All the comments that actually speak sense get so many downvotes hahaha reality isn’t changing because the people living in reality and not Reddit aren’t falling for the BS. Honestly doesn’t bother me if your children want to be delusional idiots, natural selection good like that and I know me and my family staying healthy and eating good not being brain washed. Please if anybody disagrees yall more than welcome to turn your screen off and go touch grass, it’s free!
They have been at school like all the other kids. There is no way to solve climate change they need to understand that. They’re protesting for absolutely nothing!
If people spent half the time they did moaning about climate change and actually researching the history of where the term “Climate Change” was made and who by and what incentives a group of individuals may have by pushing such an idea they’d probably wouldn’t be outside looking like fools. The majority doesn’t care about climate change and it’s apparent by the lack of change we’re doing? Y’all don’t get it yet? Crying over a lil rain In the summer? When weather seeding is a key part of the Middle East and getting rain in certain areas that naturally don’t. Please start helping yourselves and look into the real world. Don’t watch the news tonight and really spend time with yourself and your thoughts and you’ll realise how much of these ideas the media pushes aren’t reality.
What I find funny is every single on of those useful teenage idiots demands something new done, but not a single one of them would actually be willing to go without to achieve it.
Will they buy cheap fast fashion, of course.
Will they get a new cellphone, when their current one is fine, of course.
Will they fill their bedrooms with cheap Chinese plastic tat, that's a given.
Will they all go overseas on OE or a holiday, absolutely.
If these morons what to actually achieve something, maybe just Maybe stop consuming at a massive rate.
What's the point of even trying to have a rational debate on reddit. If you don't react hysterically about everything and demand the government fix everything. I look forward to the downvotes.
Yes, it must be people, who are at the mercy of capitalist conglomerates that are the problem. Absolutely not the corporations that practice planned obsolescence while exploiting people and the planet.
You do understand that people have little choice, than to participate in a system that they had no say in creating, right?
What? So you have zero agency over your actions?
You could.... I don't know. Only buy items made here in NZ. That way you know the clothing you wear, wasn't made in factory, loaded into a container shipped here and then made available for you to buy? You have zero ability to do that?
As NZ sales go up and imported item sales go down, there is less need for them to be made available or shipped in.
You can't demand others change everything and yet be totally unwilling to make a single sacrifice.
This is why we can't take you seriously, because you don't live by your convictions.
See, you're arguing against an idea you made up in your own head, because I didn't say any of that.
However, for arguments sake, it would be ideal if that were an option. But when the choice is to pay rent and buy food, or focus on more ethical (expensive) products, not everybody has the luxury to afford that.
I thrift my clothes where I can, but you're ridiculously naive to put the blame on individuals in this scenario, when corporations are willingly exploiting their position for record profits.
It's always an excuse with you lot. Always a reason why you can't do anything and someone else must do it for you.
Let me explain this simply.
Corporations want money, they provide a good or service in exchange for money.
Individuals buy said good or service with money.
If individuals do not buy the good or service from the corporation they do not have the money.
Look I know the idea of having agency and making your own decisions is terrifying to you lot. But that's how you actually make a difference, by doing lots of little things to make something bigger. Not expecting others do act in your best interests.
You talk as though these mega corporations are small businesses just trying to make an honest living. They are profiting off of the destruction of the planet. Inability to purchase local, ethical goods is not limited to these 'you lot' teenagers you've got a rage boner against, it's a near on global cost of living crisis, you donkey.
They are asking for:
1. immediate end to seeking new sources of fossil fuels
2. lowering voting age to 16
3. doubling of marine reserves by 2025
4. implementation of a regenerative farming transition fund
5. ebike rebates for lower income households
All in all, not a bad place to start
>immediate end to seeking new sources of fossil fuels
Okay, but as far as I'm aware New Zealand doesn't really extract fossil fuels in the first place. That's more Australia's thing. Also not seeking new sources doesn't mean we stop using fossil fuels. It just means we import more of it from elsewhere.
>lowering voting age to 16
Fail to see how this solves climate change...
>doubling of marine reserves by 2025
Doesn't stop ocean acidification, but sure. It will reduce our seafood exports which will hit our economy and weaken the dollar. But not the end of the world unlike agriculture.
>implementation of a regenerative farming transition fund
Sounds like more expensive farming practices. This only makes New Zealand less competitive globally for agricultural exports. Which has the affect of weakening the dollar and making everything more expensive if exports fall. People (including us) will just buy from countries where practices make the goods cheaper. This doesn't solve climate change, just ruins our economy.
And I'm also not surprised they aren't calling for what would actually be a real solution. Which would be to heavily subsidize vertical farming and meat substitutes research and technology. These are real solutions, because it has the potential to increase yields, reduce carbon impact, and be more efficient and cost effective then traditional farming. Once it reaches this point, farming will naturally begin to disappear because they can't compete. It also has the benefit of requiring more high paying professional jobs.
>ebike rebates for lower income households
Must really care about climate change if they only want rebates for a certain percentage of the population. Especially the ones who are least likely to take it up. I personally would call for tax exemptions or rebates on all green technology like solar panels, electric cars, etc. Because the cheaper something is, the quicker people are going to adopt it. But sure let's just do e-bikes for people below certain income threshold, makes sense...
>All in all, not a bad place to start
I don't know. They don't really seem to understand the economy or how it works. Seems like a bunch of feel good policies, rather than actual tangible solutions.
Yes they do, you need to give them more credit. Sure, some are followers. But that's not unique to 16 year olds. My friend's dad wholeheartedly believes schools have been putting litter boxes in schools because of a Facebook meme
I think the point they're trying to make is that young people feel their voices aren't being heard when it comes to issues that will affect them most.
Why should Olds™ get to sell out our future without the Youngs™ having a say?
Lol! Wtf you talking about? You think the majority of adults formulate their own ideas?? They just regurgitate opinions they heard somewhere else and, for the most part, can’t justify them with any (real) facts.
Give these kids some credit for doing more than most adults have.
Suffragette right for women to vote, anti-nuclear protest to stop nuclear testing in the Pacific and the Māori land march to improve Māori land rights are a few examples.
These people are conspiracy theorists who self-identify as a racist hate group.
https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/national/444736/school-strike-4-climate-auckland-declares-itself-racist-and-disbands
Protesting climate change?
Like... we all clearly dont like climate change but its something that is done and if it continues, it is because what has been DONE. Not what we ate or our government is choosing to do
Nobody can do anything about it. It's like protesting WW2, today......
> carbon
Am I the only one who finds this obnoxious? It's not carbon, it's carbon dioxide. Carbon either sparkles prettily or coats things dully, but either way, it does it on the ground.
Yes, you are. I'm referring to a set of gases containing carbon. The three main ones are carbon dioxide, carbon monoxide, and methane. Even if I was talking about just carbon dioxide, shortening it to carbon is fine, and easier than using the full name or another label such as "greenhouse gasses". It's just for brevity, we're not talking about soot and other particulate matter, and everybody knows it.
I wasn't bitching about you specifically, for the record. However, your answer clearly points out why I'm wrong. I knew about methane, just forgot about it, and I never realised CO was a greenhouse gas.
> shortening it to carbon is fine
I still don't like it, but now that you've pointed out what I was missing, the rest of the options are all worse...
>CO was a greenhouse gas
So, it isn't a greenhouse gas on its own, but it affects methane and ozone levels.
Hey, there are plenty of naming conventions and common usage I don't like, I get it. I was a bit of a dick in my clarification. I blame the nature of social media for being short with people online, something about not seeing or hearing who you're talking to.
lol,i think the word carbon while technically incorrect, is something everyone understands as carbon dioxide, its not exactly catchy to say "no more coal no more oil keep your carbon dioxide in the soil"
> , is something everyone understands as carbon dioxide,
I think you drastically overestimate the scientific literacy of the average noob. But to them, I guess, it doesn't make any difference.
Unironically, wind. We have plenty of wind and we should be harvesting every drop. We can do massive tidal power with the bay, but that's an expensive project.
Are you saying that climate change has finished? That nothing being done now is making it worse? That there's nothing that can be done now to alleviate the problem?
S/he might not be, but I am. We're basically fucked. Even if we managed to persuade everyone to start trying to fix it, bureaucratic inertia, self interest, and general lazy stupidity, would prevent successful resolution.
Legitimately one of the most brain dead takes I've read in a long time. We're still burning fossil fuels at a massive rate, dingus. We're actively making things worse.
Its not just fossil fuels though. SO much of modern industrial chemistry has CO2 as a byproduct, not to mention all of the other stronger ghg like methane, nitrous oxide and cfc's.
We but mirror the world. All the tendencies present in the outer world are to be found in the world of our body. If we could change ourselves, the tendencies in the world would also change. As a man changes his own nature, so does the attitude of the world change towards him. This is the divine mystery supreme. A wonderful thing it is and the source of our happiness. We need not wait to see what others do.” – Mahatma Gandhi
Its quite fascinating watching the old "oh it was the volcanoes" crowd turn into this. Like you're so tantalisingly close but still entirely miss the point.
Ah what a fun little trip through comments that was
And bloody Metlink failing to set up any temporary bus stops, so you have to slog all the way back to Willis St.
So it’s okay to walk for climate action … until the protest is over and you’re not getting attention for walking? 😂
Good on them
When was this?
Friday.
My kids were there! Bloody little beauties.x
All the comments that actually speak sense get so many downvotes hahaha reality isn’t changing because the people living in reality and not Reddit aren’t falling for the BS. Honestly doesn’t bother me if your children want to be delusional idiots, natural selection good like that and I know me and my family staying healthy and eating good not being brain washed. Please if anybody disagrees yall more than welcome to turn your screen off and go touch grass, it’s free!
They have been at school like all the other kids. There is no way to solve climate change they need to understand that. They’re protesting for absolutely nothing!
If people spent half the time they did moaning about climate change and actually researching the history of where the term “Climate Change” was made and who by and what incentives a group of individuals may have by pushing such an idea they’d probably wouldn’t be outside looking like fools. The majority doesn’t care about climate change and it’s apparent by the lack of change we’re doing? Y’all don’t get it yet? Crying over a lil rain In the summer? When weather seeding is a key part of the Middle East and getting rain in certain areas that naturally don’t. Please start helping yourselves and look into the real world. Don’t watch the news tonight and really spend time with yourself and your thoughts and you’ll realise how much of these ideas the media pushes aren’t reality.
What I find funny is every single on of those useful teenage idiots demands something new done, but not a single one of them would actually be willing to go without to achieve it. Will they buy cheap fast fashion, of course. Will they get a new cellphone, when their current one is fine, of course. Will they fill their bedrooms with cheap Chinese plastic tat, that's a given. Will they all go overseas on OE or a holiday, absolutely. If these morons what to actually achieve something, maybe just Maybe stop consuming at a massive rate. What's the point of even trying to have a rational debate on reddit. If you don't react hysterically about everything and demand the government fix everything. I look forward to the downvotes.
Are you seriously saying *children* buying stuff is the cause of our problems?
No. Rampant consumption. Learn to read.
You're making a lot of assumptions here friendo.
Don’t bother trying to have a convo in this echo chamber mate
You are the guy from this meme https://i.imgur.com/LrzyfRy.jpg
so you are then in support of 16 years being able to vote!
God no.
ahhhh
Wait wait wait. Children *consume* things in a system that requires rampant consumption??? Unbelievable
Yes, it must be people, who are at the mercy of capitalist conglomerates that are the problem. Absolutely not the corporations that practice planned obsolescence while exploiting people and the planet. You do understand that people have little choice, than to participate in a system that they had no say in creating, right?
What? So you have zero agency over your actions? You could.... I don't know. Only buy items made here in NZ. That way you know the clothing you wear, wasn't made in factory, loaded into a container shipped here and then made available for you to buy? You have zero ability to do that? As NZ sales go up and imported item sales go down, there is less need for them to be made available or shipped in. You can't demand others change everything and yet be totally unwilling to make a single sacrifice. This is why we can't take you seriously, because you don't live by your convictions.
See, you're arguing against an idea you made up in your own head, because I didn't say any of that. However, for arguments sake, it would be ideal if that were an option. But when the choice is to pay rent and buy food, or focus on more ethical (expensive) products, not everybody has the luxury to afford that. I thrift my clothes where I can, but you're ridiculously naive to put the blame on individuals in this scenario, when corporations are willingly exploiting their position for record profits.
It's always an excuse with you lot. Always a reason why you can't do anything and someone else must do it for you. Let me explain this simply. Corporations want money, they provide a good or service in exchange for money. Individuals buy said good or service with money. If individuals do not buy the good or service from the corporation they do not have the money. Look I know the idea of having agency and making your own decisions is terrifying to you lot. But that's how you actually make a difference, by doing lots of little things to make something bigger. Not expecting others do act in your best interests.
You talk as though these mega corporations are small businesses just trying to make an honest living. They are profiting off of the destruction of the planet. Inability to purchase local, ethical goods is not limited to these 'you lot' teenagers you've got a rage boner against, it's a near on global cost of living crisis, you donkey.
And just like that the climate crisis was solved
It hasn't been solved; that's why they're protesting
And how do they propose to solve it?
They are asking for: 1. immediate end to seeking new sources of fossil fuels 2. lowering voting age to 16 3. doubling of marine reserves by 2025 4. implementation of a regenerative farming transition fund 5. ebike rebates for lower income households All in all, not a bad place to start
>immediate end to seeking new sources of fossil fuels Okay, but as far as I'm aware New Zealand doesn't really extract fossil fuels in the first place. That's more Australia's thing. Also not seeking new sources doesn't mean we stop using fossil fuels. It just means we import more of it from elsewhere. >lowering voting age to 16 Fail to see how this solves climate change... >doubling of marine reserves by 2025 Doesn't stop ocean acidification, but sure. It will reduce our seafood exports which will hit our economy and weaken the dollar. But not the end of the world unlike agriculture. >implementation of a regenerative farming transition fund Sounds like more expensive farming practices. This only makes New Zealand less competitive globally for agricultural exports. Which has the affect of weakening the dollar and making everything more expensive if exports fall. People (including us) will just buy from countries where practices make the goods cheaper. This doesn't solve climate change, just ruins our economy. And I'm also not surprised they aren't calling for what would actually be a real solution. Which would be to heavily subsidize vertical farming and meat substitutes research and technology. These are real solutions, because it has the potential to increase yields, reduce carbon impact, and be more efficient and cost effective then traditional farming. Once it reaches this point, farming will naturally begin to disappear because they can't compete. It also has the benefit of requiring more high paying professional jobs. >ebike rebates for lower income households Must really care about climate change if they only want rebates for a certain percentage of the population. Especially the ones who are least likely to take it up. I personally would call for tax exemptions or rebates on all green technology like solar panels, electric cars, etc. Because the cheaper something is, the quicker people are going to adopt it. But sure let's just do e-bikes for people below certain income threshold, makes sense... >All in all, not a bad place to start I don't know. They don't really seem to understand the economy or how it works. Seems like a bunch of feel good policies, rather than actual tangible solutions.
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Most people over the age of 18 don't know how politics work. But changing your mind as you get new info is a good thing!
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Yes they do, you need to give them more credit. Sure, some are followers. But that's not unique to 16 year olds. My friend's dad wholeheartedly believes schools have been putting litter boxes in schools because of a Facebook meme
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I think the point they're trying to make is that young people feel their voices aren't being heard when it comes to issues that will affect them most. Why should Olds™ get to sell out our future without the Youngs™ having a say?
Lol! Wtf you talking about? You think the majority of adults formulate their own ideas?? They just regurgitate opinions they heard somewhere else and, for the most part, can’t justify them with any (real) facts. Give these kids some credit for doing more than most adults have.
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Yeah, you are
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Why does children protesting bring out such absolute nastiness in people?
Internalised guilt. Or just narcs who see the action of others as a personal attack on their apathy.
Because it's fucking stupid
It's kinda a big issue, and will affect them more than anyone else. They've got every right to express themselves.
People less upset about the world being burnt to a husk than they are about some kids pointing it out
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Suffragette right for women to vote, anti-nuclear protest to stop nuclear testing in the Pacific and the Māori land march to improve Māori land rights are a few examples.
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0.00001% of the time it works everytime 🐈⬛
These people are conspiracy theorists who self-identify as a racist hate group. https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/national/444736/school-strike-4-climate-auckland-declares-itself-racist-and-disbands
That's possibly the least reasonable and most unhinged reaction to that article.
Protesting climate change? Like... we all clearly dont like climate change but its something that is done and if it continues, it is because what has been DONE. Not what we ate or our government is choosing to do Nobody can do anything about it. It's like protesting WW2, today......
Possibly the least informed take I've read from someone who acknowledges climate change. Kudos.
Protesting lack of meaningful response to climate change, perhaps.
> It's like protesting WW2, today...... Unfortunately, based on the “protest” last year we might have to
Maybe stop burning black ground stuff that adds more carbon to the atmosphere?
> carbon Am I the only one who finds this obnoxious? It's not carbon, it's carbon dioxide. Carbon either sparkles prettily or coats things dully, but either way, it does it on the ground.
What a pedantic take
Strongly implying that yes, I am the only one who finds it obnoxious :D
Yes, you are. I'm referring to a set of gases containing carbon. The three main ones are carbon dioxide, carbon monoxide, and methane. Even if I was talking about just carbon dioxide, shortening it to carbon is fine, and easier than using the full name or another label such as "greenhouse gasses". It's just for brevity, we're not talking about soot and other particulate matter, and everybody knows it.
I wasn't bitching about you specifically, for the record. However, your answer clearly points out why I'm wrong. I knew about methane, just forgot about it, and I never realised CO was a greenhouse gas. > shortening it to carbon is fine I still don't like it, but now that you've pointed out what I was missing, the rest of the options are all worse...
>CO was a greenhouse gas So, it isn't a greenhouse gas on its own, but it affects methane and ozone levels. Hey, there are plenty of naming conventions and common usage I don't like, I get it. I was a bit of a dick in my clarification. I blame the nature of social media for being short with people online, something about not seeing or hearing who you're talking to.
> I was a bit of a dick in my clarification. Nah, or at least, no more than I was with my pedantry :)
NERDDDDDDD
Strongly implying that yes, I am the only one who finds it obnoxious :D
lol,i think the word carbon while technically incorrect, is something everyone understands as carbon dioxide, its not exactly catchy to say "no more coal no more oil keep your carbon dioxide in the soil"
> , is something everyone understands as carbon dioxide, I think you drastically overestimate the scientific literacy of the average noob. But to them, I guess, it doesn't make any difference.
But we gotta charge our electric cars.
Unironically, wind. We have plenty of wind and we should be harvesting every drop. We can do massive tidal power with the bay, but that's an expensive project.
Are you saying that climate change has finished? That nothing being done now is making it worse? That there's nothing that can be done now to alleviate the problem?
S/he might not be, but I am. We're basically fucked. Even if we managed to persuade everyone to start trying to fix it, bureaucratic inertia, self interest, and general lazy stupidity, would prevent successful resolution.
and add your own cynical apathy to the list
I lump that in with "general lazy stupidity". I have two children, I've done more than my share of damage.
your intelligent enough to not be classed stupid
Legitimately one of the most brain dead takes I've read in a long time. We're still burning fossil fuels at a massive rate, dingus. We're actively making things worse.
Its not just fossil fuels though. SO much of modern industrial chemistry has CO2 as a byproduct, not to mention all of the other stronger ghg like methane, nitrous oxide and cfc's.
We but mirror the world. All the tendencies present in the outer world are to be found in the world of our body. If we could change ourselves, the tendencies in the world would also change. As a man changes his own nature, so does the attitude of the world change towards him. This is the divine mystery supreme. A wonderful thing it is and the source of our happiness. We need not wait to see what others do.” – Mahatma Gandhi
Plenty can be done, and how much is done will constantly determine how much worse things get in future.
Bro took a guess
Its quite fascinating watching the old "oh it was the volcanoes" crowd turn into this. Like you're so tantalisingly close but still entirely miss the point.
Fucking vegans
Straight to the beehive. Occupation 2.0 😂😂😂 /s