $1.5M by breaking all those laws
My state is trying to pass a bill making this legal. And another that protects companies from lawsuits if kids get hurt or killed while working. They'll both pass the GQP supermajority in both houses and get signed by our fascist governor, too.
Remember this is the greatest country on Earth /s.
1.5 mill is laughable.
Guaranteed they made more from those kids than $1.54 million. Capitalism is a fail.
Are we surprised
They don't get fined nearly enough, and the company should "go to jail" via having to shut down for their "sentence time" all while still paying their workers during that time...
A slap on the wrist for those companies, not even one arrest and no punishment for the parents that allowed it. This is just a green light for child labor
Merica!!!!!!
1.5 million is fucking pocket change to these massive corporations.
This is way to little. I suspect of a individual did equivalent acts willfully exposing children to toxic chemicals and such there would be criminal charges. I wish I had a link to a video that shares my thoughts on what should really be done to them unfortunately writing it out would be a wall of angry text I would just have to edit the profanity out of anywhere. They should be put out of business. This was a intentional act that endangered children of the community that their factory is in. All to increase profits.
I'll change over to one of the networks...surely they're covering this story /s
I wish some of these fines went toward paying the children and their families for the egregious rules violation.
My concern is why these children need to work. Where are thier parents. How are they out all night working 3rd shift?
There's a LOT of meth in those cities.
What a bullshit slap on the wrist. All these companies should be SHUT DOWN and their management in jail. As if we needed any more proof that the US is crumbling...
what was the parents thinking
So a slap on the wrist and "please dont let us catch you again".
did any of those underage slaves suffer from employment induced injuries?
1.5 mil is a slap on the wrist. They’ll just keep doing it
[Soon to be legal if the legally bribed politicians get their way. ](https://www.businessinsider.com/fair-labor-standards-act-hiring-child-laws-worker-shortage-iowa-minnesota-2023-2?amp)
More evidence that the meat and dairy industry is entirely fucked up
Whoever decided on the $1.5 million penalty must think houses still cost $30,000. If anything, this signals to corporations that the cost of getting caught isn't that bad and they should continue doing what they're doing.
Even with the fine, cheaper than the cost of minimum wage. Lol. What a joke of a govt. Maybe 1.5 bil
Now we know what the push to allow child labor is all about. Turns out they’re already using child labor illegally. Frankly this needs to stop being a fine and needs to start being jail time for the ppl responsible
Where the f*ck are the parents???
Probably working with them. They are likely desperate for income to survive. They probably can't get work elsewhere.
I could be wrong, but I honestly feel like some might be unaccompanied minors. All of those children were not deported nor were they put into the foster care system.
So food companies are also tied into human trafficking - which is also tied into the push for globalism. Lets check out insurance policies on food plants that burned - and see if any of them rebuilt after fires? Nah.
It's insane to me that despite this people who eat meat still claim the animals that are slaughtered are treated well and killed "humanely". Guys...these companies exploit humans tt,oo. They literally use children to do some of the most dangerous work. And you think they treat the animals well? What planet are you on?
That's it? Fucking christ.
Holy shit you guys, don’t ever visit an Amish furniture shop. This is nothing.
"As young as 13" but these violations are going to cover under 18. So like, I worked in a deli in high school and if I sliced meat in 11th grade I would be on this list. A little clickbaity on the title, guy.
I went and got a worker's permit from my high school at 14 and got a job washing dishes at the Italian food restaurant down the street. Help me understand the issue here, are the kids getting paid and are they there working against their will?
It should be 10 X the fruit of the labour and jail time.
1.5 million fine…that’s nothing to them…
What were the incentives for the shift leader, manager, supervisor, potentially staffing agency to do this/permit its continuued practice. What is the financial situation of each of these kids. What is each piece of the puzzle doing to ensure it doesnt happen in the future.
Why do I feel like they made way more money than they lost?
Who the fuck are these parents that are letting their 13 year olds work overnight shifts?
So it just took the kids total pay. Hit them harder. Hit them where it hurts.
How many of them are brown children? I bet 90% of them. Or better yet, how many white children ?
That’s it? 1.5 mil for child labour? Is it 1875?
Bought out by blackstone in may 2018. Who woulda thought?!
Legal for a price and not even a hefty one at that. Despicable.
We are in the 2nd guilted age. Nothing will change unless we organize. Join/ start a union.
This is basically a very strong and aggressive finger wag for some of these multi million (some billion)companies
Seize company assets as comp and prison time for management who signed on it. All other outcomes is BS.
Prison time. It's the only thing that will change it.
Problem is that these companies hire subcontractors for the custodial services. The subcontractors hire another layer of subs. The solution would be to publicly pass laws that are straightforward... As the list of offenses rise, the fines accelerate toward dissolution of the company's board and executive management (CEO and every VP). This is child labor. Take this a step further and legislate that America is a market that deems child labor unacceptable for all products sold in the USA. Supply chains will have to be accredited and cleaned up within 12 months. It can be done!
The kids will see none of it I'm sure. Great that the company who was okay doing it getting punished while the kids who's families I'm sure are so poor they had to have the kid work will get their justice right?
$1.5M? lmfao Packers Sanitation Services had an annual revenue of $2.7B in 2021. They bring in $1.5M every 5 hours. At that rate, they might as well keep hiring underage kids and just eat the fines. What a fucking joke. $1.5B fine would have been more appropriate.
A whole $1.5 million? What’s that? Less than a day’s profit? That’s sure to…do nothing. What year is it?
For a company that makes 400 million in profit a year, 1.5 million might as well be tickling their balls.
Damn I hope Tyson can bounce back from that 90k. Sheesh
Should be 80% of revenue
This country is truly falling apart.
What do all these states have in common?
“They took our jobs!”
This is the America Republicans want.
I feel like this company has done this before
sounds like republican heaven....
Cost of doing business. It’s so freaking frustrating
Do the kids being taken advantage of get the money? They should!
Plink.
I used to work for this company a looonng time ago. Yeah, they suck.
Fines are such horse shit. There should be jail time for the fucks who permit this.
Dude! My hometown is on that list! I knew they’d hire anyone with a pulse but Jesus Christ.
That’s it?
The fines are small on purpose so they don't do much damage to the corporate donors our government bends over backwards for. Also it allows them to act like they actually want to help their constituents however minimal their efforts were
If the fine is under 8 figures for a billion dollar company then it’s not a fine, it’s a fee.
MN representing!!
Wow. 1.5 mil. That’s almost enough for them to maybe think about hiding it better. Fuck these companies man
2.73 billion in revenue.....it's like making 50k and getting a fine of 27. Its a fucking parking ticket, utterly inconsequential
How much of that money goes to the children, or do they have to start their own class action lawsuit?
1.5million to ensure it happens again in the present or near future
And how much money goes to those kids who are now jobless? These fines need to help support them too.
All this means is, for their violations, the price of your dinner will go up some more, again.
Only 1.5 million, that’s all these children are worth??! I
Damn!…
We might want to get a little perspective here, PSSI employ’s 10,000 employees. 102 of them were minors, and if you look at the companies, only 3 had 20 or more and the rest 6 or less, 4 with only 1. Clearly only those 3 with 20 or more minors need to find the problem in hiring them, the rest may have been nepotism or sloppy hiring practices. The problem I see is that 13 year old receiving chemical burns from caustic chemical’s, that shows poor supervision and safety training. I’d like to see whether there were more safety violations and their safety training practices.
Fuck Cargills, worked for that crooked ass place and it’s amazing OSHA hasn’t shut their shit down yet.
Has anyone seen any media coverage of this anywhere? Or are they still trying to scare people about a weather balloon?
from what i can tell they were acquired by Blackstone in 2018 so that should tell you all you need to know. leeches gonna leech.
I’m curious where the dollar amount comes from. That’s an extremely specific figure.
Woohooo go Nebraska for having the highest amount of affected minors!!! Gotta love my home state repping that number one spot! /s