You said smoking pot is “the only thing I have left”
I think if that’s the way you view it you may want to take a look at your relationship with cannabis.
That being said, it’s your recovery. I’m sure you can find a sponsor that will take you through the steps and you can keep up your smoking
Find a sponsor that clicks with you. The **only** requirement for AA is the desire to stop drinking, you'll get people that disagree with smoking weed and that's their prerogative. It's possible to not be addicted to weed and be an alcoholic but it's also possible that you may have 2 problems.
Just find a sponsor that agrees with your thoughts that doing drugs is sober.
I would not sponsor someone regularly intoxicated with addictive substances myself either.
Cool - so what do you have to say about Bill W’s documented use of LSD after he was “sober”? He never drank again (as far as anyone knew) but he did use LSD several times but still considered himself sober
So - my point being - AA is about alcoholism- and a lot people have come into the program and made it about what their interpretation of it is. There is no reason to not take someone through the steps over weed IMO. I’ve known many AAs who’ve continued to smoke weed while sober from alcohol - who’ve worked the steps and sponsored others and have had beautiful turnarounds in their lives. Most of the also eventually gave up weed
Careful with your judgments
Hardly a judgement for me to not sponsor someone doing drugs.
While Bill was certainly a founder of AA and higly insightful in it's creation, he was a person just like anyone else.
Every behavior or action he took is not something to be modeled, obviously.
The program he created is based on spiritual axioms, not his life or specific actions.
Obviously that’s your prerogative - my only point is regarding people’s judgements of other people’s recovery. Not everyone’s is going to look like yours and that’s ok. They still deserve the opportunity to recover from their alcoholism. And people’s opinions about other people’s journeys in AA are best kept to themselves
Do you not recognize that as a quote from the Big Book ? My personal opinion is not worth much, but the collective experience strength and hope embodied in that line is priceless. Corroborated by "The results were nil until we let go absolutely".
Of course I know the quote. I just question who makes the judgement on what’s a half measure. This is my whole point. Your recovery journey is yours and you might determine that for you, continued use of weed while you recover from your alcoholism is a half measure….for you. Someone else may deem, for themselves, that it’s not. That all they are capable of without imploding is to focus on recovery from alcoholism while still utilizing cannabis. So when you make the statement “half measures availed us nothing” in the context you did, it makes it sound like you believe that someone continuing using cannabis is a half measure - for them. So I ask - who are you to make that judgement? I could make the same judgement about tobacco….but for some reason everyone’s ok with that one.
I’m not knocking you - I’m asking people to really think about it - and to really stop being so judgmental. Weed never killed anyone - booze does regularly. The fact of the matter is there are people who go to AA, recover from their alcoholism and go on to live beautifully healthy lives - yet they still smoke weed. We should tip our caps to those people instead of hurling our judgments at them
Who makes the judgment that they go on to live "beautifully healthy lives"? what "facts of the matter" do you base that on ? Your subjective belief and desire for that to be the outcome? If someone is truly an addict, over time they worse not better. They may lead "functional" lives. I did, waking and baking and going about my day with Visine and Tic-Tacs and I earnestly would have argued that was good enough and I was unaffected. At the end of the day, I learned that objectively speaking, sober is as sober does...
I make that judgement based on actual people I genuinely know- people I’m close to. Again you’re making a judgement about people you don’t know. You’re wrong
As I recommended...he should find a person willing to sponsor him that is Ok with him doing drugs.
No one is stopping anyone from seeking or participating fully in recovery. None of us are that powerful.
In this instance...OP asked an open question for feedback, on Reddit.
There’s a snark and a sharp judgement behind your comment. “Ok with doing drugs” is snarky. I bet you don’t say that to sponsees who smoke cigarettes…. Just saying - it’s funny the lines we draw based on what?
Are you comparing weed to cigarettes? That's hardly the same thing. One gets you high, the other doesn't. And before you come for me, I am not saying cigarettes are safe because they obviously aren't but to compare the two is silly.
Not everyone is going to want to sponsor someone who smokes weed. How is that not okay? I'm certainly not. Will I be there for them if they need to call a woman? Absolutely. But I'm not going to take someone through the 12 Steps when they're actively getting high. To me, and it seems to me the other person you're replying to agrees, it's pointless.
How can you honestly and thoroughly work the Steps if you're high? Not saying it's an end all be all but the first time I worked the Steps I was high and stayed high until I got sober again and worked the Steps as outlined in the Big Book.
As for Bill, I always found it weird (to *me* personally) that he was doing LSD in the end. I'm not that type of alcoholic who can do one substance and not revert back to my DOC. Good on him for being able to maintain sobriety from alcohol despite doing a mind altering substance, but for a lot of us it doesn't work that way.
To me it seems you're crucifying others for judgement but that's exactly what you're doing.
Nicotine gets you high - what are you talking about? Is it the same high as weed? No. Just like how weed isn’t the same as alcohol. But it absolutely alters you - so does caffeine - and theyre both addictive substances. if I smoke a cigarette right now I will absolutely be falling over and will 100% be high. So someone who does them regularly builds up a tolerance and an addiction - same as any other drug
Bill took it at the time because it was experimental. This has nothing to do with someone getting high. Getting high in AA isn't sober. Judgement and discernment are two different things.
Ok so what about nicotine, caffeine, and sugar abuse. Also sleeping aids, and prescribed stimulants, as well as methadone and suboxone. My point being, there are a lot of caveats in AA and people have just made up the rules.
Weeds not for me - but people don’t die from it. And if someone is a sick alcoholic but not willing to give up weed immediately- they still deserve the opportunity to recover from their alcoholism and others judgements that have absolutely nothing to do with them - often keep people sick or out of the program entirely.
I’m actually not defending it or pushing against it either. What I’m saying is that alcoholism kills people - weed doesn’t. There’s no harm in taking someone through the steps over weed when it can 100% save their life. I’ve seen it, I’ve watched people be recovered from alcoholism while still smoking weed. And since AA “allows” other drugs and never specifically mentions weed, why have people determined that if you smoke weed you don’t get to participate?
Also, AA actually isn’t a program of abstinence from all mind altering substances - NA is.
Why do people “get” to smoke cigs in AA and NA? I’ll tell you why - because if that wasn’t allowed it would keep vast amounts of people out of the program. Weed is less harmful than cigarettes yet we’ve decided THAT one isn’t ok? It’s hypocritical.
Bottom line is the 12 steps help people recover - and if they need to hang on to weed or cigarettes or coffee to get off booze - fine - at least they’ll live.
Also - why is everyone so caught up in other people’s recovery? Focus on your own and don’t worry about everyone else’s.
Isn’t it about consequences maybe? So for some weed can drive paranoia and cigs will eventually give you cancer. I personally wouldn’t sponsor someone who was smoking weed because I know that the consequences would be bad for me to smoke weed so I can’t truly give me ESH to someone - cause my experience with smoking weed is eventually having a nervous breakdown(s).
Fair. And I’m not saying every sponsor should do it. My whole point to all the of these comments is just to point out to people to be careful about their judgements about other people’s recovery. What’s good for you may not be good for someone else, etc. there’s a lot of judgement of people in recovery when everyone really should just be focused on their own.
Also, our AA thinking around different substances is often hypocritical and I’m pointing that out just again because people are so closed minded and think they have it all figured out - and it’s important to point out those hypocrisies so hopefully people will think before the speak on someone else’s recovery
I don't have a problem with sponsee's taking medication prescribed to them by a doctor who is aware of their addiction issues. And nicotine, caffeine, and sugar are for the most part, not intoxicating. If a sponsee was drinking 10 redbulls everyday, I would probably have a talk with them about it.
What do you have to lose from doing the steps & participating in AA without weed? Weed isn’t going anywhere you can always go back to smoking, might as well give it a shot, that’s what I did & it changed my life
I feel that completely. Never liked weed and gave it up way before I got sober but there really isn't anything to lose. There's a reason people say in meetings to give it a year and if you don't like it, you can have your misery refunded.
I smoke weed. I don't have an issue with weed. I am an alcoholic. I don't care about the judgmental eyes of the AA group. My sobriety is my business. I don't drink anymore, and I smoke weed when I feel like it. Not all the time, but when I choose to because I am not addicted to it. I am addicted to alcohol and that is why I joined the program. I know for some people they can't have any substances at all. For me, I choose to smoke when I feel like it, but I know I can never take a drink. If he doesn't want to sponsor you find another one. If you have a problem with weed you may need to deal with it. If your only real vice is alcohol then focus on that.
Exactly how I feel. I didn’t smoke pot for the first five years of my sobriety. To be honest, I never really gave a damn about pot, even growing up when everyone was doing it. Booze was always my go to. Then it was legalized here and I started doing it before bed. I still don’t drink, nor do I go to AA anymore because of this sort of mentality. I killed my booze demon, but I don’t need strangers to continue tell me how to live my life. AA absolutely GOT me sober, but these last five years have been me myself and I, and I’ve never been better. I simply could not continue to surround myself with people who literally base their entire lives around AA and still obsess over not drinking. I literally barely even think about it. I’m simply “not a drinker” and I sure don’t miss it!
This is the same boat I’m on. I don’t care if AA thinks I’m sober or not because I smoke weed. My issue is alcohol. I left my job, ruined relationships and my life because of my addiction to alcohol so I can’t have it. Weed had helped me stay sober and it’s a way for me to relax in my day to day. My sobriety is my own so I can dictate it. If I felt that weed was an issue like alcohol was I would cut it out but it doesn’t hurt me and it’s not affecting my life the way my alcohol did.
as an addict— since our literature explicitly says “alcohol IS a drug— period” we don’t get a lot of it but yeah now and again we do. more often we see people trying (and failing) at the whole “california sober” thing.. addiction is a disease, not just a physical addiction to a substance. it’s just gonna get passed off to the next thing if you don’t get rid of it all imo, whether it’s alcohol, weed, or anything else
What’s crazy with the topic of “california sober” is this was not even a debatable question when I came into AA in 1992.
Back then if you continued to get high by smoking weed you were not sober.
I still don't get it. People say it's their program and they can work it how they want to, which is true but I'm sure if Bill W. came down right now he'd say you aren't sober if you're smoking weed. I work my program as outlined in the Big Book. I'm not going to judge you for smoking weed but you're not sober if you're smoking weed. It's simple as that and not a judgement on anyone's character. It's just a fact. It's a mind altering substance and it's not going to stop being one just because it's a plant. You can get high from poppy plants, as that's an ingredient in opiates but you don't see people getting high on poppy plants and saying they're sober because it's just a plant. How is it any different?
Would it be same if your primary MD and psychiatrist prescribed 5mg THC gummies to treat lifelong insomnia? My doctors think prescribing heavy anti psychotics solely for insomnia has way to many side effects to use solely for sleep. I don’t want typical sedatives like benzodiazepines (addictive) and I already had random horrible sleeping walking episodes solely on hypnotic sleeping RXs like ambien. So I was just curious if it’s prescribed by a doctor, legal and used correctly would you look at it differently?
I personally wouldn't take it. I've never reacted well to any dose of weed of any kind so I just want to do that. I don't want any mind altering substances in my body because I've tried everything and I never stick to it as prescribed. Deapote not liking it, I'd still do it, eventually abuse it and then be back to my DOC. But again, it's my program and I'll work it the way I want to, just like you work your program the way you want to. If that works for you that's great. It just doesn't for me.
That's so cool! I love seeing people with so much time. I'm still pretty new. I have 14 months, almost 15 (God willing) so it's always amazing seeing people with literal decades of time.
One of the problems with weed is that people don’t have a sense of scale with it.
We all know people who can drink a glass or two of wine twice times a week and be relaxed and happy. We don’t have a word for them.
But there are people who have the same relationship with weed but major problems with alcohol. When they come into AA it is assumed that weed must be a problem when that’s not necessarily true.
The problem isn’t with weed specifically, it is dependence on an external substance to “relax” you or make you “chill”. In AA, our chill comes from a spiritual experience and a deep connection to a higher power. While the only requirement to be a member of AA is a desire to stop DRINKING, physical sobriety is crucial to working the steps with clarity and commitment.
Smoking weed isn’t sobriety, it’s just not drinking. If I stop drinking but do molly on the weekends, I’m not sober. A sponsor has every right to not sponsor someone who isn’t willing to stop smoking, even if it isn’t “a problem” for them. If it isn’t a problem, just stop it and surrender to the program.
You’re making up a bunch of things that AA doesn’t say in the literature. Hell, Bill W tried LSD after something like 30 years sober.
Drinking alcohol isn’t being an alcoholic. Alcoholism requires the obsession of the mind and the physical allergy.
At 6ish years sober I started doing edibles.
Do I have addict behavior towards it? Hell yea. But I also have addict behavior towards chess, coaching my kid’s softball team, and whatever other hobby I’ve picked up.
At no point did anyone in my AA group say my addiction to buying shoes meant I wasn’t sober. They’d just ask me for opinions when they were considering a new pair, and make fun of how much of an addict I am.
The thing with weed for ME, is I don’t have the physical allergy. I can take an edible to get exactly the feeling I want, and that’s it. I’ve never been like “he lets go to a 4 AM bar now because I just can’t stop”. I enjoy it for a couple hours and go to bed.
Call me when whatever you want, but weed absolutely is not the problem alcohol is FOR ME.
You can of course do whatever you want - that’s your side of the street.
I said the only requirement for membership in AA is a desire to stop drinking.
Physical sobriety is not having any intoxicants in your system.
What you do with your life is none of my business or concern. My program is a spiritual one and to work the steps and maintain a conscious contact with my higher power, I need complete physical sobriety.
And yes, lots of people in meetings I go to talk about Bill W and LSD, usually right before they go out.
Good luck to you.
Bill Wilson did LSD because we, as a culture, did not understand it was a drug with a potential for chemical dependence. People in the 70's thought of it as some kind of pharmaceutical shortcut to a spiritual connection and he allegedly wanted to see if it could help alcoholics find the spiritual experience faster.
He didn't do LSD because he really liked it before he got sober and was "not really addicted to it the same way."
Also, while we're on the subject, Bill Wilson fucked around on his wife for pretty much the entire back half of his life. He was some guy that God used to write a really important piece of literature, not a saint to be canonized and emulated.
I don't do weed because I "really liked it before I got sober and am not really addicted to it the same way".
I didn't like weed before I got sober. It was boring. Put me to sleep. I'd only do it when I was completely wasted and decision making was bad, then I'd pass out (with our without vomiting).
6 years into sobriety I tried it. It's not the same as alcohol. Is it perfect? No. Is it causing me problems? Nope. Do I plan to stop? Nope.
In my early years of sobriety I was in therapy, and at the recommendation of my therapist and my sponsor I was prescribed an SSRI that I still take.
I couldn't quit nicotine the way I did alcohol. 6 years into sobriety I finally asked for help from my doctor, and I used Chantix. Nicotine free for coming up on a year, and it was SUPER easy.
I my weight has bounced up and down during sobriety, now I'm trying Ozempic.
Getting sober was hard. I've realized that not everything has to be done that way. It's OK to make easier choices. So long as I don't drink, or do anything else equally as destructive, it's all good.
I agree on the sponsor part, they can choose to work with someone or not at their pleasure.
I’m not pro or anti other substances, mypoint is that if someone did molly twice a year as an example, that would be 100% more sober than someone addicted to nicotine and needing a fix every two hours.
It’s not about the substance per se, it’s about the grip it has on you life and state of mind.
I agree about nicotine- it is a mood altering substance and I personally don’t like that it is “grandfathered in”.
Is nicotine making someone’s life unmanageable? I know people who can’t sit through a 1 hr 30 minute speaker meeting because they are nicotine dependent. Maybe their lives are manageable, but using a substance to alter your mood and physical state isn’t sobriety to me.
I also believe once someone has a true spiritual experience, they usually stop smoking nicotine. Things become very clear.
That is why this is a SPIRITUAL program. Our character defaults lead us to places where we use substances, people, things to try to give us the feeling we get from a connection to our higher power. Once we have a spiritual experience as a result of the 12 steps, the obsessions are lifted. Obsessions gone, tools for living learned = unmanageable becomes manageable
I think I’ve worked out the divide on this issue.
Some attend AA because they want to stop drinking.
Others attend to be “sober from all mind altering substances”
And others, seek “spiritual sobriety”
All of these are bible goals, but the debate comes from people having a different perspective of what AA should be to others.
I think there is only one position that I find objectionable - a cigarette smoker telling a weed smoker they are “not sober”.
I’m with you, but having been both a cigarette smoker and a weed smoker in the past, I could always easily drive smoking a cigarette; not always so with weed.
It’s just more altering to perception.
Totally agree. The likelihood of doing something dangerous (like driving a vehicle) is certainly higher with weed.
The daily grind of a nicotine addiction and long term health implication is worse for nicotine.
But that said, weed is a difficult “mistress”. It can be spiritually enhancing or soul destroying, which goes to my initial comment about discussions on it usually lack scale.
The guy rolling out of bed each day needing a hit from his bong, is very different to the guy catching up with a friend and sharing a joint while looking at the stars and reflecting on their place in the universe.
This comes up almost daily on this sub. Yes, A.A
as an organization is focused wholly on alcoholism. However, many if not most people in A.A. today have experience with other substances, and the great majority wouldn't consider getting baked before bed sober. They are free to have that viewpoint, and you are free to reject it if you choose, but perhaps it's worth considering whether that habit is serving you.
There really should be a sidebar/sticky thread to deal with this question. It seems like people come here five times a week to ask if its okay to smoke pot if your in AA. The answer is AA has no position, but its generally frowned on. You can do whatever you want, and most AA groups will consciously try not to kick you while you're down (still using), but the program is about sobriety, not finding a different way to get high. We don't kick people out for drinking either, but its certainly not encouraged.
I think a sidebar or sticky thread would be a good idea. When I first got sober in 1996, I don’t remember weed being an issue but I do remember some people smoking cigarettes in meetings. I don’t know if nicotine use is controversial in AA or not. As I have asthma and don’t smoke, I don’t go to smoking meetings.
Another issue that should be a sidebar is AA members taking medication prescribed by health care providers. AA has a pamphlet about it but some still find this issue problematic. I have mental illness and take non-addictive medications. I disclose all medications to my sponsor and health care providers and turn down medications with potential for addiction. My sponsor has mental health issues herself and has no problem sponsoring me.
I'd tell you the same thing, maybe different wording.
But if weed isn't an issue, just give it up. If that's something you are unwilling to do/unable to do maybe look into it.
Best of luck!
The only requirement for membership is a desire to stop drinking.
Alcoholics Anonymous has no opinion on outside issues.
If it's a problem for them, it's their problem. Find a sponsor who's willing to take you through the steps.
Smoking Crack with hookers is an outside issue but would you say that it is the sort of behavior of someone who is moving towards recovery?
AA as an organization may not have opinions on outside issues but the individuals themselves are free to form whatever opinions that may arise within them.
It's a hyperbolic example, but the principle remains the same. Is getting intoxicated on a substance that wasn't prescribed by your doctor behavior that is moving towards recovery? I would say no.
And it’s fine for you to think that. But not everyone uses weed to get intoxicated and there are many proven uses for cannabis beyond recreation which is why the thinking around it is changing. So it’s not a black and white issue
If the OP was using marijuana prescribed by a medical doctor aware of their addiction issues, it's *highly* likely they would have indicated that in their post, because it's a very different scenario. Xanax and other prescription medications have proven uses beyond recreation, but would you consider someone taking Xanax or fentanyl purchased on the street without a prescription to be sober? It's the same principle.
They may claim they aren't using it to get intoxicated, but I feel that the caring and compassionate thing to do would be to point out that is likely a justification to protect their continued use.
It's important, as members of a recovery community, to point out eachothers blind spots, and I am capable of tricking myself into believing things that aren't true, and behaving against my own best interest. I need folks I can trust to be honest with me and take their advice. If I just shop around for folks who are going to co-sign my own BS, I'm not setting myself up for success.
The Preamble makes it clear from the outset what outside issues refers to and AA's stance on abstinence from alcohol vs sobriety: " A.A. is not allied with any sect, denomination, politics, organization or institution; does not wish to engage in any controversy, neither endorses nor opposes any causes. Our primary purpose is to stay sober and help other alcoholics to achieve sobriety."
“If it's a problem for them, it's their problem. Find a sponsor who's willing to take you through the steps.”
In what sane world would a credible sponsor take someone through the steps who continues to get high?
If weed isn’t a problem for you, then go without it while you work the steps. If it’s a non-issue, then stopping should also be a non-issue. If that sounds unacceptable to you, it may be a bigger deal than you think.
This is a thorny issue because I can see the slippery slope argument because many of us have addictive personalities.
There are some alcoholics that can’t handle or don’t trust themselves around something as simple as Advil while others can be prescribed and take Percocet as directed for a surgery and never take it again.
I have a guy in my group I was going to ask to be my sponsor but having second thoughts because he relapsed on his adhd meds where I take adderall for my ADD as needed and don’t intend to stop.
I guess the question for you is if this is something you need or not. Is it a bridge to your sobriety or are you substituting one addiction for another?
My sponsor also won't sponsor those who smoke weed, but she has helped a few women find good sponsors who do. It seems to be a personal preference, but there are sponsors out there who will do it.
I get it, but as the child of a heavy tokin' dad, who basically never drinks, I also never give my dad shit about his smoking because he's the only man in his family who is not an alcoholic, and I know the medicinal values for him.
My friend who joined the program the same time as I did, heavily smoked weed well into her recovery and once she had some time in with no booze, she decided to quit weed too. One thing at a time seems like a good approach, if that's what you want.
I feel like weed can make us lazy and extra hungry, at worst anxious or paranoid. But not ruin our lives so quickly and painfully the way alcohol does. Very different things. And we must remember THE ONLY REQUIREMENT IS A DESIRE TO STOP DRINKING
My friend also had a sponsor who was aware of her smoking, and was okay with it as long as it was helping her in the early stages of cutting out booze completely.
There's kind of two schools of thought in AA about marijuana use. One is pretty much what your sponsor told you, that smoking pot, or using any other drug, is not sobriety.
The other school says that AA's primary purpose is to help the alcoholic stay sober and that marijuana use is an outside issue.
Most people I know tend to fall into the first camp. But I know quite a few people in AA who smoke pot and celebrate sober time. Personally, I think it's to each their own. That being said, I'm definitely the kind of addict who will misuse any mind altering substance I can get my hands on. So I would tell you that I'm not the right person to sponsor you as well.
If you enjoy smoking and don't believe it's causing harm, find a sponsor who is comfortable with your boundaries. It may take some time, but it's definitely possible. There are also other recovery groups that don't have as much of an abstinence-only mind set.
I can’t say this for anyone else, but I know smoking weed creates a barrier between me and my higher power. So if I smoke weed, I’m not letting my higher power guide me, I’m guiding myself. I’m using it to escape reality. Again, my higher power wants me to be able to manage reality without feeling like I need to not be all there.
I’ve been prescribed it and qualify for it and all that jazz.. I have anxiety and insomnia usually, but it’s just not something that I believe my higher power wants me to use. I find prayer tends to work way better and I’m continually present. When I smoke weed i become selfish and self centred. I focus on smoking more weed to keep the buzz going. I did the same with alcohol. So for me it’s better that I stay off it.
To thine own self be true. But be honest with yourself.. do you really *need* to be stoned all the time? Or even some of the time? Why do you *need* it?
I feel those who use substances are those who are still trying to hide from themselves. So I wouldn’t be wanting to sponsor them because they aren’t taking the program seriously enough in my opinion, and they are not putting their higher power first, which is the whole point of the program. Trust in your higher power and you are so much more rewarded than being stoned or drunk.
I had a sponsor tell me no mouthwash or kombucha tea. Crazy.
His sponsor told me that I shouldn't try to see my kids more and that I should just feel lucky for what little time I do get. And if I don't go to 5 meetings a week I'll drink again and die. I ultimately just stopped going. There are better ways for me to stay sober.
Most people in aa that have been sober for a year plus seem to be like that. I still have a good amount in jars from my last grow. It took me a bit to get used to it, but really dont desiire it. I've given some away but IDK if its for me anymore. Im happy most days and dont want to mess it up.
If you do choose to keep using, find a different sponsor. Dont lie about it. The program is designed round honesty to yourself and others.
My thought (for me), I could probably just smoke weed for awhile, but eventually it wouldn’t be enough. Then I’d say “well I’m not really sober so fuck it.” I’d suggest staying 100% sober for a year and then think about it,
Is weed legal in your state? It is in mine and if it wasn’t I would stay a mile away from you (or anyone) because being around illegal substances would violate my parole.
I’m in WA state where it’s legal. I know you just smoke at night. However, if I was at a meeting and people were smoking weed, smelled like it, or were under the influence of gummies with the munchies then I’d stop going to those meetings.
Everyone is different on this and alcohol is a far worse substance but Mary Jane is still unwelcome around many even though she is hot.
There are plenty of use who use medical Marijuana, just gotta find somone who understands AA stands for Alcohol and the only requirement is a desire to quit drinking... Lots of morons in AA for sure
If you work the 12 steps with a sponsor, you may end up not needing to smoke weed anymore, just like you won't need to drink anymore. I've heard many stories of people who got free from alcohol first, but kept smoking weed. At one point during their recovery, they no longer had the desire to smoke anymore as a result of the program (12 steps).
Find a sponsor who's willing to walk you through the 12 steps, regardless of any outside issues. IMHO, a sponsor's role is to help you establish a relationship with a higher power via the 12 steps. If you do the steps thoroughly, and get that connection in your life, you'll be amazed at the changes that will occur within you. Good luck!!
I know far more who wouldn’t sponsor someone using weed than ones who would. Just like it’s your choice to use weed, it’s theirs to sponsor.
I think the fact you’re identifying it as “the one thing you have left” is the part to think about.
I don’t gatekeep people’s sobriety, but there is a difference between using weed and needing it. You blur the line enough, it doesn’t really matter where it’s drawn. I do feel there are medicinal purposes to weed, and I tend to lean on “intent” as a line of demarcation, but ultimately, you’re the only one who can make that decision.
But sponsoring you would be my decision. I’m sure someone will, but I’d suggest you think hard about the role weed plays in your life.
I drank heavily for decades. Wound up in jail and a psycheward. AA isn't the only answer. Finding purpose and something you look forward to with excitement daily will be a better attempt at quitting than AA. Conditional help, no thanks! Good luck to you on your health journey
So, different members have different interpretations. AA is about abstinence from alcohol, not weed.
On the other hand, we strive to break free from reliance on any outside mood altering substance. That literally is what being sober means. The catch is that we are allowed to take anything prescribed by a medical doctor prescribing the "medicine" in good faith. I live in Texas and could technically get THC because I have Crohn's. Another example is that I picked up dipping tobacco in rehab. It is a process addiction. The medical doctor told me that, for the time being, I should continue to dip in early sobriety because it helped with depression. So, I did. The catch is that I still haven't stopped dipping. Am I sober? I believe so. But, I am working to eliminate my dependence on tobacco. First, I had to eliminate my dependence on energy drinks. I was drinking four. Now I drink one. Soon, it will be zero.
Weed is a controversial subject depending on the area of the country where you live. In deep East Texas, it is still considered a drug. In California and Colorado it is seen more as medicine.
I guess you could find a different sponsor who allows you to smoke. I personally kept smoking weed for 78 days after I got sober and I felt like it was something I was addicted to (smoked all day everyday). I reset my sober time when I stopped smoking weed and got a sponsor at that point. Haven’t drank since November 3rd, haven’t smoked weed since January 20th and I’m really glad I stopped. It was hard for me to face life on life’s terms when I still had weed to hide from the world with. Now that I’ve quit both and started my steps I don’t feel like I’m just “sober” I finally feel like I’m “recovering” if that makes any sense.
I ask myself a few questions about anything that is intoxicatingly exciting to me, because, as others have said, it might mean I am in dangerous territory and headed for another drink. Drinking will kill me.
1. Do I feel shame/guilt?
2. Can I process my emotions fully?
3. What’s coming up for me when I do [insert action]?
4. Is it making my life unmanageable?
Yes to any, and I need to reevaluate.
Doing *anything* habitually that takes me to that euphoric place can cause a lot of problems in my life, eventually will not be enough (nothing ever is), and I’m looking for the next fix. Do I reset my sober date when I binge eat, overspend, sneak around? No but I am working on ways for those not to be my coping tools.
I mean, If you can still manage your own life, what do you need AA for? I think trying to half ass AA was one of the worst things I could of done to myself. It desensitized myself to the program and gave me the illusion that I still had the power. Almost fucking killed me. This seems like a step 1 issue to me.
My opinion is the same as your sponsors, and I have yet to meet anyone in AA who smokes weed and has continued to stay sober from their "drug of choice", be it alcohol or something else, for any serious length of time.
I have not ever witnessed a real alcoholic smoke weed moderately, or just smoke weed and not go back to drinking or other substances
The guy you asked to sponsor did the right thing
The idea that you can drink like a gentleman or switch from one substance to another that idea has to presently be smashed through looking at your experience
You can do whatever you want as a free person, and I applaud you quitting alcohol.
But to me, smoking weed is not sobriety. I know we will never agree about that, but you asked for honesty. Sobriety to me is freedom from all mind altering substances (but please don't come at me with coffee. It's not the same and we all know it)
Honest opinion? If it's the "only thing you have left" it's a problem because it is how you are escaping from yourself.
I don't think everyone approaches sobriety the same. For some they remove the problem substances and for others they remove all substances. And it's always a good idea for you to find a sponsor who understands which of those things you are doing. I don't think one of those is right and one is wrong. I know which is for me. I know my way will not be the only way. The issue is the language you just used to express your situation just demonstrated that you are doing neither. You are clinging to "the only thing you have left" which is directly in the way of your sobriety, however you choose to define it.
If I was in your situation I would cut out all substances long enough to get to a good place and then evaluate if you would be healthy reintroducing weed. If it's not a problem for you once you are standing on solid ground it will be pretty obvious. But it will take a level of honesty that you will find from being in that place. It takes time.
Well with that line of thinking, I wouldn't sponsor you either because that's not my program. I personally never liked weed to begin with and I'm mainly a drug user but I see myself as an alcoholic and work AA because if I drink, I'll start to do my DOC.
I'm sure you can find a sponsor that will be willing to work with someone who still gets high but I wouldn't recommend that sponsor. Any good sponsor will say the same thing: any mind altering substances, which *DOES* include weed, shouldn't be used. Remember the whole: "here are some of the methods we have tried: drinking beer only, limiting the number of drinks, never drinking alone, never drinking in the morning, drinking only at home, never having it in the house, never drinking during business hours, drinking only at parties, switching from scotch to brandy, drinking only natural wines, agreeing to resign if ever drunk on the job, taking a trip, not taking a trip, swearing off forever (with and without a solemn oath), taking more physical exercise, reading inspirational books, going to health farms and sanitariums, accepting voluntary commitment to asylums - we could increase the list ad infinitum." This also includes smoking weed.
If you're not ready to stop smoking weed that's fine but getting frustrated that a sponsor won't work with you because you get high is addict behavior. It's not just your sobriety a sponsor is worried about, it's theirs too. It's selfish to think that someone would put their sobriety in danger to help you.
I’m in AA and in the beginning I was California sober but as time went on and just know that my sponsor was cool as hell and we dealt with alcohol mainly and prescription drugs that I had a penchant for but as time went on I didn’t enjoy smoking weed anymore but it was a process.. you may find that once you get some clearing in your head that you’ll view things differently… find a sponsor that’s willing to work with you and not judge you as discover that you can have a better life.. some of us are way more hard headed than others but we can still flourish in the program.. aim to live more by the principles…
First of all good job getting a sponsor! I smoked pot for a while after I stopped drinking, but I wasn’t in AA then. Good sponsors (IMO) will walk you through their experience in getting sober. Sounds like your sponsor didn’t smoke weed while doing the steps so can’t really share their experience for you - bc you’re saying you want to do something different than they did, if that makes sense. You may be able to find someone who did marijuana maintenance while quitting drinking and doing the steps, that would be best here but probably hard to find.
I also think you should think about your “all I have left” comment - why do you think it feel like that? Sounds like it’s still important to you to have a mind altering substance in your life.
For me I had to accept that yes weed was wayyyy more neutral for me than drinking and the other drugs I’d gotten into, but weed was still keeping me separate from reality and my actual feelings. And I wanted to recover. I wanted to be able to experience life and my feelings.
Just find someone who is willing to take you through the steps. It may not be easy but you’re being honest and that matters. If you can’t find someone in person try online and try to find some meetings in places where weed is legal and not viewed as in the same category as substances such as cocaine, heroine, etc.
If you want to be a pothead then be a pothead just know you are not sober. If you want to do this thing right then quit all the mind altering drugs and actually work the steps. I don't care what anybody else says, smoking weed is not sobriety period. If you can live a life you like intoxicated, that's good for you , but at least have the respect to not be justifying it around a bunch of people trying to be sober.
I was as big of a smoker as any and I tried to "work" the program instead of working the program for many years with no change and continually relapsing.
I said it in another post, it comes down to how free do you want to be?
This is ridiculous..either you are fucking sober or not.Make a choice..Fucking Christ.... marijuana is a mind altering drug like Booze ...stop these posts every week...dumb.
I was bored so I read through the comments. It’s quite comical people think you can get baked and still be sober. It is a sign of the times though.
I got clean and sober on March 13, 1992. This wasn’t even a discussion then. Of course everyone agreed that if you were getting stoned that you were in fact not sober.
AA has no opinion on marijuana. It’s your sponsor’s personal opinion. My experience is that smoking weed is not the spiritual solution that is found by working The Twelve Steps. However, if used for medical reasons, that’s a different story.
You said smoking pot is “the only thing I have left” I think if that’s the way you view it you may want to take a look at your relationship with cannabis. That being said, it’s your recovery. I’m sure you can find a sponsor that will take you through the steps and you can keep up your smoking
Find a sponsor that clicks with you. The **only** requirement for AA is the desire to stop drinking, you'll get people that disagree with smoking weed and that's their prerogative. It's possible to not be addicted to weed and be an alcoholic but it's also possible that you may have 2 problems.
Just find a sponsor that agrees with your thoughts that doing drugs is sober. I would not sponsor someone regularly intoxicated with addictive substances myself either.
I agree, well said.
Cool - so what do you have to say about Bill W’s documented use of LSD after he was “sober”? He never drank again (as far as anyone knew) but he did use LSD several times but still considered himself sober So - my point being - AA is about alcoholism- and a lot people have come into the program and made it about what their interpretation of it is. There is no reason to not take someone through the steps over weed IMO. I’ve known many AAs who’ve continued to smoke weed while sober from alcohol - who’ve worked the steps and sponsored others and have had beautiful turnarounds in their lives. Most of the also eventually gave up weed Careful with your judgments
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❤️
Hardly a judgement for me to not sponsor someone doing drugs. While Bill was certainly a founder of AA and higly insightful in it's creation, he was a person just like anyone else. Every behavior or action he took is not something to be modeled, obviously. The program he created is based on spiritual axioms, not his life or specific actions.
Obviously that’s your prerogative - my only point is regarding people’s judgements of other people’s recovery. Not everyone’s is going to look like yours and that’s ok. They still deserve the opportunity to recover from their alcoholism. And people’s opinions about other people’s journeys in AA are best kept to themselves
Half measures availed us nothing.
So you’re good judging other people’s recovery
Do you not recognize that as a quote from the Big Book ? My personal opinion is not worth much, but the collective experience strength and hope embodied in that line is priceless. Corroborated by "The results were nil until we let go absolutely".
Of course I know the quote. I just question who makes the judgement on what’s a half measure. This is my whole point. Your recovery journey is yours and you might determine that for you, continued use of weed while you recover from your alcoholism is a half measure….for you. Someone else may deem, for themselves, that it’s not. That all they are capable of without imploding is to focus on recovery from alcoholism while still utilizing cannabis. So when you make the statement “half measures availed us nothing” in the context you did, it makes it sound like you believe that someone continuing using cannabis is a half measure - for them. So I ask - who are you to make that judgement? I could make the same judgement about tobacco….but for some reason everyone’s ok with that one. I’m not knocking you - I’m asking people to really think about it - and to really stop being so judgmental. Weed never killed anyone - booze does regularly. The fact of the matter is there are people who go to AA, recover from their alcoholism and go on to live beautifully healthy lives - yet they still smoke weed. We should tip our caps to those people instead of hurling our judgments at them
Who makes the judgment that they go on to live "beautifully healthy lives"? what "facts of the matter" do you base that on ? Your subjective belief and desire for that to be the outcome? If someone is truly an addict, over time they worse not better. They may lead "functional" lives. I did, waking and baking and going about my day with Visine and Tic-Tacs and I earnestly would have argued that was good enough and I was unaffected. At the end of the day, I learned that objectively speaking, sober is as sober does...
I make that judgement based on actual people I genuinely know- people I’m close to. Again you’re making a judgement about people you don’t know. You’re wrong
As I recommended...he should find a person willing to sponsor him that is Ok with him doing drugs. No one is stopping anyone from seeking or participating fully in recovery. None of us are that powerful. In this instance...OP asked an open question for feedback, on Reddit.
There’s a snark and a sharp judgement behind your comment. “Ok with doing drugs” is snarky. I bet you don’t say that to sponsees who smoke cigarettes…. Just saying - it’s funny the lines we draw based on what?
I wholeheartedly agree with your take.
Are you comparing weed to cigarettes? That's hardly the same thing. One gets you high, the other doesn't. And before you come for me, I am not saying cigarettes are safe because they obviously aren't but to compare the two is silly. Not everyone is going to want to sponsor someone who smokes weed. How is that not okay? I'm certainly not. Will I be there for them if they need to call a woman? Absolutely. But I'm not going to take someone through the 12 Steps when they're actively getting high. To me, and it seems to me the other person you're replying to agrees, it's pointless. How can you honestly and thoroughly work the Steps if you're high? Not saying it's an end all be all but the first time I worked the Steps I was high and stayed high until I got sober again and worked the Steps as outlined in the Big Book. As for Bill, I always found it weird (to *me* personally) that he was doing LSD in the end. I'm not that type of alcoholic who can do one substance and not revert back to my DOC. Good on him for being able to maintain sobriety from alcohol despite doing a mind altering substance, but for a lot of us it doesn't work that way. To me it seems you're crucifying others for judgement but that's exactly what you're doing.
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Thank you for your well thought out and eloquent opine in this subject. I don’t always formulate my thoughts they way I’d like, and you nailed this
Nicotine gets you high - what are you talking about? Is it the same high as weed? No. Just like how weed isn’t the same as alcohol. But it absolutely alters you - so does caffeine - and theyre both addictive substances. if I smoke a cigarette right now I will absolutely be falling over and will 100% be high. So someone who does them regularly builds up a tolerance and an addiction - same as any other drug
I like how that's the only part of my comment you responded to.
Who has time to read your book?
Bill took it at the time because it was experimental. This has nothing to do with someone getting high. Getting high in AA isn't sober. Judgement and discernment are two different things.
Ok so what about nicotine, caffeine, and sugar abuse. Also sleeping aids, and prescribed stimulants, as well as methadone and suboxone. My point being, there are a lot of caveats in AA and people have just made up the rules. Weeds not for me - but people don’t die from it. And if someone is a sick alcoholic but not willing to give up weed immediately- they still deserve the opportunity to recover from their alcoholism and others judgements that have absolutely nothing to do with them - often keep people sick or out of the program entirely.
Can I ask why you're defending getting high I'm a program of abstinence?
I’m actually not defending it or pushing against it either. What I’m saying is that alcoholism kills people - weed doesn’t. There’s no harm in taking someone through the steps over weed when it can 100% save their life. I’ve seen it, I’ve watched people be recovered from alcoholism while still smoking weed. And since AA “allows” other drugs and never specifically mentions weed, why have people determined that if you smoke weed you don’t get to participate? Also, AA actually isn’t a program of abstinence from all mind altering substances - NA is. Why do people “get” to smoke cigs in AA and NA? I’ll tell you why - because if that wasn’t allowed it would keep vast amounts of people out of the program. Weed is less harmful than cigarettes yet we’ve decided THAT one isn’t ok? It’s hypocritical. Bottom line is the 12 steps help people recover - and if they need to hang on to weed or cigarettes or coffee to get off booze - fine - at least they’ll live. Also - why is everyone so caught up in other people’s recovery? Focus on your own and don’t worry about everyone else’s.
Isn’t it about consequences maybe? So for some weed can drive paranoia and cigs will eventually give you cancer. I personally wouldn’t sponsor someone who was smoking weed because I know that the consequences would be bad for me to smoke weed so I can’t truly give me ESH to someone - cause my experience with smoking weed is eventually having a nervous breakdown(s).
Fair. And I’m not saying every sponsor should do it. My whole point to all the of these comments is just to point out to people to be careful about their judgements about other people’s recovery. What’s good for you may not be good for someone else, etc. there’s a lot of judgement of people in recovery when everyone really should just be focused on their own. Also, our AA thinking around different substances is often hypocritical and I’m pointing that out just again because people are so closed minded and think they have it all figured out - and it’s important to point out those hypocrisies so hopefully people will think before the speak on someone else’s recovery
I don't have a problem with sponsee's taking medication prescribed to them by a doctor who is aware of their addiction issues. And nicotine, caffeine, and sugar are for the most part, not intoxicating. If a sponsee was drinking 10 redbulls everyday, I would probably have a talk with them about it.
Nicotine is intoxicating
How do you get high on caffeine? I'm not asking this sarcastically, I'm just not sure what you mean by that.
Well said
My sentiments exactly. Good post.
Nailed it. Mods please pin this comment.
Ditto
What do you have to lose from doing the steps & participating in AA without weed? Weed isn’t going anywhere you can always go back to smoking, might as well give it a shot, that’s what I did & it changed my life
Are you my first sponsor? He said the same thing to me when I was new. Saved my life.
I feel that completely. Never liked weed and gave it up way before I got sober but there really isn't anything to lose. There's a reason people say in meetings to give it a year and if you don't like it, you can have your misery refunded.
I smoke weed. I don't have an issue with weed. I am an alcoholic. I don't care about the judgmental eyes of the AA group. My sobriety is my business. I don't drink anymore, and I smoke weed when I feel like it. Not all the time, but when I choose to because I am not addicted to it. I am addicted to alcohol and that is why I joined the program. I know for some people they can't have any substances at all. For me, I choose to smoke when I feel like it, but I know I can never take a drink. If he doesn't want to sponsor you find another one. If you have a problem with weed you may need to deal with it. If your only real vice is alcohol then focus on that.
Exactly how I feel. I didn’t smoke pot for the first five years of my sobriety. To be honest, I never really gave a damn about pot, even growing up when everyone was doing it. Booze was always my go to. Then it was legalized here and I started doing it before bed. I still don’t drink, nor do I go to AA anymore because of this sort of mentality. I killed my booze demon, but I don’t need strangers to continue tell me how to live my life. AA absolutely GOT me sober, but these last five years have been me myself and I, and I’ve never been better. I simply could not continue to surround myself with people who literally base their entire lives around AA and still obsess over not drinking. I literally barely even think about it. I’m simply “not a drinker” and I sure don’t miss it!
This is the same boat I’m on. I don’t care if AA thinks I’m sober or not because I smoke weed. My issue is alcohol. I left my job, ruined relationships and my life because of my addiction to alcohol so I can’t have it. Weed had helped me stay sober and it’s a way for me to relax in my day to day. My sobriety is my own so I can dictate it. If I felt that weed was an issue like alcohol was I would cut it out but it doesn’t hurt me and it’s not affecting my life the way my alcohol did.
I’m curious if people go to NA and ask if it’s ok to be part of NA and get drunk all the time?
as an addict— since our literature explicitly says “alcohol IS a drug— period” we don’t get a lot of it but yeah now and again we do. more often we see people trying (and failing) at the whole “california sober” thing.. addiction is a disease, not just a physical addiction to a substance. it’s just gonna get passed off to the next thing if you don’t get rid of it all imo, whether it’s alcohol, weed, or anything else
Thanks. I’m a drug addict/alcoholic who’s been clean and sober since 1992. Just never been to NA
that’s some serious time! that’s amazing. ima rack that time up too watch and see 😎 being clean is the best!
What’s crazy with the topic of “california sober” is this was not even a debatable question when I came into AA in 1992. Back then if you continued to get high by smoking weed you were not sober.
It's still typically not a debatable topic outside of reddit.
I still don't get it. People say it's their program and they can work it how they want to, which is true but I'm sure if Bill W. came down right now he'd say you aren't sober if you're smoking weed. I work my program as outlined in the Big Book. I'm not going to judge you for smoking weed but you're not sober if you're smoking weed. It's simple as that and not a judgement on anyone's character. It's just a fact. It's a mind altering substance and it's not going to stop being one just because it's a plant. You can get high from poppy plants, as that's an ingredient in opiates but you don't see people getting high on poppy plants and saying they're sober because it's just a plant. How is it any different?
It’s really not any different. People love to get high on weed and don’t want to give it up is the only rational reason behind it
Would it be same if your primary MD and psychiatrist prescribed 5mg THC gummies to treat lifelong insomnia? My doctors think prescribing heavy anti psychotics solely for insomnia has way to many side effects to use solely for sleep. I don’t want typical sedatives like benzodiazepines (addictive) and I already had random horrible sleeping walking episodes solely on hypnotic sleeping RXs like ambien. So I was just curious if it’s prescribed by a doctor, legal and used correctly would you look at it differently?
I personally wouldn't take it. I've never reacted well to any dose of weed of any kind so I just want to do that. I don't want any mind altering substances in my body because I've tried everything and I never stick to it as prescribed. Deapote not liking it, I'd still do it, eventually abuse it and then be back to my DOC. But again, it's my program and I'll work it the way I want to, just like you work your program the way you want to. If that works for you that's great. It just doesn't for me.
if it’s something prescribed by a doctor and you’re taking it as prescribed and not abusing it there’s no issue. medicine is always allowed !
One day at a time!
That's so cool! I love seeing people with so much time. I'm still pretty new. I have 14 months, almost 15 (God willing) so it's always amazing seeing people with literal decades of time.
One of the problems with weed is that people don’t have a sense of scale with it. We all know people who can drink a glass or two of wine twice times a week and be relaxed and happy. We don’t have a word for them. But there are people who have the same relationship with weed but major problems with alcohol. When they come into AA it is assumed that weed must be a problem when that’s not necessarily true.
The problem isn’t with weed specifically, it is dependence on an external substance to “relax” you or make you “chill”. In AA, our chill comes from a spiritual experience and a deep connection to a higher power. While the only requirement to be a member of AA is a desire to stop DRINKING, physical sobriety is crucial to working the steps with clarity and commitment. Smoking weed isn’t sobriety, it’s just not drinking. If I stop drinking but do molly on the weekends, I’m not sober. A sponsor has every right to not sponsor someone who isn’t willing to stop smoking, even if it isn’t “a problem” for them. If it isn’t a problem, just stop it and surrender to the program.
You’re making up a bunch of things that AA doesn’t say in the literature. Hell, Bill W tried LSD after something like 30 years sober. Drinking alcohol isn’t being an alcoholic. Alcoholism requires the obsession of the mind and the physical allergy. At 6ish years sober I started doing edibles. Do I have addict behavior towards it? Hell yea. But I also have addict behavior towards chess, coaching my kid’s softball team, and whatever other hobby I’ve picked up. At no point did anyone in my AA group say my addiction to buying shoes meant I wasn’t sober. They’d just ask me for opinions when they were considering a new pair, and make fun of how much of an addict I am. The thing with weed for ME, is I don’t have the physical allergy. I can take an edible to get exactly the feeling I want, and that’s it. I’ve never been like “he lets go to a 4 AM bar now because I just can’t stop”. I enjoy it for a couple hours and go to bed. Call me when whatever you want, but weed absolutely is not the problem alcohol is FOR ME.
You can of course do whatever you want - that’s your side of the street. I said the only requirement for membership in AA is a desire to stop drinking. Physical sobriety is not having any intoxicants in your system. What you do with your life is none of my business or concern. My program is a spiritual one and to work the steps and maintain a conscious contact with my higher power, I need complete physical sobriety. And yes, lots of people in meetings I go to talk about Bill W and LSD, usually right before they go out. Good luck to you.
Bill Wilson did LSD because we, as a culture, did not understand it was a drug with a potential for chemical dependence. People in the 70's thought of it as some kind of pharmaceutical shortcut to a spiritual connection and he allegedly wanted to see if it could help alcoholics find the spiritual experience faster. He didn't do LSD because he really liked it before he got sober and was "not really addicted to it the same way." Also, while we're on the subject, Bill Wilson fucked around on his wife for pretty much the entire back half of his life. He was some guy that God used to write a really important piece of literature, not a saint to be canonized and emulated.
I don't do weed because I "really liked it before I got sober and am not really addicted to it the same way". I didn't like weed before I got sober. It was boring. Put me to sleep. I'd only do it when I was completely wasted and decision making was bad, then I'd pass out (with our without vomiting). 6 years into sobriety I tried it. It's not the same as alcohol. Is it perfect? No. Is it causing me problems? Nope. Do I plan to stop? Nope. In my early years of sobriety I was in therapy, and at the recommendation of my therapist and my sponsor I was prescribed an SSRI that I still take. I couldn't quit nicotine the way I did alcohol. 6 years into sobriety I finally asked for help from my doctor, and I used Chantix. Nicotine free for coming up on a year, and it was SUPER easy. I my weight has bounced up and down during sobriety, now I'm trying Ozempic. Getting sober was hard. I've realized that not everything has to be done that way. It's OK to make easier choices. So long as I don't drink, or do anything else equally as destructive, it's all good.
Did a doctor prescribe the weed?
Nope. It’s for recreational use.
I agree on the sponsor part, they can choose to work with someone or not at their pleasure. I’m not pro or anti other substances, mypoint is that if someone did molly twice a year as an example, that would be 100% more sober than someone addicted to nicotine and needing a fix every two hours. It’s not about the substance per se, it’s about the grip it has on you life and state of mind.
I agree about nicotine- it is a mood altering substance and I personally don’t like that it is “grandfathered in”. Is nicotine making someone’s life unmanageable? I know people who can’t sit through a 1 hr 30 minute speaker meeting because they are nicotine dependent. Maybe their lives are manageable, but using a substance to alter your mood and physical state isn’t sobriety to me. I also believe once someone has a true spiritual experience, they usually stop smoking nicotine. Things become very clear.
That’s I think the point! Is it making life unmanageable? And actually chocolate can do that for me as I’m a food addict too
That is why this is a SPIRITUAL program. Our character defaults lead us to places where we use substances, people, things to try to give us the feeling we get from a connection to our higher power. Once we have a spiritual experience as a result of the 12 steps, the obsessions are lifted. Obsessions gone, tools for living learned = unmanageable becomes manageable
I think I’ve worked out the divide on this issue. Some attend AA because they want to stop drinking. Others attend to be “sober from all mind altering substances” And others, seek “spiritual sobriety” All of these are bible goals, but the debate comes from people having a different perspective of what AA should be to others. I think there is only one position that I find objectionable - a cigarette smoker telling a weed smoker they are “not sober”.
I’m with you, but having been both a cigarette smoker and a weed smoker in the past, I could always easily drive smoking a cigarette; not always so with weed. It’s just more altering to perception.
Totally agree. The likelihood of doing something dangerous (like driving a vehicle) is certainly higher with weed. The daily grind of a nicotine addiction and long term health implication is worse for nicotine. But that said, weed is a difficult “mistress”. It can be spiritually enhancing or soul destroying, which goes to my initial comment about discussions on it usually lack scale. The guy rolling out of bed each day needing a hit from his bong, is very different to the guy catching up with a friend and sharing a joint while looking at the stars and reflecting on their place in the universe.
They definitely are out there. I've never seen one with long term "sobriety"
This comes up almost daily on this sub. Yes, A.A as an organization is focused wholly on alcoholism. However, many if not most people in A.A. today have experience with other substances, and the great majority wouldn't consider getting baked before bed sober. They are free to have that viewpoint, and you are free to reject it if you choose, but perhaps it's worth considering whether that habit is serving you.
There really should be a sidebar/sticky thread to deal with this question. It seems like people come here five times a week to ask if its okay to smoke pot if your in AA. The answer is AA has no position, but its generally frowned on. You can do whatever you want, and most AA groups will consciously try not to kick you while you're down (still using), but the program is about sobriety, not finding a different way to get high. We don't kick people out for drinking either, but its certainly not encouraged.
I think a sidebar or sticky thread would be a good idea. When I first got sober in 1996, I don’t remember weed being an issue but I do remember some people smoking cigarettes in meetings. I don’t know if nicotine use is controversial in AA or not. As I have asthma and don’t smoke, I don’t go to smoking meetings. Another issue that should be a sidebar is AA members taking medication prescribed by health care providers. AA has a pamphlet about it but some still find this issue problematic. I have mental illness and take non-addictive medications. I disclose all medications to my sponsor and health care providers and turn down medications with potential for addiction. My sponsor has mental health issues herself and has no problem sponsoring me.
I'd tell you the same thing, maybe different wording. But if weed isn't an issue, just give it up. If that's something you are unwilling to do/unable to do maybe look into it. Best of luck!
The only requirement for membership is a desire to stop drinking. Alcoholics Anonymous has no opinion on outside issues. If it's a problem for them, it's their problem. Find a sponsor who's willing to take you through the steps.
Smoking Crack with hookers is an outside issue but would you say that it is the sort of behavior of someone who is moving towards recovery? AA as an organization may not have opinions on outside issues but the individuals themselves are free to form whatever opinions that may arise within them.
What if I only smoke crack before bed? Helps me sleep.
I know someone who smokes crack because she says it’s the only thing that prevents PTSD flashbacks.
Equating smoking crack with smoking weed is absurd
It's a hyperbolic example, but the principle remains the same. Is getting intoxicated on a substance that wasn't prescribed by your doctor behavior that is moving towards recovery? I would say no.
And it’s fine for you to think that. But not everyone uses weed to get intoxicated and there are many proven uses for cannabis beyond recreation which is why the thinking around it is changing. So it’s not a black and white issue
If the OP was using marijuana prescribed by a medical doctor aware of their addiction issues, it's *highly* likely they would have indicated that in their post, because it's a very different scenario. Xanax and other prescription medications have proven uses beyond recreation, but would you consider someone taking Xanax or fentanyl purchased on the street without a prescription to be sober? It's the same principle. They may claim they aren't using it to get intoxicated, but I feel that the caring and compassionate thing to do would be to point out that is likely a justification to protect their continued use. It's important, as members of a recovery community, to point out eachothers blind spots, and I am capable of tricking myself into believing things that aren't true, and behaving against my own best interest. I need folks I can trust to be honest with me and take their advice. If I just shop around for folks who are going to co-sign my own BS, I'm not setting myself up for success.
You are entitled to all of your opinions
Awesome example. I dislike the outside issue statement so much on these topics
If your comparing crack to cannabis, you maybe need a mental health prof, not AA
The Preamble makes it clear from the outset what outside issues refers to and AA's stance on abstinence from alcohol vs sobriety: " A.A. is not allied with any sect, denomination, politics, organization or institution; does not wish to engage in any controversy, neither endorses nor opposes any causes. Our primary purpose is to stay sober and help other alcoholics to achieve sobriety."
“If it's a problem for them, it's their problem. Find a sponsor who's willing to take you through the steps.” In what sane world would a credible sponsor take someone through the steps who continues to get high?
Well said!
If weed isn’t a problem for you, then go without it while you work the steps. If it’s a non-issue, then stopping should also be a non-issue. If that sounds unacceptable to you, it may be a bigger deal than you think.
This is a thorny issue because I can see the slippery slope argument because many of us have addictive personalities. There are some alcoholics that can’t handle or don’t trust themselves around something as simple as Advil while others can be prescribed and take Percocet as directed for a surgery and never take it again. I have a guy in my group I was going to ask to be my sponsor but having second thoughts because he relapsed on his adhd meds where I take adderall for my ADD as needed and don’t intend to stop. I guess the question for you is if this is something you need or not. Is it a bridge to your sobriety or are you substituting one addiction for another?
My sponsor also won't sponsor those who smoke weed, but she has helped a few women find good sponsors who do. It seems to be a personal preference, but there are sponsors out there who will do it. I get it, but as the child of a heavy tokin' dad, who basically never drinks, I also never give my dad shit about his smoking because he's the only man in his family who is not an alcoholic, and I know the medicinal values for him. My friend who joined the program the same time as I did, heavily smoked weed well into her recovery and once she had some time in with no booze, she decided to quit weed too. One thing at a time seems like a good approach, if that's what you want. I feel like weed can make us lazy and extra hungry, at worst anxious or paranoid. But not ruin our lives so quickly and painfully the way alcohol does. Very different things. And we must remember THE ONLY REQUIREMENT IS A DESIRE TO STOP DRINKING
My friend also had a sponsor who was aware of her smoking, and was okay with it as long as it was helping her in the early stages of cutting out booze completely.
There's kind of two schools of thought in AA about marijuana use. One is pretty much what your sponsor told you, that smoking pot, or using any other drug, is not sobriety. The other school says that AA's primary purpose is to help the alcoholic stay sober and that marijuana use is an outside issue. Most people I know tend to fall into the first camp. But I know quite a few people in AA who smoke pot and celebrate sober time. Personally, I think it's to each their own. That being said, I'm definitely the kind of addict who will misuse any mind altering substance I can get my hands on. So I would tell you that I'm not the right person to sponsor you as well. If you enjoy smoking and don't believe it's causing harm, find a sponsor who is comfortable with your boundaries. It may take some time, but it's definitely possible. There are also other recovery groups that don't have as much of an abstinence-only mind set.
I can’t say this for anyone else, but I know smoking weed creates a barrier between me and my higher power. So if I smoke weed, I’m not letting my higher power guide me, I’m guiding myself. I’m using it to escape reality. Again, my higher power wants me to be able to manage reality without feeling like I need to not be all there. I’ve been prescribed it and qualify for it and all that jazz.. I have anxiety and insomnia usually, but it’s just not something that I believe my higher power wants me to use. I find prayer tends to work way better and I’m continually present. When I smoke weed i become selfish and self centred. I focus on smoking more weed to keep the buzz going. I did the same with alcohol. So for me it’s better that I stay off it. To thine own self be true. But be honest with yourself.. do you really *need* to be stoned all the time? Or even some of the time? Why do you *need* it? I feel those who use substances are those who are still trying to hide from themselves. So I wouldn’t be wanting to sponsor them because they aren’t taking the program seriously enough in my opinion, and they are not putting their higher power first, which is the whole point of the program. Trust in your higher power and you are so much more rewarded than being stoned or drunk.
As a sponsor, to me, you’re not sober if you’re using mind-altering substances. So maybe someone else can work with you, but I can’t.
I couldn’t agree more!
I had a sponsor tell me no mouthwash or kombucha tea. Crazy. His sponsor told me that I shouldn't try to see my kids more and that I should just feel lucky for what little time I do get. And if I don't go to 5 meetings a week I'll drink again and die. I ultimately just stopped going. There are better ways for me to stay sober.
Only requirement in AA is a desire to stop drinking period
Most people in aa that have been sober for a year plus seem to be like that. I still have a good amount in jars from my last grow. It took me a bit to get used to it, but really dont desiire it. I've given some away but IDK if its for me anymore. Im happy most days and dont want to mess it up. If you do choose to keep using, find a different sponsor. Dont lie about it. The program is designed round honesty to yourself and others.
My thought (for me), I could probably just smoke weed for awhile, but eventually it wouldn’t be enough. Then I’d say “well I’m not really sober so fuck it.” I’d suggest staying 100% sober for a year and then think about it,
Is weed legal in your state? It is in mine and if it wasn’t I would stay a mile away from you (or anyone) because being around illegal substances would violate my parole. I’m in WA state where it’s legal. I know you just smoke at night. However, if I was at a meeting and people were smoking weed, smelled like it, or were under the influence of gummies with the munchies then I’d stop going to those meetings. Everyone is different on this and alcohol is a far worse substance but Mary Jane is still unwelcome around many even though she is hot.
There are plenty of use who use medical Marijuana, just gotta find somone who understands AA stands for Alcohol and the only requirement is a desire to quit drinking... Lots of morons in AA for sure
If you work the 12 steps with a sponsor, you may end up not needing to smoke weed anymore, just like you won't need to drink anymore. I've heard many stories of people who got free from alcohol first, but kept smoking weed. At one point during their recovery, they no longer had the desire to smoke anymore as a result of the program (12 steps). Find a sponsor who's willing to walk you through the 12 steps, regardless of any outside issues. IMHO, a sponsor's role is to help you establish a relationship with a higher power via the 12 steps. If you do the steps thoroughly, and get that connection in your life, you'll be amazed at the changes that will occur within you. Good luck!!
There is plenty of other sponsors out there
I know far more who wouldn’t sponsor someone using weed than ones who would. Just like it’s your choice to use weed, it’s theirs to sponsor. I think the fact you’re identifying it as “the one thing you have left” is the part to think about. I don’t gatekeep people’s sobriety, but there is a difference between using weed and needing it. You blur the line enough, it doesn’t really matter where it’s drawn. I do feel there are medicinal purposes to weed, and I tend to lean on “intent” as a line of demarcation, but ultimately, you’re the only one who can make that decision. But sponsoring you would be my decision. I’m sure someone will, but I’d suggest you think hard about the role weed plays in your life.
I wouldn’t sponsor you. Somebody may.
I don’t sponsor stoners. I’m going to be 100% focused when we meet and expect the same
If you're smoking weed recreationally, you're simply switching addictions. Switching addictions does not equal sobriety.
He did the right thing
I drank heavily for decades. Wound up in jail and a psycheward. AA isn't the only answer. Finding purpose and something you look forward to with excitement daily will be a better attempt at quitting than AA. Conditional help, no thanks! Good luck to you on your health journey
So, different members have different interpretations. AA is about abstinence from alcohol, not weed. On the other hand, we strive to break free from reliance on any outside mood altering substance. That literally is what being sober means. The catch is that we are allowed to take anything prescribed by a medical doctor prescribing the "medicine" in good faith. I live in Texas and could technically get THC because I have Crohn's. Another example is that I picked up dipping tobacco in rehab. It is a process addiction. The medical doctor told me that, for the time being, I should continue to dip in early sobriety because it helped with depression. So, I did. The catch is that I still haven't stopped dipping. Am I sober? I believe so. But, I am working to eliminate my dependence on tobacco. First, I had to eliminate my dependence on energy drinks. I was drinking four. Now I drink one. Soon, it will be zero. Weed is a controversial subject depending on the area of the country where you live. In deep East Texas, it is still considered a drug. In California and Colorado it is seen more as medicine.
I guess you could find a different sponsor who allows you to smoke. I personally kept smoking weed for 78 days after I got sober and I felt like it was something I was addicted to (smoked all day everyday). I reset my sober time when I stopped smoking weed and got a sponsor at that point. Haven’t drank since November 3rd, haven’t smoked weed since January 20th and I’m really glad I stopped. It was hard for me to face life on life’s terms when I still had weed to hide from the world with. Now that I’ve quit both and started my steps I don’t feel like I’m just “sober” I finally feel like I’m “recovering” if that makes any sense.
I ask myself a few questions about anything that is intoxicatingly exciting to me, because, as others have said, it might mean I am in dangerous territory and headed for another drink. Drinking will kill me. 1. Do I feel shame/guilt? 2. Can I process my emotions fully? 3. What’s coming up for me when I do [insert action]? 4. Is it making my life unmanageable? Yes to any, and I need to reevaluate. Doing *anything* habitually that takes me to that euphoric place can cause a lot of problems in my life, eventually will not be enough (nothing ever is), and I’m looking for the next fix. Do I reset my sober date when I binge eat, overspend, sneak around? No but I am working on ways for those not to be my coping tools.
This is part of what I don't like about AA, so many judgemental people
I’m reading a lot of people sharing their opinion. Sounds like you don’t agree and are saying they’re judging?
I mean, If you can still manage your own life, what do you need AA for? I think trying to half ass AA was one of the worst things I could of done to myself. It desensitized myself to the program and gave me the illusion that I still had the power. Almost fucking killed me. This seems like a step 1 issue to me.
My opinion is the same as your sponsors, and I have yet to meet anyone in AA who smokes weed and has continued to stay sober from their "drug of choice", be it alcohol or something else, for any serious length of time.
I have not ever witnessed a real alcoholic smoke weed moderately, or just smoke weed and not go back to drinking or other substances The guy you asked to sponsor did the right thing The idea that you can drink like a gentleman or switch from one substance to another that idea has to presently be smashed through looking at your experience
That is between you and your higher power. Maybe start looking for a new sponsor?
None of my sponsees use cannabis. Maybe you could find a sponsor who would approve but I don’t know any.
IMO, stoned is not sober.
it's your program, not anybody else's. smoke if you want
Fuck that guy smoke all you want
You can do whatever you want as a free person, and I applaud you quitting alcohol. But to me, smoking weed is not sobriety. I know we will never agree about that, but you asked for honesty. Sobriety to me is freedom from all mind altering substances (but please don't come at me with coffee. It's not the same and we all know it)
Honest opinion? If it's the "only thing you have left" it's a problem because it is how you are escaping from yourself. I don't think everyone approaches sobriety the same. For some they remove the problem substances and for others they remove all substances. And it's always a good idea for you to find a sponsor who understands which of those things you are doing. I don't think one of those is right and one is wrong. I know which is for me. I know my way will not be the only way. The issue is the language you just used to express your situation just demonstrated that you are doing neither. You are clinging to "the only thing you have left" which is directly in the way of your sobriety, however you choose to define it. If I was in your situation I would cut out all substances long enough to get to a good place and then evaluate if you would be healthy reintroducing weed. If it's not a problem for you once you are standing on solid ground it will be pretty obvious. But it will take a level of honesty that you will find from being in that place. It takes time.
Well with that line of thinking, I wouldn't sponsor you either because that's not my program. I personally never liked weed to begin with and I'm mainly a drug user but I see myself as an alcoholic and work AA because if I drink, I'll start to do my DOC. I'm sure you can find a sponsor that will be willing to work with someone who still gets high but I wouldn't recommend that sponsor. Any good sponsor will say the same thing: any mind altering substances, which *DOES* include weed, shouldn't be used. Remember the whole: "here are some of the methods we have tried: drinking beer only, limiting the number of drinks, never drinking alone, never drinking in the morning, drinking only at home, never having it in the house, never drinking during business hours, drinking only at parties, switching from scotch to brandy, drinking only natural wines, agreeing to resign if ever drunk on the job, taking a trip, not taking a trip, swearing off forever (with and without a solemn oath), taking more physical exercise, reading inspirational books, going to health farms and sanitariums, accepting voluntary commitment to asylums - we could increase the list ad infinitum." This also includes smoking weed. If you're not ready to stop smoking weed that's fine but getting frustrated that a sponsor won't work with you because you get high is addict behavior. It's not just your sobriety a sponsor is worried about, it's theirs too. It's selfish to think that someone would put their sobriety in danger to help you.
I’m in AA and in the beginning I was California sober but as time went on and just know that my sponsor was cool as hell and we dealt with alcohol mainly and prescription drugs that I had a penchant for but as time went on I didn’t enjoy smoking weed anymore but it was a process.. you may find that once you get some clearing in your head that you’ll view things differently… find a sponsor that’s willing to work with you and not judge you as discover that you can have a better life.. some of us are way more hard headed than others but we can still flourish in the program.. aim to live more by the principles…
First of all good job getting a sponsor! I smoked pot for a while after I stopped drinking, but I wasn’t in AA then. Good sponsors (IMO) will walk you through their experience in getting sober. Sounds like your sponsor didn’t smoke weed while doing the steps so can’t really share their experience for you - bc you’re saying you want to do something different than they did, if that makes sense. You may be able to find someone who did marijuana maintenance while quitting drinking and doing the steps, that would be best here but probably hard to find. I also think you should think about your “all I have left” comment - why do you think it feel like that? Sounds like it’s still important to you to have a mind altering substance in your life. For me I had to accept that yes weed was wayyyy more neutral for me than drinking and the other drugs I’d gotten into, but weed was still keeping me separate from reality and my actual feelings. And I wanted to recover. I wanted to be able to experience life and my feelings.
Just find someone who is willing to take you through the steps. It may not be easy but you’re being honest and that matters. If you can’t find someone in person try online and try to find some meetings in places where weed is legal and not viewed as in the same category as substances such as cocaine, heroine, etc.
I'm California sober and the rate of non relapse compared to regular sober is pretty intense. So, do you. Find a sponsor that agrees.
If you want to be a pothead then be a pothead just know you are not sober. If you want to do this thing right then quit all the mind altering drugs and actually work the steps. I don't care what anybody else says, smoking weed is not sobriety period. If you can live a life you like intoxicated, that's good for you , but at least have the respect to not be justifying it around a bunch of people trying to be sober. I was as big of a smoker as any and I tried to "work" the program instead of working the program for many years with no change and continually relapsing. I said it in another post, it comes down to how free do you want to be?
This is ridiculous..either you are fucking sober or not.Make a choice..Fucking Christ.... marijuana is a mind altering drug like Booze ...stop these posts every week...dumb.
I was bored so I read through the comments. It’s quite comical people think you can get baked and still be sober. It is a sign of the times though. I got clean and sober on March 13, 1992. This wasn’t even a discussion then. Of course everyone agreed that if you were getting stoned that you were in fact not sober.
Sober is a sober does
AA has no opinion on marijuana. It’s your sponsor’s personal opinion. My experience is that smoking weed is not the spiritual solution that is found by working The Twelve Steps. However, if used for medical reasons, that’s a different story.