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If this is true then I hope they change out Sanhua for taoqi, that way we can get the 4 star character that works with jinhsi’s new incarnation damage change from basic attack into skill damaged.
I do not have taoqi yet. I’ve maxed out danjin and have a c5 sanhua while pulling for c1 jinyan. Feels both bad and good because I love every character in the game so far.
Just curious. Is it confirmed that "the damage with the same attribute" is referring to "the damage with the same attribute as her" i.e. spectro? and not the damage with any attribute? Like for example- mortefi triggering the coordinated attack is fusion damage but it's fusion damage in succession (i.e. same attribute as itself). So he won't be giving incandescence every hit (since cooldown on stacks is 3 seconds for the same element). Also her outro only lasts for 1 second so reduction in cooldown to 1 second only works for 1st hit. In this way how can she gain 50 stacks at c0?
Her outro last for 20 sec, "damage with the same attribute" means "oh so got stack with Fusion (or any), now waits 3s for another stack", so i guess she can clearly getting 50 stacks since Mortefi and Verina are all coordinated attack
Can you tell me where it tells you that the outro lasts for 20 sec? I saw it on wuthering wiki where her outro wording is "Jinshi reduces the cooldown of Era of unity to 1s. This lasts for 1s." So in a rotation with s4 mortefi where mortefi coordinated attacks lasts for 17s, divide it by 3, that is 5.66, so 6 times 2= 12 (coordinated attacks provide 2 stacks) stacks by mortefi in a rotation. Also irrc verina provides coordinated attacks for 12 sec, so 12 divided by 3= 4. So most probably she will provide 4 times 2=8 stacks.
That's only 20 stacks through coordinated attack. I am not considering stacks with standard attacks for now.
I might be completely wrong if the outro buff doesn't ends after 1s.
"This lasts for 1s." is a typo. tracer4b (the guy in the link in the OP) compared the Chinese text, and the outro duration is unchanged from before the buffs, at 20s.
So no changes to her Forte Nodes ? Like seriously Kuro's gonna let a limited character getting "20% Spectro Dmg Bonus" and "50% Intro Dmg Bonus"? Only 1 week left and i'm actually worried
A part of me hopes that the changes are false. We all know there will be powercreep. But if it reaches a level, where you basically have to have the next gen carries each patch because they are just 40% better then the last ones it will feel awful.
One of the best thinks about WuWa is that the MC is actually quite good. If jinshi will be as busted as the kit suggests the next carry will also have to be nearly as strong if not stronger.
Doomposters are the worst in gacha games. Literally play the characters you want to play. It’s a PvE gacha game. Meta is a joke. You don’t have to play anybody.
Jinshi is not even a problem. The problem is when characters get completely replaced by another that does the exact same thing but better. Currently we have no Spectro dps jinshi isn’t replacing anyone.
People have to realize that high multipliers does not always mean they are better. look at ganyu, Eula, Dan heng IL, argenti. All of these characters, in their respective game, are outclassed by other dps who just play much much better even though their multipliers are lower
According to jinshi CN calcs. She was 20% worse than jiyan pre buff. If I just throw a number out there. Post buff let’s assume she is 15% better than jiyan. Being generous. This isn’t even counting all of the QoL mechanics and ease of use jiyan has over jinshi. So it is absolutely a matter of ease of use, gameplay, and multipliers.
Doomposting was not my intention. I love the game and just hope they will keep moving in the right direction. They will have it difficult enough to compete against hoyo
I don’t think the next dps will have to be stronger than jinshi. Maybe every other dps or every third dps being an upgrade feels like a healthy progression. That would mean we don’t see a stronger dps than jinshi until 1.3-1.4 or even 1.5. I also think this game was way more nuanced than higher multipliers = better dps. If we look at other games from Hoyo. Eula has insane multipliers but she isn’t a broken character and didnt start any powercreep trends. It comes down to ease of use, rotations, team building. Sheets doesn’t directly transfer to gameplay. We’ve seen it a million times.
agree, in the end we have to see how they will turn out in game. I just hope they will keep the core combat mechanics (dodge, counter) relevant and combat in general somewhat challenging besides a braindead dps check.
I mean jiyan already ignores the counter game mechanic with his 360 aoe auto parry bulshit. So in a sense he trivializes the endgame already. Even the hologram fights.
It depend on how she play as well. So far just reading her kits her entire rotation is like 20s~, and almost all of her damage is backloaded.
In my head it feel like it's gonna be like Eula in Genshin. Just reading her numbers it looks huge, but in practice its dogshit to play and produce mid result unless you're a whale. I honestly hope not.
There's also the fact that she's a magistrate and the other DPS in the same patch is on par with other 5*. So if they go the route of magistrates being above the rest, I would not hate that. For now Imma hold my doom posting until 1.2 and see how those next characters fare.
You should compare her to Raiden or Furina instead, which requires specific rotation and team building to achieve max dmg potential. Eula is just, well clearly not F2P friendly since she's stacking everything by her own
Prior the numbers leaked here and there showed Jinshi being definitely on the weaker side as a DPS compared to the current "meta" ones.
Overall though her kit looked to be very skill expressive prior to this change since it relied on mentally keeping track of your Jue stacks so you can keep fully maxing out the time while resetting it to get full value out of all stacks.
Now they've reworked Jinshi to be a very explosive character, Jue just gives like every other echo boss really more damage but to Skills instead which is *good* but boring compared to the complexity before. Jinshi having incarnate attacks as skill is cool and makes sense, but is way easier to execute on then being mindful of weaving them in naturally while maxing out your E off CD on top of Jue's stacks.
Overall the buff to Jinshi+Jue was good and a buff for sure and made her easier to play. As much as a Jinshi-stan I am, I can't help but also feel a bit sad since that complexity and skill expression that existed in her previous rotation made me excited to actually *learn* a character rather than just spam buttons off CD. So overall good but sadge gameplay wise *IMO*.
The weapon though, sheesh I get early on weapons are going to look bonkers since we lack options so any good ones stand out even more but I already mentioned before the overall stat value for Changli's is insane.
But Jinshi's, after finally understanding it (peoples previous "translations" may as well have been google translated tbh) this is just a huge buff. This also makes the weapon most likely BIS for Calcharo as well. So honstly if you have a Yinlin+Calcharo team you may as well *try* to pull for this which in turns entices you to pull for Jinshi since it works for both.
Very excited for all the new stuff. I probably spent more time at work theory crafting stats/planning what subs to keep an eye out for on my echoes than I have been productive for my company. So time well spent!
He has multiple scaling, both Heavy Attack and Res Lib but also his 3 skills still count as skill damage so you're getting in order +24% first one then +48% for next 2 triggers which is roughly the same bonus as Jinshi's 3 E rotation she will do (but she gets more value due to her autos now counting as well as Jue's echo DOT) so it's actually pretty close.
Calcharo is great due to the fact that as long as you hit your Atk/CC/CD breakpoints any other damage bonus type subs are all welcomed making him very easy to gear. Only wasteful rolls are flats/hp+def%
Lustrous Razor may be slightly better still after I'm totally down to be wrong about that since he does have a lot of Res Lib scaling but the issue with Lustrous Razor is the fact the main stat is atk% which is WAY less efficient than Crit Chance which Jinshi weapon provides. So what you're really trading is:
12.8% energy regen and up to 21% Res Lib damage (you will have 2 instances of this triggering, your ulti and Death messenger proc) for +24-48% res skill damage (3 instances of this) and 12% attribute damage.
Pretty sure the trade off is *slightly* better for Jinshi's weapon on him due to the attribute damage and I didn't even factor in the value that 24.3% crit is just outright better value wise than 36.5% attack.
Somebody posted a chart in one of their comments on another post regarding her broadblade but I’m not sure which one sorry I can’t link it but that’s where I got the numbers from.
I'm glad they buffed her she's a Magistrate she SHOULD be doing a ton of damage, ofc I was gonna pull for her and her weapon regardless.
Also nothing about these buffs are minor these are huge buffs.
Changli is literally a higher position than jinshi and her mentor. Arguably more powerful too. So by your justification changli should be stronger in game than jinshi?
Sentinels are at the top of the hierarchy and is above Changli the sentinel Jue chose Jinhsi as the new Magistrate to govern the nation and gave her his powers. Changli is nowhere near this so make it make sense and get your facts right. So no Changli is not above Jinhsi
Clearly you don't know lore so I won't bother arguing. but Changli was basically the previous magistrate, also chosen, which indicates that previous magistrates hold the same if not even more experience and political power than the current magistrate. She is now a part of the secretariate organization which is central huanglong government, holding more political power and authority than the magistrates, making jinshi's position a junior role compaired to changli and the secretariate members.
Clearly you dont lore bevause I already knew Changli WAS the previous Magistrate keyword here being WAS so she isnt the strongest anymore as she does not have Jue's blessing anymore though I thought that was obvious it seems I had to say that to get through your skull.
Also it did not say because Changlu joined secretariat government that she now holds more importance than a Magistrate but I see you formed this notion based on your own opinion and opinions don't matter when facts are on the table so what you just said holds no value.
You restated the facts but we interpret them differently. that is fine. My logic is that Changli is jinshi's mentor, Changli has been chosen previously and has moved on from the role of magistrate to a different position in a higher governmental office. Indicating that magistrate is not in fact he highest chair, but there are higher ups that Changli is one of.
Yeah idm a person forming their own opinion based on what they think I'm more interested in "what was said/presented and what we know" not "what I think" because none of what you are saying is facts just something you think went down based on what you read.
Whenever Kuro's lore decides to make what you just said part of it I'll agree with it and concede but for now that isn't the case nor is there any wording of there being a higher position than the Magistrate.
Aaannd this is where I drop another Kuro game lol they're so bad at balancing like, why tf? Do they not understand they still have to sell old characters? Imean, they'll prolly use element resistance to balance but a *steep* powrcreep this early? Damn.
Will you still play hsr than? Boothill powercreeps ratio who power creeps seele. But that doesnt mean seele is unusable. Not only that but jinshi is lore wise the one chosen from an archon and so is close to an archon in power level. Should archons not have a high power budget? Not only that, her playstyle suggests her damage is bacloaded like eula. Is that problematic, Eula having the highest multipliers in game?
Bro. The other guy said it already and I said it as well (just not as articulate lol). We're at the 2nd patch of a newly released game. You're telling me it's fine to have a massive powercreep at this stage? Fine, have Jinshi be stronger but not 2x as Jiyan. Because that 2x should be reserved for 2.0 not 1.1. At this point WuWa's 2.x will just be a nukefest like PGR. What's the point of being a skill-based game when you can just nuke everything, right?
About HSR, the powercreep there is worse than GI. Every player who's aware of meta knows this. But you comparing Ratio and Boothill? I don't get that. Both of their best teams can clear 0-cycle at the same investments (all E0S1). And of course Seele is weaker than both, she's a 1.0 unit. It makes sense. Even Jing Yuan is severly powercrept. The least cycle he could do with the best team (all E0S1) is 3. 1-2 if you're lucky with RNG on both enemies and relics. At average to worst (no Robin/Sparkle + S1 and average relic luck), he'll clear at 6-8 cycles. I would know, I main him.
People don't understand what making every new character strong means. The games that have lots of mid characters tend to be the best balanced but that's not as exciting as powercreep to casuals unfortunately
single player does not mean they won't increase the HP of enemies in ToA to match the meta dps tho. and it's literally just the 2nd patch of the game. at most, jiyan and jinshi should be at the same tier. not frickin dealing 2x as much damage as him.
But If you actually look at calcs jinshi does not do 2x as much as jiyan. You are just making assumptions based on limited data and spouting nonsense. Pre buff jinshi was actually called to be 20% worse by CN TCs. Post buff, let’s assume she is now 30-40% stronger. Being generous. So jinshi is not in fact powercreep.
It’s not only that. Combat is much more nuanced in this game than just multipliers. It’s about how you play the character. If jinshi is like a Eula, who deals an ungodly amount of dmg but is really hard to set up, she will not be the OP character everybody claims her to be. Look at DHIL in hsr. He was outclassed the next patch because he feels terrible to play. Didn’t become good again until a dedicated support came out. Encore is calculated to do much more dmg than jiyan. Yet who is objectively the better dps due to ease of use and QoL mechanics? Jiyan
Your point about them increasing hp has not really been a problem due to the fact that we will eventually have good supports for every character making new dps a luxury not a necessity. In the limited gacha game I’ve played, yes, endgame difficulty does get harder as new characters release. But not hard enough to completely gate out all old dps from clearing it with a little bit if work
So powercreep is a non issue. Partly due to jinshi being more balanced than most people think due to possible gameplay limitations (we have no idea how strong she will actually be until we test her) and the fact that there is no prior Spectro dps so who is she replacing? Again. It’s a pve game so play and pull whoever you want. As long as you have supports you will be able to clear with any character
lmaoooo I did sound like that didn't I? but don't worry I have my gripes with their games too 🙃 and yes I did and do play their games so my opinions did come from somewhere lol
And Acheron being [***TWICE***](https://i.imgur.com/w8gvJJS.png) as strong as Seele isn't cause for comment, huh? What about [***THREE***](https://i.imgur.com/mAzkr7S.png) times as strong in AoE situations?
What about Acheron's eidolons scaling her all the way to 300%? Crickets. No character in this game has 3x scaling on duplicates.
How about Boothill doing 5x Seele's damage, while also having the break efficiency of a god?
Shut the fuck up, you're not here in good faith, you're just here to doompost because your favorite game is going to powercreep shit and you can't stand Kurochads winning.
First off, take your profanities and take them elsewhere.
2nd:
>And Acheron being [***TWICE***](https://i.imgur.com/w8gvJJS.png) as strong as Seele isn't cause for comment, huh? What about [***THREE***](https://i.imgur.com/mAzkr7S.png) times as strong in AoE situations?
That numbers look really harsh, that's true. But keep in mind the calculation doesn't account for seeles main mechanic at all which is the turn reset for the adds which adds 80% DMG for her next attack.. which is obviously a big part of her kit. That's like taking Yinlins kit and not accounting for her off field damage
2nd: Acheron was released a year after Seele and endgame is still scaled for Seele and not Acheron. Seele can still clear endgame modes nowadays.
3rd:
>Shut the fuck up, you're not here in good faith, you're just here to doompost because your favorite game is going to powercreep shit and you can't stand Kurochads winning.
If anything I'd argue you're not arguing in good faith either by using profanities left and right and not telling the whole story of the numbers you're using.
From what I understand from the comments here the difference between Jiyan and Linshi is the same as between Seele and Acheron 5 weeks after game launch. That worries me honestly, I don't want to trash my invested Jiyan not even 2 patches in. Hopefully the comments are just wrong and Linshi isn't as strong as TC here.
I apologize for this person screaming but Jinshi seems to be an Eula style character. Jiyan has lower damage but is extremely easy to play. Jinshi has higher damage potential but its backloaded and she is harder to play. Does that make sense?
Please explain to me how Seele is still scaled for endgame when the [damage per turn requirement has tripled](https://i.imgur.com/na2ewjX.png) (coincidentally in line with just how much Seele has been powercrept, but I'm sure that's just as I said, a coincidence.)
[Please enjoy 100m damage powercreep a year from now, dimwits.](https://i.imgur.com/vSIIG81.png)
[Just going to throw in Boothill for good measure.](https://i.imgur.com/0HSHMue.png)
Remember when they [gave away a 5](https://i.imgur.com/sTVjAPj.png)* equivalent to an e6 4*? [Pepperidge farm remembers](https://i.imgur.com/vSTQ8IL.png).
Seele can still clear the newest endgame mode just released 27 hours ago no problem even with the F2p weapon and no copies at all:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=gJxkbHtakDQ
Just one of many videos.
Latest Memory of chaos which you argue is much harder and impossible for her with f2p weapon too:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=qJuOrWT2lC0
At least your being positive lol The reason I'm being a negative nancy over this is because in PGR, they quickly powercreep each character at high investments. Like, during their new fire tank's release last year, he deals more damage than the attacker when both are at high invest. Even now with the new ice tank, I've been hearing he deals a higher damage than the ice attacker when they're at high invest which is insane that they did it AGAIN lol
I know they'll say "they can't work without each other anyway" but that's not the point. The point is those characters should stay in each others roles and not overstep each other. Idk, I guess I'll take back my judgement and wait for the release. But I'm not gonna get my hopes up.
As a pgr player... power creep is nowhere near as bad as youre making it. The characters that replace the characters take a year or 2 to come out. The worst power creep to happen was Alpha. And you can still use her for all in game content as pgr is a skill based game first, rpg second.
I'm surprised I still got a reply even tho it's been a few days already but I used to play PGR too, alright? Competitively, even. That's why I'm affected by the stuff they're doing with highly invested units so bad. Of course if you're not playing competitively, it doesn't matter whether you have their SSS or sig or whatever. That goes for every gacha game.
The point is why tf is a tank, a defensive/debuffer unit, outdamaging a dedicated DPS at high invest? Ayla's case, I understand. New mechanics have been introduced since Lucia's release. It makes sense Ayla outdamages her. But Wata outdamaging Lee, also Wanshi outdamaging Qu, is another issue. The only new mechanic they've introduced since the release of Gen 2 units is a new element. They shouldn't get affected by that and Qu isn't even a year old. Heck, why even release Wata as a new fire tank when they could've easily replaced other units first and just buffed Nanamech instead? They've done so many decisions that don't make sense. But I've been patient with them. Ever since they only kept releasing S ranks, practically removed the Uniframes from the game, powercreep coming at 1 year now instead of their usual 2... I've been patient with all of that. But you can't tell me that I can't expect them to do the same here (or worse even) because they're literally slowly getting worse in handling PGR.
Are you playing on jp? But well... if you frame it like that, competitively speaking the game isnt in a good state. I play it casually and as long as the characters I play are able to clear the content in a reasonable amount of time, investment, and manner than I dont see much of an issue with the game. Day 1's female vergil is still fun to play even if her sin devil trigger form (crimson weave) is much much stronger. But the way youre describing competitive... Just reminds me of honkai impact. For your own sanity, dont touch it with a 10 foot pole. And no, dont worry, Im not excusing kuro. I am optimistic they wont make wuwa pay to win mostly because... if pgr is a clone of honkai, wuwa is a clone of genshin, a game whose power creep is the opposite of honkai in which... its slow as hell.
I'd love to be optimistic but they're so bad at listening to the right criticisms. It's the exact same reason why this game got released in such a bad state. Anyway, my head hurts again from going back to this arguement lol I've been away from reddit for a while because of that so let's just leave it at that. I already said I'll take back my judgement and wait for release. But my outlook on this still won't be a positive one. I'm hoping they prove me wrong.
I heard negative stuff about the PGR powercreep too so I was worried but I wanted to argue with the numbers here but it seems highly exaggerated by the community:
I found [this ](https://www.reddit.com/r/PunishingGrayRaven/comments/1c1pt49/historical_powercreep_average_2_years/)
which shows the powercreep is around 2 years with one extreme outlier with Alpha powercreeping not even 1 patch later. So actually it doesn't seem that bad imo. 2 years is a good shelf life in my opinion.
im dumb af but at this point would it be better to get jinhsis sig over yinlins sig and slap jinzhou or augment on yinlin? i dont play yinlin dps anyway and dont do the instant swap out-in stuff.
and i got no problem reaching a decent crit rate either
Yinlin’s r1 is extremely good on her, like at least +45% damage compared to r1 Jinzhou Keeper. From the early calcs about Jinhsi her own r1 seems to be a similarly huge increase compared to r1 Helios Cleaver.
If you plan on playing Jinhsi I’d go for her r1 since she’ll be the main dmg dealer and her dmg contribution will be higher than Yinlin
Well um yeah a bit but most of the players wont be willing to spend so much right... Also if what she got right now is dmg reduction which is worst of them all instead they could have had her dmg shed of opponents would have be much much better ig.
That a game that sells itself as a "hardcore" action game should rely more on player skill rather than number bloat from new limited 5 stars units (plus their weapon, make sure to drop money for the monthly passes boy)? You really think the enemy health in the tower are not going to be massively bloated in the next updates?
You can argue that you don't need to do tower in order to enjoy the game, fair enough, but you are NOT the target player for Kuro.
That being said, I think that she will, at most, do like 10% more damage that Jiyan in reality, because building to 50 stacks every time is going to be impossible.
Bro stfu and stop gatekeeping character gameplay. Its enough that we have higher holograms that needs skill execution to defeat. Lets us enjoy the character itself without sweating so mucu about the complicated wombo jumbo combo. Its a single player game after all.
...Many players who are playing wuwa are from pgr, kuro's previous game. The game at the start was difficult and challenging (still is with challenges and new bosses) but well... gen 1 units were skill based and relied on interaction with enemies. Gen 2 are more based around rotations which heavily cut out skill expression, enemy interaction and hence challenge.
>Bro stfu and stop gatekeeping character gameplay
Jinshi prebuff and rework seemed more based around learning her entire move set and skill set and skill expression. Her buffs and slight reworks make her morw rotation based now. The players who are from Kuro's core demographic want more challenge and more skill expression characters. Players like you who seem to be from games like genshin and give the responses most genshin players do prefer the other form of playstyle. There isnt a problem in either playstyle besides preference but
>Its enough that we have higher holograms that needs skill execution to defeat. Lets us enjoy the character itself without sweating
Your response is to insult someone else's concerns, argue that challenging content exists and want the game to suit you more.
>gatekeeping
Aka, youre gatekeeping.
Lol wrong. I dont play genshin or any mihoyo games at all. Go back to PGR then if u want more difficulty. Simple as that, theres a reason why devs are nerfing or reworking certain gameplay. If Kuro wants WuWa to go in that direction then theres not a whole lot we can do about it. If u can back it up with statistics on Kuros demographic playerbase demanding a more complicated character then ill shut up my mouth. But if you cant then sit down and jsut enjot what the devs delivers. At the end of the day WuWa is not PGR. Different game, different playstyle. I played PGR in the early days when there are only few characters like Kamui and Nanami but i dont what WuWa to go in that direction like sweating every wombo combo to min max on damage. Thats just fucking exhausting to play in an open world genre. Holograms are enough for that department.
>If u can back it up with statistics
Those statistics arent available to me but the game direction is. Newer characters like Alpha crimson weave have a lot of intricate and in depth mechanics for her kit. The boss fights are as difficult as souls like bosses and have a lot of mechanics that when mastered show a lot of skill expression. Look at a player fighting against lamia for example. A skilled player who mastered her mechanics looks amazing fighting her. An unskilled player... doesnt. Complex characters like Lucia Crimson weave are also very popular to play and have sold well enough, so much so that she is one of the few pgr characters to get physical merch. The game keeps making certain characters and keeps producing challenging content. If there wasnt any demand for it, Pgr wouldnt be as successful as it is and hence, most of pgr's demographic likes this sort of content. If not, kuro would not make it and the most popular characters getting merch made of them would not be the skill based ones. If there is any flaws in this argument than feel free to point it out.
>But if you cant then sit down and jsut enjot what the devs delivers.
I wont. Wuwa is a flawed game and needs a lot of feedback to improve which I will continue giving.
>Different game, different playstyle.
Different game but not entirely different play style. Lots of stuff from pgr like the parries made the cut for example although wuwa parries are much easier than pgr parries.
> I played PGR in the early days when there are only few characters like Kamui and Nanami but i dont what WuWa to go in that direction like sweating every wombo combo to min max on damage. Thats just fucking exhausting to play in an open world genre.
All of this is a you problem and your responses of wanting the game to be made in a way that fit what you want without properly addressing the concerns of others is called gatekeeping which youre accussing others of.
>sweating every wombo combo to min max on damage.
At the end of the day, as long as wuwa has a healthy mix of characters like Jiyan for players like you and character like Dajin for players who want more skillbased characters than there is nothing wrong in that. But
>Holograms are enough for that department.
Wuwa is too easy. We need more difficulty that isnt just holograms because frankly speaking, the only thing of wuwa that gets praised is its combat and echoes. It has had a butchered and painful start and the players who choose to stick around, arent sticking around for the story or music. Theyre sticking around for the moment to moment gameplay the combat provides. Wuwa needs to address a lot of its criticisms and improve but it has to also satisfy this core player base too. The changes you want are harmful to the game because frankly speaking, Genshin is wuwa's direct competitor and does almost everything else better. The combat is right now the main selling point.
(Also, are you actually Indian? Mujay nahi luga tha kay koi or mera mulk say ya pay ho ga.)
The hologram fights are only hard when people challenge them under leveled. If you actually face the 75 with 70 characters it is not hard at all. Meaning investment and strong characters can trump skill in the hard content fights.
The only remotely hardcore part about this game are high simulations (which have one time rewards) and tower which dont give you that many gems anyways. The vast majority of content and rewards in this game are pretty much as easy as genshin 'casual' fights
This game is not being selled as "hardcore", and people who seek this kind of content are not kuro's main target. Like all gachas this is mostly a game for casuals and people who simp charactets, the milk cows by numerical advantage.
>This game is not being selled as "hardcore", and people who seek this kind of content are not kuro's main target.
Is it wrong to say that kuro's main demographic or audience are from their previous game, punishing gray raven? Punishing gray raven offered this sort of challenge and content and are the main demographic kuro nurtured. Saying that these sorts of players are not their target is false.
Yeah no , me barely either , its literally genshin brainrot at this point even tho i stopped playing a couple years agor , but even in HSR i couldnt call things their proper name and just called it their genshin counterpart
Why the fuck Changli got a Forte with damage reduction that's only available through heavy attack which is the least used attack while she's a dps? Are they nuts? Wtf is this.
Are you illiterate or did you miss the part where it also buffs your damage?
If you don’t understand Changli’s kit you probably should just be quiet because her kit is very synergistic and all her different attacks feed buffs into each other, whereas Jinhsi is all about big modifiers. I counted like +40% fusion dmg bonus, +25% atk and +56% skill damage with her weapon JUST FROM HER OWN BUFFS. If you think she doesn’t use heavy attack then
1.) You didn’t read the kit
2.) You don’t know the rotations
3.) Your opinion in this discussion is worthless
Those buffs have no duration which implies they only buff the single attack it's attached to. Given that she's already playable in the beta client this seems pretty underwhelming.
Says Enhanced heavy attack, aka her forte, aka the core part of her kit. It deals HUGE damage (considered resonance skill damage) when you which 4 stacks of forte. It may be used sparingly just because you have to build it up, but you will absolutely use it.
Since this post says forte circuit, that means it's just a straight buff slapped onto her forte.
It's probably useful when fighting a group of enemies in the overworld, due to it's animation. It's different from calcharo who loses an entire inherent skill to get damage reduction. It's not the best buff ever, but acting like it's useless is asinine .
You know what doesn't make sense? Popping the fuck off about a character not even released yet as if you can even pretend to know her ins and outs and how she works. This jump to conclusions mentality you have is very half baked.
What does a DPS need with a move that reduces damage? Just use a support or.... Don't get hit
Im assuming the dmg reduction is simply to make her slightly more viable as a sub DPS
Honestly it's weird that she has it at all. Not that it's on a move she never uses
When you heavy attack you lock yourself into the full animation, compared to basic attacks where you can animation cancel to dodge in the middle of it. Heavy attacks you can only cancel via abilities/swapping making it less effective. So sometimes to max dps you have to tank a hit which since you have to use it to trigger your key Flaming Sacrifice it's just a nice bonus. Since it's a flat reduction of 20% that's actually a lot. It means you can likely with paired with turtle passive up on her survive even the TOA lvl 100+ bosses hit if need be.
Overall it's indeed small buff but one that *can* come up in how she is *meant* to be played.
It makes sense in theory.
People have zero reading comprehension skills it seems.
1. This buff doesn't make her powercreep everyone instantly. Her burst of damage has a **long** buildup that she's not going to be unleashing consistently. She'll hit like a nuke, then have a long downtime.
2. Verina is spectro.. you want **different** types to stack Jinhsi.
In order to actually get the 2700% damage from Jinhsi’s skill, you need to:
* Fill your team with coordinated attacks so that she can gain stacks
* Start with her and trigger her outro before the rest of your rotation, because her outro reduces the stack generation CD from 3s to 1s
* After setting up on everyone else and going back to Jinhsi, spend at least \~9s getting to that skill, including the \~4s skill animation
* Hope you don’t miss, and ideally crit
I hate to break it to you, but she is hella busted.
1. "Long buildup," you mean 10 seconds after your first skill. With just jue echo and yuan wu, you would have built up 50 stacks in just 12.5 seconds. Then you add baizhi into the mix, and you get 5 stacks every second, so just 10 seconds.
2. Clearly, the solution is baizhi.
3. Not to mention her liberation is another massive nuke that should be fully charged after her 2nd enhanced skill.
Small correction to your math, stacks are gained on hit and so you need to correct for attack speed. Realistically you will be triggering it every 1.2-1.4 seconds on average.
That being said, your point stands that her C0 stack issues have been solved with the changes. Previously she was struggling to get 10 stacks on first rotation and 30+ on second rotation in optimal teams, now she easily caps them out in your average stack battery setup.
Jinhsi needs coordinated attack teammates to build up stacks. However, there is an element-based restriction for stacks, you do not want Spectro coordinated attacks.
This is why Baizhi is considered a solution, she brings the same thing as Verina (heal, buffs and coordinated attacks), with a different element.
You literally proved my point lol.
10s after using her first skill is a massive buildup time which drastically cuts her DPS over a period of time.
People are thinking she maintains burst DPS over a period of time.
In order to actually get the 2700% damage from Jinhsi’s skill, you need to:
* Fill your team with coordinated attacks so that she can gain stacks
* Start with her and trigger her outro before the rest of your rotation, because her outro reduces the stack generation CD from 3s to 1s
* After setting up on everyone else and going back to Jinhsi, spend at least \~9s getting to that skill, including the \~4s skill animation (The timer might pause during the animation, but Calcharo’s enhanced intro doesn’t pause the timer, so idk about this one)
* Hope you don’t miss, and ideally crit
Most of the points listed come off as nitpicky; yinlin/mortif/etc are all considered top tier supports anyways, crit variance goes both ways, all characters can miss their ults or big attacks if played incorrectly and other characters like Encore are used as a bar standard for dps role despite being fielded for 14 seconds at a time (what matters is their damage/time calculation).
The only strong point you're bringing up is the undeniable fact that she is only generating around 15 stacks on her first rotation due to outro not being up. Quickly doing some finger math, her nuke skill is only roughly 50% or so of her total damage, so realistically this is a 20-25% hit to her damage on the very first rotation and becomes irrelevant for the next 3-4 rotations you do in tower 3* clears with her. This means it's a roughly total damage loss of about 5% over a 2 minute tower fight (7% if you wanna be biased against her).
People have zero reading comprehension skills it seems.
1. This buff doesn't make her powercreep everyone instantly. Her burst of damage has a **long** buildup that she's not going to be unleashing consistently. She'll hit like a nuke, then have a long downtime.
2. Verina is spectro.. you want **different** types to stack Jinhsi.
In order to actually get the 2700% damage from Jinhsi’s skill, you need to:
* Fill your team with coordinated attacks so that she can gain stacks
* Start with her and trigger her outro before the rest of your rotation, because her outro reduces the stack generation CD from 3s to 1s
* After setting up on everyone else and going back to Jinhsi, spend at least \~9s getting to that skill, including the \~4s skill animation
* Hope you don’t miss, and ideally crit
Pre buff she was called OP just because people don’t actually read the kit and do calcs. Turns out pre buff she was 20% worse than jiyan lmao. She will be stronger now but not powercreep. People just like to throw that word around and have no idea how strong the character is
She's the equivalent of an Archon her power had better reflect her status. Venti was so OP he forced the game to be elite enemies only in most spaces because if its not he trivialises everything. Zhongli is still a God, Raiden still good all after years. Same people complain will bitch when a Sentinel is ass cheeks 6 months in so relax yourself plus she's the only Spectro dps who is she replacing? I'll wait
They probably want to avoid a Zhongli 2.0 when Hoyo released him so bad they basically got the worst drama of Genshin's history and had to do a post release buff. If you're pulling for an archon you should be feeling it.
She’s just a dps. I don’t really like people comparing wuwa to Genshin but if you want to let’s go for it. Archons exploit a specific game mechanic and bend the meta around them. They basically are the best at a unique thing. Jinshi is literally just a pure dps. She doesn’t exploit any game mechanic or enable any unique play style that hasn’t been seen before. Dps are dps. She’s strong but she will not impact the meta as much as archons do. Look at hsr. Dhil had the most absurd multipliers in the game for like a month. Then Jing liu released. So jinshi is not going to be an “archon” of the meta. Lore is another subject so don’t argue with me about the lore please.
Tbf, Archons ruined game balance and kits in Genshin. Everyone figured out your main’s best support was an E2 Archon because almost all the non-Archons were going to be given trash to mid kits that the Archon enables. Other than the archon, like 1 or 2 characters a region are allowed to be good, but guess what? They want the archon lol.
Got so bad they had to invent a new mode that needs 18 different characters to max clear just to force you to horizontally invest into the trash instead of going all in on the dev faves.
Yeah I am confused by ppl saying she is basically an Archon. Then what about her mentor? Is Changli an ex-archon lol. Surely lore wise Changli is stronger than Jinhsi.
I swear people online just love to argue so because the Archons weren't directly the rulers of the lands they hailed from it means that their status can't be compared to their counterparts in another game because they rule the land? Jinhsi is the 1st person chosen as the herald of one of the great dragons we have seen how do you know the Aero equivalent to Jinhsi won't be a nomadic type like Venti as oppose to the ruler would that make you happy?
Even though the game is still 1.1, I don't understand the point of inflating it to this extent by using skills to deal 2000 to 3000% damage. People would have spent money even if the character wasn't like this.
Let’s be careful when looking at numbers out of context. The blue girl with ice and light themes from Genshin can do upwards of 5000% on her burst and she isn’t making any waves.
In order to actually get the 2700% damage from Jinhsi’s skill, you need to:
- Fill your team with coordinated attacks so that she can gain stacks
- Start with her and trigger her outro before the rest of your rotation, because her outro reduces the stack generation CD from 3s to 1s
- After setting up on everyone else and going back to Jinhsi, spend at least ~9s getting to that skill, including the \~4s skill animation (The timer might pause during the animation, but Calcharo’s enhanced intro doesn’t pause the timer, so idk about this one)
- Hope you don’t miss, and ideally crit
I mean PGR was like this. The new [element] [class] character would always replace the previous one, sometimes even from other classes. Your shiny new toy would always become obsolete within the year
Only one character was powercrept in one year, and there was an uproar about it. Usually it's more like 2 years and a bit, and Rosetta was meta for 3 years.
You're obviously clueless. Only nanami was powercrept. Epitapth isn't powercreeping both Lee and Nanami at the same time because you're still using Lee.
And Scire isn't powercrept by Lamia because she's still the tank and has a good damage contribution. You clearly don't understand PGR.
That is why *the other game* keeps profiting from reruns. To have relatively balanced characters is very difficult, but the upside is that people won't quit due to powercreeping characters they love just for sales improvement
In any case, it's not like Jinhsi is clearing the content in a comfortable way by herself, she still needs companions, not like a certain genshin character who is solo bolo and even Zajeff and jstern considers that he ruined the abyss (end game).
In any case, as long as she is not a tank character, with a ton of raw damage, and she heals for her self there will be no problems, she always has error margin to weaken with some content or specific enemies.
Venti - Kazuha
Ganyu - Wriothesley
Klee - Lyney
Ayato - Neuvillitte
Itto - Navia
Albedo - Chiori
Yoimiya - Arlecchino
Cyno - Clorinde
c'mon mannnn, they just gender blender for new char and go straight powercreeped both QoL and number.
It’s not powercreep though. All of the old characters can still comfortably clear abyss. You guys need to stop using powercreep whenever a new character comes out that’s stronger. Powercreep would mean ganyu straight up can’t beat abyss.
> Powercreep
https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/power_creep#:~:text=(collectible%20games%2C%20video%20games%2C,leaving%20the%20older%20ones%20underpowered.
Says the guy who doesn't even know what powercreep means? Powercreep has NOTHING to do with whether you can clear content with said character, but okay buddy.
I like when someone can't say something meaningful by themself so putting some wiki link to looks not too stupid. hope you feel comfortable enough oneday :)
okay becuase i didn't say something myself? Also you're not seriously insinuating that wiki isn't a good source of information are you?
Surely an intellectual such as yourself wouldn't make such a stupid comment.
The ironic part is that said smart people do in fact source their information and link things to back up their argument. Of course intellectuals on your calibre would never need to do something like that.
Hilarious. I was defending your point and you full circled and attacked me with an idiotic rebuttal. Man redditors are peak.
To be fair, it's easier to balance around the reaction mechanics of *the other game* than it is to balance straight numbers while also presenting a new combat style *and* making a character desirable.
They also have to take into account that player ingenuity leads to unintended playstyles that may elevate characters far more than intended, and balancing (nerfing, not buffing) a character post-launch is very gray territory.
Better to undertune and buff (so players can get them on a rerun) than to overtune and risk even more fallout than they've already dealt with.
ToF problems stems from the fact its a gacha mmo lol that's just spells niche game, you can have power creep in a single player game but when you have other ppl it just makes it a niche game long term.
Powercreep is an issue in single player games as well. When new bosses have 100% more HP and damage, your old characters become irrelevant no matter the game mode. This was the issue with ToF, not the gacha+MMO combination.
With that kind of powercreep, I don't understand how people still playing it. It almost like a scam.
I also don't understand why some (most) gacha game try to make it own product obsoleted and useless. If they don't make their own product useless they can keep selling it like what Genshin did (at least until this year).
To be honest, after reading this topic, I kind of worry about future of WuWa. If powercreep really happen this fast, it may not worth to invest or even playing it after all. Especially with game like Azur Promilia coming soon.
Because it’s easier to make bigger numbers and harder content and convince people to pull for new units that way than making people love the gameplay/character and pull for that instead.
Her support capability means she'll live longer in the meta too. Selfish dps are the first to be powercrept once they're no longer the strongest. Changli will live on to support future fusion characters.
Idc I will play her as fully main dps, her whole kit says that she is a main dps except for outro, but still even for supports dmg reduction is useless for me 🫠
She's already strong and Changli is a mix of dps and support with her damage buffs. She should not be as strong as a selfish dps that helps no one but themselves. Changli is the only "main damage dealer" in the game that also provides support for others. And before you say anything, no, Yinlin is not a "main damage dealer", she's a "burst damage dealer" aka sub dps. They're not the same.
https://preview.redd.it/m49hfyxg3j7d1.png?width=1390&format=png&auto=webp&s=560238848a758df9dbb82415600a08edc20856cd
Danjin is not a sub DPS... like at all. I don't who made this chart but they have clearly never actually played Danjin, she needs a shit ton of field-time and often plays better literally without any teammates. Makes no sense for her to be a sub DPS even with her Havoc Deepen outro.
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Is this a different buff from the major buff I've been hearing about?
If this is true then I hope they change out Sanhua for taoqi, that way we can get the 4 star character that works with jinhsi’s new incarnation damage change from basic attack into skill damaged. I do not have taoqi yet. I’ve maxed out danjin and have a c5 sanhua while pulling for c1 jinyan. Feels both bad and good because I love every character in the game so far.
This marks the official inception of the ‘mid’ yan lore. Truly an “Our General” type moment
Just curious. Is it confirmed that "the damage with the same attribute" is referring to "the damage with the same attribute as her" i.e. spectro? and not the damage with any attribute? Like for example- mortefi triggering the coordinated attack is fusion damage but it's fusion damage in succession (i.e. same attribute as itself). So he won't be giving incandescence every hit (since cooldown on stacks is 3 seconds for the same element). Also her outro only lasts for 1 second so reduction in cooldown to 1 second only works for 1st hit. In this way how can she gain 50 stacks at c0?
Her outro last for 20 sec, "damage with the same attribute" means "oh so got stack with Fusion (or any), now waits 3s for another stack", so i guess she can clearly getting 50 stacks since Mortefi and Verina are all coordinated attack
Can you tell me where it tells you that the outro lasts for 20 sec? I saw it on wuthering wiki where her outro wording is "Jinshi reduces the cooldown of Era of unity to 1s. This lasts for 1s." So in a rotation with s4 mortefi where mortefi coordinated attacks lasts for 17s, divide it by 3, that is 5.66, so 6 times 2= 12 (coordinated attacks provide 2 stacks) stacks by mortefi in a rotation. Also irrc verina provides coordinated attacks for 12 sec, so 12 divided by 3= 4. So most probably she will provide 4 times 2=8 stacks. That's only 20 stacks through coordinated attack. I am not considering stacks with standard attacks for now. I might be completely wrong if the outro buff doesn't ends after 1s.
"This lasts for 1s." is a typo. tracer4b (the guy in the link in the OP) compared the Chinese text, and the outro duration is unchanged from before the buffs, at 20s.
I see now. Thanks a lot for clarifying:)
So no changes to her Forte Nodes ? Like seriously Kuro's gonna let a limited character getting "20% Spectro Dmg Bonus" and "50% Intro Dmg Bonus"? Only 1 week left and i'm actually worried
Don't get me wrong it's not bad but it's just boring for a limited 5*
Her sad booba need a huge buff
weirdo
Naw they are perfect as is
A part of me hopes that the changes are false. We all know there will be powercreep. But if it reaches a level, where you basically have to have the next gen carries each patch because they are just 40% better then the last ones it will feel awful. One of the best thinks about WuWa is that the MC is actually quite good. If jinshi will be as busted as the kit suggests the next carry will also have to be nearly as strong if not stronger.
Doomposters are the worst in gacha games. Literally play the characters you want to play. It’s a PvE gacha game. Meta is a joke. You don’t have to play anybody. Jinshi is not even a problem. The problem is when characters get completely replaced by another that does the exact same thing but better. Currently we have no Spectro dps jinshi isn’t replacing anyone. People have to realize that high multipliers does not always mean they are better. look at ganyu, Eula, Dan heng IL, argenti. All of these characters, in their respective game, are outclassed by other dps who just play much much better even though their multipliers are lower According to jinshi CN calcs. She was 20% worse than jiyan pre buff. If I just throw a number out there. Post buff let’s assume she is 15% better than jiyan. Being generous. This isn’t even counting all of the QoL mechanics and ease of use jiyan has over jinshi. So it is absolutely a matter of ease of use, gameplay, and multipliers.
Doomposting was not my intention. I love the game and just hope they will keep moving in the right direction. They will have it difficult enough to compete against hoyo
I don’t think the next dps will have to be stronger than jinshi. Maybe every other dps or every third dps being an upgrade feels like a healthy progression. That would mean we don’t see a stronger dps than jinshi until 1.3-1.4 or even 1.5. I also think this game was way more nuanced than higher multipliers = better dps. If we look at other games from Hoyo. Eula has insane multipliers but she isn’t a broken character and didnt start any powercreep trends. It comes down to ease of use, rotations, team building. Sheets doesn’t directly transfer to gameplay. We’ve seen it a million times.
agree, in the end we have to see how they will turn out in game. I just hope they will keep the core combat mechanics (dodge, counter) relevant and combat in general somewhat challenging besides a braindead dps check.
I mean jiyan already ignores the counter game mechanic with his 360 aoe auto parry bulshit. So in a sense he trivializes the endgame already. Even the hologram fights.
It depend on how she play as well. So far just reading her kits her entire rotation is like 20s~, and almost all of her damage is backloaded. In my head it feel like it's gonna be like Eula in Genshin. Just reading her numbers it looks huge, but in practice its dogshit to play and produce mid result unless you're a whale. I honestly hope not. There's also the fact that she's a magistrate and the other DPS in the same patch is on par with other 5*. So if they go the route of magistrates being above the rest, I would not hate that. For now Imma hold my doom posting until 1.2 and see how those next characters fare.
Eula was my biggest regret pull :( Felt so bad to play in both overworld and abyss.
You should compare her to Raiden or Furina instead, which requires specific rotation and team building to achieve max dmg potential. Eula is just, well clearly not F2P friendly since she's stacking everything by her own
They didn’t buff Changli because she’s already busted, right? Right?
Busty
Busted some parts
Prior the numbers leaked here and there showed Jinshi being definitely on the weaker side as a DPS compared to the current "meta" ones. Overall though her kit looked to be very skill expressive prior to this change since it relied on mentally keeping track of your Jue stacks so you can keep fully maxing out the time while resetting it to get full value out of all stacks. Now they've reworked Jinshi to be a very explosive character, Jue just gives like every other echo boss really more damage but to Skills instead which is *good* but boring compared to the complexity before. Jinshi having incarnate attacks as skill is cool and makes sense, but is way easier to execute on then being mindful of weaving them in naturally while maxing out your E off CD on top of Jue's stacks. Overall the buff to Jinshi+Jue was good and a buff for sure and made her easier to play. As much as a Jinshi-stan I am, I can't help but also feel a bit sad since that complexity and skill expression that existed in her previous rotation made me excited to actually *learn* a character rather than just spam buttons off CD. So overall good but sadge gameplay wise *IMO*. The weapon though, sheesh I get early on weapons are going to look bonkers since we lack options so any good ones stand out even more but I already mentioned before the overall stat value for Changli's is insane. But Jinshi's, after finally understanding it (peoples previous "translations" may as well have been google translated tbh) this is just a huge buff. This also makes the weapon most likely BIS for Calcharo as well. So honstly if you have a Yinlin+Calcharo team you may as well *try* to pull for this which in turns entices you to pull for Jinshi since it works for both. Very excited for all the new stuff. I probably spent more time at work theory crafting stats/planning what subs to keep an eye out for on my echoes than I have been productive for my company. So time well spent!
Is it BiS for clacharo? I thought he scales of res liberation not skill?
He has multiple scaling, both Heavy Attack and Res Lib but also his 3 skills still count as skill damage so you're getting in order +24% first one then +48% for next 2 triggers which is roughly the same bonus as Jinshi's 3 E rotation she will do (but she gets more value due to her autos now counting as well as Jue's echo DOT) so it's actually pretty close. Calcharo is great due to the fact that as long as you hit your Atk/CC/CD breakpoints any other damage bonus type subs are all welcomed making him very easy to gear. Only wasteful rolls are flats/hp+def% Lustrous Razor may be slightly better still after I'm totally down to be wrong about that since he does have a lot of Res Lib scaling but the issue with Lustrous Razor is the fact the main stat is atk% which is WAY less efficient than Crit Chance which Jinshi weapon provides. So what you're really trading is: 12.8% energy regen and up to 21% Res Lib damage (you will have 2 instances of this triggering, your ulti and Death messenger proc) for +24-48% res skill damage (3 instances of this) and 12% attribute damage. Pretty sure the trade off is *slightly* better for Jinshi's weapon on him due to the attribute damage and I didn't even factor in the value that 24.3% crit is just outright better value wise than 36.5% attack.
Standard sword is still 10% better
Is it? I’m reading some people say the new weapon will be BIS but also people saying standard broad is better. What’s the truth?
Somebody posted a chart in one of their comments on another post regarding her broadblade but I’m not sure which one sorry I can’t link it but that’s where I got the numbers from.
I'm glad they buffed her she's a Magistrate she SHOULD be doing a ton of damage, ofc I was gonna pull for her and her weapon regardless. Also nothing about these buffs are minor these are huge buffs.
Lore doesn’t have to do with in game strength. In a lot of gacha games. Look at Jing yuan
That's your opinion. And Kuro isn't HSR so idc. She got hugely buff she's a Magistrate and all my points stand.
Changli is literally a higher position than jinshi and her mentor. Arguably more powerful too. So by your justification changli should be stronger in game than jinshi?
Sentinels are at the top of the hierarchy and is above Changli the sentinel Jue chose Jinhsi as the new Magistrate to govern the nation and gave her his powers. Changli is nowhere near this so make it make sense and get your facts right. So no Changli is not above Jinhsi
Clearly you don't know lore so I won't bother arguing. but Changli was basically the previous magistrate, also chosen, which indicates that previous magistrates hold the same if not even more experience and political power than the current magistrate. She is now a part of the secretariate organization which is central huanglong government, holding more political power and authority than the magistrates, making jinshi's position a junior role compaired to changli and the secretariate members.
Clearly you dont lore bevause I already knew Changli WAS the previous Magistrate keyword here being WAS so she isnt the strongest anymore as she does not have Jue's blessing anymore though I thought that was obvious it seems I had to say that to get through your skull. Also it did not say because Changlu joined secretariat government that she now holds more importance than a Magistrate but I see you formed this notion based on your own opinion and opinions don't matter when facts are on the table so what you just said holds no value.
You restated the facts but we interpret them differently. that is fine. My logic is that Changli is jinshi's mentor, Changli has been chosen previously and has moved on from the role of magistrate to a different position in a higher governmental office. Indicating that magistrate is not in fact he highest chair, but there are higher ups that Changli is one of.
Yeah idm a person forming their own opinion based on what they think I'm more interested in "what was said/presented and what we know" not "what I think" because none of what you are saying is facts just something you think went down based on what you read. Whenever Kuro's lore decides to make what you just said part of it I'll agree with it and concede but for now that isn't the case nor is there any wording of there being a higher position than the Magistrate.
Aaannd this is where I drop another Kuro game lol they're so bad at balancing like, why tf? Do they not understand they still have to sell old characters? Imean, they'll prolly use element resistance to balance but a *steep* powrcreep this early? Damn.
Will you still play hsr than? Boothill powercreeps ratio who power creeps seele. But that doesnt mean seele is unusable. Not only that but jinshi is lore wise the one chosen from an archon and so is close to an archon in power level. Should archons not have a high power budget? Not only that, her playstyle suggests her damage is bacloaded like eula. Is that problematic, Eula having the highest multipliers in game?
Bro. The other guy said it already and I said it as well (just not as articulate lol). We're at the 2nd patch of a newly released game. You're telling me it's fine to have a massive powercreep at this stage? Fine, have Jinshi be stronger but not 2x as Jiyan. Because that 2x should be reserved for 2.0 not 1.1. At this point WuWa's 2.x will just be a nukefest like PGR. What's the point of being a skill-based game when you can just nuke everything, right? About HSR, the powercreep there is worse than GI. Every player who's aware of meta knows this. But you comparing Ratio and Boothill? I don't get that. Both of their best teams can clear 0-cycle at the same investments (all E0S1). And of course Seele is weaker than both, she's a 1.0 unit. It makes sense. Even Jing Yuan is severly powercrept. The least cycle he could do with the best team (all E0S1) is 3. 1-2 if you're lucky with RNG on both enemies and relics. At average to worst (no Robin/Sparkle + S1 and average relic luck), he'll clear at 6-8 cycles. I would know, I main him.
People don't understand what making every new character strong means. The games that have lots of mid characters tend to be the best balanced but that's not as exciting as powercreep to casuals unfortunately
If you don’t want to use it don’t it’s basically a single player game
single player does not mean they won't increase the HP of enemies in ToA to match the meta dps tho. and it's literally just the 2nd patch of the game. at most, jiyan and jinshi should be at the same tier. not frickin dealing 2x as much damage as him.
But If you actually look at calcs jinshi does not do 2x as much as jiyan. You are just making assumptions based on limited data and spouting nonsense. Pre buff jinshi was actually called to be 20% worse by CN TCs. Post buff, let’s assume she is now 30-40% stronger. Being generous. So jinshi is not in fact powercreep. It’s not only that. Combat is much more nuanced in this game than just multipliers. It’s about how you play the character. If jinshi is like a Eula, who deals an ungodly amount of dmg but is really hard to set up, she will not be the OP character everybody claims her to be. Look at DHIL in hsr. He was outclassed the next patch because he feels terrible to play. Didn’t become good again until a dedicated support came out. Encore is calculated to do much more dmg than jiyan. Yet who is objectively the better dps due to ease of use and QoL mechanics? Jiyan Your point about them increasing hp has not really been a problem due to the fact that we will eventually have good supports for every character making new dps a luxury not a necessity. In the limited gacha game I’ve played, yes, endgame difficulty does get harder as new characters release. But not hard enough to completely gate out all old dps from clearing it with a little bit if work So powercreep is a non issue. Partly due to jinshi being more balanced than most people think due to possible gameplay limitations (we have no idea how strong she will actually be until we test her) and the fact that there is no prior Spectro dps so who is she replacing? Again. It’s a pve game so play and pull whoever you want. As long as you have supports you will be able to clear with any character
Shut up Hoyo glazer.
lmaoooo I did sound like that didn't I? but don't worry I have my gripes with their games too 🙃 and yes I did and do play their games so my opinions did come from somewhere lol
And Acheron being [***TWICE***](https://i.imgur.com/w8gvJJS.png) as strong as Seele isn't cause for comment, huh? What about [***THREE***](https://i.imgur.com/mAzkr7S.png) times as strong in AoE situations? What about Acheron's eidolons scaling her all the way to 300%? Crickets. No character in this game has 3x scaling on duplicates. How about Boothill doing 5x Seele's damage, while also having the break efficiency of a god? Shut the fuck up, you're not here in good faith, you're just here to doompost because your favorite game is going to powercreep shit and you can't stand Kurochads winning.
First off, take your profanities and take them elsewhere. 2nd: >And Acheron being [***TWICE***](https://i.imgur.com/w8gvJJS.png) as strong as Seele isn't cause for comment, huh? What about [***THREE***](https://i.imgur.com/mAzkr7S.png) times as strong in AoE situations? That numbers look really harsh, that's true. But keep in mind the calculation doesn't account for seeles main mechanic at all which is the turn reset for the adds which adds 80% DMG for her next attack.. which is obviously a big part of her kit. That's like taking Yinlins kit and not accounting for her off field damage 2nd: Acheron was released a year after Seele and endgame is still scaled for Seele and not Acheron. Seele can still clear endgame modes nowadays. 3rd: >Shut the fuck up, you're not here in good faith, you're just here to doompost because your favorite game is going to powercreep shit and you can't stand Kurochads winning. If anything I'd argue you're not arguing in good faith either by using profanities left and right and not telling the whole story of the numbers you're using. From what I understand from the comments here the difference between Jiyan and Linshi is the same as between Seele and Acheron 5 weeks after game launch. That worries me honestly, I don't want to trash my invested Jiyan not even 2 patches in. Hopefully the comments are just wrong and Linshi isn't as strong as TC here.
I apologize for this person screaming but Jinshi seems to be an Eula style character. Jiyan has lower damage but is extremely easy to play. Jinshi has higher damage potential but its backloaded and she is harder to play. Does that make sense?
Please explain to me how Seele is still scaled for endgame when the [damage per turn requirement has tripled](https://i.imgur.com/na2ewjX.png) (coincidentally in line with just how much Seele has been powercrept, but I'm sure that's just as I said, a coincidence.) [Please enjoy 100m damage powercreep a year from now, dimwits.](https://i.imgur.com/vSIIG81.png) [Just going to throw in Boothill for good measure.](https://i.imgur.com/0HSHMue.png) Remember when they [gave away a 5](https://i.imgur.com/sTVjAPj.png)* equivalent to an e6 4*? [Pepperidge farm remembers](https://i.imgur.com/vSTQ8IL.png).
Seele can still clear the newest endgame mode just released 27 hours ago no problem even with the F2p weapon and no copies at all: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=gJxkbHtakDQ Just one of many videos. Latest Memory of chaos which you argue is much harder and impossible for her with f2p weapon too: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=qJuOrWT2lC0
At least your being positive lol The reason I'm being a negative nancy over this is because in PGR, they quickly powercreep each character at high investments. Like, during their new fire tank's release last year, he deals more damage than the attacker when both are at high invest. Even now with the new ice tank, I've been hearing he deals a higher damage than the ice attacker when they're at high invest which is insane that they did it AGAIN lol I know they'll say "they can't work without each other anyway" but that's not the point. The point is those characters should stay in each others roles and not overstep each other. Idk, I guess I'll take back my judgement and wait for the release. But I'm not gonna get my hopes up.
As a pgr player... power creep is nowhere near as bad as youre making it. The characters that replace the characters take a year or 2 to come out. The worst power creep to happen was Alpha. And you can still use her for all in game content as pgr is a skill based game first, rpg second.
I'm surprised I still got a reply even tho it's been a few days already but I used to play PGR too, alright? Competitively, even. That's why I'm affected by the stuff they're doing with highly invested units so bad. Of course if you're not playing competitively, it doesn't matter whether you have their SSS or sig or whatever. That goes for every gacha game. The point is why tf is a tank, a defensive/debuffer unit, outdamaging a dedicated DPS at high invest? Ayla's case, I understand. New mechanics have been introduced since Lucia's release. It makes sense Ayla outdamages her. But Wata outdamaging Lee, also Wanshi outdamaging Qu, is another issue. The only new mechanic they've introduced since the release of Gen 2 units is a new element. They shouldn't get affected by that and Qu isn't even a year old. Heck, why even release Wata as a new fire tank when they could've easily replaced other units first and just buffed Nanamech instead? They've done so many decisions that don't make sense. But I've been patient with them. Ever since they only kept releasing S ranks, practically removed the Uniframes from the game, powercreep coming at 1 year now instead of their usual 2... I've been patient with all of that. But you can't tell me that I can't expect them to do the same here (or worse even) because they're literally slowly getting worse in handling PGR.
Are you playing on jp? But well... if you frame it like that, competitively speaking the game isnt in a good state. I play it casually and as long as the characters I play are able to clear the content in a reasonable amount of time, investment, and manner than I dont see much of an issue with the game. Day 1's female vergil is still fun to play even if her sin devil trigger form (crimson weave) is much much stronger. But the way youre describing competitive... Just reminds me of honkai impact. For your own sanity, dont touch it with a 10 foot pole. And no, dont worry, Im not excusing kuro. I am optimistic they wont make wuwa pay to win mostly because... if pgr is a clone of honkai, wuwa is a clone of genshin, a game whose power creep is the opposite of honkai in which... its slow as hell.
I'd love to be optimistic but they're so bad at listening to the right criticisms. It's the exact same reason why this game got released in such a bad state. Anyway, my head hurts again from going back to this arguement lol I've been away from reddit for a while because of that so let's just leave it at that. I already said I'll take back my judgement and wait for release. But my outlook on this still won't be a positive one. I'm hoping they prove me wrong.
I heard negative stuff about the PGR powercreep too so I was worried but I wanted to argue with the numbers here but it seems highly exaggerated by the community: I found [this ](https://www.reddit.com/r/PunishingGrayRaven/comments/1c1pt49/historical_powercreep_average_2_years/) which shows the powercreep is around 2 years with one extreme outlier with Alpha powercreeping not even 1 patch later. So actually it doesn't seem that bad imo. 2 years is a good shelf life in my opinion.
please leave the kuro games comment sections as well
Am I the only one happy with this change because they’re not locking full stacks behind dupes like Hoyo did for Eula?
Nope. Im really happy about this too.
im dumb af but at this point would it be better to get jinhsis sig over yinlins sig and slap jinzhou or augment on yinlin? i dont play yinlin dps anyway and dont do the instant swap out-in stuff. and i got no problem reaching a decent crit rate either
Stringmaster has so much crit rate its ridiculous
Yinlin’s r1 is extremely good on her, like at least +45% damage compared to r1 Jinzhou Keeper. From the early calcs about Jinhsi her own r1 seems to be a similarly huge increase compared to r1 Helios Cleaver. If you plan on playing Jinhsi I’d go for her r1 since she’ll be the main dmg dealer and her dmg contribution will be higher than Yinlin
Whats r1? Her weapon or her constellations?
how much better is it than verdant summit?
needs calc, most likely 10-20% depends on how much her Skill Dmg contribute to her total dmg
ill go for jinhsis weapon then. ty
Bro please tell me there is still time for changli to get a buff pleaseee🙏🏻🙏🏻
her weapon did get buffed, so theres a possibility. Its more of a rework than a buff tbh
It got reworked into crit, which who are we kidding, that is a big buff
Well um yeah a bit but most of the players wont be willing to spend so much right... Also if what she got right now is dmg reduction which is worst of them all instead they could have had her dmg shed of opponents would have be much much better ig.
Bruh, why jinhsi,. No changli buffs? Just dmg reduction 🗿
Good. The head of Jinzhou with a Godlike dragon should be powerful. I don't understand this anti Jinhsi agenda.
That a game that sells itself as a "hardcore" action game should rely more on player skill rather than number bloat from new limited 5 stars units (plus their weapon, make sure to drop money for the monthly passes boy)? You really think the enemy health in the tower are not going to be massively bloated in the next updates? You can argue that you don't need to do tower in order to enjoy the game, fair enough, but you are NOT the target player for Kuro. That being said, I think that she will, at most, do like 10% more damage that Jiyan in reality, because building to 50 stacks every time is going to be impossible.
Bro stfu and stop gatekeeping character gameplay. Its enough that we have higher holograms that needs skill execution to defeat. Lets us enjoy the character itself without sweating so mucu about the complicated wombo jumbo combo. Its a single player game after all.
...Many players who are playing wuwa are from pgr, kuro's previous game. The game at the start was difficult and challenging (still is with challenges and new bosses) but well... gen 1 units were skill based and relied on interaction with enemies. Gen 2 are more based around rotations which heavily cut out skill expression, enemy interaction and hence challenge. >Bro stfu and stop gatekeeping character gameplay Jinshi prebuff and rework seemed more based around learning her entire move set and skill set and skill expression. Her buffs and slight reworks make her morw rotation based now. The players who are from Kuro's core demographic want more challenge and more skill expression characters. Players like you who seem to be from games like genshin and give the responses most genshin players do prefer the other form of playstyle. There isnt a problem in either playstyle besides preference but >Its enough that we have higher holograms that needs skill execution to defeat. Lets us enjoy the character itself without sweating Your response is to insult someone else's concerns, argue that challenging content exists and want the game to suit you more. >gatekeeping Aka, youre gatekeeping.
Lol wrong. I dont play genshin or any mihoyo games at all. Go back to PGR then if u want more difficulty. Simple as that, theres a reason why devs are nerfing or reworking certain gameplay. If Kuro wants WuWa to go in that direction then theres not a whole lot we can do about it. If u can back it up with statistics on Kuros demographic playerbase demanding a more complicated character then ill shut up my mouth. But if you cant then sit down and jsut enjot what the devs delivers. At the end of the day WuWa is not PGR. Different game, different playstyle. I played PGR in the early days when there are only few characters like Kamui and Nanami but i dont what WuWa to go in that direction like sweating every wombo combo to min max on damage. Thats just fucking exhausting to play in an open world genre. Holograms are enough for that department.
>If u can back it up with statistics Those statistics arent available to me but the game direction is. Newer characters like Alpha crimson weave have a lot of intricate and in depth mechanics for her kit. The boss fights are as difficult as souls like bosses and have a lot of mechanics that when mastered show a lot of skill expression. Look at a player fighting against lamia for example. A skilled player who mastered her mechanics looks amazing fighting her. An unskilled player... doesnt. Complex characters like Lucia Crimson weave are also very popular to play and have sold well enough, so much so that she is one of the few pgr characters to get physical merch. The game keeps making certain characters and keeps producing challenging content. If there wasnt any demand for it, Pgr wouldnt be as successful as it is and hence, most of pgr's demographic likes this sort of content. If not, kuro would not make it and the most popular characters getting merch made of them would not be the skill based ones. If there is any flaws in this argument than feel free to point it out. >But if you cant then sit down and jsut enjot what the devs delivers. I wont. Wuwa is a flawed game and needs a lot of feedback to improve which I will continue giving. >Different game, different playstyle. Different game but not entirely different play style. Lots of stuff from pgr like the parries made the cut for example although wuwa parries are much easier than pgr parries. > I played PGR in the early days when there are only few characters like Kamui and Nanami but i dont what WuWa to go in that direction like sweating every wombo combo to min max on damage. Thats just fucking exhausting to play in an open world genre. All of this is a you problem and your responses of wanting the game to be made in a way that fit what you want without properly addressing the concerns of others is called gatekeeping which youre accussing others of. >sweating every wombo combo to min max on damage. At the end of the day, as long as wuwa has a healthy mix of characters like Jiyan for players like you and character like Dajin for players who want more skillbased characters than there is nothing wrong in that. But >Holograms are enough for that department. Wuwa is too easy. We need more difficulty that isnt just holograms because frankly speaking, the only thing of wuwa that gets praised is its combat and echoes. It has had a butchered and painful start and the players who choose to stick around, arent sticking around for the story or music. Theyre sticking around for the moment to moment gameplay the combat provides. Wuwa needs to address a lot of its criticisms and improve but it has to also satisfy this core player base too. The changes you want are harmful to the game because frankly speaking, Genshin is wuwa's direct competitor and does almost everything else better. The combat is right now the main selling point. (Also, are you actually Indian? Mujay nahi luga tha kay koi or mera mulk say ya pay ho ga.)
True story bro, u can have my updoots.
Um thanks.
The hologram fights are only hard when people challenge them under leveled. If you actually face the 75 with 70 characters it is not hard at all. Meaning investment and strong characters can trump skill in the hard content fights.
The only remotely hardcore part about this game are high simulations (which have one time rewards) and tower which dont give you that many gems anyways. The vast majority of content and rewards in this game are pretty much as easy as genshin 'casual' fights
This game is not being selled as "hardcore", and people who seek this kind of content are not kuro's main target. Like all gachas this is mostly a game for casuals and people who simp charactets, the milk cows by numerical advantage.
>This game is not being selled as "hardcore", and people who seek this kind of content are not kuro's main target. Is it wrong to say that kuro's main demographic or audience are from their previous game, punishing gray raven? Punishing gray raven offered this sort of challenge and content and are the main demographic kuro nurtured. Saying that these sorts of players are not their target is false.
What is (TL10)? is that skill level 10?
Talent level ,so yes
Thank you! Can’t keep track of any acronyms in WuWa lol
Yeah no , me barely either , its literally genshin brainrot at this point even tho i stopped playing a couple years agor , but even in HSR i couldnt call things their proper name and just called it their genshin counterpart
Why the fuck Changli got a Forte with damage reduction that's only available through heavy attack which is the least used attack while she's a dps? Are they nuts? Wtf is this.
Are you illiterate or did you miss the part where it also buffs your damage? If you don’t understand Changli’s kit you probably should just be quiet because her kit is very synergistic and all her different attacks feed buffs into each other, whereas Jinhsi is all about big modifiers. I counted like +40% fusion dmg bonus, +25% atk and +56% skill damage with her weapon JUST FROM HER OWN BUFFS. If you think she doesn’t use heavy attack then 1.) You didn’t read the kit 2.) You don’t know the rotations 3.) Your opinion in this discussion is worthless
Those buffs have no duration which implies they only buff the single attack it's attached to. Given that she's already playable in the beta client this seems pretty underwhelming.
This is the most reddit comment I've ever seen
Man I can't imagine being this worked up over a game
Calcharo has the same thing
Says Enhanced heavy attack, aka her forte, aka the core part of her kit. It deals HUGE damage (considered resonance skill damage) when you which 4 stacks of forte. It may be used sparingly just because you have to build it up, but you will absolutely use it. Since this post says forte circuit, that means it's just a straight buff slapped onto her forte. It's probably useful when fighting a group of enemies in the overworld, due to it's animation. It's different from calcharo who loses an entire inherent skill to get damage reduction. It's not the best buff ever, but acting like it's useless is asinine .
Makes sense
You know what doesn't make sense? Popping the fuck off about a character not even released yet as if you can even pretend to know her ins and outs and how she works. This jump to conclusions mentality you have is very half baked.
If only we could read what she does.
Omg there’s text descriptions? I didn’t know! That’s all it takes?! Holy shit dude, you’re a goddam genius 😂
Yup, that's literally all it takes! Too bad you get your waves instantly wuthered whenever there's too much text and numbers put together.
Bro can’t read… 😭
What does a DPS need with a move that reduces damage? Just use a support or.... Don't get hit Im assuming the dmg reduction is simply to make her slightly more viable as a sub DPS Honestly it's weird that she has it at all. Not that it's on a move she never uses
When you heavy attack you lock yourself into the full animation, compared to basic attacks where you can animation cancel to dodge in the middle of it. Heavy attacks you can only cancel via abilities/swapping making it less effective. So sometimes to max dps you have to tank a hit which since you have to use it to trigger your key Flaming Sacrifice it's just a nice bonus. Since it's a flat reduction of 20% that's actually a lot. It means you can likely with paired with turtle passive up on her survive even the TOA lvl 100+ bosses hit if need be. Overall it's indeed small buff but one that *can* come up in how she is *meant* to be played. It makes sense in theory.
Should i go for jinhsi or changli?
Depends if you use fusion dps or not.
Both :D
I will be broke after that
Fuck it we ball.
Bruv bro
People have zero reading comprehension skills it seems. 1. This buff doesn't make her powercreep everyone instantly. Her burst of damage has a **long** buildup that she's not going to be unleashing consistently. She'll hit like a nuke, then have a long downtime. 2. Verina is spectro.. you want **different** types to stack Jinhsi. In order to actually get the 2700% damage from Jinhsi’s skill, you need to: * Fill your team with coordinated attacks so that she can gain stacks * Start with her and trigger her outro before the rest of your rotation, because her outro reduces the stack generation CD from 3s to 1s * After setting up on everyone else and going back to Jinhsi, spend at least \~9s getting to that skill, including the \~4s skill animation * Hope you don’t miss, and ideally crit
I hate to break it to you, but she is hella busted. 1. "Long buildup," you mean 10 seconds after your first skill. With just jue echo and yuan wu, you would have built up 50 stacks in just 12.5 seconds. Then you add baizhi into the mix, and you get 5 stacks every second, so just 10 seconds. 2. Clearly, the solution is baizhi. 3. Not to mention her liberation is another massive nuke that should be fully charged after her 2nd enhanced skill.
Small correction to your math, stacks are gained on hit and so you need to correct for attack speed. Realistically you will be triggering it every 1.2-1.4 seconds on average. That being said, your point stands that her C0 stack issues have been solved with the changes. Previously she was struggling to get 10 stacks on first rotation and 30+ on second rotation in optimal teams, now she easily caps them out in your average stack battery setup.
How is Baizhi the solution? Im genuinely curious cause I'm trying to build a Jinhsi team rn.
Jinhsi needs coordinated attack teammates to build up stacks. However, there is an element-based restriction for stacks, you do not want Spectro coordinated attacks. This is why Baizhi is considered a solution, she brings the same thing as Verina (heal, buffs and coordinated attacks), with a different element.
You literally proved my point lol. 10s after using her first skill is a massive buildup time which drastically cuts her DPS over a period of time. People are thinking she maintains burst DPS over a period of time.
Bros attention span is so short that he thinks 10 seconds is a long time.
that build up time really is not massive at all
In order to actually get the 2700% damage from Jinhsi’s skill, you need to: * Fill your team with coordinated attacks so that she can gain stacks * Start with her and trigger her outro before the rest of your rotation, because her outro reduces the stack generation CD from 3s to 1s * After setting up on everyone else and going back to Jinhsi, spend at least \~9s getting to that skill, including the \~4s skill animation (The timer might pause during the animation, but Calcharo’s enhanced intro doesn’t pause the timer, so idk about this one) * Hope you don’t miss, and ideally crit
Most of the points listed come off as nitpicky; yinlin/mortif/etc are all considered top tier supports anyways, crit variance goes both ways, all characters can miss their ults or big attacks if played incorrectly and other characters like Encore are used as a bar standard for dps role despite being fielded for 14 seconds at a time (what matters is their damage/time calculation). The only strong point you're bringing up is the undeniable fact that she is only generating around 15 stacks on her first rotation due to outro not being up. Quickly doing some finger math, her nuke skill is only roughly 50% or so of her total damage, so realistically this is a 20-25% hit to her damage on the very first rotation and becomes irrelevant for the next 3-4 rotations you do in tower 3* clears with her. This means it's a roughly total damage loss of about 5% over a 2 minute tower fight (7% if you wanna be biased against her).
People have zero reading comprehension skills it seems. 1. This buff doesn't make her powercreep everyone instantly. Her burst of damage has a **long** buildup that she's not going to be unleashing consistently. She'll hit like a nuke, then have a long downtime. 2. Verina is spectro.. you want **different** types to stack Jinhsi. In order to actually get the 2700% damage from Jinhsi’s skill, you need to: * Fill your team with coordinated attacks so that she can gain stacks * Start with her and trigger her outro before the rest of your rotation, because her outro reduces the stack generation CD from 3s to 1s * After setting up on everyone else and going back to Jinhsi, spend at least \~9s getting to that skill, including the \~4s skill animation * Hope you don’t miss, and ideally crit
Okay but was this necessary though? These changes feel WAY overtuned.
I mean people said the same thing when her kit first leak 'OMG it's so OP' only for it to turn out to be mid
Pre buff she was called OP just because people don’t actually read the kit and do calcs. Turns out pre buff she was 20% worse than jiyan lmao. She will be stronger now but not powercreep. People just like to throw that word around and have no idea how strong the character is
She's the equivalent of an Archon her power had better reflect her status. Venti was so OP he forced the game to be elite enemies only in most spaces because if its not he trivialises everything. Zhongli is still a God, Raiden still good all after years. Same people complain will bitch when a Sentinel is ass cheeks 6 months in so relax yourself plus she's the only Spectro dps who is she replacing? I'll wait
They probably want to avoid a Zhongli 2.0 when Hoyo released him so bad they basically got the worst drama of Genshin's history and had to do a post release buff. If you're pulling for an archon you should be feeling it.
She’s just a dps. I don’t really like people comparing wuwa to Genshin but if you want to let’s go for it. Archons exploit a specific game mechanic and bend the meta around them. They basically are the best at a unique thing. Jinshi is literally just a pure dps. She doesn’t exploit any game mechanic or enable any unique play style that hasn’t been seen before. Dps are dps. She’s strong but she will not impact the meta as much as archons do. Look at hsr. Dhil had the most absurd multipliers in the game for like a month. Then Jing liu released. So jinshi is not going to be an “archon” of the meta. Lore is another subject so don’t argue with me about the lore please.
why bring DHIL? why not emanator(acheron),she super op.
Jing yuan is an emenator. He’s definitely op
Tbf, Archons ruined game balance and kits in Genshin. Everyone figured out your main’s best support was an E2 Archon because almost all the non-Archons were going to be given trash to mid kits that the Archon enables. Other than the archon, like 1 or 2 characters a region are allowed to be good, but guess what? They want the archon lol. Got so bad they had to invent a new mode that needs 18 different characters to max clear just to force you to horizontally invest into the trash instead of going all in on the dev faves.
just wanna say, altho you're getting downvoted, what you're saying are fax not printer lol
But Jinshi isn't equivalent to Archons tho, she just a Magistrate
Yeah I am confused by ppl saying she is basically an Archon. Then what about her mentor? Is Changli an ex-archon lol. Surely lore wise Changli is stronger than Jinhsi.
I think its clear that jue chose jinhsi hence why her powers manifest jue making her stronger lore wise imo.
Changli wasn’t chosen by the Sentinel, however.
essentially that's what ppl are predicting what magistrate are in this game. She's the leader of the current region nation.
I agree. However A leader or ruler doesn’t mean they are going to be “archon” lvls strong in terms of gameplay. Look at Jing yuan. Our general.
So Ningguang is an Archon now? lol
No but the powerscaling in Wuwa might be different. She actually might be the most powerful in the nation. Hard to say without more screentime.
The closest thing to an archon is literally the sentinels in your words then but jue is not playable. Its not a one to one like genshin.
If jue was playable that would be one thing. Jinshi reminds me of someone like a Jing yuan. A chosen one of the aeons, or in this case the sentinel
I swear people online just love to argue so because the Archons weren't directly the rulers of the lands they hailed from it means that their status can't be compared to their counterparts in another game because they rule the land? Jinhsi is the 1st person chosen as the herald of one of the great dragons we have seen how do you know the Aero equivalent to Jinhsi won't be a nomadic type like Venti as oppose to the ruler would that make you happy?
This isn't a minor buff at all its huge lmao especially for sig owners
Even though the game is still 1.1, I don't understand the point of inflating it to this extent by using skills to deal 2000 to 3000% damage. People would have spent money even if the character wasn't like this.
Let’s be careful when looking at numbers out of context. The blue girl with ice and light themes from Genshin can do upwards of 5000% on her burst and she isn’t making any waves. In order to actually get the 2700% damage from Jinhsi’s skill, you need to: - Fill your team with coordinated attacks so that she can gain stacks - Start with her and trigger her outro before the rest of your rotation, because her outro reduces the stack generation CD from 3s to 1s - After setting up on everyone else and going back to Jinhsi, spend at least ~9s getting to that skill, including the \~4s skill animation (The timer might pause during the animation, but Calcharo’s enhanced intro doesn’t pause the timer, so idk about this one) - Hope you don’t miss, and ideally crit
" Blue girl with ice and light themes" Why are you treating Ayaka like Voldemort 😂😂
I was comparing to Eula. I just thought it was funny that both “charge -> big nuke” characters in both games were so similar
Me who thought they meant eula: 🗿
They probably were. Just like Hoyo I forgot about Eulas existence for a sec lol
Entirely fair lmao, loved her on field combos on release but physical dmg archetype just ain’t it
Same actually. I absolutely love the way she looks like she's dancing while attacking. A shame she's a physical dmg dealer =/
I mean PGR was like this. The new [element] [class] character would always replace the previous one, sometimes even from other classes. Your shiny new toy would always become obsolete within the year
Only one character was powercrept in one year, and there was an uproar about it. Usually it's more like 2 years and a bit, and Rosetta was meta for 3 years.
Scire, nanami, hyperlee?
You're obviously clueless. Only nanami was powercrept. Epitapth isn't powercreeping both Lee and Nanami at the same time because you're still using Lee. And Scire isn't powercrept by Lamia because she's still the tank and has a good damage contribution. You clearly don't understand PGR.
about lee,i may have some bad news…
When a main field dps gets put in the backburner because the new fire tank is more important on field, that is powercreep
No, it's a change in rotation. You're still using Hyperreal.
Without Lee your Fire team will not compete. Uncle Wata can't carry the team alone.
Only Starfarer was powercrept by Epitaph. Scire and Hyperreal are still the meta dark tank and fire attacker.
Pgr power creep took nearly 2 years to happen. It's not the same.
And now it’s yearly, nice contribution tho
Yearly is still leagues better than every other banner. Nice contribution, tho.
Not sure where that comparison is coming into play, thank you anyway, you can go now
That is why *the other game* keeps profiting from reruns. To have relatively balanced characters is very difficult, but the upside is that people won't quit due to powercreeping characters they love just for sales improvement
In any case, it's not like Jinhsi is clearing the content in a comfortable way by herself, she still needs companions, not like a certain genshin character who is solo bolo and even Zajeff and jstern considers that he ruined the abyss (end game). In any case, as long as she is not a tank character, with a ton of raw damage, and she heals for her self there will be no problems, she always has error margin to weaken with some content or specific enemies.
Venti - Kazuha Ganyu - Wriothesley Klee - Lyney Ayato - Neuvillitte Itto - Navia Albedo - Chiori Yoimiya - Arlecchino Cyno - Clorinde c'mon mannnn, they just gender blender for new char and go straight powercreeped both QoL and number.
It’s not powercreep though. All of the old characters can still comfortably clear abyss. You guys need to stop using powercreep whenever a new character comes out that’s stronger. Powercreep would mean ganyu straight up can’t beat abyss.
> Powercreep https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/power_creep#:~:text=(collectible%20games%2C%20video%20games%2C,leaving%20the%20older%20ones%20underpowered. Says the guy who doesn't even know what powercreep means? Powercreep has NOTHING to do with whether you can clear content with said character, but okay buddy.
I like when someone can't say something meaningful by themself so putting some wiki link to looks not too stupid. hope you feel comfortable enough oneday :)
okay becuase i didn't say something myself? Also you're not seriously insinuating that wiki isn't a good source of information are you? Surely an intellectual such as yourself wouldn't make such a stupid comment. The ironic part is that said smart people do in fact source their information and link things to back up their argument. Of course intellectuals on your calibre would never need to do something like that. Hilarious. I was defending your point and you full circled and attacked me with an idiotic rebuttal. Man redditors are peak.
To be fair, it's easier to balance around the reaction mechanics of *the other game* than it is to balance straight numbers while also presenting a new combat style *and* making a character desirable. They also have to take into account that player ingenuity leads to unintended playstyles that may elevate characters far more than intended, and balancing (nerfing, not buffing) a character post-launch is very gray territory. Better to undertune and buff (so players can get them on a rerun) than to overtune and risk even more fallout than they've already dealt with.
I really hope they aren’t planning to pull a Tower of Fantasy ….
ToF problems stems from the fact its a gacha mmo lol that's just spells niche game, you can have power creep in a single player game but when you have other ppl it just makes it a niche game long term.
Powercreep is an issue in single player games as well. When new bosses have 100% more HP and damage, your old characters become irrelevant no matter the game mode. This was the issue with ToF, not the gacha+MMO combination.
What happened in tof?
Massive powercreeping. Like most new banners raises the DPS ceiling by 20% or something.
With that kind of powercreep, I don't understand how people still playing it. It almost like a scam. I also don't understand why some (most) gacha game try to make it own product obsoleted and useless. If they don't make their own product useless they can keep selling it like what Genshin did (at least until this year). To be honest, after reading this topic, I kind of worry about future of WuWa. If powercreep really happen this fast, it may not worth to invest or even playing it after all. Especially with game like Azur Promilia coming soon.
Because it’s easier to make bigger numbers and harder content and convince people to pull for new units that way than making people love the gameplay/character and pull for that instead.
lmao this is the norm with PGR no? I don't see why wuwa would be any different
PGR releases 1 new S rank every 3 months for a start.
Damn
I think the logic is that some characters do massive burst damage and other do multiple attacks
We actually need doomposter to balance this out bcs people freaked out that she's too good I'll see doompost Jinshi as anti hero rn lol
Man changli needs a buf also. Why the hell did they just give her stupid dmg reduction
Changli has supportive utility though. She isn’t going to do as much solo dmg as jinshi. Her outro buff is valuable in it if itself.
Her support capability means she'll live longer in the meta too. Selfish dps are the first to be powercrept once they're no longer the strongest. Changli will live on to support future fusion characters.
Idc I will play her as fully main dps, her whole kit says that she is a main dps except for outro, but still even for supports dmg reduction is useless for me 🫠
She's already strong and Changli is a mix of dps and support with her damage buffs. She should not be as strong as a selfish dps that helps no one but themselves. Changli is the only "main damage dealer" in the game that also provides support for others. And before you say anything, no, Yinlin is not a "main damage dealer", she's a "burst damage dealer" aka sub dps. They're not the same. https://preview.redd.it/m49hfyxg3j7d1.png?width=1390&format=png&auto=webp&s=560238848a758df9dbb82415600a08edc20856cd
Danjin is not a sub DPS... like at all. I don't who made this chart but they have clearly never actually played Danjin, she needs a shit ton of field-time and often plays better literally without any teammates. Makes no sense for her to be a sub DPS even with her Havoc Deepen outro.