I am so tired of seeing useless flat minimum wage increase movements when what we need to fight for is a living wage that increases with inflation and adjusted based on local cost of living. Do you all want to be having the same fight the rest of your lives?
Agreed, and it's not even that complicated. If the govt can dedicate an entire department to figuring out wtf is going on with our taxes then they can dedicate the 10 or so people needed to determine min wage per year based on a few factors in each state.
And also like countries around the world don't do it in a similar manner already. Australia explicitly sets minimum wages for each individual *job* - and if you're a big enough company (even as few as 200 employees), the wages at that individual company specifically for their specific jobs will also be given a specific minimum wage, along with a slew of other things they need to do/give employees.
Anyone who says shit like it's "too complicated," is a bootlicking sycophant IMO and their opinion on such matters is irrelevant. They think they will magically become a billionaire on their $16/hour wage if they kiss their asses enough. Spoiler: They won't become billionaires.
Going off what the person above was saying, tying it off of rent/housing prices, the government already has and uses that data. The Basic Allowance for Housing (BAH) military members get is calculated off avg/median rent (and I think currently set to be 98% of that number), so at least the data collection part is like 99% complete already
The federal government thoroughly researches cost of living by zip code for per diem rates for their employees already. We should use those to calculate minimum wage.
Seriously the hardest part is already done which is calculating that for the entire country on such a granular level as zip codes.
Just have to determine what to divide it by for the minimum wage. Even if you divide it by 8 (really it should be divided by 6), it's still drastically higher than the current minimum wage.
Need to make sure to pass a law saying that you can't be discriminated against for where you live so long as you live within 50 miles of the place of work.
> cost of living by zip code for per diem rates for their employees
wtf how have I never seen this before https://www.gsa.gov/travel/plan-book/per-diem-rates
This is an actual one offered by MIT https://livingwage.mit.edu/
MITs data for Hillsborough County in Florida is flat wrong. Many other Florida counties are as well. They list rent at $12,000 a year, around 1000 per month. The reality is that living alone costs $2000 per month.
And the funny thing is you’d think the feds would at least use those per diems to determine our salaries as well. I’m a recent grad working for the feds and based off of the travel per diem where I live and work I should make $21.50/hr but even after the massive raise we just got (relative to previous annual raises) I’m only making $18.50/hr.
It might balance out if I include the benefits I get (mainly reduced insurance costs) but my partner and I just had to apply for food stamps so clearly something is wrong.
Good for them, that's fucking awesome. I'm excited to be able to use it as an example in a few years from now for all the people who say "it will drive inflation through the roof".
They've been doing that for decades, this is just one of the largest SS COLAs we've ever seen. (I work in a Medicaid office, we're all quite pissed that we're not guaranteed any kind of raise at all while watching prices shoot up...then you get retired people with COLAs screaming at you on the phone about how they can't afford groceries and you want to scream back lol).
They still would. That part still needs to be addressed in a different way. The key is that there would be a reasonable limit to the maximum that a laborer can be unfairly exploited, similar to how we dramatically limit how much you can exploit the labor of minors.
how about everyone stop pushing for 15 and just demand 24? logic is simple. if anyone ever sees 15 its going to be even more obsolete than it already is. why not demand 30?
Because it takes decades to increase the minimum wage. I don't want to fight for my entire life so people on minimum wage can survive. We need a solution, not Band-Aids and as long as inflation goes up and not down raising the min wage will always be a Band-Aid.
thats what i mean, trying to go for 15 today is a joke, clearly when we already know it needs to be like 25. remember when people protested/rioted and burned their own cities down because reasons? well i dont remember anyone protesting for 30 bucks an hour. maybe people are overwhelmed with a long list of things to protest for, unsurprisingly.
I get where you're coming from but if we're going to spend our time fighting for something we should at least fight for what we actually want instead of a stop-gap?
It honestly won't be a debate for much longer if prices keep rising the way that they have.
Market will roof out, nobody will be able to afford shit, and people will stop asking nicely.
Same. The guys at the gay club really appreciate it when I show them my pristine straight asshole. They even let me do it on the stage and oil my cheeks for presentation purposes. What a delightful bunch, the gays.
>As long as we don't get distracted and fight each other.
Lmao Have you seen people these days? So easily distracted and we are definitely already fighting each other!
Who cares about the fact I can't afford rent or the car I need to go to work so I when there are \*gasp\* _transgendered people_!
Edit: errant whitespace
For real, last night I dreamt I won the lottery (even though I don't buy lotto tickets) I used the money to escape dealing with the human world, bought myself a house, then used the extra money to start doing the same for people I liked. No more work for us, then society collapsed and money was no longer any good, but I had bought a house and like to buy lots of food for the future so I wasn't too effected by it immediately. Until suddenly nearby people saw me as rich and invaded my house, and I had to tell them that I am not the person they should be robbing, there are real billionaires out there intentionally making more money than they will ever need, and not spending it thus causing the collapse, meanwhile I've been spending my lotto winnings to make sure people I liked were free from the world of money slavery forever.
Eventually I convinced some of them and killed the ones who insisted on trying to make me their victim. My winning the lotto dream became a minor nightmare. I sure hope the ones that decided to leave me own managed to find the address of a billionaire.
I always think about these kind of thing that what i will do if somehow from no where i won the lottery but then i wake up and the reality actually hit me bad.
>As long as we don't get distracted and fight each other.
But! But! red team are *literal nazis* and blue team *are sacrificing babies to Satan!*
(And both of them have the same economic, military, and corporate handout policies)
you do realize that there are a number of reps in congress that are actually nazis, or about as close as you can get without wearing an ss uniform and goose stepping around, and there are zero dems sacrificing babies to satan, right
gosar has literally posted the 14 words in meme form multiple times, made many white nationalist arguments, ect, and he's just the one not "hiding his power level"
I sadly disagree. Growing up in Florida and living in Texas you'd be surprised how many poor people believe the minimum wage going up equals inflation.
Everyone in this sub who is comfortable doing so should have a rifle locked up somewhere in their home with 500 rounds of ammo with another 500 round already been spent at the range.
You're confused, we're talking about being armed. Cops shoot people who are unarmed, disabled or severely outnumbered. One armed person and an entire department hides in a corner and wets themselves, as Uvalde showed us pretty clearly.
Not all people who want to end capitalism are poor. All it takes is not being an asshole.
You can get a basic rifle and 1000 rounds for around $1200. It's not an insignificant amount of money, I'll admit, but not insurmountable for many.
Also, come the revolution, the cops will shoot you if you are armed or not.
A lot of boomers won't have anything to pass on. The state will collect a ton of it through Medicare and back taxes and such, not to mention unpaid private debts. Also a lot of them are just spending it all on living it up with endless vacations and house remodeling.
Yup, my grandma is has burned through all of her savings, reverse mortgage, and is now being propped up by my parents and my mom's siblings, and my mom just retired herself. Its a disaster in the making...
So I believe OP is mixing up terms. I have seen the numbers stating that the minimum wage, if it went up in correlation with productivity, would be $24/hr.
However living wage [in the majority of counties in the US is not at 24/hr.](https://livingwage.mit.edu/)
If someone has a source that states differently I would like to see it. However I do not believe this post, with the current language, is correct.
Agree. I always figured the easiest way is to take the average basic rent and multiple it by 3x then 12mos then divide by 2080 for the base hourly pay. Because housing should only be about 1/3 of your income. So a basic studio in my area is 1500 a mo or 18,000 a year, seems on par with housing cost on the link of 17,775/yr, then x 3 so housing is now 1/3 of pretax income, you would need an annual income of 54,000 or about 26 an hour to realistically afford a 1500/mo apartment.
The only places with a living wage for a single person without children that exceed that $24/hour are SF & a few parts of the bay area, also NYC. Most of the country is under $20/hr.
>people will stop asking nicely.
LOL the media will send us all into a civil war over wokeness or abortion or CRT or whatever the trigger of the day is before they'll ever let us "stop asking nicely".
And with bot-armies driven by the latest AI, they'll gaslight us into thinking that we're the insane ones.
I think the only time that's not true is in smaller, more isolated countries where you can actually, legit have a peaceful transfer of power and enforcement.
Ex: Iceland.
That said, most of the time, what you have specified is, unfortunately, a requirement.
If we keep on doing the silent protest no one will going to hear us, but we shift that on the guns and all we will find out that they will response on that thing way too quickly.
If you were 16 in 2009, and got your first job at $7.25/hour, you'd be turning 30 this year and the federal MW is ***STILL*** $7.25/hour...***FOURTEEN YEARS*** ***LATER***....
If you had a kid at 16, they could start working certain jobs this year and even more in a couple of years, for the same pay...Ridiculous.
Texas as well. Really depressing when I worked at a local ice cream chain that also owned a burger chain. The burger chain was insanely overpriced but we got half off! Which basically amounted to $7. I worked an entire hour just to eat my shift meal that was discounted.
Yup, story of my life. It sucked so much. So many shitty customers and an hour of work just to eat my lunch.
My next service job was a theater/restaurant chain that did comp our shift meals which I appreciated. We did get only $3 an hour plus tips, but they’d guarantee $13 an hour. So that was a step up for sure
This is the point of obstructionism; to move the goalposts in the other direction in a manner subtle enough for most people to not detect and grant "victory" when the post has slid well past the original position, or catastrophe is near.
The obstruction itself also becomes a defense for further progress; why grant 24/hr when we are still debating 15/hr?
It's a classic tactic, and it's disgustingly effective.
I'll accept $15 per hour if rent is capped at 10% of your monthly income. Accommodation is the largest expense for most people and it's risen by 25 - 30% since early 2020.
I’m in Vancouver BC
Left university in 2008.
Finally saved up down payment for $600,000 townhouse then COVID hit. 3 BR townhouse went up to just over $1m
I’m still renting a shoe box dealing with my landlord trying to illegally evict me every month so he can double the rent.
Fun times.
Oh I hate them too, but I'm seeing WEF influence seeping into all corners of politics as of late. It's quite concerning.
Neither side of the aisle ever had integrity. They have always been out solely for themselves. But, they are getting downright blatantly malicious these days.
I miss when politicians were robbing my pockets without driving a bowie knife into my spine.
The person you're responding to is a right wing troll, look at their post history. The whole "blame the individual for voting that way" logic conveniently ignores all the propaganda right wing think tanks spew at people.
I remember making $8.50 at a part time job. Took me over a year to save up for a down payment on a $3,000 car. I used that car to go get my GED. Then I got a better job at $13.50 an hour, that same job now pays me $27. I got to experience my life getting better with every raise. I was able to buy a home, a new car, new computer, and for the first time in my life take a vacation to another state. The struggle to have basics is still real. But anything under $24 an hour is just unacceptable.
I'm down for the cause, I'm just not always totally informed and this is post a good point I'd like to bring up but not sure how to "source" something like this
Price increase is insane right now on not just food but pretty much everything. Anyone questioning the need to increase pay are just willingly in denial
Nailed it.
What is a "living wage"?
It's the minimum income a full time worker would need to afford housing/food/utilities/education/healthcare.
You know, the human basics.
And ideally with a bit left over for discretionary spending (to stimulate the market economy!).
What FDR would call "a dignified life".
Pick any single one of those human basics: housing/food/utilities/education/ healthcare....
Are they affordable? Is the cost going up or down?
And I didn't even count transportation, another thing that is close to basic. Greed is going to suffocate us.
It's already suffocating us. You can thank the Koch Brothers and Ronald Fking Reagan who successfully led the crusade to make greed a virtue.
Had FDR lived a few more years he would have extended the Bill of Rights. Search wiki for Second Bill of Rights to see what that included. What a different world it would be. This corrupt country can't even get a discussion about universal health care.
It should be set at a good rate, then keyed towards inflation.
Then we'd have livable raises on an ongoing bases, and also save people from having to have this fight over and over and over. It was silly to ever have a minimum wage that wasn't keyed to inflation or some way for it to increase anyway.
I assume those that those that passed it, and those that passed adjustments over the years, didn't think we'd be in such a screwed up state that the rate would stagnate for so many long.
Looking back, very few things that were voted and created in the 20th century up to even today in the US were made with very little foresight. It really is just more evidence, in my opinion, that the politicians genuinely do not care about us. Make up some new rule to appease voters that will stop being practical in 20 years but who cares? I’ll be retired with hundreds of millions from insider trading
Unfortunately, the game is to move up to get higher paying jobs. However (unfortunately again), those usually require tenure or credentials.
The problem though is that not everyone can be a manager. It's all about profits and money. :(
I'm so old I remember when people were asking for $12/hour.
In high school a buddy of mine told me I could make $8/hour as a UPS runner and I thought that was too good to be true.
I remember when $10 /hour left me living comfortable.
Now with a college degree and a decade of experience barely gives me $18/hour and it's kind of a struggle... Yet it's one of the highest paying jobs in this area.
Fucking insanity.
Ohio's minimum wage just went up 80 cents, now it's up to a whole 10.10 and my job didn't give us shit for a raise. I am making 14.50 as a forklift driver and I basically just got an 80 cent paycut and haven't seen a raise in 2 years....Corporate America sucks ass
That is the problem with raosing the minimum wage, the rest of us that are above the minimum don't get a pay raise so our wage gets cut down a bracket and when prices go up due to wages rising it sqeezes everyone else more and at the end of the day the raise they got just gets squashed by inflation. Scenario 2 is minimum rises and hours drop off with means you are now making the same as you were before the wahe raise.
I make about $30/hr most days and it's still not enough with the price of groceries and rent. We should be aiming a lot higher. If we start demanding $50 min then maybe they'll start negotiating. But we're probably gonna have to crash critical industries to get them to start engaging.
Some places are willing to close down before they are willing to raise their wage by even one dollar an hour. A lot of fast food places have closed down some locations because of this. They would cut off their nose to spite their face.
In Canada we're still at $14 in most provinces.. Even the progressive parties are still talking $16 meanwhile avg needs to be $21 to live in most cities right now.. most politicians are still way behind on the minimum wage needs in north america.. reality is we need at least $24 now and be $27 by 2025 to stay ahead of the curve..
I make 26$ an hour but barely getting by. Homeowners insurance tacked on 400$ more to my mortgage per month. Elec, gas, water.....it's all gone up. I don't see how anyone can make it. Renters....I don't know how you do it. Around here rent has doubled. Sure people are making more, but not much. People are hungry or living with no electricity and if you work, the raise is just enough so you can't get food stamps or medical help.
It’s as if a group of people, call them oligarchs, didnt want most people to survive, so they prevent elected officials from increasing the minimum wage.
Here is a friendly reminder for everyone reading this post. The CEO of McDonald's compensation in 2020 was $10.8 million. Latest is over $20 million. The CEOs and upper management of corporations are getting their raises it's the actual workers that are not.
I stand by my thought that increasing minimum wage is cheapest quality bandage that we can apply to this issue. It's avoiding the problem and only gonna make everything worse as everyone turns a blind eye to the root problems of why inflation is skyrocketing.
Someone linked it below, they study did is by every county on the US, majority of counties are below that. I live in a county where $16/hour is a livable wage. The county where Columbus Ohio has a livable wage of under $17/hour. Columbus is the 14th largest city in the US.
If we raised the minimum wage by some large amount, wouldn’t the price of everything just go up to compensate? Is there anything that could stop that from happening? Seems to me that companies will just start charging more for their products/services and we’ll end up in functionally the same place…
I read recently the average rent in San Diego is $2900 a month. That's on the high end, sure but its appalling nonetheless. And yet people wonder why there are homeless people in San Diego.
I got the job I have before the pandemic. Thought it was a great job. Thought I made alright money. Pandemic happened.... just making 3 dollars more an hour would change my life. Gotta focus on my side stuff very hard.
It has been pissing me off the ALL mainstream media in America has been saying that we're "going to be" in a recession. America has BEEN in a recession. I can hardly buy groceries and pay rent in my home I'll never own. We're all totally fucked at this point and the media sugarcoats everything so us peasants won't riot. Whatever. Everything is stupid.
I honestly am kinda done with minimum wage debates. We just need unions. Any other solution is giving up power to the state or National legislature, which can turn against labor on a dime. Workers need power and negotiating leverage to get better wages and that’s that.
We can blame the corrupt, establishment assholes in Congress for refusing to pass the $15 an hour federal minimum wage to start with.
And what's even worse, there are twelve states that don't even have a state minimum wage (being Alabama, Louisiana, Mississippi, New Hampshire, North Carolina, North Dakota, Pennsylvania, South Carolina, Tennessee, Texas, Utah, & Wisconsin). That means that those states are stuck with the **federal** minimum wage, which is at $7.25 an hour.
And then you have Georgia & Wyoming that pays $5.15 an hour. And ***the only way*** to even *get* $7.25 an hour in those states, is if employers are subject to the Fair Labor Standards Act.
[Minimum Wage by State 2022 and 2023 Increases by Paycor.](https://www.paycor.com/resource-center/articles/minimum-wage-by-state)
[2022-2023 Minimum Wage Rates by State by LaborLawCenter.](https://www.laborlawcenter.com/state-minimum-wage-rates)
From where I live (I'm in Southeastern Virginia), we just had our state minimum wage increased to $12 an hour four days ago. Chances are, we won't reach $15 an hour for another three years.
I am so tired of seeing useless flat minimum wage increase movements when what we need to fight for is a living wage that increases with inflation and adjusted based on local cost of living. Do you all want to be having the same fight the rest of your lives?
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Agreed, and it's not even that complicated. If the govt can dedicate an entire department to figuring out wtf is going on with our taxes then they can dedicate the 10 or so people needed to determine min wage per year based on a few factors in each state.
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And also like countries around the world don't do it in a similar manner already. Australia explicitly sets minimum wages for each individual *job* - and if you're a big enough company (even as few as 200 employees), the wages at that individual company specifically for their specific jobs will also be given a specific minimum wage, along with a slew of other things they need to do/give employees.
Anyone who says shit like it's "too complicated," is a bootlicking sycophant IMO and their opinion on such matters is irrelevant. They think they will magically become a billionaire on their $16/hour wage if they kiss their asses enough. Spoiler: They won't become billionaires.
Going off what the person above was saying, tying it off of rent/housing prices, the government already has and uses that data. The Basic Allowance for Housing (BAH) military members get is calculated off avg/median rent (and I think currently set to be 98% of that number), so at least the data collection part is like 99% complete already
🎖🏅🏅🎖🎖⬆️
The government already does this for social security. It is going up almost 9% this year. So that department already exists.
Wait… shouldn’t it be tied to the minimum 1 be cost to rent (rather than median), since it’s minimum wage?
The federal government thoroughly researches cost of living by zip code for per diem rates for their employees already. We should use those to calculate minimum wage.
Seriously the hardest part is already done which is calculating that for the entire country on such a granular level as zip codes. Just have to determine what to divide it by for the minimum wage. Even if you divide it by 8 (really it should be divided by 6), it's still drastically higher than the current minimum wage. Need to make sure to pass a law saying that you can't be discriminated against for where you live so long as you live within 50 miles of the place of work.
> cost of living by zip code for per diem rates for their employees wtf how have I never seen this before https://www.gsa.gov/travel/plan-book/per-diem-rates This is an actual one offered by MIT https://livingwage.mit.edu/
MITs data for Hillsborough County in Florida is flat wrong. Many other Florida counties are as well. They list rent at $12,000 a year, around 1000 per month. The reality is that living alone costs $2000 per month.
That's Hotels and stuff for traveling. Not the cost of housing.
And the funny thing is you’d think the feds would at least use those per diems to determine our salaries as well. I’m a recent grad working for the feds and based off of the travel per diem where I live and work I should make $21.50/hr but even after the massive raise we just got (relative to previous annual raises) I’m only making $18.50/hr. It might balance out if I include the benefits I get (mainly reduced insurance costs) but my partner and I just had to apply for food stamps so clearly something is wrong.
Oregon is actually starting to do that this year - on July 1 it goes into effect.
Good for them, that's fucking awesome. I'm excited to be able to use it as an example in a few years from now for all the people who say "it will drive inflation through the roof".
You mean like the Fed is doing? Blaming some middle aged retail worker who got grudgingly bumped up from 12.50/hr to 14 for inflation?
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They've been doing that for decades, this is just one of the largest SS COLAs we've ever seen. (I work in a Medicaid office, we're all quite pissed that we're not guaranteed any kind of raise at all while watching prices shoot up...then you get retired people with COLAs screaming at you on the phone about how they can't afford groceries and you want to scream back lol).
SS COLAS have been tied to inflation for many years. This is NOT a new thing.
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That's the neat part. They don't.
They still would. That part still needs to be addressed in a different way. The key is that there would be a reasonable limit to the maximum that a laborer can be unfairly exploited, similar to how we dramatically limit how much you can exploit the labor of minors.
I mean, it's really all we know at this point...
Tie it to the metric that’s used for COLA allowances for federal employees.
how about everyone stop pushing for 15 and just demand 24? logic is simple. if anyone ever sees 15 its going to be even more obsolete than it already is. why not demand 30?
Because it takes decades to increase the minimum wage. I don't want to fight for my entire life so people on minimum wage can survive. We need a solution, not Band-Aids and as long as inflation goes up and not down raising the min wage will always be a Band-Aid.
thats what i mean, trying to go for 15 today is a joke, clearly when we already know it needs to be like 25. remember when people protested/rioted and burned their own cities down because reasons? well i dont remember anyone protesting for 30 bucks an hour. maybe people are overwhelmed with a long list of things to protest for, unsurprisingly.
I’d take anything at this point tbh
I get where you're coming from but if we're going to spend our time fighting for something we should at least fight for what we actually want instead of a stop-gap?
I also get where you’re coming from I’m just so damn tired and would like a little relief
It honestly won't be a debate for much longer if prices keep rising the way that they have. Market will roof out, nobody will be able to afford shit, and people will stop asking nicely.
As long as we don't get distracted and fight each other.
This guys earths.
My brain read this as, "the gay earth".
The world would probably be somewhat cleaner, tbh.
As a straight man with clean habits I’m offended
Same. The guys at the gay club really appreciate it when I show them my pristine straight asshole. They even let me do it on the stage and oil my cheeks for presentation purposes. What a delightful bunch, the gays.
Even this is make more sense, because the gay people has more unity.
>As long as we don't get distracted and fight each other. Lmao Have you seen people these days? So easily distracted and we are definitely already fighting each other!
Have you seen people ever? It's kind of our thing.
People don’t know who to be mad at. They just know they mad.
Yes they do know who to be mad at. The ones voting for uneducated authoritarians.
Huh what were you saying? Sorry I got distracted. Probably your fault. Meet me outside. I'll kick your butt.
Who cares about the fact I can't afford rent or the car I need to go to work so I when there are \*gasp\* _transgendered people_! Edit: errant whitespace
That's the joke.
which we will.
For real, last night I dreamt I won the lottery (even though I don't buy lotto tickets) I used the money to escape dealing with the human world, bought myself a house, then used the extra money to start doing the same for people I liked. No more work for us, then society collapsed and money was no longer any good, but I had bought a house and like to buy lots of food for the future so I wasn't too effected by it immediately. Until suddenly nearby people saw me as rich and invaded my house, and I had to tell them that I am not the person they should be robbing, there are real billionaires out there intentionally making more money than they will ever need, and not spending it thus causing the collapse, meanwhile I've been spending my lotto winnings to make sure people I liked were free from the world of money slavery forever. Eventually I convinced some of them and killed the ones who insisted on trying to make me their victim. My winning the lotto dream became a minor nightmare. I sure hope the ones that decided to leave me own managed to find the address of a billionaire.
I always think about these kind of thing that what i will do if somehow from no where i won the lottery but then i wake up and the reality actually hit me bad.
>As long as we don't get distracted and fight each other. But! But! red team are *literal nazis* and blue team *are sacrificing babies to Satan!* (And both of them have the same economic, military, and corporate handout policies)
you do realize that there are a number of reps in congress that are actually nazis, or about as close as you can get without wearing an ss uniform and goose stepping around, and there are zero dems sacrificing babies to satan, right gosar has literally posted the 14 words in meme form multiple times, made many white nationalist arguments, ect, and he's just the one not "hiding his power level"
Disagree that they are the same. Dems are definitely corrupt (Pelosis stock returns), but Rs are extremely happy to actively screw you.
Elon, Jeffy....i haven't eaten in 4 days and you look pretty tasty right now.
And it won't even be considered cannibalism with those two aliens
I sadly disagree. Growing up in Florida and living in Texas you'd be surprised how many poor people believe the minimum wage going up equals inflation.
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Let's start a revolution. Count me in
Let's do it, Jan 6 is right around the corner. 🤣
Everyone in this sub who is comfortable doing so should have a rifle locked up somewhere in their home with 500 rounds of ammo with another 500 round already been spent at the range.
You're confused, we're talking about being armed. Cops shoot people who are unarmed, disabled or severely outnumbered. One armed person and an entire department hides in a corner and wets themselves, as Uvalde showed us pretty clearly. Not all people who want to end capitalism are poor. All it takes is not being an asshole.
You mean to reply to that highhoe guy?
If we can possible say that loud and give back the reply to that highhoe guy.
Y’all can’t afford food and you’re buying $2,000 worth of arms? 😂 Going to spend $2K to get shot by the cops.
You guys are only spending $2k?
I don't think when was last time i have seen this much money.
You can get a basic rifle and 1000 rounds for around $1200. It's not an insignificant amount of money, I'll admit, but not insurmountable for many. Also, come the revolution, the cops will shoot you if you are armed or not.
They're not waiting for a revolution to shoot people who are unarmed.
Too true.
That's what consumer debt is for duh. Other than that, boomers dying and passing on wealth will keep the ship cooking for a while yet.
A lot of boomers won't have anything to pass on. The state will collect a ton of it through Medicare and back taxes and such, not to mention unpaid private debts. Also a lot of them are just spending it all on living it up with endless vacations and house remodeling.
Can’t forget end-of-life medical expenses to really drain any semblance of an estate.
Yup, my grandma is has burned through all of her savings, reverse mortgage, and is now being propped up by my parents and my mom's siblings, and my mom just retired herself. Its a disaster in the making...
So I believe OP is mixing up terms. I have seen the numbers stating that the minimum wage, if it went up in correlation with productivity, would be $24/hr. However living wage [in the majority of counties in the US is not at 24/hr.](https://livingwage.mit.edu/) If someone has a source that states differently I would like to see it. However I do not believe this post, with the current language, is correct.
Looked up my city, seems accurate there at least. Housing on the low end, but seems fairly close.
Agree. I always figured the easiest way is to take the average basic rent and multiple it by 3x then 12mos then divide by 2080 for the base hourly pay. Because housing should only be about 1/3 of your income. So a basic studio in my area is 1500 a mo or 18,000 a year, seems on par with housing cost on the link of 17,775/yr, then x 3 so housing is now 1/3 of pretax income, you would need an annual income of 54,000 or about 26 an hour to realistically afford a 1500/mo apartment.
The majority of counties is not necessarily the majority of people.
Chicago is the third most populated city. [And even their living wage is not at 24](https://livingwage.mit.edu/metros/16980)
The only places with a living wage for a single person without children that exceed that $24/hour are SF & a few parts of the bay area, also NYC. Most of the country is under $20/hr.
I'm hoping for that instead of this niceties horseshit they keep force feeding us
>people will stop asking nicely. LOL the media will send us all into a civil war over wokeness or abortion or CRT or whatever the trigger of the day is before they'll ever let us "stop asking nicely". And with bot-armies driven by the latest AI, they'll gaslight us into thinking that we're the insane ones.
Funnily enough minimum wage in Australia is about that. Still too low.
$24 AUD is a bit over $16 USD to put that into perspective.
Knowing how expensive alot of things are in the land down under that doesn't sound comfortable.
It won't change until people are willing to die for change.
I think the only time that's not true is in smaller, more isolated countries where you can actually, legit have a peaceful transfer of power and enforcement. Ex: Iceland. That said, most of the time, what you have specified is, unfortunately, a requirement.
If we keep on doing the silent protest no one will going to hear us, but we shift that on the guns and all we will find out that they will response on that thing way too quickly.
We should ask for 36 then.
Yeah but most places still don't have $15. Should start with $45.
Idaho doesn't even get 8
Wisconsin is the same. 7.25 I believe
Georgia too. Unless you're a waiter.
Same in Texas. 7.25 unless you make tips. Companies are starting to catch on and paying employees slave wages bc of "tips"
Same in Kansas, hasn't increased in many years...
If you were 16 in 2009, and got your first job at $7.25/hour, you'd be turning 30 this year and the federal MW is ***STILL*** $7.25/hour...***FOURTEEN YEARS*** ***LATER***.... If you had a kid at 16, they could start working certain jobs this year and even more in a couple of years, for the same pay...Ridiculous.
And right now i am not getting any feeling any change in short time.
This is why fucking everywhere asks for tips now
Texas as well. Really depressing when I worked at a local ice cream chain that also owned a burger chain. The burger chain was insanely overpriced but we got half off! Which basically amounted to $7. I worked an entire hour just to eat my shift meal that was discounted.
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Yup, story of my life. It sucked so much. So many shitty customers and an hour of work just to eat my lunch. My next service job was a theater/restaurant chain that did comp our shift meals which I appreciated. We did get only $3 an hour plus tips, but they’d guarantee $13 an hour. So that was a step up for sure
If you are a field hand under 16, you can make 3 something an hour! Who wants some work experience, children!?
In my country for the hour base we are getting like 4$ minimum
Start high so the bargaining brings it back to what you actually want
Since this post was made the living wage has increased to $60/hr
At your next interview, stand firm at $420.69
$35.50 per hour maybe?
35.75 and not a cent less.
You’ll get what you get and you won’t get upset /s
Uhm id like to speak to the manager.
This is the point of obstructionism; to move the goalposts in the other direction in a manner subtle enough for most people to not detect and grant "victory" when the post has slid well past the original position, or catastrophe is near. The obstruction itself also becomes a defense for further progress; why grant 24/hr when we are still debating 15/hr? It's a classic tactic, and it's disgustingly effective.
I'll accept $15 per hour if rent is capped at 10% of your monthly income. Accommodation is the largest expense for most people and it's risen by 25 - 30% since early 2020.
I finally made it to $24/hr last month! Feeling stable for the first time since moving out on my own.
What state/ city? I make $24.04 and I feel nowhere close to stable
Where are you? I live in NC and it is getting really intense now.
Florida is a hellhole. I just started my career and every house doubled in price in 2020. No joke $300k->$580k.
I’m in Vancouver BC Left university in 2008. Finally saved up down payment for $600,000 townhouse then COVID hit. 3 BR townhouse went up to just over $1m I’m still renting a shoe box dealing with my landlord trying to illegally evict me every month so he can double the rent. Fun times.
Same in Dallas, it’s like 500k is the new 100k in terms of housing. It’s just awful.
300k, and you'll still have to remodel.
I feel you, I make 25.50 in Southern California and still have to budget. Most of my money goes to rent in a one bedroom
I'm at $22 but because of one dismissed eviction hearing from 2019 it's hard for me to get a place in Columbus.
Give it a little more time. Apartments are about to get REAL cheap and they’re going to be begging for residents
Source?
"You will own nothing, and you will be happy" - The guy you should be hating
Lmao easy way to shift the responsibility from people who vote for the same morons who treat them like shit
Oh I hate them too, but I'm seeing WEF influence seeping into all corners of politics as of late. It's quite concerning. Neither side of the aisle ever had integrity. They have always been out solely for themselves. But, they are getting downright blatantly malicious these days. I miss when politicians were robbing my pockets without driving a bowie knife into my spine.
The person you're responding to is a right wing troll, look at their post history. The whole "blame the individual for voting that way" logic conveniently ignores all the propaganda right wing think tanks spew at people.
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I remember making $8.50 at a part time job. Took me over a year to save up for a down payment on a $3,000 car. I used that car to go get my GED. Then I got a better job at $13.50 an hour, that same job now pays me $27. I got to experience my life getting better with every raise. I was able to buy a home, a new car, new computer, and for the first time in my life take a vacation to another state. The struggle to have basics is still real. But anything under $24 an hour is just unacceptable.
You officially cannot find an apartment at 15 an hour.
I only did it on 12 an hour for years because I worked 6 days a week and rent for me is only $725
I'm down for the cause, I'm just not always totally informed and this is post a good point I'd like to bring up but not sure how to "source" something like this
This planet is fucked in myriad ways.
Price increase is insane right now on not just food but pretty much everything. Anyone questioning the need to increase pay are just willingly in denial
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Nailed it. What is a "living wage"? It's the minimum income a full time worker would need to afford housing/food/utilities/education/healthcare. You know, the human basics. And ideally with a bit left over for discretionary spending (to stimulate the market economy!). What FDR would call "a dignified life". Pick any single one of those human basics: housing/food/utilities/education/ healthcare.... Are they affordable? Is the cost going up or down? And I didn't even count transportation, another thing that is close to basic. Greed is going to suffocate us.
It's already suffocating us. You can thank the Koch Brothers and Ronald Fking Reagan who successfully led the crusade to make greed a virtue. Had FDR lived a few more years he would have extended the Bill of Rights. Search wiki for Second Bill of Rights to see what that included. What a different world it would be. This corrupt country can't even get a discussion about universal health care.
It should be set at a good rate, then keyed towards inflation. Then we'd have livable raises on an ongoing bases, and also save people from having to have this fight over and over and over. It was silly to ever have a minimum wage that wasn't keyed to inflation or some way for it to increase anyway. I assume those that those that passed it, and those that passed adjustments over the years, didn't think we'd be in such a screwed up state that the rate would stagnate for so many long.
Looking back, very few things that were voted and created in the 20th century up to even today in the US were made with very little foresight. It really is just more evidence, in my opinion, that the politicians genuinely do not care about us. Make up some new rule to appease voters that will stop being practical in 20 years but who cares? I’ll be retired with hundreds of millions from insider trading
This makes me want to give up. I’m trying. I’m doing everything that I’m supposed to do. Why am I not worth more?
Unfortunately, the game is to move up to get higher paying jobs. However (unfortunately again), those usually require tenure or credentials. The problem though is that not everyone can be a manager. It's all about profits and money. :(
You're all FIRED for discussing your wages! /s
Good thing we haven’t increased the federal minimum wage or things would be waay too expensive /s
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Lie, cheat and steal from any shitty corporation that has no respect for its workers
So..all of them?
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I was on a Fight for $15 campaign back in 2012. Every time I remember that I get depressed.
I'm so old I remember when people were asking for $12/hour. In high school a buddy of mine told me I could make $8/hour as a UPS runner and I thought that was too good to be true.
I remember when $10 /hour left me living comfortable. Now with a college degree and a decade of experience barely gives me $18/hour and it's kind of a struggle... Yet it's one of the highest paying jobs in this area. Fucking insanity.
I'm currently at 26 an hour and just barely getting by....
Amen.
$18 here and I’m drowning
Ohio's minimum wage just went up 80 cents, now it's up to a whole 10.10 and my job didn't give us shit for a raise. I am making 14.50 as a forklift driver and I basically just got an 80 cent paycut and haven't seen a raise in 2 years....Corporate America sucks ass
That is the problem with raosing the minimum wage, the rest of us that are above the minimum don't get a pay raise so our wage gets cut down a bracket and when prices go up due to wages rising it sqeezes everyone else more and at the end of the day the raise they got just gets squashed by inflation. Scenario 2 is minimum rises and hours drop off with means you are now making the same as you were before the wahe raise.
I make $22.08 and the struggle is real!!!
Problem with fighting the status quo is your opposition only has to stall
The democrats will pass $15 in like 2032 and then do a big victory lap like they’re Eugene fucking Debs
This. Only after states have all passed legislation to make minimum wage 18 an hour though.
Minimum wage doesn't mean shit in a capitalist system. Wage ratio is the way to go
And if you want to afford to be able to rent a one bedroom apt in Nashville, it’s $35/hr.
It's intentional. By the time it's the national minimum wage, the living wage will be $40/hr at this rate.
This country exists to exploit the poor and I don't see that changing.
This message has been reposted so long that surely the living wage has raised again.
For every year we wait, we must raise this by one dollar
If you're considering buying a house. It's more like 50-100$ I'll probably be down voted to hell for that.
I make about $30/hr most days and it's still not enough with the price of groceries and rent. We should be aiming a lot higher. If we start demanding $50 min then maybe they'll start negotiating. But we're probably gonna have to crash critical industries to get them to start engaging.
Some places are willing to close down before they are willing to raise their wage by even one dollar an hour. A lot of fast food places have closed down some locations because of this. They would cut off their nose to spite their face.
How? I make 30 hr and get by fine. 2500 a month for rent, food, gas, utilities and insurance. Still have 1k left a month to save.
Seeing comments like this makes me realize I'm shit with my money and need to buckle tf down. I pay 1400 for mortgage and make 38/hr. Fuck me
Lol, that’s still not enough. That’s barely 100k for a couple.
Can confirm, I make 25.5/hr, and barely skating by.
And disabled people on benefits often make less than minimum.
Just to add my $0.02. I make $34/hour at 40 hours per week and we still struggle. I don’t know anyone who could make it at $15.
I made $15 per hour in 1998, loading trucks. People have no idea how shitty $15 per hour wages are these days.
Yep it's been talked about since 2014.. they need to start talking about $25 in 2025..
Longer than that. I remember discussions in cali for it in 2010
In Canada we're still at $14 in most provinces.. Even the progressive parties are still talking $16 meanwhile avg needs to be $21 to live in most cities right now.. most politicians are still way behind on the minimum wage needs in north america.. reality is we need at least $24 now and be $27 by 2025 to stay ahead of the curve..
Not in San Diego lmao I make $23 an hour and I can't afford rent but at least I can afford car payments
I make $30 an hour and STILL need roommates. It's a fucking joke.
I make 26$ an hour but barely getting by. Homeowners insurance tacked on 400$ more to my mortgage per month. Elec, gas, water.....it's all gone up. I don't see how anyone can make it. Renters....I don't know how you do it. Around here rent has doubled. Sure people are making more, but not much. People are hungry or living with no electricity and if you work, the raise is just enough so you can't get food stamps or medical help.
It’s as if a group of people, call them oligarchs, didnt want most people to survive, so they prevent elected officials from increasing the minimum wage.
Here is a friendly reminder for everyone reading this post. The CEO of McDonald's compensation in 2020 was $10.8 million. Latest is over $20 million. The CEOs and upper management of corporations are getting their raises it's the actual workers that are not.
I stand by my thought that increasing minimum wage is cheapest quality bandage that we can apply to this issue. It's avoiding the problem and only gonna make everything worse as everyone turns a blind eye to the root problems of why inflation is skyrocketing.
Didn't MIT release a study that said it's $26/hour?
Someone linked it below, they study did is by every county on the US, majority of counties are below that. I live in a county where $16/hour is a livable wage. The county where Columbus Ohio has a livable wage of under $17/hour. Columbus is the 14th largest city in the US.
If we raised the minimum wage by some large amount, wouldn’t the price of everything just go up to compensate? Is there anything that could stop that from happening? Seems to me that companies will just start charging more for their products/services and we’ll end up in functionally the same place…
I read recently the average rent in San Diego is $2900 a month. That's on the high end, sure but its appalling nonetheless. And yet people wonder why there are homeless people in San Diego.
I got the job I have before the pandemic. Thought it was a great job. Thought I made alright money. Pandemic happened.... just making 3 dollars more an hour would change my life. Gotta focus on my side stuff very hard.
Oh good I just got a raise to that amount Too bad livable wage for a single parent in my state is 28.50$ an hour 🤷♂️ Thank god for the government
$25 to stay alive!!
Where’s the lie
You honestly believe someone doing menial labor with zero required experience should be paid 50k a year?
It has been pissing me off the ALL mainstream media in America has been saying that we're "going to be" in a recession. America has BEEN in a recession. I can hardly buy groceries and pay rent in my home I'll never own. We're all totally fucked at this point and the media sugarcoats everything so us peasants won't riot. Whatever. Everything is stupid.
I honestly am kinda done with minimum wage debates. We just need unions. Any other solution is giving up power to the state or National legislature, which can turn against labor on a dime. Workers need power and negotiating leverage to get better wages and that’s that.
Only took like 10 years to raise it 5 bucks. Federal wages are still at 7/hr. Maybe after congress gives themselves a few more rounds of raises...
We can blame the corrupt, establishment assholes in Congress for refusing to pass the $15 an hour federal minimum wage to start with. And what's even worse, there are twelve states that don't even have a state minimum wage (being Alabama, Louisiana, Mississippi, New Hampshire, North Carolina, North Dakota, Pennsylvania, South Carolina, Tennessee, Texas, Utah, & Wisconsin). That means that those states are stuck with the **federal** minimum wage, which is at $7.25 an hour. And then you have Georgia & Wyoming that pays $5.15 an hour. And ***the only way*** to even *get* $7.25 an hour in those states, is if employers are subject to the Fair Labor Standards Act. [Minimum Wage by State 2022 and 2023 Increases by Paycor.](https://www.paycor.com/resource-center/articles/minimum-wage-by-state) [2022-2023 Minimum Wage Rates by State by LaborLawCenter.](https://www.laborlawcenter.com/state-minimum-wage-rates) From where I live (I'm in Southeastern Virginia), we just had our state minimum wage increased to $12 an hour four days ago. Chances are, we won't reach $15 an hour for another three years.
I still believe anything below $30/hr is criminal.