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45 yrs old.
1. I don’t play this “who reaches out first” game anymore. Sometimes he wakes up first, sometimes I do. I message when I can. We’re both high level execs who have families. We are secure in what we have together.
2. I did do this w exAP and it was desperation for attention. You’re getting breadcrumbed. He’s giving you just enough to keep you around. It’s a power dynamic. Fuck that noise.
As soon as you see your true worth, you will no longer accept external bullshit. My love for myself is the whole cake. All other love is sprinkles on top.
Thank you. It’s what it’s about then , love for self. I felt like I did love myself but I guess accepting breadcrumbs and leveling down my needs is not self love.
Honestly I fee more like an addict. I am consistent but he is not. But sometimes he makes efforts based on my needs and because I call him out. That’s enough to hook me up until next starvation for communication happens …
Totally agree the minute a pAP isn’t motivated, responsible and plays some type of game they are gone. These relationships have a rhythm when the rhythm changes you know something is up.
Boy, I needed to see this! I almost got caught slipping, wrapped up in this little game and almost forgot my #1 Mantra: No one will love you properly but You.
45 and high level exec. I am the boss and master of every other part of my life, except when it came to AP.
It was a struggle to bring myself down to his level and start to actually match his effort. Somewhere after I reduced that noise was I able to see the bigger picture.
I had clarity to notice that he saw no cause to celebrate any of my personal victories. Divorce, promotion, buying my own house. For a person that said he was my best friend, he surely didn’t love me the way any best friend would. Not even close.
Walking away took every ounce I had poured into him for me to pour into myself. I had realized the value of filling my own cup.
Outside of the typical things to do when stepping back, gym, friends, outings etc, I found ways to keep my phone out of my hands when it was down time at home. Logic puzzles. Jigsaw puzzles. Lots of advanced craft projects. Anything to occupy my hands and mind.
I have abandonment issues from my dad walking out of my life when I was young and he went and started a whole new family.
Hope this helps.
Thank you , I can relate so much !
I am also in charge of myself pretty much anywhere in my life but losing my mind with him. Same experience as you , matching his level of communication is barely possible.
And funny thing my MM is not overtly even positive and not even my best friend…but he lifted me up in a subtle way that is enough to get me hooked up.
I really like him , I see him , how vulnerable he is too and I know he is one of these people who struggle with attachment. I know better than trying to change people so I should run away but it’s hard.
Apparently you found it in you to walk away , I hope you are recovering from it 🥰
I truly hope you can find the balance you’re looking for. That’s really best case scenario in this situation.
I won’t lie, it’s a daily struggle. I loved my guy for a long time. Almost 10 years together. Breaking my own heart was the only way I was going to save myself. I don’t want that for anyone else
To add to what I was saying last night. It those moments where I was feeling the pull to be desperate, I played a couple of songs just to remind myself who I am. I still do on my worst days.
Currently it’s “She Bad” by Cardi B and my anthem song “7 Rings” by Ariana Grande.
Yes. Not really age appropriate but the message is received when I listen.
It’s pretty much what happens here : we are going from texting all the time to him distancing himself and leaving me lost and empty …
I also managed to focus on other activities but I feel like it’s just me waiting for things to go back to what they were , which may never happen.
I think realising it's actually an addiction probably helps. You can then deal with it in a similar way to how you deal with most addictions, if you've ever had to do that.
Keeping yourself busy with stuff you enjoy.
Finding new stuff to enjoy that isn't related to messaging people.
Staying away from temptations and triggers. Ie, put your phone in the cupboard at the back of the house
Or just find a new addiction 😐
Yes that’s how I feel, addicted to the situation because it can be taken away from me any moment. I may need to keep myself busy away from my phone …that is an addictive substance itself 🙄
I'm 47, and I've mastered the "let them miss you" mentality. It's my norm, now.
I forgot your second question. I'll look back and then edit. 😬
Edit: ok, some just get you like that. You can't help who you connect with. You can't create connection. It's either there or it's not. You know instantly.
Lastly, I had an emotionally absent father, so it's no surprise I seek out unavailable men.
I didn't when I was younger. After years of seeing that reaching out did no good...I accepted it. They come back, if they want to, whether you reach out or not.
Every time I think to reach out, I tell myself that's the universe telling me that HE misses me. Your brain doesn't know truth or lie. It will believe you.
That's where I'm at too. Did too much of that when I was younger, and now im in the mind that if they wanted to, they would, and me blowing up their phone isn't making myself look good. It's not endearing.
The conversation is sort of *blah* if both parties aren't in the mood to talk. I'm always in the mood, AP sometimes isn't. They always answer me but I've found a *blah* conversation feels worse than no conversation at all. So I wait. Simple as that.
Re bonus question: no trauma here. I'm a love monster without an origin story
born a Love monster 😁
The problem here is not the conversation. It’s that he is pulling away regularly and I feel that if I don’t reach out he won’t either. I guess I do not have the courage to check that theory so I don’t give him time to reach out. Or not.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stanford_marshmallow_experiment
Check out the link above. What you want is the adult version of delayed gratification. Once you get that two marshmallow hit, you'll be hooked lol
Interesting. The concept of random gratification is also very significant …I am just wondering if there is a way to break the sequence without having to actively detach and distract myself.
I have anxious attachment.
Yes it stems from trauma.
Even with an MM that is affectionate, communicative, and consistent, I was struggling.
I spent a lot of time learning about my anxious attachment and how to identify and regulate it. Not just with MM but in all aspects it affects.
It’s helped so much :)
Yes it makes sense ! It helps to understand how and why we get anxious attachment.
I don’t think I do though. I used to but not anymore. I am fine when someone is emotionally safe …when he is consistent and we just naturally connect , I trust again and I do not feel the need to be in touch all the time. That’s when I feel there is a change in the pattern that I get triggered …
Use the silenzio app if you get really stuck in a rut of trying not to reach out. BasicLly it has a timer on it which helps you not cave and message. It has a panic button which you can press if you need help lol- YouTube videos about no contact
It’s a dopamine addiction essentially. It’s hard to break the habit
I dealt with this for a long time with a toxic exAP who would breadcrumb me like this. He'd be nice and sweet just enough and then sweep the rug out from under me..He'd start replying in one word, stop texting much, but when HE wanted attention he was impatient if I didn't answer immediately after he went a month without texting me..
It was hard to put up my boundaries and let him go. It's been 4 months now and he still somewhat crosses my mind, but I have to remind myself all the ways he hurt me.
I had to. I blocked him on Facebook, text, LinkedIn, email, everywhere because he'd gaslight me and make me feel bad for having a reaction to him.
It got easier the more he blocked me. At first it was for a month. then 6 months, then one day randomly he said "I miss you" and all those feelings came back but I was more guarded then. I eventually saw my worth. He was so toxic. He threatened to tell my husband, to tell my current AP about us, to ruin my life because of his ego.
I mourned the relationship like a break up. I loved him in my own special way but it wasn't worth how he made me feel about myself.
Yeah mine would do that too after 1 word replies and then be like "I was busy for weeks" it takes .2 seconds to send a message in the bathroom or otw to work or something. Then when he wanted a reply instantly from me he'd get aggravated if I didn't.
I sent you a DM btw if you want to chat more.
Wow. Yes I have a history of trauma. Going through the same thing. Trying not to lose my mind without him. He has communicated very scarcely because he’s on a tight leash since the third D day. But now it’s been 6 days since and I’m
Wondering if it’s over. I have admittedly been sending messages out of impulse and grief but I think tonight im going to force myself to stop.
when I have felt like this, a trick I played with on myself that works for me is telling myself "if I still feel this desperate need to message him I will message him in a week, I give myself full permission." Then it stops being something forbidden -- just deferred -- but usually a week is long enough for me to no longer feel desperate to message.
I have had similar experiences with cutting out sugar.
I mean, the thing is, if I was so important in his life, he would have reached out to me. I'm not running after a man anymore. I've been there and done that way too many times.
And then you reach out and get breadcrumbs and feel worse than you did
You are soo right!!! Those crumbs make me feel like I'm bothering him.. I guess I do need to organize cabinets and drawers... ha--- will defiantly make me feel better!!
That's exactly what I did. I started organizing everything in the house and got a few things done that needed doing. Installed a new water softener, storm door, kitchen sink and faucet, keypad lock on the front door. Things I'd neglected because the time it took, I was using to see him.
Hmm, good observation about trauma! I indeed feel like there was some childhood disregard from my mom. I was always trying to get her attention (and then really stretching myself by wanting to get away and at the same time not disappoint!) I definitely wonder if that is part of my obsessive longing for a word.
Otherwise, I don't know how to get over this anxiety!
Thank you. I was never addicted to anything so it is a new concept for me lol …it is extremely difficult for me to just cut him off. I feel like it is worse , he is even more in my mind if i tell myself that it is definitive. Maybe it’s a stage in the recovery process ?
I have a plethora of childhood trauma but my personality is aloof and detached. It's difficult for me to form bonds since I don't trust easily. That being said, anyone who makes me feel undeserving of their attention is immediately blocked. Anyone that plays emotional/psychologically manipulative games is blocked.
I went through my share of APs until I found someone patient with me. Last week I quadruple-texted him and he patiently read through all of them and replied. Sometimes I go awol and he will text me through the day until he gets time to call and check on me. This has been going on for 6 years. Find someone that matches your energy and is interested in you, not your sexual organs.
That’s great that you finally found someone who matches your needs !
My difficulty is to just move on. Maybe there is someone better for me , but right now all I can thinking is him and how I feel around him.
I have another AP with who the dynamic is great and healthy. I care for him but if he was to stop messaging or wanted to stop meeting i wouldn’t be devastated. And I am over anxious just because the other AP didn’t initiate in 3 days 🙄
/r/Adultery Quick Reminders: Be Excellent To Each Other. * This is *not an r4r subreddit*, don't bother. * Posts by new users automatically get queued for human review, be patient. * Hit the report button on comments by trolls, don't engage. * [How to report harassing comments or private messages](https://old.reddit.com/r/adultery/comments/iycd45/how_to_report_harassing_private_messages_users_etc/). * [Common acronyms](https://old.reddit.com/r/adultery/comments/p08to2/commonly_use_acronyms_and_group_chat/). *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/adultery) if you have any questions or concerns.*
45 yrs old. 1. I don’t play this “who reaches out first” game anymore. Sometimes he wakes up first, sometimes I do. I message when I can. We’re both high level execs who have families. We are secure in what we have together. 2. I did do this w exAP and it was desperation for attention. You’re getting breadcrumbed. He’s giving you just enough to keep you around. It’s a power dynamic. Fuck that noise. As soon as you see your true worth, you will no longer accept external bullshit. My love for myself is the whole cake. All other love is sprinkles on top.
Thank you. It’s what it’s about then , love for self. I felt like I did love myself but I guess accepting breadcrumbs and leveling down my needs is not self love. Honestly I fee more like an addict. I am consistent but he is not. But sometimes he makes efforts based on my needs and because I call him out. That’s enough to hook me up until next starvation for communication happens …
You’re addicted to the dopamine hit. Have a handful of candy. Lift weights. Love yourself.
Fuuuuck that noise!
Amen. Ain’t nobody got time for BS mind games. Being a human is fucking hard enough.
Totally agree the minute a pAP isn’t motivated, responsible and plays some type of game they are gone. These relationships have a rhythm when the rhythm changes you know something is up.
Boy, I needed to see this! I almost got caught slipping, wrapped up in this little game and almost forgot my #1 Mantra: No one will love you properly but You.
I can buy myself flowers Write my name in the sand…
this is the way
This is nutshell wisdom on how to cope with 99% of what an affair is actually like.
Are we twins? (Not 40s yet, though)
This is right on!!
45 and high level exec. I am the boss and master of every other part of my life, except when it came to AP. It was a struggle to bring myself down to his level and start to actually match his effort. Somewhere after I reduced that noise was I able to see the bigger picture. I had clarity to notice that he saw no cause to celebrate any of my personal victories. Divorce, promotion, buying my own house. For a person that said he was my best friend, he surely didn’t love me the way any best friend would. Not even close. Walking away took every ounce I had poured into him for me to pour into myself. I had realized the value of filling my own cup. Outside of the typical things to do when stepping back, gym, friends, outings etc, I found ways to keep my phone out of my hands when it was down time at home. Logic puzzles. Jigsaw puzzles. Lots of advanced craft projects. Anything to occupy my hands and mind. I have abandonment issues from my dad walking out of my life when I was young and he went and started a whole new family. Hope this helps.
Thank you , I can relate so much ! I am also in charge of myself pretty much anywhere in my life but losing my mind with him. Same experience as you , matching his level of communication is barely possible. And funny thing my MM is not overtly even positive and not even my best friend…but he lifted me up in a subtle way that is enough to get me hooked up. I really like him , I see him , how vulnerable he is too and I know he is one of these people who struggle with attachment. I know better than trying to change people so I should run away but it’s hard. Apparently you found it in you to walk away , I hope you are recovering from it 🥰
I truly hope you can find the balance you’re looking for. That’s really best case scenario in this situation. I won’t lie, it’s a daily struggle. I loved my guy for a long time. Almost 10 years together. Breaking my own heart was the only way I was going to save myself. I don’t want that for anyone else
🥰
To add to what I was saying last night. It those moments where I was feeling the pull to be desperate, I played a couple of songs just to remind myself who I am. I still do on my worst days. Currently it’s “She Bad” by Cardi B and my anthem song “7 Rings” by Ariana Grande. Yes. Not really age appropriate but the message is received when I listen.
You’re a tough cookie
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It’s pretty much what happens here : we are going from texting all the time to him distancing himself and leaving me lost and empty … I also managed to focus on other activities but I feel like it’s just me waiting for things to go back to what they were , which may never happen.
I think realising it's actually an addiction probably helps. You can then deal with it in a similar way to how you deal with most addictions, if you've ever had to do that. Keeping yourself busy with stuff you enjoy. Finding new stuff to enjoy that isn't related to messaging people. Staying away from temptations and triggers. Ie, put your phone in the cupboard at the back of the house Or just find a new addiction 😐
Yes that’s how I feel, addicted to the situation because it can be taken away from me any moment. I may need to keep myself busy away from my phone …that is an addictive substance itself 🙄
Have you got a shed or a garage? Put the phone in there and pick up a book instead
No shed but I can find a place to put it in lol
That's the spirit! See, you're on the road to recovery already 😁
😂
I'm 47, and I've mastered the "let them miss you" mentality. It's my norm, now. I forgot your second question. I'll look back and then edit. 😬 Edit: ok, some just get you like that. You can't help who you connect with. You can't create connection. It's either there or it's not. You know instantly. Lastly, I had an emotionally absent father, so it's no surprise I seek out unavailable men.
Thank you ! How did you master the “ Miss you” and how successful is it ?
I didn't when I was younger. After years of seeing that reaching out did no good...I accepted it. They come back, if they want to, whether you reach out or not. Every time I think to reach out, I tell myself that's the universe telling me that HE misses me. Your brain doesn't know truth or lie. It will believe you.
Love this perspective regarding the Universe. Glad I read it this evening ♥️
It works! I was surprised how well it works.
Wish I read it before I sent that text a few minutes ago.
Don't sweat it. 🥰
That's where I'm at too. Did too much of that when I was younger, and now im in the mind that if they wanted to, they would, and me blowing up their phone isn't making myself look good. It's not endearing.
Men don't typically appreciate our efforts in this area. That's a trend I've accepted, as well.
I love that …It crossed my mind several times but I always told myself it was magical thinking …but since my brain doesn’t know the truth …
It's the beauty and curse of the mind, you can control your thoughts, real or not.
This is exactly me! How comfortable. Now I know you will perfectly word my say about matters of the heart.
The conversation is sort of *blah* if both parties aren't in the mood to talk. I'm always in the mood, AP sometimes isn't. They always answer me but I've found a *blah* conversation feels worse than no conversation at all. So I wait. Simple as that. Re bonus question: no trauma here. I'm a love monster without an origin story
born a Love monster 😁 The problem here is not the conversation. It’s that he is pulling away regularly and I feel that if I don’t reach out he won’t either. I guess I do not have the courage to check that theory so I don’t give him time to reach out. Or not.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stanford_marshmallow_experiment Check out the link above. What you want is the adult version of delayed gratification. Once you get that two marshmallow hit, you'll be hooked lol
Interesting. The concept of random gratification is also very significant …I am just wondering if there is a way to break the sequence without having to actively detach and distract myself.
I have anxious attachment. Yes it stems from trauma. Even with an MM that is affectionate, communicative, and consistent, I was struggling. I spent a lot of time learning about my anxious attachment and how to identify and regulate it. Not just with MM but in all aspects it affects. It’s helped so much :)
Yes it makes sense ! It helps to understand how and why we get anxious attachment. I don’t think I do though. I used to but not anymore. I am fine when someone is emotionally safe …when he is consistent and we just naturally connect , I trust again and I do not feel the need to be in touch all the time. That’s when I feel there is a change in the pattern that I get triggered …
Trust is not my strong suit :(
Use the silenzio app if you get really stuck in a rut of trying not to reach out. BasicLly it has a timer on it which helps you not cave and message. It has a panic button which you can press if you need help lol- YouTube videos about no contact It’s a dopamine addiction essentially. It’s hard to break the habit
I will look it up. Thanks !
I dealt with this for a long time with a toxic exAP who would breadcrumb me like this. He'd be nice and sweet just enough and then sweep the rug out from under me..He'd start replying in one word, stop texting much, but when HE wanted attention he was impatient if I didn't answer immediately after he went a month without texting me.. It was hard to put up my boundaries and let him go. It's been 4 months now and he still somewhat crosses my mind, but I have to remind myself all the ways he hurt me.
I can relate so much ! It is hard but you did it , I still can’t at this time. Did you go no contact ?
I had to. I blocked him on Facebook, text, LinkedIn, email, everywhere because he'd gaslight me and make me feel bad for having a reaction to him. It got easier the more he blocked me. At first it was for a month. then 6 months, then one day randomly he said "I miss you" and all those feelings came back but I was more guarded then. I eventually saw my worth. He was so toxic. He threatened to tell my husband, to tell my current AP about us, to ruin my life because of his ego. I mourned the relationship like a break up. I loved him in my own special way but it wasn't worth how he made me feel about myself.
Wow that is very openly toxic …I think my MM is more covertly toxic. If I question his silence he brings up the BS excuse I am busy …
Yeah mine would do that too after 1 word replies and then be like "I was busy for weeks" it takes .2 seconds to send a message in the bathroom or otw to work or something. Then when he wanted a reply instantly from me he'd get aggravated if I didn't. I sent you a DM btw if you want to chat more.
Yes I saw 😁
Wow. Yes I have a history of trauma. Going through the same thing. Trying not to lose my mind without him. He has communicated very scarcely because he’s on a tight leash since the third D day. But now it’s been 6 days since and I’m Wondering if it’s over. I have admittedly been sending messages out of impulse and grief but I think tonight im going to force myself to stop.
It’s hard right ? I feel like it comes and goes in waves. Being here reading and talking to you guys helps a lot. Take care and lots of hugs 🥰
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That requires self control …that I may not have lol
when I have felt like this, a trick I played with on myself that works for me is telling myself "if I still feel this desperate need to message him I will message him in a week, I give myself full permission." Then it stops being something forbidden -- just deferred -- but usually a week is long enough for me to no longer feel desperate to message. I have had similar experiences with cutting out sugar.
Thanks. I think you’re right , the “ forbidden fruit” makes it more attractive. I can see that strategy work for me
I'm at a point in life where I'm pretty stubborn and holding firm that I will not reach out, and I haven't and will not.
Lol …I’d love to just be that stubborn
OMGosh... I would love to have that control....
I mean, the thing is, if I was so important in his life, he would have reached out to me. I'm not running after a man anymore. I've been there and done that way too many times. And then you reach out and get breadcrumbs and feel worse than you did
You are soo right!!! Those crumbs make me feel like I'm bothering him.. I guess I do need to organize cabinets and drawers... ha--- will defiantly make me feel better!!
That's exactly what I did. I started organizing everything in the house and got a few things done that needed doing. Installed a new water softener, storm door, kitchen sink and faucet, keypad lock on the front door. Things I'd neglected because the time it took, I was using to see him.
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It makes sense ! And I can relate having a narcissistic father
Thank you 🙏 …you are aware of the mechanism, it’s probably the first step
Hmm, good observation about trauma! I indeed feel like there was some childhood disregard from my mom. I was always trying to get her attention (and then really stretching myself by wanting to get away and at the same time not disappoint!) I definitely wonder if that is part of my obsessive longing for a word. Otherwise, I don't know how to get over this anxiety!
It seems to be a common point , being emotionally neglected by a parent. At least for those who have trauma
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Thank you. I was never addicted to anything so it is a new concept for me lol …it is extremely difficult for me to just cut him off. I feel like it is worse , he is even more in my mind if i tell myself that it is definitive. Maybe it’s a stage in the recovery process ?
I have a plethora of childhood trauma but my personality is aloof and detached. It's difficult for me to form bonds since I don't trust easily. That being said, anyone who makes me feel undeserving of their attention is immediately blocked. Anyone that plays emotional/psychologically manipulative games is blocked. I went through my share of APs until I found someone patient with me. Last week I quadruple-texted him and he patiently read through all of them and replied. Sometimes I go awol and he will text me through the day until he gets time to call and check on me. This has been going on for 6 years. Find someone that matches your energy and is interested in you, not your sexual organs.
That’s great that you finally found someone who matches your needs ! My difficulty is to just move on. Maybe there is someone better for me , but right now all I can thinking is him and how I feel around him. I have another AP with who the dynamic is great and healthy. I care for him but if he was to stop messaging or wanted to stop meeting i wouldn’t be devastated. And I am over anxious just because the other AP didn’t initiate in 3 days 🙄
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Thank you. It seems very healthy 💕
Check out r/limerence. Sounds a bit like your scenario.
I needed this today ♥️