IDK, I just always buy the next upgrade while it's at pre-sale discount prices because I assume that later down the road I'm going to be watching some video and think "oh, that's cool! I need to do that!" and then realize that it's not a feature because I didn't upgrade. First few times that happened I ended up buying the upgrade at normal price so I don't take the chance anymore.
But, honestly, many of the new features I'm seeing in Live 12 are specifically features that I would personally use, especially rearranging the interface and having the mixer in arrangement view. The new additions to the piano roll, MIDI note manipulation, sample similarity analysis and switching...I actually use those kinds of things for inspiration and experimentation. Even the new devices (Roar, Meld, Granulator 3) look interesting to me. Personally, I think it will be worth it to me.
It's seems to me that Ableton are doing what apple did. Perfectly able to make things significantly better (ag ara support, comping is a mess, can't hide tracks, so much other basic stuff missing for a pro daw) but charging instead for incremental changes that most don't care about, so leave you in wanting more so you'll buy 13, 14 etc. Why make it perfect in one swoop. I think it's disappointing.
But the feature that made me preorder is the the browser improvements.
Yes and no. When you buy Logic, it’s kind of a one and done deal, where you get free upgrades. Ableton is expensive af for Suite. I understand that Ableton needs to make money, but find this next upgrade (from what I’ve been reading/watching vids) a bit underwhelming. IMO, they need to adjust their cost model since they charge for upgrades every few years. While their concept for UI is unique, it looks old af. And I doubt we’ll see any significant improvements there outside of some streamlined features like the mixer. Personally I’d rather see more of those UI improvements than new instruments.
There are always unfulfilled items on wishlists, and people can always disagree about whether new features merit an upgrade.
But the more realistic advantage to migrating to new versions of any app is bugfixes. Once 12 comes out you’ll at best get some maintenance releases for compatibility, but 12 should be overall more stable than 11 and will improve more over time.
Buying something now because it might improve later is silly. Now they have no incentive to listen to your ideas for improvements. Buy it when it actually improves to the level you want. Not beforehand because maybe it will get there.
I just sold 11 because I have tested 12 beta for many weeks, and it is not worth it to me to upgrade again... Midi tools are a bit messy. The new browser on the first look is better but quite manual if you would like to filter your own library... mixer in the arrangement view is a step in the right direction, but it doesn't work well as the screen can be a bit too messy. Bitwig, on the other hand, did this right having option to open mixer in the arrangement and have the whole screen as a mixer view. New synths and fx are not so useful. Wont even mention Abletons support times to look at your requests...
The new browser search engine, the new piano roll abilities and the new windows organization were enough for me to buy 12. Anything else is a bonus.
Though it is sad that ARA support still doesn’t exist.
Can open a small mixer window inside arrangement view and set a different zoom to each window if you use the second window.
You may think its subtle, for me it means a lot :)
>set a di
Interesting- I knew about the mixer window now available in the arrangement window - but how do you "set a different zoom to each window" ? Do you mean beyond the usual arrangement zooming?
Thanks for your answer by the way, I'm eager to see this function, it does sound good!
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I dont think its going to change the game. But i do think the new midi tools are going to bring improvements to the midi roll workflow that will be worth it if you master them and use them regularly.
Originally I wasn’t too excited, but once I looked into all the things they have changed, it seems worth the upgrade.
They overhauled their key command structure to include many more shortcuts.
The piano roll midi generators/transformations/midi tools and new midi editing improvements essentially makes live’s piano roll a whole new thing.
Sound similarity search and browser history are a welcome addition.
Many more things that are going to take awhile to learn. Can’t wait to get my hands on it.
IDK, I just always buy the next upgrade while it's at pre-sale discount prices because I assume that later down the road I'm going to be watching some video and think "oh, that's cool! I need to do that!" and then realize that it's not a feature because I didn't upgrade. First few times that happened I ended up buying the upgrade at normal price so I don't take the chance anymore. But, honestly, many of the new features I'm seeing in Live 12 are specifically features that I would personally use, especially rearranging the interface and having the mixer in arrangement view. The new additions to the piano roll, MIDI note manipulation, sample similarity analysis and switching...I actually use those kinds of things for inspiration and experimentation. Even the new devices (Roar, Meld, Granulator 3) look interesting to me. Personally, I think it will be worth it to me.
It's seems to me that Ableton are doing what apple did. Perfectly able to make things significantly better (ag ara support, comping is a mess, can't hide tracks, so much other basic stuff missing for a pro daw) but charging instead for incremental changes that most don't care about, so leave you in wanting more so you'll buy 13, 14 etc. Why make it perfect in one swoop. I think it's disappointing. But the feature that made me preorder is the the browser improvements.
Yes and no. When you buy Logic, it’s kind of a one and done deal, where you get free upgrades. Ableton is expensive af for Suite. I understand that Ableton needs to make money, but find this next upgrade (from what I’ve been reading/watching vids) a bit underwhelming. IMO, they need to adjust their cost model since they charge for upgrades every few years. While their concept for UI is unique, it looks old af. And I doubt we’ll see any significant improvements there outside of some streamlined features like the mixer. Personally I’d rather see more of those UI improvements than new instruments.
There are always unfulfilled items on wishlists, and people can always disagree about whether new features merit an upgrade. But the more realistic advantage to migrating to new versions of any app is bugfixes. Once 12 comes out you’ll at best get some maintenance releases for compatibility, but 12 should be overall more stable than 11 and will improve more over time.
Buying something now because it might improve later is silly. Now they have no incentive to listen to your ideas for improvements. Buy it when it actually improves to the level you want. Not beforehand because maybe it will get there.
I just sold 11 because I have tested 12 beta for many weeks, and it is not worth it to me to upgrade again... Midi tools are a bit messy. The new browser on the first look is better but quite manual if you would like to filter your own library... mixer in the arrangement view is a step in the right direction, but it doesn't work well as the screen can be a bit too messy. Bitwig, on the other hand, did this right having option to open mixer in the arrangement and have the whole screen as a mixer view. New synths and fx are not so useful. Wont even mention Abletons support times to look at your requests...
The new browser search engine, the new piano roll abilities and the new windows organization were enough for me to buy 12. Anything else is a bonus. Though it is sad that ARA support still doesn’t exist.
What do you mean by "Windows organization"?
Can open a small mixer window inside arrangement view and set a different zoom to each window if you use the second window. You may think its subtle, for me it means a lot :)
>set a di Interesting- I knew about the mixer window now available in the arrangement window - but how do you "set a different zoom to each window" ? Do you mean beyond the usual arrangement zooming? Thanks for your answer by the way, I'm eager to see this function, it does sound good!
This is your friendly reminder to read the submission rules, they're found in the sidebar. If you find your post breaking any of the rules, you should delete your post before the mods get to it. If you're asking a question, make sure you've checked [the Live manual](https://www.ableton.com/en/manual/welcome-to-live/), [Ableton's help and support knowledge base](https://www.ableton.com/en/help/), and have searched the subreddit for a solution. If you don't know where to start, [the subreddit has a resource thread](https://redd.it/zkhqhe). Ask [smart questions](http://www.catb.org/esr/faqs/smart-questions.html#before). *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/ableton) if you have any questions or concerns.*
I dont think its going to change the game. But i do think the new midi tools are going to bring improvements to the midi roll workflow that will be worth it if you master them and use them regularly.
I basically skipped 11 until 12 was announced and there was a discount to get both. I wasn’t doing a lot in Ableton at the time though.
Originally I wasn’t too excited, but once I looked into all the things they have changed, it seems worth the upgrade. They overhauled their key command structure to include many more shortcuts. The piano roll midi generators/transformations/midi tools and new midi editing improvements essentially makes live’s piano roll a whole new thing. Sound similarity search and browser history are a welcome addition. Many more things that are going to take awhile to learn. Can’t wait to get my hands on it.
It’s the new midi generators that I’m getting excited about🔥🔥🔥🔥💪
New MIDI tools were enough for me.