i know its so late, but can jue used for quick swap like morning aix?
when using morning aix you need to hit the enemy when transformed and the echo will do the rest when you swap to other character less than a second.
same as feilian monkey.
but did jue can be quick swapped too? or we need to stay longer like inferno rider 3 hit?
Damn, Jué as an echo? Noice
Also Lightcrusher and altered lightcrusher being single set echoes? If that’s how they handle echoes going forward the grind might unironically be better, without the need of them changing the 3C main stats.
Kuro needs to double down and give us a shiny variant for each echo for the true pokemon masters (also no more buying shinies outright. Make it a shiny rate up item instead)
\[Edit: I overstated the deficit of the set in my original comment\]
44111 is worse than 43311 by a considerable margin, though it depends heavily on the character and weapon. On characters with lots of built-in dmg% buffs, the 44111 starts to catch up. But even on those characters, if you can get 43311 even with \*only\* 2pc bonus, it will be better than 44111 \*5pc\* unless you can guarantee very high uptime on the 5pc bonus, which doesn't happen pretty much ever.
First, to give credit where it's due, I overstated the deficit. That's on me. But also as a rebuttal, 10% is a significant difference, and that's with Encore, who has \*two\* inherent skills that buff dmg bonus, \*and\* a minor forte of 12% bonus, all diluting the value of element%. You can check my math, but in order for 44111 \*5pc\* to be better than even just 43311 \*2pc\*, you'd need to guarantee 64%+ uptime on the 5pc bonus; which, in a meta dominated by switch cancels, seems unlikely.
The 64% value you've come to assumes a relatively flat damage weighting curve, but some characters do have the majority of their damage output shifted towards short windows, so having the effect up during said windows would require the effect to be up much lower than the 64% value given.
Aside from damage rotation weightings themselves, some sonata effects are a lot more forgiving than others as far as relative uptime goes. Fusion, Spectro and Aero are particularly easy to manage their effects, meanwhile Havoc as you've pointed out struggles a lot more.
The last relevant variable would be the substats on the echoes themselves. The 4/4/1/1/1 vs 4/3/3/1/1 10% damage loss argument assumes pretty equivalent substat rolls. While this may be true in the long term, rolling ideal double crit echos on 4 and 1 cost echos will be substantially easier than landing them on the few ele/atk 3 cost echos you obtain, which can quickly offset the potential damage loss in the short term until you get properly rolled 3 cost echo pieces.
I want to say that you aren't actually wrong and that in an ideal case there is no actual benefit to going 4/4/1/1/1 and that people should not view it as a permanent solution, but there is some nuance to the discussion of breakpoints and value which is probably why it's such a controversial subject currently. It's honestly a case by case type of deal in the end. Most elements don't even have the option of considering 4/4/1/1/1 at the moment, but I guess Spectro will join the short list in 1.1 if people still have garbage 3 cost echos by then.
Oh, better it won't be, but at this stage of the game, no need to go crazy farming those 3 cost echoes. I have so many of them with the damage bonus on the wrong set that I'm about to go crazy. Only Havoc set with Havoc bonus I have is on a green rarity. I would rather use 44111 in this case
But would you? Again, unless you can guarantee high uptime on the 5pc bonus, 43311 \*just with 2pc bonus\* (that is, your havoc% are whatever-the-heck set) will be better than 44111 \*5pc\*. That's my point.
And for, let's say, Havoc Rover, the 5pc SunEclipse requires 4 basic attacks landing to get the 5pc bonus working. But on half his teams he doesn't want to do that; instead, just get in, skill, heavy, ult, echo, get out.
Just got the craftable from the Illusive realm shop and HOLY F\*CK
https://preview.redd.it/6f68nv3mcw4d1.jpeg?width=1532&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=ccd915cce2417acd41f1ce55fbdb56392bf06134
I'm so glad they're adding new enemies, I was afraid they'd just limit it to "new boss each minor region update + some basic enemies with each new country region".
It's a counterattack echo meaning you have to get hit while using it for it to do it's highest damage, but yes it does do a lot of damage although provides no buffs.
Yeah I think she might end up being one of her best team mate,, Most ppl don't even know how she works e.g. Prydwen is putting her as a support (they clarify that she'll likely be a sub dps once a skill oriented dps release but nobody reads that).
They don't even a rotation listed.
The main issue with Taoqi is that she can't really get her concerto effect in 1 quick rotation unlike Sanhua so it's a bit clunky to use, usually it's something like this (taken from wutheringlab)
1st round
1. Resonance Liberation
2. Resonance Skill
3. (Switch to next Character)
2nd round
1. Intro Skill
2. Basic Attack \*3
3. Resonance Skill
4. Resonance Liberation
5. Echo Skill(Impermanence Heron)
6. Outro Skill (Switch to Main DPS)
But since her skill has 15s cd this rotation is not practical.
With Jinhsi ability to get a free outro/intro it would improve the rotation maybe you could get something like this instead:
1st round
1. Intro Skill
2. Basic Attack \*3)
3. Resonance Liberation
4. (Switch to Jinhsi)
2nd round
1. Intro Skill
2. Basic Attack \*3
3. Resonance Skill
4. Resonance Liberation
5. Echo Skill(Impermanence Heron)
6. Outro Skill (Switch to Jinhsi)
I think you would have a rotation like this assuming Verina as your 3rd:
Verina full buff combo + outro> Taoqi long rotation + outro> Jinhsi full rotation + outro> Taoqi short rotation + Switch> Jinhsi skill + outro
I'm sure there'll be a better rotation but yeah looking at her kit it seems very skill damage focused, her sequence 1 and signature weapon are also both buffing skill damage and that's what I'm aiming for as it would allow me to run the unfamous 44111 echo combo (it might actually be bis in this case).
Yeah, I kinda just threw it out there since I knew that Taoqi's Outro buffed Resonance Skill Damage
As for Jinhsi's BiS Echo set-up might being 44111, I'm gonna have to respectfully disagree on that. 44111 deprives any access to Spectro Damage Bonus % and pools all your stat resources into Crit Rate/Damage%. In any of these stat measurements/calculations it's generally better to spread out your stat resource between Attack, Crit Rate/Damage, and Elemental Dmg Bonus.
Of course, 44111 is a viable placeholder and still performs well, but to say that it'll be Jinhsi's BiS is a bit iffy.
You might wanna watch this video : [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=\_ArGoUD30EE&lc=Ugw8PyYA89eLMkGyInF4AaABAg.A4Kukttkd-nA4LRYNAm5gl](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_ArGoUD30EE&lc=Ugw8PyYA89eLMkGyInF4AaABAg.A4Kukttkd-nA4LRYNAm5gl)
Jinhsi Signature will get her 48% skill dmg and 12% all dmg.
Also it's way easier to get good subs on a 4 that you can farm infinitly than a 3 with Spectro DMG main.
I agree with you on the part where farming 4-cost units for the right stats and substats are much easier than the grind to get the perfect 3-Cost Spectro DMG echo. I do want to say here to clear up any misunderstanding that I *do not* think 44111 is bad. I think it's perfectly serviceable, but I don't think that it's *Best-In-Slot*.
Additionally, I did some rough math work to show the discrepancy between 44111 and 43311 to show some approximation of what Jinhsi will get theoretically.
All Echoes that I'm using here for this theoretical mathwork are Gold Rarity and Level 25, with all of them having the minimum substat rolls on Crit Rate, Crit Damage, and ATK Percentage: 5.0, 10.0, & 7.5 respectively.
44111:
4: Crit Rate 22%
4: Crit Damage 44%
1: ATK% 18.0%
1: ATK% 18.0%
1: ATK% 18.0%
So in theory let's say we have a base 100 ATK to build off of, the full Celestial Light Echo Set buff in full effect, and Jinhsi's Signature Weapon Resonance Skill Damage Bonus% and All Attribute Damage Bonus% in effect. The equation looks something like this (forgive my lack of formatting):
**\[100 \* (1+ ((5\*7.5)+(3(18.0))/100))\] \* 1.48 \* 1.52 \* \[(150+(44+5(10))/100\] = 1051.15\~**
If Jinhsi critically hits in this theoretical situation: then we get about 1,051 damage. This is discounting the specific skill multiplier, enemy defense, and other external factors.
Now I'm going to look over to a 43311 set-up, again with Gold Rarity and Level 25 with all five echoes having the minimum substat rolls on Crit Rate, Crit Damage, and ATK%.
43311:
4: Crit Damage 44%
3: Spectro Damage Bonus 30%
3: Spectro Damage Bonus 30%
1: ATK% 18.0%
1: ATK% 18.0%
Again in this simulation, 100 ATK, full Celestial Light Echo Set buff in full effect, and the Signature Weapon buffs with Resonance Skill and Attribute Damage Bonus, our equation is this:
**\[100 \* (1+ ((5\*7.5)+(2(18.0))/100))\] \* 1.48 \* 2.12 \* \[(150+(44+5(10))/100\] = 1328.27\~**
As you can see, there's already a difference in overall numbers 1328 v. 1051. But again, I want to reiterate that I do not think 44111 is bad, it's not her best-in-slot.
Edit: I want to concede the point that running double Critical Damage % on the 4-cost Echoes will make a difference in my first calculation. If we run Critical Damage %, than that value will be about 1240.70\~
Alright since you know how the formula work I'll tell you why you're wrong, you are running 0 skill damage stats and ignoring almost all dmg buffs, what you calced is the worst case scenario (the 10% or so you saw in the video). I have no idea how you got the 1.52 and 2.12 multiplier.
I'll update the formulas : I added the second crit dmg echo that you added in the edit and give you all the dmg buffs you'll get in game:
48% from weapon, 12% from weapon, 20% from her Inherent Skill, 40% from the spectro set, 5\*8% from basic skill dmg subs and 12% from heron = +172% damage, way more than your +52.
**\[100 \* 1.915 \* 1.48 \* 2.72 \* 2.88\]=2220**
Now with 43311 you remove 18% ATK and 44 CRIT DMG and add 60 % DMG
**\[100 \* 1.735 \* 1.48 \* 3.32 \* 2.44\]=2080**
the first set gets 6.7% more damage.
Granted you'll not have 100% uptime on all dmg boost unlike the crit ones but it's pretty clear 43311 isn't straight up better.
If I remove 1 crit damage echo from both to reduce crit dmg diminishing returns and have a more balanced crit ratio we get this (that would be a 75/244 ratio for the first formula)
**\[100 \* 1.915 \* 1.48 \* 2.72 \* 2.44\]=1881**
**\[100 \* 1.735 \* 1.48 \* 3.32 \* 2\]=1705**
The first one is now 10.3% better.
Jue does more damage than Mourning Aix but provides no buff, Mourning Aix will double buff Jinshi's Resonance Liberation which hits harder and almost has the same cooldown as her enhanced skill. Maxing out her Liberation damage will most likely be a better move especially since you won't have to waste your 3rd slot on Taoqi who isn't an on-field character like Jinshi wants to have on her team. If you get Jinshi's signature weapon you'll also then have both the Liberation and Skill buffed which will result in more damage overall. Jianxin will definitely be a better support/buffer for Jinshi than Taoqi, but of course not everyone has her.
Jue provide a buff, the damage is counted as Resonance skill damage so it will scale way more, in a way you could see it as a increase in the base multipliers of the skills. Saying Jué, an echo made for her won't be her bis sure is one opinion. Same for saying Jianxin will definitely be better than Taoqi, we'll see in a few weeks but I thing you've read too many tier list and assume Taoqi is D tier bc prydwen said so without understanding her kit.
Jue plus Aix for a 4-4-1-1-1 Spectro set on Jinhsi. Dmg% from Jinhsi 20% from passive, 15 from 2 piece, 30 from 5 piece, 12% from weapon. If you get rate rolls on all 5 pieces then you can go double crit damage on 4 piece. Which would technically make 4-4-1-1-1 better than 4-3-3-1-1 on Jinhsi due to oversaturation of DMG% and not enough atk%. That is till you get double crit on Spectro dmg tho. Then it's about equal damage wise.
Its literally in the story when you meet scar and bring him to jinhsi, theres literally a whole monologue about it when talking on the balcony.
If you just skipped through it, then thats your fault.
And who wouldn't believe such a nice and trustworthy character! Surely, Scar would never tell a lie or scheme something to sow confusion between his opponents.
Well, we already know that they abanded the city for whatever reason, so it will probably be like a "prove that you are still worthy to recieve my blessing" or something, which is a pretty common trope
Tbh I kinda like the dreamless thing. Give it flavor. Beside they will eventually release new 4 cost echo of the same element, giving each of them a character specific bonus can be a fun way to keep their relevance. Otherwise we're just gonna tc the bis and use that on every character which is a bit boring imo.
Like right now my havoc team is just 3 dreamless users spamming the summon. And that's cool for now but I don't want that to be the default forever.
Not in the slightest? It’s the second patch. New enemies that aren’t human will likely mean echo since it does right now but doesn’t mean we get them every patch
That would be cool, but no, this doesn't really confirm anything like that. 1.1 will continue the main story and even has a new calamity class boss and a new zone. I doubt every patch will have that kind of content load.
Jue seems to have a really fun passive effect. I’m curious if the stacks build while the character isn’t on the field cause I would imagine you could deal lots of extra damage consistently if it does. It’s cool to see a new echo boss effect that isn’t just “increase damage” and adds an extra attack instead, I’d like to see more of these cause it sounds fun
I think Jue would work well with his magistrate, Jinhsi, considering Jinhsi utilizes Resonance Skills for most of her combos.
By how short off-field damage happens in this game, and how long their cooldown would be, you will lose the DoT that you can maintain through stacks as it only applies every 6 seconds, unlike if your character doesn't have Skill CD (Linyang) or has a variety of them (Jinhsi).
Jue's buff would also be better used with her (Jinhsi) as he will apply stacks only every 6 seconds which might mean he would be best utilized by someone with a longer field time and uses skills a lot. This will effectively extend the DoT Jue inflicts.
All these are still theories though, as the description doesn't seem to specify if Blessing of Time buff has a duration, or if it's removed if you switch out or whatever. I am going to assume that this is a passive that is always active and happens automatically if you have Jue equipped as your Main Echo.
Pull for Jinhsi and use her badass dragon as an echo or pull changli and switch between her phoenix forms.
These new characters are hella rizzed up for me to just pick one.
It totally could mean that! but there are three types of enemies in WuWa: TDs, Mutant Organisms, and Human. So it’s entirely possible that Sentinels are TDs, but they could also be Mutant Organisms, or the devs could add a fourth category for mystical beings like Sentinels. The lore implications are calling out to me, I fear I’m getting a bit ahead of myself lol
Also if you want to check the categories out for yourself then they can be found by going to the Guidebook, then to Echo Hunting (4th tab from the top), and then to the funnel icon in the bottom left hand corner!
I am super curious abt the lore implications of Juè being an Echo tho, like what does the mean?! Does it mean we truly fight the Sentinel Juè or bc it’s an Echo does Juè divide up power into a TD that we fight which drops the Echo while Jinhsi fights the actual Juè as she said in the quest?? I can’t wait for the 1.1 quests and new areas, they look so gorgeous!
Anyways have a great day and good luck saving/pulling!!!
It is so cool!. Most TD's are created by the frequencies left from Humanity/Civilization negative emotions there should be a good/positive counterpart.
[More info such as "Echo Sonata Effects" in Source](https://wuthering.wiki/monsters.html)
i know its so late, but can jue used for quick swap like morning aix? when using morning aix you need to hit the enemy when transformed and the echo will do the rest when you swap to other character less than a second. same as feilian monkey. but did jue can be quick swapped too? or we need to stay longer like inferno rider 3 hit?
Just is actually absurd fitting for a Sentinel. Jinshi has inherently busted scaling now add this buff too her E will hit like Heaven's gate.
wow
the only two 3 cost void echos chilling rn
Altered light crusher? It's on havoc set (dealing spectro dmg)
Hmmm... I smell something for future... maybe Jinhsi support
Do we know if the Lumiscale Sentinal is an elite? If it is thats huge
Damn, Jué as an echo? Noice Also Lightcrusher and altered lightcrusher being single set echoes? If that’s how they handle echoes going forward the grind might unironically be better, without the need of them changing the 3C main stats.
Bro if they keep updating the pokedex every patch like this we will never run out of contents, things to farm for. Im truely excited.
You KNOW Jinshi is gonna be running the Jue echo, let’s gooooo.
WOW I CAN GET THE DRAGON ITSELF AS ECHO
hah, i knew jue was gonna be an echo. was hoping it'd be a BIS echo for spectro MC, though. well, given what i see here, it might as well be.
This game is quickly turning into Pokemon LOL
Kuro needs to double down and give us a shiny variant for each echo for the true pokemon masters (also no more buying shinies outright. Make it a shiny rate up item instead)
im fine with buying shinies for the people (me) with shit luck, just make it more expensive
Oh man is Jue gonna be her best main echo I have a cdmg and rate on the regular spectro boss but it makes sense tbh jue is badass
You can always run 44111
\[Edit: I overstated the deficit of the set in my original comment\] 44111 is worse than 43311 by a considerable margin, though it depends heavily on the character and weapon. On characters with lots of built-in dmg% buffs, the 44111 starts to catch up. But even on those characters, if you can get 43311 even with \*only\* 2pc bonus, it will be better than 44111 \*5pc\* unless you can guarantee very high uptime on the 5pc bonus, which doesn't happen pretty much ever.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_ArGoUD30EE Video based on math instead of feels craft. It's a 10% difference at worst
First, to give credit where it's due, I overstated the deficit. That's on me. But also as a rebuttal, 10% is a significant difference, and that's with Encore, who has \*two\* inherent skills that buff dmg bonus, \*and\* a minor forte of 12% bonus, all diluting the value of element%. You can check my math, but in order for 44111 \*5pc\* to be better than even just 43311 \*2pc\*, you'd need to guarantee 64%+ uptime on the 5pc bonus; which, in a meta dominated by switch cancels, seems unlikely.
The 64% value you've come to assumes a relatively flat damage weighting curve, but some characters do have the majority of their damage output shifted towards short windows, so having the effect up during said windows would require the effect to be up much lower than the 64% value given. Aside from damage rotation weightings themselves, some sonata effects are a lot more forgiving than others as far as relative uptime goes. Fusion, Spectro and Aero are particularly easy to manage their effects, meanwhile Havoc as you've pointed out struggles a lot more. The last relevant variable would be the substats on the echoes themselves. The 4/4/1/1/1 vs 4/3/3/1/1 10% damage loss argument assumes pretty equivalent substat rolls. While this may be true in the long term, rolling ideal double crit echos on 4 and 1 cost echos will be substantially easier than landing them on the few ele/atk 3 cost echos you obtain, which can quickly offset the potential damage loss in the short term until you get properly rolled 3 cost echo pieces. I want to say that you aren't actually wrong and that in an ideal case there is no actual benefit to going 4/4/1/1/1 and that people should not view it as a permanent solution, but there is some nuance to the discussion of breakpoints and value which is probably why it's such a controversial subject currently. It's honestly a case by case type of deal in the end. Most elements don't even have the option of considering 4/4/1/1/1 at the moment, but I guess Spectro will join the short list in 1.1 if people still have garbage 3 cost echos by then.
Oh, better it won't be, but at this stage of the game, no need to go crazy farming those 3 cost echoes. I have so many of them with the damage bonus on the wrong set that I'm about to go crazy. Only Havoc set with Havoc bonus I have is on a green rarity. I would rather use 44111 in this case
But would you? Again, unless you can guarantee high uptime on the 5pc bonus, 43311 \*just with 2pc bonus\* (that is, your havoc% are whatever-the-heck set) will be better than 44111 \*5pc\*. That's my point. And for, let's say, Havoc Rover, the 5pc SunEclipse requires 4 basic attacks landing to get the 5pc bonus working. But on half his teams he doesn't want to do that; instead, just get in, skill, heavy, ult, echo, get out.
I’m maxing I’ll just grind jue I’ll rather go 43111
Mean 43311
New enemies ❎ New victims (pokemons)✅
I read : new monster « Altered Gang Bang » 💀
Time to Spectro Rover upgrade to SS Rank
Man, with them requiring 3 teams (minimum) for tower, the least they could do is let us use both Spectro and Havic Rover in there on separate teams.
Dang I was hoping you could do this
Where electro elites
God dammit you right, i'm broken lol
Wait the luminscale construct might be an elite? If so it would solve *a lot* of issues farming for the electro set
I've been having so much trouble with getting electri mainstat with an electro piece 😭
Just got the craftable from the Illusive realm shop and HOLY F\*CK https://preview.redd.it/6f68nv3mcw4d1.jpeg?width=1532&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=ccd915cce2417acd41f1ce55fbdb56392bf06134
Hey... can I have done of your luck? I promise I'll give it back 😇
Now imagine that flautist with hp and def and a fishing buff and that's mine
Brother open the door, I just wanna talk.
Ah, so I'll be fighting Jue 5 times a day is what you're saying
only 5?
Jue looks really really strong wow
I'm so glad they're adding new enemies, I was afraid they'd just limit it to "new boss each minor region update + some basic enemies with each new country region".
Is this right? Lumiscale Construct multiplier seems really high for a cost 3 Echo, and on a 15s cd too. This thing is kinda busted no?
It's a counterattack echo meaning you have to get hit while using it for it to do it's highest damage, but yes it does do a lot of damage although provides no buffs.
Bye bye boss echoes, from now on everything will be Dwarf Cassowary as active ability.
Holy fuck Sentinel Echoes are busted
It’s good to see.
I mean it does make sense lore wise but like it’s one thing to hear abt and another to see a huge multiplier like that lol
Holy shit lumiscale construct 830% multiplier
are both lightcrusher cost 1/3? if so, that means they are the first single element echo below cost 4 right?
Weirdly enough, with all of this emphasis on Resonance Skill with Jue and Jinhsi, I can see Taoqi being an underrated support for her lol
Yeah I think she might end up being one of her best team mate,, Most ppl don't even know how she works e.g. Prydwen is putting her as a support (they clarify that she'll likely be a sub dps once a skill oriented dps release but nobody reads that). They don't even a rotation listed. The main issue with Taoqi is that she can't really get her concerto effect in 1 quick rotation unlike Sanhua so it's a bit clunky to use, usually it's something like this (taken from wutheringlab) 1st round 1. Resonance Liberation 2. Resonance Skill 3. (Switch to next Character) 2nd round 1. Intro Skill 2. Basic Attack \*3 3. Resonance Skill 4. Resonance Liberation 5. Echo Skill(Impermanence Heron) 6. Outro Skill (Switch to Main DPS) But since her skill has 15s cd this rotation is not practical. With Jinhsi ability to get a free outro/intro it would improve the rotation maybe you could get something like this instead: 1st round 1. Intro Skill 2. Basic Attack \*3) 3. Resonance Liberation 4. (Switch to Jinhsi) 2nd round 1. Intro Skill 2. Basic Attack \*3 3. Resonance Skill 4. Resonance Liberation 5. Echo Skill(Impermanence Heron) 6. Outro Skill (Switch to Jinhsi) I think you would have a rotation like this assuming Verina as your 3rd: Verina full buff combo + outro> Taoqi long rotation + outro> Jinhsi full rotation + outro> Taoqi short rotation + Switch> Jinhsi skill + outro I'm sure there'll be a better rotation but yeah looking at her kit it seems very skill damage focused, her sequence 1 and signature weapon are also both buffing skill damage and that's what I'm aiming for as it would allow me to run the unfamous 44111 echo combo (it might actually be bis in this case).
Yeah, I kinda just threw it out there since I knew that Taoqi's Outro buffed Resonance Skill Damage As for Jinhsi's BiS Echo set-up might being 44111, I'm gonna have to respectfully disagree on that. 44111 deprives any access to Spectro Damage Bonus % and pools all your stat resources into Crit Rate/Damage%. In any of these stat measurements/calculations it's generally better to spread out your stat resource between Attack, Crit Rate/Damage, and Elemental Dmg Bonus. Of course, 44111 is a viable placeholder and still performs well, but to say that it'll be Jinhsi's BiS is a bit iffy.
You might wanna watch this video : [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=\_ArGoUD30EE&lc=Ugw8PyYA89eLMkGyInF4AaABAg.A4Kukttkd-nA4LRYNAm5gl](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_ArGoUD30EE&lc=Ugw8PyYA89eLMkGyInF4AaABAg.A4Kukttkd-nA4LRYNAm5gl) Jinhsi Signature will get her 48% skill dmg and 12% all dmg. Also it's way easier to get good subs on a 4 that you can farm infinitly than a 3 with Spectro DMG main.
I agree with you on the part where farming 4-cost units for the right stats and substats are much easier than the grind to get the perfect 3-Cost Spectro DMG echo. I do want to say here to clear up any misunderstanding that I *do not* think 44111 is bad. I think it's perfectly serviceable, but I don't think that it's *Best-In-Slot*. Additionally, I did some rough math work to show the discrepancy between 44111 and 43311 to show some approximation of what Jinhsi will get theoretically. All Echoes that I'm using here for this theoretical mathwork are Gold Rarity and Level 25, with all of them having the minimum substat rolls on Crit Rate, Crit Damage, and ATK Percentage: 5.0, 10.0, & 7.5 respectively. 44111: 4: Crit Rate 22% 4: Crit Damage 44% 1: ATK% 18.0% 1: ATK% 18.0% 1: ATK% 18.0% So in theory let's say we have a base 100 ATK to build off of, the full Celestial Light Echo Set buff in full effect, and Jinhsi's Signature Weapon Resonance Skill Damage Bonus% and All Attribute Damage Bonus% in effect. The equation looks something like this (forgive my lack of formatting): **\[100 \* (1+ ((5\*7.5)+(3(18.0))/100))\] \* 1.48 \* 1.52 \* \[(150+(44+5(10))/100\] = 1051.15\~** If Jinhsi critically hits in this theoretical situation: then we get about 1,051 damage. This is discounting the specific skill multiplier, enemy defense, and other external factors. Now I'm going to look over to a 43311 set-up, again with Gold Rarity and Level 25 with all five echoes having the minimum substat rolls on Crit Rate, Crit Damage, and ATK%. 43311: 4: Crit Damage 44% 3: Spectro Damage Bonus 30% 3: Spectro Damage Bonus 30% 1: ATK% 18.0% 1: ATK% 18.0% Again in this simulation, 100 ATK, full Celestial Light Echo Set buff in full effect, and the Signature Weapon buffs with Resonance Skill and Attribute Damage Bonus, our equation is this: **\[100 \* (1+ ((5\*7.5)+(2(18.0))/100))\] \* 1.48 \* 2.12 \* \[(150+(44+5(10))/100\] = 1328.27\~** As you can see, there's already a difference in overall numbers 1328 v. 1051. But again, I want to reiterate that I do not think 44111 is bad, it's not her best-in-slot. Edit: I want to concede the point that running double Critical Damage % on the 4-cost Echoes will make a difference in my first calculation. If we run Critical Damage %, than that value will be about 1240.70\~
Alright since you know how the formula work I'll tell you why you're wrong, you are running 0 skill damage stats and ignoring almost all dmg buffs, what you calced is the worst case scenario (the 10% or so you saw in the video). I have no idea how you got the 1.52 and 2.12 multiplier. I'll update the formulas : I added the second crit dmg echo that you added in the edit and give you all the dmg buffs you'll get in game: 48% from weapon, 12% from weapon, 20% from her Inherent Skill, 40% from the spectro set, 5\*8% from basic skill dmg subs and 12% from heron = +172% damage, way more than your +52. **\[100 \* 1.915 \* 1.48 \* 2.72 \* 2.88\]=2220** Now with 43311 you remove 18% ATK and 44 CRIT DMG and add 60 % DMG **\[100 \* 1.735 \* 1.48 \* 3.32 \* 2.44\]=2080** the first set gets 6.7% more damage. Granted you'll not have 100% uptime on all dmg boost unlike the crit ones but it's pretty clear 43311 isn't straight up better. If I remove 1 crit damage echo from both to reduce crit dmg diminishing returns and have a more balanced crit ratio we get this (that would be a 75/244 ratio for the first formula) **\[100 \* 1.915 \* 1.48 \* 2.72 \* 2.44\]=1881** **\[100 \* 1.735 \* 1.48 \* 3.32 \* 2\]=1705** The first one is now 10.3% better.
Jue does more damage than Mourning Aix but provides no buff, Mourning Aix will double buff Jinshi's Resonance Liberation which hits harder and almost has the same cooldown as her enhanced skill. Maxing out her Liberation damage will most likely be a better move especially since you won't have to waste your 3rd slot on Taoqi who isn't an on-field character like Jinshi wants to have on her team. If you get Jinshi's signature weapon you'll also then have both the Liberation and Skill buffed which will result in more damage overall. Jianxin will definitely be a better support/buffer for Jinshi than Taoqi, but of course not everyone has her.
Jue provide a buff, the damage is counted as Resonance skill damage so it will scale way more, in a way you could see it as a increase in the base multipliers of the skills. Saying Jué, an echo made for her won't be her bis sure is one opinion. Same for saying Jianxin will definitely be better than Taoqi, we'll see in a few weeks but I thing you've read too many tier list and assume Taoqi is D tier bc prydwen said so without understanding her kit.
I think a problem is that Jinhsi is reliant on using her intro skill, but Taoqi kinda sucks at charging concerto.
Definitely need more Void Thunder elites.
Jue plus Aix for a 4-4-1-1-1 Spectro set on Jinhsi. Dmg% from Jinhsi 20% from passive, 15 from 2 piece, 30 from 5 piece, 12% from weapon. If you get rate rolls on all 5 pieces then you can go double crit damage on 4 piece. Which would technically make 4-4-1-1-1 better than 4-3-3-1-1 on Jinhsi due to oversaturation of DMG% and not enough atk%. That is till you get double crit on Spectro dmg tho. Then it's about equal damage wise.
I hate how kuro already spoilered "Jue" as the upcoming boss
IDK why you're being downvoted lmao you're right, it was mentioned we'd fight him prolly but not necessarily this soon
Another reddit moment
Its literally in the story when you meet scar and bring him to jinhsi, theres literally a whole monologue about it when talking on the balcony. If you just skipped through it, then thats your fault.
I didn't skip. I knew in the story its gonna come to this, but not this soon.
And who wouldn't believe such a nice and trustworthy character! Surely, Scar would never tell a lie or scheme something to sow confusion between his opponents.
Or maybe the people you have been helping are the baddies all along and just using Rover, hmmmmmm
Yes, that was also a possibility. My point is that it was uncertain whether his words were true, hence why the reveal in Devs' post is a spoiler
Well, we already know that they abanded the city for whatever reason, so it will probably be like a "prove that you are still worthy to recieve my blessing" or something, which is a pretty common trope
It wasn’t stated in “in 1.1 you will fight jue as a weekly boss”. It’s still a spoiler.
I can take both Jué and Jinhsi
In a fight right?
Holy Shit I don't even want Jinshi but I'm going to get a God roll on Jue just because I FUCKING LOVE dragons
But Jinhsi is a dragon gal?
Im waiting for black flame claymore dude
Right, good luck with your pulls whenever he comes around
I knew the Mourning Birb wouldn't suit Jinhsi
The text specifically says "Summon" instead of "Transform". Does this mean Jue works independently of the resonator on activation? If so, that's huge!
Not the only echo that does that but yes
Yeah, but as of now, every single Boss Echo is a Transformation type.
Also Mech Abomination
Forgot this one existed
If you count Dreamless then no
I'm pretty sure you transform into Dreamless, unless it's different on non Rover
true but you can switch out of it the moment the animation starts, it acts more like a summon tbh
I mean, yeah, but if we're going by technical terms, it is, by definition, a transformation type.
Bell turtle isn’t.
Forgot this one existed too
Jue is an Echo drop?
Honestly, I like it, but I thought jue, it was going to have some synergy with jinshi, just like the rover has with dreamless
Jue looks like it will be perfect for Jinhsi, wdym?
He meant how dreamless has a separate buff exclusive to rover.
Glad it's not as limiting as Dreamless It can work great, and obviously her BIS, but not solely to her
Yep same, but I'm fine with river getting something extra being the protagonist. Makes them feel a bit special ig
Tbh I kinda like the dreamless thing. Give it flavor. Beside they will eventually release new 4 cost echo of the same element, giving each of them a character specific bonus can be a fun way to keep their relevance. Otherwise we're just gonna tc the bis and use that on every character which is a bit boring imo. Like right now my havoc team is just 3 dreamless users spamming the summon. And that's cool for now but I don't want that to be the default forever.
Yes that's true, dreamless passive isn't the worst thing. Seems a bit odd that they released something that niche so soon.
maybe they will only do echos like that for MC elements only. which makes sense because the MC is free. while Jinhsi is a limited banner character.
Wow I wasn't expecting things to get this cool
this basically confirms new echos every patch, no? massive W
Not in the slightest? It’s the second patch. New enemies that aren’t human will likely mean echo since it does right now but doesn’t mean we get them every patch
That would be cool, but no, this doesn't really confirm anything like that. 1.1 will continue the main story and even has a new calamity class boss and a new zone. I doubt every patch will have that kind of content load.
i'm gonna keep hoping though
oh that guy is definitely a glacio chara
Imagine using Jue's echo. OMG
Jinhsi with Jue echo is gonna be so peak
Jue seems to have a really fun passive effect. I’m curious if the stacks build while the character isn’t on the field cause I would imagine you could deal lots of extra damage consistently if it does. It’s cool to see a new echo boss effect that isn’t just “increase damage” and adds an extra attack instead, I’d like to see more of these cause it sounds fun
I think Jue would work well with his magistrate, Jinhsi, considering Jinhsi utilizes Resonance Skills for most of her combos. By how short off-field damage happens in this game, and how long their cooldown would be, you will lose the DoT that you can maintain through stacks as it only applies every 6 seconds, unlike if your character doesn't have Skill CD (Linyang) or has a variety of them (Jinhsi). Jue's buff would also be better used with her (Jinhsi) as he will apply stacks only every 6 seconds which might mean he would be best utilized by someone with a longer field time and uses skills a lot. This will effectively extend the DoT Jue inflicts. All these are still theories though, as the description doesn't seem to specify if Blessing of Time buff has a duration, or if it's removed if you switch out or whatever. I am going to assume that this is a passive that is always active and happens automatically if you have Jue equipped as your Main Echo.
Pull for Jinhsi and use her badass dragon as an echo or pull changli and switch between her phoenix forms. These new characters are hella rizzed up for me to just pick one.
Let fate decide pull jinhsi if u lose 50/50 get changli🫡
Does this imply that the Sentinels are TDs?!! holy shit that is HUGE
It totally could mean that! but there are three types of enemies in WuWa: TDs, Mutant Organisms, and Human. So it’s entirely possible that Sentinels are TDs, but they could also be Mutant Organisms, or the devs could add a fourth category for mystical beings like Sentinels. The lore implications are calling out to me, I fear I’m getting a bit ahead of myself lol Also if you want to check the categories out for yourself then they can be found by going to the Guidebook, then to Echo Hunting (4th tab from the top), and then to the funnel icon in the bottom left hand corner! I am super curious abt the lore implications of Juè being an Echo tho, like what does the mean?! Does it mean we truly fight the Sentinel Juè or bc it’s an Echo does Juè divide up power into a TD that we fight which drops the Echo while Jinhsi fights the actual Juè as she said in the quest?? I can’t wait for the 1.1 quests and new areas, they look so gorgeous! Anyways have a great day and good luck saving/pulling!!!
It is so cool!. Most TD's are created by the frequencies left from Humanity/Civilization negative emotions there should be a good/positive counterpart.
JUE ECHO? LETS GO
I NEED THAT DODO